http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108BC-2800.zip

Of course, I have to restart, as the first random civ was England. :rolleyes:

I found one way that Civ4 is worse. The delay between switching from the game to word where I type my reports is a longer.

Our random civ turns out to be India.


4000 BC
Delhi is formed in place. Pigs and corn are both nice food bonuses, and will really help the health of our city once

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LAK-1023.jpg

I am going to go right for Polytheism. Being a founder of a religion would be really nice, and we can even be historically accurate and form Hinduism.


3920 BC
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LAK-1024.jpg


3760 BC
We pop a hut, but simply get gold.


3560 BC
Once again we get gold from a hut. :(


3400 BC
(ST) Not unexpected at this level, but we get good news.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LAK-1025.jpg

Picking a new tech is much harder now. There is no automatic path to follow. Your tech choices really need to be tailored to your terrain. With pigs and corn nearby I am going to start us down that part of the tree next.


A hut finally was worth popping:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LAK-1026.jpg


3360 BC
(IT) We have contact with Germany and are peaceful for now.


3200 BC
(ST) Bears maul our warrior, but it is still alive.


3000 BC
We comp farming and head for animal husbandry to take advantage of the health bonus of the pigs. If we get the cows, that will another health bonus.


==========================

Summary:
Does anyone have an idea how to get an auto-save for every turn? It appears to be doing it every 4 turns.


Due to the way the date change I am now reporting the time between the player turns as ST (Start turn). I can't easily tell what the previous date was.


I just found my first bug with Civ4. :cry:
If you alt-tab out of the game with the diplomacy screen up, along with some of the other screens, you loose the bottom of the screen. I had to reload for peace with Germany. I almost got stuck in the technology screen.


We have a worker on the way to start improving the lands. We *don't* want a settler next. Sending out a settler without escort is just too dangerous in Civ4.


Signed up:
LKendter
Methos (currently playing)
MeteorPunch (on deck)
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

Got it....

What's wrong with England? :lol:

Edit your Config file to change Autosave Interval. (Look for a redirect in your Civ root folder).

I just found my first bug with Civ4. :cry:
If you alt-tab out of the game with the diplomacy screen up, along with some of the other screens, you loose the bottom of the screen. I had to reload for peace with Germany. I almost got stuck in the technology screen.


:hmm: It must be your computer, as I tried it on mine and had no trouble Alt-Tab'ing back and forth. As you said though, it is a lot slower doing it with CivIV.

I just found my first bug with Civ4.
If you alt-tab out of the game with the diplomacy screen up, along with some of the other screens, you loose the bottom of the screen. I had to reload for peace with Germany. I almost got stuck in the technology screen.

That happens to me when I open CAII.

Good luck guys! Civ4 looks awesome, I can't wait to get it!

What's wrong with England? :lol:

MeteorPunch asked that we *not* play it as he is already in a SG as England.

Nice start location - pigs and corn. I think food is still very important.

So far in my experience, I think you're right about researching techs based on your nearby resouces/worker actions. Sometimes you get a resource like wine, for example, that you can't build the "special terrain improvement" for until much later, though.

I haven't found any early civics that I care for, so I don't try for those techs.

City builds and units are the other two things I'm going for, tech wise.

Chopping forest - ie, Bronze working is good too.

...and don't forget about Religions...lots of options really. :crazyeye:

:hmm: It must be your computer, as I tried it on mine and had no trouble Alt-Tab'ing back and forth. As you said though, it is a lot slower doing it with CivIV.

I am suspicious of screen resolution. I haven't confirmed that yet, but that is my gut feeling. I have put this in the Civ4 bug reports thread.

Due to not being able to switch builds as much is there anything specific we are going for? I just finished the worker and was thinking about building a barracks.

Due to not being able to switch builds as much is there anything specific we are going for? I just finished the worker and was thinking about building a barracks.

I think it is a bit early for a barracks. I would really like a second town. That needs a warrior, and then a settler. Barracks would really slow expansion at this point.

2800 BC (0): Everything looks good.

2760 BC (1):
IT: Cultural boundary expands

2640 BC (4):
IT: Delhi Fast Worker>Barracks

2600 BC (5): Warrior spots brown border east of him.

2560 BC (6): We meet Kublai Khan (Mongols). It happens to me [LK's bug]. I end up having to highlight the “We’ll put your head on a stick” and than arrowing down to get the peace option. Looks like doing a turn log is going to be rather troublesome.

2480 BC (8): Set science at 80%
IT: A bear comes into our view directly south [4 tiles] of Delhi.

2440 BC (9): Set science at 70%
IT: Animal Husbandry>Masonry

2400 BC (10): Set science at 100%. Worker begins a pasture for the pigs.

-I went the route of Masonry so we could build a quarry on the marble.
-As you can see from the pic below we have quite a few resources around us.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_Delhi.JPG

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_resources.JPG

Here's the save (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_BC-2400.Civ4SavedGame).

I think it is a bit early for a barracks. I would really like a second town. That needs a warrior, and then a settler. Barracks would really slow expansion at this point.

Whoops, my bad. Next player needs to switch the build than. We might want to use the wheat tile than to speed up our growth. Are you suggesting building the settler at size 3, 4, or when?

Whoops, my bad. Next player needs to switch the build than. We might want to use the wheat tile than to speed up our growth. Are you suggesting building the settler at size 3, 4, or when?

The way growth works in Civ4 it appears to be better to build workers and settlers from smaller cities.

I hate delaying expansion 30 turns just to build a warrior with a promotion. Once better units arrive I will be more concerned. Our second city could become a heavy military city.



http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LAK-1028.jpg

The way growth works in Civ4 it appears to be better to build workers and settlers from smaller cities.I've been building workers at size 3 and settlers at 4 or 6. I think there could be advantages to either way, but it's too early to tell.

Queing up builds is awesome. Start on something that you'll need later to pass the time during growth and switch builds back and forth at leasure - I love it.

India: Not a fan of this UU. A 3-move worker? I'm not impressed.

Civics: Seeing that we founded Hinduism, I like Organized Religion -- that +25% production in cities with state religion is pretty nice. Not that I'm suggesting we make a beeline to it, just throwing it out there.

Marble: I'd like to get it, as it speeds up the production of quite a few wonders -- will give us options if nothing else.

Resources: As far as I can tell, happiness bonuses are more important than food bonuses (with some exceptions) because an unhealthy city just wastes some food, whereas an unhappy city wastes an entire tile. The exception is lots of jungle, which can prevent growth completely without health bonuses hooked up. I think flood plains have the same effect, but since they produce so much food it balances out.

The way growth works in Civ4 it appears to be better to build workers and settlers from smaller cities.
Why do you say this? Since workers and settlers don't remove population from the citites that build them, there isn't a recovery period where you lose the production of 1 or 2 tiles after popping the unit. You can get right back to working all your improved tiles. And there is the obvious point that better-developed cities build faster. And larger cities often don't need to be in a hurry to grow, depending on the happiness situation, so stopping the accumulation of food is not as painful as it is for small, growing cities. Those are the reasons I can think of to build workers and settlers in bigger cities -- why do you say smaller cities makes more sense?

Well we are all learning, so at this point this really is not clear answer on what size to build workers / settlers. My comment we because growth appear to slow down the larger the city gets. I didn't think about a city that isn't worth growing.:blush:

2400 switch barracks to worker to try for more contacts. leave barracks in the queue.
2360
2320
2280
2240 someone founds Judaism.
2200
2160
2120
2080 build warrior.
2040
2100 learn masonry.

- build a settler at size 4? always leave barracks in queue, until built...
- zero science has been put towards the next tech. I'd go for bronze working or pottery.
- turns go by a lot faster in 4.

:ack: one of our brave warriors:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/MP_LK108_00.gif

One thing I'm just come to realize is there's no reason to MM much anymore. All extra hammers and/or beakers becomes overflow and can be used in the next build/tech. Here I've been trying to make sure nothing was wasted.:blush:

2480 BC (8): Set science at 80%
2440 BC (9): Set science at 70%
IT: Animal Husbandry>Masonry
2400 BC (10): Set science at 100%.

In Civ 4 you no longer have to do this as all the left-over beakers are automatically used for your next research. In fact, you won't probably have to touch the slider for a very long time.

This is true for shields too, the extra ones are used for your next build.

In Civ 4 you no longer have to do this as all the left-over beakers are automatically used for your next research. In fact, you won't probably have to touch the slider for a very long time.

This is true for shields too, the extra ones are used for your next build.
Tnx P32zz! :)

In Civ 4 you no longer have to do this as all the left-over beakers are automatically used for your next research. In fact, you won't probably have to touch the slider for a very long time.

This is true for shields too, the extra ones are used for your next build.

Er, looks like you missed my post that is just above the one I quoted from you.:D

- turns go by a lot faster in 4.


I have been noticing the same thing. I want to complete more games before making any decision, but it appears 20 turns may make more sense. There is just to little going on.

=====================


Signed up:
LKendter
Methos
MeteorPunch
Eotinb (currently playing)
DeceasedHorse (on deck)


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

In order to use resources such as corn and pigs you need a road to them. That lets you get the extra bonus help. We should try to lay roads toward any resources. I found some of them help other then health.


I do have a request that the second warrior not explore to far. My goal was to be able to protect a settler for a second city. Until this game is better understand I think SGs will have problems with a coordinated plan.

Got it.

