I'd like to know everything about unit creation as soon as possible. :D The graphics are probably going to be the hardest part, so if you already know about modding the graphics of a game using the Gamebryo engine, feel free to post here whatever might apply to Civ IV. It seems I won't get my copy of the game until November, so I want to use that time to make graphics that I can't test. :p

The graphics are probably going to be the hardest part
:lol:
I wonder what else there actually is for unit creation? Well, yeah, sounds of course :)

Imagination! :p

Well you have to actually add it in the game, but that should be easy with XML. No more text file nightmares....

So, unit creation can't begin until the SDK comes out? Just wondering, since I'm very interested in creating a new unit or two in Civ IV.

No, the SDK will just be for changing the way the game works. Units will be done with XML.

I'm not sure how we will be able to create new models, but I would think it wouldn't be too hard to re-skin a unit, but keep the same model and add it too the game under a different name. I think so because *most* 3D games are a base "model" (wireframe thingymabobber) with a "skin" (pic file) wrapped around it.

Example: Subject A is wanting to make an American Civil War scenario. So, he takes basic in game rifle unit's skin, uses a photo editor to give it a gray uniform, and saves the model and skin in a new folder called "Confederate soldier" or whatever. This should allow it to be used without problem.

Yeah, from what I've read about proper 3D games it is alot easier to reskin than to remodel.

Yes! Let's get kicking with a new game! :)

I'm already working on potential models.

Does anyone know if the SDK will include a plugin or converter for making new models? Almost all games use proprietary (sp?) file types for in-game models. This means that you either need a converter that will convert your new model into something the game can use, or you need a plugin that will allow your modeling program to export directly into the game's format. Does anyone know if there will be a plugin or converter available, or will we even need one? Some games actually use a format already supported by the modelers.

nevermind.

This reskin thing sounds very interesting.. Since these «skins» are going to be pic files, I assume they are going to be in 2D (Am I right?). Hence, people like me who are only equiped with basic image editors (like photoshop) would be able to bring their humble contribution on unit creation. At least on models created by gifted 3D modelers. Will it be that easy? Or will we have to modify the skin in a 3D program?

Reskinning will be a 2D-only project.

Hmmm this sounds fun!

If modding is the same as in Pirates! then i already have a bit of experiance under my belt :) I acturally did quite a bit of modding skins in pirates so this should work out really nicely. You don't need a 3D program to modify a skin, I use GIMP 2.2, but you could even use just paint ;) lol. (so yes-photoshop would work).

As long as we get some people making the models (and i'm sure they'd like to make full units too) then theres tons of people who could use the models and make skins for them!

and acurally... if its the same as Pirates! the skin files will be .dds files, but Idk if its the same...

This all sounds really neat! Now i'm getting excited! woohoo! lol....

If that's the case, then I guess I won't need to abandon my pixel-by-pixel way of doing things. :)

you could even use just paint ;)
That's going to make a lot of people very happy. ;)

GameBryo? Isn't that the same engine used to make The Elderscrolls games isn't it? That would mean they are using the NetImmerse engine. I have seen the NIF Exporter for a few of the games (Morrowind, Freedomforce) but I think they were made specifically for those games. Then again I could be wrong on that.

Maybe you could give a link to the exporter Weasel Op?

Where are the scripts used for the units, to provide info on attributes and such?

I don't know if an exporter is even required, or where to get it if it exists. But if one is required, it definitely has been made, because people have been modding Pirates! for a while already. Since it uses the same graphics engine, it would use the same exporter.

edit: @wotan321: the unit stats come from the xml files

I am pretty sure you need an external exporter for 3ds max for the .nif file format. I do not think it is a native extension for 3ds max. But it really doesn't matter. I don't think a single unit will be made until Firaxis provides modders with the exporter, assuming it is coming with the SDK next year.

Yet again I am going on what little I know and am not an expert on thins, just making some educated guesses.

Mhahahaha!!! First Civ4 unit evar!!! Bask in the power that is my ability to create!!! Bow down before the powerful and might RED GEOSPHERES!!! J/k :lol:
101850

I took the liberty of making a geosphere in Milkshape 3D and then exported it with an custom made exporter from a Yahoo Group called NIFLA (http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/NIFLA/). It took me all but 2 minutes to do that, and most of the time I was waiting for the programs to load. :lol:

Wow, so are you saying that we can actually make units already? Can the exporter do animatoins?

