We should have the save today or tomorrow. Donut and MIA have played. Who would like to play the save?
Turn order is as follows:
Team Doughnut - teamdoughnut AT gmail DOT com
Team TNT - teamtnt AT gmail DOT com
Team M.I.A. - mtdgMIA AT gmail DOT com
Team K.I.S.S. - teamkiss AT gmail DOT com
Email password sillywabbit6
Game save password 100Euros

Please name the save according to the above post, and send it to the next team and the admins. One important note: Do not enclose any important requests to the admins in the save e-mail! If you have something you want us to know/check out, place it in a separate e-mail or PM!

EDIT - Each team has 48 hours to play the first save. From that point on, it's the usual 24 hours. A team may ask for an extentsion (if they have a valid reason) in this thread as long as the request is asked by the first 24 hour limit. Post here that you've asked for an extension, then PM Ginger_Ale or myself the reason.

Save Naming
The team that goes first will start out by naming it MTDG001_TeamXXXX (where XXXX = team name). For example, MTDG001_TeamGroundhogs. The next team will do the same. Once we get to turn 2, it goes to MTDG002_TeamXXXX, etc, etc.

Save Sending
All teams have to send either a team email address or the turn player's email address for that team to the admins. They will update this post with the 4 team's emails. When you send the save, also send a copy to the admins:
Ginger_Ale: ale.of.ginger AT gmail DOT com
RegentMan: TitanicWhiz18 AT comcast DOT net

Do we play one turn at a time? How have they "already played?" Have they played just one turn?

One turn at a time and send it on.

That will take a while, will it not?

Yes PBEMs move pretty slow. This may move faster because there are so many people that can pick up and play the save. I would expect 3-5 turns per week. We'll see.

When is this starting?

Can I examine saves to find MM errors without Multiplayer accessability?

We are underway Bugs. We go last. It's on the main "multi-team demogame" page. Each team was allowed 48 to make their first move then it's 24.

@Own if you can upload the save you shouldn't have a problem checking the MM'ing. If not I'm sure there will be pics on this forum.

@Own if you can upload the save you shouldn't have a problem checking the MM'ing.

Does that require multiplayer accessability, though?

Does that require multiplayer accessability, though?
If you're loading the save to check things, then you don't need multiplayer accessability (e.g. an Internet connection). In fact, you don't need one for playing a PBEM (just an e-mail address).

In fact, you don't need one for playing a PBEM (just an e-mail address).

So here's the situation:
I have two computers, one with internet, one with civ (no internet). If I can get the save via e-mail on the internet computer, can I transfer it (burning/erasing CD-RW) to the other and play it?

Own: yes you can.

Sweet. Sry if it wasn't already obvious.

Are we going to have a thread to just keep a turnplay log and nothing else?

Are we going to have a thread to just keep a turnplay log and nothing else?Done. I set up a turnplay only thread.

Would anyone like to play the save? I can't till I get home around 11 pm GMT. The turn should be very simple with the worker roading the cattle and changing the build from gran to warrior.

Team Doughnut, Ginger Ale and RegentMan's email address is in our outbox. I forgot to put them in the address book.

I can play it after work in ~4.5 hours from now if no one else can get it by then. How do I get the save?

I can play right now, I guess. Just have to learn how to save and send it...

Do I load it from Load Game or from Multiplayer->PBEM? :confused:

IP--it's not much different than a SG except you download the save from our email inbox, download it, put in our team password 100Euros and play it. When you exit you are done (no going back). Then rename MIA with our name on the save and attach it to the email to Doughnut, RegentMan and Ginger Ale (emails are in the outbox). See? Easy idiot style.

Having done some calculations the roading the cow makes sense.

Once I get approval for a spreadsheet I will post it.

Eureka!!!! Oh I understand now.... goto gmail.com and type in teamkiss into the username and sillywabbit6 into the password and that is the outbox Whomp's been talking about... If I were any stoooopider then I wouldn't know how to put my shoes on correctly. :crazyeye:

Ok, thanks Whomp. Playing now.

Yep, it works. I'll send the save in a few minutes.

EDIT: Just 1 more question. :blush: Do I press enter, then save? Or save, then press enter? :confused:

EDIT: Nvm, figured it out.

Eureka!!!! Oh I understand now.... goto gmail.com and type in teamkiss into the username and sillywabbit6 into the password and that is the outbox Whomp's been talking about... If I were any stoooopider then I wouldn't know how to put my shoes on correctly. :crazyeye:
:lol: Dude you're such a loser....more likely it's my lack of Major Idiot writing skills. :hmm: Sorry for not being more clear. Dorkmania! Catch it!

IP make sure to post in this thread that the turn was sent to Doughnut too.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=124134

EDIT: Just 1 more question. :blush: Do I press enter, then save? Or save, then press enter? :confused:

EDIT: Nvm, figured it out.So which is it for those of us who have never done this before?

So which is it for those of us who have never done this before?
I had a feeling someone would ask me this. :)

Just press enter, and it will prompt you to Save & Exit or Continue (I don't even know why they have the second option).

btw, I added Team Doughnut, Ginger_Ale, and RegentMan to the Contacts.

Thanks for adding them IP.
Yeah just press "enter" and "save and exit" (this is how you rename the save).

Dorkmania! Catch it!
I got the full strength dose of it!!! :lol:

It looks like we'll be getting the save soon. It's in MIA's hands now. Is the next turn a just hit enter turn? Someone ought to be lined up to pull this one down and turn it around fairly quick.

im back...
when do we play...?
i can play tonight (from 1 hour from now to 5 hours)
will check in 2 hours, and 4 hours.
play the 1 turn, enter, save.
go to our gmail - send to doughnut, ginger and regent.
no sending other info in that mail...

I think anyone can post a "got it" in the turnplayer thread and play it. Keep that save moving at the outset.

I would really like to post my spreadsheet but they're waiting on a vote. :sad:

ok then... i got it.

a quick question though.
the save is delivered to us via our EMail, and passed on later, right?

That is correct SW. You pick it up in our email box and then you send it on to Doughnut when you're done. Here's the thread that tells you when it's in. Seems Provolution forgot to send a save with his email.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=124134

The next few turns should be move scouting units & just hit enter for everyone, unless there is controversy and the build is switching.

ok, so im waiting for the MIA save, which is, well, MIA :D
plan is to walk the walk and talk the talk.

notice im pumpping here posts like an over excited bull fighter in alaska.
i guess ill shut up now and go home so i can check for the save.

Do we have a scouting unit? I think it may be more like hit enter and save.

It will be done on turn 4 Bugs.

I'm not sure it even benefits us to move the citizen to the wheat on turn 3 because we'd end up with 22 food on growth so I would keep the citizen on the cow.

it was exactly HIT ENTER and save.
sent it onwards.

Do we have a scouting unit? I think it may be more like hit enter and save.I was speaking of all of the teams. I couldn't remember if any were EXP. PLus I am getting this and SGOTM8 confused in my head sometimes. :crazyeye:

Well the vote so far is 3-0 for to allow the spreadsheet. Whomp has placed the filled in spreadsheet in the gmail account for us to use while he was gone. The last time I tried to use the attachments, I proved my idiot status. So if someone could download it and post it to a thread here or there for reference that'd be great. I think that the next turn only involves something about an ENTER button. I can't remember whether its push, pull, or press.

