Although some of this is dependent on the map (especially whether the capital is coastal, although there is a good chance since we are seafaring), I would like to open discussions on our methods of exploration. In particular, should the emphasis be land first, then water, or water first, then land? Also some discussion about how many exploring units are needed would be good. As we are seafaring, curraghs would be particularly good for exploration.

As we are Seafaring, and will almost definately start next to the coast, I suggest a curragh (2 of them actually, to go along the coast), then a warrior for exploration. Meanwhile, we use the luxury slider for happiness. Then a settler...of course, this is all dependent on the map, but that's a rough guideline. Curraghs are faster than even a scout (3 moves, no matter what terrain), so I think they are much better than warriors - we can also use them to find other continents/islands suicidally once they map the coast.

I am a big fan of curraghs;
you'll meet many civs because you aren't landlocked;
you have 3 movement instead of 1;
you can't be attacked by warriors or other land units;
you are less likely to be killed by barbarians;
etc.

hmm, go west, no wait north! Ahh, it's too hard to see in this thick, black fog. ;)


I'd wait until we see what our land is like. Besides, a curragh would be the 3rd (sometimes 2nd) thing I'd build. I'd rather find goody huts (hoping they're friendly).

hmm, go west, no wait north! Ahh, it's too hard to see in this thick, black fog. ;)


I'd wait until we see what our land is like. Besides, a curragh would be the 3rd (sometimes 2nd) thing I'd build. I'd rather find goody huts (hoping they're friendly).
I second this opinion, since I would rather see the map itself before making a decision to decide where to go.

This is long term planning, which doesnt depend on the map anyways... Short term planning hasnt started yet, but will once the creation day has been played.

The probability of barbarians on Emperor is 65%, iirc. The other biggest one is a tech, which is 10%. Others, like map and gold are 5%... these are not good chances. If we pop barbs, our scouting warriors could die -> curraghs can't die (unless out of coast, even then it's only a 25% chance - good for suicide curraghs) until Map Making (barb galleys).

Curraghs only show in front the coast one or two squares (depending on terrain). Having a curragh or two explore the coast is fine, but we will need several warriors to explore the interior, meet the neighbors, and die at the hands of barbarians.

I'm for land exploration first, followed by a curragh or two, then more warriors.

I say, build 2 warriors, then a curraugh, assess city growth, and build according to the city growth ratio, possibly a new warrior or a new settler. When new settler is built , build a new curraugh for sailing the other direction.

I, too, think land exploration takes precidence over sea. After all, we can only build cities on land, so finding suitable city sites is more important than discovering the shape of our continent.

Without seeing the map, I would say:

Warrior / Curragh / Warrior / Curragh

We'll need the Warriors to pop goodie huts (barb huts?), as well as scout for interlopers. But the Curragh could define the outskirts of our land so that our Warriors do not waste time inadvertently heading towards the coast.

Plus a Curragh will be more quickly built from a Size 2 city, so there's another reason to lead with Warrior.

We need to secure our home island (if that's the case) before colonizing other islands. It is just annoys me when I've left a gap and an AI civ plops a city down on my island.

Speed of initial contact can be a key to be able to trade for all of the opening techs. Curragh's have a much better chance of finding contacts due to their 3x speed and ability to see further along the coast to spot borders.

I say that we should build curragh / warrior / curragh / warrior / settler. If we've got food bonuses available at the start then I might consider building the settler earlier. In either case, once we see the starting location I will employ my analysis and calculations on possible optimal starts to get expansion running quickly (that will be a tactical discussion of course).

Out of the people that clearly stated a preference it appears to 3 (GA, RM, M) want at least 1 curragh first and 4 (Uly, Prv, Ash, DZ) want at least 1 warrior first. I couldn't determine (or maybe just interpret) the preferences of 6 people (TB, CT, CG, BH, YN, or bh).

Without seeing the map, I would say:

Warrior / Curragh / Warrior / Curragh

We'll need the Warriors to pop goodie huts (barb huts?), as well as scout for interlopers. But the Curragh could define the outskirts of our land so that our Warriors do not waste time inadvertently heading towards the coast.

Plus a Curragh will be more quickly built from a Size 2 city, so there's another reason to lead with Warrior.
I would pop huts more conservatively in a higher difficulty level since there is a higher chance of poping goodie huts that contain agressive barbarian warriors.

I have given thought of using the Curragh for scouting our coastal waters, but then I had to think realisticly and keep my eye on the department incharge of where settlers plop to settle. Im sure that if we find a good coastal area with access to fish and wheat/cattle resources, then curragh scouts are possible :).

Once I see the start I may change my mind, but I'd prefer to produce two warriors, then a curragh. The warriors are useful for scouting the immediate vicinity, which is important so we can begin planning where to place our cities. Also, if we have neighbors right on our doorstep it's important to learn that ASAP. If we have an aggressive neighbor close by that may affect our military strategy.

