View Full Version : Orthanc's Creation Thread


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HunterAnubis
May 09, 2008, 05:51 AM
yea its there. I gess those doors are open on the picture you got there thus making it like there are none :)

Hikaro Takayama
May 09, 2008, 02:20 PM
NIIIIIICE!!!

Now, if you get this done before the FF mod goes beta (I give even odds for that... especially with all the SW graphics I'm going to need for all the summoned creatures), then I'll use it as the Ghost Ship "fiend" unit.

Orthanc
May 10, 2008, 11:27 AM
Thanks!
Well I've put up the railings, the Kraken-summoning-hammer-thingy and the steering wheel, so the hull is now done, onto the masts!
It's taking about 4 1/2 minutes to render each image now:
http://img392.imageshack.us/img392/962/p7mc8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Either the fortify, fidget, victory or maybe one of the attacks will have the 'Kraken hammer' wind up and come down (I'll be sure to add the shockwave), here's the up position for comparison:
http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/2845/p7bvl6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
EDIT: Just realized this thing is only supposed to have one anchor. That would explain why the one that is there is, quite massive. I'll have it fixed in the next preview.

Sword_Of_Geddon
May 10, 2008, 02:06 PM
Nice your really skilled at boat building Orthanc....you've been missed

HunterAnubis
May 10, 2008, 04:29 PM
cant wait Cant Wait CANT WAIT!!!!!

I wonder how will the animations look like. But with your skills its going to be one of THE units :king:

Gen. Rommel
May 12, 2008, 07:13 AM
This looks amazing!

May I suggest making the Kraken summon the second attack animation. The first would obviously be the immense cannon fire from all the ship's armament.

I think a sweet fortify would be the ship submerging like it does in the movies...or will that be the normal "run" animation of the ship?

How about throwing one of the ship's sailors off the deck and into the water for the fidget?

Sword_Of_Geddon
May 14, 2008, 09:33 AM
That might be asking for alittle to much :lol:

Orthanc
May 14, 2008, 10:35 AM
The problem with the ship submerging for the fortify is it would have to go back down again during the last attack in order to flow with it rising up in the beginning of the first attack, which would look weird and quickly get annoying with the ship constantly going down and coming back up again during a battle. I'm thinking the animations are going to go something like this:

Default: Sitting there as usual
Run: Normal above water run
Fidget: Submerge and rise up (so that animation will be rather lengthy, but fidget only happens once in a while so it won't look weird when it happens)
Fortify: Bow cannon ports open and bow cannons pop out (even though they won't be used in the standard attacks, still looks like the ship is getting ready to fight)
Attack A: Broadside
Attack B: Kraken hammer rises, comes down
Attack C: Kraken Tentacles whip around
*other attack options, you'll have to change the ini file if you want these, suggest you don't mix them with the default attacks*
Attack D: Bow cannons (facing towards enemy)
Attack E: Kraken Hammer (facing towards enemy)
Attack F: Kraken Tentacles (ditto)
Victory: Not much animation, but the sound will be a clip of Davy Jones playing his theme on the organ
Death: Sinks, to show that it really is dead and not just submerging there will be some masts coming down too

Sword_Of_Geddon
May 14, 2008, 10:49 AM
:goodjob: Sounds great Orthanc....

Gen. Rommel
May 14, 2008, 11:07 AM
Wow, very nice plans you have there. I can't wait to see these hehe. This model is insanely detailed and accurate...anyone who knows here by now knows that I have a detail fetish.

Deth McBones
May 14, 2008, 11:12 AM
:run::eek::bowdown::woohoo::drool::wow::mwaha: :suicide:
I can't believe it! When you complete this, you are going to be my favorite person alive on this earth! I'm going to add this to every personal mod I ever started! (not really..) This unit is going to be one of the best ever made....thank you so much for starting it!

Sword_Of_Geddon
May 15, 2008, 04:21 PM
So how's Mr. Tenticle-face's ship coming Orthanc master of the shipyard? :)

Orthanc
May 15, 2008, 08:44 PM
You mean Davy Jones' Flying Crocodile Machine?
http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/4257/p8pe5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
It's Masting.

HunterAnubis
May 15, 2008, 09:48 PM
seems quite high without sails or maybe its just my imagination

Orthanc
May 15, 2008, 10:33 PM
Masts are always a bit tricky to get the sizing right with, I've done a bunch of tweaks already as well as put on the last mast, tomorrow I'll try and get some previews of this with the sails up (sails might not have their seaweed texture, I'll put that in when the sails are right), will probably need more tweaking after that, which is a bit of a pain with the sails already up, but I won't have to "imagine them in".

I must say, from the video clips I've been watching the Dutchman has very tall top and top gallant sails (that's the 2nd and 3rd sails up, the Dutchman has 3 sails on the fore and main masts and just one normal sail on its mizzen), particularly the top gallant of its main mast is GINOURMOUS, you can see it around 5:14 here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1Gx9fpy0kI).

HunterAnubis
May 16, 2008, 05:54 AM
yea your right its quite taller to black perl http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2_CtuAnge8&feature=related at 4 55
btw is it just coinsidence that there are czech subs or your a czech?

Gen. Rommel
May 16, 2008, 07:08 AM
particularly the top gallant of its main mast is GINOURMOUS, you can see it around 5:14 here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1Gx9fpy0kI).

I would say that is also greatly in part due to the skewing of the actual picture in that video. The scale of the width is not accurate and far too skinny for the height of the video's picture. That way, the height of the ship (including its masts) is dramatically unproportioned.

I don't know if you've seen these already, but they may help with the mast problem:

http://seiroth.fortunecity.com/davy/images/theflying-dutchman/dutchman_plan.jpg
http://shanny.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/dutchmanresize.jpg

Virote_Considon
May 16, 2008, 10:21 AM
Coming along nicely! :thumbsup:

Orthanc
May 16, 2008, 09:38 PM
Thanks again!

Gen. Rommel, your first image isn't showing up for me, and yes I have seen the 2nd image. The youtube vid is noticeably stretched, I watched the real movie to compare, conveniently that gave me the chance to compare my unit to the real thing. You'll notice in your 2nd image image that the real-life Flying Dutchman doesn't have very much mast above the crow's nest, because the sails and masts above that are completely digital, so the Flying Dutchman in the movie itself is the only one that is 'complete'.

Anyways, as mentioned the masts are all up, and I've got sails on the Fore mast. I'm working on the sail texture right now, preview of that also included, I'm thinking of putting a design on them (or maybe just some of them) rather than my standard 3-civ-colored-stripes. The black parts will be transparent:
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/3276/p9alr4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/9354/p9bli3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

EDIT: Here's the design I'm thinking of, I'd probably put it on the Top sail (remember that's not 'literally' the topmost sail) as well as the lateen sail on the mizzen mast and leave all the other sails with just the plain texture:
http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/723/p9cii2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Gen. Rommel
May 16, 2008, 10:56 PM
Oh, you're right, they extended the masts in the movies (most likely digitally). And I must say, with the sails on it, I seems to be looking just fine. So keep working with them! :goodjob:

And by god, that texture and the design look superb! How did you do it by the way (the design, that is)?

Orthanc
May 16, 2008, 11:46 PM
Photoshop, pen tool. The heart is a default shape, but the rest I drew.

For the texture I just went crazy with tiny brush strokes, which is easy (and fun) when one possesses a tablet.

EDIT: Got most of the sails and a bunch of the ropes up, once I've got all the ropes up there's a few fore-aft running sails to put in, plus the jibs at the front. But then, it'll be done.
If aaglo is reading, this file is, surprisingly, my largest POV Ray file at 62.5 kb, even the Ragnarok was only 60 kb!
http://img356.imageshack.us/img356/6396/p10xg4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

HunterAnubis
May 18, 2008, 12:09 AM
for some reason that hearth on the sails doesnt fit on pirate ship to much altho it looks great by it self but I gess thats me again

Gen. Rommel
May 18, 2008, 05:21 AM
for some reason that hearth on the sails doesnt fit on pirate ship to much altho it looks great by it self but I gess thats me again

But if you consider the story of PoC3, it makes perfect sense to have a heart, since whoever possesses the heart of Davey Jones also controls the ship. So in essence, the heart is also the heart of the ship.

HunterAnubis
May 18, 2008, 12:21 PM
good point on that one

Orthanc
May 18, 2008, 01:18 PM
Yeah, the fact is there just isn't a better suited symbol for ol' Davy than a heart, and anyways there were real pirate flags with hearts on them, they were usually bleeding, this one has tentacles.

Come to think of it (this is just a tad off-topic) I would be totally shocked if Kingdom Hearts 3 (not that I've played any of those games or know when the next is coming out, I just hear about them lots) didn't have Davy Jones in it, I mean come on, guy without a heart, a key to said heart that he carries everywhere, no stretch of plot required to fit him in at all *does a search to see if anyone's had that idea already*

On that note, I was considering putting a key over the heart on the sail design, but at civ scale I think it would make the heart to unrecognizable.