My comment we because growth appear to slow down the larger the city gets. I didn't think about a city that isn't worth growing.:blush:
Actually, I was thinking along the lines of once we have 3-6 cities and choosing between building a settler in one of the older, more developed cities vs. the younger, growing ones. As far as how big the capital should be before making the first settler, I really have no idea. But it should be possible to figure out how many turns you will save by waiting to grow from, say, 2 to 3. The calculation is actually a lot easier than civ3 because the only changes to s+f/turn will be worker improvements, rather than gaining a whole new worked tile.

One thing I'm just come to realize is there's no reason to MM much anymore. All extra hammers and/or beakers becomes overflow and can be used in the next build/tech.
I love this new feature. The other MM-reducing feature is not-stupid city governors. I've been fooling around with them quite a bit, and they work pretty well. I'm wondering if using them violates the anti-automation suggestion in the LK series... And on that note, I'm wondering the same thing about goto commands -- I can see why they were frowned upon in civ3, but given that left clicking on a unit reveals its projected path (whereas in civ3 doing that canceled the goto command) I'm not sure they are as confusing now. Just food for thought.

In order to use resources such as corn and pigs you need a road to them. That lets you get the extra bonus help.
This is true for all resources -- health, happiness, and strategic. I thought I had read where as long as you had the appropraite worker improvement and the resource was in the city radius, you didn't need to road, but that is not true.

Be right back with my log.

It does appear the need to drop the slider is gone the last turn of science is gone. I don't know how to verify this.
It does appear that several MM tasks are gone, but how to prove it?

It does appear the need to drop the slider is gone the last turn of science is gone. I don't know how to verify this.
It does appear that several MM tasks are gone, but how to prove it?
Um, will "take my word for it" count as verification? The science slider managment is definitely gone. You can see how much the overrun contributes to the next tech once you select it because its shaded in on the bar. Shield overrun works the same way. As for the govs, fool around with them yourself and see what they do.

The log...

Pre-turn: Everything looks hunky dory. I decide to do some city planning using the strategy layer. Keeping in mind that rivers count as roads for trade purposes, I propose we put the second city (Bombay, IIRC) where i have indicated so it will capture both the cows and the gold. A third city could go down on the coast and capture the wheat (the label for which can't be seen in this shot). I'm thinking a fourth city could go further upstream along the same river if there are any goodies in the fog. With this plan, the only roading we'd have to do is that connecting the resources to their respective cities and the little stretch from Delhi W&SW to the big river.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk109-eotinb_screenshot01.jpg

1975ST: Augustine thinks we're smart.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk109-eotinb_screenshot02.jpg
1975BC: I go promotion hunting with the lions in the south. Kill them without taking a scratch. Delhi grows to 4 and I change it to a settler. I tell let the gov take over and he shaves 2 turns off the build (from 17 to 15) which will get even faster once the corn is farmed. I meant to turn the gov back off after I had him rearrange, but I may have forgotten. Please check, DeceasedHorse.
1950BC: I choose Woodsman I for our promotion. I'm tempted to take Combat I and go after the bears next door, but I can probably get them to attack me in the woods, and Woodsman II is very nice for scouting. The upstream spot is looking pretty good, with sugar and dyes both within two tiles of the river.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk109-eotinb_screenshot03.jpg
1925BC: Bears moved away -- this bear meat tastes like chicken. Now I also see rice within the radius of my proposed spot -- very nice!
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk109-eotinb_screenshot04.jpg
1900BC: Corn finishes, and I start connecting it with roads. Time to send the escort back. I have positioned our southern warrior so that he might get attacked by lions and bears next turn while safely in the woods.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk109-eotinb_screenshot05.jpg
1875ST: Bears attack but lions don't. We're down to 1.4/2.
1875BC: I decide now is the time to hit the lions and get our next promotion. We win.
1850BC: Get Woodsman II. I had planned to move to this wooded hill and heal, but then I saw this little hut and I couldn't pass it up.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk109-eotinb_screenshot06.jpg
We get a map revealing a lot of water and some very frigid lands SW of this coast.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk109-eotinb_screenshot07.jpg
1825BC: Move back to wooded hill and start licking wounds.
1800BC
1775BC
1750BC: Corn now connected to Delhi and I move over to marble so we can put a quarry on it, which should speed up the settler some more.

Summary: Southern warrior healing for a few more turns. Northwest warrior almost home just ahead of the finished settler. I still think my proposed spot is good for Bombay, but I'd forgo the wheat/coast spot for now and head upriver for the third city. BW is coming along, but fortunately we have had plenty of improvements to do that don't require chops.

The save. (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_BC-1750.zip)

:p @ last pic

Hurricane Katrina! (j/k) ;)

Well the first round is going really quick. Could I have it back today?

Glad to see all the pictures. With the game being so new, all the lurkers will want screen shots.


Signed up:
LKendter (on deck)
Methos
MeteorPunch
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse (currently playing)


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

It does appear the need to drop the slider is gone the last turn of science is gone. I don't know how to verify this.
It does appear that several MM tasks are gone, but how to prove it?

LK, the way I found out was by mousing over the technology indicator at the top of the screen. Right where it has the green bar and lighter shade , and the number of turns that are left until it is known. When you mouse over it a box will appear in the lower left corner of the screen [the same place that tile information is shown]. MM the science bar so that you know you're way overproducing beakers. Than after the tech is learned and the next one is selected mouse over the bar again. You'll notice that you already have beakers earned.

Same goes for builds. Mouse over the bar and it shows you how many hammers you have and how many are needed total. Mouse over the little hammer that indicates how many hammers you make a turn. If you do this at the begining of a build it'll say "+[i]x amount of overflow".

Hope that helps.

Got it. My copy of Civ is acting a bit squirrely, but I should be able to get it up and running.

lurking:
Is it true that you still have only 1 city? It seems really nothing much is happening besides exploration and fighting animals :crazyeye:

lurking:
Is it true that you still have only 1 city? It seems really nothing much is happening besides exploration and fighting animals :crazyeye:
It is true. We may have gotten away with building a settler from a size 3 Delhi instead of waiting for size 4, but civ4 is definitely not settler factory friendly. I'd go so far as to say that REX should probably be downgraded to MEX (Moderate Early Expansion). But on the other hand, I haven't really seen anyone push expansion as fast as possible, costs be damned. Hmmm... maybe I've given myself an idea for my next SP game. :hmm:

Unfortunately, I'm going to have call for a skip as I cannot get my copy of civ to run-so far, I've only gotten to play civ IV for a single day (granted, that was for about five hours...) and am slightly irritated by this fact :mad: :mad:
It's probably better this way, as I have some serious academic commitments to work through in these next couple of days.

Sorry guys.

Signed up:
LKendter (currently playing)
Methos (on deck)
MeteorPunch
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse (skipped)


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

More than ten turns in the early going might be in order. Twenty turns in the late game, though? :eek:

More than ten turns in the early going might be in order. Twenty turns in the late game, though? :eek:
I was gonna ask if we could try that for this round. Although it makes less discussion, which hinders strategy, it's not like we'd have anything thoughtful to say. :mischief:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_BC-1750.zip


1750 BC
When building a settler a food heavy tile is best to use. By switching to the food heavy tile I saved a turn on building the settler.


1550 BC
(ST) I start research on writing next. Open borders helps relationships with our nearby civs. It also opens up alphabet for the very useful ability to trade techs. I don't know if we will start Alphabet next, as the current research time is way to long.

I started up another worker before we go to barracks. I want the copper connected, along with the gold and marble. The faster we connect the second city, the quicker we start getting trade bonuses. Not to mention getting the cow for a third source of health.


1525 BC
Since playing this is the first time I saw sheep as a source of food. In case you can't tell, I haven't touched the manual yet.


1500 BC
We meet Spain whom doesn't like us because of different religions.


==========================

Summary:
The black circle is the settler / warrior pair ready to build the next city.
The yellow line is the road network I want built to connect all of the resources. Copper is very useless for better military and I now feel a barracks is justified after the worker. Gold will be our first source of happiness. Marble can be very useful with certain buildings / wonders. In addition, connect our cities will give us some needed trade routes to increase income.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LAK-1029.jpg


Signed up:
LKendter
Methos (currently playing)
MeteorPunch (on deck)
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse (skipped)


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

Our second worker can hook Delhi to the river with two roads (W, SW) and the trade route will start bringing in money then. Then it can swng back east and road to the marble, then move on to the copper while the first settler gets the gold on the way to roading all the way to Bombay. Rivers = roads for trade purposes.

When building a settler a food heavy tile is best to use. By switching to the food heavy tile I saved a turn on building the settler.
Really? I thought (surplus) food and shields were equivalent for purposes of building workers and settlers. So a forrested plains (2 shields + 1 food) is the same as a forrested grassland (2 food + 1 shield).

Really? I thought (surplus) food and shields were equivalent for purposes of building workers and settlers. So a forrested plains (2 shields + 1 food) is the same as a forrested grassland (2 food + 1 shield).

We weren't using the corn at 5 food. That beats either of those other combinations.

I see. Absolutely, we should have been using the corn -- that's my bad. I must have turned the gov off, as he would have switched once the farm was done. But any high production tile is good for building workers/settlers, right? A five shield tile is just as good as a five food tile, no?

But any high production tile is good for building workers/settlers, right? A five shield tile is just as good as a five food tile, no?
Yes - they are the same. The trouble is we were using a 3 food and hammer tile when a 5 food and hammer tile could be used.

Got it....

I'm willing to sign up as a replacement in case any regular players end up with intractible issues running the game. :D

I'm willing to sign up as a replacement in case any regular players end up with intractible issues running the game. :D

Ha Ha...

