1 or 2 more players are needed for the Saxon Menace. Post here or email me if you are interested.


Civilization: Essex (Expansionist and Militaristic. UU is the Berzerker. Brief history at bottom of post.)
Difficulty: Monarch
Map: Large. Random type, temp and age
Opponents: Random
Victory Conditions: All
Barbarians: Restless

Turn submission:
24 hours to pick up or pass your turn (post a message saying that you have the game)
24 hours to submit after picking up the game

Turn duration:
15 rounds

Game rules:
No save/reload
No trainers
No worker automation before Republic is discovered
No retiring
Post a timeline or story brief with your completed turn.

Game Modifications:
This succession game uses the British Isles mod (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12923)Version 6.2 or 7.0. You'll need this mod in order to play. It has install and uninstall files so switching between the mod and regular game settings will not be a problem. Please email me if you need one of these versions as the forum thread carries only the most current version.

Modifications include:
All civs replaced with Kingdoms of the British Isles
Barracks reduces corruption
Brehon Law tech/government added
New unique units for all civs. Essex has the berzerker, a 5/1/1 swordsman.


Player order:
Shaitan
Charis
Grey Fox
Xrang


Brief history of Essex, courtesy of Infoplease.com:
Essex is one of the early kingdoms of Anglo-Saxon England. It was settled probably in the early 6th century by Saxons who traced their royal line back to a continental Saxon god instead of to Woden, as did the rulers of other early kingdoms. Essex eventually included the modern counties of Essex and Middlesex, most of Hertfordshire, and London. Under the influence of his uncle, Æthelbert of Kent, King Sæbert of Essex accepted (c.604) Christianity, but the kingdom lapsed into heathenism when his successors expelled (617) Mellitus, bishop of London. In c.653, however, at the request of King Sigbert, Oswy of Northumbria sent Cedd to convert the East Saxons and to build churches. The submission of Essex to the overlordship of Wulfhere of Mercia marked the beginning of a long domination by the larger state. In 825, Essex joined other eastern kingdoms in submitting to Egbert of Wessex and became an earldom. Heavily settled by the Danes, it became part of the Danelaw by the treaty of 886, but was retaken by Edward the Elder of Wessex in 917. Its most famous later earl was Byrhtnoth, who was killed in the battle of Maldon in 991.

I am not sure, so save a place for me, okay?

Originally posted by das
I am not sure, so save a place for me, okay?

Okay, just let me know for sure before the list fills.

Hello. This sounds very interesting and fun. I would be interested, but how good of players do you want. I am fairly good. I have been playing on Regent, and although not doing exceedingly well, I am holding my own. If you have no particular requirements for skill level. I would enjoy participating.

Originally posted by Colonel Kraken
Hello. This sounds very interesting and fun. I would be interested, but how good of players do you want. I am fairly good. I have been playing on Regent, and although not doing exceedingly well, I am holding my own. If you have no particular requirements for skill level. I would enjoy participating.

Welcome aboard. A mix of player styles and skill levels is what makes succession games so cool.

Welcome aboard Garret. That brings our player total to 4 which should be good to get started. Look for the first installment (4000bc to 3050bc) tomorrow morning.

Colonel Kraken, you'll be up after that.

Getting excited now. This is going to be great! :)

Welcome to History 101, "Birth of a Power - Essex in the 4th millenium before Christ". I am your instructor, Professor Shaitan.

This lecture will concentrate on the burdgeoning growth of the Essex Empire. Though you all must be intimately familiar with the current power and might of the Empire, this class will cover a time when Essex was neither powerful nor mighty. Specifically, we will look at the birth of Essex through approximately 3000 BC.

In 3950 BC, the city of London was founded on the shores of Lake Henk. London was veritably surrounded by grasslands teeming with massive herds of cattle. With the easy accessibility of fresh water and bountiful food sources, the tiny village very quickly began growing. Exploration of the homeland revealed the surrounding territories to be just as fantastic and ripe for expansion. Was this the catalyst for the classic Essex expansionist mentality? With so much prime land so close to London it must have proved to be an irresistable lure. (See slide 1)
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/essex3950bc.jpg

Shortly after the founding of London, the Essex encountered a small tribe of Goths. The Goths proved friendly and imparted the knowledge of cremation and burial to them. This was quite a wakeup call for the Essex. Their own seers and mystics had made neglible gains in discovery while this tiny tribe had possession of such amazing knowledge. It is my belief that this sparked a fantastic cultural hunger for knowledge that would one day propel the Essex to technological mastery.

Continued growth and exploration led to the meeting of the Northumbrians, an Angle civilization with homelands to the east of Wessex. The two peoples had little to share with each other. The Essex (thanks to their Goth allies) had knowledge that the Northumbrians lacked but Northumbria had nothing to offer Essex in return. As the lay of the land unfolded it would reveal that these two civilizations had posession of the finest territories available. Both homelands were bountiful and blessed with resources. Each was jelous of the other's posessions and saw the destruction of the other as the most secure way to ensure their own peoples' growth. As a result there was tension between the two from their first meeting.

By 3500, London had expanded to almost thrice its size, was well protected by native warriors and had fully explored its immediate surrounds. Essex could easily defend its north reaches by stationing troops on the Trey isthmus north of Lake Henk. The militaristic minded Essex had begun active preparation to build up their military and expand their empire at the expense of Northumbria but found their goals jeopardized by a new tribe. To the south of Essex across the Great Desert, scouts discovered the homeland of the Wessex. Though they were a Saxon tribe like Essex, the Wessex were quite hostile. They also had knowledge superior to Essex and no desire to share it.

The turn of the millenia proved to be a monumentous time for Essex. A rich tribe of Gepid helped finance the purchase of the Wessex knowledge of Masonry. This in turn spurred the founding of Enfield to the South of London. Enfield's addition to the empire gave such an immediate boost to production and the economy that Essex was able to deal with Northumbria to acquire knowledge of carts and chariots. The wild horse herds of London and Enfield suddenly took on a new and very important military aspect.

Although Essex was now beholden to both Northumbria and Wessex, the seeds of Essex greatness had been planted. With their native militaristic skill, local resources of horses and the knowledge of chariots, what could stop the Essex expansion? (See slide 2)

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/essex3050bc.jpg

That is all for today students. Please file out in good order and leave your assignments on the table near the door.


Timeline turn notes
4000 BC Incredibly fertile grasslands with massive herds of wild cattle found. We have a coastline to the west but there is another coast to the East. In the hopes that this second coast is fresh water our settler moves to the east. Our gamble proves true. Our capital will be founded with a source of fresh water and 2 herds of wild cattle. Our scout has found a river to the south with wild grains growing right on the sea coast. Could our homeland be any more fertile?
3950 London is founded and begins training warriors. Our mystics begin researching the secrets of Masonry. This will allow us to build the Pyramids.
3900 Excellent grasslands to the northeast and southwest. Fertile plains found to the southeast.
3850 We have discoverd a Goth tribe who has taught us ceremonial burial. Our scout has found a scout of the Northumbrian tribe. Edwin of Deira, king of the Northumbrians seems friendly enough but it is distressing to discover another advanced tribe so close to our homeland. We could have traded our newfound knowledge of Ceremonial Burial but Northumbria is so poor that it would have netted us little.
3800
3750 Desert found to the southeast of the plains area.
3700 London has completed training a warrior. Warrior has been assigned to protect London. London now begins gathering citizens to found a second city. An extremely fertile river basin runs through the eastern desert. Spice is there in abundance.
3650 The borders of Northumbria have been found. It lies due east of London.
3600
3550
3500
3450 The borders of London have expanded because of its high culture. This reveals a very defensible isthmus between our fertile lands and that of Northumbria. Our settlers will be gathered soon. Once they are sent on their way we will train another warrior and station them on this isthmus to protect the homeland.
3400
3350
3300
3250 Our scout has met representatives of Caewalla of the Wessex. Although they are Saxons like us, this tribe seems highly aggressive. The Wessex have the knowledge of Masonry that we are struggling to learn but we do not have enough to offer them in turn for the knowledge. They already know our guarded secret of Ceremonial Burial.
3200 Our group of settlers has departed for the fertile river basin area to the south, accompanied by London's warriors for protection. The site should prove even more productive than the capital, if not so encouraging to fast growth.
3150
3100
3050 Our scouts have found a Gepid tribe that gave us 25 pieces of gold. We gave us enough funds to trade with the Wessex for their knowledge of Masonry. We offered them a small tribute as well as the bulk of our treasury. They now have knowledge of the wheel but would not even consider trading that secret. We are now researching Bronze Working. Enfield has been founded and immediately begun construction of a granary. With their lower harvest capability they will need this to achieve growth comparable to London. The increase in revenue from founding Enfield has given us the income to purchase the secrets of the Wheel from Northumbria. The cost was exhorbinant - twice the tribute we pay Wessex, plus the secrets of Ceremonial Burial.



Current Status thoughts
London is one turn away from finishing its warrior. This was earmarked for the isthmus between our lands and Northumbria (very nice defensible spot in the forest). Was planning another warrior next, for London garrison, then next settler. London is growing so quickly that there's no need for a granary yet (probably not until it passes size 6). The worker has been mining and roading the herd filled grasslands (no benefit to irrigate these in a despotism) but now that we have the wheel, it could be a good idea to build a road to the horses north of London. The river in the plains looks like the next best place for a city (otherwise Northumbria will probably take it). Northumbria already claimed the floodland/river/spice area in the desert south of their capital. Another scout to check out the lands south of Enfield would be good too. I hope the hills near Enfield have some iron or it could get pretty ugly for our position in the iron age. Should probably start planning on waging war against Northumbria. We're definitely going to want the entire fertile north of our continent. Build up troops until our tribute to them ends then attack to take over their cities. They'll probably respawn to the south somewhere, in the desert.



Next up
Colonel Kraken, you've got the ball. Please post when you pick up the game so we know you've got it.

Good luck and kick butt![IMG][IMG]

Hiyas...

Just downloaded the mod and this looks pretty interesting. (Had a shock to see those 5-1-1 ancient troops!) If you would like a fifth player, I'm interested. If you've got enough though, no problem, I'm already in a few RBD games at the moment... :D

Charis

I've never played on Monarch before, but I've been very successful on Regent. I'm willing to play if ye need another player, this sounds interesting.

Welcome to the game Charis and Exsanguination!

Colonel Kraken hasn't responded for his turn and Garret is unable to play this round. That puts Charis in the driver's seat with Exsanguination on deck.

Colonel Kraken, let us know what's up. We can reshuffle the order so you don't lose your turn.

Das - I need your decision whether you're going to play or not, our list is complete if you are playing. Thanks.

Originally posted by Charis
Hiyas...

Just downloaded the mod and this looks pretty interesting. (Had a shock to see those 5-1-1 ancient troops!) If you would like a fifth player, I'm interested. If you've got enough though, no problem, I'm already in a few RBD games at the moment... :D

Charis They're a double edged sword too. In play testing I had several masses of berzerkers obliterated by horsemen. The AI is very aware that they have a defense of 1. You're almost forced to send a spearman with each one.

Got it, will play shortly this eve... :crazyeyes:

Charis

Herein lies the tale of the reign of an unlikely leader. One "Charis O'Saebert",
an Irishman at the helm of the Essex nation. At this early stage in history,
they had not yet had 'run ins' with other cultures and did not think this
odd at the time...

3050 BC (0) - Charis O surveys the situation. Notices science was "off"
so he spends the 1 gold to go after Bronze Working. Agrees with assessment
to fortify the choke point and that Northumbria is a likely early foe.
Charis O didn't care for the granary choice with this much exploring to
do, but in deference to the founder of their nation, he leaves it be.

3000 BC (1) - If we're planning military units, better get London a Barracks.

2750 BC (6) - Barracks done, start on Warrior to finish before city grows.

2710 BC (7) - Takes a look at Enfield, and tries to move a worker. City governor
is on for my citizens ???? (Snaps that puppy off)

2670 BC (8) - Starts a temple for culture and happiness, in London.

2550 BC (11) - Whips the granary in Essex now that it needs 38 to complete.
Starts another scout.

2390 BC (15) - London hits size 4. Governor wants to make an
entertainer. Charis fires the governor and pushes up luxury rate a notch.

2310 BC (17) - London and Enfield both start Settlers (finally!)

2230 BC (19) - Great, a barbarian camp just below us. No surprise with
no one to watch the area ;p

2190 BC (20) - Settler pops out, ready to get that nice river wheat spot.
He'll need protection, so an archer is started, with the firepower to
take out the camp. He's headed to the spot to the SE of the wheat,
which is on the river and lake, and knight's move from the game, and next
to the mountain. The warrior is sent with him, leaving London (gasp) bare.
Archer due in 3 can follow them while London pumps out another mil unit.
The worker is on a road now, expected to road to the horses next. When
he does, we'll have access to Chariots. (If another archer is made, can
switch before it's finished.)

That's 20 turns, so quick :P There is a barbarian camp just south of the
Southern scout, and just North of the Northern scout, so careful!
You can see the camp, just not the barbs, due to fog.

Bronze Working is due in 11, with a push up of science and recent road
development. Watch if a city grows to see if luxury rate needs to go
back up. (London will need 20% luxury when it hits 4 I think). From
scouting, it seems, though not 100% sure, we're on an island with these
other two civs. Should be a bloodbath at some point. We're short in
everthing - cities, military, and infrastructure. That only leaves us
our wits ahead of the AI!

Good luck!
Charis

Sweet. I agree we'll need some infrastructure soon.

Exsanguination, you're up. Post to let us know when you pick up the game.

Exsanguination, are you there? For that matter, Colonel Kraken and Das - are you there?

Much silence from everybody except Garret and Charis. If Exsanguination doesn't pick up today I'll grab the game this eve and we'll just start the go round again.

I've got the game and this will be the start of round 1.5.

All players besides Charis and Garret please respond if you are still playing. From the silence it looks like we'll need to clean up the player list and start recruiting again :(

Turn notes
2150 Scout chased north by barbarians, finds Goth tribe. Goths teach us Bronze Working. We're now researching Iron Working. This will give us BERZERKERS! 40 turns to world domination. Research turned way down - was no turn advantage to higher research (40 turns no matter what). Entertainment pumped up to 30%. Keep (most of) the peeps happy. (picture)
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/essex2190bc.jpg
2110 London switched production from archer to Pyramids. Should be complete by the time we get Iron Working (Berzerkers). Enfield switched production from settler to spearman for London defensive garrison. Basically turning from expansion to conquest at this point. There aren't enough fertile lands in the north of our island continent if Northumbria is allowed to compete.
2070
2030 Phoenecian raiding party ambushes one of our scouts.
1990 Workers complete road to horses. Enfield production switched to chariot.
1950
1910 Edwin of Deira (Northumbria's king) tried to extort us for our entire treasury. I told him to go sit on a pike. He backed down. Hatfield is founded, begins construction of a temple. Enfield completed our first chariot unit bound for London defense. Begins construction of a temple. We need a decent culture base to capture Northumbria cities and hold them.
1870
1830 Northumbria has founded the town of Durham directly north of our isthmus defense force. Warrior moved west to other side of isthmus to escape Northumbrian territory. Enfield whips out their temple. Will start a barracks next turn.
1790 Caewalla of Wessex offers us Iron Working in exchange for our entire treasury plus an annual tribute equal to our entire economic growth. We agree. Our own science can be turned down as well as our entertainment to bring back economic growth. This way we have Iron Working more than 30 turns faster than planned. There is iron right next to Enfield. Worker immediately put on road construction to the iron deposit.
1750
1725
1700
1675
1650 A barbarian is seen to the south of Hatfield. Hatfield fortifies for defense.
1625 Enfield completes barracks. Begins training archers. This will be switched to berzerkers as soon as our iron source is functional.
1600 Hatfield successfully defends against Anglican barbarian assault. Damned Anglicans. Don't they recognize Saxon superiority? Iron source brought online. Enfield production switched to berzerker. Luxury rate raised to 40% to prevent riots with population growth next turn.
1575
1550
1525 First berzerker unit trained. Sent to London to help hold the peace in the growing burb. Enfield begins training basic warriors as local garrison/police forces. (photo)
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/essex1525bc.jpg

Ruminations
Planning on pumping out cheap warriors for local defense and crowd control, 2 per city. Mobilize berzerkers and spearmen for assault on Northumbria. Berzerkers must be paired with spearman or they get slaughtered when defending.

I took a fairly big chance by abandoning the expansion plan and tooling up for conquest but the techs fell in very nicely so it is working so far. Enfield is tooling up to be a fantastic production center.

Players
Charis, you're up next. Garret is on deck. This is still 20 turns per player (round 1.5)

Had to trim the player list for apparent fallout so we're actively recruiting again. Pipe up if you're interested.