Just out of curiosity I checked our gmail account & sure enough we had mail....no notice in the master multi-team turnlog thread. Sent the new save. Next player will need to move the worker to the FP & start the warrior either on MP duty or exploration. We also need to start building another warrior.

Do we have pictures securely posted somewhere?

Do we have pictures securely posted somewhere?
i think if we use the attach to message thingee it should be ok.
using outside image hosts should be ok too, as long as this thread/forum is inaccessable to the others (e.g. only we can view this one, right?)

i might be wrong though.
i think we need clarification from the powers that be.

So if someone could download it and post it to a thread here or there for reference that'd be great.

Here you go! I had to ZIP it, because .xls attachments are not allowed.

i think if we use the attach to message thingee it should be ok.
using outside image hosts should be ok too, as long as this thread/forum is inaccessable to the others (e.g. only we can view this one, right?)

i might be wrong though.
i think we need clarification from the powers that be.

I right-clicked and selected 'properties' on the attachment link in the post above... the link is:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=95317

If you enter the link in IE, you get the attachment. Apparently our attachments are not entirely secure. I don't know if the attachment ID is a random number, but our opponents _could_ try to download our attachments.

This being said, I am not worried. The standards in the Civ3 community are high and I trust our opponents (in that respect :rolleyes: ).

On the irrigate FP issue. I mis-typed. It should be road the FP not irrigate.

Sorry for the mis-information. I guess that we need to limit that to just being sent to the other teams ;)

EDIT:::: Here is a screenshot of the excel worksheet. I'm trying to expand my horizons.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=95336

The save is in the gmail inbox. Can anyone take it in the next 7 hours?? If so, please do. It shouldn't be too time consuming. The actual downloading and logging the turn takes longer than the turn to play.

If no one has gotten it by the time I get home from work, I'll play.

Have we decided whether to let the warrior stay or explore??? That's the biggest decision this turn.

Are we not supposed to use the spreadsheet? Is that a violation costing us 10 turns?

This was posted before the spreadsheet was posted.Unless vbraun posts otherwise, then the 2/3 majority has been achieved. Spreadsheets are allowed to be used in this game.

Road the FP and send the warrior exploring is the best I think.

I concur, we want to know who we share the continent with asap, among other things. Place your bets, gentlemen, my money is on the Iroqois.

Another thing... what should we do with huts? Being an Emperor game I suppose we cannot expect much from them.

We're next to the Greeks.

I agree. I think it's the Greeks. Although it could also be the Iroquois. But we should not count out the possibility of it being the Persians... <_<

I concur, we want to know who we share the continent with asap, among other things. Place your bets, gentlemen, my money is on the Iroqois.(..)If the rewards are high enough; I might consider to place a bet... :mischief:

If the rewards are high enough; I might consider to place a bet... :mischief:

I might place one too. I haven't even looked at the map yet. No, really, I haven't. ;)

Hi everyone! Miss me?

The hotel has internet so I thought I'd check in with you all. My money is on a non ag and likely Greeks. OK gotta go. Montreal is a great walking city.

Whomp, about the day you get back, I'll be in Chicago :devil: !

If you post the picture to imageshack and use something unrelated as the name, I think you could post pictures here fairly securely.

If you post the picture to imageshack and use something unrelated as the name, I think you could post pictures here fairly securely.

Actually, an attachment is pretty secure, as you can't view an attachment in a forum you don't have access to. So, I'd recommend that.

:lol: Someone (I forget who) had a link in his sig to Team TNT :rotfl: . I didn't click it but I wonder if it would take me there.

Hi everyone. Just hanging out in a internet cafe` because I really have no interest in walking in the boutiques on Ste.-Denis so checked in with the office and here instead.

Tubby thanks for messing with the spreadsheet. If we can get the gran up without waste that would be fantastic. It looks as if a second city can share the wheat because Simpleton will have plenty of food for a 5 fpt settler factory.

I was just perusing the spreadsheet and noticed that according to the spreadsheet we are planning in mining the cow on the BG. That'll be a tremendous waste. That 3rd shield won't be available until Republic/Monarchy. I'd recommend roading the vineyard instead.

Here is the current situation. Should that goodie (barb) hut be busted yet? or can it wait? Someone might even be able to get a dotmap out of this booger.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=95428

Link doesn't work. Why don't you use the standard attachment system?

Link doesn't work. Why don't you use the standard attachment system?It works for me :confused: I did use the "Manage Attachments" to attach it. I didn't want to use /uploads10/. Can anyone else confirm that the link doesn't work? I'll be back home in about 6 hours.....

Not working here either.

Doesn't work for me either.

Strange. :confused:

Easiest thing to do is just pick it up from the gmail account.

@TR, you can't use http to get to the attachment. It has to show as an "attachment" in its own little frame.

Sorry about not reporting back last night. I went out with the little woman & got the in-law to baby-sit my other little woman.

I sent it to the gmail account. it sould be in the inbox (& probably the sent box as welll). I think that I just wanted everyone to see the situation that hasn't had a chance to play yet.

BTW, I expect another turn to come our way in the next 12 hours if someone wants it. If it comes around when I've available and nobody has posted an "I want it" I'l ljust go ahead and play to keep it moving. But I don't want to hog all of the fun.

I think the worker action after the irrigated plain should be a move and mine the bg(not cow). For some reason I can't get the spreadsheet to work after the 2nd settler but I think get the gran and settler factory up and running is the key. Our 2nd and 3rd cities are going to have to be specialized as well I'd think. 100% Worker and military pumps.

Seems MIA's industrial trait is impacting their score. No worries though ag will take over soon enough. :D

Here is a picture for everyone. I posted it on imageshack.
http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/7884/musicfrom3750bc9fr.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Please note in the future, it would help if you added a mini-map and the situation report from the lower left and right corners. Plus it is a good idea to hit control-G to bring up the grid early in the game like this. Helps with dot mapping.

@ Tubby - Mining the cow is not a waste. You lose one shield in depotism not two.

It is a waste. A BG plus cow bonus is 2 shields. Mining it gives another shield, to 3 shields. But the despotic tile penalty takes that down to 2. Unless there is a terrain value change I'm not aware of.

Sorry about the minimap & grid. Normally I have the grid on, but forget to turn it on if not already.

Cows give +2food & +1 shield. It's on a BG (2 food & 1 shield). So the tile is current giving 3 food (despo penalty of 1) and 2 shields (no despo pen.). Are Own & I missing something or does our math hold up to scrutiny?

Turn 7 is available to play for anyone that can play. Can someone confirm that according to the plan using the spreadsheet in post 45 (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=2971531&postcount=45) that the FP citzen should be switched to the bg this turn?

If it's not played when I get home from work, I'll play it. Team TNT has been warned about taking 24 hours (from my thread in the main forum :devil: ). Since I started the stink about them taking too long, I don't want it to sit with us for too long.

I would say mining the cow in despotism is a waste, as the shield you gain by mining is lost under the infamous penalty.

Turn 7 is available to play for anyone that can play. Can someone confirm that according to the plan using the spreadsheet in post 45 (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=2971531&postcount=45) that the FP citzen should be switched to the bg this turn?


I took the turn, but did NOT switch to the BG. Right now we had 6 food in our box, with warrior 2 due in 1 turn. Another turn in this configuration will get us up to 12 food, enabling us to make the switch without wasting food(we will make 4 food/turn after switching to the BG).

