DG6 RPG Rules, 1st Draft

Land Management

1. Land provides a number of food, shields and commerce/gold (f/s/c or f/s/g) that it would if worked in a city, and produces it's value shown when clicked to view info in a game. This is pretty straight forward.

2. A city produces the number of food, shields, and gold seen in the city view, plus an additional gold for each population point.
Example: Fanatica is size 6, so it's owner receives an additional 6 gold to his/her income.

3. Gold can be converted to food or shields, making 1/2 of either.

4. Land will be divided into 'sections' of tiles that can be in any size from 4-16, but for the most part not going past 9 or so. This is to help Land Management's record keeping. Income will still be calculated for individual tiles.

5. A single contigous territory with at least 5 tiles, earns added gold per tile.
5-9 tiles = +1 g/ti
10-14 tiles = +2 g/ti
15-24 tiles = +3 g/ti
25-49 tiles = +5 g/ti
50+ tiles = +10 g/ti
Here is a chart to help you:

TilesGold added to income
55
66
77
88
99
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1020
1122
1224
1326
1428
------
1545
1648
1751
1854
1957
2060
2160
2266
2369
2472
------
25125
26130
27135
28140
29145
30150
31155
32160
33165
34170
35175
36180
37185
38190
39195
40200
41205
42210
43215
44220
45225
46230
47235
48240
49245
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50500


The Feudal System(strongly encouraged, not required)

A player who owns a large amount of territory will have difficulty keeping track of his or her land and income. A player may allow another to use his land as the new player's own. Some rules to consider:

-The Lord of the land still collects added gold for his contigous territory. This includes the land he allows Vassals to use.

-Vassals collect added gold for the land that is alotted to them by the Lord

-A Lord may tax his Vassals as he sees fit, though it may not be what the Vassal wants.

-A Vassal is considered to have sworn allegiance to the Lord upon taking the land, and the diplomatic relations of the Vassal to any other Lord's or foreign Vassals will be what his Lord's relations are.

-A Vassal may rise up in rebellion against the Lord, and likewise, the Lord may use any means necessary to crush the rebellion.

-If a Vassal succeeds in rebellion, his land is now completely his and is considered a new nation.

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Characters

1. Each player may control 2 playable characters (PC's) at any given time.

2. Character statistics are the innate traits of the character. These are determined by the player.

3. A character cannot die of old age, or in a random event (unless the player states). A character can die in combat.

Character Stats and Traits

Intelligence - Determines how the character is intellectually, and their ability to solve problems. A high intelligence will help a character outwit his or her enemy in the battlefield

Charisma - Determines how the person appears to other characters. A character with a high charisma will be able to command more soldiers in the battlefield.

Constitution - Determines the physical strength and health of the character. A higher constitution increases the chances a character will come out of a battle alive or only minorly wounded.

Dicipline - Determines how industrious they are at performing tasks, and how they can lead people and show patience. A higher discipline enables a character to command more units in battle, and increases a character's chance of survival in a battle.

Agility - Determines the athleticness and quickness of the character. A character with a higher agility will have a higher survival rate.

You may give your character stats (from 0 - 20). You get 65 points to put into these stats. 10 is average.

Calculation for Unit Control

(C^3*I^2*D)/200,000

C is Charisma
I is Intelligence
D is Discipline

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Conflict and Units

Basics

1. Each player may raise a certain number of units per chat. This is based on their caste level and modified by their statistics.

2. Each character also has a maximum number of units that they can maintain command over. This is based on their statistics, and modified by their caste and territory owned.

3. Each unit costs one shield and one food per chat to be maintained in fighting order. A unit without this support becomes a half strength unit. After 2 chats at half strength the unit will disperse.

4. Each unit costs a number of shields to raise that is equal to 1/10 of the number of shields to build it in the Civ3 game.

5. Mercenary units must be supported with gold and cost gold equivalent to their unit raising cost each chat. (Example: It costs 3 shields to raise a swordsman. It would cost 3g per chat to maintain a mercenary swordsman.)