Shaitan,

Alas, when I try to load your save file, the application crashes about 60% through the read. :( I can start a new Essex game, or load my old files, and got this crash repeatedly, only on this save file, so the mod is correctly installed. We can either...

- have you try to upload a new different freshly zipped version
- have Garret see if he can load this turn's save

:eek:
Charis

Originally posted by Charis
Shaitan,

Alas, when I try to load your save file, the application crashes about 60% through the read.
Charis

Here's a new one. Fresh off the zipper.

Thanks for the retry, but drats.... it still doesn't work -- the
program crashes. :mad:

Let Garret try this turn?

:confused:
Charis

I found the problem. It's not the save, it's the install batch file for the mod. I've attached a corrected version. Unzip into the BritIsles folder to replace the old batch file. Make sure you uninstall the mod before reinstalling it with this batch file so the automatic backups will remain correct.

The problem was a missed directory change in the installation that caused the unique unit files to not get copied over. Our berzerker was crashing the game.

Ah, that makes sense. Problem didn't show up until a UU did.

I'll play this eve late night, or worst case tomorrow.

Charis

So can I join, I mean do you need any players?

Seems like you do... well I manage Emperor level, 100% Win on Monarch...

Originally posted by Grey Fox
So can I join, I mean do you need any players?


Sure do! Welcome to the game. You're in the rotation after Garret.

1525 BC (0) - The reigns turned again to the hands of Charis O'Saebert.
The bloody Northumbrians understood the key role of the choke point, and
did found Dunholm to counfound us. Our day will come... In Enfield,
with some shield waste with warriors, I'm shifting to get 10 shields and
one warrior a turn at a slight food shortage, then switch back to a two
turn warrior and make up the food. That's two warriors every three turns
instead of every four.

1500 BC (1) - 1400 BC (5) Pretty quiet with just three cities... build a
spearman and start a settler and hope we land the Pyramids.

1375 BC (6) - Luxuries are getting expensive with London now at size 7
and

1350 BC (7) - We're informed the Scottish city of Edinburough has completed...
the Pyramids. Ack! Seven turns away, were we. Important safety tip...
If you try to build a wonder, you better have a backup wonder/tech to
switch to if you don't make it. We're going to have to switch those 258 extra
shields to granary (it was our capitol so we can't switch to Palace).
Unless... I can get a tech for trade... Northumbrians have Mysticism, but a
trade "Can't be done." Having no production for the last hundred years has
left us poor and without a military, so pushing a war right now would
just leave us in worse shape. 8-\ Our neighbors switch to Oracle...

1325 BC (8) - Start cranking out settlers, and will send one to our
Northumbrian chokepoint, and another for the incense-river area near
Hrypis.
1300 BC (9) - 1200 BC (13) Not much...

1175 BC (14) - Welwyn is formed to choke off the Northumbrians. Temple started.

1100 BC (17) - Stanstead Abbots is formed on river next to Iron right on
the doorstep of Hyrpis. They'll just love that! With all land un-fogged,
our scout is disbanded to save on costs.

1025 BC (20) - Get Alphabet for Northumbrians for 33 gold + 3/turn (if they
get uppity, they'll lose the per turn amount, I figure)

1000 BC (21) - Was planning to go one extra turn to get a nice 'even' year,
and Northumbrian demands (cough) tribute of 28 gold. I quietly turn my
back on them, and feel a knife in it! They declare war! :eek: (Darn, should have
gone even more gold/turn and less lump ;p)

Given this development, I'll pass the game over at the BEGINNING of this
turn. All moves are left. The settler is heading SW a few squares to the
whale. Redirect if you have a better spot. They have spearmen-settler
pairs in a few places. Enfield is running a temporary shortage to get its
Berzerker in 2 turns instead of 3. Once it's out, redistribute workers agn.

Good luck, it's just now heating up ;p (Garret is up unless asleep, in which case Grey Fox will have his hands full)
Charis

PS On my screen, the Berzerker looks like a Worker, not a swordsman! I may
need to reinstall the mod's graphics.

Missed the Pyramids by seven turns... My, that truly blows :(

Fantastic city management there, Charis. It never occured to me to run shortages to boost production. I'll definitely start doing that.

So, Northumbria wants war, eh? We'll have to teach them all about the Saxon Menace. :ripper:

Originally posted by Charis
On my screen, the Berzerker looks like a Worker, not a swordsman! I may need to reinstall the mod's graphics.

Zoinks! I can't believe nobody caught that bug before (including me!). It's fixed in the newly posted version 6.2.

If you don't want to redownload the whole mod for that you can fix it quick by copying swordsman.ini (from the Art/Swordsman folder) to the Art/Berzerker folder. Then go into the berzerker folder and delete berzerker.ini and rename swordsman.ini to berzerker.ini.


Garret's awake and will play tonight.

Garret is apparently still asleep. Grey Fox, go ahead and take the game.

Good luck and kick some butt!

I'm playing...

:crazyeyes I lost my notes, but no worry...

I failed to do much... I razed one City, got one of mine razed and a lot of My berzerkers were killed. I guess I used the wrong tactics...

We got an early Golden Age... good?

The Manx have the Colossus and the Northumbians have the Oracle in Loidis.

I played about 10 Turns... I have no more time to play tonight so I stopped. *Sigh* I'll go to bed soon.

I've got the game for the start of round two. 15 turns per player now.

Early golden ages are common in this mod as most of the UU's are from the ancient times.

Basic berzerker strategy is to pair each berzerker up with a spearman. Berzerks have an awesome attack but if they ever have to defend they are just so many very pissed off corpses.

750 BC Garrison of Hatfield mobilized to attack Hadeford. The warrior of Welwyn sacrifices himself against elite Ulfedhn. The Ulfedhn is virtually destroyed. Mysticism purchased from Wessex. Embassy established with Wessex and a militarty pact with Wessex against Northumbria is made. Focused cities on production - reduced science from 70 to 50, raised entertainment from 10 to 20. Removing entertainers brings London up 1 shield, Enfield up 2 shields, Treasury growing. Literature will take 2 more turns to research. Southern (small) cities are building spearmen. Northern cities are producing berzerkers.The people are generally unhappy but productive. They'll get over it. Despotism isn't for the benefit of the citizens anyway. (image)
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/essex750bc.jpg

730 BC Although London is in borderline rebellion, the people still love me so much that they've put a second story onto the palace.

710 BC Spearmen from the south begin traveling to the northern staging areas. They should be there just in time to meet up with the newly trained berzerkers. Loidis is our target.

690 BC The people just love me. They've put a third story on the palace. The Hatfield garrison is poised to attack Hadeford.

670 BC The Hatfield force has broken its teeth against the shields of Hadeford's spearmen. Great damage was inflicted but troop estimates for Hadeford were too low and sheer number of defenders defeated us. Archers from Stanstead Abbots and Hatfield will soon join the seige force. A berzerker has also been dispatched to bolster the southern force assault strength. Combined force of berzerkers and spearmen leave Welwyn temporarily unguarded to assault a target of opportunity - a lone Ulfedyn. He crumbles before the fury of the berzerk assault. The march on Loidis has begun.

650 BC Northumbrian counterattack has left the northern assault force without its screen of spearmen. Berzerkers orderd to head south to meet a spear remnant from the group besieging Hadeford.

630 BC Spearman heading north to meet berzerkers is surprised by an Ulfedhn unit and destroyed after causing some damage to the "wolf cloaks". Northern berzerk force then exacts Odin's revenge on the scurvy dogs. Ulfedhn are forced to flee.

610 BC Two groups of Ulfedhn converge on the Northern berzerk force and decimate them.

590 BC Heroic efforts of the Hadeford besieging force. The main defensive unit of this force beat off two assaults by Ulfedhn and was then able to counterattack one and destroy it. We will try to get this badly damaged unit to safety. Their heroism has set the stage for the second assault on Bradeford.

570 BC Bradeford has been taken. The demoralized populace has not even organized resistance against us. All available forces make for Loidis.

550 BC Assault forces are in place to attack Loidis. Bradeford's citizens are whipped to complete a barracks. This will let us heal the units damaged in taking the city and enable a second wave attack on Loidis if necessary. Luxury expense increased to 30% to support increased production in Enfield and London.

530 BC Loidis has fallen. The Oracle is ours! Extremely heavy resistance encountered (7 of 9 populace). Food production cut off and temple construction is begun. Northumbria has moved their capital to far Dearthingtun. Once we enforce the Pax Essex in Loidis we will immediately move against Hrypis. Control of that area will give us access to incense.

510 BC The Bradeford assault force is back to strength and begins travel towards Hrypis. They should be able to take Hrypis by themselves leaving the Loidis force to attack Heafudenne (iron) or Dearthingtun.

490 BC Five resistors remain in Loidis. Population has decreased to 8 due to food shortage. Latest troop influx has pushed our economy into the negative. Production switched to civil buildings as long as shield loss did not occur.

470 BC Our research into Literature finally pays off. Begin research on Code of Laws, aiming for Brehon Law. 2 resisters remain in Loidis. 3 understrength units remain to keep the peace, remainder sent for Dearthingtun. Science/Luxury set at 50/10. London and Enfield set to produce workers. Our territory has almost doubled. We need workers to get it functional.

450 BC The resistance in Loidis has finally ended. Food production has been reinstated and temple construction completed at the end of the whip. Manageable population of 5 remaining. First Wessex unit seen near Hrypis - a single spearman. Our forces marshalled outside Hrypis' gates. They will fall at our will. Forces are in place outside of Dearthingtun that should have no problem taking that city. Enfield and London are producing our first Librarys. (image)
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/essex450bc.jpg

Notes:
What a fantastic turn! Grey Fox, I was afraid what I'd find when you said you lost a lot of berzerkers and a city but Essex was in great shape. Just took a few tweaks to get it running to my war strategy.

Essex berzerkers backed by horse and spear units soundly thrashed Northumbria's forces. Killing their Ulfedhn is a pain in the butt because they can retreat. Best force mix was to team up a berzerker to attack, horseman to finish off the wounded Ulfedhn and spearman to protect the berzerker. The exposed horsemen tend to die quickly though. I didn't see any more Ulfedhn after the fall of Loidis so I didn't replace the lost horsemen.

430 BC should see the fall of Hrypis and Dearthingtun. The fall of Heafudenne should coincide nicely with the expiration of our military alliance with Wessex. Northumbria is ruined as a power. Finish them off or give them to Wessex. Remember - mercy is way overrated and it was Northumbria who started this war. I vote for annihilation.


You're up next Charis.

In recent years in Essex, the world was turned upside-down. our neighbors
and supposed friends, the Northumbrians, attacked us unprovoked and without
cause. Defended by two great captains, now it was Essex pressing the attack.
Things were going so well they had a lottery and thought they would let
a Lance Corporal try to run the show for 15 years. Corporal Charis was
selected - Let's see how the young boy did...

450 BC (0) - London has two entertainers?? Let's make a settler to fix that.
Same for Enfield, we're massively undercolonized, no time for libraries
(especially in middle of a conquest war ;p) Abbots swaps to temple.
Mercy or annihilation? They started it when we accepted them as neighbors
and friends. Besides, its not really annihilation, we'll let their citizens
join us and become cultured :P

430 BC (1) - Elite Berzerker mauls the first defender at Hrypis. A horseman
tries to soften it up with no luck, then an archer takes the city.
On Dearthingtun a vet Berz becomes 'lite. We then lose one, and another
takes the city. (Which is EMPTY? What kind of capitol is that? Oh ya, the
displaced capitol.) We go to discuss the idea of peace. He mocks us by
saying he only had 4 workers to offer! hah! (Well, it was true)

410 BC (2) - Moving on Heafuddene.

390 BC (3) - A mighty Ulfhedn chooses as his target... a worker next to
the city?! Ha!! What a maroon. He's no match defensively against our
Berzerker, and after he backs up, another Berz takes him out. ;p
Two Berzerkers go up against the city and...

"You have Fledling Northumbrians, Sir" :hammer:

Looks like we got those four workers anyway ;p

Corporal Charis looks at Wessex. Their best known unit is an Archer. We
have a massive battle hardened army with Elite Berzerkers begging for a
Great Leader, and Wessex denied us any true help in this war that could
have ended our civilization. Our advisor reports they fear us, and that
our military outnumbers them. (What on EARTH have they been doing all this
time??) They will pay for this insolence!! :hammer:

370 BC (4) - HeuffanoodleCasserole and Dearthingtun are double whipped for
temples. Bradeford and Abbot get a templewhip too. (Oracle should help them
feel better soon.)

350 BC (5) - 310 BC (7) Moving the troops up. Does Wessex know what's coming?

290 BC (8) - In the field is a stack of four, a spearman and three archers.
Take them out now with no defensive bonuses, or let them wander past
us to lightly defended cities? Is Dorsetshire shrinking? Are they whipping?
Do they suspect? Unfortunately one of our settlers is in harm's way, so we
press on to their capitol.

270 BC (9) - Uneasy looks as the armies pass...

250 BC (10) - Code of Laws discoverd, and we're now on our way to glorious
Brehon Law! We encircle and surround their little pack. (See picture)

230 BC (11) - Our horsemen sent to start the fight by 'softening up' their
Spearman killed him without a scratch! :hammer:
You just gotta see the next post for a picture - I would HATE to be that spearman! :lol:

210 BC (12) - They respond with brilliant tactics: Send an archer out into
the open ;p We found a new city, although the corporal will no doubt
get reprimanded for the insolent name chosen!

190 BC (13) - We attack and autoraze the tiny city of Brokenbloke. Alas, they
take out a zerker in the process.

170 BC (14) - A Wessex axeman of the Clifford line comes out to challenge our
Berkerker to a one on one to fight to the death. One of the Essex archers
didn't realize it was a duel of honor and interfered. He was slain where
he stood. Slaying a fellow soldier in front of a Berzerker is NOT a good
idea! That was Clifford's very last battle...

150 BC (15) - That same enraged berzerker stepped up to another rather
foolish archer who jumped out in the open to face him. He was slain
without a scratch.

The Corporals fifteenth year was up. "NO!!!! I'm RIGHT at the
doorstep of their capitol!!" Alas, it was not to be his glory. "OH CRUD!
Isn't that always how it goes?? The little guy does ALL the work, now some
high-falutin' general is gonna come in and get all the GLORY! It's not Fair!"

"War is not fair, Corporal Charis..."
Good luck General (GreyFox?)

(Parting thoughts: Whip the temple in Hrypis when there are 39 shields left
to complete it. There are TWO settlers with moves left in on this turn in 150.
One can found in a decent spot right where he is, the other is in a town.
Decent for coverage, not for resources, that is. Our economics are not great,
we're having to go for Brehon Law at min rate for example. The worker near
Hatfield was to start a road to the abbott. In London I would
keep cranking out Berzerkers one per two turns until Sussex is history.
Then get mapmaking and a boat and conquer the next country :hammer: In the meanwhile, fill out this rock of an island we call home, spam settlers)

Charis

In fact, this was a really, REALLY bad day to be a Wessex spearman. See that guy in the middle... muhahaha! :hammer:

-- Charis

Grey Fox, please take the game. Garret's beloved Patriots are losing the Super Bowl and he'll be unable to play the game through his waterfall of tears.

No Grey Fox? Hmm...

Charis, it looks like we're the only ones playing this game. What would you say to making it an Open Succession game?

I've been kinda busy these days... been skipping 3 Succession games... all were I've been late to respond.

Sorry for that.

I'll be here for my next turn though...

All righty then. I've got the game.

:confused: Do you need another player? ;) I've never played a succession before, so......:spank:

Originally posted by xrang
:confused: Do you need another player? ;) I've never played a succession before, so......:spank:

Yup, we sure could use another player. I'll add you to the player list right now. Do you have any questions on how the game works?

Also, you'll need the British Isles mod for this game (link is in my signature).

Welcome aboard!

Shaitan,

I think an "open" (grab-the-game) succession would be a poor choice for a mod, where they might grab one turn, have no idea what a berzerker or Brehon Law is and come up with foolishness. Having someone stick with it a while is much better. Also you'll get no useful feedback on the mod if someone 'dips in' for a turn once in a while.

As far as opening it up to new players, sure!! (Xrang, hi!) Recruit or from time to time post messages in here "Any lurkers who have been following care to join in, we can use more!" -- that would be great.

I dare say for this game experience is less important than in some other ones - again in part due to the fact this is a mod and no one is a Saxon-guru yet.

