Ok, here's the first progress indicator for the upcoming The Ancient Mediterranean MOD (http://jan.vandercrabben.name/tam/) (TAM) for CIV4.

Here's the map which I made in the later stages of the preview releases. It is a normal civ map, without any modifications! As I don't have the final version of the game yet (coming soon), I'll post this map here. I hope this works with the final game version (don't see why it shouldn't though).

Download Ancient Mediterranean Map 0.1 (http://www.jan.vandercrabben.name/tam/civ4/The Ancient Mediterranean0.1.Civ4WorldBuilderSave) (249kb)

Changes in v0.1:
- Starting locations added (Arabia, Egypt, Greece, Russia, Mongols, Rome, Germany, France, Spain)
- Playable with 9 civilizations

http://www.jan.vandercrabben.name/tam/civ4/medmap.gif

Also, I'm looking for people to help me on TAM, as it's much harder to do in CIV4, and I have much less time (I wasn't even in university when I started TAM... long time ago...).

The best mod i played in civ3, You have to finish it.

My first thought after palying my first Civ4 game through to the end was, "Now it's back to modding. Hopefully TAM will be the first one updated for Civ4."

Hey, thanks. That's good to hear!

Do I smell dedication? :worship:

TAM is probably still the best epic-game mod out there for CivIII.

Well, I do need some help to finish TAM. CIV4 modding is a nightmare...

Anyone willing to help with XML files a bit? Or ideas?

Depends a lot on who many Civs you can put thogether, how many artwork are out there, and also if you are going to adapt what you have on Civ3 or start from scratch. I confess that I waiting for TAM so I can start my Medieval Mod on the point that TAM for CIV4 ends.

I registered just to thank you Thamis. TAM mod is the only reason I spent as much time with Civilization III as I did, and I'm very happy that you're looking to bring it into Civ4.

Depends a lot on who many Civs you can put thogether, how many artwork are out there, and also if you are going to adapt what you have on Civ3 or start from scratch. I confess that I waiting for TAM so I can start my Medieval Mod on the point that TAM for CIV4 ends.

Rhye already did a lot of stuff for the Greek World MOD, a lot of the info came from me (go figure). So I'll use what's there and do the rest.

The problem is not the amount of civs, but the amount of XML to code in. Units are a nightmare, as there are probably 10 XML files that have to be edited for each unit that goes in. :(

@TAM Fan: Thanks! :D

Has anyone downloaded the map and tried it at all?

The Problem with XML is beacuse is so powerfull, it is complicated at the same time. Looking the files, is going at the end to be a copy/paste job. But now, we don't have a lot of artwork or units to put on.

TAM was one of my favorites for Civ III as well. Once I get a copy of cIV I will dl this map. Meanwhile.. what civs did you use for this map?

This map has the standard civs, nothing TAM-ish in there yet, apart from the region.

Has anyone downloaded the map and tried it at all?
I downloaded it, but can't try it till my new computer arrives (hopefully tomorrow). :)

I haven't looked myself but there is a rumor of some extra unused unit graphics one of which is companion cavalry. If you can, please include it as the first mounted unit instead of horse archers. Very unhistorical! Also, and maybe I'm the only one that feels this way but...people often forget that horses had to be bred to be big enough to ride. This was the cause of the developement of the chariot as a mobile weapons platform. Early American natives found no use for domesticting horses so they just ate them all hence the reintroduction of horses to the "New World" by the Spanish. Hope you have time to include a seperate chariotry skill with the wheel and animal domestication as prereq. At the very least please don't require horses as a resource for building chariots.

What's so unhistorical about horse archers as the first mounted unit? In fact, the earliest known depictions of warriors on horseback are Assyrian soldiers shooting with bows from atop their horses.

Yes the map works.

Here is the bare minimum code needed in the map file to put proper starting locations. Feel free to clip out the civs you aren't going to use and put it in your map. You still need to adjust the starting locations, but it's a start. BTW, this is from my latest release of the Huge Europe/N. Africa/Near East map on this forum.

Once you set it up, backup this part of the code since the worldeditor will add countless lines of crap. Also kill all teamvision, units (important), and improvement (non-tribal village) code as well.