6. Units are stationed in a territory and can be assumed to be located anywhere inside that territory. A unit can move into (through) one territory per chat for each of its Civ3 movement points. If movement is not contested and is along roads a unit can move into (through) 3 territories per chat for each of its Civ3 movement points. A unit must always stop movement when it enters a contested territory.

7. Units in a contested area will fight using their unit attack/defense values from the Civ3 game modified by character warfare skills, terrain, defenses, etc. Forces may be destroyed, rebuffed, routed, etc.

Unit 'Leasing' (Player Mercenaries)

A player may have a surplus of units that he or she does not need, and can let another player's character 'borrow' that unit for a price. The unit will then be considered under the paying character's control and will effect his or her Unit Command. That unit cannot be used against his original owner and WILL defect if the new owner tries to use it in combat. This can result in a rear flanking and could cost the new owner gravely.

Unique Units

A player may create a limit of 1 unique unit for the entire game. This unique unit will be available to that player's characters for purchase for a limit of 3 turnchats. The player creates the stats, but are subject to approval by the (Conflict) RPG Manager.

Unit Command

As stated earlier a character has a certain amount of units he or she can control. That character can control more units than the alotted number, but they may defect, and can either pledge alliegance to a neighboring province, or become rogues.

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Nobility and Caste Rules

1. All characters begin play in a specific caste (Imperial, Royal, High Noble, Noble, Upper Gentry, Lower Gentry, Common). It is possible for a character to become a higher (or lower) caste through appointments and storyline effects.

2. The default government of the captial of the nation will be a Feudalistic Monarchy, and all characters will start with their allegiance to the Kingdom. Of course, anyone can rebel and set up their own government system.


Title male (female) Class

King (Queen) Royalty
Prince (Princess) Royalty
Archduke (Archduchess) Royalty

High Lord (Lady) High Noble
Lord (Lady) High Noble
Duke (Duchess) High Noble

Marquis/Margrave (Marquessa) Noble
Earl/Count (Contessa) Noble
Viscount (Viscountess) Noble
Baron (Baroness) Noble

Baronet Gentry (civ)
Knight Gentry (mil)
Squire Gentry (mil)


*Note: If a player manages to somehow unite all player's under one contigous territory, he or she will be deemed Emperor or Emperess

This is the standard system of Caste Ranking. It is default throughout the RPG as to prevent confusion.

3. Each caste gives a bonus for unit commanding.

Royalty: +5
High Noble: +4
Noble: +3
Gentry: +2

4. Certain characters can give certain titles.

-The general rule for giving a title is that a character can only give a title up to 1 rank below his.

-Naming someone a Prince/Princess is considered naming an heir, unless it is otherwise stated.

-And another exception to this rule: If a vassal successfully revolts agains his lord, he can proclaim for himself a title only to High Lord.

5. A certain amount of land is required before a character can attain certain ranks.

King/Prince: 40 tiles (Unless it is DG Captial City and the territory around it.)
Archduke: 36
High Lord: 32
Lord: 28
Duke: 25
Marquis: 22
Earl/Count: 18
Viscount: 15
Baron: 12
Baronet: None
Knight: None
Squires: None

Knights and Squires do not require land as they can be supported by a higher caste, or be given units to command that are supported by their master.

RPG Managers

Because of the anticipated size of the RPG world, there may be multiple Conflict and Land Managers. This will be established at a latter date.

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This is the rough draft. I had planned on having this portion of the RPG start around the late ancient age. If that is not what players want, we can start a few days after the DG begins, but this may not be fun because we'll just have 1 city.

Another thing i have thought about adding is Battlefield Formations and Tactics. We desperately need imput on this ruleset and anything that you may have a concern for. If we get good discussions, and people really want it, we can start 2 or 3 days after the DG begins.

Edits- Land requirement for Nobility Titles are gone.

Something I noticed in your formula:
(C^3*I^2*D*1.5)/300,000
The *1.5 is unneccesary and can be simplified out:
(C^3*I^2*D)/200,000
^The above is equivalant and simpler.