Charis

what exactly do you want me to do? i know that sounds stupid but I need to know these things:confused: :blush:

150 Bumped up science spending. Running a budget deficit but will get Brehon Law 10 turns faster. Analysts decide the military is overbudgeted and that there are enough forces to complete the Wessex campaign already in theatre. Unit training exercises are abandoned across the country in favor of domestic works projects. (image)
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/essex150bc.jpg
130 Dorsetshire assaulted by two understrength Berzerkers. Both succeed in destroying a spearman defender. Dorsetshire will fall at our will.

110 Dorsetshire falls. Troops from Essex are heading for the western Wessex cities. The main assault force will take out the eastern ones. Snap, crackle, pop! Libraries will soon start popping up all over the place, encouraged by the whip.

90 Resistance in Dorsetshire ends. Lose a bowman from the eastern assault force to incompetence (died attacking a half strength warrior).

70 Library construction has shaved 10 turns off Brehon Law research. Treasury is looking sad though.

50 Mixed results on both fronts. New Wessex capital of Salsbury hit hard. Will fall when we next attack it.

30 We've discovered that the Manx city of Douglas has completed the Great Lighthouse. Hopefully we'll be able to get off of this rock without it. Salsbury and Southampton fall. Forces move on the new Wessex capital of Reading. Caewalla requests peace, for which he will offer...nothing. The people of Essex are not amused.

10 Movement but no combat action.

0 (non turn) Millenium celebrations are held all across the land. In the east, a bright light is seen in the sky. Is it the herald of a new messiah? Nope, turns out to be burning Wessex cities.

10AD Elite Horsemen conquer Alesforda (Western assault force).

30 Elite Berzerkers conquer Reading (Eastern assault force).

50 Our palace is expanded again. Culture from our many libraries is quickly covering our desert island. Elite horse driven back from Wdetun (Western force). Berzerk assault force in place for next assault. Treasury is virtually bankrupt. Decision is made to continue defecit spending and sacrifice troops to pay the budget.

70 Elite Berzerkers conquer Wdetun. Wessex has one city remaining (Quenta).

90 Loidis and Enfield are set up to pump out workers.

110 Brehon Law research will be completed momentarily. We're able to adjust our budget to run in the black again.

130 Brehon Law is discovered. We enter a period of blissful anarchy as we reorganize the government.

150 Most major cities have fallen into disorder but the enraged populace have not begun looting or destroying structures yet. Assault on Quenta fails but all defenders have been eliminated except for one severely depleted spearman.

170 Riots in Enfield. Barracks destroyed. Quenta is destroyed by ravening berzerkers. The fledgling Wessex are no more. We have completed our manifest destiny and taken the entirety of our island continent. (image)
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/essex170ad.jpg


Notes: There are a few places on the coast where we should stick some Dry Gulch cities to completely envelop the island in our borders. There are many, many pirate ships watching our coast so when we do get galleys we will probably lose a few. Speaking of galleys, boy do we need some of those. Map Making is up for research and it should be a fairly fast learn as we'll be in Brehon Law and just about every other civ probably has it already. I was hoping for a leader so we could relocate the capital smack in the middle of our desert isle but no luck there. Building palace isn't an option without a leader. We could put the Forbidden Palace down south but then would have no option for effective expansion off of the island.

Charis, you're up. Goal is 15 turns now. A few more or less is okay, player's discretion.

Charis, excellent points regarding an open game. We'll definitely keep it closed.

xrang, email me at jrpea@bellsouth.net and I'll give you the skinny.

Excellent job taking our destiny, the island of Essex! :hammer:

Agreed, we need at least 3 settlers I would say to close out the borders. The AI is VERY aggressive on grabbing those 'last spots' in someone else's territory. In border 'gap' cities good job building libraries, I'll make sure those are everywhere border expansion is needed.

I'm seeing this Anarchy mistake in several of my SG games now, so here's a tip: Under conditions of civil disorder, which you are prone to have for several turns under Anarchy, things get destroyed. Sometimes painfully expensive things. There's no need for this - when you go Anarchy, go through the cities and make as many entertainers as needed to keep them happy. You get no shields anyway, so it's almost painless - the only 'iffy' case at all is when it would starve a city. The "fast" way to do this which takes only a few seconds even for a huge nation... zoom in on a city and click your cursor on the 'center' city square. Don't move it. It will readjust citizens to avoid unhappiness. Press the right arrow button on your keyboard, it will move you to next city. Click moust button (still over the city center tile). Arrow. Repeat click-and-arrow right after the other, don't even wait. You can avoid revolt in dozens of cities in just a few seconds. When you research the new governement, repeat the process to get rid of the entertainers and make them productive again. Micromanagers will then go through and reassign citizens as needed, but that's not required for a casual player.

In one game this wasn't done, a harbor was lost on a second continent, and bam, a ton of luxiries and resources were cut off. That was VERY painful.

Another thought based on your last message, Shaitain. What you might have is a post or a Readme-like file that describes for people PLAYING this mod just what the key differences are. I still have no clue other than the berzerker and the Ulf which I've seen repeatedly in combat. A one page bit on the names of the civs, their UU and what makes them different, and on key tech changes like Brehon Law, would be good. Post rather than email.
(Ok, one MORE comment. I saw your replies in the graphic mod threads. That fire longbowman just ROCKS! Minor bombardment role and normal archer powers, and a gool gfx. Likewise some other gfx do look great for this mod). My only feedback question at this point is that I'm not sure berzerkers (and perhaps several other UU's) aren't imbalanced. For when you get them, they just dominate TOO much. 5-1-1 in the early ancient era is just a crusher. Why make anything else besides a spearman to protect them? You don't see that kind of firepower in a Civ3 normal unit until *Cavalry*. In UU's, not until Cossacks. The Persian immortal is borderline imbalanced at 4-2-1, would you like to face a 5-1-1 immortal? :eek: If you're going for "difference", 5-1-1 is certainly novel, but really it should come around... hmm... Feudalism? If you want them earlier or want better balance, 4-1-1 for a UU that early (or even 4-2-1 like Immortal) would work. That's just 2 cents based on the game so far, I've not gone over the mod changes in detail to know what other civs are like. (When we face them I sure will though ;P)

Good job on the conquest :p
Charis

there is also a governor that maintains happiness...

Thanks for the mod feedback, Charis. It's incredibly helpful for the continuing development of the mod.

There is a readme.txt in the mod file. I can post that here as well. Maybe add it to the threadstart post...

The berzerker and ulfedhn do seem a bit potent. Our berzerks definitely steamrolled Northumbria and Wessex. I'm not sure exactly why we did so well against Northumbria as the Ulfedhn generally take down Berzerkers. Probably just that Northumbria didn't build enough Ulfedhn.

What I thought would be the balance is that any old horseman can wack either one. Backing them up with spearmen makes them uberpowerful. I like your suggestion on delaying them. Stormerne has suggested that they come in with Polytheism instead of ironworking (as they are warriors devoted to Odin). I think I'll playtest and probably implement that.

Grey Fox - that's why I was caught flat footed by all the riots. I normally use the governors and was lost without my "crutch" ;)

The post-war turn went very well, with a HUGE increase in jobs for workers, settlers and city founding, and not bad for military too...

The realm is in Anarchy, the people cry out for Brehon Law!!

170 AD (0) - The Charis clan of the O'Saebert line comes once again to power.
Their survey of the realm starts quite strong. The island is theirs, and theirs
alone. He makes plan to insure it STAYS that way. With their berzerkers the
dominant force of their time, finding another land to conquer would work
well (hehe, we ARE expansionist and militaristic). But to do that we'll need:
mapmaking, and better production, so it's a time for building. He awaits the
official installment of his new government and is happy to see in the meantime
that temples are being built. In the meantime he bones up on Brehon Law...

Good efficiency, Pay labor, nuisance corruption, MP of 4 (!), unit support 2/4/8
and draft rate of 1. Compared to monarchy less corruption, more MP, and the
same unit support. (Comment to Shaitan: it "dominates" Monarchy, not really
a good thing. It's better in everyway except draft, no real tradeoffs)
Compared to republic, same corruption and efficiency, much more unit support
and a ton more MP. And no war weariness! (Worse imbalance. Basically it's just
too good. It makes the other two ancient govts useless. If there's a commerce
bonus for Republic not in Brehon, then it only dominates Monarchy. Actually,
this )

Alas, just one problem that Charis O'Saebert sees. We're too soon for Brehon.
That gaggle of temples was just crying out, yearning for a good whipping.
We'll make do, but if we were religious and no anarchy penalty, I would revert
back, whip for about 4 turns, then re-revolt to Brehon :hammer:
On this difficulty this won't set us back at all, so not to worry.

Oops, sorry, more than one problem. Courthouse being built in a city right
next to our capitol??! As one who has suffered under the influcence, Charis O'
immediately recognizes this as pure weed effect :smoke: With so many shields
already done towards it, he shifts it to palace 'placeholder' for a wonder.
Once we get a tech that allows a wonder we want to build, it can be switched
over to that. Looking at how many have already been snarfed, that might not
be until Sun Tzu or Sistine. The courthouse in Hatfield is also useless,
with only 1 gold and 1 shield loss. We take a settler instead, needing about
3-5 more to fill out the island.

BUG REPORT: The shields box for the 'Palace' in Welwyn isn't showing up right.
It's keeping track properly, just showing a 1 column box for some reason.

Oh, now the young celt-turned-essex Charis is going to get chastised for being
far too picky, but... he fires all the governors! Just not good for succession,
the choices are poor- in nine cities citizens needed to be moved, they've all
been smoking weed too!. They would even starve a city to make entertainers that
weren't needed.

190 AD (1) - 230 (3) Not much going on really... London soon goes into troop
mode, one zerker per two rounds, Enfield likewise one spearman per two.
With Brehon's great Military Police rate of 4, we can build up for our
next invasion AND keep the people happy, at no unit support cost :p
(These cities are chosen both for high shield rate and for barracks. Non-
barracks cities on troops were taken off)

250 AD (4) - Scots finish the Great Wall. (They must all be together on a
continent, their rate of research and getting techs is blowing us away.)
We actually have four stellar production cities, just nothing to produce
in the way of infrastructure yet.

260 AD (5) - Loidos is set up as a "worker farm"!! This is a size 7 city
with a granary and 10 shields per turn. It cranks out literally one
worker per turn. When it does the larger food box of a size 7 city instantly
fills the size 6 box and it grows/produces another worker, cycling again.
These workers can both work the land or join other slow growing cities.
:hammer: BTW, when the AI assesses your military strength is goes purely
by 'number of units'. That counts workers :lol: By the end of my reign
or next, they will feel true fright of our military might!

300 AD (9) - Fishing/whaling village of Meresig founded. We continue working
hard at a massive road network. It will help our commerce alot, and make
movement over this large island much quicker.

320 AD (11) - Map Making learned, Mathematics started. We've still got ages
to go before temples are done to be able to start on better things.
Southampton gets a Galley queued up after it's temple, in 5 turns.

BUG: Gah, for some reason can't select 'Harbor' for Stanstead Abbot.
It's listed but greyed out. Hmmm... if I right-click on city instead of
zoom, I can (and do!) (I'll try to attached year 310 AD save file to
see palace box and harbor listing bugs). I start the harbor before the
galley because there are a dozen barbarian ships patrolling our shores!

330 AD (12) - We queue up a scout to board the upcoming galley. The people
like the harbor so much they build onto the palace. (Just noticed how far
up the luxury slider is. We'll need yet more MP troops to cut that down)

350 AD (14) - Hyrpis reaches size 7 with a granary and starts a barracks.
It should likely crank troops for a while after that.

Stopping at 14 to get an nice round number for final year. The F11 screen
shows us that we're #1 in population, GNP and productivity, and #2 in land
area. These are VERY good signs! Literacy could be higher (ya, could have
whipped the libraries as well as temples, but we're onto higher forms of
rule by the people now! :hammer:)

Tips for next leader...

- Support costs are starting to get to us. May have to stop short the
worker factory (for now) or start adding some workers to the smaller
cities.
- Harbor then Galley in Southhampton. Take a berzerker and a scout on a
long ride and see the world!
- Don't let Welwyn confuse you. Leave its production as it is and someday
we'll get a wonder there.
- May need to, now or soon, cut back science rate to help budget. Can't
turn back luxury rate or London will riot (get a settler from there if
needed)

Good luck,
Charis

Saitain, this file should show the palace shield box bug in
Welwyn. And this turn or next, try zooming to city and changing
to harbor off the current granary in Stanstead Abbot.

See if you see the same problems (?)

Charis

Originally posted by Charis
Saitain, this file should show the palace shield box bug in
Welwyn. And this turn or next, try zooming to city and changing
to harbor off the current granary in Stanstead Abbot.

See if you see the same problems (?)

Couldn't reproduce the harbor wierdness but I've definitely got the palace bug. That is VERY odd as there haven't been any changes to the palace in the mod. Tried it in other saves and in a new game and all showed up the same way - 1 column with nothing filled. Keep an eye out for this in other improvements. I'm going to go back through the versions and see where it kicked in. Can hopefully isolate the offending party that way.

You're right on Brehon Law, it's just too good. I'll be lowering the MP to 1 and free units to 1/2/4. That'll give it advantages and disadvantages to both of the other ancient governments.

Note to all players
Version 8 was posted today. Please do not try to use that version for the succession game. There were changed to civ specific abilities in this version and there's no telling what that will do in an existing game.

Looks like you're getting some good feedback on the mod in its thread, and making good progress incorporating them :)
I do like the Berzerker coming with Polytheism, good call.

> You're right on Brehon Law, it's just too good. I'll be lowering the MP to 1 and free units to 1/2/4

A move in the right direction, but that won't work either :P
(EDIT-- unless I've misread Civopedia entry on it, see below)

The key advantage of Mon or Rep over despotism is you stop losing bonuses for food and mining over 3, as well as some decrease in corruption. The difference between Mon and Rep is basically... how do you make your people happy? In Monarchy it's with MP. Rep gets higher commerce, which is enough to let you crank up the luxury slider to compensate for lack of MP. In fact, with marketplaces in place, your *net* gain in commerce after subtracting the NEEDED luxury increase is medium, and to compensate, war weariness is added into the mix. Thus Monarchy is where you want to be if in war, Republic if relative peace (add Democracy for dominant peace and Communism for dominant war). There's a good balance.

Now if you do NOT give Brehon MP 4, and cut the unit costs covered per city, and do NOT give it the Republic commerce bonus, it's owned by Monarchy. What I guess I'm not clear on is if you get the Republic/Democracy 'commerce bonus' with Brehon Law. If so, then actually it will work, it a very nice compromise between Monarchy and Republic, but you need to make this clear in the Civilopedia. One other compounding factor to mention. If you don't give the commerce bonus to Brehon, it won't have the cash to rush things, and the rush method is cash not people.

btw, with 1 MP and 1/2/4 support, we need to change gears *ASAP* in our game!! We'll be thrown into a virtual depression short on cash, with our high population, high military unit count, and 'abundant' worker count! :P (yet we need those workers to improve the mining to get more shields to build temples and marketplaces in less than 500 years, and to increase commerce by more roads)

If you want just a touch more power to Brehon (and it won't have a big effect in our game, not saying it because of that) would be to have Brehon kicked up a notch on how well it reduces corruption. Historically... was Brehon law known for times of harmony and low corruption, strong commerce, mistreatment of workers, a heavy police/military presence, or perhaps even increased worker efficiency? I have no clue, but you likely do :P

One far-out thought for the mod... was "Feudalism" a form of government in the British isles under this time period? If so, it would make a natural replacement for Communism. Communal corruption (decreased but farther spread), rush by laborers, good MP bonus - overall comparable in power to Communism.
Or (I'm really stretching here), was their a British-specific type of Democracy that could be made into its own new type, whether 'added' or a replacement for Comm or regular Dem ?

While I'm throwing out random thoughts... did they have any special siege engines, more effective than a catapult but predating the cannon? There's a huge gap in time and in power between those two at present, something in between around Invention would be a nice addition! (If there is historical basis for it, again, no clue)

Charis

Yes, I am getting some excellent feedback :)

First, changes won't affect our game. We have to continue using versions 6.2 to 7. Version 8 has changes in civ specific abilities and some other background tweaks that might give unpredictable results on a game started in an earlier version. So no worry about Essex going bankrupt because of Brehon Law changes.

Speaking of Brehon Law, if I give the commerce bonus there won't it completely overshadow Republic? Same corruption, plus MP and free units. I've been toying with using Communal corruption for Brehon Law. Brehon Law structure was myriad little kinglets under the overall direction of the high king. Corruption wasn't really a factor of distance or travel because there was strong, local, autonomous leadership in each of the minor kingdoms. Thoughts?

Feudalism came a bit later than the focus of the mod. Then again, all of the techs are available in the main mod so there's no reason not to incorporate it. Problem was, Feudalism was an attrociously bad form of centralized government. Brehon Law, Republic and probably even pure Monarchy were superior. There may be some other government forms that were used by the various peoples. I'll look into it.