Version=11
BeginGame
Calendar=CALENDAR_DEFAULT
GameTurn=0
StartYear=-4000
Description=PUT WHAT YOU WANT HERE
ModPath=IF YOU ARE USING ANY
EndGame
BeginTeam
Tech=TECH_MYSTICISM
Tech=TECH_THE_WHEEL
EndTeam
BeginTeam
Tech=TECH_FISHING
Tech=TECH_THE_WHEEL
EndTeam
BeginTeam
Tech=TECH_THE_WHEEL
Tech=TECH_AGRICULTURE
EndTeam
BeginTeam
Tech=TECH_FISHING
Tech=TECH_MINING
EndTeam
BeginTeam
Tech=TECH_THE_WHEEL
Tech=TECH_AGRICULTURE
EndTeam
BeginTeam
Tech=TECH_HUNTING
Tech=TECH_MINING
EndTeam
BeginTeam
Tech=TECH_FISHING
Tech=TECH_HUNTING
EndTeam
BeginTeam
Tech=TECH_AGRICULTURE
Tech=TECH_HUNTING
EndTeam
BeginTeam
Tech=TECH_FISHING
Tech=TECH_MINING
EndTeam
BeginTeam
Tech=TECH_HUNTING
Tech=TECH_MINING
EndTeam
BeginTeam
Tech=TECH_MYSTICISM
Tech=TECH_FISHING
EndTeam
BeginTeam
EndTeam
BeginTeam
EndTeam
BeginTeam
EndTeam
BeginTeam
EndTeam
BeginTeam
EndTeam
BeginTeam
EndTeam
BeginTeam
EndTeam
BeginPlayer
Team=0
LeaderType=LEADER_SALADIN
CivType=CIVILIZATION_ARABIA
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=68, StartingY=2
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=1
LeaderType=LEADER_HANNIBAL
CivType=CIVILIZATION_CARTHAGE
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=25, StartingY=19
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=2
LeaderType=LEADER_HATSHEPSUT
CivType=CIVILIZATION_EGYPT
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=58, StartingY=2
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=3
LeaderType=LEADER_VICTORIA
CivType=CIVILIZATION_ENGLAND
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=20, StartingY=45
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=4
LeaderType=LEADER_LOUIS_XIV
CivType=CIVILIZATION_FRANCE
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=21, StartingY=39
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=5
LeaderType=LEADER_BISMARCK
CivType=CIVILIZATION_GERMANY
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=31, StartingY=43
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=6
LeaderType=LEADER_ALEXANDER
CivType=CIVILIZATION_GREECE
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=44, StartingY=21
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=7
LeaderType=LEADER_CYRUS
CivType=CIVILIZATION_PERSIA
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=81, StartingY=14
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=8
LeaderType=LEADER_JULIUS_CAESAR
CivType=CIVILIZATION_ROME
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=29, StartingY=27
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=9
LeaderType=LEADER_CATHERINE
CivType=CIVILIZATION_RUSSIA
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=55, StartingY=49
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=10
LeaderType=LEADER_ISABELLA
CivType=CIVILIZATION_SPAIN
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=8, StartingY=26
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=11
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Color=NONE
ArtStyle=NONE
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=12
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Color=NONE
ArtStyle=NONE
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=13
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Color=NONE
ArtStyle=NONE
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=14
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Color=NONE
ArtStyle=NONE
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=15
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Color=NONE
ArtStyle=NONE
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=16
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Color=NONE
ArtStyle=NONE
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
Team=17
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Color=NONE
ArtStyle=NONE
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer

Thanks a lot! Don't you need loads of different XML files that actually make the references to Carthage complete?

Thanks a lot! Don't you need loads of different XML files that actually make the references to Carthage complete?

Yeah, I'm using Jecrell's Carthage mod for that, and it is at:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=139107

Qart-Hadasht Qart-Hadasht Qart-Hadasht Qart-Hadasht

please for the love of Tanit and Ba`al Hammon

Qart-Hadasht Qart-Hadasht Qart-Hadasht Qart-Hadasht

So i was thinking if i should make a new thread for this and i probably will. still i think your mod would be the first mod that could benefit from this idea.

i would strongly argue that the mode of research as it is handles in Civ 4 is not aplicable to "Era" spanning mods. like yours.

