Well, since the other thread got practically no attention, and I want to finish this leaderhead in a reasonable amount of time, I'm opening this thread so I can get opinions, and especially (and hopefully) many suggestions on how to improve it (especially how to make him look like Roosevelt, since it still does not look anything like him)

As it stands, it would make an excellent generic mobster lh...for general reference, for the rest of the board, here is FDR, circa 1933, as acquired from good ole wikipedia:

hair color is strange, he isnt that bald, his face is longer, he has some dots on his face you can make in the texture

hair color is strange, he isnt that bald, his face is longer, he has some dots on his face you can make in the texture

I know... I can work on all that later, since it's just some texture work (or on his hair, some simple props stuff).

However, what I am mostly looking for now is some suggestions on how to make his face shape more like FDR's

Well you got the forehead perfectly. Increase thee distance from oouth to chin a bit.... then see what you got...

changes to the nose.
It is too wide by a bit and seems the wrong shape.
FDR's was up turned, while your model has a turned down one.
The bridge of the nose is too wide in the model. Also the double wrinkle is missing (very characteristic of FDR) from the top of his nose

changes to the skin.
FDR was sickly and very pale. your model is robust and even italian looking.

Changes to the eyes
The biggie here is the size. Yours are too small. This must a default setting in Poser since Civ's Army also all have tiny little eyes. Your eyes are not as small as civ's, but they are still a bit too small. Measure the proportions and you will see. Simple way to do this is to print them out at the same scale. The upper eye lid should be heavier and sag down a bit, especially in the outside corners. The eyes should tilt up just slightly at point where they meet the bridge of the nose. There is a simple poser setting for this. There should be slight bags under his eyes.

Changes to hair.
FDR had his parted to the side, not combed back.
Also not gray enough at the temples and too thick at the front of his head. The eybrows are too dark.

Changes to face shape.
Move the lower jaw slightly forward. Increase the distance between the lower lip and the jawline. Slightly increase the size of the lower lip (this might be accomplished in moving the jaw forward). Slightly reduce the size of the ears, esp the lower bit. If it is possible (I don't think it is) the puffyness of the fold of skin between his cheekbones and nose should be increased.

New preview now: I think I managed to make him look quite older, but I still haven't managed to make him look like FDR. I think it looks closer to CivArmy's Bush now than anything else. Any opinions/suggestions?

Find a better hair prop, for one. Alot of what makes FDR's imiage is his hair. Also, Glasses Glasses Glasses. He has to have glasses. I know he doesn't in that picture posted above.. but.. thats from '33....

- Kinder eyes, he's squinting too much
- Paler skin.
- Perhaps some added fat, his face is a bit too gaunt
- A bit longer face and a stronger chin/jaw
- I agree with Goldflash, hair prop is bad

Other than that, it looks good. I have confidence that this one will turn out as well as your other leaderheads. :)

Well, after a break from doing this head (which I used to get Franco almost completely done :D ) here it is a new preview, trying especially stuff like new hair stlye, which I had to do myself with balls and stuff, so it may have many flaws, though it looks more like FDR's hair than any other props I used before, and spectacles, which I'm having a bit of trouble parenting to the head (they get all deformed when I do that, just like happened when I had to do it on Hirohito, so I guess I'll find out how to revert this thing, though I'll accept any suggestions).


I'm still open to suggestions (hopefully a lot of them), since I still feel this has a long way to go before it's finished

make his eyes more puffy, needs a little more wrinkes on his face. maybe get rid of the circle on the top of his head and make a hair layer in the hair room make 2 one black and one greyesh, both with maybe 200 or 500 strands. then make another layer for the sides and make it a grey with a few strands. like this
http://www.stamps.net/Wallpaper/fdr.jpg
or
http://www.bibl.u-szeged.hu/bibl/mil/ww2/who/pics/fdr.jpg
http://www.bpa.gov/Power/pl/columbia/gallery/fdr-bon2.jpg
kind of a mix of black hair and white hair, although I can never get white hair to look right with poser....

The face definitely needs to be longer, somehow. Roosevelt looks a bit like a baked bean. Try making the nose a bit longer and thinner, and easing the face down to match it - it is quite striking how long and thin the nose is in the photo.

OK, new preview now. I tried doing that thing with the Hair Room, but as it didn't work I preferred to play around with some textures I had lying around, so this is the result of that.