Anyways, back to the ropes I go.

Stormrage
May 18, 2008, 02:54 PM
Wow.. thats awesome.. just awesome..

Sword_Of_Geddon
May 18, 2008, 04:06 PM
Nice job...time has not dulled your skills.

Gen. Rommel
May 18, 2008, 06:16 PM
Come to think of it (this is just a tad off-topic) I would be totally shocked if Kingdom Hearts 3 (not that I've played any of those games or know when the next is coming out, I just hear about them lots) didn't have Davy Jones in it, I mean come on, guy without a heart, a key to said heart that he carries everywhere, no stretch of plot required to fit him in at all *does a search to see if anyone's had that idea already*

On that note, I was considering putting a key over the heart on the sail design, but at civ scale I think it would make the heart to unrecognizable.

Yeah, that definitely fits perfectly to the Kingdom Hearts story! As you said, no lame stretches within the storyline required to fit him in as a character at all. They could do some pretty cool stuff using him...that said, I think there's a very good chance that he WILL be added.

And about the design, I don't see any reason to modify it further (with a key, or anything else to be honest). For me, it looks perfect right now, and the design looks both fantastic at civ-scale and at normal scale. Just get the other things done and release, no need to add anything more when it's unneeded. BTW, I must once again say, this model is absolutely stunning! :goodjob:

Sword_Of_Geddon
May 18, 2008, 06:29 PM
I can't wait for alot of the units on Orthancs list. The Meso ships and the Orion especially. And I am curious about the African ship set. Should be good!

Orthanc
May 18, 2008, 06:43 PM
Nice job...time has not dulled your skills.

Well I've spent 2 years at an art college so far (4 more to go, w00t), so I'd hope that the reverse is true, not that they've taught me anything about POV Ray, but art is art!

Sometime over the next 4 years of school they'll start teaching me how to use 3ds max or maya (my school probably uses both) professionally, when that time comes I'll see whether I'll keep using POV Ray for Civ3 or switch over, either way I'll only do whatever I think will improve my units.

Meanwhile, 3 jibs to go! Well, technically, I think, only the fore-aft sails attached to the bowsprit are jibs, and the fore-aft sails running between masts are called stays, in which case I've got 3 stays left to put in...:
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/7324/p11ain7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/7816/p11bzr5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

BadKharma
May 18, 2008, 08:13 PM
It is looking exceptional. I have a tablet myself quite handy aren't they? Although I find allot of times I just use the pen tool with the mouse.

Orthanc
May 18, 2008, 09:10 PM
Thanks!
Yes, I was ecstatic when I got my tablet (I think I mentioned it in this very thread), I actually find the pen tool much nicer when I use the tablet pen. It makes sense in words, in practice to each his own.
I use the mouse entirely when in POV Ray and for just about everything else, but opening up Photoshop and switching to the pen always gives my artist side (which is the biggest 'side') a warm fuzzy feeling.

The last sail is in, but I'm tweaking it, and I just remebered I still have to model the triple guns, which is dead easy (a hollowed out cone x3 x2) and a tentacle (each will be the same just move differently), which is less trivial but I have done something quite similar before (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=5717014).

Sword_Of_Geddon
May 19, 2008, 07:27 AM
Orthanc one quick question is the "Arsenal Gear" from the MG series? This may be a stupid question.

Orthanc
May 19, 2008, 10:35 AM
Not stupid question, answer be yes.

To entertain you guys while I figure out the Tentacle motions, it's the happy tentacle dance!
http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/7374/tentdancelp0.gif (http://imageshack.us)
Now on YouTube!:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4D90DrWCIag

Hikaro Takayama
May 19, 2008, 09:44 PM
Come to think of it (this is just a tad off-topic) I would be totally shocked if Kingdom Hearts 3 (not that I've played any of those games or know when the next is coming out, I just hear about them lots) didn't have Davy Jones in it, I mean come on, guy without a heart, a key to said heart that he carries everywhere, no stretch of plot required to fit him in at all *does a search to see if anyone's had that idea already*

Now I have even MORE of an excuse to add this unit to the Final Fantasy mod as the barbarian sea unit. :evil:

...And with all the underwater/underwoldly stuff and the tentacle factors involved with Davy Jones, one must wonder if he wasn't in cahoots with the dread Cthulhu (the entrance to his realm looks like it would have not been too far from where R'lyeh was supposed to be).....

Orthanc
May 19, 2008, 10:36 PM
There definately must've been some Cthulhu inspiration for ol' Davy, I agree that the two would've gotten along famously.
Speaking further of tentacles, here's the motions I've come up with, the Kraken attack will consist of one or two of each different movement swarming a bit aways from the Dutchman. One thing I'm wondering, should I civ-color the tentacles or leave em green (staying green shouldn't give any palette issues, I'm gonna need lots of greens for the hull anyways):
http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/8869/tentdance1zv3.gif (http://imageshack.us)

Might make a tentacle unit quickly after the Dutchman, since I've already got models and animations, I'm sure there's a Kraken or something out there already, but would any be interested in just a tentacle or two?

HunterAnubis
May 19, 2008, 11:08 PM
3rd and 5th tentacle are dancing :D I hope they will attack to at attack B

Stormrage
May 20, 2008, 05:08 AM
Keep `em green I say. But is it possible to texture their green side a bit more slimy and sleek? They kinda look more reptilian or like worms now..

Gen. Rommel
May 20, 2008, 08:49 AM
Keep `em green I say. But is it possible to texture their green side a bit more slimy and sleek? They kinda look more reptilian or like worms now..

I have to agree with this...a slightly wetter, slimier look would be better, because at the moment they look too rubbery. Also, would a more brownish tentacle color rather than a green be out of order. I've never seen a green octopus or squid tentacle to be honest, and something a bit more brown seems better in my opinion.

When you posted that first video, it totally reminded me of Day Of The Tentacle (http://youtube.com/watch?v=2BRXmgcBHBM)! Man that brings back memories. Made me laugh! :lol:

HunterAnubis
May 20, 2008, 10:44 AM
actualy they remind me catrpilar or worm but I still think theyer great

Orthanc
May 20, 2008, 10:49 AM
Well actually an octopus can become just about any color it wants (texture too!), but then the Kraken seems more like a squid anyways.
So I've made the tentacles browner, also changed the texture to be more reflective, should look a bit slimier that way. Also made back and forth wiggling motions, and made the old side-to-side wigglers sway back and forth:
http://img356.imageshack.us/img356/4996/tentdance2wq9.gif (http://imageshack.us)

Sword_Of_Geddon
May 20, 2008, 10:54 AM
I say the tenticles are done...time for some cannon action...triple cannons....fire!

Gen. Rommel
May 20, 2008, 10:56 AM
They look perfect now Orthanc! I agree with SoG, they look to be done and ready for rendering. :goodjob:

Chris85
May 20, 2008, 11:06 AM
Wow! That's freakin sweet! :eek:

Virote_Considon
May 20, 2008, 11:14 AM
I agree with the above! :goodjob:

Quinzy
May 20, 2008, 01:02 PM
Holy smudder cluckin'... Man, that has to be made a unit by itself. :D

Hikaro Takayama
May 20, 2008, 01:48 PM
Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn....

Er, I mean, they look great!

HunterAnubis
May 20, 2008, 04:23 PM
They look cool but question is how will it look with the ship

Orthanc
May 22, 2008, 06:54 PM
Thanks again everyone:)

Just an FYI, animating has begun.

Madeira
May 24, 2008, 07:55 AM
That looks really cool! :)

odintheking
May 25, 2008, 08:56 PM
Oh my god that's cool!!

HunterAnubis
May 28, 2008, 02:18 PM
so I gess your all waiting for my post so master shipyard boss could post his work so far :D

BadKharma
May 28, 2008, 02:53 PM
The Brown looks good the latest motion looks good, I cannot wait to see the final result.

Wyrmshadow
May 29, 2008, 07:28 AM
I have a suggestion for a new unit. It will be much simpler but more useful than your present project. The Great Eastern.

Ozymandias
May 29, 2008, 08:10 AM
I have a suggestion for a new unit. It will be much simpler but more useful than your present project. The Great Eastern.

Good idea :) The Great Eastern: http://www.greatoceanliners.net/greateastern.html

-Oz

Orthanc
May 29, 2008, 11:14 AM
Good idea :) The Great Eastern: http://www.greatoceanliners.net/greateastern.html

-Oz

Wow, that boat never had a good time did it?

I'll keep it in mind, looks like a neat build, but the to-do list is currently of nigh-eternal length:sad:

Anyways, I really hope to have the Dutchman done for the end of the month (so I can get back into the competitions). Not sure if that will happen, but that's my goal.

Orthanc
May 30, 2008, 09:03 PM
Yet another double post due to relevant progress!

I've got the default, fortify run and fidget done, just wondering what you guys think of the fidget:
http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/7475/fidget1et6.gif (http://imageshack.us)

Sword_Of_Geddon
May 30, 2008, 09:50 PM
No problems here.