Good catch on the food Crakie. With 3 shields on the cow it's one of the few times we could switch off the cow.

With 3 shields on the cow it's one of the few times we could switch off the cowhuh? 6morelettersneeded

Duh...I meant the cow and the capital produce 3. :blush:
With a second citizen we won't need to take the citizen off the cow.

Good catch on the food Crakie. With 3 shields on the cow it's one of the few times we could switch off the cow.

Actually, I think we should move the citizen working the floodplain. With 12 in our foodbox, we want to make as many shields as possible while making 4 food/turn. We get that working the cow and the BG.

EDIT: crossposts :)

My bad again. The citizen never comes off the cow but the 2nd switches from the fp to bg.

I will have to look at the spreadsheet again it looks off to me for some reason. Since I haven't used one for civ before so it's something I'm learning.

We have some more decisions to make...

After roading the FP, we can move the worker to the forest for a chop. I think we can even begin chopping, crank out another warrior and then get the chop-shields for a granary. The 'emphasize production' should be enabled though, so we get 2 forest shields upon growth.

After the chop, we are on a plains, which I guess should be irrigated and roaded to not waste worker turns. We also want to road/irrigate the wine tile and the bonusgrass NE to the FP-wheat, available after expansion (this BG has river commerce bonus, as opposed to the other one).

Our turn is up. Can anyone play before 4?

btw, I think that it's funny that the other teams have a "Chain of Command" and we're just willy-dilly (<- that's a technical term).

Our turn is up. Can anyone play before 4?

btw, I think that it's funny that the other teams have a "Chain of Command" and we're just willy-dilly (<- that's a technical term).
I can play now. I just need to find out what to do for the turn...

Yes, it's interesting that we have had no trouble getting our turns done so far, while at least one team has been late. :)

Geographically speaking, of course, it's 'willy nilly" and "olly olly ocean free, free, free" where I grew up . :D
It seems a willy dilly approach works for us as our save moves quickly. Honestly, I can't think of a situation where that approach wouldn't always work. Diplo maybe? A steady dialogue from eloquent Bede and Mr. Jive Talkin' Soul Dude should throughly confuse them.

Who wants the save?

IP
I would start the gran build, fortify the warrior. Move the 2nd citizen to the BG as Crakie said. Is the work finished on the FP wheat? If so we may want to move to chop. Keep the warrior heading south unless you can uncover more river tiles.
Post a pic.

Did I miss anything?

- the citizens should be working the cow & mined BG at the end of the turn.
- Check happiness.
- move worker to chop forest

^I've done all that, including lowering lux because of the new warrior, but the worker can't move this turn...was that supposed to happen? Did I somehow make him skip his turn? :confused:

^I've done all that, including lowering lux because of the new warrior, but the worker can't move this turn...was that supposed to happen? Did I somehow make him skip his turn? :confused:
I think you're all good IP.
(1)Move, (3)road cow, (1)move, (3)road FP so turn 9 should move to chop.

road FP will be done next turn.

Whoever plays next turn will be moving our migrant worker.

Alright, here's a screenshot (we have decided that it's safe to use the forum's Manage Attachments, right?).

The warrior allowed lux to be lowered and Sci to be increased, shaving a turn off of BW. I'm not sure if it was worth it, since we'll have to increase lux again in 2 turns, though.

Every penny in the sci bucket will help. I'd rather have one penny more than we need than to have to wait a whole extra turn for the penny we saved to be added.

A penny saved is a beaker earned.

I think we should send the warrior to the hill then we should discuss the next move. The more of the river we uncover the better.

will he be able to see over the forest directly W of the hill?

How many turns can citizen Kane work the FP wheat without dying of disease? We must keep an eye on that.

Every turn that a citizen is working the tile there is a chance the 2 pop will die of idiocy. (That is until sanitation.) It doesn't matter if it's turn 5 or turn 100. The amount of growth over time more than outweighs the potential loss of 2 pop. Either we shouldn't ever work it or work it as much as possible.

Switching every now & then is just as much lunacy as "Hey I've been losing a lot of battles so my turn to win is coming up soon!"

So I guess to answer your question, How many turns can citizen Kane work the FP wheat without dying of disease?anywhere from 1 to 540

:lol:

You guys crack me up and seem to have all well in hand.

Who could resist working a FP-wheat tile? :D

But I'd like to get some discussion going about some short-term goals. Do we want another warrior, because I _think_ we can get it without wasting the chop shields. In fact, it might not even delay the granary. Someone should do the math on it... I'd do it but I don't have time right now :(

Are we shooting for a warrior+settler factory? It is an attractive idea, since we will have to deal with barbs AND will probably want to mass-upgrade to GS. We should however have a barracks in the capitol to get maximum gain out of it, which would delay expansion a bit.

Another very attractive option is to dedicate our second city to workers, and the 3rd, 4th etc to military. The worker factory would benefit from the remaining flood plains in addition to sharing the bonus resources of the capitol when needed. I doubt (but I'm not sure) this setup would allow low-turn warrior-settler factory.

I am leaning toward the 2nd option. Whatever we do, it will require alot of planning and math. We might need to mine a plains for example, which I cannot remember doing early in a game ever. But then again, I never had such a great start ;) Perhaps I have some time for calculations in the weekend (which is to say I hope someone else will beat me to it :D )

If the warrior completes the turn the chop is done, the shields WILL get wasted.

I like the capital as a settler pump and lean towards the 2nd city being a worker pump and 3 and beyond rax/warriors. I see very little advantage to another reg warrior at this point since it won't be upgraded at 90g. I will futz with the spreadsheet again.

Oh no! Somebody (*cough cough Whomp*) posted in the turnplay log! All turnplay related probs and issues go here. That's five lashes for you. Whomp:whipped: I must post in the Needed Things.

Oops. I wanted to let you all know that the spreadsheet looked off because it started at 0 instead of the turnlog which, idiot me, started as number 1.

Sorry everyone for breaking the turnlog rule and thanks for throwing me under the bus Own. :D

Thanks for throwing me under the bus Own. :D

Good way to put it :lol: . No biggie, as Rik the magnificent will be here to delete the evil post.

Arguing over where to put citizens is about exciting as watching the paint dry on my porch. Granted with 95 degrees F. and 12% humidity, it dries really quickly. I'm just going to leave these details to those more qualified and able to sustain interest. :D

I like the capital as a settler pump and lean towards the 2nd city being a worker pump and 3 and beyond rax/warriors. I see very little advantage to another reg warrior at this point since it won't be upgraded at 90g.
you said it.

Arguing over where to put citizens is about exciting as watching the paint dry on my porch. Granted with 95 degrees F. and 12% humidity, it dries really quickly. I'm just going to leave these details to those more qualified and able to sustain interestEveryone has their place. I've seen what you could do in Mag 7+1. No way I'm gonna tell you how to run a war ;). My place turns out to be "good enough to know what I did wrong but dumb enough not to do it a second time". But I think that I've finally broken my habit of mining food bonuses in despotism.

The save is available in our gmail account.

Things to do this turn....
1. Move worker NW to forest to chop
2. Move scounting warrior S to hill
3. Always check happiness @ end of turn <-- Should be done every turn since no CAII

That should be it. It seems as though these saves are coming mid-morning on the east coast & I can't play until this afternoon.

The save is available in our gmail account.