Unless you intended it to be D^1.5 and typoed it.

(As far as most of this goes, I get the basic idea, just need to readthrough a few more times to process it all.)

Like I suggested before, I'd modify the land rules a bit. Rather than selling tiles one-tile-at-a-time, I think we'd be better off if they were predivided into chunks of 10-20 tiles and sold. Income and prices from the tiles could still be calculated on an individual tile basis.

My thought is that it would be easier to keep record of land this way, because keeping records of individual tiles is a pain - you'd be lucky to find a manager to do it. It also makes the combat manager's job easier, since unit locations could be described in terms on those chunks of land rather than tracking individual tiles - it's kind of like turning it into a game of Risk.

How about chunks of 4 or 9, since those fit in fairly well with the layout of the civ map?

Qwerty- Thanks for that. I had been using an old system, but this makes it easier.

Oct- It is a good idea, and I think I would put it in something like Qwerty suggested with sections of 4 and 9, and maybe larger, or sometimes smaller.

Other than that, I'm almost done whipping up the Battlefield Formations&Tactics parts to be implemented, if it is wanted.

Edit- Another thing that was suggested was the implementation of buying or building homes/castles/fortresses. I am curious to see what people think on this matter.

The problem with using varied sections of 4 and 9 though is that you end up with overlaps, so if you're going to go with multiple sizes, how about groupings of 4, and then groupings of 4 groups(16 tiles), and for really large areas 4 groupings of 4 groups(64 tiles)? Of course you could always negotiate with several seperate chunks of 4, and not have to worry about operating in "lots". 4 also works out nicely because every city will have at minimum 4 tiles(3 + city square) to itself regardless of placement. (That's not to say you couldn't share tiles, but under ICS each city on average is gonna have 3 workables.)

About the house/building thing: It could add an interesting aspect to the game, especially when it comes to combat and stuff like that(you'd have specific locations instead of generic tile areas to RP in).

About my efficiency system, the main idea of this was to make items/housing/etc. actually useful, instead of the pointless mess it was in the DG2 RPG. That was quite possibly one of the most looked forward to, and the most disappointing aspect of that RPG.

My idea for this is to give each item/building a rating. IE: A desk will add a rating of .02% to that tile/sections income. Whereas a large house will add 12%.

This can go over several of the factors, a fort on a section/tile can add a defensive bonus instead of a bonus to the income. Possibly create a defensive bonus, but make a penality towards the tiles income (Upkeep/maintence).

I've made up the Battlefield Tactics and part of the efficiency system rules, but my computer is slowing down right now so I'll post everything tomorrow.

how about we just write fun stuff, and have fun and leave the maths to school.

Because complicated games need rules. If you want, you can set up RPG: Go Fish! and play that. But, this is obviously going to be an in-depth undertaking. And I, for one, am looking forward to it.

I have almost finished the Battlefield Formations & Tactics part, but I'm having a little trouble thinking of prerequisites for certain formations, and to figure their defensive and offensive bonuses. I'm thinking maybe having the player 'purchase' a general to command his troops, which will give certain tactics. Or we can have no prerequisites for the tactics. This is what I have so far:

Tactics

Center Charge- Troops charge straight for the middle of the enemy formation to try and split them apart

Attack Right Flank- Troops attempt to overtake the enemy's right flank.
Strengths: Attack Left Flank, Defend Left Flank,
Weaknesses: Defend Right Flank

Attack Left Flank- Troops attempt to overtake the enemy's left flank.
Strengths: Defend Right Flank
Weaknesses: Defend Left Flank, Defend Both Flanks

Attack Both Flanks- Troops attempt to overwhelm both flanks of the enemy.
Strengths: Defend Right/Left Flank
Weaknesses: Defend Both Flanks

Wedge- Troops attempt to penetrate the enemy's front line.
Strengths: Center Charge
Weaknesses: Cavalry Assault R/L/B Flank

Cavalry Assault- Cavalry charges straight into the enemy's line and scatters them apart, while the infantry follows behind or on the flanks.
Strengths: Center Charge
Weaknesses: Wedge