What annoys me the most was that I finally got it working Friday, only to come back after a long day on Saturday and discover that my computer will no longer read CD#1

Ha Ha...

What annoys me the most was that I finally got it working Friday, only to come back after a long day on Saturday and discover that my computer will no longer read CD#1

Sorry to hear that, my post was aimed more at the seemingly widespread issues and not at any particular player's misfortune.

@LK: Some proof for you that MMing is gone. This is a quote from Soren on the main CivFanatics frontpage:

Removing unnecessary micromanagement from the game was a high-level design goal for Civ IV, one which paid off huge dividends in the final product. We systematically looked at every piece of micromanagement from which Civ 1-3 suffered and figured out ways to remove it without altering the underlying game dynamic. Pollution was removed in favor of a high-level health system. Beaker and hammer overflow was introduced to end the incentive for min-maxing your citizens each and every turn. City riots were simply turned into angry citizens to take away the need to continually check on your cities' happiness in case something went wrong. Workers now have two moves so that a move and an order can be given on the same turn -reducing the number of times the player deals with an active worker by half. Also, some high-level controls to allow micromanagement were added. For example, workers can be grouped together and given an infinite number of sequential orders. Multiple cities can be selected at a time, allowing the player to change all cities on one continent to build tanks with just two clicks.

@LKendter: The save you provided in post #37 is the wrong save. Can you please upload the 1500 BC save?

Corrected link:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_BC-1500.zip

Got it, again.

1475 BC (1): Bombay founded, begins warrior.

1450 BC (2): Kublai Khan adopts slavery (meaning they know BW)

1425 BC (3): Worker finishes quarry, moves NW and begins road.

1375 BC (5): Delhi Fast Worker>Barracks
IT: We meet Washington

1350 BC (6): Worker finishes road south of Delhi, moves S. Both Workers begin road.

1325 BC (7): We meet Louis XIV. Worker finishes road, moves SW.

1300 BC (8): We meet Alexander

1275 BC (9): Workers finish road to the river [gold] which connects our two cities. Begin on a mine. Other worker heads to the cow.

1250 BC (10): Worker begins Pasture.

-Delhi is growing great, earning +9 food.

Copper is very useless for better military and I now feel a barracks is justified after the worker.

I don’t quite understand the above quote. I’m not for sure if you are saying copper is worthless, or just not good for advanced units? In the ancient age copper (or iron) allows us to build axemen and spearmen. Eventually it also allows macemen and phalanx. IMO copper is worth connecting, especially now that we are building a barracks.

Here's the save (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_BC-1250.Civ4SavedGame).

On the copper comment that was causing confusion:
I didn't want to build a barracks simply for better warriors. Now that we can build better units I feel the time for a barracks is justified.
It was meant to be *usefull*, not useless.

Signed up:
LKendter
Methos
MeteorPunch (curently playing)
Eotinb (on deck)
DeceasedHorse


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

I fixed the above to show: MeteorPunch (curently playing)
I had two players on deck, but noone actually playing.

1250
1225 Hinduism spreads to Bombay.
1200
1175 Writing discovered. Science was autoset to research Alphabet next. Do't know if this was intentional...that would take 29(!) turns. Set research to Pottery.
Get Open Borders with 4/6 known civs. France and Spain wouldn't go for it.This is one of the big downfalls of converting to a state religion. We have a -4 relation modifier with civs of another religion.
1150
1125 Gold Luxury connected.
1100
1075
1050
1025 Cow resource connected. Pottery researched. Starting Hunting.
1000

The Mongols have placed a city nearby. I think our next city should be in this area before they take it. Lots of resources.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/MP_LK108_01.gif

Signed up:
LKendter
Methos
MeteorPunch
Eotinb (currently playing)
DeceasedHorse (on deck?) Is Civ4 working yet?


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

I took a look at the game. We are building a settler even though we only have *one* warrior in that city. Everything I have read says that unescorted settlers are far worse in Civ4. Please put a warrior in front of that build.

Edit: No reason to waste another post.

Pre-turn: Push warrior in front of settler in Delhi, per LK's request. FYI, there was a warrior near MP's proposed spot, so we would have been OK. Also push granary in front of Bombay's library. Bombay will need the help growing with all those plains around and won't get much use out of the library until it's working the gold mine tile. MM in Delhi to speed hunting and warrior (both in 2).

980BC
960ST: Hunting comes in, I start Priesthood (6). With our marble hooked up, we have a good shot at the Oracle, which we could use to get CoL and found another religion, or Monarchy and hook up those wines west of Bombay, or Alphabet and trade techs. Lots of options. Also, we will need either a temple or another lux to grow Delhi past 8.
960BC: Warrior finished in Delhi, redo MM to optimize settler (8). Pick Combat I for our barracks promotion, since this guy will mostly be doing garrison duty. While it's waiting for the settler to finish, I want to take out a barb that just showed up east of Bombay and get that 5th xp for the next promotion.
940ST: Warrior exploring in trees in the NW defeats a barb on defense.
940BC: Woodsman warrior only down to 1.5, decide to keep him scouting through trees -- should be safe with all that +def in the woods.
920BC
900ST: Two barb attacks, two wins.
900BC: Promote escort to Shock -- most likely to be taking on warrior barbs during guard duty. Move NW warrior to wooded hill to heal (6 turns).
880BC: Bombay's borders expand, but already working the best tiles.
860BC
840ST: Lose NW warrior to barb attack despite his favorable position. Priesthood comes in, start on Archery.
840BC
820BC: Start mining copper, axes and spears to come. Bombay grows to 3.
800BC: Delhi finishes settler and resumes library. Bombaby finishes granary (crappy timing there) and also resumes library. Settler heads towards hill, with escort already in place.

Summary: Delhi can crank out the Oracle in 11 turns, before MM for production, so I think we should go for it. Still no hurry for the library in Bombay, so feel free to delay that further if you have something better to build (another escort for another settler, perhaps -- our neighbors are closing in from all directions). Screenshots below show a spot north of Delhi that we could settle and grab some gems, a pre-Calendar lux and the reason the Khan is crowding us, no room to his east.

The save. (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_BC-0800.zip)

Gem town:
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot008.jpg

Outer Mongolia:
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot009.jpg

I took a look at the game. We are building a settler even though we only have *one* warrior in that city. Everything I have read says that unescorted settlers are far worse in Civ4. Please put a warrior in front of that build.Yeah settlers need to be watched over. They have 2 movement which can get them out of any trouble besides a wolf or puma (2 movement) sneak attack. Edit: but I guess moving your settler and revealing a bear right next to you is certain doom...

There is a warrior to the East of our capital (check the screenshot) that I would have us use for cover. I should have put that in my summary.

This post is just to notify people that I edited my "got it" post and put the log in there since there weren't any newer posts when I started writing the log. Post conservation is all the rage, you know.

This post is just to notify people that I edited my "got it" post and put the log in there since there weren't any newer posts when I started writing the log. Post conservation is all the rage, you know.
Please *don't* do this in the future.
If somebody looks between the got it the game gets lost. I already had more then one SG in limbo because of this. Please "waste" the post and start a new one.

Signed up:
LKendter (on deck)
Methos
MeteorPunch
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse (currently playing) (hopefully Civ4 is now working)


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

I need another skip.

I'm going to try exchanging my copy of civ and see if that helps at all.

Sorry.

Yeah, I see the problem now. I was making fun of myself with the whole post conservation thing. Won't happen again.

Signed up:
LKendter (currently playing)
Methos (on deck)
MeteorPunch
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_BC-0600.zip


800 BC
While a lot has changed with Civ4, I still feel the most basic rules of Civ3 apply. Empire expansion is first (settlers, workers and military). After that you can start to develop cities. The building of 2 libraries is very premature IMHO.
The building of 2 libraries at this point will cost us at least 1 city. A city will help research just as much, if not more.

I found a screwed up feature in civ4. There is no way to move the barracks back up the queue, so I have to flush 27 shields toward the library.


760 BC
Madras is formed.



==========================

Summary:
Once the barracks is completed in Bombay that city should go in heavy military mode. I would like to get something better then one warrior per city.


Signed up:
LKendter
Methos (currently playing)
MeteorPunch (on deck)
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

While a lot has changed with Civ4, I still feel the most basic rules of Civ3 apply. Empire expansion is first (settlers, workers and military). After that you can start to develop cities. The building of 2 libraries is very premature IMHO.
The building of 2 libraries at this point will cost us at least 1 city. A city will help research just as much, if not more.
Maybe, but maybe not. I think this has not been ascertained for certain yet. But I do agree with you that it seemed a bit premature to be building libraries. When I found them in the queues, I went back and checked to previous turns to see if there was a reason I was missing for them to be built. I didn't find one, so I superseded both orders.

I found a screwed up feature in civ4. There is no way to move the barracks back up the queue, so I have to flush 27 shields toward the library.
The shields should still be there, even if you remove something from the queue. Try for yourself by clicking on the library again and see how far it is to completion. AFAIK, the only way to lose shields put towards a build is decay.

Edit: Thinking a little harder about which would increase reseach more: infrastructure or another city. On the turn it is built, a new city should be growing, which will usually mean it is not working a high-gold tile -- the 1 gold from working a tile next to river is the most likely scenario. You could also generate income from a trade route, but I think that with the way trade routes work, a new odd-numbered city doesn't get that benefit (assuming only domestic routes). And of course, you have the maintenance cost of another city to factor in. I suspect that in the short run, a new city hurts research more than it helps. A library is not a great build to focus on at this point in a game, but a monastary probably makes sense. And it may make sense to devote shields to the library you will eventually finish if there is nothing more urgent to be building.