Things to do this turn....
1. Move worker NW to forest to chop
2. Move scounting warrior S to hill
3. Always check happiness @ end of turn <-- Should be done every turn since no CAII

That should be it. It seems as though these saves are coming mid-morning on the east coast & I can't play until this afternoon.

I got it... will check in again soon

I think warrior west to the mountain to see how long that river runs.

Like I said earlier, and will futz with the spreadsheet again, I think we can keep citizens on the two roaded tiles till we finish the gran without waste, speed of finish or detriment to pop growth.

Does anyone know how to do a F11 analysis? I thought I read something on it but can't remember where. It might be valuable to keep an eye on this for when the others are popping settlers, economics etc.

The roaded tiles will start being worked next turn. The food didn't matter this turn (or the previous). Next turn we should be up to 3 pop and the FP wheat can be worked once again and from now on. I've went through and updated the turn number to coincide with our "turn number". I've also set the worker actions through 2430 BC (Turn 34) by then we'll have 4 cities & one more settler that was just made. I have the worker just roading the wines since that tile won't be used for a long time.

EDIT:::removed spreadsheet to update & move to a later post

Have we decided on a second city site?

My assumption is that it will go on the floodplain near the second exposed wheat.

If that is the case my next questions are...
1) Is our roaming warior exploring close in for city sites, or far out for contact?

2) Will we be sending settlers out without warrior protection to found new cities?

My favored course of action is to take the warior and explore those nearby mountains, then send him over to second wheat and scope out the best place for our second city (I vote for 'Dunderhead' as the name).

I *think* we are getting away with it this time, but the next player should turn on 'emphasize production'.

BTW Wines: Instead of 1 food + 1 commerce wines are 2 commerce and 0 food.

I think contact is important so the question is whether it's worthwhile to let the warrior in the capital explore the perimeter and exploring warrior meet someone. BTW these guys need names. Gene Simmons and....I don't know any other Kiss guys. :blush:

City 2...military or workers? In a Single player game this would be a no brainer with a worker pump. What are the risks of another civ rushing the capital and how long before they'd get to us? I am inclined to go worker pump still because I think it would take a while before anyone could reach the capital and by then city 3 would be in place. Big decision here so let's discuss.

Crakie's right emphasize production ASAP!

Since I named the capital I will refrain from giving my vote for the next cities.

Dunderhead has my vote. Why not alternate worker-warrior(or archer) in city 2 until city 3 gets online. With the wheat it should grow quicker than the worker can be produced.

BTW, I got an ok from Rik & Regent to check F11 in the old saves. No moving units or anything else. Just status of empire stuff. I'll report back tomorrow on what I find.

EDIT :::: removed the offending 'c' :whipped:

It's Rik, not Rick ... :mad: ;)

It's Rik, not Rick ... :mad: ;)
:worship: I'm sorry oh Great Killer Whale :worship:

:hammer: Please don't give me the red mod message
:cringe:

To collapse the discussion here and in the scouting thread, depending on what is revealed further out, the grassland between the goodyhut and the wheat, next to the river may be a good place for a city. Food, production, a safe goodyhut pop.

It may be the best of all possible worlds. In which case we may want to name it Dunderhead (Candide).

Well, since my suggestion has not been discussed, I repeat: we do have the option of changing our granary to warrior, without wasting the chop shields. The warrior would be produced with 2 shields wasted though. Had we discussed it earlier like I meant to, we would have produced it next turn without waste, if we had 'emphasize production' turned on.

I am leaning more towards upping the lux and let our warrior in the capitol scout the perimeter. Getting IW a turn or so later is not that important compared to city placement. Getting the granary up is asap is also very important.

If the hut doesn't pop after cultural expansion, I like kickbooti's suggestion for our second city.

I was just mentioning that the safest way to not get barbs out of the GH is to plant a city right next to it or be expansionist. Since we are not the latter then the former is the easiest way.

The warrior out first won't benefit us as much as the granary. I'd say let Dunder Head deal with military. Simpleton needs to focus on its specialty settlers.

EDIT::: the GH will pop on cultural expansion but the likelihood of barbs is 65%. if we plant next to it its 0%. I agree that city placement is more important than 25G, maps, and possibly a tech.

Crakie you may have been right and I was listening but getting that gran up seems a priority. What's the cost of running the warrior out from the capital?

Ok I've finished my homework. I went through turns 2-9 saves. Opened them up and got all of the information out of the F11 screen. I'll post it here once it's uploaded. It seems that whoever is Persia (or the Hittites) has pulled an early worker out on turn 8. That means that they probably have less military. You can also gather from the populations of the towns & the military service that Greece has at least one military scout.

EDIT::: I moved the spreadsheet to a new thread to be stickified

Excellent Tubby! That's really helpful. In fact, I think it should be dedicated to another sticky thread.

Do you want me to start it? Every turn I could update it. I might not be able to do it right away but now that Rik & Regent has given permission to go back to old saves for "status of the empire" stats it wouldn't take long to go back & update the spreadsheet.

EDit::: started the thread here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=125992). I've already asked Rik or Regent to put adhesive on it.

Crakie you may have been right and I was listening but getting that gran up seems a priority. What's the cost of running the warrior out from the capital?

Yeah, as it is now, getting the granary up is fine.

I think letting the second warrior scout will require at least 20 %, possibly 30%, lux to keep three citizens happy. This would probably increase the number of turns to get BW with 2 or 3.

I think its been discussed, but when do we road the grapes? That will effect the happiness.

Okay that was gratuitous. You guys know that it effects happiness. I'm still new and assume that everyone is a dunderhead like me :crazyeye:

We should irrigate+road (and afterwards: work) the wine tile, not the plains that will result after the chop. The commerce bonus of the wines will make up for the lack of river bonus. I hate to let a worker to leave a tile (the soon the be ex-forest in this case) without at least roading though.

I think its been discussed, but when do we road the grapes? That will effect the happiness. According to the spreadsheet (which is just a guide, but a useful guide), the road to the wines will be completed on turn 24. improving the other tiles are more important right now to get the settler factory up.

I'm still new and assume that everyone is a dunderhead like me :crazyeye:
No we're mostly idiots. ;)

According to the spreadsheet (which is just a guide, but a useful guide), the road to the wines will be completed on turn 24. improving the other tiles are more important right now to get the settler factory up.

According to the spreadsheet, we will be irrigating+roading the plains where the forest used to be, while working the (unimproved) bonusgrass tiles. Why not leave the forest tile unimproved, move to the wines, fully improve that one and then move on to the bonusgrass? (Yes, I do know I said I hate to leave tiles unimproved...) We can move from the wines to a river BG in one turn.

I've updated the spread sheet to show us leaving the plain after we finish the chop to go to the wines and road & irrigate them. If something isn't right let me know & I'll fix it & update the attachment

Looks great to me TR! :goodjob:

One more thing though, we seem to be able to get the required shields for the 4-turn factory even without mining the BGses. We should consider roading only as long as there is no need for it and the worker is more useful elsewhere. (The spreadsheet actually only mentions mining one BG, so we would gain 6 worker turns).

If we mine them then the we won't have to be as fickle about "Make sure you move the citizen from the forest to the bg." and such. Missing one of those can make things harder to deal with (experience).

EDIT::: save is available for anyone that can play it. As most of the time, I'll play this afternoon if it hasn't been played yet

Do we have the plan for this turnset? Please, please turn on emphasize production!!