Also changed a bit his face and nose shape. Later I'll try some new facial textures to give him some more wrinkles

As always, I'm open to suggestions (though I think it's getting closer to my final goal)

his eyes arent blue
needs more wrinkels in his face. his chin should stick out more, maybe make him a little heaver, his hair still doesnt look right. send me the face texture and I can help out a little

his eyes arent blue
needs more wrinkels in his face. his chin should stick out more, maybe make him a little heaver, his hair still doesnt look right. send me the face texture and I can help out a little

Well, I'm just using M3 standard face texture for now, so it doesn't have any wrinkles from that (they are all made by deforming the model, with which you can't get the best results)

So if you want to help with that, just try to modify M3 standard face texture adding some wrinkles and I'll be quite thankful for that (also, if you had any other facial texture which looks quite real - as this one does - and is does still look quite old, I'll be quite thankful to you if you sent me those)

That is a MUCH better face. It is one of the best LHs I've seen!
Not much room for improvement, but I suggest making the nose slightly different.
Have it come out at the tip just slightly more.
Maybe a bit less rounded at the tip.
Maybe have the whole nose rise off the face a little more.
Could you post a preview with a slight angle, so we can get a different perspective?
It might be close to impossible in Poser, but maybe thin out the hair on the top of his head.

It might be close to impossible in Poser, but maybe thin out the hair on the top of his head.

Well, that's exactly what I've been trying to do, mainly by playing around with transparency maps, but so far the results haven't been as great as I expected them to be (remember the "hair" now is just made of some balls with textures, so perhaps I won't be able to achieve exceptional results). I'll try anyway with some different maps, with more amount of dark zones (which will become transparent) and see if I get any good results.

About the nose: I'll try to change it as you suggested, and I'll try to post an image from a different perspective, though I'm not promising much, since because of the way I make the hair and stuff, it may look awful if watched from a side

Great job!! I lam liking what I am seeing in the progress. keep up the great work.

I don't know about FDR, but that last preview would make an excellilent Woodrow Wilson....

Yeah I see your point SoG he does kinda resemble woodrow wilson.

Here's what I came up with. I changed the hair, made his face longer, nose stronger, gave him some more mass to his lower face, tightened his lips and brought his eyes closer to each other.

Don't know if it made a difference, but it was fun doing it. Hopefully some of it is of help to you. :)

Good changes... I'll try to do the same to the model, since I think it won't be that difficult and would definetely help the LH.

Now Drift, I have to ask you something: since Corn Shucker hasn't answered my PM yet, could you tell me if you'd be willing to make something similar to what he did in my Franco leaderhead (adding a coat which looks much better than anything I'd be able to make with Poser) if I sent you a larger image?

I can always try. :)

Ok, here is what I came up with using Poser, based on Drift's changes.

I'll probably start working on his moods and eras now, unless I get any major complaints about his look now

pretty good. mouth has to be higher and the chin longer and less rounded.

Good to have you back Sween...

thanks. that makes me feel good. :)

maybe i'll start a new project once i'm settled into the new apartment.

Yo Yo Sweenster!

Anydangway, FDR is lookin purty gud! I don't know if itds possible but you modify the hair to make is even closer to how it is in Drift's suggestion? Would look more betterer that way.

thanks. that makes me feel good. :)

maybe i'll start a new project once i'm settled into the new apartment.

:eek: thats the Civfanatics equaleviant of the Beatles getting back toghether

:eek: thats the Civfanatics equaleviant of the Beatles getting back toghether

LOL, exactly. And hopefully the new stuff will be as good (and as inspirational) as the old one was (at least it was very inspirational to me... "if he could do it, why couldn't I do it?")

Had some time today, and so I worked on the other eras for him, so here's now a new preview of that.

Wasn't sure if I should dress him as a Roman British man, or just a Germanic Barbarian, but I decided to go for the first one. If anyone would prefer that to be changed, please say so and I'll consider that

Roosvelt is a dutch name, so you can make him as a saxon, I think

I love the Industrial look!

That face looks incredible - all I would suggest is to move the eyes a tiny bit closer each other, but that's really not necessary. He looks great as it is :)

I can't believe how good this LH looks!!! It's FDR to the "T"... :)

BTW.. I will have to replace Sweens Eisenhower now...