The other factor in this equation is if it makes sense to build multiplier buildings when you have so little base to multiply. With the gold mine in Bombay's radius, I think an early library makes more sense there than Delhi.

LK, as a lurker, let me ask you this question. It's now 750BC and I can't see much happening in the game. It all looks a little, err, boring. Is it the level of difficulty or is that the norm for Civ4?

LK, as a lurker, let me ask you this question. It's now 750BC and I can't see much happening in the game. It all looks a little, err, boring. Is it the level of difficulty or is that the norm for Civ4?

One thing I've noticed is CivIV is a lot more slow than CivIII. You'll also note in the CivIV General Discussion that there are several threads on how very little warmongering was done through the entire game. Many people mentioned none at all. I believe those that did were playing the easier levels though.

BTW, got it.

LK, as a lurker, let me ask you this question. It's now 750BC and I can't see much happening in the game. It all looks a little, err, boring. Is it the level of difficulty or is that the norm for Civ4?

The city growth curved was really killed. Because of this, the BC time frame is quite boring. That is why LK109 has a change of 20 turns for all players the first round.

Once you get the hang of some of the new tactics, BC won't be so boring. Hint: you pay a high price for chasing religions if you don't start with Myst...

Hint: you pay a high price for chasing religions if you don't start with Myst...

I've only tried this up to Noble, but I don't recall every losing out on Hinduism even when I chose someone without the Spiritual trait. My first two techs are always Mysticism [typically in 4] and than the Hinduism tech [typically in 6 or 7]. Going for Buddhism is foolish as that is the tech the AI's seem to always go for.

I'll play late this afternoon, after I wake up.

Well, that's my point. The opportunity cost is the techs you weren't researching during that time. Given the right bonus squares, it can pay to squeeze out a worker VERY early. But if you don't have the right techs to get them up and running, things will indeed be pretty boring.

:mischief:

Do we have any sort of city spot planning? I've been trying to figure out where to send the settler and figured I'd ask first.

I like the spot in the north, just past those two peaks. Will grab dyes, two gems, and something else. I put a screenshot in my last log. Cold also go upriver from Bombay to the rice, etc.

600 BC (0):
580 BC (1): Delphi Settler>Settler. Copper connected. Worker moves to cow and begins pasture. Settler and weakest warrior head north. Southern worker begins farming on a river tile.
560 BC (2): Isabelle adopts Slavery.
540 BC (3): Alexander converts to Judaism.
520 BC (4): Bombay Barracks>Axemen.
500 BC (5): Our scouting warrior fell to a barbarian warrior.
480 BC (6): Bangalore founded, begins obelisk.
460 BC (7): Worker finishes pasture near Madras, heads towards Bangalore.
440 BC (8): Borders of Delphi expand, bringing the gems within our borders. Hinduism spreads to Madras.
420 BC (9): Southern worker finishes farm, moves towards Madras.
400 BC (10): Alexander demands we drops our agreements with Germany. I decline. Bombay Axemen>Axemen. Madras Obelisk>Granary. Delphi Settler>Settler.

-The worker south of Madras needs to road and farm towards the rice. This will give us +1 health.
-I haven’t promoted our new axemen as I wasn’t for sure what our future plans were. Possible promotions are Combat I. Woodsman I, or City Raider I.
-Both Madras and Bombay have just started their current builds. Both can be reset to something else.
-The workers that are building a road towards Bangalore should mine the gems for the increased happiness. Our road to Bangalore goes directly over the gems.
-Though I have set Delphi to build another Settler I disagree some with it. Our economy has dropped to -4 gpt. I have indicated a spot where we should probably send this settler in the attempts to increase our income. I suggest building cottages around this new city to increase our income. We could use this city as a money town.
-So as not to lose the shields should we finish the library [in Delphi] before we continue to expand? It is my understanding that CivIV does not work well with the early settler rush.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_New_City.JPG

Here's the save (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_BC-0400.Civ4SavedGame).

I believe I've got civ running again

I found a screwed up feature in civ4. There is no way to move the barracks back up the queue, so I have to flush 27 shields toward the library.
As eotinb said, the shields/hammers aren't lost. You can hover your mouse over the build icon and it will say how many hammers are built towards it (27/60, for example). I thought I wasted some production in today's game, but nope, it's still there. Interesting side note: If you start a wonder in one city, then take it out of the queue and start the same wonder in another city you still have the production saved in the first city; when the second city finishes you cash out the production from the first city. Probably not useful to do, but useful to know.

Roster:
LKendter
Methos- Just Played
MeteorPunch- Up
Eotinb- On Deck
DeceasedHorse

There were several questions in my last post I was hoping would be discussed.

1) Promotion- though in truth I don't really believe we know enough to decide what direction we want.
2) Settler factory- too many cities are causing our economy to drop.

Roster:
Ouch - it's been a long time since I got beat to the punch on this.


2) Settler factory- too many cities are causing our economy to drop.
We have to look long-term. If we don't grab the land now, war will be the only method. That hasn't changed from civ3. If new cities gain luxuries, resources, or health help they are well worth it.
We can improve revenue easier then we can grab cities in the future.

On promotions, there isn't a need to hurry and get them. We can even save up the xp and promote multiple times once we know what we want a unit for.

On growth, in my SP games, more cities seems like a good thing, even if you have to pay for them.

Just noticed that we're playing on "Epic." The Epic setting is kind of an odd one, as they simply increased everything, which just results in a longer game. Many people are modding this in C&C as it should have been that Tech takes longer, but builds do not, so that you can actually build and use units before they become out of date. With the "smaller is better" mentallity of the developers of Civ 4, I'm finding small maps more enjoyable. I was quite suprised at how long builds are taking with these settings.

400-200BC

Just curious, why is Bangalore where it is? I think it should be 1 tile south.

400
380
360 discover Alphabet. Start on Monarchy. Trade Polytheism for Meditation. Trade Alphabet for Iron Working. This is a bad deal because Alphabet is more valuable. I did this because a Barbarian city has popped up nearby and Iron would help to conquest it.
340
320 Calcutta founded. Kind of a hard choice for city placement here. I put it in a place where it would "fit" along with other cities and so that we could keep the barb city, rather than to get the iron.
300
280
260
240
220
200

Notice 2 things: Germany's borders are pressing on us in the north. I sent my axemen up there in case the decided to declare as they had a few units running around. I have had several games where the AI has declared early war on me before I was ready...

Also, you can see the barb city. It is in a great location for us. when it gets to size 2, we can capture it, which may be during the next turnset.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/MP_LK108_02.gif

I forgot we need 2 things: Real defenders, ie archers, and workers.

Signed up:
LKendter
Methos
MeteorPunch
Eotinb (currently playing)
DeceasedHorse (on deck)

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

I've got it. Should be able to play later tonight.

Short version: Fred took out Ghuzz (barb city) and auto-razed it. :whipped: in Delhi as happiness management, used overflow to get a head start on Oracle. Made some headway on the worker and archer shortage.

Pre-turn: Delhi is at max size until we get another lux (gems now, eventually wine) hooked up. Since we are spiritual and have BW, I switch to Slavery in preparation of using the whip to manage pop growth. MeteorPunch wasn't kidding about needing workers -- we have 2! Not sure why the worker near Bangalore is building a cottage instead of hooking up the gems -- no big deal.

1. 180BC: Send some of our axes to scout Ghuzz and monitor it's growth.
2. 160BC: Archer finishes in Delhi, heads to garrison Calcutta. Axe finishes in Bombay, start on a much-needed worker. Send axe also in direction of Ghuzz, without using his promotion -- I figure we can take City Raider if we indeed raid the city. I whip the library in Delhi -- making plenty enough coin to make this worthwhile. Taking a happiness penalty for 15 turns (which you can monitor by hovering on the whip button -- subtract 15 from whatever it tells you and that's how many turns left on the previous whip). We need to be careful not to regrow that pop point before the penalty goes away (on second thought, we should have the gems hooked up around then, so this may not matter). FYI, a whipped citizen = 60 hammers on this speed.
3. 140BC: Overflow from library is just enough to finish an axeman or more than enough for another archer, but I decide to use it as a jump-start on the Oracle, which we have the marble to build fast anyway. Ghuzz still at 1, with one archer defending. Getting in position to take it as soon as it grows.
4. 120: Start worker on gems. Not that it matters, but I chop before mining as this will eliminate the health penalty from the jungle sooner than doing both at once and I think it's the same net worker turns.
5. 100BC: Looks like Fred is going after Ghuzz.
6. 80BC: Yup, it's gone. Looking back, I probably should have tried with our one axe over there and at least taken the consolation prize of the sacking money. I thought Fred might not attack (although this seemed unlikely) or might fail and we might still get a useful city. I also wasn't in a good position yet, with only one axe and that one attacking across the river. Whatever.
7. 60BC: ...
40ST: Fred offers Sailing for Writing. Since we have no coastal cities yet and Writing would allow him to trade techs around, I turn him down. Feel free to second guess me on this. Also, Monarchy comes in and I start on CoL -- we have a decent shot to found Confucianism but it's also a good tech to have (Caste System, courts) and a moderate price. This is also a bit of a placeholder -- no need to start on an expensive tech that we could get free anyway with the Oracle in a few turns. We can now hook up our wine.
8. 40BC: Madras finishes granary, starts on another worker.
9. 20BC: Would-be Ghuzz attacker set to sentry duty in Calcutta for now.
10. 1AD: Abacuses everywhere fail due to the nasty Y1 bug. Bombay finishes worker, can go back to library or start on something else -- next guy's call. I'd have that worker farm one of the grasslands on the river for enough excess food to mine a plains hill, then road out to Calcutta maybe.