Ok here's the list

1. turn on emphasize production in the governor screen
2. make sure that the cow, wheat, & a bg are being worked
3. move scouting warrior W to investigate river
4. move MP warrior SE-E to scout FP area
5. rename units for clarity
6. Check Happiness @ end of turn, always
7. optional, get all data out of F11. (I can get it tonight if you forget.)
8. save, exit, & send save to Doughnut, Ginger_Ale, & RegentMan

Turn 10 is up, we have not yet reached consensus/a majority on/for what to do with the MP warrior though. My vote goes to: let it scout the eastbank of the river (for starters).

I agree with scouting with the MP. What about the other warrior? Should he climb the mountain west or head east to uncover better city placements? Crakie can you name the warriors too. It helps idiots like me to identify them easier.

I was about to put something in the list about that. Going to the river is fine with me, but I wouldn't go much further not with just one city.

Go ahead and play if you can. We don't want to pull any attention away from TNT vs. MIA smackdown.

For Southpaw, I'd go W to get scouting along that river. then go SW to the mountain in turn 11.

For Southpaw, I'd go E to get scouting along that river. then go SW to the mountain in turn 11.

I think you mean W-SW (it's wrong in the to do list also).

Something came up, I cannot play it anymore. Go ahead and take it.

Yes I did mean W-SW for Southpaw.

I fixed both of my posts. & included move MP warrior to FP

I guess I'll play the turns...I just got a PM from Provolution asking me to play the save... :confused: :lol:

Well, I was going to play SW7, but I guess that can wait 10 minutes (sorry SW ;) ).

8. save, exit, & send save to Doughnut, Rik, & RegentMan
Just a reminder: Ginger_Ale and myself are the admins. Rik just made the map. He is also the moderator of this forum (i.e. you post naughty stuff, he'll be the one to punish you). He has no other position with the game.

Oh sorry. We have contacts already in our account for GA, Regent, & MIA. I'll fix the post. Thanks.

I just got a PM from Provolution asking me to play the save... Is this allowed?? Can we send PM's to the other teams to request people to play the save? Provo seems to be getting hornery (<- is that a word? )

Is this allowed?? Can we send PM's to the other teams to request people to play the save? Provo seems to be getting hornery (<- is that a word? )
...I think you mean ornery. ;)

Want me to post the message? (if that's allowed)

That would not be allowed (Playing the other team's save). It could set you up for violating espionage rules. Please forward me the PM; I'm sure Provolution made a simple mistake.

IP he wrote so there's no problem posting it in the Intel Thread.
I think it's best to let RegentMan handle this and we need to stay mum until we are asked to do something.
If someone on his team was smart they'd tell him to zip it and quick. He has not endeared himself to Classical, DaveShack or us.

OK we need to vote on the "posting to the turntracker rule".
Bede says yes.
I say "yes" but with some leniency. At least 3 warnings before penalty seems reasonable to me. What do you all think?
Yes, No or abstain.

EDIT::::

Tubby votes to vote to abstain
IroP can post with his own vote.... ;)

As Tubby had previously posted, I vote no. My reason is that I almost forgot to post there on Turn 8, so I know how it feels.

Sorry, IroP I didn't want to speak for you in case you had changed your mind.

The reason why I voted to vote to abstain is that by voting we are going to be "chosing a side". If we abstain we could still play both teams against each other, after we meet them of course ;).

I have posted for some clarification on the rule because I may change to NO if the penalty is harsh.

I so happy we have this team. We don't seem to have any problem moving the save....it almost brings a tear to my eye.....I love you guys man!

The amendment now looks like this. I'm sorry for any inconvience:

6.3.2 - Notification of Playing
Immediately after the save has been played and e-mailed to the proper people, the team's designated player must notify the MTDG community by posting in the designated "Turn Tracker" thread.

The only good diplomatic vote is abstain. Obviously if the penalty is a turn for an offense then vote NO.

But if it is not a big deal, vote to abstain. WE haven't had any trouble and I suspect that we won't after everyone that plays normally gets a couple of turns under their belt.

- If you vote YES, your perceived to be on Provo's side.
- If you vote NO then you are on Classic's side.

Let DaveShack decide between them and then we'll be able to play all three against each other.

The penalty will be the same as not playing within the 24 with some leniency.
I agree with Tubby and my vote is to abstain.

Given TR's analysis of the situation I think abstinence is the best.....

Regarding the Provolution PM incident: He didn't imply you playing TNT's save, he just saw you online and wanted to remind you to play when the save came your way, so that the game would keep moving.

Wow, listening to your political assesment's makes me feel like Kissinger's shoe-shine boy.

I'll vote to abstain too.

Hmm, after reading Tubby's analysis, I vote to abstain as well, as long as the penalty isn't too harsh.

Regarding the Provolution PM incident: He didn't imply you playing TNT's save, he just saw you online and wanted to remind you to play when the save came your way, so that the game would keep moving.
Oh, yeah, I knew he didn't want me to play TNT's save...is that what everyone else thought I meant? :confused: Sorry for the confusion.

I am going to post it as a vote to "abstain". I think that's a quorum.

@ IroP, no I didn't think that he wanted you to play for TNT. I was just concerned about him telling you to play.... It's really not a big deal but we only had the save for 2 hours and he's already pressuring us to play. We'll play when we're ready. Stop bother us.

We may get another save today as it was just sent to MIA.

Oh, yeah, I knew he didn't want me to play TNT's save...is that what everyone else thought I meant? :confused: Sorry for the confusion.
Oops... that what I thought.

We may get another save today as it was just sent to MIA.nope I just finished my SGOTM8 turns and was expecting this one to be there, but nada.

I just picked up the save from MIA and will take a look at it after work. It might be time for me to learn the routine :D

Edit: Played the turn on lunch but had to go back to work before posting. The scouting warriors, Average Joe and Peapants, have revealed some new terrain but no luxes. Our river Styx looks like a nice route to settle along and I suppose our future FPalace will be placed somewhere SE of Simpleton. I also got science down to 70% without losing speed on BW so now we're doing +1 g :clap:
Will post map and some stats later.

gone for a fewhours and already 3 pages down?
all this politiking makes my eyes hurt...
but ive grown a mean disliking to provo.
i would vote absain too, but only on the condition we get to put his revolutionary head on a pike outside our palace.
he really should learn to zip it.

*and i thought he was just speeding us up, not asking us to play his turns. just me and my devious mind. nobody would be that daft, right?

@ Daghdha, I'm at home for another hour or two. Have you already played?

@Tubby
Yes I have and hopefully there was no major idiocy being conducted. Now I will post the screenies on terrain and demographics and if I don't here a "hell no", I will send the .sav to d'nuts and admins.

Edit: Oh, and of course update the much debated turntracker :D
Edit2: Another thing before I post screenies. How is the safe procedure for getting them attached in the post, just to be sure.

If you've already exited it, it's too late regardless of any mis-clicks and other beffudle-try. We have to live with mistakes (I use to mine the heck out of food bonuses in despotism :blush: ).

If you still have it open then you can change it. If so make sure that we work the BG to the N of the river (just available from expansion) for the extra gold instead of the one S of the city. The citizens should be working the cow, wheat & bg @ the end of your turn.