Don't even get me started on siege machines! The catapult was a poor weapon and was only in use for a very short time. It was quickly replaced by torsion driven engines that had much greater range, power, accuracy and reliability. The trebuchet was the fulmination of the torsion siege engines. Perhaps I can put a trebuchet somewhere between catapult and cannon...

Keep the feedback coming. This is great stuff!

It seems like Communal corruption might be good with Brehon law.

When I first played the Mod, I saw that it had all that was good with Monarchy and Republic and that it was better than Democracy in some ways.

You might wanna put in some War weariness too. It seems like a more peaceful government than Monarchy. Were the people are little more free. And the less opressed the people is, the more war-weariness...

Good point:goodjob:

I playtested with communal corruption and it works well. It is not as lucrative as Republic and not quite as good in war time as Monarchy. If you want a government to go through various periods of war and peace though, this one works extremely well. I'll most likely include these changes in version 9.

Grey Fox - are you skipping your turn again? Xrang has been patiently waiting for you.

Sorry for keeping you wait, remember that I live in sweden so I can play when you guys sleep...

Well do I install the latest Mod or what?

Originally posted by Grey Fox
Sorry for keeping you wait, remember that I live in sweden so I can play when you guys sleep...

Well do I install the latest Mod or what?

Not a problem, just let us know as soon as possible. Xrang could have snuck in a turn there.

No, don't install the latest Mod. There were some mechanics changes in Version 8 that are not compatible with games started in earlier versions. We'll stick with versions 6.2 or 7 for this game.

So wich save-file should I play with now then?

Originally posted by Grey Fox
So wich save-file should I play with now then?
saebert of the essex, 350 ad.zip posted by Charis

Then I'm away to Essex once again. City improvements is our main goal, right?

And some exploring of the sea if I can or what?

Originally posted by Grey Fox
Then I'm away to Essex once again. City improvements is our main goal, right?

And some exploring of the sea if I can or what?

Yup. Building infrastructure and meeting new neighbors. Be careful of the huge number of pirates off our coasts. Probably want to clean them out before loading anything valuable into a galley.

Grey,

Be sure to read at least the last half of my report where the save file is posted... otherwise you'll be very confused at a few things ;p

Key things are: watch support costs, economy needs work; harbor then galley then explore the world in Southhampton.

:crazyeyes:
Charis

I've been thinking about starting the Forbidden somewhere? where should I start it?


A good production town is started to grow in the NortEast, we might wanna build it there 'cus the north is the "Green" area of our country, what do you think?

I did a lot of tweaking with citizens, this round. It was kind of an experiment with specialist citizens, because I have never taken an extra look into those.

And it seems as if it paid of. I managed to get down the research speed with 1-3 Turns on every tech. The trick is to convert citizens that work without an effort into scientists. If a city is a size 6, and it can't grow. Take all those that work on food squares and make em' scientists. Do this until you see a change in the research speed. If nothing changes, you can change those to work on shield tiles or make them Tax men.

Remember that Corruption can't affect Specialist citizens! And a 12 Size city that can't grow hardly needs all tiles to be worked. We can for example produce a Berzerker every Second turn in London, with 9 Tiles worked and 2 Scientists and 1 Taxman. Remember that if these could work a tile that would produce 2 uncorrupted Gold, they should probably do so, but they can't do that in London so we "Earn" from having them as Scientist an Taxmen...

1: 360 AD
Harpenden is founded in the middle of the Great Desert.

2: 370 AD
Hemel is founded close to a whale, near the city Colneceastre. Changed a citizen in a city, that worked on a Desert tile (producing 1 Shield, went to corruption anyway.) to be a scientist instead. That gave us 1 turn quicker research. Hempstead is founded. Alot of 'H' cities now.

3: 380 AD
The city Ricksmanworth is founded near a fish, in the south-east.

4: 390 AD
Tweaked a lot of cities and changed citizens to Scientists, managed to get Construction-Breakthrough down to 11 Turns instead of 14 turns.

7: 420 AD
The city Watford is founded, near the Diamond. Bye the way, we are getting 7 spices, a lot to trade with when we met the other civs! And we will get diamonds soon so we might be able to lower our Luxary costs.

8: 430 AD
Put an entertainer in London (Instead of a tile with +2F +2C), and lowered luxary costs with 10%, this gave us +13 Gold/Turn, instead of +2. I was able to do this because London was the only city that needed this extra entertainment... I hope we will see this micromanagement by every player in this "Team" in the future!

9: 440 AD
I managed to overlook something... the city building tha palace to store shields also needed an entertainer... bad by me. It is rioting, I should be a Micro-manager pro by now. ARGH! Well this will never happen again!

I sunk 5 Barbarian Galley's without losing a single of our own!

We got Mathematics and Construction on my turn, 'cus of my tweaking.

WORDS TO THE NEXT PLAYER

Well a real Micromanagement heaven is waiting for the next player...

Hrypis that is building a FP, might need an entertainer next turn, it will grow. Try to make it without having to raise the Luxary cost. Our cities need to grow to, so I put the "Worker Factory" on coloseum instead of a monster producing unit machine. You should use some of these workers and add them in cities that are improved to make more money.

If you press F1 you might see that I have a lot of Taxmen and Scientist, if you remove one scientist, the research might drop, but you could try ans see what happens because we are researching Currency for the moment. I know that if you replace 4-5 Taxmen with Scientists you will get a 1 Turn boost on the Tech research, but then we will loose 5 G/Turn.

You need to check happiness in the F1 screen often, and DO NOT use the Happiness Governor!!! It will ruin all my tweakings... Argh %&!¤ erfz %¤" ze tar %!#!...

...And London is producing a Settler! I dont know if that is the best thing to do...

It might ruin our economy and Science Rate. So do it if you must.

My thought was that the settler could be added to a City with low growth and has plenty improvements around it so it won't starve...

Here is a screen:
http://medieteknik.bth.se/frst01/essex.jpg

Here is the Save File:

Fantastic micromanagement. I've learned loads from you and Charis.

Xrang, you're up. See what you can find off of our little rock.

I just DLed the file. I'm going to play now.:)

Hope your not to offended by my statement xrang. Don't backout because of me...

I've answered your reply, though...

I'm not offended. Sorry...you've read my reply...i hope

Well if you read my reply to your reply on my reply on your reply :), I forgive you!

I guess we're online at the same time, including SKILORD:)

So where are you from then?

Little Off-topic and a spam, but send me a PM when answering maybe...

just continue on city improvements, right? i hate these games where ur stuck on an island...anything we could do?

Try to explore with galleys if you can...

private Messaging isn't working. what do u think the reason is?

I get tons of messages from you, I just thought there was something wrong...

The messages are probably the same, right? My computer keeps telling me i can't send messages. Not to worry. sorry about the constant messages, must be annoying/:rolleyes:

Turn 1, 510 AD
Galley was ambushed by pirates near Southampton. Lost 2 hit points but defeated pirates. I Fotify Galley.
I don't know what to do with the military units; I guess I'll just Fortify them in cities, no? 2 Workers near Hatfield irrigate 1 square, will be done in 2 turns. 2 Workers near Enfiel are sent to cut down trees in 1 square. I don't know what to do with the people of Wenwyn....2 Workers near Wenwyn mine 1 square. 4 Workers are sent to cut down Wenwyn trees. 1 Worker near Dearthington are sent to irrigate 1 square. After some movement 1 square was irrigated near Harpenden. 5 Workers are sent to irrigate 1 squre near Harpenden. Galley is sent to explore sea around the Enfield area. Spearman Fortifies in Southampton. Some troops fortify near this mountain South of Southamton (l0l). 1 Worker near Colneceastre is irrigating 1 square. Do I need to tell you guys everything? lol

Turn 2, 520 AD
London produces 1 Settler (I sent it to Hatfield) prodiction changed to Colosseum. Enfield produces 1 Spearman production changed to Colosseum. Some worker managment. Some unit movement...and more Worker management.

Turn 3, 530 AD
Salsbury produces temple production now is Harbor(?). Wenwyn is rioting, do I keep producing place?...I can't do anything about the riot because the city will starve, what do I do? Harpenden produces Spearman, producing Temple.

Turn 4, 540 AD
Worker movement....that's all, really. Galley exploration.

Turn 5, 550 AD
1 Worker near Enfield cut down trees. 1 Hatfield Worker irrigates. 4 Harpenden Workers irrigate 1 square. Another 2 Workers wove to irrigate. 2 Workers are sent to irrigate 1 square near Heafuddene. 3 Workers are sent to cut down trees on 1 Loidis square. 3 Workers start the finishing road to Watford. 2 Workers irrigate Colneceastre square. Galley explores some more of the northern coast. 2 Spearmen are moving to Welwyn.

That's it for me. See if you still want me. I really don't have the greatest handle on this game. Maybe you'll say, "How dare you ruin our game, you sick...." l0l :lol:

Xrang,

Thanks for joining in. A few comments...

First, you need to post the save file, in .zip format, as an attachment to your post :D
That is, winzip the file, then at the bottom of the post in the "attach file section" hit the browse button then choose the zip file.

> 4 Workers are sent to cut down Wenwyn trees
Recall them! :crazyeyes: cut trees do NOT work for palace, forbidden palace or wonders. Most of the military by the way are for military police duty, just to sit in town and keep the peace.

> Do I need to tell you guys everything?
:P No, not really. Although in this case it helped the forest-cut shields from being thrown away.

> Wenwyn is rioting, do I keep producing place?...I can't do
> anything about the riot because the city will starve, what to do?
Oops! Three choices, rioting is *NOT* an option -- not only is it no production, but rioting people eventually start to *destroy* things already made! If they destroy the temple.... :eek:

Choice one is to make a citizen a entertainer, and move around some other works to have "zero growth" in food. If that's not possible, raise the luxury rate. If we can't afford that, we would have let it starve down, then set the rate there to zero growth.

> 2 Spearmen are moving to Welwyn.
Hmm, if we have less than the max allowed military police in Welwyn, that beats the other three options! Do we currently get 4 MP with this version of Brehon law??

> Maybe you'll say, "How dare you ruin our game, you sick...." l0l
Lack of skill is really no problem whatsoever, don't feel bad about that. Lack of interest in learning how to play better would be the only sickening thing :P Hopefully the tips above help -- if any questions, or if clarification needed on those, feel free to ask.

Charis

Xrang - You only took 5 turns. Are you cutting your turn short? Remember that you can take 15.

Charis - Yup, this is the unmodified Brehon Law so it's got an MP of 4.

Xrang is having problems logging in so he emailed the save file to me. Garret's out for the forseable future (just has too much on his plate right now) so I've got the game for my turn.

Brit Isles version 9 was posted this morning. I've done some backwards compatability testing and have found no problems using games started as far back as version 4. In other words, if we want to, we can go to version 9. What's the general feeling of the players? Stay with 7 or go for 9? We've all got to play on the same version so it's got to be a concensus.

We should probable switch to version 9 of the mod, but it could mess things up with our economy and such...

This my (xrang) new screen name. My other one wasn't working(couldn't log in).:confused:

Never mind about consideration of moving to version 9. Two resources were added and since our map was built in V6, it doesn't have them anywhere. We will never get off our rock without hardwoods in V9 (required for all wooden ships except galley).

I had a good building turn with 3 palace improvements! I'm getting better at micromanaging, thanks to Charis and Grey Fox's examples.

We are so stuck on this rock. I lost 2 galleys in ocean exploration without finding anything promising. I've tracked our research towards Astronomy. We might get lucky with caravels.

My turn was cut a few rounds short due to simply running out of time.

Synopsis:

550 AD Dorsetshire switched from library to colloseum. The people there aren't exceptionally happy and would prefer circuses to bread. The Forest Preservation Society of Welwyn petitions the Ard Ri to protect their virgin woods. 4 working parties reasigned to the forests surrounding Loidis. Hrypis changed from Forbidden Palace to Courthouse construction. Heafuddne changed from harbor production to spearman production. As workers become available, some will be added to cities to make budgetary room for incoming war capable units. These in turn will be used to bolster the military police in large cities.

Check that. Heafuddne put back on harbor construction. There are enough overgarrisoned smaller cities to cover the MP requirements in the large ones, at least for now. Many garrison troops grumble as massive redeployments are ordered.

560 The desert village of Harpenden becomes a town overnight with the massive influx of incense hungry settlers. Much worker activity and minor coastal exploration. 7 units found fortified atop Mount Crumpet (southernmost tip of the Isle of Essex). Their general is given 40 lashes and the troops dispersed to nearby cities. The people add a wing to the palace.

570 Danmonii raiders sunk in a battle off the north coast. Two more units found vacationing on the beaches west of London. Officers from both units have been drawn and quartered and the units redeployed to city garrison duty. The manager of the Population Distribution Department is sacked as Harpenden suffers massive starvation due to overcrowding.

580 Coastal exploration proving unfruitful, dedicated crews begin positioning their galleys for best chance of suvival for deep sea exploration forays. Harpenden is back to its pre-meddling population and food production once again meets the populations' needs.

590 London and Loidis run out of things to build. London is at population capacity so works on workers so population can be redeployed to smaller cities. Loidis begins working on wealth.

600 We have learned currency and begin research into Philosophy. We learn that the Scotch city of Edinburgh has completed the Hanging Gardens - whatever those are. Enfield and Loidis begin work on public marketplaces. New constructions have beaten our budget into the red. Some entertainers and scientists changed to tax collecters to balance the budget. Still researching Philosophy in 4 turns. Went through the 1 shield yield cities and made some more taxmen. May want to change these to scientists after this research is complete.

610 The people add another wing to the palace.

620 Almost lost a galley due to forgetting that they only have a movement of 3 when you don't have the Lighthouse. Boy, do I miss that Lighthouse :cry:. There's a nice sea channel at the northeast corner of Essex. Volunteers have begun exploration.

630 Some beautiful towers are added to the palace. The northeastern sea channel turns out to be a dead end. Our feerless sea explorers make a mad rush for the coast. Research rate lowered and 5 taxmen turned to scientists. Change will net 8 more gold.

640 Polytheism in 7. Redistributed scientists/taxmen. Loidis has completed a marketplace and begins gathering a working party to add to another city. Our brave sailers were lost in treacherous waters.

650 Pirates sunk near Rickmansworth. London completes its marketplace and begins working on a population transfer team (worker). Influx of cash allows us to bump our science rate. Polytheism in 5.

660 A Desperate galley captain makes a run into the easten ocean. No new land is sighted.

680 The Sussex city of Lancing has completed the Art of War. Our scientists scratch their heads in confusion at the concept of "Feudalism". The captain of the galley exploring the eastern ocean has returned his ship to the coast! There is much rejoicing. Research is spiked to get Polytheism next turn.

690 Lost a galley due to forgetting that they only have a movement of 3 when you don't have the Lighthouse. Argh! We're out of the Ancient Age. Research set to make a beeline for Astronomy (Caravels). Budget balanced and specialists tweaked to give us Monotheism in 10.

Thoughts:
We're going to be on the rock and alone for a while. When we do meet the rest of civilization we're likely to be a dirt poor backwater with outdated units (our berzerkers will almost definately be outdated).

Might be good to get the Forbidden Palace going in the southeast somewhere. We'll likely need a very productive island kingdom and might need to steer away from the conquest angle. Maybe go diplomatic or spaceship?

We can pepper the desert with mini cities. It's a huge swath of desert and no city in there will likely ever need more than a few squares of territory. We can easily fit 10-15 cities in there, ungarrisoned, creating only culture builders. Each burg also allows 1 more free military unit under Brehon Law.

Charis, you're up.

I'd forget my head if it wasn't attached. Here's the save.

What version are we using? 6? I think I just deleted it. oops:lol:

I have the save, will play tonight (likely) or tomorrow.

As far as versions... I would have to imagine that it would serve the mod best if we upgraded to the new version. Otherwise Shaitan won't get the feedback he needs on the current version to continue to improve it.

On our economics, let's assume Brehon law will supply only 1 MP and try to get geared up for that over the next turn.