Summary: Oracle up next turn. I'd say Feudalism would be a nice tech to grab, but any of the more expensive ones would be a steal. Got one of our axes headed out to Madras to help out until another archer (or longbow) finishes. Probably need to get a city out to where Ghuzz was pretty soon -- that's a good spot even without the iron we need. Got a worker roading out to Calcutta and I left the new one in Bombay for DeceasedHorse.

Screenshot to follow.

The save. (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_AD-0001.Civ4SavedGame)

PS. I forgot to check, but this feels like an Epic speed game, which would explain why it feels like nothing is happening.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot010.jpg

dang that Fred! ;)

Since we have no coastal cities yet and Writing would allow him to trade techs around, I turn him down. Writing is open borders. Alphabet is tech trading. However, with no coastal cities it really doesn't matter.


Signed up:
LKendter (on deck)
Methos
MeteorPunch
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse (currently playing)

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

Writing is open borders. Alphabet is tech trading. However, with no coastal cities it really doesn't matter.
Doh! Why do I keep making that mistake!? :aargh:

Writing is open borders. Alphabet is tech trading. However, with no coastal cities it really doesn't matter.


Signed up:
LKendter (on deck)
Methos
MeteorPunch
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse (currently playing)

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.
I got it, provided I'm within the 24 hour window.

Preturn: I do as the previous Great Masters have instructed regarding worker actions.

Turn 1: The Oracle finishes, and we learn Feudalism from the deranged Prophets that lurk within it, feasting on the souls of the innocent. Or something. Incidentally, we enter the Medieval age. Delhi starts on longbow.

Turn 2: Not much

Turn 3: ditto

Turn 4: We now have a pop of 500,000. Blue border spotted northeast of Madras, looks like the American Pig-Dogs have founded a city near the rice.

Turn 5: Forest near Delhi expands. Yay! Check around to see if there are any good tech trades available-there are not.

Turn 6: Madras builds Fast Worker, starts another.

Turn 7: Delhi builds Longbow, starts on Settler; hopefully we can grab those horses east of Bangalore. Bangalore finishes Obelisk, starts Granary; ATM it produces too few shields to accomplish much.

Turn 8: Usual mishmash of AI units wander around. Increase science to 100% at -6gpt, Code of Laws due in five. Spot a brown border near the horses I was hopping to get. Wake up the warrior in Calcutta and send him west to see if there are any good city cites still available in that direction.

Turn 9: Alexander shows up, wants to trade sailing for polytheism. Since both techs have the same cost and we need access to Calender eventually, I agree. It looks like Isabella has us closed in on the west.

Turn 10: Not much. Next leader may want to just go ahead and flush the settler being built in the capitol; other than grabbing the gold to the southeast, I’m not sure if have much use for him, although getting a coastal city might be a good idea.

IIRC there was a spot on the coast that grabbed some wheat. In any case, a spare settler is a pretty good thing to have.

Signed up:
LKendter
Methos (on deck)
MeteorPunch
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse (currently playing)

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

LK- uhh... Deaceased horse just played :p

Or did I...DUM DUM DUM!!!!

Well I shouldn’t post after an exhausting drive…
Let’s try this again.

Signed up:
LKendter (currently playing)
Methos (on deck)
MeteorPunch
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_AD-0400.zip


260 AD
(ST) We have formed Confucianism. :D


280 AD
Delhi accepts Confucianism.


400 AD
Lahore is formed. It is a bit tight with Bombay.

==========================

Summary:

Signed up:
LKendter
Methos (currently playing)
MeteorPunch (on deck)
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

Got it....

400 AD: Unsure why Calcutta is building an axemen without a barracks, but I leave it anyway.

410 AD: Louis XIV adopts Organized Religion. Kublai Khan declares war on Washington.

420 AD: -2 gpt, so I adjust science rate down to 80% (+1 gpt).

430 AD: Washington asks us for help, but I decline.

470 AD: Washington calls on us for some tech trade. I don’t wish to ruin our relations any further so agree to giving him Monarchy for Mathematics.

490 AD (9): Kublai Khan asks us to join in on Washington, but I decline this too.

-Hmm, I believe I should have accepted one of the deals as we’re now at -1 with both of them. Washington is still pleased with us but the Khan is cautious. Wasn’t for sure if we’re ready for war or not, or if we ourselves are ready. Still not used to the diplomacy in CivIV.

-I built, or am building, several cottages to help ease our finances.

Here's the save (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_AD-0500.Civ4SavedGame).

Signed up:
LKendter
Methos
MeteorPunch (currently playing)
Eotinb (on deck)
DeceasedHorse

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

Oh yeah, almost forgot. I did not promote any of the units I built as I didn't know what we needed. I suggest we not promote them until we know what our plans are. There's no reason to rush it anyway, as we can always promote them the turn we need the promotion.

500
510
520 Revolt to Organized Religion. This gives a 25% production bonus to our building-producing Hindu cities at the low, low cost of 2gpt. :cool:
530
540
550 Theology discovered. We are now the founders of 3 Religions.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/MP_LK108_03.jpg

Researching Calendar next would give access to 2 more luxuries, but our people are pretty happy already. I'm gonna start us on Metal Working to get some quick Forges up (Industrials build them twice as fast). This plus Organized Religion will get our production skyrocketing.
560
570 Kublai Khan demands Alphabet...too bad for him.
580
590
600

We still have room for a couple towns. Here's a suggestion:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/MP_LK108_04.jpg

I've got it. Those proposed city sites seem like they overlap quite a bit with our existing cities. If instead of those two, we put one on the hill in the SW corner, the only overlap would be the worthless peak tile.

I've got it. Those proposed city sites seem like they overlap quite a bit with our existing cities. If instead of those two, we put one on the hill in the SW corner, the only overlap would be the worthless peak tile.True...I just can't stand to see some tiles go to waste though. :D Going the one city route would waste 2 tiless in the south and I think 5 or 6 in the north. Either way works for me though, this is a learning game and I couldn't say either is better, ultimately.

Signed up:
LKendter
Methos
MeteorPunch
Eotinb (currently playing)
DeceasedHorse (on deck)

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

600AD (pre-turn): Defenses are pretty weak, I'll make it a point to get more modern troops on the ground -- longbows at least. Pull a priest out of Dehli, as we will want quite a few prophets down the road, and the faster the better. I agree with the idea of spreading our religins via missionaries, but don't see the need to hurry until we have the shrines to make it profitable.

610AD (1): Christian temple finishes in Delhi, start on longbowman. LB finishes in Madras, start on another one -- I think I'd like two in each city. And I've read in other SGs about using the first strike promotions instead of city garrison as it gives flexibility, but in any case I'll hold off on promotions until they are needed. Switch civics to Vassalage and Theocracy for military buildup -- civic upkeep goes from 2 to 4gpt.

620AD (2): Bombay finishes missionary, starts on LB. Lahore finishes granary, starts on courthouse. Hindu missionary succeeds in Bangalore -- now all our cities are Hindu, time to start on neighbors.

630AD (ST): Fred tried to get us to convert to Confucianism -- I try to tell him no but switching to this log and back prevents me from turning him down. I thought I read where there was a workaround for this annoying problem using the arrow keys, but I couldn't get it to work, so we are Confucian for 3 turns until I can change back. At least it didn't cause any anarchy.

630AD (3): Have a warrior fortifying in the woods outside the barbarian town of Apache. If they attack he will promote, and maybe we can swoop in after an AI attempt to take the town falls short.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot011.jpg

640AD (4): One advantage of switching to Confucianism is it allows us to peek in on a few neighboring cities.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot012.jpg
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot013.jpg

650AD (5): I have to put something in the queues in front of our about-to-complete longbows for a turn so we can change back to Hinduism and get the benefit of Theocracy.

660AD (ST): Finish researching MC, start on Currency -- +1 trade routes/city is mmm mmm good.

660AD (6): Can't convert back to Hinduism. :hmm: Maybe because we did it at Fred's behest we have to wait a certain number of turns (above and beyond the number allowed between revolutions). This is certainly slowing down my military buildup.

670AD (7): Moses is born in Delhi and proceeds to build the Kashi Vishwanath (Hindu shrine). Extra income allows us to push research back up to 90% at +1gpt.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot014.jpg

680AD (8): I can finally switch back to Hinduism, which I do, and bring the longbows back to the front of their respective queues, queueing up another in each of our first three cities at the same time. George W is now Jewish, along with about half of the civs we know.

690AD (9): In the inter-turn, an archer in Apache attacks our fortified warrior and loses. I promote to WoodsI and re-fortify. Three LBs complete and each city starts another.

700AD (ST): Washington comes begging for CoL and I turn him down. Between this, our not helping him in his earlier war, and his Judaism, I think a war is not too far in our future. I suggest we continue the arms buildup.

700AD (10): Nearby Mongol city gets the true faith, and I take a peek inside. Ouch! Hope that's not for us!
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot015.jpg

Summary: I see no reason not to continue building troops for the near future. I didn't settle any new towns, but that would be a nice thing to do pretty soon, either MeteorPunch's 2-city plan or my 1-city plan (or some other crazy plan I suppose). Looking at our cities, I like Bangalore as the research center, with all those gold-heavy luxury resources about. I think Madras can be a pretty powerful hammer-producing city if we can get enough excess food to work all those hills. Delhi should be a good all-purpose city.