HunterAnubis
May 31, 2008, 12:54 AM
I thought theres gona be some tentacle for fidget but this looks ok to

Stormrage
May 31, 2008, 07:04 AM
Can`t see :(

Orthanc
May 31, 2008, 12:09 PM
Yeah my computer's caught a bit of a bug which has been causing various issues with my internetz, the image cut out for me too, but I've re-uploaded it, hopefully it works for everyone now.

Just realized my original plan was for the fidget to be the submerge/emerge animation, so what I'll do is just rename Fidget to Victory.

Here's hoping I can animate the attacks quickly!

Stormrage
May 31, 2008, 12:44 PM
I saw it, ts amazing.. :wow:

Orthanc
May 31, 2008, 09:54 PM
Boat, looks like this won't be finished for the May competitions.

Oh well, it'll certainly be finished soon, I wouldn't be surprised if I could have it out by tomorrow night.
But in the meantime, while my computer renders as-if-its-going-out-of-style, prepare to broadside:
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/1629/attacka1hn7.gif (http://imageshack.us)

Sword_Of_Geddon
May 31, 2008, 10:05 PM
Nice.....can't wait for the triple cannons!

Stormrage
Jun 01, 2008, 04:16 AM
I like it alot!

BadKharma
Jun 01, 2008, 11:48 AM
The attack looks awesome. The original fidget that you posted that will now be the victory looks really good. Cannot wait to see the new fidget with the submerge.

Orthanc
Jun 01, 2008, 09:08 PM
Thanks again everyone, really appreciate you guys stickin around this thread!

*sigh* Okay looks like it won't be done today either, I'm going to just say it'll be done when it's done, cause obviously I can't predict when I'll finish things, lol.

The fidget is rendering now and I'm quite happy with how it looks, but I'll save the preview for the release so that you have something to look forward too:D. Just have Attacks C and D (E too, but it's nearly identical to C so it hardly counts) and the Death to deal with.

In other news, remember that Arsenal Gear is next line, but I also hope to do return to working on my nigh-abandoned POV-Ray tutorial while I work on Arsenal. Good times!

HunterAnubis
Jun 03, 2008, 07:04 AM
YES ARSENAL!!! I hope I wount by on vacation before its finished :)
btw Have you thought of making all Metal Gears + other related stuf?

Orthanc
Jun 08, 2008, 09:43 PM
Well HunterAnubis I've already made Rex (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=5512821) and Ray (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=161944) if that's what you mean. While we lack a Solid Snake, I need not mention once more the current to-do list length.

And while I'm going link happy, guess what's done! Something! A boat! How unlike me to make a boat!:D

Sail the Dutchman here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=6904418).

Balthasar
Jun 08, 2008, 09:57 PM
I've been keeping an eye on this thread too...Great work on this one Orthanc. It's perfect.

HunterAnubis
Jun 08, 2008, 11:21 PM
Ive been here when you made them remember? But Ive ment making Gekko, Metal Gear D,Metal Gear RAXA,Shagohod,Metal Gear GANDER....and that ry could use better walk and colours by my opinion :D

That dutcham is superb :D
(btw no one cares but I upgraded my ship to lvl 8 in one online game he he he)

BadKharma
Jun 09, 2008, 11:13 AM
Amazing job on the Dutchman, I cannot wait to see what you do next.

Orthanc
Jun 10, 2008, 03:16 PM
Just gonna throw together a striped-sail version of my old Pirate Ship, then Arsenal work shall commence.

EDIT: The new version's done, I've also linked yet another version of the Pirae Ship I put together not long after finishing the original, so if you count the Ghost Ship (not the Flying Dutchman, but the one which uses the same model as my Pirate SHip) I've made 4 different versions of the same boat:crazyeye:. Anwho, since the Pirate Ship thread is quite old I'll just be mentioning that update here.

BadKharma
Jun 10, 2008, 09:57 PM
That is a small ship I realize it is for Zelda but what would that size ship represent in something other than zelda?

Sword_Of_Geddon
Jun 13, 2008, 06:10 PM
Maybe a fancy pirate ship? :confused:

Orthanc
Jun 13, 2008, 06:15 PM
I think in a normal Civ game it would fit as either a smaller Pirate/Privateer, or a small medieval attack vessel (since it has catapult and arrow attacks).

Might be getting a new computer soon, I'm backing up all my stuff on this one, so the shipyard is on hold very briefly.

BadKharma
Jun 14, 2008, 06:49 PM
OK, that is a very generic answer I was hoping for something more specific. The only single masted ships I could find are a Sloop and a Cog. Everything else has 2 or more masts. I suppose I could make it something like a War Sloop.
I hope the shipyard see alot of action with the new computer!

Orthanc
Jun 19, 2008, 11:27 AM
Oks, POV Ray runs perfectly well on the new machine, but my Photoshop 7hasn't transfered that well, was kinda hoping I could just copy and paste all of its program files over to the new machine, that doesn't work, and that was when I discovered the CD is missing:cry:

So I can still make the units in POV Ray, but lacking photoshop I can't make the storyboards for the animations or the civilopedia pics.

Being an artist, not having Photoshop is quite painful, so I'll be working to fix this.

Though some certain games from Stardock are kinda distracting...

Hikaro Takayama
Jun 19, 2008, 02:38 PM
Well, if you need a decent program to fill in, just download the GIMP.... It's almost as powerful as PhotoShop (and at least as powerful as PsP), and the best part is that it's 100% free.

TopGun
Jun 19, 2008, 02:43 PM
but lacking photoshop I can't make the storyboards for the animations or the civilopedia pics.

Why don't you use SBB for the storyboards? It's so quick and easy to use...

BadKharma
Jun 19, 2008, 08:19 PM
Oks, POV Ray runs perfectly well on the new machine, but my Photoshop 7hasn't transfered that well, was kinda hoping I could just copy and paste all of its program files over to the new machine, that doesn't work, and that was when I discovered the CD is missing:cry:

So I can still make the units in POV Ray, but lacking photoshop I can't make the storyboards for the animations or the civilopedia pics.

Being an artist, not having Photoshop is quite painful, so I'll be working to fix this.

Though some certain games from Stardock are kinda distracting...
That is painful indeed. Since you have a registered copy of photoshop contact adobe they should have a web download of Photoshop 7 still in the archives.

Orthanc
Jul 01, 2008, 07:30 PM
More painful is this new comp uses Vista, which I didn't mind one bit until I started making a new unit.

For some reason, it likes to hide new files and images I make in POV Ray, they are contained within the folder I save them too, but I have to click some button labelled 'Compatability files' when browsing in My Computer, so it's not even like they're normal hidden files, its a whole new kind of hidden file. Fun times.

In spite of such hinderances (and others), I've started work on Arsenal Gear. Appropriate to do so after the release of MGS4, which I would love to play except that I never intend to buy a PS3, especially after getting this new computer (yes, Vista has its issues, but this thing plays Supreme Commander, Galactic Civilizations and Sins of a Solar Empire like a charm, hence the lack of updates).

Anywho, not much but here's what I've gots:
http://img380.imageshack.us/img380/887/p1yb7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

HunterAnubis
Jul 01, 2008, 11:52 PM
You better go and buy windows XP my friend has Vista and he hates them, he cant play anything or use any programs, Ive lend him CnC 3 tiberian wars and gess what....His vistas wount alow him to play. After 2 weeks of trying getting something work on them he gave up and bought XP, I sugest you do the same

Hikaro Takayama
Jul 07, 2008, 01:38 PM
I second Hunter Anubis' motion..... Windows Vista is the new Win ME. :vomit:

Ozymandias
Jul 08, 2008, 02:44 PM
I second Hunter Anubis' motion..... Windows Vista is the new Win ME. :vomit:

NEVER buy the first release of a MicroSoft OS! :nono: Remember, Windows 98 was nothing more than a massive bug-fix for Windows 95.

-Oz

Hikaro Takayama
Jul 09, 2008, 12:33 AM
Trust me, I didn't.... I don't plan on ever buying Vista either. It's nothing more than a conspiracy to force people to buy a new computer, what with its unnecessary resource-hogging "features" like the stupid 3D menu systems... I swear people are getting too hyped up about the whole "3D" BS nowadays... I could probably take a dump in a software box, slap "3D" on the label somewhere and it would sell. :vomit:

If the next Windows is as bad as, or worse than Vista in terms of hogging system resources, I'm going to fully go over to Linux and not bother looking back...

Keroro
Jul 09, 2008, 03:21 AM
It's always amazed me that a 3D version of something I already have, that requires 4 times the system resources, manages to sell so many copies. Now guess whether I'm talking about Windows Vista or Civ 4.

The thing that rather annoys me is that things like operating systems and civ really don't require 3D to do their job. It's completely unnecessary IMO. Just give us an Operating System that runs all our programs and goes like a rocket is what I say. I still fondly remember the Amiga, which managed to effeciently cram it's operating system onto a couple of floppies.