If so, then this is really quite cool.

woah! do they actually work as a unit? able to animate? why are they solid red?! please ellaborate more on your testings :)

What's the actual process though? You export the file as a .nif, but then where do you put it? And what, if any other steps are required?

I did a lot of stuff in 3D graphics for Civ3, but obviously, this is new to me since I'm not rendering still images...

Also, how would we make the skins or export skins to be edited for particular units?

Gaias, those spheres look goooood! What stats are you giving that unit? <g>

Hey, its a start! How did you get it in the game? And what other scenarios are in the game, I see you put the spheres in the Revolutionary war scenario.

Thanks.

Whoa... hey...now... not all at once there! :p I was just doing it for fun to see if I could do it. All it is is a basic geosphere primitive replacing the .nif file for the militia unit in the American Revolutionary war senario. All I really wanted to see was if I was right about the 3d applications needing an exteral exporter plugin to make the .nif files.

Now what I know about .nif is very basic (mostly gleaned from the Morrowind Modding Community), and I don't really know enough to be of any use to anyone. What I do know is that no units are going to be made until either the exporter is shipped with the SDK or some ingenious programmer/modeller makes a plugin that can export .nif files for one of the freeware based 3d applications.

Then again it wouldn't be hard for a modeller to make a unit in a freeware 3d application and export it as a .3ds format and then have someone with 3ds max to export it to a .nif file. I say 3ds max because that is the only program (other than Maya) that can export to the .nif format.


From what I understand of the .nif format it is what holds the base model and texture map coordinates (also I think other stuff like world coordinates, alpha channel, etc.). I think animation is held in seperate keyframe file, the .kf (I think Poser can also export keyframe animation files, so it could be feasible to make units in that program), yet the I think all the .kf files are organized by the .kfm. If I remember correctly that is the master file that controls all the animation or at least their xzy coordinates. The textures I believe are stored either in .dds or .tga formats, usually 128x128 or 256x256 in dimension.

Remember I think this is what some of it is I cannot be sure. I am just making some educated guesses here. I know not very helpful... :sad:

can anyone post a texture file yet, just to see the format. (not sure if firaxis would get upset yet, it is for a good cause

can anyone post a texture file yet, just to see the format. (not sure if firaxis would get upset yet, it is for a good cause

Putting a watermark on the texture ought to prevent anybody from Firaxis getting too worked up about it.



As for exporting from 3DS Max, I have that, so I can export 3DS files as .nif files...

I guess the only way I'm going to figure out how to do this is to sit down tonight and fiddle with it until I finally get it.

I wont have cIV until christmas (long story) but could you post the text or better yet as an experiment put the legion/praetorian texture on the navyseal body and seewhat the unit looks like?

thanks.

NIF (NetImmerse file Format)
This is the native file format of the 3D engine used by SSI for PG3DA and PG3SE. The engine is the NetImmerse 3D engine, which is made by Numerical Design Ltd.

All *.NIF file for PG3DA and SE, that means all 3D object such as Maps, units, Shadows etc.. is made in 3D Studio Max then converted to NIF format. The *.NIF is actual a somewhat "secret" format, its somewhat impossible to find specifications on it, unless you go a buy the complete 3D engine. All NIF file of PG3DA and PG3SE is version 2.3 of the NetImmerse File Format

Making new maps or units is not going be a slam dunk that is for sure. As I understand it the companies that license or buy this engine does not have the right to release its code.

Well you can download a free utility at Numerical Design Ltd, called MAXI Immerse that can actual convert 3D studio Max format to *.NIF. I don't know if *.NIF is a lose-less format, meaning if its actual possible to convert back to 3D Studio Max format. Anyhow there is not such an utility available for free anywhere, - unless you buy the NetImmerse engine. So for now its not even possible to actual view any of the NIF files found in the Panzer3 games, not to speaks of making you own.

from:
http://www.elysiun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=22521&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

They have made a .NIF importer for Blender, but no exporter as of yet.

I intend to look at all the file types before I even play a game. :D

I did, however, notice how incredibly mum Firaxis has been on graphic modifications. If it is true .NIF does not allow conversion, we could be one sad group of modders.

I've got Pirates! a few months ago and the only graphics mods I saw were new textures :-/

People have been adding models to Morrowind, which uses the .NIF format. The hard part will be figuring out how to animate the models.

Maybe the SDK will have conversion utilities and/or tutorials. If not, I'm sure someone will figure it out.

...