A limited era project, similar to the "Greek World" mod that shipped with the game really really does not do well in terms of technology. Sure you can see something like "Nuclear Fission" somewhere in the tech tree, yet it will take a million turns to research and you only have soo much of land to conquer

The "American Revolution" mod is even worse.

You can not even access the research screen in that scenario.
It is limited to 100 turns total, and there was no drastic change in technology there.

However taking out research completely makes the replayaility of the mod virtually null

So here is my proposal

A number of technologies and appropriate buildings would need to be disigned to simulate era appropriate buildings that add incremental functionality to the cities. Similar to what medieval total war and Rome total war do with their research/building cues.

in there both are combined. which in not required for the concept to work

Technologies / Buildings

-Spearmaking (tech) Allows to build the building ("Spearmaker ) which allows to train spear troops.
-Horse domestication - allows Stables allows to train better horses suitable for warfare.

if both buildings are built you can build either spear cavalry or chariots. Chariots might require Smihy

-Axe Smith (Allows to build Axemen)

Also building upgrades would allow to use promitions creatively as they coudl be tied to a building

Build "College of Medicine" and all troops could either get the healing promotion or you could build specialized medical units. although this is for late eras. this promotion would be free and not require experience to be spent

Muster field woudl allow to train basic troops and would be a prerequisite for barracks which allow to build better troops and would be a prerequisiste for royal barracks.

I can't download it - the address brings in a long text of code

Right-click the link and select "save as".

TAM was (and still is) my favorite mod. I would be happy to help out. I've spent the last days exploring the XML structure of Civ4 by working on an Israeli mod which im kinda using to gain some experience with moding in Civ4. Next step is phyton which doesn't look to bad either. So if there is any way I can help out with TAM let me know. I'm already bored with tanks and airplanes - I need TAM :).

Hey Thamis,
Where did you get your map? Can I get a copy of the whole world?

Could someone explain to me how to add the starting locations for specific civs? I try to do it in the worldbuilder but I never get the right civs, like I have 8 civs on the map and they are not always the right ones. How can I get all 18 on the map? Or how can I switch civs in the worldbuilder?

Map and Mod are working great! Thanks! Can't wait for it to get more "TAM-ish" Once I start to get the hang of modding Civ4, I'll probably use this map for a game of Napoleonic era civs. I've seen a Turksh mod, it would be cool if someone did an Austian mod using George Washington.

Actually I will start out by converting the old TAM mod for CIV3 to CIV4. There are 4 eras, all of which are in the ancient times, only ancient techs, buildings, and units. Each CIV also has a specific advantage.

I will then add in things that use the new possibilities of CIV4, such as religions. Don't worry, it won't be a boring no-research mod. :-)

So i was thinking if i should make a new thread for this and i probably will. still i think your mod would be the first mod that could benefit from this idea.

i would strongly argue that the mode of research as it is handles in Civ 4 is not aplicable to "Era" spanning mods. like yours.

A limited era project, similar to the "Greek World" mod that shipped with the game really really does not do well in terms of technology. Sure you can see something like "Nuclear Fission" somewhere in the tech tree, yet it will take a million turns to research and you only have soo much of land to conquer

The "American Revolution" mod is even worse.

You can not even access the research screen in that scenario.
It is limited to 100 turns total, and there was no drastic change in technology there.

However taking out research completely makes the replayaility of the mod virtually null

So here is my proposal

A number of technologies and appropriate buildings would need to be disigned to simulate era appropriate buildings that add incremental functionality to the cities. Similar to what medieval total war and Rome total war do with their research/building cues.

in there both are combined. which in not required for the concept to work

Technologies / Buildings

-Spearmaking (tech) Allows to build the building ("Spearmaker ) which allows to train spear troops.
-Horse domestication - allows Stables allows to train better horses suitable for warfare.

if both buildings are built you can build either spear cavalry or chariots. Chariots might require Smihy

-Axe Smith (Allows to build Axemen)

Also building upgrades would allow to use promitions creatively as they coudl be tied to a building

Build "College of Medicine" and all troops could either get the healing promotion or you could build specialized medical units. although this is for late eras. this promotion would be free and not require experience to be spent

Muster field woudl allow to train basic troops and would be a prerequisite for barracks which allow to build better troops and would be a prerequisiste for royal barracks.

maps.google.com

Hey Thamis,
Where did you get your map? Can I get a copy of the whole world?