The by now customary smilie for this thread: :vomit:

Apologies to Orthanc for the slight off topic swerve this thread is taking...

HunterAnubis
Jul 09, 2008, 10:43 AM
Floppie...sounds achient ....oh the little / big flat thingis with no space at all.
I share the wish of ultimate OS that runs everything and fast but I fear once only vistas will be here that the whole stack of games and programs Ive got will be useles junk becose there will be nothing to instal it on :(
and Civ 4 in 3D isnt a bad thing but the way they did it made mesick (small map ugly graphics religions few units and there was like hyper jump from stone age to modern age I didnt even had chance to build knight :( )
oh and hows the arsenal comming?

Hikaro Takayama
Jul 09, 2008, 02:15 PM
Hunter: If you look in the tech support forum, it tells you how to run Civ III under Linux (any version), and Linux, being a completely open source program, ain't going anywhere anytime soon (plus, it will run on just about anything.... even X-Boxes)

HunterAnubis
Jul 09, 2008, 02:28 PM
Linux?!?!? brrr youve got to be kiding that crapy OS got broken in 2 days in my school (old school Im out of it finaly) also not even half stuf worked on those for my friend either but still he was more complaining about vista..

Quinzy
Jul 09, 2008, 03:17 PM
Get Ubuntu then? :D

Blue Monkey
Jul 09, 2008, 03:56 PM
.... [civ3mac] ....

Hikaro Takayama
Jul 09, 2008, 08:14 PM
Get Ubuntu then? :D

Quoted For Truth.... I'm working on building a server/firewall/router based on Ubuntu Server Edition. :D

Blue Monkey:

The only way I'll buy any apple product is if Steve Jobs stops being a prong, and lets you just buy Mac OS-X and install it on any custom built box you come up with, as opposed to having to shell out the :commerce::gold::commerce::gold: to buy some ugly, non-end-user serviceable P.O.S Apple box. :rolleyes:

Orthanc
Jul 09, 2008, 11:45 PM
I had to use Macs at school this year, was not a pleasant experience for me, so won't ever be headed that direction. I realize Vista has its faults and the like, but at this point it would probably waste more time and effort to switch my new comp over to XP rather than just touhg it out. Anyways Microsoft will be ramming Vista down our throats for the next eternity so might as well see what they do with it.

Hikaro, I've never heard of calling someone a prong, yet it seems somehow appropriate anyways.:D

Blue Monkey
Jul 10, 2008, 01:00 AM
The only way I'll buy any apple product is if Steve Jobs stops being a prong, and lets you just buy Mac OS-X and install it on any custom built box you come up with There are end-user serviceable Macs - unfortunately they're the high end ones. Historical note: when Apple was just ramping up the Mac IBM had a virtual monopoly on desktop hardware & OS. Then they hired Gates to make them what became Windows & made the brilliant decision to share the architecture & let others build & sell machines that could run the OS. When's the last time anyone bought an IBM-PC? Or ran an IBM OS on their desktop? I agree Jobs is a prong & I've spent an hour with him. But imagine him as the CEO of Mac-rosoft.

I like the idea of having a machine that will run any OS I want - one I can build & customize myself. By the time I can afford my ideal machine it'll be smarter than I am. I hope it likes me. And lets me play Civ. And lets me sleep inside.

HunterAnubis
Jul 10, 2008, 01:11 AM
I gess it will like you as long as you wount be wining the game :D
I sugest you switch now or pay for it later becose Ive heard something about canceling production of XP thus there will be only vista....

BadKharma
Jul 10, 2008, 02:24 AM
I had to use Macs at school this year, was not a pleasant experience for me, so won't ever be headed that direction. I realize Vista has its faults and the like, but at this point it would probably waste more time and effort to switch my new comp over to XP rather than just touhg it out. Anyways Microsoft will be ramming Vista down our throats for the next eternity so might as well see what they do with it.

Hikaro, I've never heard of calling someone a prong, yet it seems somehow appropriate anyways.:D
Yes unfortunately you are better off hoping that MS fixes the glaring problems in Vista quickly especially if you are running a 64bit CPU. I also agree the "prong" comment fits him well.
I gess it will like you as long as you wount be wining the game :D
I sugest you switch now or pay for it later becose Ive heard something about canceling production of XP thus there will be only vista....
They have been talking about canceling support for XP for some time now. I am sure it is only a matter of time before it will be put into effect.

Plotinus
Jul 11, 2008, 12:53 AM
I'm sure there are more appropriate places on this site for this conversation!

And the Amiga's Workbench came on one floppy disk. Although I'm reluctant to call anything a "floppy" disk that you couldn't actually bend in your fingers, like the C64 ones.

Ozymandias
Jul 11, 2008, 07:48 AM
I'm sure there are more appropriate places on this site for this conversation!

And the Amiga's Workbench came on one floppy disk. Although I'm reluctant to call anything a "floppy" disk that you couldn't actually bend in your fingers, like the C64 ones.

Keeping everything o/t :mischief: didn't that have 5-1/2 inch "floppy" diskettes?

Plotinus
Jul 11, 2008, 12:26 PM
It certainly did! You could probably tear one in half with your hands if you tried.

Hikaro Takayama
Jul 11, 2008, 02:18 PM
Actually, they're 5 and 1/4 inch floppy discs... I even still have a couple around the house somewhere (the first PC I built has a 5.25" floppy drive in it)... Heck, I'm half tempted to put a 5.25" FD drive in the next computer I build, just to see the looks on peoples' faces when they see a brand-new system that has the latest duo-core processor, dual-boot WinXP/Ubuntu Linux box with dual-DVD burners, 500 GB HD, and a 5.25" High-density (1.2 MB) FD Drive. :lol:

@Blue Monkey: I can build a decent PC (including OS) for about $300.... And if any computer I own thinks it's smarter than me, it's getting broke down for spare parts. :smug: (Remember, I AM a certified electronics technician with 8 years of professional experience, and almost 20 as a hobbyist, on top of which I'm close to earning my AS in Electronic Engineering Technology, a side-effect of which is that I'll be A+ certified by the time I graduate....)

HunterAnubis
Jul 13, 2008, 01:30 PM
whats wrong your taking quite long to make this one those vistas must give you a hard headace considering how fast and good is your work all the time

Stormrage
Jul 13, 2008, 03:50 PM
Your request is being made. Play nice.

HunterAnubis
Jul 14, 2008, 12:01 AM
this wasnt my request I think its just that usual production rate was 1 unit per week or maybe even faster and now there arent even any progres pictures and stuf

Ogedei_the_Mad
Jul 14, 2008, 12:13 AM
Repeatedly asking for things isn't going to make it any faster.

HunterAnubis
Jul 14, 2008, 01:03 AM
Im not asking to speed it up I asked if hes having that much troble with vista.....

Orthanc
Jul 15, 2008, 04:07 PM
No it's not my computer that's causing my issue, it's my time I have with my computer that's the issue, for various reasons I've been away from my computer much more than I thought I would. I regret not being able to work on my units as much as I hoped I would be right now, I'm not being lazy, I love making units, there's just other stuff going on (yeah I know I said I'd have plenty of time this summer, but that's life).

Ozymandias
Jul 15, 2008, 09:30 PM
No it's not my computer that's causing my issue, it's my time I have with my computer that's the issue, for various reasons I've been away from my computer much more than I thought I would. I regret not being able to work on my units as much as I hoped I would be right now, I'm not being lazy, I love making units, there's just other stuff going on (yeah I know I said I'd have plenty of time this summer, but that's life).

You're one of our premier shipwrights - you mean you have a real life as well? :D

... Speaking of which, has anyone "seen" vingrjoe recently?

HunterAnubis
Jul 16, 2008, 01:31 PM
OMG GUARDS he has a real life!!! go and brainwash him again so he would serve us 24/7!

Orthanc
Jul 28, 2008, 06:11 PM
Still alive!

There isn't much to Arsenal, it's basically one big weird shape, so modelling is getting quite close to completion (don't worry the texture will be getting more work):
http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/6193/p2rx3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/8868/p3nn9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
El Referenceo
http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/349/arsenalgear1rm4.png (http://imageshack.us)

Spacer One
Jul 28, 2008, 07:09 PM
looks good...(oh yeah, Spacer is back!) good to see mine are next...and 12th :)

HunterAnubis
Jul 29, 2008, 02:58 AM
I kidna started to think that you gave up :)
anyway have you thought about the attacks yet?

Orthanc
Jul 29, 2008, 01:49 PM
Attack A: Torps
Attack B: Mutliple missiles
Attack C: One big missile (ie: an SLBM)
Missiles will launch from hatches that'll open up on the 'spine' near the bow (the bow of this, thing, is the pointy part, yes it floats but other than that one can barely call this thing a boat:crazyeye:). Arsenal would be able to take on any single vessel, but to quote Revolver Ocelot, alone against much more than that and it's just an enourmous coffin. It's really just a submersible aircraft carrier, except instead of jets it launches Rays (already got that unit done!:D) to deal with threats.