If we can't export original 3D models and stuff into Civ 4, I'm not sure I'll get it at all, and that would make for a very sad day. :(

I'm not so concerned about using only freeware prgorams, I'm going to get one of the major programs (either Studio Max or Maya) anyways, eventually, but as I said, if there's no way to make new models, no Orthanc contributions to Civ 4!

Yeah, only modding textures in Pirates! was a bit of a let down, I would have loved to pack that thing with dozens more ship types.

Firaxis denying us the ability to add our own 3D models, would be a slap in the face to us unit makers. So far, I'm hoping for the abiltity to add my own 3D units in addition to being able to tweak the combat abilties in CivIV (give warships the ability for strike warfare, ie-bombarding units outside of a city). Those are the only reasons I'm not taking the game back right now. But, perhaps I should, and buy it when I know for sure about the 3D model details when the SDK comes out.

Firaxis denying us the ability to add our own 3D models, would be a slap in the face to us unit makers. So far, I'm hoping for the abiltity to add my own 3D units in addition to being able to tweak the combat abilties in CivIV (give warships the ability for strike warfare, ie-bombarding units outside of a city). Those are the only reasons I'm not taking the game back right now. But, perhaps I should, and buy it when I know for sure about the 3D model details when the SDK comes out.

Well VingRJoe, if your talents can't be used in Civ IV, that will be a true waste.
I think you and I know of one scenario that won't be ported over to Civ IV, if the above posts are accurate.

I don't know much about 3D, or any of these file types, but what is making people think we can't make our own units if Gaias already added his own model?

The problem is WeaselOp is that is not to export all the information (animation, textures, mesh, etc) with the current group of NIF Exporters. Most of the open source plugins for the freeware/professional applications are either in alpha (can export Mesh/Texture) or beta (can export most, but may screw something up along the way). The big concern here is most of the NIF Exporter plugins are being made for current games that use the GameBryo engine. They may not be compatible depending on how the plugin exports information. For all we know as of yet there can be a huge difference as to be no compatibility with preexistiing open source plugins.

True I was able to export a very simple object into Civ4, but I don't know if it was the correct information in the export, for the game to use.

Oh yeah, there is an exporter for Blender in the works right now found here (http://niftools.sourceforge.net/) Unfortunately most of the development is geared towrad The Elder Scrolls: Morrownding.

OK, ATI users, sorry, I don't know how well ATI supports developers, I only knwo a bit about NVidia, and they put out excellent tools. If you have an NVidia card, you can try to modify these files, but of course, be warened, and back up first!

In


C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Shaders\FXO

are .fx files, which if you have an NVidia card, can be editied with this:

http://developer.nvidia.com/object/fx_composer_home.html#2 I believe.

Shader are used to create color and light effects.

In
C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Assets\Art\Movies\Era
are .dds files. These are stills for something

(AFAIK, these files are usually used on textures for models. I can use NVidia's MeLODy to to create certain .dds files for normal maps.... ones I don't see the Civ IV engine using.)

The rest of the movies appear to be .bics, and there was an editing tool mentioned in the C&C threads for .bik, but I am not sure where
that thread was.

http://developer.nvidia.com/object/nv_texture_tools.html

is where you can find another NVidia tool, that allows you to directly manipulate .dds files through Adobe photoshop... (which I do not have)

anyways, here is a look at an infantry texture, using NVidia's Windows Texture viewer:
This texture is 128 by 128, and IIRC, .dds files are also only 256 color. This was found in the
C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Mods\American Revolution\Assets\Art\Units\Militia folder

It also appears there are 3 file types for models:

.NIF, already mentioned, this would be the mesh files
.kf = keyframe files, I assume these handle the animations, since they are all named after animations
and .kfm = I don't know what this is, but since their is only one, and it is named after the model, I would assume the m stands for "master".... OK, enough investigating the engine... back to a game as the Japanese....

There is also a DDS Converter (http://eliteforce2.filefront.com/file/DDS_Converter;29412) out there that will allow you to convert .dds files into other image files and then be able to reconvert them back to a .dds file.

Over on 'Poly, Locutus has indicated that graphics mod tools are forthcoming.

The thread:
http://www.apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=140902

Well the good news is if they give an exporter for 3ds/Maya and proper documentaton on the whole unit/leader/building creating process, they we can make all that stuff in no time. The bad news is those programs cost thousands of dollars, so those that could have made units won't. Though I am sure their are work arounds.

What about texturing? Can we still swap skins without those programs?

thats what i was wondering:

... but could you post the text or better yet as an experiment put the legion/praetorian texture on the navyseal body and seewhat the unit looks like?