Cavalry Right/Left/Both Flank(s) Assault- Cavalry attempts to overwhelm both flanks of the enemy.
Strengths: Defend L/R Flank, Wedge
Weaknesses: Defend R/L/B Flank

Cavalry Rear Assault- Cavalry attempts to get around the enemy and harass the rear.
Strengths: Center Charge, Defensive Ambush
Weaknesses: Defensive Position

Ambush Right/Left Flank- Troops attempt to surprise the enemy in a hilly, mountainous, or wooded area.
Strengths: Defend Left/Right Flank, Center Charge
Weaknesses: Attack Right/Left Flank, Cavalry Flank Assault.

Defend Right Flank- Troops keep alert for an anticipated attack on the right flank while they charge.
Strengths: Attack Right Flank, Ambush Right Flank, Cavalry Right Flank Assault
Weaknesses: Attack Left Flank, Ambush Left Flank, Cavalry Left Flank Assault

Defend Left Flank- Troops keep alert for an anticipated attack on the left flank while they charge.
Strengths: Attack Left Flank, Cavalry Assault Left Flank, Ambush Left Flank
Weaknesses: Attack Right Flank, Cavalry Assault Right Flank, Ambush Right Flank

Defend Both Flanks- Troops keep alert on both flanks for an anticipated attack while they charge.
Strengths: Attack R/L/B Flank, Cavarly Assault R/L/B Flank, Ambush R/L Flank
Weaknesses: Wedge, Center Charge, Cavalry Rear Assault

Defensive Position- Troops stand their ground and take up defensive positions to break the enemy's charge.
Strengths: N/A
Weaknesses: N/A

Defensive Ambush- Troops lie in wait for the enemy to charge or walk into a trap.
Strengths: Center Charge, Cavalry Assault, Wedge
Weaknesses: Flanking Manuevers

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Suggestions for Strengths/Weaknesses is appreciated, or if we should have strengths and weaknesses at all.

I have almost finished the Battlefield Formations & Tactics part, but I'm having a little trouble thinking of prerequisites for certain formations, and to figure their defensive and offensive bonuses. I'm thinking maybe having the player 'purchase' a general to command his troops, which will give certain tactics.

Why not, instead allow a player to choose a differant trait for there character? One of these traits could be "Natural Leader" or "Supreme General," or possibly even allow both. These can decide what tatics an army has.

If you like the idea, I'll be willing to compile a list of traits and what they do.

Rules for Landgrabs during exploration.

The most interesting part would be to find a way to distribute new land. I think each citizen should receive by order of citizen registry.

40citiesX12tiles=480 tiles, about 500 tiles. We assume 100 Citizens register.
Since we need to agree which tiles should be given to which player in order of sequence, we need to give six tiles, with the North going to the first in registry rank and then six tiles South to the second in registry rank. This division should be arbitrated by the Mayor of the City, which has absolute control in the manner.
Then each player should cede away a tile each to the Mayor.

However, non-city tiles needs a different treatment. The Governor or his Deputy should map up all non-city tiles (outside maximum city tile coverage), and give the remaining tiles to the Governor who can reward Consuls, Directors and Volunteer Office holders with tiles, as well as citizen military units winning battles (1 tile per kill).
The last point would require detailed battle reports by DP as in PBEMs.

The output by each tile in the RPG should carry the gold levels as a percentage of the gold production and a percentage of the corruption. Legal money would buy more real estate or build buildings, where corruption can be used for secret operations, bribes, luxuries, women and gambling. Illegal money can be washed to legal, but would lose its
value to 50 %.

For example

Provolution gets 6 tiles outside Camelot, our new Capital, as Blackhole gets 6 before him by the new Mayor, Donovan Zoi. Donovan Zoi gives Blackhole 6 tiles North and Provolution six tiles south. Blackhole and Provolution gives DZ one tile back each.
This mechanism allows for a speedy distribution of land, and fair in the sense that the Mayor is rewarded by the work, and that internal negotiations over land plots may in fact give the Mayor one of the best tiles and one of the worst tiles, or possibly two good or two bad ones, depending on negotiations.