@Tubby
Could've missed that but not sure :hmm:...:blush:

edit: I'm back at work so I have no save to look at but was it really possible to do the suggested move? Pop 3 means Johnny works the wheat, Joey works the cow and Dee Dee's at the boozer in Simpletons red light district. Who's to work a BG?

The turn is available in our inbox.

Things to do this turn:
optional, take screenshot @ beginning of turn of f11 screen Move warriors (E for the northern & W for the southern) make sure that the citizens are working the Cow, wheat, & BG (the one NE of the wheat) take a screenshot of the city screen for me please (I need a sanity check on the spreadsheet) Check for Happiness & to see if we can lower science & maintain same tech pace @ end of turn end your turn and email the new save to Regent, Ginger, & the 'nuts

That's all I have. I have to be @ work until 3 EDT which I'll play it if no one gets it by then or requests to play.

I posted a comment about a new rule change in the Dept. of General Musings thread so this one wouldn't get clogged up with a political discussion. Please review the new rule change in the Main MTDG forum and respond in the other thread.

I got it and will post in a minute.

I just realized something, we have to cut back on growth. the way we are running it now we will grow he same turn as we finish the granary. The we start with an empty granary. If we work the wheat, cow and the rest of the citizens work a forest then we can get the granary up one turn earlier. The downside is that growth is screwed up. I'll try to fool around with the spreadsheet. and come up with something.

Ok I got it. Below is the old version and the new version of the spreadsheet. The new one has yellow at the top for the turns that have already been played. This gets our granary up 1 turn earlier and still gets us 4-turn settlers immediately afterword.

EDIT:: Image1.gif is the old version. The new version is image2.... oh never mind, the one below is the new one. I'll put the old one on my previous post for posterity

EDITEDIT:: had to fiddle with it a bit latest version as of 1:45 pm EDT

A job well done, Tubby. Getting the granary right before growth is essential. Thank Rik we have such a wealth of tiles to choose from... let's hear it for flexibility! ;)

We are going to have to stick pretty strictly to this schedule of tiles to work. There is no more flexibility in the schedule. I tried playing with tiles a little and if anything is switched out, the then the settlers will be delay up to 3 or 4 turns.

So if anyone plays, they have to make sure that the tiles in the same line as the turn are worked by the citizens. It would be nice to check one last time before you end the turn that the amount of food and shields per turn in-game are the same as those on the spreadsheet.

Tubby, you are 'Da Man :goodjob:

I have never worked with a spreadsheet before, so like a caveman with fire - it is strange and wonderful to me. So as the official 'fire-bearer' for team K.I.S.S., you have the stunned awe of simple 'duffers,' such as me :worship:

KB

To do list in case nobody is around when the save becomes available.... move citizens to cow, wheat, & 2 of the forests. This is essential to not loose up to 3 turns in our settler factory continue scouting around rivers if worker has completed chop, then move to wines for roading check for happiness @ end of turn send save to Doughnuts and admins

Turn 13 is in. I got it.

Hmmm... in turn 13 the chop had finished but the worker had already moved. I think it had been chopping for 4 turns, so shouldn't it be able to move? This has probably something do to with Whomp already seeing the chop finishing at the end of his turn.

turn 13 was the 4th turn. Whomp said that things don't act the same as they do in SP mode. The chop finished this turn and the worker had used up his movement point at the beginning instead of at the end as it normally would. I put it the worker action in there just in case you could move him.

Where should we send the warriors to next?

The exact layout of the bend in the river is putting pressure on my brain, I argue for sending the eastern scout to the SW to see exactly what the layout is.

As I say, that request is in large part due to the voices I am hearing :crazyeye: so I could be talked out of it, but that particular patch of black tiles is annoying me.

Just wondering...

KB

Sounds good

Average Joe (Northeastern scout) should probably verify that there are no barb camps over that way

Peapants (Southwestern scout should continue south. Since this is a continent, I'd suspect that it is a N-S continent instead of an E-W continent. And a contact could be straight down.

OK I understand the worker finished the chop but I'm confused where he went. I didn't move him.

Looking @ Crakie's pic in the Turnplay log, I think that he meant that the movement points were used up (by finishing the chop). He didn't move anywhere. clear as mud?

OK I understand. The chop finished and the worker couldn't do anything so next turn he moves to the wines then road.

This is something that's a little different on a PBEM with the IT. It seems it's pre-turn instead of after-turn.
Turnplayers please watch the "save and exit" because in my other PBEM I had barbs pop up during that timeframe.

Whaddayamean barbs pop up? you mean out of the fog?

Correct out of the fog.
So my point is that any IT activity happens when you exit. You will see all other movement (IE Chop, military actions against us?) during the save and exit.

Things to do once the save comes in.... Research IW at max. optional, pull info out of f11 screen for me please. make sure that the 4 citizens are working the cow, wheat & 2 forests. Move Average Joe (Northeastern scout) to scout around river bend Move Peapants (Southwestern scout) towards the south. exactly which direction I dunno, just go where the most scouting can happen with the fewest moves. Check happiness @ end of turn hit enter, save, exit, email to d'nuts & admins, post in turn tracker.

EDIT:: Do you guys want me to continue to do this?? I don't want to be telling people what to do. I know when I play SG's it's nice to have objectives and direction when I play. Again, I don't want to come off dominering but at this stage in the game a mis-click could cause us to be behind.

For me it's excellent and if I'm to play and have doubts about the to-do-list, I'll post a Q before playing.

The save is available. If anyone wants it.

No keep summarizing the saves Tubby. BTW we can add another player. Anyone have someone they think we should add? I asked AK but I think he's trying to get back in the swing. Maybe someone else can explain he doesn't need to be altogether active right now.

Yeah, I find the list helpful, for now at least. When the later turns come where MM isn't as important, and the list would be 3 posts long, it wouldn't be as helpful.

Other people? I'll need to check the sign-up list first.

EDIT: Some people I thought of were Beorn, RowAndLive, Bigfoot, Greebley, and jb1964. They're all Emperor/DG players. I'm playing an AWE with Regicide on with all of them right now, and it's going pretty well.

Also, today's my account's first birthday! :band: [party]
I've been here longer than some of you (Whomp and Tubby, for example), and yet you have 2 or 3 times my posts. :lol:

For me it's excellent and if I'm to play and have doubts about the to-do-list, I'll post a Q before playing.
I agree with Daghdha, TR. I find it very helpful to have the thinking of people who play at a higher level than I do, and I'd ask if I had questions. Your summaries are great.

Keep up the summary, Tubby. Measure twice, cut once and all that jive.

Besides, your an important part of the glue that keeps us happy, healthy anarchists and not raging hordes of barbarians :viking:

Or souless beauracrats for that matter :borg:

KB

I don't really need the list, but I would really encourage you, Tubby, to keep doing it as long as humanly possible. It should prove really helpful to those playing at levels that do not require MM, and I wish I had participated in something like this when I was a n00b :)

Well Ok. I'll do it until we have a few cities under our belt or until people get tired of me. I'd rather think about playing civ than work any day!! ;) Once we meet someone, and/or it gets complicated, I'm going to default to the old grumpies. :D

I got the save... how exciting ;)

First of all, I got an 'encouragement' from this Provolution guy by PM:

We are waiting :)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

sending it to Doughnut soon ?

I could really do without that. I refrained from any sort of reply, but we might want to consider contacting the admins in the future to discourage this kind of overzealous behavior.