Still Arsenal's entire purpose was to house the AI GW, but I haven't a clue how one might reflect that in Civ, meh.

HunterAnubis
Jul 29, 2008, 02:15 PM
GW could show by flick when it says turn your PC of !!! just like in game I was like WTF?!?(honestly no one who played it expected that sorta thing comming)

Since arsenal is submarine I gess its going to be submerged with attacks that that will make it go up shot and go back underwater or do you plan something else?

Orthanc
Jul 29, 2008, 02:49 PM
Actually subs can launch their missiles while submerged, so I think this'll be an all-underwater vessel, simplifies things. The Rays are amphibious, so they'd be able to launch while it's submerged as well. An amphibious attack from a stealth vessel should work in Civ...

HunterAnubis
Jul 29, 2008, 03:13 PM
stipid question time!!!
Will I be able to park it in Manhatn just like Raiden :D
Is there a way to make some unit land and naval at the same time?(I tryed to do it with space ship but it didnt work out to well it could attack and move freely but when something attacked it it went BOOm no mater its health)
any chance of seeing dancing metal gears on arsenal? (when zoomed theyl be trying to squish raiden eventualy :D )
btw on your to do list frigate is a normal naval unit or space ship?
and Virus unit is that from Red Alert or is it something else?

Orthanc
Jul 29, 2008, 03:37 PM
Sure you can park it on New York, just build it in New York and select it, it'll appear on top of the city as always:crazyeye:
I was always hoping that giving an air unit health and movement would give you a truly ambibous unit (or an air unit that can attack land/sea targets like normal), but alas it seems the 'get attacked=death' rule will always foil that idea.
Dancing Rays? I think the only move they could bust would be The Robot (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSoVKUVOnfQ)
The Frigate is the wooden sailing version, a replacement for the original one to give your fleet more visual consistency with my other ships.
Virus is going to be the unicellular one (ie: a real virus, just unit-sized), someone wanted it for some sort of human body scenario.

Spacer One
Jul 30, 2008, 09:05 AM
Orthanc: I noticed that the last thing(s) on your To Do are a bunch of African ships...Im kinda wondering if you are gonna do the whole boat line??

HunterAnubis
Jul 30, 2008, 12:04 PM
:mischief:that reminds if africa realy has some ships apart from kanoe Id be suprised if they had one decent ship for entire continent

Ozymandias
Jul 30, 2008, 12:49 PM
:mischief:that reminds if africa realy has some ships apart from kanoe Id be suprised if they had one decent ship for entire continent

The "Swahili" trading city-states south of the Horn in eastern Africa on the Indian Ocean were well established by ca. 1000 - 1100 CE. So at the very least they would have been exposed to Arab dhows.

-Oz

Orthanc
Jul 30, 2008, 01:02 PM
The intention is to make all or most of the boat line (Galley, Caravel, Frigate, Galleon etc.) using my old Umkhumbi (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=131146) as a basis (subject to further artistic license) for the design. I'm sure some other African country had some sort of sailing navy before (besides Egypt), but since I don't know about it I'm making one up for the whole continent to use.

Besides, who doesn't want Zebra stripes on their boats?

Blue Monkey
Jul 30, 2008, 01:58 PM
The "Swahili" trading city-states south of the Horn in eastern Africa on the Indian Ocean were well established by ca. 1000 - 1100 CE. So at the very least they would have been exposed to Arab dhows.

-OzThey were a major trading partner with their Indian contemporaries, at least since the period when Rome had ports on the Horn (http://www.amazon.com/At-Empires-Edge-Exploring-Egyptian/dp/0300088566/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1217447671&sr=1-2). And dhow became a generic name for a type of ship in common use throughout the Indian Ocean. adopted and adapted by each culture. There's no reason there could not be specifically African ships.

Spacer One
Aug 01, 2008, 09:46 AM
so they will look kinda Zulu?

great, cant wait!!...

Orthanc
Aug 02, 2008, 08:42 PM
Even though those are at the end of the list, I do look forward to them African ships.

ANyways, I think modelling for Arsenal is now officially done, here's a preview into the workings of the missile hatches:
http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/811/arsenalhatchesnp9.gif (http://imageshack.us)
FIRE ZE MIZZILES!

HunterAnubis
Aug 03, 2008, 01:27 AM
I cant wait for all animations :D

Deth McBones
Aug 05, 2008, 02:02 PM
I'm guessing that it's too late to suggest that the Arsenal would be a great space capital ship...but you're going to make it submersible, that's fine.
But you could consider making it 'float' instead of running underwater...for us sci fi guys....:rolleyes:

Orthanc
Aug 05, 2008, 02:08 PM
This thing renders fairly fast, you might just get that (though there are plenty of other space ships already out there).

Stormrage
Aug 05, 2008, 02:17 PM
There are alos gazillions upon brazillions of tanks and airplanes out there, whats your point? :D

Orthanc
Aug 05, 2008, 02:20 PM
Point was while I can make this a spaceship, there's no desperate need for more spaceships fuelling the request to make this submarine into one.

Stormrage
Aug 05, 2008, 02:27 PM
There is always a desperate need for .. everything!! :run:

I`d second it as a space ship.. Looks kinda Tau, might be useful for a 40k scenario one day.

HunterAnubis
Aug 05, 2008, 03:09 PM
well to be honest arsenal reminds me of wraight ship from stargate atlantis so maybe you could make a hole in center bit upgrade the sides and youve got wraght hive ship!
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/64/Hive_scale.jpg

Deth McBones
Aug 05, 2008, 03:24 PM
There are alos gazillions upon brazillions of tanks and airplanes out there, whats your point? :D
Hee, hee. Yeah, I just meant if it wasn't too much trouble, it would look really cool...if you do, I will print up three thousand shirts that read "Orthanc is a Civ III God." And I will wear them. All. For the rest of my life.

HunterAnubis
Aug 05, 2008, 11:37 PM
once you do dont forget to send one to me :P

Orthanc
Aug 05, 2008, 11:42 PM
Hee, hee. Yeah, I just meant if it wasn't too much trouble, it would look really cool...if you do, I will print up three thousand shirts that read "Orthanc is a Civ III God." And I will wear them. All. For the rest of my life.

Then I feel sorry for sheep who must give up all that wool, cause this is quite likely to happen.

Might also have to sig quote that.

But first I need food cause I just wasted about 10 hous on the internet reading useless information. Ahh, the information age.

Deth McBones
Aug 05, 2008, 11:58 PM
Yeah...never get on Wikipedia to research units. I read the entire synopsis for Harry Turtledove's alternate timeline after looking at Gary's and Wyrm's thread. Crazy.
Speaking of crazy, I got my shirts picked out.
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll14/dethmonkeyninja/orthanc.jpg
Nothing fancy....yet....

HunterAnubis
Aug 06, 2008, 12:38 AM
you should add some of his best units on it

Orthanc
Aug 07, 2008, 12:14 AM
If you actually make those shirts, I would totally buy one and wear it to school in September (maaaybe not the first day... but probably the first week).


Sadly, I almost wish I was making this up (cause then I wouldn't actually have to 'fix' it), but for no apparent reason my POV Ray has decided to stop animating, it'll render a single frame, but once I tell it to render a sequence of frames it locks up. It was working perfectly a few days ago:(

Fixing this (trying!), as this is my main pass-time and I would really like to get to work on them Meso-American ships that are next in line. But even old files aren't working, so it's not just this new one causing trouble, which means I have to fix this before I can make progress on anything:(:(

HunterAnubis
Aug 07, 2008, 01:23 AM
blame vista its that damn program fault:aargh:

you could try reinstaling it your animation program that might work.

btw Im starting to think arsenal is cursed since I know that few ppl wanted to do it but they never finished it

anyway I hope you solve your problem soon

Deth McBones
Aug 07, 2008, 06:39 AM
Curses! Hope you get it working. Because now I'm seriously thinking about getting these shirts made....creepy, I know.

Blue Monkey
Aug 07, 2008, 08:03 AM
If it was black with white or colored lettering I'd wear one. Long-sleeved I'd lay down $.

HunterAnubis
Aug 07, 2008, 09:46 AM
Im sure youll give out those shirts for free

Deth McBones
Aug 07, 2008, 10:34 AM
I'd lay down $.
Now we're talking!
EDIT: Well, to give out for free would take a little longer. I'm trying to pay for college expenses right now, and the money's a little tight.

HunterAnubis
Aug 08, 2008, 12:09 AM
Collage, what a nonsence. Giving us one of those for free is priority

Orthanc
Aug 09, 2008, 10:27 AM
:(

I got animation working again for POV Ray, but at some point, I really don't know how, I lost the file for Arsenal.

I spent the last few days using various deleted file recovery software to try and get it back, at this point I've decided it'll just be better to remake it.