TAM was (and still is) my favorite mod. I would be happy to help out. I've spent the last days exploring the XML structure of Civ4 by working on an Israeli mod which im kinda using to gain some experience with moding in Civ4. Next step is phyton which doesn't look to bad either. So if there is any way I can help out with TAM let me know. I'm already bored with tanks and airplanes - I need TAM :).

Since I don't have the final version of the game yet (waiting for Firaxis to ship it to me), you are free to work on whatever you want.

I think the easiest thing to do is to take the TAM-C3C civilizations and implement them in TAM-CIV4. That's probably the easiest part of the process, and it doesn't really require us to think about any unit values or tech costs, etc.

Oh, and the best thing you could do immediately is to just fix the starting locations on this map in WorldBuilder. ;)

Thanks for offering help!!!

Yeah, I'm using Jecrell's Carthage mod for that, and it is at:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=139107

Would it be possible for you to send me your version of this map with Carthage in and the correct starting locations?

email: write (AT) jan (DOT) vandercrabben (DOT) name

Would it be possible for you to send me your version of this map with Carthage in and the correct starting locations?

email: write (AT) jan (DOT) vandercrabben (DOT) name

You can download them at:

Map: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=138404
Mod: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=139107

I can't send over 500kb (for the mod) at a time, and I rarely check my personal e-mail. PM, if you have more questions. I'm compiling a sort of guide at the moment, and will post it here on civfanatics and on that new wiki page.

One more request. Could you please use all 2-D leaderheads for us old timers with slower graphics cards? My system is really starting to bog down around 1800AD. I'm thinking about going in and taking out the English, Arabs, and Spanish to improve turn speed. I guess what I'm asking is to please keep this in mind add playable ancient civs to your mod.

The leaderheads don't bog down your system, as they only come up when you're doing diplomacy.

But as I have no 3d talent whatsoever, I'm not going to make any and I guess I'll just be using the default ones.

Just curious, why not include the Brittish isles in your map? After all, Rome did conquer them up to Hadrian's wall and a little north of that! Bath and other places in England are good reminders of the fact that Britannia was at least until the Vth century part of the Empire!

Here's a vote of encouragement. I loved the last version of TAM. Good luck with this next one. I'll be waiting eagerly.

@Nemovadit: The TAM MOD will include different maps, this is just the one I will start with (because it's fairly small and actually playable).

@Leptomeninges: Will start work on TAM soon. Gonna get my copy of CIV4 tomorrow.

I had a look at the map you have posted in the start of the thread and played my way through the opening stages of one game (while editing the map to start as Rome in the correct geographical position). So much of your last mod was the gameplay as dictated by starting positions and rules changes that it is, of course, difficult to compare. A few thoughts that you can consider or disregard as you like.

1. Both of those wheat resources on the Po river are exactly where I liked to settle on your last map. I am relatively new to civ 4 and may not understand the game mechanics well enough yet, but to the best of my knowledge settling on a resource effectively prevents you from utilizing it. From a gameplay perspective I'd prefer those shifted, but you may want to maintain them if you feel their current locations are more "realistic."

2. The map feels smaller than your last by maybe 15 or 20%. I particularly noticed this in the Alps which feel relatively diminished. Perhaps you just chose to resize them.

I'm a computer idiot, so I can't help much with anything technical, but I'd be happy to help in other ways (testing, etc) if you have a need. I sunk a lot of hours into TAM for Civ 3.

I can move the resources, no problem.

I chose to make this map smaller (it is actually MUCH smaller than the Civ3 maps), because, having played CIV4 extensively the last 18 months or so, the game can get REALLY slow very quickly. I'm playing on a laptop (1 year old) and I want to be able to play the game myself. But, as in the old TAM, we'll be adding other maps soon.

Oh, and I'm gonna meet up with Soren and Sid for an interview tomorrow (and will finally get my CIV copy), any questions you always wanted to ask them?

Yes! how can they make an awesome strategy game like civ4 unplayable with a pc from 3 years ago! We dont want all that 3dstudio animated resources, we wanna play civ, and play big TAM maps without having to wait 10 minutes between turns. :(

Btw, dont say nothing of that, i am sure that ppl will continue make civ the best game of all times.