The save. (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_AD-0700.Civ4SavedGame)

I see no reason not to continue building troops for the near future. I didn't settle any new towns, but that would be a nice thing to do pretty soon...
While I agree we can use more armies, I don't want that to be the only focus. Last time I looked at the game our empire was to small, and we really needed some infrastructure to offset that.
IMO the settler for another city needs to be high on the priority list.


Signed up:
LKendter (on deck)
Methos
MeteorPunch
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse (currently playing)

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

wow, that Mongol city looks dangerous. I don't think I've seen a city like that (on Warlord!) at this point in the game. It would be difficult to capture too, on a hill with walls.

I have got it.

The following tactics are PROHIBITED:

1) The diplomatic demand exploit. You can demand a ton of stuff from a civ, ask for a counter-offer and get everything you want.


Standard LK house rules:
1) Automation of any kind is strongly discouraged until the game is known better.

2) Go to orders beyond the end of your turn are not allowed.

3) Please complete your turn. At most the next player should have one unmoved unit such as a settler where you are unsure of its direction.

4) Please load the game while running civ. If you load by clicking the game you rename the leader. The leader name becomes part of the save, so I want to keep LK### as the leader name. I don't want to defeat a very useful feature.
If you do accidentally load by double clicking the save, then please use the Alt-D feature for civ details and rename the leader by the LK### value.

Preturn: Hmm, everything looks good to me.
Turn 1: The Spanish build Toledo on top of the hill Eotinb had suggested as a city site, pretty much ending any discussion of founding more cities for the immediate future. Alexander wants to trade Calander for Caste System, and I turn him away as I don’t see any need for Calander that would be worth obsoleting Stonehenge for. On the other hand, I see that we do have dyes and spices north of Madras. Hmmm.
Turn 2: I go ahead and trade Code of Laws to Washington for calendar-none of our cities will really be at all affected by the culture loss, and two more luxuries are always nice.
Start on some plantations. I figure that we should build up some more military than snag a couple of Spanish cities, as Isabella is weak and doesn’t like us anyway
Turn 3: Delhi builds Longbow, starts Forge. The only nation willing to trade us Iron is the Mongols, and they want too much for it IMO. Research to 100% so we get currency next turn. Shave a turn off the forge in Delhi by slowing growth down a bit.
Turn 4: Currency comes in, start on Construction so we can build us some Catapults. Research back to 90%.
Turn 5: Bombay builds longbow, starts Forge.
Turn 6: Washington wants us to break our deals with the Mongols. Um, no. In other news, a source of Iron pops up UNDERNEATH on of the mined hills next to Madras ! Bombay goes to zero growth in order to cut two turns off of its forge.
Turn 7: Bangalore builds granary, starts Hindu Temple.
Turn 8: Stuff
Turn 9: Not much
Turn 10: Construction comes in; after that, I suggest we start building up some catapults for the inevitable conflict with Spain once our Forges finish up.

Signed up:
LKendter (currently playing)
Methos (on deck)
MeteorPunch
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

Revised rules as I just learned about another exploit.

The following tactics are PROHIBITED:

1) The diplomatic demand exploit. You can demand a ton of stuff from a civ, ask for a counter-offer and get everything you want.

2) The diplomatic gold exploit. See the below thread for details. You can do such silliness as get iron for $1/turn.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=139169


Standard LK house rules:
1) Automation of any kind is strongly discouraged until the game is known better.

2) Go to orders beyond the end of your turn are not allowed.

3) Please complete your turn. At most the next player should have one unmoved unit such as a settler where you are unsure of its direction.

4) Please load the game while running civ. If you load by clicking the game you rename the leader. The leader name becomes part of the save, so I want to keep LK### as the leader name. I don't want to defeat a very useful feature.
If you do accidentally load by double clicking the save, then please use the Alt-D feature for civ details and rename the leader by the LK### value.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108AD-0900.zip


800 AD
Our number one problem is city size. We are nowhere close to our happiness limit. We don't have enough farms to get our cities to the maximum size. We really need some growth from out cities.

I trade some obsolete techs to the AI and use the cash to upgrade 1 archer and 2 warriors. Civ4 does seem to be much heavier in demands for military, so I can't argue with getting 3 better units.


810 AD
(ST) We are the most cultured civ in the game.

I sneak in Literature to get the Great Library. I know it isn't as good as Civ3, but I still like the idea of snagging as many wonders as possible. If nothing else, we will get overloaded with great people points. ;)


830 AD
I don't understand the cottage on a hill by Madras. I am replacing it by a mine to increase production.


840 AD
(ST) Spain captures the barbarian city of Apache.


880 AD
(ST) Hinduism spreads in Thermopylae.



==========================

Summary:
I am researching music hoping to snag the free great person.

There is a missionary ready to spread Hinduism to Toledo. I want to see our state religion start to spread. We may even get the option to convert some AIs to our faith for a huge diplomatic bonus. I would like to see Delhi continue to sneak in missionaries to spread the faith.

Signed up:
LKendter (skip Nov 23 to Nov 27)
Methos (currently playing)
MeteorPunch (on deck)
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

Got it, but won't be able to play until tomorrow night.

900 AD: Adjust Bombay for growth. Still making the same shields but less commerce.

920 AD: Music>Compass. We have a Great Artist.

930 AD: We lose the GL to someone, but earn 294 gold for our loss. We spread Hinduism to Philadelphia.

940 AD: Washington asks to trade his Silks for our Gems. They both have the same bonus so I see no reason not to. Delhi begins celebrating We Love the Monarch Day.

950 AD: We spread Hinduism to Turfan.

960 AD: Louis XIV wants Open Borders, I agree. We spread Hinduism to Old Sarai.

980 AD: Compass>Paper

990 AD: Louis XIV demands we cancel all deals with Germany, I say no. We spread Hinduism to Munich.

Notes:
-Delhi has done nothing but build Hindu missionaries.
-Delhi is working on another Great Prophet. I suggest we use him to make a special shrine for one of Bombay’s religions. I can’t recall but one of the cities religions has already spread a little.
-We have a Great Artist in Delhi that has just been sitting there. Not for sure what to do with him. Anyone have any suggestions?
-Either have built or am building courthouses. It’ll help with our gpt.

Uploads page still isn't working...

We have a Great Artist in Delhi that has just been sitting there. Not for sure what to do with him. Anyone have any suggestions?
:confused: Was that there from the beginning of my turn?
We want to find some use for it - even if we merge it with a city. Don't knock the amount of culture you get.

Signed up:
LKendter (skip Nov 23 to Nov 27)
Methos
MeteorPunch (currently playing)
Eotinb (on deck)
DeceasedHorse

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

:confused: Was that there from the beginning of my turn?
We want to find some use for it - even if we merge it with a city. Don't knock the amount of culture you get.

No, we got it from learning Compass.

Well, as a war may be in our near guture, he would be useful to end a revolt.

Revolts aren't really a problem in CivIV. At least I've never had a problem with them. How does the great artist cancel the revolt? Is it by culture bombing?

IMO using the great artist to culture bomb a city is probably our best bet. Though I'd prefer to do it where our borders are warring with another. Also place the culture bomb so it'll be near AI cities with low culture. Gain some territory that way.

Using an artist to set off a culture bomb in a just-captured city will immediately end the revolt (and expand the borders as usual). I agree that revolts aren't all that problematic in CIV, but using a Great Artist this way can help an advance keep moving forward and give immediate access to a new resource (assuming you haven't pillaged the AI-built infrastructure).

I see I'm up. Do we have any victory condition in mind? I don't mind going peaceful here, diplo, space, or culture. I'd like to go for diplomatic. Maybe just conquer our neighbors, Spain and Mongolia, or something?

Otherwise I'll just keep building things. :D I noticed we still have a nice city spot in the SE where I will definitely put a city. Also, we could have a miniwar to claim Toledo from Spain.

If we go to war for Toledo, might as well get that city north of Calcutta (Cordoba?) while we're at it.

- The mongols have already converted to our state religion, so now I will evangelize the germans.
- An aquaduct is being built in Bombay which doesn't help at all. The health there is 10 out of 15 which means it can gain 6 more pop before becoming unhealthy.
- We should focus more on markets/libraries/forges, stuff like that as we are pretty healthy and happy.
1000
1005
1010
1015 spread Hinduism to Berlin.
1020 Germany coverts to Hinduism. :D
1025
1030 Paper is researched, start on Civil Service.
1035
1040 Karachi is founded. Hinduism should naturally spread here soon - no need to waste a missionary.
1045 Isabella wants Alphabet. She's in last place in score and we need some positive attitude points with her so I do. We gain +2. She still won't give open borders...
1050

- the hindu missionary in the jungle is headed to Greece.
- I think we should get rid of miss isabella soon.

What did our great artist do?


Signed up:
LKendter (skip Nov 23 to Nov 27)
Methos
MeteorPunch
Eotinb (currently playing)
DeceasedHorse (on deck)

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

What did our great artist do?He's just been sitting there smoking weed. Trying to get "inspiration" or something.

I've got it. I think I shall do another round of military buildup -- this time for offense. I'll either save the Great Potsmoker for ending a revolt in a captured town or assimilate him. :borg:

I would like to put the artist to work now if possible. He won't survive my turn no matter what...