As for not having a resource... if you **need** a resource just to get off your island, that's unacceptable design. Needing it to get 'special' or better ships, that's fine. Any other resources besides hardwood? You could also, I imagine, edit the save file to add/remove resources? (Or ask another mod-designer not playing the game to do so?) Another option is to have 'later' and better techs not need the intermediate resource, like saltpeter. That also avoids getting into TOO deep a bind when a resource is short. (Thus map making lets you make the little ship, hardwood let's you make a better ship around the time of invention, a second nice hardwood ship at astronomy, then assume it's a common resource and not require it for any more ships once navigation is learned)

Charis

690 AD (0) - We really do need more to build! It's so wasteful to have London
and Loidos (20 shield cities) on Workers. There's still a bad palace bug.
Looking at Loidos it suggest it would take 200 turns of our 20 shield/turn
city to make a 400 shield structure! (Don't fix this until Welwyn gets
to pop out its wonder it's been sitting for eternity prebuilding in darkness)

We look so alone... good news though! F11 shows that we're ranked #1 in
land area. Also #1 in population and annual income, and #2 in gnp and
production. Our literacy is low. London is 3rd ranked city. Edinburgh seems
to be a super city with Pyramids, Hanging Gardens and Great Library. I do
see some sea currents south of Watford. If I get a chance I'll send a ship
down there.

Only one thing to change. A courthouse in Bradeford next to the capitol??
We'll get nothing out of it at all and pay maintenance for it. It's put
on Marketplace. On the off chance it reduces corruption from 1 to zero,
I'll restart it once the Marketplace done and nothing else to build.

700 AD (1) - 740 AD (5) Not too much...

BTW, we're in a *crucial* timeframe culture-wise. There is a 1000 year
'bonus' which doubles the culture/turn of such old buildings. So temples
and libraries pre-750 AD are HUGE. Why? The turn-year factor in 1750 drops
down to 2 yrs/turn. I just noticed we have some cities with colloseums and
*NO LIBRARY* and smaller ones with no temple... ack! :P This is also why
we got out of despotism WAY too early. We should have stayed there and popped
both temples and libraries from all these weenie desert towns, and done so
looooong before 750 AD. Alas, our treasury is too poor to buy-rush them now.
This may toss out chances for a cultural victory, hard to tell.
(We'll be fine, just pointing this out as a tip for future games)
Just noticed too we should have a fishing village north in corner near
Loidos and Welwyn.

750 AD (6) - Welingum founded on whale spot near Enfield. Dunemowe founded
NE of Loidos. Trafalgar Fishing Villa founded near London.

770 AD (8) - Vet gally heads for the sea current. I don't think it actually
opens into anything, but we need to find out.

800 AD (11) - Hmmm... a bug??! I sent a ship into the unknown in the South.
It ended up being ocean past the point of no return. And yet... it as a
galley did NOT sink. (800ad save file is included in the posted zip!) I can see sea,
and might drown there next turn, but if not I'll hit coast!?

810 AD (12) - The ocean-surviving galley was lost on the other side, in
the sea (shucks). It's a long trip to get to shore :(
Monotheism comes in, now we can start on Cathedrals all over in the big cities.

New Saebert is founded in the south not far from Dorsetshire. It can
borrow wheat from the latter, has some hills and a horse, and might make
a fair Forbidden Palace site, with its south-central location.

850 AD (16) - (Previous player took only 14 turns, so I'm evening up the
year again.) So how is our 'Palace' in Welwyn doing? 233 turns to complete
earlier, now 236 :P

It might be quiet for some time yet. Plod along, do what you can for the
economy, and hope we're "found" soon :P

Good luck,
Charis

I'll play sometime tomorrow...

Originally posted by xrang the II
What version are we using? 6? I think I just deleted it. oops:lol:

6.2 or 7

I'll email you 7 tonight.

Originally posted by Charis
As far as versions... I would have to imagine that it would serve the mod best if we upgraded to the new version. Otherwise Shaitan won't get the feedback he needs on the current version to continue to improve it.
Definitely would be better for the mod, if we can swing it.


As for not having a resource... if you **need** a resource just to get off your island, that's unacceptable design.
Wouldn't normally be a problem. Hardwood is as plentiful as horses. If the map had been built with hardwoods in the mod, there would be some on the island. On the other hand this could be a problem at the watery extreme (archipelago, 80% water). I may add a tiki at the same time as caravel becomes available (short masted ship but boyant and relatively save for sea travel). No resources required, speed 2, carry 1, sea travel okay. Nobody in their right mind would build one if they didn't have to but it does give you a chance to get off of the island if you are stuck there without hardwoods. Have it upgrade to caravel so you'll never even see it unless you need it.


Needing it to get 'special' or better ships, that's fine. Any other resources besides hardwood?
Stone is the other resource added. Required for walls, cathedral and colloseum.


You could also, I imagine, edit the save file to add/remove resources? (Or ask another mod-designer not playing the game to do so?)
Not sure. I've never tried the save game editors. I'll look into it.


Another option is to have 'later' and better techs not need the intermediate resource, like saltpeter. That also avoids getting into TOO deep a bind when a resource is short. (Thus map making lets you make the little ship, hardwood let's you make a better ship around the time of invention, a second nice hardwood ship at astronomy, then assume it's a common resource and not require it for any more ships once navigation is learned)
Maybe add a schooner at invention...
Do you think this would be necessary with the addition of a tiki?


There's still a bad palace bug. Looking at Loidos it suggest it would take 200 turns of our 20 shield/turn city to make a 400 shield structure!
Annoying, isn't it? It's clear back to version 4 too and I haven't been able to isolate the cause. It's still on the list of things to fix. The palace has a variable cost increasing with the number of cities, introduced in the 1.16 patch. The result is you never know how many shields it actually will take to complete the palace. In a game I'm finishing up right now it would take Dubris with 135 shield/turn output a frightening 57 turns to finish a new palace. That's over 7,600 shields for a palace. Ouch.


I sent a ship into the unknown in the South.
It ended up being ocean past the point of no return. And yet... it as a galley did NOT sink
Not a bug. There's a chance of sinking in sea and a much larger one for sinking in ocean but sometimes you just luck out. :)

I'll see what can be done to upgrade our game to be V9 compatible. Actually, with the new patch coming out on Friday I'll need to put out a V10 for patch compatibility and I'll try to get our game compatible to that.

I think I'm going too play soon, which version should I use?
I'll start playing now, I'm using the same version I used last time I played, I think it was 6.2 or something...

You should really add the Version number inside the text file... :)

Originally posted by Grey Fox
I think I'm going too play soon, which version should I use?
Same as we have been - either 6.2 or 7.

I might be interested in doing some graphics or help you with the mod in any way I can... just give me something to do and I'll see what I can do.


I'm doing some mighty Tweaking this turn too! :D

(Currently raising our research speed by one turn, losing only 4 gold, from +3 to -1)

Well I'm in a tough position, Shall I switch to Sistine chapel?

or shall I wait for Copernicus, Sistine's Cost 600 Shields and when I switch we loose 400 Shields...

Copernicus costs only 400 shields....


Quick responses please

Originally posted by Grey Fox
I might be interested in doing some graphics or help you with the mod in any way I can... just give me something to do and I'll see what I can do.
I could definitely use some graphics help! I'm working on resource specific city improvements. You know how you need Iron and Coal in order to build the Ironworks? Well, I'm making one city improvement for each of the (24) resources. Here's my working plan:

Resource-Improvement---Cost--Upkeep--Culture--Effect
Horse-----Stable------------100-----1--------3-----makes 1 content
Wines-----Winery------------100-----1--------3-----makes 1 content
Incense---Pagoda------------100-----1--------3-----makes 1 content
Gems------Gem cutter--------100-----1-------------- +50% tax revenue
Spice-----Apothecary--------100-----1-------------- +50% tax revenue
Silk------Clothier----------100-----1-------------- +50% tax revenue
Furs------Tannery-----------100-----1-------------- +50% tax revenue
Cattle----Ranch-------------100-----1-------------- +50% tax revenue
Fish------Fishing Fleet-----100-----1-------------- +50% tax revenue
Game------Chalet/Lodge------100-----1-------------- +50% tax revenue
Gold------Jeweler-----------100-----1-------------- +50% tax revenue
Whales----Whaling Fleet-----100-----1-------------- +50% tax revenue
Dyes------Stained Glass-----100-----1-------------- +50% tax revenue
Ivory-----Carver------------100-----1-------------- +50% tax revenue
Wheat-----Grist Mill--------100-----1-------------- +50% tax revenue
Saltpeter-Illuminators------120-----2--------1-----Makes 2 content
Uranium---Radiology Center--180-----3--------1-----Makes 3 content
Iron------Smithy------------240-----3-------------- +50% production
Coal------Mine--------------240-----3-------------- +50% production
Hardwood--Mill--------------240-----3-------------- +50% production
Stone-----Quarry------------240-----3-------------- +50% production
Aluminum--Machinery---------240-----3-------------- +50% production
Oil-------Rig---------------240-----3-------------- +50% production
Rubber----Tire Factory------240-----3-------------- +50% production

If you could do graphics for any of these improvements, that would be fantastic!

Originally posted by Grey Fox
Well I'm in a tough position, Shall I switch to Sistine chapel?

or shall I wait for Copernicus, Sistine's Cost 600 Shields and when I switch we loose 400 Shields...

Copernicus costs only 400 shields....


Quick responses please

Sistine! Definitely go for Sistine Chapel. Kicks but all over Copernicus.

I might even use 3D Studio MAX for those things, might not be needed though!

Well I seem to be busy in the future!

Those improvements have to be in the city radius right?


You could skip some of them and make some that needs two different like another small wonder, like cattle and wheat and make it produce 100% extra food... would we be able to get 40/50+ cities or what...



I built the Sistine by the way

Originally posted by Grey Fox
Those improvements have to be in the city radius right?
Yup. The resource has to be in the city radius in order to build the improvement. I envision certain cities known for their magnificent horses, others for fantastic wines, etceteras. If any city is lucky enough to build the Ironworks it will be a truly powerful production center as it will also be able to build an iron smithy and coal mine.

Originally posted by Grey Fox
You could skip some of them and make some that needs two different like another small wonder, like cattle and wheat and make it produce 100% extra food... would we be able to get 40/50+ cities or what...
New minor wonders are planned for stage two that will use the combo resource plan. I like that tie in for wheat and cattle.

1: 850 AD
Some changes in some cities gave us one faster turn research, what I did was to change citizens that worked on Tiles that generates extra shields, not needed or extra food not needed, to become scientists or work on a coastal tile which generates 2 Gold. If we would have raised the Science level by 10% our income would be -30 per turn, and we would get the next tech in 5 turns. My tweaking does the same thing as that, but with only a loss of 1 per turn. So instead of making 3 Gold per turn and getting Theology in 6 Turns, we get the tech in 5 turns and we loose 1 G/Turn.

860-880 AD
Worker management, and some installations of improvement. (And some tweaking, of course...)

5: 890 AD
Our Scienists learn Theology and we switch the production Sistine Chapel if we can in the city producing palace... Or capital is used to produce settlers to settle the vast desert in the hopes of generating some unit upkeep... And I also made it possible for the city northwest of our capital to work on two of the cows London was working on, as they wasn't needed.

6: 900 AD
Sistine Chapel built. Our galley was lost in the eastern oceans.

9: 930 AD
Another Galley is lost down south.

11: 950 AD
Built the town of Borehamwood close to Hatfield, in the desert.
Our two settler factories, stops for the moment, 'cus our economy suffered severely by the people transfer. The city Greyhamwood is founded close to Enfield and the capital.

12: 970
Greypool is founded, close to the other cow city, in the northeast.

15: The Palace is expanded, the emperor laughs as he realize the people has built a strange looking palace for him...

A palace is being built in Loisis and is supposed to be switched to University when we get Education in 2 turns, and the same thing goes for Hrypis who is building F.Palace (22 Turns left, could be a good place to put it... down south there is only desert citys, that are only good for pop-rushing berzerkers at a medium speed...), my thought was that we should switch that to university when it becomes available, but to me it seems like a good position for the F.P...


I'll start on some of the improvement-graphics right away.

And by the way, Berzerkers will surely last trough out the hole this era and a little longer...

together with a pikeman or musketman it will be quite effective...

Grey Fox,

One of the changes in the new patch is removing bonus resources from the prerequisites. I'm not sure if they mean just units or both units and improvements. If you start working on these now, hold off on the ones dependent upon bonus resources (gold, wheat, cows, etc.)

Grey Fox

Feel free to do any of the improvements, even bonus resources. If necessary, I'll be turning bonus res into lux or strat res so they can be used. I was going to avoid this because it would add too many trading elements but it was pointed out to me that these are so plentiful that they wouldn't generally be traded at all.

Also, someone had a better idea for the "gold" improvement. That will be changed to a mint instead of a jeweler and we'll move jeweler to "gems" to replace the gem cutter. Also, "wheat" will change from grist mill to brewery :beer:

Xrang

You're up bud. Are you taking the game?

All
Making little progress with fitting our game to V9. There is a crash that is likely a UU problem with one of the changed units between V7 and V9. I'll keep working on it.

Palace bug found! It's not a problem with the mod at all. The flexible cost structure of the palace is 3 times to high. Base cost set in the editor is 40 (equals 400 shields). Flex cost is multiplying this by 3 when you have 2 cities and increasing as you get more cities. This makes the minimum cost of the palace 1200 shields. This can't be represented in the city display, therefore the display error with only one column showing.

Could someone please verify this for me in a non-mod game? Just start up a game, build a second city and see what the shield cost of the palace will be. It should be 1200 if I'm right.

Originally posted by Shaitan
Grey Fox

Feel free to do any of the improvements, even bonus resources. If necessary, I'll be turning bonus res into lux or strat res so they can be used. I was going to avoid this because it would add too many trading elements but it was pointed out to me that these are so plentiful that they wouldn't generally be traded at all.

Also, someone had a better idea for the "gold" improvement. That will be changed to a mint instead of a jeweler and we'll move jeweler to "gems" to replace the gem cutter. Also, "wheat" will change from grist mill to brewery :beer:


We should probably change version on the next game, if everyone feels like playing a new game after this one.

A question: What is mint, or a Gold Mint? Do you mean mine?

I'm thinking the same thing about the versions. It looks like I'll have to get rid of most of the changes in V9 in order to get this game to work so not too much benefit in doing it.

A mint is where they make currency (coins).

I'm taking the game, do i use the new patch, V9? whats a'haps?
please tell me before i play... :p :mad:

I didn't...

Originally posted by Grey Fox
I didn't...
does that pertain to me? I don't think so...:rolleyes:

i sent you a pm...

Same version of British Isles, same version of Civ.

If you already did the 1.17 Civ patch, go ahead and play. Just keep an eye out for any wierdness and let me know about it.

i'm playing bi v6.2 and the new patch :D

Xrang, it's been way over 24 hours since you picked up the game. If you played, please post. If not we need to pass you to keep this thing in motion.

Charis, please go next. I'm heading to Tennessee for the day tomorrow so won't be able to play. If Xrang has posted his game by the time you read this then take it. If he hasn't, please take your turn with the last save posted by Grey Fox. The palace bug was indeed my fault. Base cost for the palace was supposed to go to 10 in the 1.16 patch but I missed it. It's fixed in V10 which updates to the 1.17 patch (should be posted on Monday).

Grey Fox, the resource specific improvements will have to be small wonders as the flag to force resources in the city radius is only available for wonders. This just means we'll need wonder splash graphics as well as the normal improvement graphics. If Charis posts his game any time tomorrow then feel free to take it as I won't be able to play until Monday morning.

My ISP goes down tonight at midnight. It's (cough) supposed (cough) to be up at noon tomorrow, but... we'll see.

I'll check back in when I'm back online, but hope xrang can finish his turn and post before then.

Good luck! ;)
Charis

I was playing last night and in the middle of the game my pc crashed (It isn't the BEST!). Sorry I couldn't do it. At least I attempted. Grey Fox could you pick up the slack. Again, I'm very SORRY!:o :cry:

I don't think it should be me playing again... I think I will wait until you all (or at least 2 of you) can play.

Sorry for any inconvenience. I found a sliver of time to play. I hope you didn’t get too nervous. I played a full 15 Turn game so I didn’t waste your time. Thanks!

Turn 1, 1010 AD
Heafuddene completed Marketplace, production changed to Cathedral. Bradeford completed Cathedral production changed to Wealth (nothing improvement-wise to do...). Cultural influence expanding...Worker management. London completes Settler, it is sent to Welingum(?). More Worker management. 2 Spearmen Fortify in Dearthington..

Turn 2, 1020 AD
We’ve discovered Education, we are trying to learn Astronomy. Cultural influence expanded, again. Worker management. Dearthington built Galley, production changed to University (?). What should I do with the Galley? I make it ‘explore’. Worker management.

Turn 3, 1030 AD
Watford built Temple, production changed to Library. Worker managment.. Settler joins Welingum.

Turn 4, 1040 AD
Southanptom completes Courthouse, production is set to University. Stanstead Abbots produced Aqueduct, we’re working on Marketplace. More Worker management. Galley ‘exploration’.

Turn 5, 1050 AD
More Worker management. Galley movement. Unit movement.

