I have been hearing about Theodora for quite some time now and I was wondering: Apart from telling Justinian not to leave Byzantium when the revolt took place, did she do anything worth writting in the history books?

I have been hearing about Theodora for quite some time now and I was wondering: Apart from telling Justinian(I, II, III?)(sp?) not to leave Byzantium when the revolt took place, did she do anything worth writting in the history books?

well she was a hooker when he met her--she must of had some hmmmmm good qualities :D

Not true, theodora was no harlot. She was merely in the circus and had an act with this dancing bear (no, I'm dead serious, true story). But I do think that Justinian would have been a better choice for a leaderhead to the Byzantines, what with the creation of one single legal code, the construction of Hagia Sofia and the conquest of western rome (or what was left of it).

Historychannel.com says that she was a prostitute.

Basically she ruled from behind the throne and was responsible for most of Justinian's actions, IIRC.

Basically she ruled from behind the throne and was responsible for most of Justinian's actions, IIRC.

that's can be debated. I think she gave him a lot of moral support, and direction sometimes, but she was not the mastermind behind his most ambitious projects.

Historychannel.com says that she was a prostitute.

as does historians of that time, procopius of caesarea and john of amida

that's can be debated. I think she gave him a lot of moral support, and direction sometimes, but she was not the mastermind behind his most ambitious projects.
she was responsable for belisarius's dismissal in Italy and his replacement. Narse's was one of her favorites

Yes, but as the reconquest of the west was ultimately a failure, I don't count the dismissal of Justinian's greatest general such a big loss (no matter how much Belisarius could have conquered, it would been lost anyways as soon as the arabs attacked the provinces of real importance of the roman empire (which has always been Egypt and Syria).

She was born in the lowest cast(circus worker) of the Byzantine society and ended up as Empress, in fact co-ruler of the Empire. Such social ascension for a woman, in that time, must count for something.

Basically she ruled from behind the throne and was responsible for most of Justinian's actions, IIRC.
yup... that and she was a prostitute. that's about it.

Theodora was a Monophysite while Justinian was Chalcedonian (at least until the end of his life, when he converted to the extreme form of Monophysitism known as Aphthartodocetism). She secretly helped the Monophysites behind Justinian's back, and gave them the support they needed to break with the Orthodox and set up their own independent church structure. Thus she sponsored the activities of Jacob Baradaeus, the great hero of the Jacobean Church (which takes its name from him). She was also reponsible for sending a Monophysite mission to Nubia, in the hope of converting it to Monophysite Christianity. When Justinian heard about this he had little choice but to send a rival, orthodox mission to the same place - but Theodora's man got there first, convinced the Nubians that he had been given authority by the emperor over the other lot, and duly converted everyone to the religion that Theodora wanted!

In other words, Theodora was extremely influential in Middle Eastern and North African religious history.

Well, she made the history author of her time (Prokop) very angry, and thus he defamed her afterwarts in all sorts of manner. :) That's a clear sign that she was important: Authors only treat important persons... ;).

And of course, for more serious answers I think, the other posters have said enough.

mfG mitsho

Not true, theodora was no harlot. She was merely in the circus and had an act with this dancing bear (no, I'm dead serious, true story).

One of her "acts" was to have grain placed over her exposed pudenda and then pecked off by geese.

And, yes, she was also a prostitute. As was her older sister, Comito.

One of her "acts" was to have grain placed over her exposed pudenda and then pecked off by geese.

And, yes, she was also a prostitute. As was her older sister, Comito.

Gosh, what caused you to learn the word pudenda? For me it is a website devoted to interesting words beginning with "P" when I was trying to learn clever insults my mentor was afflicting me with :(

The sort of street-entertainment I want to see more of in Manchester ;)

Wouldnt Saint Irene the empress be a better candidate for the game than Theodora?, she was also very important, she had an even more direct influence on religion history than Theodora, by condemning Iconoclasm, which was tearing apart the empire, and ...she was an empress who ruled in her own right ,she was on the coins.
Not just the hooker wife of the emperor.

the real hero of the time was belisaurius, and to a lesser extent narses, they did all the work

But they weren't emperor/empress. That's the point.

History creates heros. It does not matter wether these heros have really acheived something, or are just good 'ego-propagandists'. (People that know how to place themselve in a good light wether or not this is true).