Income per tile should be calculated by resources present and land improvements.
Roads, Irrigation and Mining are key here. In addition, each landholder would share the
income fo the cities gold production and corruption divided in two.

This would give legitimate savings and a hidden slush fund.

for Example
Provolonia, the five tiles South of Camelot, has 2 mountains, one hill and two forest tiles. However, one of the mountain tiles include a Diamond. Since there is no corruption in Camelot, all money is legal, but there are no hidden slush fund.
This means that core landholders would get a lot of legitimate money, but cannot undertake certain activities as succesfully as a overseas Pirate Port. This illegal economy equates the problems of corruption. Since Provolonia has little gold but the Diamond, and only one roaded forest tile is in place, Provolonia has a meager 5 gold income per turn from tiles, but gets 50 % of the income from Camelot in addition.
Camelot, size 5, has 8 gold per turn, so Provolonia has an income of 9 gold per turn.
However, as the road is connected to the diamond, Provolonia gets a Diamond Monopoly in the nation. For RPG purposes, a monopoly should have a given value per turn in gold, ranked by value of the luxury. Diamond ranks as nr One, and wins 10 gold more per turn, a staggering total of 19 Gold per turn.

However, the number of tiles around each city dependson the number of interested players, and if we are few, we may consider all tiles around a city, and if we are many, as little as 3 tiles per city. So we need a RPG Citizens Registry here. This will reward the early effort put into the RPG that will attract more players.

However, the illegal economy may be used to take legal gold from the center, so the game could revolve around trade, investments, buildings, speculation, land development and for the peripheral colonies to regain something from the center using illegal activities from the corruption gathered. So this would play out as a mixture of Settlers, Scissors, Paper and Rock and a Feudal Dynasty style RPG with elements of war and subterfuge. I would love Thunderfall to add a binding dice randomizer to the forum pages for adding an element of RNG to the RPG.

For example, Pirate Colony Gibraltar has a player with a lot of illegal funds that want to
take the lands of Provolution near Camelot, and spends 20 black gold on a mission to take a tile. He goes for the Diamond Mountain, which has a value of 11 gold (10 for diamond monopoly and 1 for road). This means he needs to strike more than 11 on the dices, but he cannot get more than +1 to the roll due to the limited illegal funds spent.
However he strikes 10, and barely makes it. The player (Nobody for example) takes the Diamond tile from Provolution. However, new cities are built and more land distributed, so no-one would really lose 100 %, but someone will become more rich and powerful.

how about we just write fun stuff, and have fun and leave the maths to school.

I agree, why not have an RPG like last time. We dont need formulas

Strider- That's a great idea! If you would please, a list would be nice.

Provo- It's good in thought, but the RPG is not affected by the DG, only with cultural boundaries and wars. If you're the President in the DG you dont get a bonus in the RPG. We did do that in the first RPG, but that proved a bit unfair for some people, so we kindly leave that out.

Really, there is no 'legal' or 'illegal' economy. We probably wont go past the late Medieval Era because this is the time period where it is most fun. Technically there are no laws, and the DG constitution doesn't apply to the RPG.

The Governor of a province is not responsible for anything in the RPG, so he doesnt have to map anything for the benefit of the RPG. Map

Income already is calculated by what is on a tile. You earn what the tile says if you right click it in the game.

I'll read more through your ideas when i have more time Provo. They seem good overall.

Gulliver- If you look back at DG4RPG and DG5RPG you will see that the RPG was dead. Barely anyone participated. In theory yes, it is a perfect idea to just have fun stories and forget about gaming. In reality, that idea ran into the ground. I've watched the RPG in it's golden age, and participated, and I know first hand how fun it can be.


On other matters, I can post a registry as soon as the rules are finished. The more people discuss the rules the faster this will move along. I really don't want to rush this like the DG constitution was.