Weasel Op, you should be able to change skins w/o a 3D program. Providing you just tweak the default one, since it is already mapped to the model ingame. I believe you can use PSP or Photoshop.

I have a really stupid question. Where are the unit models? The only ones I can find are the ones in the American Revolution scenario.

That's not a stupid question Weasel'. I looked everywhere and couldn't find them. I found the same ones you mentioned in the scenario folders. I wonder if the game pulls them from the CD ? Or if all the game models are packed into a file only the game can read.

:cry:
So much for reskinning the units.....

They're in the Art0.fpk file in the assets/art directory. You can use the un-pak utility firaxis provided for the ATI fix to extract them and re-pak them.

Have no fear Weasel Op. You can reskin the units. I did a quick paint job on the stealth bomber in Adobe Photoshop.

Just get that unpak utility here:
http://www.2kgames.com/civ4/support_ati.htm

Scroll down past half way to get to the unpak directions.

BTW, you will need a DDS plugin for PSP or PhotoShop. Just do a google search. Nvidia makes a good DDS utility.

BTW, you will need a DDS plugin for PSP or PhotoShop. Just do a google search. Nvidia makes a good DDS utility.

Or you could just use the DDS Converter (http://eliteforce2.filefront.com/file/DDS_Converter;29412) and convert it to a .bmp and edit in MS Paint.:D

vingjoe any chance you can try that switching skins with the legion and the navy seal, like seeing a mosern legion unit?

or has any one tried mixing the RoN skins?

Ekmek, from my understanding, you have to be careful of 'swapping skins'. Each model's skins or textures, are mapped to that model. Now if the seal and mosern legion have the same model, then you should be able to swap skins.

...Now if the seal and mosern legion have the same model, then you should be able to swap skins.
... which is very doubtful :) To get skins to work correctly, you wont be able to swap, You'll have to edit the unit's own dds file.

edit: nevermind, I didn't look far enough

I think I owe you a hug. :D

Here's another screenshot. I gave the gunship the ol' shark face .

Awesome job vingr. I'm glad to see you're doing what you can while we wait for info on the .nif files and how to make our own new units. I'm pretty confident Firaxis wouldn't have gone through all this trouble to expose everything in the game to the XML and python and then prevent us from adding new models. I think if we have a little patience and give them time to get over their crunchtime hangovers, we'll get our answers :)

I do hope you are right Zurai. For now, I may play with skins, but for the most part, I will stick with making models for Civ3 if and until the time comes when we can add new 3D models to Civ4.

Here's another screenshot. I gave the gunship the ol' shark face .
LOL - that's awsome.

Now what we need is some sort of code which randomly switches between several skins available. That way you could have every unit looking subtly different - it'd be so cool!

That would be cool. It could also be used for flavor units. Each civ could have a slightly altered texture.

That would be cool. It could also be used for flavor units. Each civ could have a slightly altered texture.

For now, that is how we will have to do it, when adding a new unit. Custom skins, I assume, will have to act as placeholders until we are given the ability to add our models to the game.

The problem is WeaselOp is that is not to export all the information (animation, textures, mesh, etc) with the current group of NIF Exporters. Most of the open source plugins for the freeware/professional applications are either in alpha (can export Mesh/Texture) or beta (can export most, but may screw something up along the way). The big concern here is most of the NIF Exporter plugins are being made for current games that use the GameBryo engine. They may not be compatible depending on how the plugin exports information. For all we know as of yet there can be a huge difference as to be no compatibility with preexistiing open source plugins.

True I was able to export a very simple object into Civ4, but I don't know if it was the correct information in the export, for the game to use.

I still don't quite understand how this is stopping us. Since Civ4 obviously accepted your "unit", doesn't that mean it's in the right format? What would we need to do that you didn't do with your spheres?


@vingrjoe: There are enough different human models in the game that we should be able to get by for a while just with skins. Even Civ3 human units used a lot of the same models, or at least parts.

@Weasel Op

What I was trying to infer with that statement was that even though I did export a basic primitive, it doesn't mean that it would actually work for all that is required to make a unit in Civ4. The plugin in question that I used with Milkshape 3d was a alpha opensourced project that was geared initially toward The Elderscrolls Morrowind (which also used the GameBryo engine). I say 'was' because said plugin is close to a year old and alpha notheless (all I could do was export the basic primitive into the game and nothing else, ie animations).