Turn 6, 1060 AD
THE EAST ANGLICAN HAVE BEEN DESTROYED?! WHOA! Worker management.

Turn 7, 1070 AD
We have information that the Briton city of Brest has completed a great project, Leonardo’s Workshop! Worker management (that line is getting old). Dorsetshire completed Courthouse, producing University. Astronomy in 7 turns, +4 gold p/t. Some city micromanagement (not Grey Fox quality but...).

Turn 8, 1080 AD
Dunemowe produced Aqueduct, now Library. We love the King day celebrated in Trafalgar Fishing Villa (must be doing something right...). Worker management....

Turn 9, 1090 AD
Astronomy in 6 TURNS! Trafalgar Fishing Villa finished Aqueduct, now Library. Management of Workers (that has a nice ring to it lol).

Turn 10, 1100 AD
Hatfield produced Colosseum, now University. Greyhamwood completed Temple, now Marketplace. Weligum Granary, now Harbor. Some civil disorder in Geypool (!), took care of it though. London completed University, now Wealth.

Turn 11, 1030 AD
Enfield created University, Wealth. Welwyn Cathedral, University. Unit movement, worker you know what.

Turn 12, 1140 AD
Galley movement, unit movement. Nothing interesting.

Turn 13, 1150 AD
ASTRONOMY!!!!! WE’RE OFF TO THE BRAVE NEW WORLD(great book btw, get it today!). Researching now Navigation. Hempstead production changed to Caravel. Same Colneceastre. And the same for Welingum.

Turn 14, 1160 AD
Worker management. Galley movement (should I abandon it?). That’s it!

Turn 15, 1170 AD
Worker stuff. THAT’S ALL FOLKS!! :goodjob:

Saitan, I just got back online just before bed here, so I won't beat you to it for tomorrow night. Go ahead and keep the order, I'll go after you.

In our rbd games, Xrang, we got so tired of saying More Movement/Management of Workers that it got abbreviated...

MMOW ;)

good luck,
Charis

ic, thanx for the heads ^(;) right back at u):lol:

Okay, I've got the game and will post by tomorrow morning. Looks like we might get off the rock! Woo hoo!!!

Don't forget the East Anglicans have been destroyed...doesn't that mean there must be a more (undoubtedly) powerful Civ out there?lol nrn...:lol:

there* (correction), i can't edit for someodd reason so i did it the old way :lol:

Had an excellent turn. We've made contact with 7 other civs and are almost at technological parity. I ran out of time this morning so the last turn is incomplete and I only took 13 turns. Had a burp on my FTP server so I couldn't upload the screen shot either. I'll get that going tonight and post our revealed map.

Timeline details:
1170 Hrypis changed from FP to Copernicus (due in 12). Caravels purchased in Colneceaster and Hempstead. Welwyn and Salsbury changed to caravel. Caravel expedition will begin next turn with 4 ships. Many city tweaks to production, science, entertainment, food and taxes.

1180 Worker/city management. Begining to explore seas safely. Caravels will still have to risk ocean voyages but they'll get a much better start than the galleys. Last galley heads to Southampton for upgrade.

1190 Bloody hell. (Seems like) 100 workers just finished off a mountain west of Hrypis. They've been scattered to the south and west to work on desert terrain.

1200 Plans are drawn up to trim back our worker force. We are just about completely developed now. If we pump 20 or so into towns we will be able to save a load on our military budget and crank up our research significantly.

1210 First caravel lost in treacherous waters. He'd almost made it to the sea lane to our south east.

1220 Second caravel lost in treacherous waters. Made excellent progress in exploring the ocean to the west. Four ships remain in the Essex fleet. Will one of them escape the sandy confines of our island home?

1230 Sea waters found due west of Essex! Will our brave caravel survive to reach them? They've already beaten the odds getting as far as they have.

1240 Third caravel lost in treacherous waters to the northeast. Our valiant sailors have survived the westward journey and have landed on the shores of Sussex. Aelle of the Sussex is polite enough but he holds our science in contempt. They are remarkably more advanced than we are (we're behind by 6 primary techs, probably close to a dozen techs overall). We lack the funds to purchase these technologies at the moment. Aelle is also well traveled and will be able to introduce us to many other peoples, for a price. We elect to do our own exploring at this point. The Sussex empire is rated as higher than Essex in power but our culture is greater (as is our Score). We swap territory maps with Aelle and our caravel begins making a northerly circuit around the immense lands of Sussex.

Sussex is an island kingdom a bit larger than Essex. It also kicks our ass as far as prime real estate is concerned.

1250 SOSO (Same Old, Same Old - city management, worker tasks, movement)

1255 A caravel has survived the trip to the blue water at our south east!

1260 Fourth caravel casualty. This one sinks in waters to the north east. The blue water to the south east turns out to be just a patch of relatively shallow ocean. Our sailors prepare to brave the wild oceans again. Workers without jobs are being sent to Bradeford where they'll be retrained for settlement tasks. We can fill in another dozen or so desert villas.

1265 Aelle complains about our caravel's presence in his waters. We promise to move them along. He still wants far too much for any contacts or technologies. We'll have Navigation in two turns which will allow us to trade our bountiful spice reserves. Sussex doesn't have Navigation yet either so we'll also have a good tech for trading. Enfield, Hatfield and London switch from wealth production to horsemen. These new troops will be needed for garrison duty in some of our growing towns.

1270 Hrypis has completed Copernicus' Observatory!

1275 We've discovered Navigation and begin studying Music Theory. This will give us JS Bach's Cathedral in Loidis.We purchase contacts with the Scots, Irish, Cornish and Welsh for Navigation, Spice, a load of cash and our World map. Our world map has only Sussex and Essex on it right now so it's not a big concern bartering it.

We contact the other civilizations in their order of decreasing importance. From Robert the Bruce of Scotland we get Music Theory, Feudalism, Printing Press and contact with the Bretons and Manx. From Brian Boru of Ireland we get Chivalry, Engineering, The Republic and Monarchy. Llewellyn ap Iorwerth of Wales gives us Invention and some gold for Navigation. He is the first foreigner we have met who is cautious instead of polite (this proves to be a trend as all of the rest are cautious too). We get Gunpowder, Incense and Chemistry from John Betlesworth of Cornwall. He gets spice and saltpeter. Brittany has Banking, Physics and Metalurgy but their asking prices are an insult. They devalue our maps and technology to the point of rudeness. We get Metalurgy from the Manx.

Voila! We are nearly technically current.

We are now researching Banking. JS Bach's Cathedral will be finished in Loidis in 8 turns. Welwyn will have Magellan's voyage in 20. I think we're in great shape for Bach and decent shape for Magellan. We've got the Palace available to switch to if another civ beats us to one of them.

I reset all of our specialists to workers, balanced the budget and founded the city of Sancte Albanes Stow in the desert. This is where I had to stop. All of the cities need to be retweaked for growth (or non-growth), production and specialists.

There should be one more civ on an island somewhere. The ocean between Essex and Sussex is the most likely spot. Also, there's a lot of ocean around our island so there's a fair chance we'll be able to find a small island continent (or that last civ). When we do find that civ, they will be our *****. They'll be so technologically backwards that we'll be able to do whatever we want to or with them (as long as we don't trade contact to them). I recommend preparing an invasion fleet and taking them out hard and fast as soon as they're discovered.

Second to last note - Embassies should be a priority. Embassies equal ROP agreements, equals friendly civs, equals better deals and cheaper alliances if needed. Our island's entire habitable area is covered so we can use ROP as liberally as desired.

Last note - I don't like Brittany. Not at all. Every other civ was at least reasonable. Essex pride has been injured.

A *most* excellent turn! :hammer:

Super job on the tech trading, they were just pouring in, wtg :goodjob:

If Britanny wants some, tell them to COME GET SOME!
They check the annals of ancient history and find it littered with the wreckage of civs who showed disrepect to the mighty Essex!!

I think I'm up, hope to get to it tonight, if not... tomorrow.

We'll want a decent worker force to railroad our homeland, then they're truly done. At least we got in a massive worker force generated before the patch killed that strategy. Very likely some can go, but don't decimate them quite yet, Steam Power is not far way :P

Charis

Yup, you're up Charis.

I couldn't fit very many workers into cities. Most are at or near capacity already. There are a handful heading up to Bradeford to join that city as settlers are made. That'll be a slow reduction though - averages under 1 worker per turn.

Actually, decimate is close to what I was looking for (as in the original Roman meaning - eliminate 1 in every 10). :)

A headzup on Brittany - They'll be the power to watch soon. The Brethon UU (the Sarrisa) is a pikeman upgrade that WILL defeat a Berzerker. Fortunately there are no Normans (their Chevalier UU is a cavalry upgrade) unless they are the undiscovered civ (in which case they'll be quite far away from cavalry and easy pickings).

ALL I CAN IS BRING ON THE INVASION FLEET (S)!!!! AND SUSSEX YOUR DAYS ARE NUMBERED! :lol: ::i don't always act like this...:::king:

Seems like an waiting invasion is up!

Just keep those soldiers coming! Slice 'em, chop 'em, squash 'em!

AMEN! Sorry, um, GOOD LUCK!

Shaitan,

Oops, you forgot to post your save file. Put that up and I'll
play it tomorrow.

:hammer:
Charis

PS one thought for your 'mod' thread -- post a list of all the UU's, what they replace, and their special abilities/stats. I was at work trying to see what the UU's would be of what we're about to face, and couldn't find that info easily.

Originally posted by Charis
Shaitan,

Oops, you forgot to post your save file. Put that up and I'll
play it tomorrow.
Crappy. I put it on a floppy to post it from work and it turns out the floppy is toast so it didn't post. I'll get the file up as soon as I can get my wife to mail it to me.

I just wanted to say that I have made one of the improvements on the list. The Stable.

You can see a quick render here:

http://medieteknik.bth.se/frst01/StableRender.jpg

More, details will be added... and it seems like my settings on my stationary PC is a little dark because the picture is awful light on my laptop...:scan: is it light on your comps too?

Happy Civing!

Awesome!

The stable color looks perfect. The grass might be a little bright but that might just be because there's a large field. Great work Grey Fox!

Charis, Brehon Law in the new version is working great. It's a great in-betweener for Republic and Monarchy now. Side benefit of communal corruption is you can build the Forbidden Palace in a reasonable amount of time. Thanks for helping to iron this out!

I've added civ descriptions to the Brit Isles mod thread. I edited the second post so it's right up near the top. It's appropos of the current version but the only UU change has been the Kent Falconer so should be fine for this game. Many of the civ specific abilities are different between this version and as posted on that thread - all of the germanics are Expansionist/Militaristic in our game.

Here's the save for you.

The line of the aged Charis O'Saebert clan stepped forth, and in wonder
did note they were no longer alone in the world!! There was surely life
beyond the little island we call home :)

Bottom line: This 15-round turn I built the Forbidden Palace,
snagged two wonders when we should have lost both, and started
Wall Street even though we started the turn just starting to research
banking. Also, the treasury has gone from not-enough-to-upgrade-a-spear
to over 1000 next turn, with 30 gold/turn income from other civs. We also
have cavalry and musketmen. Even found the last civ and established
embassies with ALL. This is a very informative post, if I say so myself.
Grab a cup of coffee and enjoy :crazyeyes:

The Britons seemed to be those the advisors disliked. And so puny, with just
seven cities to their name. Our great island put all others to shame. All
but Sussex that is. :grr: A full six nations vied for power in the western
hemisphere, while Sussex, clearly military expanionists (takes one to know one!),
took over the central hemisphere. Prophets felt there was one more ocean civ
waiting to be found. Our science advisor thought us backward. And yet we were but
a few techs away from a glorious new era. Our treasury was weak, and it was hoped
banking would help there. We had a standing army very appropriate for our
government, so thoughts at further worker consolidation were quickly squashed.
spearman the best defender? That would not last, although depending on our
plans, Rifles might be fine to wait for. Wonder wise, we're trying for two in
non-capitol, good deal folks. Er... wait. *Ten* excess food in a city building
a wonder in a tight race???? Mine, men, mine I say!! Looks like someone filled
in a few cities too, good job.

I talk to the foreign leaders, meeting them for the first time. Briton is,
as hinted at, arrogant to the max. He and his people will be punished for
their insolence. The timing... hard to say. The Sussex are equally arrogant.
No one can/will take our excess incense? Do these fools have no harbors?? Sigh...

Judging by all these and the histogram, Sussex is by FAR our biggest rival
and risk. We must gear up to face them, establish a beachhead, and take over
their island. But they're ahead of us, AND have Mil tradition, and we have no
infrastructure, not even a single knight, and no defenders better than a spear,
so that time is not anytime soon. Briton will fall, but to go after them now
would likewise be simply foolish. The Brehon committee decides anyone thinking
this was a time for war was thinking with a part of his anatomy other than
that which lies above the neck! This will be a reign of building...

1275 AD (0) - A number of libraries under construction, a good start. Egads,
we've still not got all temples built?! :P Building Knights? Nay, we have
11 horse that we need CASH to upgrade to knights, let's built marketplaces.
Hmm... can we upgrade?? At first I think, "Uh oh, Saitan... we have a bug! I
can't seem to upgrade *anything*!" Then I realize we're just too poor, with
less than 80 in the treasury. Next turn I see upgrade to Knight is 100, 80 to
musketman.

Hmmmm... no forbidden palace. Either we wait about 700 years (not good since
it's almost 1300 already) and build in Sussex or we start NOW and get one
going! In the South of our Island our max-shield city and best chance is
very clear... Southhampton. It's got one turn left to University. Perfect!!
I'll take that as an insightful placeholder :P About half done then, and
sixteen more turns to finish. Four excess food at size 4, I move workers
around and steal a tile from Dorsetshire. Speaking of Dorsetshire, holy cow!
*16* excess food??? Mine mine mine mine mine! :hammer: :D
See, I want my worker corp back already, there is a TON of mining to do.
Down to 14 turns to the FP - sweet, within my realm :P
Another micromgmnt tip. London is cranking out 18 shields/turn. Everything
needs a multiple of 10 or 20 to build. So for an 60 turn musket it's 4 turns
vs 3, for a 33% increase in production if you can get 2 more shields/turn!
We do that, taking back the cattle square rightfully belonging to London
away from the fishing village. (Don't let the peon cities steal from the
mega cities!) Same idea in Enfield. (Hatfield, for example has 12 shields and
two lost for '10' actual, perfect.) In Welwyn, we stop the peon city of
Dunemowe from stealing the super iron-hill and cut Magellan production time
from 20 to 15! Dunemowe is found guilty of another crime!! It's stealing
not only from London, but from Loidos, which is working on Bach. Bach is HUGE
for our island! I cut the remaining time from 8 turns down to 6, I hope it's
enough. If I can get a miner there I can probably cut it one more.

Wow! Can this be right? *ZERO* artillery?? If you have time, check out
recent progress in our rbd5 and 'infantry' succession games. Artillery just
rocks, used properly. (Pardon the shameless plug) I've cut back science to
build up cash. Given we're 2-3 techs behind and EVERYONE else has the missing
techs, we can buy them at 1/2 the cost to research them ourselves if we
build up some money. Even better if they build harbors and we can get caught
up with incense.

Ok, that's enough "pre"-turn, let's rock.

1280 AD (1) - A half dozen cities go WLTK and they expand the palace!
I start moving workers into position to mine. That's about it...

1285 AD (2) - Ah, some of the AI have built harbors. Let's get Briton
dependent on our (cough) incense and burn his treasury. World Map, 9 gold
and 9 gpt is the cost. The Isle of Man gives us the secrets of cavalry for
a mere 5 gpt and some incense. (See, why research it yourself at a price
like that?) Wales gives us Banking for 180 gold, 5 gpt and incense.

1290 AD (3) - Salt Lake City founded on a river next to the Saltpeter mid-
continent.

1295 AD (4) - Bretons start Newton's University (so they have Gravity),
and the Irish, Bach's, the Manx, Magellan's.

1300 AD (5) - Irish start Magellan's, and Sussex, Newton and Magellan.
Things heat up. Herlawe (fishing village) is founded South of Enfield.

1305 AD (6) - JS Bach's cathedral arrives!!! :hammer: Phew! I don't know
if that was close or not but I'm glad I could chop off several turns, with
so many trying to build it. Two content citizens for every city in our
homeland is great. We can slip in a Bank and University here before starting
its next wonder. (About 8 AI cities change from Bach to something else)

Speaking of wonders... Magellan's seems to be a recent start, with
restrictions on what can build it. Our chances to finish it are good.
Newton's everyone is going for and someone will get, no big loss. That
will finish the Industrial age cascade. We DEFINITELY want Theory of Evo,
which will give us Atomic and Electronics and guarantee Hoover as well.
If we can get Suffrage too, so much the better. We'll be sure to have two
placeholders lined up for those soon.