Consider this turnlog a shameless plug for my new log mod (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=141164). :) The dark text doesn't show up very well in this image on my screen
(but seems fine in-game).
If others have trouble reading it, I can blow up this one and I'll change the colors for the next version.
I think the log entries are stored in the save file, in which case others will be able to see the additional entries.
Please let me know if this is the case.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot021.jpg

The battle of Toledo, demonstrating the power of first strike.
Two Drill II longbows take out two fortified archers defending a city on a hil
(after being weakened with some suicide-cat collateral damage).
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot016.jpg
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot018.jpg


A spear takes down a pillaging chariot.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot019.jpg

I try to take out one of the archers defending Cordoba with a City Raider II sword (no defense % from walls, culture, etc. at that time).
I pay for all that good luck in Toledo.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/eotinb/LK108/lk108-shot020.jpg

Summary: Forces amassed/amassing outside Cordoba and Seville.
Two workers asleep (both noted in log):
One outside Karachi, waiting for borders to expand; the other inside Calcutta waiting to rebuild pillaged farm and fix up Cordoba once we take it.
Artist also in Calcutta -- I'd suggest using him in Seville rather than Cordoba, since the former is deeper in Spanish territory.

The save. (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_AD-1100.Civ4SavedGame)

Edit: LK, I didn't see your request about the Artist until after my turnset or I would have put his slacker ass to work.

I have very mixed feelings on the war. One of the things I really looked forward to Civ4 was the fact that war wasn't as mandatory to win. I burned out on Civ3 because the most effective winning method was fight, fight, breather and fighter.


If others have trouble reading it, I can blow up this one and I'll change the colors for the next version.

The blue colored entries are illegible for me. I think I made out a comment about a shrine, but I can't tell.
The next line is white is the only reason I am sure. The dark blue has got to go.
The posted picture is blurry, and some of the other areas are hard to read.


Signed up:
LKendter (on deck) (skip Nov 23 to Nov 27)
Methos
MeteorPunch
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse (currently playing)

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

I have very mixed feelings on the war. One of the things I really looked forward to Civ4 was the fact that war wasn't as mandatory to win. I burned out on Civ3 because the most effective winning method was fight, fight, breather and fighter.
Well, we can stop once we get the two towns on spots we intended to found (Toledo and Cordoba)

The blue colored entries are illegible for me. I think I made out a comment about a shrine, but I can't tell.
The next line is white is the only reason I am sure. The dark blue has got to go.
The posted picture is blurry, and some of the other areas are hard to read.
Noted. I'll change the colors. FYI, the red events are unit-related -- combat results (those I can't change, as that's vanilla CIV -- I guess I could duplicate them in an easier to read color, but that would clutter the log even more...) and unit build completions and orders (those are mine, which I'll change). The only important information is the two units we lost: the suicide cat attacking Toledo and a sword attacking Cordoba. The dark blue is building completion and build notifications. The shrine message is actually duplicated with a vanilla CIV message (mine also includes the city it's built in -- Bangalore of course). The other building notes are a market in Bombay and two forges (in Calcutta and maybe Madras).

I would like to put the artist to work now if possible. He won't survive my turn no matter what...I think we should save him. The best thing you could use him for is a GA, second best is creating a great work...which isn't that great unless you really need some space. Thirdly is becoming a permanent great person, which is just a tiny boost to a city. But I dunno for sure...maybe the instant add pays off over time.

I thought about using him with the Great Prophet we got to start a GA, but then thought that prophet was better used to build another shrine.

I was reviewing the 1050 AD save. I don't understand why Karachi was built in its current location. 1 tile SE at least would have given it decent food from the water. It also would have brought the deer on-line sooner, and that would benefit our empire.

What I am more confused by is why isn't this city working on culture considering how much culture pressure is already on the city.

I would like to understand the reasoning behind the current location, and why the courthouse for a city with just 2 dollars in maintenance cost.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LAK-1047.jpg


With the removal of abandon city that annoys me to no end there isn't a way to recover from sloppy placements. If this was Civ3 I would abandon the city to move it 1 tile SE.

Perhaps to grab the gold? And I think you mean SW, as 1 SE is on a peak.

Perhaps to grab the gold? And I think you mean SW, as 1 SE is on a peak.

Yes, I meant SW. :blush:

All valid concerns.

1. I couldn't be built 1 SW or I would have. Cities must be 3 tiles apart.

2. The courthouse build was a flub on my part. If I'm unsure of what to build in a city, I'll just put something there as a placeholder with the intention of changing it before the end of the turn...forgot about it until a couple turns went by.

3. Culture build. I'm hoping and assuming that Buddhism will spread there shortly and provide the 10 culture for the borders. That would be cheaper than building something. Once the borders expand I think it'll work the gold and the deer for a decent small city.

Signed up:
LKendter (currently playing) (skip Nov 23 to Nov 27)
Methos (on deck)
MeteorPunch
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse (skipped - must reconfirm)

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

War is very time consuming. Turns are finished, but to much to write up before going to sleep.

More Spanish cities have fallen...

While there is no question that war is more of a challenge, it has come with a price of eating up a lot more time per round.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_AD-1150.zip



1100 AD
Spain won't talk, so this war will continue for now.

Please don't put workers to sleep. I found 2 workers being wasted. Mines on tiles inside our borders, but outside the 21 cities tiles does give us a chance for finding resources. ;)

While it may be weaker for unit experience, I swap over to organized religion for the shield boast and the ability to build missionaries now. We really need to start spreading out core religions that have the income producing shrines.

I swap Bangalore to a temple. It is so close to Berlin and Munich that I feel it should concentrate on culture.


1105 AD
(ST) The catapult without escort by Seville was destroyed.


1110 AD
It cost a sword, but 3 chariots that we ready to pillage us to death are destroyed.


1115 AD
(ST) The AI is definitely more of a pain, as a war elephant sneaks in and killed a catapult near Calcutta.


1120 AD
More AI junk tries to sneak behind out lines to pillage. Fighting 2 move units is a pain when we only have 1 more units.

Now that I got to use catapults for the first time, I must say I am *not* impressed. They are good for attacking cities, but can't touch anything else. The early artillery units have been weakened big time IMHO.

I have snuck in some missionaries, and Karachi has joined the Hindu faith.

Seville has been captured, but the screen shot is missing so I can't post it.

I use up Homer in Seville to quickly expand the borders. Barcelona must have some obscene culture as we get no border expansion in that direction. We still can get that fish on-line soon for another source of health.


1125 AD
We are already hit with WW. I fix it with 2 trades for luxuries with the AI.


1140 AD
The bombardment of Barcelona begins.

The Hindu faith has spread to Toledo.


1145 AD
I just learned a new civ fact. I knew you could upgrade units in any town without a barracks. I just realize it is *anywhere* inside our cultural borders. Our first macemen are arriving.

==========================

Summary:
The nation epic completes next turn. The doubling of great people points is very appealing to me.

We still want to keep some military building, but we need to get more infrastructure going. This includes plenty of Hindu missionaries to get all our cities Hindu along with a few of the AI cities. As we gain more cities I suspect that courts will become important.

At this point we should eliminate Spain. They are correctly rated in last place. The only city I would raze is Apache as it is so awkwardly located vs. the rest of the empire.

Signed up:
LKendter (skip Nov 23 to Nov 27)
Methos (currently playing)
MeteorPunch (on deck)
Eotinb
DeceasedHorse (dropped)

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

FWIW, I noted the two sleeping workers in my log (amid all the junk -- not doing that again). The idea was to have one ready to get the furs online once Karachi expanded borders and the other to repair any pillaged tiles near Calcutta. I thought that being ready to do those things as soon as possible was more valuable than hopeful mining. Glad Homer finally got off his duff and did something useful.

Got it....

Got it....

Apparently I lied, as there's no save posted. LK?

Edit: Found it in the uploads, here's LK's save (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_AD-1150.zip).

Fixed the missing link in my post - I am glad you found it.

Delhi finishes: National Epic
Bombay finishes: Hindu Missionary
Toledo grows: 2
Hinduism has spread: Karakorum (Mongolian Empire)

Delhi begins: Aqueduct
Bombay begins: Hindu Missionary
Bombay has tons of health and happiness yet growth is stagnant. Set to grow.
Turn 251 (1155 AD)
Send the missionary to Seville.
Calcutta finishes: Maceman
Karachi grows: 2

Turn 252 (1160 AD)
Calcutta begins: Maceman
Adjust Calcutta so that it can grow into its health.
Maceman promoted: Combat I
Maceman promoted: Shock
Madras finishes: Hindu Missionary

Madras begins: Catapult
Send Hindu missionary to Cardoba
Hinduism has spread: Seville
Tech learned: Engineering
Seville finishes: Jewish Temple

Research begun: Guilds
Decide on Guilds as we badly need more commerce. We're currently running at -26 gpt.
Set science at 90% which gets us -8 gpt.
Turn 254 (1170 AD)
Bombay finishes: Hindu Missionary
Madras finishes: Catapult
Cordoba finishes: Confucian Temple

Bombay begins: Hindu Missionary
Madras begins: Aqueduct
Cordoba begins: Courthouse
Send Hindu missionary to Barcelona
Catapult promoted: Barrage I
Catapult promoted: Accuracy
Hinduism has spread: Cordoba
Bombard Madrid, bringing defenses down from 60% to 33%.
Karachi finishes: Granary
Toledo's borders expand
Toledo finishes: Hindu Temple

My apologies for the odd turnlog. I was testing eotinb's newest version of his modded turnlog and the text writer.

Here's the save (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK108_AD-1200.Civ4SavedGame).