The other problem is that even though this instance did work the plugin was geared toward a different game entirely. Morrowind came out in 2002, and the authors of that plugin said explicitly that they were working on the NIF file format that was used in the game. Now I am pretty sure that the makers of GameBryo have upgraded their engine in that 3 year time. I am also assuming that Firaxis used a more recent incarnation of that engine. Just by an educated guess I would be lead to believe that even though both NIF file formats are in general the same, they may vary enough as to not be cross compatible. And that is the real problem.

Unless someone with good C++ and a knowledge in 3d applications wants to design a exporter plugin for one of the various 3d applications available to the public, we are just going to have to wait until Firaxis release their SDK with a NIF exporter. Until such time, things like units and building are not going to happen. Well at least not very easily one might assume.

Ok, I get it now. Thanks.

@Weasel Op

What I was trying to infer with that statement was that even though I did export a basic primitive, it doesn't mean that it would actually work for all that is required to make a unit in Civ4. The plugin in question that I used with Milkshape 3d was a alpha opensourced project that was geared initially toward The Elderscrolls Morrowind (which also used the GameBryo engine). I say 'was' because said plugin is close to a year old and alpha notheless (all I could do was export the basic primitive into the game and nothing else, ie animations).

The other problem is that even though this instance did work the plugin was geared toward a different game entirely. Morrowind came out in 2002, and the authors of that plugin said explicitly that they were working on the NIF file format that was used in the game. Now I am pretty sure that the makers of GameBryo have upgraded their engine in that 3 year time. I am also assuming that Firaxis used a more recent incarnation of that engine. Just by an educated guess I would be lead to believe that even though both NIF file formats are in general the same, they may vary enough as to not be cross compatible. And that is the real problem.

Unless someone with good C++ and a knowledge in 3d applications wants to design a exporter plugin for one of the various 3d applications available to the public, we are just going to have to wait until Firaxis release their SDK with a NIF exporter. Until such time, things like units and building are not going to happen. Well at least not very easily one might assume.

What if we don't really care about animations. I mean the animations are cool, but I can wait for them. I have an idea for a handfull of new units and I can design the models. In fact, I already have 2 of the models done in 3ds max. If this exporter of yours can export the model and textures, then we could possibly use it to create basic, non-animated units to use until a dedicated exporter is released. I personally don't care for the animations for the most part anyways.

I don't know what 'we' your talking about :) I would never put a non-animated unit into my game-just doesnt make sence IMO and I think a majority of the members would agree (naturally some wouldn't).

Actually I think a CivI graphics mod would be cool. :mischief:

I don't have anything against the animations, but, in the interest of getting unit creation going, I would be perfectly happy having non-animated units.

Actually, I agree with Weasel about the graphics. I am stratagy board game veteren. My brother and I even designed a complete modern combat game, similar to Axis & Allies, using simple card tokens and flags for units. Less complex units makes it easier for us the create new units.

Instead of shelving new unit creation until January when a possible file exporter/converter becomes available just because we can't animate units, lets get the mechanics down and working. Then when the exporter/converter comes out, we can finish the new units. Not to mention, creating animations for these games is often not an easy task.

Creating animations ...for this game should be relatively easy actually since the majority of units are humanoid...most animations will be a variation on a theme....
One basic rig..the clothes/weapons etc are cosmetic changes that can be simply "bolted on" to any animation sequence (gotta love bones)...Character studio is ideal for this...and (if I remember correctly) .nif files simply locate the correct keyframe to 'loop' from when a particular action is processed..thats what the kf file is all about

Thing is, the units I want to create are not humaniod. I want to creat things like new ships and aircraft, which may be able to use one of the default keyframe files. How would we do this?

I would ask one of the Freedom Force meshmasters for details, as most of their .nifs use default keyframes included with the original game. I believe the procedure as far as making the meshes compatible would be exactly the same.

I have no doubt Firaxis will release a Gamebryo exporter. Making Civ 4 the most moddable game with no ability to add new unit/building/anything models would be hilarious. :lol:

Hey, I have an Idea!

Since Civ IV uses the Gamebryo engine, and Gamebryo is used by several other popular games, shouldn't there be a GMAX plug for Gamebryo models? If so, this would mean that you'd basically have the same capabilities as 3D Studio Max for modeling and animating (since GMAX is basically 3DSMAX without any rendering functions) that won't cost a red cent.

Gmax is no longer going to be offered in a couple of months. Which means that the expense of creating a Gamebryo exporter will not be worth the while of either Gamebryo or Discreet.