Embassies did you say? Established now in Scotland (Edinburgh with three
wonders and a five musket defense!), Sussex (Brighton, with decent items
and units, but only 8 shields/turn), Briton (Brest, with a big stack of
musket, building a cav, having Leo's, and 22 shields/turn production),
and Ireland with 11 sh/turn production. Rights of Passage now! One with
Briton is worth 5gpt, but I ask for Physics and give 11 gpt, a decent deal.
Scotland for RoP gives a discount on furs, 25 gpt. This saves us in luxury
tax *60* gpt. Ireland is too poor to compensate us, so I pass. Sussex is
bigger than us and would charge for Right Of Passage... no thanks.
The embassies pay for them self immediately.

We have five banks due in 8 turns, then we can start Wall Street and collect
our 50 gpt interest by maintaining 1000 gold in our treasury.

1310 AD (7) - WLTKD is celebrated throughout the land! I guess the folks like
their new imported furs! Another embassy in Manx- Douglass is set to complete
Magellan in 8 turns! (15 shield/turn production) They already have the Colossus
and the Great Lighthouse, the other 'river city' wonders. We're also set to
complete Magellan in 8, and go first!!!!

:hammer:

We'll beat them by LESS than one turn. If this doesn't show the importance
of maximizing production in your wonder city by worker movement and mining
squares, even if already irrigated... I don't know what does!
Manx is too poor to afford an RoP, btw.

1320 AD (9) - Another palace expansion...

Aha! I see purple culture boundaries with our South Sea caravel! It's the
people of Kent! They seem nice enough, but boy, are they backward! They
give us all they have, world map, 19 gold, and 11 gpt, for Monotheism.
They also lack Monarchy, Republic and Gunpowder. In 20 turns or when they
get more cash we can trade them another tech :P They have a TON of silks,
so as soon as others meet them, they'll be exporters. Well, that is if the
silly folks ever build a harbor and find a route :( The Kent people are
SE of Sussex, so their backwardness is the fault of the Sussex people. In fact,
the Sussex have an expansion Isle of three cities just NW of Kent.

Now... if our next leader happens to be bent on conquest... we could likely
take over the whole island of six cities and SEVEN silks without much
problem, given they have no gunpowder. Just crank out about a dozen cavalry
and go. Heck, our berzerkers might be able to do it. Do **NOT** sell our
World Map or communication to other civs! They would then have first crack
at conquest and/or trade there.

Three more embassies. Cornwall at Bodmine, which is producing Newton's and
will be finished around time my turn is up, with 13 shields/turn output.
Aha! They're in anarchy at the moment, switching govt no doubt. They could
lose Newton doing that, silly AI. (Production will be 18 post-anarchy)
Wales, Caerphilly is working on a bank at 12/turn. Decent garrison.
Final embassy for Kent, at Canterbury. Nice 19 shield/turn production.
Holy cow!!! Never mind that quick conquest idea! They have a garrison of
11 units, mostly pike. If you do go, get their before gunpowder!!! (And
bring the cavs and cannon, not just berzerkers)

1325 AD (10) - Oh, an island not far from us! Ugh! Four squares, pure tundra.
Well, a whale anyway. Let's found it. (If that Irish ship also next to it
doesn't have a settler anyway)

1330 AD (11) - Manx has learned Democracy. For an RoP they'll pay 5 gpt.
Britons, Cornwall, Sussex also have Democracy and Gravity. Scotland, Wales
have Gravity only. Ireland neither. We get Democracy from Manx and sell to
Scotland and Wales. Pay 95 gold and 18 gpt, get Gravity, 16 gold, 5 gpt.
Net: Two good techs for under 350 gold :P Everyone must be studying
Magnetism now, nobody seems to have it. We'll can either buy it last or
buy it 2nd and sell to everyone, if they have the means to pay.

Been running science at zero pretty much my whole turn, with one scientist.
Yet we've learned five techs and are doing great financially!

1335 AD (12) - Drats. Ireland lands on the ice rock island. Fine, they can
build it to max size then we'll crush them and take it over. They're so
dirt poor something is wrong in that country...

1340 AD (13) - Loidos finishes its bank and starts Wall Street. I adjust to
get the 'magic' 20 shields/turn and it's due in 20 instead of 22 turns.

Sheesh!! The Irish found on the island, but NOT on the square that can
reach the whale! If I were a betting man, I would bet there is OIL on
the square they have founded. Either that or the AI truly is dumber than
imaginable. In their current location the city must be razed someday,
not captured, so we can re-found next door at whale station.
We're seeing more ships now, btw, buzzing about the area. None look mean
intentioned yet.

1345 AD (14) - Forbidden Palace is BUILT! :hammer: [dance]
We go from paltry shield production to the following in the South:
22 shields/turn, no waste in Southhampton. 15 at Dorsetshire, 13 (net 10)
in Salsbury. No more 1/turn on our southern coastal cities.

Bodmine, the city we saw earlier, just now completed Newton's. (I knew
that one was lost)

1350 AD (15) - With a deep, deep breath and a drumroll...

Magellan's Voyage is completed in Welwyn. :party:

(I was starting to get nervous and doubt that we would in fact go before
Manx, who was also due to finish it this turn.) The wonder cascade comes
crashing down. The dozen cities trying for Newtons and Magellans are toast.
Only the Scots manage to escape, starting Smith's.

Time to recheck diplomacy. Kent has his silks online, and we take him up
on them to make our people more happy, for Monarchy and about 6 gpt.
Briton will trade Econ for a paltry 130 gold, not bad. But Wales will give
it up for Iron (we have 4 extra) so we take the latter. Heck, they'll
throw in 5 gpt. Cornwall will pay for a RoP decently. But with a ship
RIGHT on our shore, I'll let our next leader do that in a few turns. Well,
no one was studying magnetism afterall, rather, the side-tech, Econ.
Three or so civs had it, so let's broker.

With Econ, Loidos and London switch roles, Loidos taking a head start on
Smiths, due in 28 (make that 26 after some tile rearrangement -- we're a good
bet to get it, but not by much. Production is net 22/turn) London will finish
Wall Street in 18.

- Trafalgar fishing village is your K-mart for expansion! It's got a galley,
settler, two workers, musket, and cav, all sitting ready to deploy. (They
were started for whale island near us, before Irish hit it. No rush on
taking the latter)

- Hatfield is worker lounge. I'm done mining finally, so they're hanging
out until we learn Steam Power. After that, man-o-man will they be busy!

- Dunemowe only appears to have a food shortage. When it completes its
harbor next turn, it will be surplus.

- Sell Cornwall an RoP in a few turns after he pulls away from our shore.

Good luck,
Charis

Charis left 1000 gold in the treasury??? Amazing. :)

Fantastic run Charis! We're getting up into the catbird seat now. Any thoughts on what victory to pursue? Domination/Conquest will have to go through Sussex. For culture we'll probably have to axe them as well. We've got some excellent production cities so spaceship is a definite possibility and we've made an excellent start on manipulating the world for diplo. So, as I see it all options are still open to us but some will require removal of Sussex.

Sorry about the blanked city management. I ran out of time before I could go through them.

Great Run Charis!

About that fishing City, I think it was I who made them work on the Cows, but that was only temporarly to make the city grow, and build it's first improvements...

Must have forgotten to move the "peons" (citizens?), or didn't need to...

Grey Fox, you're up now. Can you grab the game and post that you're going?

Thanks

No response from Grey Fox. Xrang, please pick up the game and take your turn. Grey Fox, you can go after Xrang.

Strange, I didn't get any notification of your post on this thread...

Must have been because of the Forum Down-Time yesterday.

I can play now if it's okay?

Sure, play now. I didn't even think about the forum going down yesterday.

By the way, you don't have to wait for me to post to take your turn. As soon as Charis posts you can take it. Same for you, Xrang - as soon as Grey Fox posts his game you can take it. Don't wait for me.

Then I'm Playing.

Forget this post...

I'm going to try to crank in some cities in the desert for unit support.

1350 AD
Changed some cities to (as Charis so beutifully said it) one of the Magical Numbers. Remember Charis that the Corruption is counted in the Shield Count in the City, so if you have a production of 10 Shields, and a corruption of 1, then you will only have 9 shields, even if it says you have a production of 10. So to have 10 in production in those cities, you have to have the magic Number 11. And some more city tweaking.

1: 1355 AD
Many cities celebrate "WLTK"-days.

2: 1360 AD
Traded Magnetism from the Sussex for 220 Gold. I was thinking about setting up a Pop-Rush city, with our workers in one of the Desert Cities, pumping out Berzerkers. But I noticed that we were in Brehon Law.

6:1380 AD
Bought Free Artistry from Cornwall. This will give us Shakespeare's in 12 Turns(in London), and Wall Street in 16.
Traded Incence and 76 Gold. to the Sussex for Wines.

7:1385 AD
Cornwall, did not want our trade for spices any more? I do not understand why... maybe they get Saltpeter from another source. Founded Blackpool, in the desert.

8: 1390 AD
Founded Greyford upon Avon in the desert.

9: 1395 AD
Somethings happened, but nothing out of the ordinary.

10: 1400 AD
Sold RoP to Cornwall for 148 Gold.
Sold RoP to Wales for 29 Gold, 8 Gold/turn, and Territory Map.

I'm stopping here to even out the Years, and I have no more time to play...

I don't know about you, but sometime soon, the AI will start producing Riflemen, so if we are going to take the Sussex, we need a massive Invasion Force.

We have quite a few Wonders being built. And A palace is storing shields for some Wonder, Maybe the Universal Suffrage, 'cus we will get Steam Power in 4 turns or so. And then we could go for Industrialization or maybe Scientific Method, the T of E rocks! (My choice if I were you, so we could get the Hoover to...)

Forgetful me... I forgot the save-file...

Well here it comes.

I have the game. I'll have it ^ for sure this time on time (?). :lol: Any suggestions on invading...?:soldier: :flamedevi

The time to attack is when you have decisive force and/or a very strong tactical advantage (ie you have cavalry they've not yet got saltpeter online, or you get tanks and they still only have rifles).

Not sure how things have changed in the last reign, but by last reckoning we had neither. To win on someone elses continent you need a ton more troops. Figure the AI as two defenders per city. So count their cites, double or triple that number at least, and ask, do I have that many equally competent attackers. Some less will do if their very strong for their time, like Cav and Tanks, or if the defenders are weak, like cav. If one doesn't attack decisely they just get them mad and waste resources.

(Then again, if we have that advantage, by all means let 'er rip)

Charis

Try to build some units before you do... :D

And upgrade our horsemen, but try and stay above 1000 Gold when we get the Wall Street. (Because then we will get 50G/turn)

i haven't played yet...i'm guessing naval ships will be needed in great supply....i'll try my best

We've got two targets for our third agressive action. Sussex or Kent. Sussex is technologically comparable and just as big and nasty as we are. We're also pretty much fated to butt heads with them at some time in the future. Kent is a dirt poor backwater. Big with lots of troops but they're of dubious quality. I vote for the next action to be against Kent. This will give us a second easily defensible island continent in excellent striking distance for Sussex.

I agree with Charis and Grey Fox. We need to start this invasion with all of the troops that we will need to totally annihilate Kent. Remember, Essex never makes peace :satan:
Seriously though, due to the slow passage and long distance of the conflict, we'll need to make a coastal swamping assault. If we don't take them quickly, there will be a high incidence of cultural reversion in captured cities.

So...I'd recommend that you build an assault fleet and the troops to go in it. Figure 2 pikemen per city defending and what would be needed to take them out, like Charis said. Also figure close to a dozen in the capital (or use the embassy to find out if they're keeping up that massive garrison). Watch Sussex. Keep checking to see if they have discovered Kent (if you can still offer contact with Kent then they're in the dark). When they do, we may need to launch prematurely because I guarantee that they will attack as soon as they possibly can. Sussex is just as militant and expansionist as we are and they are very agressive.

Another thought - if Sussex starts an assault before we do, we need to ROP and Ally with Sussex. This way we can steal in front of them, use their troops as buffers and take cities before they do.

Forgot to mention it, but I found another small island below the Kent...

Those blue Britons have a city there...

so attacking Kentis still ok? I'm going to play and maybe i'll have it up tonight. Maybe...

Originally posted by xrang the II
so attacking Kentis still ok? I'm going to play and maybe i'll have it up tonight. Maybe...
If you've got the forces ready, then go for it. Then again, in the final analysis, you're the king now. Do whatever you think is best. That's the fun part of succession games - different player styles affecting the game. ;)

Listen, the reason I was going to have the game up last night was because I won't be here today (not until 9:00 pm). I was playing last night and my computer crashed (IT'S A PIECE OF CRAP, OK, I KNOW!). It took me an hour of trying to make the computer work, thus wasting my time...I think I have a software conflict or something...Anyway, I would like for one of you guys to take my game before my turn so no time is wasted. Or is it possible for one of you to play and then I'll play after? It's ok if I can't, no worries...good times. But all in all someone please play my turn! Thanks, btw, Shaitan, I'm making a new thread and editing the one in Story and Tales, as I know which civs for sure (well, maybe not so sure) to use. Good Luck

Rich (;) Charis)

No problem. I'll take the game with Xrang to follow me and Charis to follow him and we're back on track.

My pre-turn took all of my available time this morning. I'll run through the actual turns this evening and post the save and synopsis. In the meantime, here's my beginning of turn report:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/essex1400ad.jpg
Shaitan the Agressor takes up the reigns of Essex with a promise of blood and fury. He looks over the land and what he sees is good. The treasury is overflowing with gold, the people are fat and happy and the troops train regularly in their ancient traditional ways. Hmmm...maybe not so good after all. He imagines the troops in their fine antique armor being riddled by musket balls. This will need some work. Perhaps Shaitan the Mobilizer is a better moniker...

1400 AD Inventory time. Loads of spearmen, upgrade at 80. 11 horsemen upgrade at 100. 1 chariot upgrade immediately for 120. 4 musket, 6 cav, 4 cannon, 17 berzerk - all good as is. Only 2 caravels for transport though. Upgrade to galleon for 40. One immediately upgraded. Second will return to port asap for upgrade.

Our target is the island kingdom of Kent:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/Kent1400ad.jpg
We'll need 3 assault armies for Kent. 1 each for Chatham, Canterbury and Wells. These groups would then proceed to Greenwich, Tunbridge and Hastings respectively.

Proposed armys will consist of 4 cannon, 5 berzerks, 8 cavalry, 3 muskets which means we'll need to build 13 galleons, 8 cannon and 1 cav. At least 6 frigates also needed. Upgrade 5 spearmen at 80 each and 11 horsemen at 100 plus one galleon at 40. 1540 total needed for upgrades. Treasury now stands at a hair over 1000. Army's are larger than some might expect because we need enough to take all 6 cities without waiting for healing and there's no possibility of reinforcement. Could get by with fewer if our intent was to raize and repopulate but since we're working on an island conquer I'd like to take the cities intact. There won't be much production out of these cities, ever, so whatever buildings can be taken intact are worth their weight in gold.

Building queues set. Our army will be built in 10 turns. We'll need some cash for the upgrades though and we don't want to drain the treasury (anticipating Wall Street). Tech lowered so treasury grows by 137 per turn. This will give enough funds over 12 turns to leave a grand in the bank before Wall Street is built. Coal power in 6 turns instead of 4. Workers head out into pre-rail position.

10 horsemen upgraded.

2 incense equals about 1 spice. Incense to Scotland for 19/turn. Incense plus ROP plus 16/turn to Ireland gets us spice. 10 more per turn from Wales and Man. Science bumped back up to get rails in 5.

Run through cities proves mostly unenventful. Everything's in great shape. One settler build changed to worker. Tiny tweaks here and there.

Shaitan the Mobilizer won't be able to sate his bloodthirsty desires but he vows that his successor will inherit one kick ass invasion force.

I just noticed that it's not good to Run the unInstallBritIsles twice...

It removed my .bic file... urgh :(

I have to install the patch or something again

Yeah, they're "dumb" files. They work well but no protection from erroneous use. The bic file (and civilopedia.txt and pediaicon.txt) will be in your recycle bin though.

Thanks!

Looks like we are building up our military.

Sorry to not have done that myself so much, I built one or two cannons started by Charis, and some Cavalry.

It's to bad we're not in despo, 'cus if we were we could set up some worker factories and pop rush in two or more desert cities by adding a worker every other turn (right before you are able to rush) and producing quite a lot of berzerkers every turn.