:confused: What happened between 1175 AD and 1200 AD?
What is the status of the Spanish war? Outside of a bombard comment, I have no idea what is going on.
This log system of Eotinb is not going to cut it, if the status of the war is lost.

Signed up:
LKendter (skip Nov 23 to Nov 27)
Methos
MeteorPunch (currently playing)
Eotinb (on deck)
Open Slot

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.

The below are revised rules to avoid a lost post.

The following tactics are PROHIBITED:

1) The diplomatic demand exploit. You can demand a ton of stuff from a civ, ask for a counter-offer and get everything you want.

2) The diplomatic gold exploit. See the below thread for details. You can do such silliness as get iron for $1/turn.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=139169


Standard LK house rules:
1) Automation of any kind is strongly discouraged until the game is known better.

2) Go to orders beyond the end of your turn are not allowed.

3) Please complete your turn. At most the next player should have one unmoved unit such as a settler where you are unsure of its direction.

4) Please load the game while running civ. If you load by clicking the game you rename the leader. The leader name becomes part of the save, so I want to keep LK### as the leader name. I don't want to defeat a very useful feature.
If you do accidentally load by double clicking the save, then please use the Alt-D feature for civ details and rename the leader by the LK### value.


NEW
5) Don't edit your game results into a got it post. There is *no* notification of new activity. I have had SGs stalled waiting for a person to move, when the already did.

Everything should be there, it's just the formatting is a bit odd. Here's a cleaned up version:

Turn 250 (1150 AD)
Delhi finishes: National Epic
Bombay finishes: Hindu Missionary
Toledo grows: 2
Hinduism has spread: Karakorum (Mongolian Empire)

Turn 251 (1155 AD)
Delhi begins: Aqueduct
Bombay begins: Hindu Missionary
Bombay has tons of health and happiness yet growth is stagnant. Set to grow.
Send the missionary to Seville.
Calcutta finishes: Maceman
Karachi grows: 2

Turn 252 (1160 AD)
Calcutta begins: Maceman
Adjust Calcutta so that it can grow into its health.
Maceman promoted: Combat I
Maceman promoted: Shock
Madras finishes: Hindu Missionary

Turn 253 (1165 AD)
Madras begins: Catapult
Send Hindu missionary to Cardoba
Hinduism has spread: Seville
Tech learned: Engineering
Seville finishes: Jewish Temple

Turn 254 (1170 AD)
Research begun: Guilds
Decide on Guilds as we badly need more commerce. We're currently running at -26 gpt.
Set science at 90% which gets us -8 gpt.
Bombay finishes: Hindu Missionary
Madras finishes: Catapult
Cordoba finishes: Confucian Temple

Turn 255 (1175 AD)
Bombay begins: Hindu Missionary
Madras begins: Aqueduct
Cordoba begins: Courthouse
Send Hindu missionary to Barcelona
Catapult promoted: Barrage I
Catapult promoted: Accuracy
Hinduism has spread: Cordoba
Bombard Madrid, bringing defenses down from 60% to 33%.
Karachi finishes: Granary
Toledo's borders expand
Toledo finishes: Hindu Temple

There's no reason 1175 to 1200 should be missing, though. Methos, can you take a peek at your log file again and see if those turns are there?

There's no reason 1175 to 1200 should be missing, though. Methos, can you take a peek at your log file again and see if those turns are there?

Whoops! That's interesting. I must have missed my cut-n-paste some. Oh well, here's the rest:


Turn 256 (1180 AD)
Karachi begins: Library
Karachi needs some culture bad.
Bombard Madrid, bringing defenses down from 33% to 6%.
Hinduism has spread: Barcelona
Delhi finishes: Aqueduct
Seville grows: 4

Delhi begins: Market
Catapult loses to: Spanish Archer.
Catapult loses to: Spanish Archer.
Catapult defeats: Spanish Archer.
Maceman defeats: Spanish Archer.
Swordsman defeats: Spanish Archer.
Swordsman defeats: Spanish Archer.
Judaism has spread: Madrid
Bombay finishes: Hindu Missionary
Calcutta grows: 7
Lahore finishes: The Colossus
Seville finishes: Lighthouse

Bombay begins: Hindu Missionary
Lahore begins: Market
Seville begins: Harbor
Went with the harbor in Seville as that'll gain us an additional 2 gpt.
Swordsman promoted: City Raider III
Hindu missionary heads towards Madrid.
Madras finishes: Aqueduct
Lahore grows: 9
Karachi's borders expand
Cordoba grows: 2

Madras begins: Hindu Missionary

Turn 260 (1200 AD)
Hinduism has spread: Madrid
Turn 260 (1200 AD)

As you can see I captured Madrid. The attacking force is sitting in Madrid waiting for the next player.

It's interesting that the text file doesn't state that Madrid was captured. Is that an error eotinb?

Well, not so much an error as kind of a combination of an oversight and a problem. The problem being that the onCityAcquired() event has been giving me some trouble so I gave up on it. The oversight being that I was thinking this event was about trading for a city (pretty rare) and forgot about capturing a city (pretty important to note). I'll see what I can do, but for now the lack of city capture event is not an error in the code. Another thing is that looking at your log, I miss not seeing bombard results and collateral damage. I'll see if there's a way to add those. In fact, I should be able to provide more detail in general on combat results, like remaining strength of surviving units.

For the rest of the team, even though the turn headers are missing, every blank space is the start of a new turn.

Nice job capturing Madrid, with the only losses being the cats, I see. And we got The Colossus, which isn't huge for us since we don't have that many coastal cities, but it's still nice.

It's interesting that the text file doesn't state that Madrid was captured. Is that an error eotinb?

The text version of this log is much more viable for SG play.
However, the capture of cities is a very critical component for war. That detail really needs to get into the log.

The text version of this log is much more viable for SG play.
However, the capture of cities is a very critical component for war. That detail really needs to get into the log.
I agree. Since I will most likely be using my log mod, and Methos is (at least for now), this game may become something of a test run for the mod. I hope that doesn't annoy you, LKendter. Any feedback like this on missing features, or included features that should be eliminated or altered, or anything else will be very helpful.

Edit: For instance, first contact with another civ is something I think I can note but don't now. Would that be useful? Also, losing a city to another civ is not in (but obviously must get in along with capturing a city).

Edit: For instance, first contact with another civ is something I think I can note but don't now. Would that be useful?

I always report first contacts. I also like to report trade details, but at the moment can't due to the print screen bug with the trade screen. I found printing a bunch of screen the easiest log method for the moment. Windowed mode is odd at times, and I hate alt-tab any more then needed.

Another thing is that looking at your log, I miss not seeing bombard results and collateral damage. I'll see if there's a way to add those.

Weird thing is I checked the turn log (Ctrl-Tab) and noticed it stated there how much collateral damage was done. When I saw that I just assumed it would be ‘echoed’ into the text file too. If memory serves me correctly the collateral damage was 3, 3, and 1.

The text version of this log is much more viable for SG play.

Very true. In another SG I used a screenshot of the turnlog and that seemed to confusing. Especially since you had to read it from the bottom up.

Since I will most likely be using my log mod, and Methos is (at least for now), this game may become something of a test run for the mod.

No problem here. As a matter of fact I’ll be using this for all my [civ4] SG’s so will try to pay closer attention to it.

I always report first contacts. I also like to report trade details, ...

I agree with this. I like having first contact noted and definitely would like the trades mentioned. I personally added them to the log.

I'll work on first contact. Trade deals is a great idea. At the moment, I have no idea if it is possible, but I'll dig into it and find out.

I always report first contacts. I also like to report trade details, but at the moment can't due to the print screen bug with the trade screen. I found printing a bunch of screen the easiest log method for the moment. Windowed mode is odd at times, and I hate alt-tab any more then needed.
You can take screenshots of interface stuff in windowed mode by doing it the old way... alt-printscreen and paste into paint (the alt- copies only the content of current window)

I'll work on first contact. Trade deals is a great idea. At the moment, I have no idea if it is possible, but I'll dig into it and find out.
Seeing this I plan to add the current trade deals to my eventlog dumper program , so if you cant make if work from python it will be possible to dump it from the savefile.

I took a look at the game. Cordoba is a lousy 9% Indian. This town is begging for a flip to Germany. We are building a courthouse in that city. WT???? Can we please swap it to the fastest possible building for addition expansion? If we went through the pain of war, I don't want to lose the city to a flip to Germany.

I took a look at the game. Cordoba is a lousy 9% Indian. This town is begging for a flip to Germany. We are building a courthouse in that city. WT???? Can we please swap it to the fastest possible building for addition expansion? If we went through the pain of war, I don't want to lose the city to a flip to Germany.When a city gets a "revolt," the first time your units will beat the revolters down and take damage themselves. The second time this happens the city flips - no loss of your units. At any rate, the town is now 100% Indian because the Spainish population is gone.

1200 Send units to the 2 remaining Spainish towns. I will keep both because of the resources. I tried to get Germany and Greece to declare war on her and give us a "Mutual Military Struggle" modifier, but they are both friendly with Spain.

1205

1210 Guilds has been researched, start on Divine Right (for Islam). We need Education next. Heroic Epic can be built, I'm putting it in a high production/low commerce city, Madras.

Santiago is captured.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/MP_LK108_05.jpg

1215 Apache is captured, the Spainish are dead. I would have razed this city because it is a tiny city that is far away..but is has 2(!!!) luxury resouces that we didn't have - spices and incense.

1220
1225
1230 Lower the Science from 90 to 80%. Some of these new towns coming active cost a bit.

1235
1240 We get a Great Scientist. I'll have him put an Academy in B