I'm glad to say this is the only time this has happened, but it just really shouldn't have happened. The files dissappeared after I had BACKED THEM UP, they vanished from both locations, Vista...

So give me a few more days to remodel, and expect the new version to look different, but probably for the better. I do have an older version of the file that was sitting around, it doesn't have very much but at least I don't have to totally start from scratch.

HunterAnubis
Aug 09, 2008, 12:21 PM
either vista suck that much or arsenal is cursed as I said before! You better be carefull so you wount have any more acidents in your shipyard

BadKharma
Aug 09, 2008, 06:15 PM
You people could put a little effort into a T-shirt design like what Orthanc is..............
http://www.vladiskovic.it/chiara/images/orthanc.jif

Sorry to hear about the Vista woes. I really am torn about eventually upgrading to Vista. Of course Windows 7 may be even worse since it will require all new programs.

Ozymandias
Aug 10, 2008, 07:05 AM
I really am torn about eventually upgrading to Vista. Of course Windows 7 may be even worse since it will require all new programs.

Personally, I'm sticking with XP for as long as humanly possible.

HunterAnubis
Aug 10, 2008, 07:22 AM
so would I be but I wouldnt get full potentional of my new computer that is next to me and lacks to wents and vistas.(yes I forgot to order 2 back wents laugh at me)

Orthanc
Aug 10, 2008, 10:25 AM
Personally, I'm sticking with XP for as long as humanly possible.

I'm sad to say it, I was optimistic about Vista and for people who just do office work or only play games they won't have any issues, but the security features seriously interferes with the animation process, which involves creating multiple files and moving them about quite often.

For anyone planning to use POV Ray to make animations, I sadly have to recommend sticking to XP. I'll tough it out now anyways though, come this far already after all.

Quinzy
Aug 10, 2008, 01:32 PM
Ah well. Windows 7 in 2010 at the latest. :D

BadKharma
Aug 10, 2008, 04:00 PM
Personally, I'm sticking with XP for as long as humanly possible.
So am I it runs very stable and is faster than Vista.
so would I be but I wouldnt get full potentional of my new computer that is next to me and lacks to wents and vistas.(yes I forgot to order 2 back wents laugh at me)
With the exception of a few graphics programs that are written to actually use 64 bit you do not get the full potential anyway. Also there is XP 64 bit and I am sure that with the number of drivers updated for 64 bit Vista there is allot of crossover.

The problem with Windows 7 as I see it are:
It will be an entirely new operating system.......that means it will most likely be buggier than any preceding version of Windows because they are starting over from scratch. Also because it will be an entirely new operating system you can forget about all the programs you currently own unless they mange to make some kind of backward compatibility. For me that would be extremely expensive just replacing Creative Suite 3 alone is not cheap.

Quinzy
Aug 10, 2008, 04:08 PM
They aren't starting from scratch are they? I thought they were starting from a Vista base and building from there? Also, it's meant to be fairly backwards-compatable with your Vista gear, or so I read. It's meant to be more "user-centric" too. Either way, I'll have to wait and see. :D

BadKharma
Aug 10, 2008, 04:23 PM
Like I said it is my understanding it will be entirely new. That does not mean it will be I am just going on what I have managed to dig up on the new OS. If it is based upon Vista however then you will most likely have the same problems Vista has. So is it really a step forward. What upsets me is Microsoft's plans to stop supporting XP.

Ozymandias
Aug 10, 2008, 05:55 PM
What upsets me is Microsoft's plans to stop supporting XP.

Oh dear God when is that scheduled to happen??

Orthanc
Aug 10, 2008, 05:57 PM
Oh dear God when is that scheduled to happen??

That's probably the apocalypse the Mayan's predicted, so that''d be 2012.

There will be no fire raining from the sky, floods, or wars, just support for XP being dropped entirely.

:(

(I honestly have no idea, hoping for NEVER)

Stormrage
Aug 10, 2008, 05:59 PM
[offtopic]


http://i5.tinypic.com/4zmg6xe.png

Orthanc
Aug 10, 2008, 06:09 PM
Yes we are getting off topic, the re-make of Arsenal is progressing smoothly and is 'working' better than the old version already. By working better, I mean that the model is easier to work with and more accurate. I'll put up a preview of the new model sometime today.

Stormrage, your image brings A New Hope, yes just like Luke did in Star Wars before it was all shattered by the prequels (I personally don't mind the prequels too much, but the general opinion seems to be quite bad).

Also, Stormy gets 10,000 points for quoting Yahtzee in his sig, especially since it's the line about the gun that shoots Velociraptors. As epic as that gun is, I always find I can one-up it, how about a gun that shoots lightsabre-chainsaws?

:D

Stormrage
Aug 10, 2008, 06:21 PM
See, there was so much off-topic, I missed you mentioning a re-make of the Arsenal.. awaiting screenies!

10,000 points! Yay! Now I can upgrade my sword-chucks to axe-chucks!

Deth McBones
Aug 10, 2008, 09:48 PM
Too bad about the original...oh well, the new one's going to be better.

As for the shirts...count me out for at least another two weeks, things are about to get crazy, moving into a dorm and doing college band camp will probably sap all of my time. Although I did quit my job to move...

I like the original Orthanc pic, reminds me of when I first started reading LOTR, which was quite a long time ago...

May I query as to what attack anims are going to be in the new Arsenal?

Orthanc
Aug 10, 2008, 10:02 PM
Animation question was answered back here:

Attack A: Torps
Attack B: Mutliple missiles
Attack C: One big missile (ie: an SLBM)
Missiles will launch from hatches that'll open up on the 'spine' near the bow (the bow of this, thing, is the pointy part, yes it floats but other than that one can barely call this thing a boat:crazyeye:). Arsenal would be able to take on any single vessel, but to quote Revolver Ocelot, alone against much more than that and it's just an enormous coffin. It's really just a submersible aircraft carrier, except instead of jets it launches Rays (already got that unit done!:D) to deal with threats.

Still Arsenal's entire purpose was to house the AI GW, but I haven't a clue how one might reflect that in Civ, meh.

Don't worry too much about the shirts, it'd be awesome if they get made regardless of when. I will say I adore Orthanc's design from the movies, (an image of it is buried somewhere in this thread as well) but if you were to say, take the line-art of just Orthanc from the picture above, that'd be cool too.

Oh, and except for re-making the missile hatches, the new model is complete:
http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/6701/p4za2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Deth McBones
Aug 10, 2008, 10:13 PM
Okay, just wanting to know if you were going to change anything.
The new model looks great! And familiar!
Yeah, I felt just about everything in the movies was perfectly matched with the descriptions, or at least my interpretations of the descriptions, in the book, with a few minor exceptions. I promise I will at least make a cool digital tshirt to put as maybe my avatar. But first you need to make it a space unit as well...:):):)

HunterAnubis
Aug 11, 2008, 03:20 AM
hey I was wondering about something since I watched MGS4 cutscene and all(I dont have a ps3 and I aint buying it since I got new comp nearly ready)
and in mgs 4 theres another type of arsenal gear this time its caled Heaven :D textures are the same it just has REXs rail gun instaled on it yes Liquid upgraded it
anyway main weapons of Heaven seemed to be Ray since in one scene it jumped on a battleship I wonder how long it would last if Snake didnt save the day

Orthanc
Aug 11, 2008, 06:11 PM
Ugh, stupid mouse closed the window and I had to retype this (that issue isn't, for once, Vista's fault)

I don't plan on getting a PS3 for a while for pretty much the same reason, so I too watched the cutscenes from MGS4 on Youtube.
Outer Haven is just an alternate design of Arsenal, probably one of the rejected concept designs for Arsenal that Liquid Ocelot got a hold of and used his uber-income (as the secret leader of the largest PMCs) to get it built.
In combat it'd be just like Arsenal really. You can take the rail gun out of ship-to-ship equations, you'd only use it against entire fleets, since it launches nukes, and they'd have to be at quite a distance.
The thing seemed to dwarf the WW2 Battleship that Snake had, so that means it'd be pretty much the largest warship ever. Sheer size means it'd last longer, especially since I'm betting its got some very tough armour, considering the precious cargo it was built to protect (the AI called GW).
Being submersible is always an advantage, especially since it can launch it's main defenders (Rays) while submerged. That pretty much obsoletes aircraft carriers right there. It's got it's own missiles as well, though it's shown to have to surface to use those (that's actually just silly design-wise, we're perfectly capable of launching missiles while submerged).
It must have torpedoes too, really it would have used them in that fight at the end of MGS4. Outer Haven couldn't move to face the Battleship since it had to stay in position to fire the rail gun, but I'm fairly sure that modern torpedoes can be fired at a target that isn't within the intial firing arc of the torpedo launchers (see The Hunt for Red October, those torpedoes went all over the place! I realize it's a movie and so not necessarily fact, but it still makes sense to me).
In summary, it was clear that Outer Haven had the Battleship totally tanked. Though it was still awesome when a Ray got hit by one of the main turrets at point-blank range:D

Stormrage
Aug 11, 2008, 07:59 PM
The thing seemed to dwarf the WW2 Battleship that Snake had, so that means it'd be pretty much the largest warship ever.