List of traits:

Good Commander
You are excellent at commanding troops, and receive additional offensive tatics. (Possibly +1 when attacking?)

Supreme Commander
Because of your natural knowaledge of war and command, you receive all advanced offensive tatics. (Possibly +2 when attacking -1 when defending? Also, Good Commander should be required to get this trait.)

Natural Leader
You are a natural leader, and as such your forces receive a bonus in morality boosting there effectiveness. (I would recommend +3 (overall) for this trait)

Good Defender
You are excellent at the cooridination of defense, and as such receive bonus defensive tatics. (Possibly +1 when defending also?)

Supreme Defender
You are well-known for your ability to handle defense, and receive all bonus defensive tatics. (Possibly a +2 when defending and -1 when attacking also? And I'm thinking that having "Good Defender" already is required to get this one.)

Ambusher
You are good at getting your troops around without being noticed. Your troops no longer have to stop when they enter a contested area, and you receive a +1 bonus to attacking.

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I'm putting up these for you to look at, I can make more, but I want to know what you think first. Also, what about shops/business's? I can make additional traits that effect these also, but there is no rules over them.

The traits are a good idea, Strider, though I do think that we can balance out the system more if specifically negative traits were added - ineffecient organizer, procrastinator, boring, coward, stupid, etc. I think a system of traits runs the risk of giving overpowering advantadges if one is not careful.

The traits are a good idea, Strider, though I do think that we can balance out the system more if specifically negative traits were added - ineffecient organizer, procrastinator, boring, coward, stupid, etc. I think a system of traits runs the risk of giving overpowering advantadges if one is not careful.

Well... I was thinking of possibly allowing the player to choose an ??? number of traits, and then they receive additional ones (either good or bad) by taking part in the Feudal/Nobility etc. systems. An RPG Manager grants characters additional traits.

Of course, I'm still waiting on Civanator's reply, he's the one running the show. I'm just an idea man.

They're great Strider, but as Oct said we do need a way to balance them. Maybe we can have the player pick the negative traits, like we had tried in this last RPG; I think that was the one.

Maybe for winning certain types of battles or losing certain battles, or even attaining a certain Rank a character can get a trait, but it has to be random.

Lastly, maybe for the tactics have certain 'levels' of offensive and defensive tactics to go along with Good Defender, Supreme Defender and all that.

Gulliver- If you look back at DG4RPG and DG5RPG you will see that the RPG was dead. Barely anyone participated. In theory yes, it is a perfect idea to just have fun stories and forget about gaming. In reality, that idea ran into the ground. I've watched the RPG in it's golden age, and participated, and I know first hand how fun it can be.

Yeah,but for DG5 there was one RPG with the bar,i cant remember what it was called, but you saw how many people read it.

Yeah,but for DG5 there was one RPG with the bar,i cant remember what it was called, but you saw how many people read it.

Actually, that thread is nothing prepared to the DG2 RPG. Imagine several threads about 3 times as big as that one. Not counting dozens of other threads.

So, how will you pick who gets to be the king? For that matter, how are we going to figure out who gets what land?

I made a model with the real game in mind, to make it more fair in the lottery sense, as we got no online binding dice roll. All we can do is to use the City Registry List, or make a new one here, and share the tiles of each new city and within each new province following a preset key with some room for negotiations. Frankly, we need to base it on the DG actions, or this would become a dead game. We should also link our named units to the battle results. Death of a unit compared to becoming elite or even a hero for example, and the ownership of resources in tiles.

They're great Strider, but as Oct said we do need a way to balance them. Maybe we can have the player pick the negative traits, like we had tried in this last RPG; I think that was the one.

Maybe for winning certain types of battles or losing certain battles, or even attaining a certain Rank a character can get a trait, but it has to be random.

Lastly, maybe for the tactics have certain 'levels' of offensive and defensive tactics to go along with Good Defender, Supreme Defender and all that.

Well I was thinking along the lines of the player chooses two "good" traits. Then additional bad and good traits are "awarded" to the player based on there actions. Also, what about business's?