Do you want another example than theodora?
What about Ramses II.? The one that fighted that hard at Kadesh? Don't you think. He was a terrible general that almost (he just had luck) destroyed his own army. but, well he was a builder, and then, back at home, he let extremely many temples be built in which he was celebrated as the winner of kadesh, etc. The result was that at home in egypt he was a hero, and later in 19th century Europe too: They only knew the Egypt sources. :)

Back to topic now :)

mfG mitsho

Theodora was if perhaps largely responsible for the survival of monophisitism, which led to Coptic and Jacobite churches emergance, and future Persian and Arab conquests.

Theodora was very defamed by Procopius and the rest of the Byzantine aristocracy because she was from the lower cast of the society, hence they called her a prostitute, when she actually was a circus worker.
She almost made the whole of Christianity to convert to monophysitisme - if it wasn't for the intervention of the pope himself. Besides she had a great deal of influence over Justinian.
However, I agree that the Byzantine leader should not be her. She never actually were the powerful person in the throne. Irene was, and in her laws she signed as an EmperOR- basileu, in the masculine, and not basilissa, in the feminin. But she governed the Empire in a low point, it wouldn't be logical to put her.
And Justinian shouldn't be the leader because, as most historians says he was the last great ROMAN emperor. ROMAN not BYZANTINE. Only after Heraclius the caracteristics of a byzantine civilization would be stronger. Therefore, I guess the leader should be Heraclius, who saved the empire from destruction, or Basil II, who made the empire rise to a level of recognition and prestige unparelleled since Justinian.

And Justinian shouldn't be the leader because, as most historians says he was the last great ROMAN emperor. ROMAN not BYZANTINE.
How can he be a Roman empire without Rome in control, and in fact Rome being the city he wanted to conquer?
Of course he was a Byzantian Empire, though in a time when Byzantia still held much of its Roman charcter, which is not alien to her. In fact, Byzantia was essentially and partially Roman in charcater.
There's no one more suitable than Justinian as the greatest Byzantine ever.

Theodora was very defamed by Procopius and the rest of the Byzantine aristocracy because she was from the lower cast of the society, hence they called her a prostitute, when she actually was a circus worker.


At that time and place, there was very little difference between the two professions.

@Companiero: Actually, historians only see the characteristic byzantine civilization comoing up after Heraclius, since he was the one to take the title of Basileus, instead of Augustus. Also, he commanded the empire as a Roman and not a Byzantine Emperor. Alas, he used Diocletian organization system, he was always organizing triumphs, etc...

ehh. I always believed that it was the historians that named it the byzantine empire... and that the byzantines always considderd themselves roman.

and so you are right, superisis. Where's the problem?

mfG mitsho

ehh. I always believed that it was the historians that named it the byzantine empire... and that the byzantines always considderd themselves roman.

so? Saying your one thing, while being another dosetn actually make you what you say you are.

ehh. I always believed that it was the historians that named it the byzantine empire... and that the byzantines always considderd themselves roman.
Many European power's have called themselves Roman or a new Roman empire. They never got over it.

Many European power's have called themselves Roman or a new Roman empire. They never got over it.

and... what it got to do with the roman empire with constantinople as the capital learn the truth story of The Roman empire, not the "one" that ended in 476 or 480

she was responsable for belisarius's dismissal in Italy and his replacement.
Doesn't sound too "great" to me.

and... what it got to do with the roman empire with constantinople as the capital learn the truth story of The Roman empire, not the "one" that ended in 476 or 480

The "truth" is that by the time constantinople was set as the capital of the Roman empire, one is going to har dpressed to find anything "Roman" in the empire at all. (not to mention the fact that COnstantien himself smaks as littl emore then an arrogent fool who was adept at winnign battles, but not managing an empire, and was perhaps one of the greatest human reasons the empire fell in the first place)

The "Truth of Rome" died with Julian the Apostate. after that , late Roman, and Early Byzantien culture is a mixture of influnces into a unique whole, but fully undeserving of the title "Roman", and can more accuratelly called "Latin Chrisitan"

Doesn't sound too "great" to me.

wasn't meant to be, was in response to a post saying she had little influence on justinian's policies

Was she sexy?

Was she sexy?

either that, or she and ole' Justin were just damned kinky enough for each other ;)

Apparently Justinian didn't pass any major laws after she died. So was he just in mourning or was she the brains and muscle in the relationship?