Second of all, we can afford to work the river BG once in the next 3 turns (for the extra food and commerce), working forests only will result in 1 shield waste. I know it will probably make little difference, but I just thought I'd mention it.

Third is the F11 screen.

We are waiting :)
That's crap. He has to stop doing this. There is no other team that moves a save as fast as we do. Grrrrr...
I will pm RegentMan.

[QUOTE=Crakie]First of all, I got an 'encouragement' from this Provolution guy by PM:

We are waiting :)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Awww, I wouldn't worry about it. I forget the coach that forbade dancing in the endzone, he told his players "just act like you belong there." Their encouragement is just water off a duck's back.

Or, if we need to couch it in religous terms (being religous and all) there is the old Heugenot poem...
"Hammer away, ye unregenerate hand.
Your hammer breaks, God's anvil stands."

Besides, being Machiavellian, we may need to make an alliance with them in the future.

All I asked is for RegentMan to tell him to cool his jets a bit. We have not delayed this game, ever. Nothing condescending.

We will not dance in the endzone however we will talk softly (and slowly) and carry a big fat SOD.

About the working the BG. We can afford to work the BG, but if we work it too much then we won't get the shields and we'll end up wasting food. I'd rather waste 1 shield then grow at the same turn as the granary finishes. But yes. It doesn't matter too much.

I got the info from f11. You can ditch the attachment Crakie. It'll be posted in the Dept. of G&N in a minute...

About Provo. This is what I was talking about when he PM'ed IroP. I knew that he wasn't trying to get IroP to play his turns, but I thought that there was something fishy about him asking us to play early before there we had 5 hours after we received our email... Go get him coach...

We are waiting
Actually...Doughnut is the one waiting...If Provo hadn't said anything, he probably wouldn't get the save any later than he will now. :rolleyes:

About which way to explore, I say we head straight south. I'd say it's obvious that that's the direction the other team on our continent is in (well...they could be West, too. Rik may have done two E-W continents, instead of what everyone expects, N-S), so the sooner we head south, the sooner we meet them and we know what shape our continent is.

We still haven't explored our entire starting position, but that's what Average Joe is for.

@ Crakie. I think that you sent the save that you got from MIA. You need to send the D'Nuts the KISS save not the MIA save. I wouldn't worry too much about the time since we have plenty of time before the time limit is up.

Actually...Doughnut is the one waiting...If Provo hadn't said anything, he probably wouldn't get the save any later than he will now. :rolleyes:
I know absolutely nothing about Provo except what I've read in this forum lately, but I think I know what he's up to. I think he's trying to get us rattled...either feeling pressured and hurried or even just getting angry with him. If we're rattled, he probably figures our player might lose their concentration and make mistakes, and THAT could only be good for his team. That may be what he's up to with his potshots at Classical Hero too.

I don't know if he's that sophisticated, but it makes for an interesting strategy if that's what he's up to. If that's it and it works, you can just imagine his team laughing about it in their forum. I wouldn't want to give them the satisfaction. I wonder if there's anything we could do to rattle him. :mischief:

What should we do about the save? I could play it again and then send the save to D'nut. But that's not right I don't think. I'd hate to cause a delay because of an oversight like sending the wrong save. :confused: what to do?? :confused:

Which direction do we want to go with our western explorer? I think due south might be a good idea.

What should we do about the save? I could play it again and then send the save to D'nut. But that's not right I don't think. I'd hate to cause a delay because of an oversight like sending the wrong save. :confused: what to do?? :confused:
Just wait for Crakie to send the correct one. There's no reason to risk an espionage trial over this.

Sorry guys, I sent the correct save. Provolution apparently succeeded in pissing me off.

about all thjis Provo babble.
i have a quote for you guys -
Revenge is a dish best served cold

since tubby is doing the todo list ( :goodjob: ) and we have atleast medium range plans, dont let him annoy you too much.

my vote would be to have him between our sights, waiting for that moment.... :evil:

ill try and get the next save, as i feel some have played lots and me only one turn.

About the working the BG. We can afford to work the BG, but if we work it too much then we won't get the shields and we'll end up wasting food. I'd rather waste 1 shield then grow at the same turn as the granary finishes. But yes. It doesn't matter too much.

I know, Tubs... I said work it ONCE during the next three turns. This would gain us the large sum of 1 (!!!!) extra gold and 1 (!!!!) extra food (13 instead of 12)... I thought I'd mention it because in rare cases it could shave a turn of our research.

I wonder if there's anything we could do to rattle him I'd say staying cool dudes and not responding at all. We're best off laying all grudges away and base decisions purely on facts available. Remember we figured the bad blood btw classical and provo could serve us well. Let's not involve in any of that. If an alliance with TNT is the best option for us in the future we should not hesitate to sign one just because we think on of their members are a bit annoying. I'm sure his behavior is ment to psych us like "Now we'll show them how fast we can play" and then we make mistakes. No need for that. We have our 24 so let's use 'em. Might even be good to wait with posting save until last hour. Especially after those kind of comments. That's one way to reply ;) .

I thought I'd move this pic to an updated post. Crakie is correct. The BG can be worked in the next 2 turns. To keep things easier on the turn-players, we'll change to the BG on turn 16. That way no further changes will be needed until the growth.

I. IMPORTANT THINGS

Thanks Tubby and Crakie for MM and getting every bit of production out of our empire.

I know the production list on Tubby's spreadsheet is proposed, but when should we produce a defensive unit? Would it be wise to make a spearman before our settler for happiness purposes and just on the off chance that they stumble across our happy kingdom while the warriors are out scouting?

II. THE INSANE

I'm with Dhaghdha and Soul Warior, don't let the competition rattle you, we will have to base our future decisions on facts and self-interests; remember that politics makes for strange bedfellows.

I simply console myself with the advice of that sage for the ages, Homer Simpson...

"Just do what I do, Lisa. Shove all your rage into a cold little ball in the pit of your stomach and let it explode at a socially inapporopriate moment; like when I threw the whiskey bottle at the referee's head."

Just make sure we empty a couple of bottles so we're ready :beer:

KB

On point #1. I know I don't mind doing it and I don't think that Crakie does either. I guess that means your welcome. But the day when my usefulness will soon draw nye. Defense will be the #1 job of the next city. We will have a new city approx. every 4-5 turns. So the 3rd or even the 4th could start on the workers. I'd rather the 3rd.

I'd also bring Average Joe (Northern warrior) back home for that very reason.

On point #2. Yes that small cold ball will explode in a flurry of empty whiskey bottles. Should we get Barbslinger on our team??

On point 1--most important is expansion. Settler factory from 4 to 6 will see us leap in score like no one's business. The Iroquois made a blunderous move IMO. 2nd city can focus on military(maybe a worker when we make contact) and 3rd city should be workers (maybe military if needed).
On point 2--Being of Italian descent we say "Keep your friends close and your enemies closer"......then point at the scoreboard. I believe I read Provo is a lobbyist by trade so is masterful in using words to rattle people. Do not let him bother you.

On new players. I've pm'd AK again and he said he would not be able to participate much but said he'd join. I forwarded the link. My original PM to bring this crew together included 'Slinger. Should I ask him again?

If drinking & playing and toting a gin are involved, I'd guess he would jump on it. I'm in my first game with him right now but it hasn't really started yet (Double Secret Probation). He sounds like a fun guy and from what I gather really knows the game very well.

