This discussion deals with the what if of if we get philo first. What do we want to get from it?

Note to RegentMan: this is not the "convince others to do wheel/iw" thread. Thats the first discussion.

Please keep all posts to what tech we should try to get from Philosophy and why.

SaaM

Can you list what trades we CAN get if we get philo first please?

That's impossible to list, as we only have one neighbor who is one tech ahead of us.

If the question is what techs we can get if we reach philo first, they are:

Lit
CoL
Rep (if CoL is obtained prior)
MM

Also obtainable if prereq techs are available:
Anything else in the Ancient Age.

Those three techs are the main ones that you can get from Philo. And its mainly MM and Lit.

Those are really the two choices.

SaaM

Note to RegentMan: this is not the "convince others to do wheel/iw" thread. Thats the first discussion.
Even I wouldn't grab the wheel nor iron working with a free philosophy tech. Be assured that that crusade won't appear here.

I would have to say map making. Our seafaring trait adds one movement point to all ships, making four move galleys. Plus, seafaring also reduces the chance for sinking, thus we'll have better luck with suicide galleys. Therefore, we'll probably know more of the world, which will make trading worthwhile. However, building the great lighthouse is iffy, as it will trigger our golden age during depotism.

I would go map making, it is worth the most(besides republic) and will be useful since we are sea faring. Second choice would be literature, it would be risky going for repubilc on emperor, however i do it alot on monarch...

@RM: GLight gives half of whats needed. Collossus is the auto-triggerer for England.

I think (please. correct me if i'm wrong)

@RM: GLight gives half of whats needed. Collossus is the auto-triggerer for England.
Are you certain? I know that the lighthouse in vanilla/PTW was commercial/expansionist. I assumed that they added in seafaring too, but kept the other traits?

Lighthouse is seafaring, expansionist, and commerical. That is the same for Colossus. In other words, we need Republic/Monarchy before we complete the Wonders.

Get Republic and go a gov change while our cities are low so it won't take as long.

I would prefer not to get a tech the AI beelines to. Thus, I would prefer lit or currency (if we've bought math). Republic would be nice, but I doubt CoL will be researched by the time we learn philosophy.

I agree with Blackheart: I'd like to aim for Republic. This can be a gamble (we'll have to get Code of Laws first; and because we can't count on trading for it, we'll have to research it) and using the Philosophy gambit to get Republic is more difficult on higher levels of play. Rival civs almost always research Map Making, so I wouldn't make that a priority; we should be able to trade for that. Literature or Currency, as TimBentley suggests, might be the way to go if we decide not to risk trying for Republic.

Must get the Great Libray...so if we fall behind in tech, we have the geat Library to catch up...

- TP

Agree with TP. I think we need the GL before the Lighthouse.

Ack, having a republic with a low city count is not my idea of fun. Only one free unit per town, and each additional unit costs two gold per turn? Not good for a small civ.

Let's think about this a bit. The free tech, if we actually make it there first which is not a given, should be the most expensive one on the board that we get as a monopoly, plain and simple. Why do it this way, you ask? Because on Emperor we have no prayer of keeping up in tech by researching, due to the AI-AI trade discount. It doesn't matter a bit whether we need that most expensive tech for our strategic plan, because we will be able to acquire what we need, but only if we have a monopoly on something.

On wonders, we are almost certainly better off putting the shields into units and improvements. Let our opponents tie up all those shields, especially if some of them get stuck with a bunch of waste.

If y'all are going to be wonder happy, we need to also consider all the new wonders added in C3C. Time to go tap the Culture Consul on the shoulder and get some educational material posted on our new options.

We should take the most expensive monopoly tech. It's that simple. From where I stand that will be currency. Republic and lit are optional techs. Libraries would be a futile expense until we have republic. They will not allow us to outreaserch the AI whilst we are despotic. The risk in researching CoL before Phil is too great to even contemplate. We have 11 rivals I believe. We would not stand an earthly chance even if there are no barbs (and therefore not goody huts) on the map.

Any talk of trying to hand build an AA wonder on a large map with 11 rivals should be voted into oblivion immediately so that we can focus on winning the game. :)

What about Polytheism? It is very likely that we will not be able to get Republic after Philo. Its usually easier (faster) to get to Poly than to Currency and Construction.
We should chose most expensive tech, my suggestion is in this order:
Currency->Construction->Polytheism->Literature.
Anyway, if we get Philo first this should be polled.

I say we should go for either MM or LIt. Republic isn't as important since literatur has the Glibary and MM will help us increase our sea power. WE need to do as much exploring as possible at sea and the galley and Great Lighthouse will both help in those regards.

By the time we finish Philo we should have a decent idea of the landmass type. Right now its looking like Continents or Pangaea but it could still be big islands.

If we are on a Pangaea then I say we should take Literature as we won't be able to play the tech broker for long and might need the Great Library to keep up.

Strongly agree about the viability of us building an Ancient wonder at the Emporer level. Shy of a GL, it's highly unlikely to happen. I'd rather use our production to build our base for a strong middle and industrial era.

If we're looking at the early war with India, we'll need all the production we can for troops to handle their counterstrike.

-- Ravensfire

defintley lit. not nesseccerily to get the GL. of course if we have enough cities, or one city with enough production to not build it in 200 turns, more like somewhere in the 80-110 at the most. but it is a nice tech and it takes around 15 turns to get. getting it would probably give us a 2 tech lead. phil and lit. we could go with mm. which is great for trading and gets us the GLighthouse, but with the India controversy diverting shields for gallies and the GLighthouse would take to long.

At Emperor, and keeping research at min, we need the GL. We already know the Indians are in contact with at least one other civ, so we're sharing our (presumed) continent with at least two civs. Plus we're seafaring, so we're more likely to make contact with civs on other continents. And if we're on a pangaea, then making contact with everyone is merely a matter of time.

Alrighty.
Tomorrow I'll poll this (yay for benga consul).

Most likely it'll be MM vs Lit vs Rep (if it's achievable)

A number of people advocate Currency.

Stay at Map Making, we need the galleys to move troops quickly East and West, as well as settlers. The sooner we agree on this the quickly we can move along the coast.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=113988
poll