Thamis, please tell them thanks for creating this ever evolving game and embracing the gaming community. I was hooked from the original "Fascist Patch" for Civ 1. The replayability of the Civ series has what's kept it vital for over a decade! I guess there is just something is some people's nature that forces them to tinker with things, computer games included. I have never played (and I started in 1982) a computer game that I was "completely" happy with. It seems like there is always something I want to change. Civ is one of the only games that has allowed me the unending pleasure of doing it. I truley believe that Civ fans are like no others and we have Sid and his developement teams over the years to thank for providing an outlet for our passions.

Please let us know how your interview goes.

TAM, here's a working version of the file you were asking about in the BMP to WBS Converter forum. The order of the info inside the

BeginPlayer
LeaderType=LEADER_SALADIN
CivType=CIVILIZATION_ARABIA
Team=0
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=73, StartingY=14
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer

is crucial. This attachment is working with your info in it. ;)

Question though - how did you determine the numbers for the XY location you wanted them to start at. (Ruler in paint program?)

Tbear2520

ZIP is broken, but if it's just a problem with the order in the player info I can fix it myself. Thanks a lot! I'll add that info to the modding wiki.

I managed to extract the final WBS file from the ZIP you sent me. I still want to change a few things, so I have to work on the PY file.

I'm still having problems with my map. Same thing. I changed the order for the civilizationinfos in my tam.py file, but I still get the crash...

Can you please either look at my files (attached) or send me your py file which works, so that I can check whether my installation of pythong might be broken.

My email: write (AT@) jan.vandercrabben.name

Reply to your question for the coordinates: Flip the map vertically in your image editing program and move the mouse over the coordinate in the image. Voila.

Thanks!

Ok, I think I found the error. In the revealPlots() function, I had only entered 3 players. I needed to enter 9. Now it seems to work. I'll keep you updated. :)

Here's everything except the map (Plot info) ;) Oh the tutorial=0 I took out in my testing. But this works. Also you might want to apply the 1.09 patch that came out. It helps a lot with the map stuff during the world builder.

TBear2520

Version=11
BeginGame
Calendar=CALENDAR_DEFAULT
GameTurn=0
StartYear=-4000
EndGame
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=LEADER_SALADIN
CivType=CIVILIZATION_ARABIA
Team=0
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=73, StartingY=14
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=LEADER_NAPOLEON
CivType=CIVILIZATION_FRANCE
Team=1
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=16, StartingY=35
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=LEADER_ALEXANDER
CivType=CIVILIZATION_GREECE
Team=2
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=42, StartingY=18
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=LEADER_JULIUS_CAESAR
CivType=CIVILIZATION_ROME
Team=3
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=30, StartingY=22
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=LEADER_CATHERINE
CivType=CIVILIZATION_RUSSIA
Team=4
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=54, StartingY=34
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=LEADER_GENGHIS_KHAN

CivType=CIVILIZATION_MONGOL
Team=5
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=74, StartingY=34
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=LEADER_HATSHEPSUT
CivType=CIVILIZATION_EGYPT
Team=6
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=56, StartingY=5
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=LEADER_ISABELLA
CivType=CIVILIZATION_SPAIN
Team=7
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=8, StartingY=17
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=LEADER_BISMARCK
CivType=CIVILIZATION_GERMANY
Team=8
PlayableCiv=1
StartingX=23, StartingY=34
Handicap=HANDICAP_NOBLE
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Team=9
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Team=10
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Team=11
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Team=12
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Team=13
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Team=14
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Team=15
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Team=16
EndPlayer
BeginPlayer
LeaderType=NONE
CivType=NONE
Team=17
EndPlayer

BeginMap
grid width=80
grid height=37
wrap X=0
wrap Y=0
world size=WORLDSIZE_STANDARD
climate=CLIMATE_TEMPERATE
sealevel=SEALEVEL_MEDIUM
num plots written=2960
EndMap

Ok, I uploaded the map with the correct starting locations.

The first version of TAM for CIV4 is out:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=3389853

Go Thamis :cool:

Got v.06 It may just may be a fluke but when I played as Rome I started with no known techs. It also went pretty fast. I went ahead and changed the tech rate from 100 to 150 because I was upset with how fast my legions were obsolete.

edit: oops, meant to post on the completed scenario thread