I'd ask him again.

Oh BTW, if you load the MIA save into CAII, it shows that city before anything happens that turn. In order to find out what our city really looks like you have to load the save that we send to the D'nut factory.

KB's point #1: Thanks for the kind words, but I'm sure in no time I will be the one thanking people. I am a mere demigod/good-start-deity player, while some on our team beat Sid... I think.

I share your concern for early defense but I think getting the settler factory up ASAP is of foremost importance. Our second city will probably go near the goody hut, an excellent location to start cranking out military. The third can alternate warriors and workers (near the second FP-wheat).

Point #2: We seem to agree not to let Provolution's pedantic behavior get in our way of victory... let's close the discussion about it :D

My thanks go out to TR and Crakie as well. And the most important thing we do right now is make settlers and warrior escorts. Anything else is a snare and delusion.

On 'slinger - strong warrior. Overall good player and welcome addition to the team.

Keep those babies coming guys. :thumbsup:

to do list for turn 15: Do not move the citizens this turn (Should be working cow, wheat, & 2 forests.) have the worker start roading those vineyards move Average Joe (Northern scout) back to Simpleton Move Peapants (Southern scout) straight to the south. check for happiness @ the end of turn. hit enter, save, exit, send email to D'nuts & admins, post in turn log.

Can I recomend adding a turn or two to Average Joe's (N Scout) to Simpleton and finish scouting the bend in the river?

Unless population increase would create happiness/production problems in the extra turn or two that would add, it would be nice to know the geography so we could difinitively map out at least three cities.

Since Provo's been being a jerk to everyone, I'm very concerned about leaving our only city undefended for any longer than we have to. I didn't expect that warrior to be gone for that long when we had him scouting. Right now we are looking @ 5 turns before that Average Joe gets back to his MP duties. That's pretty scary if a foreign warrior pops out of the fog.

I'd really like to get him back ASAP. Btw, if he goes W-W-W-NW-NW to get back home the river will be scouted (at least 1-tile on either side of it.)

Here is a screenie from CAII

One thing to bear in mind on Average Joe, though not a very attractive option if someone shows up, we can play the gambit of letting him explore a little longer because we could pop rush a couple spears in the capital.

No way... Then we would be in the same hole that D'nut put themselves into by getting that settler out first.

If a foreign unit shows up before those 5 turns are up then sure pop rush the spear, but that is my last resort.

I hate pop rushing in the settler factory, did it once in a sid game, and my citizens were unhappy for 20 turns, and it cost me a lot of money towards lux.

Though I usually like CXXC spacing, we have expanding competitors, and we don't have time to get decent land if we need to build so many more cities. Second city should probably go on the grassland west of the regular warrior.

Btw, nobody's played turns in a while. What's the deal?

Let's do this....

Move Ave. Joe W this turn and discuss this before turn 16. That way. We can see what is immediately around the river and if something is REALLY interesting and needs checking out then sure, lets investigate. I'm still kind of nervous about an undefended capital.....

Agreed Tubby. I think that works.
Average Joe will not be the only one to cover the capital if we get bum rushed. We will have to pop rush if someone doesn't back off our borders on contact.

I got a little idea- send a warrior over to ou neighbor, and they'll have to pop rush a unit or two, and then we go away. It will cost them pop, shields, and happiness :groucho: .

That's what Peapant's mission is :evil:. That's not a bad idea. We even could declare on them and steal their worker. It would be a while before the other continent could invade and by then we would be ready.

If it's D'nut or MIA, then we might have to think twice about this strategy but if TNT's on our continent, I'm sure that the other 2 teams wouldn't mind getting rid of them. :D

Don't get rid of them. All that time they bothered to sign up, whichimadoodad, don't end it for them cruelly like this. Just cripple them, steal their worker, force them to pop rush somefing, pillage roads, etc.

I think Tubby's proposed course of action with Ave. Joe sounds good.

As for city placement, I sent a proposal for the next two in that thread.

I also love the idea of Peapants finding our opposition and making them sweat...

I am anxious to find out who are neighbors are. This should be interesting.

Why are we so sure the others are in the south? They could be west. It is a custom map after all.

Habit mainly. good point.

You could be right Crakie. It doesn't make sense to go diagonally though since more space can be covered by going a cardinal direction. The likelihood of our continental neighbor being as far from us is very good. Since Peapants is more south from our coordinates (when compared to east & west) it just makes sense to continue that way until we either hit a beach or an opponent. Then east or west would be the next direction.

:hmm: Good point Crakie. You'd think we would've made contact to the south.
Most of our darkness seems to be to the west. Should we send Peapants back west and north?
Signed,
Mr. Decisive

Most of the darkness is to the west because it also comprises of the east if you go far enough. The world is not a sphere, it's a cylinder. I stay by my original direction. Go south until beach or opponent is discovered then head east or west (whichever looks better).

If our continent happens to stretch east-west and we continue heading south we will hit the coast soon enough. So yes, I think heading south is fine. By the way, in that case (east-west continent), we will probably find our neighbours on the same lattitude westwards. I doubt Rik would make it easier for one civ to contact the other continent, i.e. curraghs will have to travel roughly the same amount of squares.

So we say just cripple but no kill, for the niceness and to avoid a dogpile?

I think that a dog pile would be inevitable. I think that before we declare on anyone we would really need the "approval" of at least one other team. Maybe not an alliance but something to say "ok, we're not going to come after you for fighting with the other team". Does that make sense??

I think that making them have to pop-rush a spear or something woudl be great. but taking a worker is a DoW and I don't know if we are ready for that....yet.

DoW :confused: ?

Does that make sense??

Sorta, how about we ally with one Team, and it will force them to ally as well. That way we can avoid dogpiles. When it's down to us and our ally, we can duke eachother out without dogpile worries.

DoW = declaration of War

OK I got the save. I'lll be back later.

EDIT::: played & nothing to report. All is well on the homefront.

Since Dave & Provo have already played and Classic should play this morning here are the Turn 16 to do's: Move citizen from orange X to orange O as shown below(Citizens in simpleton should be working cow, wheat, forest & BG) Move Ave. Joe either pink or blue route back (shown below) back to Simpleton Continue Peapants and a direct south route Check for happiness @ end of turn press enter, save & exit, send save to D'nut & admins, post in turn tracker.

I suggest putting city 2 one northeast.

Oh I was just fooling around with the cities. The only one that is actually in the plan is 1.

Is three by a river? I can't tell.

Yes. the river is SW of it. It is also the planted on a wine tile. These are just me playing though. I forgot to take them off before the screenshot was taken.

Should City 1 be moved 1 tile SW? Like Bede said, our agricultural prowess will do wonders on the river so the wheat isn't as essential; especially if City 1 is for military and City 2 is for workers.

I like the spot for city two. I prefer to be inside the river. With the river wheat, river bg's, forest all look pretty good to me.
If City 3 is on the wines will it give a commerce boost in the city of 2.

Should City 1 be moved 1 tile SW? Like Bede said, our agricultural prowess will do wonders on the river so the wheat isn't as essential; especially if City 1 is for military and City 2 is for workers.No. Right now City #1 is on a regular grassland and on a river. If we move it SW it will be on a BG. I'd liek to keep the BG's open for the citizens to work. City 2 & 3 are still open for discussion though. I'll post this in the City planning thread so this won't get clogged up with city planning talk.