Gmax is no longer going to be offered in a couple of months. Which means that the expense of creating a Gamebryo exporter will not be worth the while of either Gamebryo or Discreet.

Well, Shucks, looks like I'll just have to forget making units for Civ IV.....

Unless someone would be willing to work on a Shade 7 plugin (Shade, which is originally a Japanese 3D program, is about as powerful as 3D studio max, but costs 1/10 as much and has the added benefit of a direct to Poser export feature).

Sorry, dude.

Depending on the neccessary export settings, however, you could possibly do the base modelling for buildings and terrains, and pass them to a MAX owner to actually turn into game nifs. Rigging and animating character meshes, unfortunately, is terribly time-consuming, though, so MAX'ers might prefer to model their own...

I never thought I would say this, but I miss FLCs :cry:

It looks like it is coming for you guys:

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=141424

Valandar's one of those Freedom Force .nif masters I mentioned, so do listen to him.

on the subject of importing custom models I think we have to wait until we get the plugins...I made my own model to replace the fort model but it didn't work...the red sphere on the first page is just what the game defaults to if it can't find any model...in this case it probably couldn't read my fort model because it doesn't agree with the nif exporters that I've used and therefore all forts became red spheres...

there's no animation files for the actual fort model found in the game so it can't be because of no animation

Here is a Q does the 3ds Max have to be version 8 in order to have the models or would version 7 sufice, because I have found one on ebay for 100 bucks?

assuming there's nif exporters released for 3ds max it really depends what version they're built for...I've been using max 5 for a long time now and most plugins work for it as plugins can be compatible with different versions

I doubt the plugin will be available for anything less than version 6....but I've been wrong before :)

I googled "3ds max nif" and found a plugin for v3.1, for Morrowind.

the morrowind plugins require morrowind to be installed

I was just showing that it doesn't have to be the newer versions. So maybe we can find affordable versions to make units.

The .nif importer/exporter for blender was designed for version 2.36.... and says there may be a bug due to changes in the animation system in Blender 2.37

Regardless, it is a matter of double-clicking on a different exe, because Blender hosts all versions.

Anyways, the readme seems to talk about how to export UV maps, (skins), animations, and models.

And Blender, you can have ......tonight.... I can't find the link to the exporter, however. Someone else posted it, its on sourceforge:

http://niftools.sourceforge.net/

Note, it does not support export for Maya yet.

So save your pennies... and go open source!!! Do not be afraid.

Be safe and get 2.36, or be current and get 2.37a, or be uber, and get 2.40 alpha2


:D

http://www.Blender.org

I am trying it as we speak, and it requires the armature (bones) to be converted to a mesh object... which is possible, of course, just need to find how.

You guys are doing some really nice work here. I'm watching this thread with interest to see if you all can work out a way to create the new untils before the SDK comes.

I believe in you fellow Civ-ers! :D

@Neomega: Is that your technical way of saying we can make units in Blender now? :)

@Neomega: Is that your technical way of saying we can make units in Blender now? :)
I am saying I am experimenting with the exporter... unfortunately, every experiment takes 5 minutes to load up civ iV and see if it works.

This nif tool was made for morrowind, however, and I wonder if Firaxis pulled some kind of trick like they did with their flcs.... making them proprietary.

...and the answer, I think is, yes. I tried to import the windmill, and an error came up... "this does not appear to be a net immerse file" So firaxis tweaked their nif's a bit.

I am saying I am experimenting with the exporter... unfortunately, every experiment takes 5 minutes to load up civ iV and see if it works.

This nif tool was made for morrowind, however, and I wonder if Firaxis pulled some kind of trick like they did with their flcs.... making them proprietary.

...and the answer, I think is, yes. I tried to import the windmill, and an error came up... "this does not appear to be a net immerse file" So firaxis tweaked their nif's a bit.

I believe currently the NifTools cannot recognize the file version that Firaxis used for Civ4. It is being worked on in ernst, though not much is going to happen for awhile. I enquired about it here (http://niftools.sourceforge.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=61&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0).

Thanks for the link Gaias, Looks liek we'll still ahev to be patient, but at least that confirms it... Civ IV is using a newer version of .nif format than morrowind.

Hey, no problem! Just glad to help in any small way I can. :cool:

This is an interesting thread to watch. It reminds me overall of the scientific process that we see in the journals (including little posts like this). Keep up the great work guys and I can't wait to see the fruits of your progress!