Traits - You could dig the trait system up from DG2/3.
Businesses - Don't bring that in. Having stock exchanges before the civ even has currency is just unrealistic.

Businesses - Don't bring that in. Having stock exchanges before the civ even has currency is just unrealistic.

On that topic, I am not to keen on having an economic simulation in this game.

Ok alot to answer here.

I have been thinking about droping the tactic system, but keep the Traits. They can give maybe percentage bonuses. The reason for this is because the tactic system is plain out confusing and adds too much complication that the CM's (Conflict Managers) would have to deal with.

Also, I think some people are thinking that this is going to strictly be a game and no storylines, but actually storylines are the backbone of the RPG. Without people role playing we will just have an offline version of Civ3.

About Businesses: maybe instead of player controlled businesses, we have a list of what players can 'buy' like fortress, castle, some kind of wall? When they buy it they have to spend a certain amount of shields to build it. If they have the required amount all in one turn, it is completed in one turn. Kind of like the way you build things in Civ3.
Also- there will be no stock exchange. No economic sim this game.

About the trait system- Maybe using the DG3RPG style of selecting 3 positive(or strengths) and 3 negative(or weaknesses) traits. Then, characters can be awarded traits based on their actions (as Strider had said).
Strider, if you'd be so kind I'd like you to come up with the traits that can be chosen.

About who gets the land- I'm still at a loss for ideas to tell you the truth. In DG3 RPG we nad an NPC despot who was murdered and then it got hairy, eventually one person came out on top as the Emperor, gave alot of land to his loyals and then we had 3 people with all the land. In DG2RPG it was sold at a first come first serve basis, with the exception that people who had never had land got first dibs. Maybe something like a random dealing to players at first and then they can 'negotiate' who will have the most land in the end ;).
Or as provo said when the RPG registry is started we give the land out in the order that you signed up on. Maybe the first people to sign up get dibs?
Edit- Maybe select one player to start as the King with all the Land, and he gives land to Vassals as the DG nation gets bigger, and then of course rebellion can happen?

About DG actions- Yes the DG actions are tied to the RPG in weird ways. Say if in the DG we have a warrior exploring, you can start a storyline where your characters are with or they are the exploring warriors. Also if we get a great leader and he is in a city, a story can be started around that great leader an such. I think what I mean to say is that the DG has heavy influence on the RPG, but we have no influence on the DG, but you dont have to follow the DG to play the RPG (for the most part).

Edit- I had also thought about dropping the Land requirements for attaining a certain Nobility Title. It's just plain out silly.

Some more after thoughts- It seemed to be decided at the death of the DG3RPG that the late ancient to late medieval ages was the most fun time for an RPG. When we start this RPG, we can start as if we are at the late ancient age- or we can start and follow the DG, tech for tech, which gets boring. Another option is to follow the DG, but maybe have the techs (during the ancient age) 2 or 3 ahead of what is already researched.

Also- the rules say a player can have 2 characters. What does everyone think on that? Should we go with 2 or go with 1?

Thoughts or comments greatly appreciated.

Why do we even need traits? Just role play your character and their vices and virtues should become obvious.

No economic model?

Count me out, I much prefer the fun-writing threads.

I actually don't like the economic sim. Not only does it get unrealistic fast (with banks, and stock markets), there's always a few players who tend to get a monopoly, and makes the game less fun for others.

Now, we could do a variation on the economic sim like this:

Before Currency - Economy is based on bartering.
Before Banking - Economy is based on currency (economies are not standardized).
Before Economics - Economy is based on banking (economies are standardized).
After Economics - Economy is based on stock markets.

By "not standardized", I mean that currency is based off of some material for wealth (i.e., silver, gold, or even something like seaweed. It's still somewhat based on bartering).
Standardized = money is based off of 1 pound of gold increments.

About Businesses: maybe instead of player controlled businesses, we have a list of what players can 'buy' like fortress, castle, some kind of wall? When they buy it they have to spend a certain amount of shields to build it. If they have the required amount all in one turn, it is completed in one turn. Kind of like the way you build things in Civ3.
Also- there will be no stock exchange. No economic sim this game.