Very nice! :) It almost looks like he's dressed as a Swedish Carolean in the Industrial era, though. ;)

Very nice! :) It almost looks like he's dressed as a Swedish Carolean in the Industrial era, though. ;)

That's true, but I based it on a portrait of George Washinton dressed in a military uniform; and as CivArmy uses to say, they were imitating the uniforms worn in Europe at the time

@Rufus: That was an option, but I decided not to go for that one since I've already made enough Saxon/Viking/Germanic type of ancient LHs, and I've started to run out of clothing props for that theme (and I've just gotten some Roman tunic I wanted to use)

@everybody else: Thanks for your possitive comments! :)


Now comes a new problem (though not as problematic as making his face right, I hope ;) ): what pictures could I use as backgrounds for every era?

Looking Cute- if one could call a US President that (well, possibly with the exception of Jimmy Carter :P) !!!

@ Jorde- the 'Storm! over the World' people have asked me to ask you about your plans on your terriffic WWII leaderheads line and if you'd like to join the creator team ??

Well, my idea at the moment is to make most (if not all) of the most important leaders from Europe/Asia (and of course, FDR). What I don't know for sure yet is whether I'll keep going on this project non-stop until I make them all, or if I'd prefer to take a small rest after Franco and FDR (perhaps to be used on a couple of requests).

But anyway, I'll be glad to join the creators team. Is there any thread for that project?

Jorde is moving up in the world he is... :goodjob:

FDR? :| hmm please forgive my ignorance...

FDR? :| hmm please forgive my ignorance...


Franklin Delano Roosevelt


And in case you forgot: is there a thread for that project you told me about?

And the last thing (for everyone): any suggestions for background pictures for all eras, except Modern and the Alternative Modern one I'm making (current decade or so), of which I'm posting a preview now?

How about...

Ancient - Any temperate outdoor scene
Mideival - Plymouth Rock or Jamestown Colony
Industrial - Liberty Bell, Boston Harbor, etc.

That's true, but I based it on a portrait of George Washinton dressed in a military uniform; and as CivArmy uses to say, they were imitating the uniforms worn in Europe at the timeOk (Damn you ten character limit!)

And in case you forgot: is there a thread for that project you told me about?

Yes, go and login here: http://www.evo-games.net/Home/

and then PM either myself, Recon1591, or Winter and we'll let you into the developement threads.

New preview, showing his different expressions.
If everything's OK, once I get the different background pics, I'll start rendering

Very very nice. Your most impressive work to date.
The only room for improvement I see is perhaps raise his upper lip a little when he smiles.

The trees outside the window looked too washed out and detract from this otherwise magnifique leaderhead.

The trees outside the window looked too washed out and detract from this otherwise magnifique leaderhead.
The background pic is a placeholder according to Jorde's post. I don't add many LH's to my game, but this one is definately going in.

The background pic is a placeholder according to Jorde's post. I don't add many LH's to my game, but this one is definately going in.

Oh. Okay.

You COULD use that one.. with Photoshop you could erase the trees and put ibn better looking ones so that appears like its outside.. using layers n' stuff.

Oh. Okay.

You COULD use that one.. with Photoshop you could erase the trees and put ibn better looking ones so that appears like its outside.. using layers n' stuff.

Exactly... that's how I found this image, but it seems the trees were added using Photoshop to the image, and the result was awful, so I have to erase them and replace them as you said. This rest of the image (not the trees) will not be changed

Well, I'm posting what might be the last preview for FDR, now showing all the different backgrounds for each era (plus an edited background for modern era, with new trees added :P)

Unless there's anything I'd have to change here, I'll start rendering this one

Very nice stuff, looking forward to it.

I have to agree with the others here Jorde....this is indeed your best work to date......

The only thing I'd fix is his hat in the Industrial Age, it seems alittle blocky to me. If that can't be helped then please ignore this comment though.

Yeah, you're starting to become my favourite Leaderhead creator Jorde, but I can't use your work because the black parts look blocky and unrealistic and there's usually a fault with the white, bits. :( So when's this Leaderhead going to be finsihed anyway?

:eek: Mouth and chin are most similar! :king: :lol:

As it stands, it would make an excellent generic mobster lh...for general reference, for the rest of the board, here is FDR, circa 1933, as acquired from good ole wikipedia:

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Hey, Most impressive! This is the first time I've looked a the thread! Looks very very good! I'll agree that this looks like some of your best work yet! I'm looking forward to the release! Good work.

The only room for improvement I see is perhaps raise his upper lip a little when he smiles.

I would agree with this, but I still think it looks excellent. Thats just a thought that also crossed my mind.

Very good work!

You don't have to worry: I'll have this guy released by the end of the weekend, since I have already rendered every era, and now have just to make the flics (quick) and pcxs (not so quick) for him, and then it'll be ready for upload

Awesome...