I do agree that we should produce several curraghs as soon as feasible. Curraghs make early exploration easier, and discovering early trading partners should help us keep up in technology. If we think our capital can become a settler pump, however, most of these may need to be produced by our second city.

We are in the far south of the map, and the ocean is south, and it looks like we got plenty of land up north, I would say we go for 2 warriors and a curraugh, then reassess as we explore more.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads9/DG6-BC4000-pre.jpg

Warriors will take a long time to meet other civs. I would like a curragh -> warrior -> curragh, then maybe a settler. If we don't settle on one of the wines (I like going 1 SE, even though we waste the river), and we irrigate them, mine the BGs and one additional grassland, we can have +4 fpt, and a six turn settler factory at sizes 4-5.

"Where to settle" should be a different thread.

This particulair food-low start requires a good location for a 2nd city. That is best done by land. So I opt warrior - curragh - curragh - warrior (MP)

I definately think we should get a warrior going before a boat. Scouting city locations takes precidence over finding out the shape of our continent. I would prefer warrior -- warrior -- curragh.

"Where to settle" should be a different thread.

This particulair food-low start requires a good location for a 2nd city. That is best done by land. So I opt warrior - curragh - curragh - warrior (MP)

This is not a low food start. Its a medium food start. Even so, as Sea Faring it would be best if we can get a good coastal location for city #2. I think getting curragh-warrior-curragh would be best to scout additional coastal locations as soon as soon as possible.

How fast will we have another settler? If it's not going to be very soon then why build a warrior first to scout the land?

What's a curragh?

I will be providing deeper analysis this afternoon, but here is some rough ideas on when we grow in population assuming that we irrigate both Wines and do not have a Granary. The number in parentheses after the turn is the turn if we settle in place with only one bonus food (wine).

Turn 8(7): Size 2
Turn 14(14): Size 3
Turn 19(21): Size 4
Turn 24(28): Size 5
Turn 29(35): Size 6
Turn 34(42): Full food bin.

The earliest I would consider building a settler would be on turn 20(22). By this point we can be size 4 reduced to size 2 with settler. I'm not sure how the shields work out to this point.

A curragh is a small rowed boat. Animal skin over a wooden frame. They were introduced in C3C. They have 2 movement, but our sea-faring trait gives them +1 for 3 moves total. I don't know the cost as I don't own C3C, but I would expect it is 20 shields.

A curragh costs 15 shields. I'm uncertain whether curragh-warrior-curragh or warrior-curragh-curragh would be better.

I thought this was a thread about exploraation but it's turned into a discussion of what to build. ;)

Warrior (explore) / Curragh / Warrior (explore->escort->explore) / Settler / Curragh / Warrior (MP)

We won't need MP until size 4, but do need to be defended in case an AI warrior shows up.

On the original topic of this thread, given this start position we should aim for 2 warriors and 2 curraghs for exploration. Go both ways around the coast with boats, and explore by land NW and NE (after an initial move straight north). Making as many contacts as far apart as possible is critical, to give us leverage in trading techs. A first warrior move of straight north should also reveal the most likely 2nd city location.

would building a curragh not give us a quicker idea of the map were on and hence overall long term plans? so buidling curraghs makes more sense intially

Since curraghs have a movement advantage, building a warrior first gives us a 5 turn or so head start on exploring the interior, which will take longer anyway. Also we can directly use the land a warrior discovers by moving N, while the curragh will need to go several turns before having a chance to find another civ, which is its primary purpose.

Curragh first will allow us to quickly scout for good coastal locations for our next cities. We will have a warrior out to scout well before the settler is ready.

Please make these comments in the build queues (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=113507) thread...

I second DS here, we need to move Northwards first with a warrior, and back up that initial probe with circling the coastal tiles for maximal usage of our scouts.

Discussion seems to be 2 to 1 in favor of warrior first. I will argue no more. If anyone else feels strongly about curragh or warrior first then they should speak up fast.

I would go for warrior, warrior, curraugh and settler, since we only need to sail one side until we know we are on an island or a continent of sorts. We need to run the warrior through the center, and leave coastal zones to the curraugh to catch up. After the first settler, we can decide on a new curraugh or a new warrior as the first settler should be defended by the second warrior.

I favor mixed exploration, alternating warriors with curraughs untill we see an opposing unit or something. I'd cap the number of curraughs at three (2 would probably be plenty for a couple 100 years).

Since we are in the Southwest end, we need to explore EAST. so warrior should go to the mountain and NE, and the Curraugh should go SE and E.

Myself, the governor, has decided on warrior -> curragh -> warrior. I hope this is ok for everyone, it seems to be the majority. I will *NOT* poll it unless there is an overwhelming desire to, as it seems most people want a warrior followed by a curragh. Please post in the governor's thread if you have any special things to say, or you want my response quicker (these threads have TONS of overlap with each other).

I agree with your choice Governor Ginger Ale.

The Commander also agrees with the governor's queues :D.

warrior, curragh, warrior sounds good.... i think the curragh should go east, and one warrior north and the other one n/e