The economic sim is what made the DG2 RPG so popular. If you noticed, ever sense we took the economic sim out in DG3, the RPG hasn't done well.

I was also thinking, ontop of the Trait system, we could also have a Job system. The player choose's there character a certain job (blacksmith, carpenter, bonesmith, goldsmith, leathercrafter, farmer, scientist, etc.). These jobs will determine what a character can make or do. Instead of having "business's" we could just allow them to handle exchange privately.

About the trait system- Maybe using the DG3RPG style of selecting 3 positive(or strengths) and 3 negative(or weaknesses) traits. Then, characters can be awarded traits based on their actions (as Strider had said).
Strider, if you'd be so kind I'd like you to come up with the traits that can be chosen.

Yeah, I'll get to work on it

Some more after thoughts- It seemed to be decided at the death of the DG3RPG that the late ancient to late medieval ages was the most fun time for an RPG. When we start this RPG, we can start as if we are at the late ancient age- or we can start and follow the DG, tech for tech, which gets boring. Another option is to follow the DG, but maybe have the techs (during the ancient age) 2 or 3 ahead of what is already researched.

I was thinking, maybe we could follow the DG's tech pace all the way (instead of staying inside of the middle ages the entire game). Just with one main differance, we keep the feudal system the entire game. It would be interesting to see several differant feudal lords fighting with planes and tanks :).

IIRC, in the DG2 RPG, you had to have a business or something just so that you could participate. If yours didn't do so well, you didn't have any money left to replace your business that went out of business, so you couldn't participate. I don't think it was the economic sim that made it popular, but the land ownership game that made it popular. If we are to do an economic sim, then atleast let's keep it in line with the game. Start the Fuedal Sim up once we get to the middle ages. Also, any other thread (not related to businesses) can be posted as well.

Some more traits:

Positive Traits:
Good Manager- All land receives 10% bonus income

Charismatic- You receive a 5% discount on all "official" purchases.

War Vetern- You receive an additional 5% to attack and defense.

Manipulative- You receive a 10% discount on all official purchases. Requires the Charismatic trait.

Sense Intentions- You receive an additional 10% to attack and defense. Requires War Vetern trait.

Efficient- Land receives a 5% bonus to shields.

Mercenary Captain- Mercenaries cost 1/4 less to maintain.

Negative Traits:

Coward- You receive -5% to attack and defense

Anti-Social- You receive -5% to all official purchases

Going to need some time to think of some more, how many exactly do you want?

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Also, about the job system. I was thinking that each character could choose a job, and that will be there primary source of income. Of course, we give each player a set amount of gold when they join the game. However, unlike in DG2, this will not be where the gold just magicly appears. The only way to obtain additional gold is by trading, through land, or by winning a contest of sometype. The jobs a player can choose from could be the following:

Blacksmith- Weapons, Armor, Iron Buckets, etc.

Goldsmith- Jewerly, Gems, etc.

Weaver- Woven Cloths

Leathercrafter- Anything made of animal hides

Bonesmith- Necklaces made from seashells. Basicly anything made of limestone of calcium.

Farmer- Simple enough... anything you can grow.

Alchemist- Medicines, Fertilizers, etc.

Hunter- Most meats

Cattleherder- Goats, Cows, milk, etc.

Banker- Someone who manages anothers players money.

That's all of the jobs I can think of right now. These will most likely made up the core of the system. We can let the players neogoitiate on prices, or let them set up there own prices. Of course, there should be a fee to set up a business (mainly just buying the store).

Now as for a player making something for themself, it should be considerably cheaper, but they shouldn't beable to make a huge load of items. So we put a small fee down of about 20% of the items average cost. For realistic purposes we can say that fee was obtaining the raw materials needed to make the item.

Well, I posted a separate subgame that will use the game actions and map exploration/city founding. Regardless of the outcome of this thread, the subgame will work out due to a limited ambition level and a sort of fair randomizer on bets.