.....In summary, it was clear that Outer Haven had the Battleship totally tanked.


Wait, so you are saying the WW2 Battleship had Snake on it? .. then poor Outer Haven never stood a chance.. :D

HunterAnubis
Aug 12, 2008, 01:56 AM
Little corection the new arsenal was called Heaven. Outer Heaven was Big bosses Country or base not sure right now in realy first metal gear game.

Anyway I would like to have another monsterous submarine capable of carring Rays. One of the attacks could be rays jumping out of the water :crazyeye: and use Rex rail gun to bombard everything in long range.
Btw since you made Rex already how about cutting its rail gun and ading him those Kung fu kicks:lol:

Orthanc
Aug 15, 2008, 04:28 PM
Sorry HunterAnubis, the giant ship in MGS4 is definately HAVEN not HEAVEN, yes Big Boss' country is called Outer HEAVEN, but Liquid Ocelot's ship is called HAVEN, particularly because it serves as a literal 'haven' away from the control of The Patriots (or at least that's what they said it was for).

Anyways, Arsenal Gear is finally done! If there was a curse, it is now broken (never believed in those things anyways), the unit is out. Standby for the spacey version, so that I can say been there, done that, bought the T-shirt.

Enter the world of plot twisting nautical goodness here:
Arsenal Gear Thread (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=287377)

Stormrage
Aug 15, 2008, 04:31 PM
Hey, Orthanc, do you have some reference images for that Elven Warship on your list? I`d like to know what I am looking forward to! :D

Orthanc
Aug 15, 2008, 04:50 PM
Actually Stormy it was you that made that request and sent me reference pics via PM some months ago:
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/5311/request6iy2.png (http://imageshack.us)
There were two other ships, kinda forget which of the three you wanted most.

Stormrage
Aug 15, 2008, 04:56 PM
Oh darn.. well the one in the post above is the most.. well, common. Plenty of ships similar to it.

But the mutated hull of a Chaos Long Ship, or the sleek lines of a Dark Elven Warship? Now there is a hard choice.. Do a random number choice, I can`t decide! :cry:

HunterAnubis
Aug 16, 2008, 03:18 AM
I think I saw this one somewhere altho it had bit diferent colours

Orthanc
Aug 18, 2008, 07:39 PM
Alrighty, the space version of Arsenal Gear is done and out!

As for which boat to do for Stormy, I think I'll go with the Dark Elf warship (that's this one right?):
http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/2017/request7wd6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Might be because it looks like the Batmobile.

But for now, work shall commence on the Meso-American Trireme, which will be followed immediately by a Galleass. Names...

FYI, I'm getting all 4 of my wisdom teeth out this thursday, so I'll be drugged/mostly unconcious for a few days, but I still hope to get the Trireme and maybe (big MAYBE) the Galleass done before August is out.

Deth McBones
Aug 18, 2008, 09:30 PM
As I said in the other thread: thanks so much for honoring my request. Hope the mouth surgery comes out right. Nothing like drilling around your highly sensitive teeth.:)

Orthanc
Aug 18, 2008, 09:36 PM
You're welcome!

For the surgery, first they said they'll be giving me some good ol' nitrous oxide, which'll make me too giddy to care when they put some needles in that'll almost knock me out, by the sounds of it I won't feel much, if anything, until well after the operation when the drugs wear off, at which time I will have my Mom around to take care of my needs. w00t.

BadKharma
Aug 19, 2008, 03:22 PM
I had my wisdom teeth pulled many years ago hope things go smoothly for you.

Tank_Guy#3
Aug 19, 2008, 03:34 PM
I had my wisdom teeth pulled many years ago hope things go smoothly for you.

My dentist informed me that there is no need to remove my wisdom teeth :smug:. He says he feels guilty telling a patient they need their wisdom teeth removed, as he still has his also. Good luck with your operation :goodjob:.

Stormrage
Aug 19, 2008, 03:46 PM
Batmobile it is :D

Good luck Orthanc! Have fun with the Funny Gas :D

Orthanc
Aug 19, 2008, 10:49 PM
Before I go off tomorrow, thought I'd put up what I put together for the Meso-American Trireme, which I've decided to call the Camaxtli (think it was the Aztec god of war or something like that). Got a pretty good idea where this going from here. The bow is by no ways done, but the rammer is. That big green hollow cylinder is going to be the eyes. Expect to see more skulls and step-pyramids as always!:
http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/5928/p1oc7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Keroro
Aug 20, 2008, 04:05 AM
Looking forward to these, your ships are always brilliant. As far as the names go - the Aztec God Tlaloc was God of water, and he was able to send thunder and lightning on people if displeased (the way to please him apparently was with child sacrifice). Tezcatlipoca* was associated with hurricanes, and would make a good alternative. Ehecatl-Quetzalcoatl or just Ehecatl is God of Wind, and would have an obvious affinity to ships, although that one might be better to save for the Galleas that follows.

Camaxtli seems to have been more of a hunting God, so not so appropriate for a galley IMHO. If you're after something difficult to pronounce (I know I am) then Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli is the God of Venus, and is (according to wiki) considered a most dangerous and malevolent God.

Apparently his name means Smoking Mirror in Aztec, I'd guess that's where the old civfanatic member Smoking Mirror got his name.

Ogedei_the_Mad
Aug 20, 2008, 09:05 AM
"Hurakan" could make a nice name if you'd like to go easier on the tongue. ;) Hurakan was the Maya god of storms and the name "Hurricane" derives from his name.

BadKharma
Aug 20, 2008, 03:11 PM
My dentist informed me that there is no need to remove my wisdom teeth :smug:. He says he feels guilty telling a patient they need their wisdom teeth removed, as he still has his also. Good luck with your operation :goodjob:.
That is true, however mine were impacted necessitating removal. Hopefully his dentist has determined the need to remove or not remove.
I like the start of the new ship cannot wait to monitor the progress.

Orthanc
Aug 25, 2008, 08:21 PM
Well the teeth are all out and I'm on my way to eating normally again. The top teeth were impacted like yours BadKharma, where as the bottom teeth were turned forward almost 90 degrees so there was no way they were going to grow in right. Anyways they're all gone now so that's that!

I got back to my place yesterday evening, here's what's cooking:
http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/8927/p2gk4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/2339/p3cj5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Still have the main mast, oars, and the fore-sail to add, those feathers at the back are for steering, they'll be mostly submerged.

BadKharma
Aug 25, 2008, 09:54 PM
Looks very detailed.

Deth McBones
Aug 25, 2008, 09:54 PM
I LOVE the skull. It's cultured. :skull:

Orthanc
Aug 27, 2008, 02:29 PM
Just have to get the sounds together for the Meso Trireme, before I send it off I just want to know if you guys would really prefer a name change. Kinda forgot the other name suggestions after I had my teeth out, so I've still been calling it Camaxtli, if I'm going to rename it I think I'll be going with Tlaloc.

AndrewG
Aug 27, 2008, 06:53 PM
I quite liked the suggestion of "Hurukan".

Orthanc
Aug 27, 2008, 06:54 PM
Yeah but I was thinking of saving that one for the Galleass, which is next in line.

utahjazz7
Aug 27, 2008, 09:13 PM
I really like the way your meso-american ship is coming along there. Earlier this month, I was in Mexico for a week and visited the Museum of Anthropology in Mexico City as well as the pyramids in Teotihuacan. When I came back, I was feeling a little inspired to maybe put together a meso-american unit. After seeing your ship, I'm thinking that—if I do go through with making a unit, which is a big maybe—I might try my hand at some sort of fictional unit. Maybe a cannon or something, who knows?

Blue Monkey
Aug 27, 2008, 09:33 PM
Maybe a cannon or something, who knows?Perhaps this British Raj era cannon could be some inspiration?

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/829/boarcannonce3.png

With more a Meso- looking mouth:

http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/578/10037fo1.jpg

utahjazz7
Aug 28, 2008, 07:33 AM
That's pretty similar to what I was thinking—something like the head on the front of Orthanc's ship.

Thread-jacking over. ;)

Orthanc
Aug 28, 2008, 09:00 AM
Well at least the thread-jacking wasn't totally OT (the bow of my ship is modelled after that serpent image Blue Monkey put up), but yes time to get back on track.

The thing is ready, do we have an agreement on the name yet? Camaxtli, Tlaloc or Hurucan?

HunterAnubis
Sep 22, 2008, 01:33 AM
Nearly a mounth and not a single post. I gess its my time to post something dumb again :D
I gess I would go with the first name but dont expect me to say it on laud

Orthanc
Sep 22, 2008, 01:22 PM
Well you did just say it out loud, thanks for your opinion.

The name thing isn't of course the main reason there's been no activity here. I don't think I have to retell the situation for the third year now.

Might release this during reading week (Oct 12 or so) or if I miraculously find some time.

HunterAnubis
Sep 22, 2008, 01:40 PM
Well since Im of to high school after 26 th I wouldnt mind one last bedtime story about How Orthanc couldnt produce more awsome units :D
Anyway I was always wondering where you get the idea to make your own stuf like this ship.

Orthanc
Sep 22, 2008, 01:45 PM
This ship was a request by Sword of Geddon, but as for the ship's design I just combine various bits of Meso American architecture with what I know about naval architecture, sketch out various ideas and go with the one that I think works the best.

For this ship and the Meso-American Galleass (up next, whenever that happens) Sword of Geddon actually supplied some simple sketches, so I developed it of of those as well.

As for your bedtime story:

Once upon a time there was an artist.
He liked epic ship battles.
So he made new ships for Civ 3.
Now he could watch epic ship battles for years on end.

Then one day he wanted to make his ships even better.
So he applied to a school that would help him be a better artist.
He tried three times to get into the program.
And the third was a charm.

And now he has to manually draw a 40 frame animation of a balloon floating into a room.

HunterAnubis
Sep 22, 2008, 02:34 PM
By manualy you mean pen and paper? If so then Im realy jeles coz I cant draw with pen or with computer :(

Stormrage
Sep 22, 2008, 07:22 PM
You have to dip the computer in some paint or ink, otherwise it won`t leave traces on the paper..

HunterAnubis
Sep 23, 2008, 02:27 AM
so thats what Ive been doing wrong all the time :wallbash:

Hikaro Takayama
Sep 27, 2008, 05:59 PM
This ship was a request by Sword of Geddon, but as for the ship's design I just combine various bits of Meso American architecture with what I know about naval architecture, sketch out various ideas and go with the one that I think works the best.

For this ship and the Meso-American Galleass (up next, whenever that happens) Sword of Geddon actually supplied some simple sketches, so I developed it of of those as well.

As for your bedtime story:

Once upon a time there was an artist.
He liked epic ship battles.
So he made new ships for Civ 3.
Now he could watch epic ship battles for years on end.

Then one day he wanted to make his ships even better.
So he applied to a school that would help him be a better artist.
He tried three times to get into the program.
And the third was a charm.

And now he has to manually draw a 40 frame animation of a balloon floating into a room.

Ah, going to art school for animation I see! My brother did that, and now he's working in the mail room of a big office building, sorting mail, and making less money than his brother who only has a high-school diploma (namely, ME). :lol: (I keep telling him he should see if Firaxis is hiring.... He can make models that are at least 20 times better than what they've been using in their latest games :rolleyes: )

I just hope this works out better for you than it did for him. :D

Orthanc
Sep 27, 2008, 07:20 PM
Well my program reports an employment rate around 90% I believe. This is probably because in the 3rd year we'll do a co-op during summer before 4th year starts, so when we graduate after 4th year it should be pretty easy to just go back to where we worked during the co-op.

I hope your brother is at least trying to get an animation job, if the program he took was any good employers should be all over him, there's just SO much stuff out there for animators to work on...

Hikaro Takayama
Sep 28, 2008, 08:03 AM
Well, he has been somewhat, but the idiot went and got married right out of school (which takes up a lot of time and effort, not to mention ties you down), and he doesn't want to move out of the area, nor will he work for companies that make violent, gory or sleazy games (the school he went to actually sent his resume to Rock Star games, which pissed him off to no end, and after he told the school what he thought of that, they refused to offer any further assistance :mad: ), so that narrows his options down a bit.

Quinzy
Sep 28, 2008, 08:16 AM
Why on earth would you become an animator if you have no interest in violence, sleaze or gore? I mean... there aren't many computer games out there without any of that.

He might end up making those Disney games...

Hikaro Takayama
Sep 28, 2008, 05:51 PM
Why on earth would you become an animator if you have no interest in violence, sleaze or gore? I mean... there aren't many computer games out there without any of that.

He might end up making those Disney games...

Actually, he was more hoping to go into movie/TV CG animation, as well as possibly working from the inside to knock it into the producers' thick skulls that a game can be really good and fun to play WITHOUT all the sleaze and bloody gore...

This is one area that I aggree 100% with him on (as you've no doubt seen with my non-sleazy, non-gorey units here)

Quinzy
Sep 28, 2008, 06:15 PM
My sentiment exactly. I just meant that's how games are, not how they should be :D

Orthanc
Sep 28, 2008, 07:18 PM
Most games and movies have violence, most aren't exactly Disney-type kid friendly in other areas as well, but Rockstar tends to make games that are exceptionally violent, sleazy etc. From a purely artistic/gameplay standpoint their games are certainly not bad (have to admit it's been a while since I've played a Rockstar game, but I did play GTA3 and Vice City), but I probably wouldn't work for them either. I'd much rather work on a Civ or Mario title (Zelda, Metroid, Kirby etc.). Even Metal Gear Solid, though very violent and realistic (except for the sci-fi bits) doesn't have the same 'attitude'.

Disney games unfortunately tend to be purely movie hype boosters, so I don't even bother trying them. The exception of course is Kingdom Hearts, (which I admit I haven't played alas, I haven't had a PS2 for years) but they made that with Square-Enix so it's unfair to compare it with Disney-only games. But if I go the movie route in my career, working for a Disney film would be EPIC, 3D or 2D, doesn't matter.

Hmm, maybe I'll help convince Disney into making their own stand-alone (not based on a movie) game. Of course it wouldn't be anything new if it was just a bunch of cinematics with playable sections in-between. There needs to be some sort of blend between the personal involvement of adventure games (Mario, Metroid, Halo, MGS, Zelda etc.) and the ability to create a unique environment based on your actions found in strategy games (CIV and GalCiv). Actually, ironically, GTA is a series that tries to do this, but the city you're in doesn't really change unless there's a scripted event. Basically games as a whole so far don't let you do anything 'heroic' or 'epic' unless they have a script for you to follow, and if you take down a thousand bad guys in one move outside of the 'plot' nothing will change except your stats (if that).

Is this what qualifies as a rant? If it is; oh well, my thread anyways.

Anywho, I guess I'm leading to the idea of a game that (via some CRAZY coding I admit) starts a cinematic because it recognizes that your charge on the enemy base is history in the making, and not because the writers have said it is so. At the same time I feel that difficulty based purely on levels or numbers isn't the best option, probably the best combo I can think of is where your initial abilities (A is jump, B is punch etc.) should be improved as you either use them, collect stuff or defeat stuff. I know there are already games that do that. The problem is that scripting often steers you to gain very specific levels or abilities.

MMORPGs that I know of DON'T fix this problem because while your power levels are increased, the game still plays out the same way. But say you added levels to Mario's jump ability, and made that game into a MMORPG. Any puzzle or enemy could be defeated by a level 1 player (if they're skilled or lucky) but a level 10 player can jump higher and punch harder or faster. But if we do that, we can't just leave the maps to stay the same, at the same time if we have them all set up from the start then we'd also have to plan out the rate at which you level up, which really makes the entire leveling system pointless.

But if we make the maps 'fluid', or in the case of some sort of combo of Strategy-Adventure MMORPG, created by the players (ie: they'd gradually build their castle defences and traps) everything becomes unique. Someone might manage to get the resources (sacrificing their own leveling) to build a wall that a level 1 player can't get over, at the same time it might actually be possible, but a level 10 could do it much faster and with less risk. Or maybe you just need to build your own wall beside it so you can use the wall jump technique (which would also have levels for speed and height) to get over. 'Winning', or just doing well in the game would require new strategies all the time, along with leveling to give you a power boost so that figuring out these new strategies on the spot won't be as stressful. The key difference really is that there would be no real limit to the complexity or 'style' of the puzzles as the game goes on.


SOOO, I ended up spilling ideas for some reason, felt like it was a good opportunity to get this down somewhere...
For those wondering, typing this out was HUGE procrastination on my part and now I REALLY have to get to my homework.:D

HunterAnubis
Sep 29, 2008, 12:24 AM
violent, gory or sleazy games.
Who would play such a game without any of above :mischief:

HunterAnubis
Jan 25, 2009, 07:30 AM
so long time passed and Im begining to think that the shipyard got closed pernamently :(

Orthanc
Jan 25, 2009, 10:49 AM
so long time passed and Im begining to think that the shipyard got closed pernamently :(

Sadly this may be the case, though again I'll have time once more from the end of this April to end of August, but in the 3rd year (not this summer or the next but the one after the next) is the part of my course I've mentioned before where I have to work in the animation field over the summer so I won't have any time that year (let's see that'll be, 2011) at all. And the year after that I graduate and all things being well I'll actually be employed as a professional animator.
To put it simply, soon I won't be able to make units because Civ3 unit making doesn't make money (especially with so many people still making them for free) and I'll be busy enough making art that does pay me.
If you guys want to see what Orthanc's doing with all this non-unit making time though you can always visit me BLOG (http://www.stephengood.blogspot.com/).