Just checked something and those files might not be in your recycle bin after all since they're deleted through a dos command. If you check and they're not there, send me an email to jrpea@bellsouth.net and I'll send you a .zip with the original files.

should we change to despotism...? jk...just kidding (like u didn't know that;) ) I'm next right? I'M READY TO TEAR DOWN THE WALLS! :cringe: :ripper: :rocket2: :rocket:

Yup, you're up next Xrang. Here's the turn brief:

1405 AD (first turn). Force movement begins towards staging area at Colneceastre. Desert village of Herpedene founded. Everybody knows about Kent at this point so Maps are a viable trading item again.

1410 Building. As at capacity cities come up they will build workers. 2 spearmen upgraded.

1415 Had to renegotiate furs from Scotland. Now costs 6 g/t more. Happiness will be critical as our garrisons are going to be lightened. Will also be losing silks from Kent soon as we can't renegotiate that. Last horseman upgraded.

1420 Stithenaece founded. Spearman upgraded.

1425 Aelle (Sussex) wants a MPP and ROP. We agree to a ROP. We've got coal and can build the Ironworks!! Salsbury changed to Ironworks (once started, it can always be finished - even if a resource goes away). Industrialization chosen for next tech. Aelle has Nationalism - we get that and dyes and 21 g/t for Steam Power. Ivory and 4 g/t from Scotland. 57 g/t from Isle of Man. 45 g/t from Cornwall. 20 g/t plus 50 g now from Wales. 14 g/t from Brittany. Renegotiated incense with Brittany - bumped it up 2 g/t and got another 17 on the spot. Making 200 g/t with a 10 turn research time. First spearman upgraded to rifleman for 120 g. This will cost a bit more for our upgrades but we're cranking the treasury to compensate.


1430 Sussex declares war against Scotland. Scotland and Ireland form an alliance against Sussex. An addition is put onto the palace. Spearman upgraded. Musketman upgraded (40).

1435 Brittany wants a MPP. We say no but happily renegotiate our ROP so they're paying 6 instead of us paying 12. 2 spearmen upgraded. ROP with Manx renegotiated from -18 to +6. Saltpeter to Cornwall for 12 g/t. Saltpeter to Wales for 7 g/t.

1440 Shakespear's Theatre completed in London. Brittany switches to Smith's Trading Company. Everybody's building Smith's now but we can't afford to check on their progress. Cross fingers and hope - we're 8 turns away. Transcontinental railroad will be completed in 2 turns. After that we'll build rail around Loidis to speed this up, if possible. 2 spearmen upgraded. 1 musket upgraded. 1 more infantry upgrade plus the caravel upgrade is all that's left.

1445 Musketman upgraded. Army mobilization going very well. Once caveat - we'll have 3 ironclads instead of 6 frigates for naval superiority. Shouldn't matter against Kent but we'll need a much stronger navy when we go after Sussex.

1450 Isle of Man and Sussex make an alliance against Scotland. Scot city of Dundee completes Smith's Trading company. No techs to purchase. Enfield produces a cavalry unit, wasting 214 shields. Loidis switches to the palace with around 350 shields in the bank. Transcontinental rail completed (Loidis to Colneceastre). London spur under construction.

1455 Tweaked Salsbury to get Ironworks in 14 instead of 18 turns. Island defense force is starting to be suplemented by new build cannon. Concentrating these in Loidis and London. With rails in place they will be able to respond wherever needed. Caravel upgraded to Galleon.

1460 Lost our silk supply from Kent. That's okay though. We'll have a native silk supply soon. Wallstreet completed in Southampton. London spur complete. Salsbury spur begun.

1465 Corwall and Sussex have made an alliance against Ireland. Kent and Corwall have signed a MPP. We'll be at war with Corwall when we attack Kent. Corwall is allied to Sussex so this could bring Sussex against us.

1470 The Great Army has boarded their transports and the fleet has taken sail towards Kent. There is rejoicing across the land and Ard Ri Shaitan declares luxury day in celebration. Managed to get another ironclad out but it's a good 5-6 tiles behind the rest of the fleet. Running rear guard, as it were.

1475 Kent declared war on the Irish. What a mess. It's going to be World War I with Ireland, Scotland and us against Sussex, Man, Corwall and Kent. When we declare against Kent we should grab Brittany and Wales as soon as possible. We get Communism and Industrialization from Brittany. Now researching medecine with a beeline towards Scientific Method (Theory of Evolution). 5 turns at 100% research. Loidis switched to Universal Suffrage (in 9 turns). Southampton buys a factory. Put them on Palace for prebuild to Theory of Evolution next turn. 1297 gold in the bank. The invasion fleet has to be moved manually. There is an undiscovered area between Kent and Essex and the automove will go all the way around this. I screwed up a "J" move with the workers so the spur to Salsbury won't be completed until next turn. After the spur is completed my intent was to put rail on production areas being used by Salsbury and Southampton to speed up the wonder production.

"Luxury Day" was a turn with 10% luxury spending. It wasn't necessary but the peeps deserved it after getting an entire invasion force assembled in excellent time.

Invasion plan (Recipe for a short, victorious war) for Kent was:

Turn 1: Land all troops (roaded mountains next to Chatham and Wells).
Turn 2: Kent will yell at us to get off his soil but we don't have to. This turn move the Capital assault force next to Canterbury. Extra ironclad to Chatham, 1/2 center fleet to Wells with ironclad, other 1/2 of the fleet to Chatham.
Turn 3: Kent demands that we move or declare war. Declare war. Cannons and riflemen soak up anything he can throw at us, weakening his city defense. City assault begins - two ironclads each on Chatham and Wells, 4 cannon on each city. Berzerks attack and take Chatham and Wells. Berzerks attack Canterbury but can't take it. Cavalry take Canterbury. Wounded berzerks will be city garrisons. All able bodied cavalry proceed to secondary targets. Riflemen will escort cannon at a slower pace. They will most likely not see the engagement before it's over.
Turn 4: Cavalry take Greenwich and Hastings. All forces converge on Tunbridge.
Turn 5: Cavalry from all 3 forces assault and take Tunbridge. Kent is destroyed. Make peace with Cornwall.

That's the plan I had in mind when I built the combined forces but prosecute our agressive action as you see best. I just couldn't let my battle plan go without sharing it :)

Kent is broke so shouldn't have many riflemen but will likely build conscripts (they have Nationalism) when we're at war.

There's a possibility that Kent has another island somewhere but I doubt it. There are two isles right off their coast that were colonized by mainlanders so I don't think they had any kind of sea travel before being discovered. You might want to buy a territory map from them before we're at war.

Ideas for after Kent:
The world will be at war. We can just let this go and take some time to build up our infrastructure (factories, plants, soon to be hospitals, etc). The most likely result of our inaction would be the destruction of Ireland and Scotland. They couldn't stand against Sussex alone, much less Sussex and every other western power (except Brittany). So long as the mainlanders took the majority of the new territory we would be in good shape. We definitely don't want Sussex getting any larger though.

The second option is to get the world to attack Sussex. This wouldn't be too difficult if you follow these steps:
Let our contracts run out with Sussex.
Move the successful Kent assault troops to invade Sussex.
Make MPP's with everybody possible on the turn we land on Sussex. Cancel our ROP on this same turn.
Next turn declare war on Sussex but don't attack.
When Sussex attacks our forces, the world will then declare war on Sussex. MPP outweighs their military alliances.
We could either prosecute our war to the fullest or stage razing raids to "free the opressed Sussex workers". In either case, Ireland and Scotland will likely survive.

There are one or two elite berzerks in each battle force. If possible, save them to take the cities. Excellent chance of a leader in a city taking battle.

Ok I've DLed the game and I'm playing for real. I will report within 24 hrs to spread the new glory of the empire. btw, what do u think of my new look(i mean the avatar and quote), i was inspired by Shaitan and how he changed his avatar...:cool:

Nice match of the avatar and sig. Have fun with Kent ;)

;) right back at you

When the Mod becomes more "Final", then you might think about sending it to Civ3.com, they have a Mod section now...

If it's EVER final. :lol:

Seems like it's taken on a life of its own.

Here's the story. I recently installed a new CD-RW into my PC and it has been giving me problems. I've been on the phone with the company for days now. I thought it would've been fixed days ago, but obviously it hasn't. So if you could skip me (again), I would apprectiate it...but in no way think that i'm going to quit, please! I really love this game and, without a doubt, I WILL BE FOR SURE HERE TO PLAY THE NEXT TURN! Please excuse me. And, btw, everytime I post I'm using my other PC. Again, I'm sincerely sorry for this...:(

Okee dokee. Charis, you're up for the invasion of Kent then. We're in regular rotation. I just had my turn. Now Charis, then Grey Fox and back to Xrang. Xrang, I emailed you some help for your disk problem.

Got the save file... between the Mrs wanting a movie night (Men of Honor, not bad!), another game, and lack of attachment posting, this one won't make it tonight. Soon...

:P
Charis

You couldn't post it tonight anyway. Upload on the Forum is down until Friday or Saturday.

Oops. Spoke too fast. I just saw Thunderfall's post that you can post attachments again.

Oh Thunder! I was actually looking for that extra day or two!

Got my 'Infantry' turn finished but if you've caught the rbd13 thread, I'm starting a new Succession game with a miniature mod aspect, the Cretan civilization with the Minoan Bull UU. First crack at modding or the editor, so that took most of the eve.

Kent is spared, but just for one more eve! :crazyeyes:

Charis

1475 AD (0) - Wow!!! At first glance I looked for the tall ships and
thought... "Invade Kent? With what, my good looks?!" Then I saw three
ironclads, but wait stacks of ironclads?? Nay! STACKS-O-DOOM! :hammer:
I almost feel sorry for Kent for what's about to happen...
The new King, Charis O'Saebert, must thank those who went before him
for handing him this ARMADA! Any good results are feathers in their
caps, any bad results will be due to the pungent weed! :smoke:
Hrmm... they DID gut my worker force?! Boo! All those wonderful benefits
of rails will have to wait several more decades... (Salsbury, our
Ironworks city, really rather ironically, has not a single rail tile! :P )
Suffrage due in 9, excellent (although, almost no rails there either, if
we lose it by a turn or two, the weed police will come out!)

Looking at Kent, we see only six cities. Right in the middle is their
capitol. We'll try to take that first, using our element of surprise.
That will also cut off the two halfs and make it impossible to reinforce.
Divide, then conquer. Good on paper, let's see if it works! I think
we have enough troops to simultaneously hit Wells.

1480 AD (1) - Wales and Manx ally vs Scotland, then Wales declares war.
The more fighting the AI does and leaves us alone to conquer Kent, the
better! We trade Territory map with Kent. Chuckle... better recon for
'current' conditions when we land. We're reminded too that he has
ruthlessly backstabbed the Irish. Ah, it's clear now! Tis fate that
a third generation Irishman, Charis O'Saebert, leads the charge!
About six workers are started in production.

Hmm, that's where the units came from. Our home cities are EMPTY! :eek:
May as well put up neon lights "Sussex!!!! Come invade us!!!!" With
all current production needed for infrastruture and war, a mild draft
of defenders is seen as prudent.

1485 AD (2) - Everything looking good so far - on our last move here,
a Kent fishing vessel spots us. We try to look casual (darn!)

1490 AD (3) - Sussex discusses our trade of Wines for Insense. We have
to throw in 13 gpt. Coal Mountain Valley is setlled on our lovely scenic
SW mtn with the Coal resource there, begging to be mined.

Hmmm... Medicine we get next turn no matter what slider says? That means
someone has it, just now, and will sell it to us for 1 GP. Sussex? Sure
enough! That saves us a turn and lets us start Replaceable Parts for the
Infantry. Hmmm... with Sussex caught up in tech, we better first go
electricity then SciMethod and TOE aimed at Atomic and Electronics.

We land at Kent, they, uh, don't look happy! Oh my! Horsemen and Pikes
all around? I hope that they have better than that! Our Berzerkers will
eat their lunch!

1495 AD (4) - Kent threatens us!!! "Leave or declare war!" Well, sheeeeesh
that's a no brainer!

:rocket:

I had hoped for one round of 'warning us' then next round attack. They
did get to slip SOME defenders into place, but... none modern.

Well that's interesting... Kent had "morons" in Cornwall sign a MPP!
So we're at war with Cornwall. (Which peon civ are they?!)
Oh shoot. We had a trade deal ongoing with them. It better not hurt *OUR*
rep if THEY choose to attack us! Our quarrel was with Kent!
These little "pink" civ people have six cities to their name. They're just
as pathetic as the Kents. We cut off our supply of saltpeter to them.
Would you believe that's the ONLY MPP in the game right now?!

If we don't take Wells this turn, 11 pikes enter the city. A gauntlet?
I love it! Hmmm... rifle conscripts show up in Hastings. Don't love that!
Hmm, one cav goes elite vs said conscript :hammer:
Another cav goes elite vs the last defender in Hastings, a Spearman.
Since we intend to WIPE out Kent, I keep the cities instead of raze.
(Soon there will be no Kent to 'flip' back to, if all goes well)

At Wells, it was just plain a rout! We lost one berzerker, while they
lost about five and the city. Our cav move so quick they press on to
Canterbury and are outside it immediately!

1500 AD (5) - Hmmm... I still see "Swordsman" and chuckle, thinking patsy.
What is the Kent UU again?! A cav, swordlikeman, and arrowbuttkicker
shot at us mid turn. Falconers?? Hehe, well that's no threat!
The stack of pikes comes at Wells. The resistance in Hastings ends (well
sheesh that wasn't much resistance) Those 11 pikes up... 11 down. Only
loss for us was a zerker (they should have stayed in mountains) and we got
two elite cavs. Even our riflemen take some offensive shots.

Yeehaw! First artillery shot at Canterbury destroys the barracks! :hammer:
The fighting there is furious. We actually lose a few battles, two zerks,
a cav, but so do they! We get two elite cav, one elite zerk. Before we
even run out of attackers, on the first assault round, Canterbury falls.
We'll need to rushbuild the barracks to heal properly, once the
resistance is quelled. The capitol moves to Greenwich.

Ha!! Not for long! We had three cavs yet to move, and they're so fast
they made it to Greenwich. Three defenders, they all fell!
Out of curiousity, an ambassador calls out. No answer. (Silly fools!)

1505 AD (6) - Four Britton ships are moving SOMEWHERE, and right off
our coast at Travalgar? Do they want a piece of us or something?!
Frigate/Galley pairs... an invasion force. They have a RoP with us,
so I can't even tell them to leave. I wonder if I should MPP with their
biggest and toughest neighbor?! I look at our standing and our mil advisor
says our army is weak compared to other nations. Great, and 1/2 of it is
on another island right now. I draft one from virtually every available city.
I institute a North coastal neighborhood watch (a dozen spare units hangout
there instead of in town, to discourage landings :P )

Saitan - bug alert! Are Warriors *supposed* to upgrade up to riflemen??
seems like a UU thing, but that doesn't seem right...

Phew! Not only no counterattack at Greenwich but the resistance is over.
And we only had two units on garrison (the attacking cavs).
To help reduce flip chances I am starving down the cities a few.

1510 AD (7) - Brown ships approach our shore, and Wales comes up to discontinue
our RoP. We renew it when he gives us 24 Gold. We lose our supply of
Spices. Great, now who is that? Ireland. What?? You want HOW MUCH for
those Spices now??! Grr.... cancel that. And before long, bub, I'm
coming to get those spices for MYSELF! Scotland wants to cut a deal too,
and pay less for their incense. Palace expansion...

Chatam and Tunbridge remain in Kent. A brown ship lands next to Chatam.
Hey pal!!! **OUR** invasion, get lost!! :hammer: Oops, maybe it was
just a purple Kent ship.. never mind. They conscript a rifle there, but
they're WAY short. Three defenders, three attacks, Chatham is ours.

1515 AD (8) - Has Manx gone crazy??? They're sending an armada our way.
I recognize it because it's like what we sent down to Kent!!
Actually, it's much odder. 13 galleys and a frigate. Are they heading
up North past us??? Very likely. Britton sailing south, Manx north.
Manx has an RoP and a deal with us. The AI does some dumb things but
it doens't every break RoP. They're not after us (for now! :P )
Still, I kiss up in a minor way and buy their world map for a generous
price and cut back 1 gpt on their incense purchase.

Crud, we kill three defenders at Kent's last city, Tunbridge, but one
left. No fresh units in range. Three badly damaged cavs though???!
The first valiant cavalry rider has one hp, but takes down the arrogant
pikeman. The city is ours, Kent is.... GONE! (Hope you didn't blink!!)

"We have destroyed the solid Kent, High King!" :hammer:

Cornwall the Moronic refuses to see us. He gets swept into an MPP
with a puny civ about to be eaten alive by a big civ, and won't let
up after that puny civ is wiped out?! :smoke: We prod them by
sinking a wooden ship with an ironclad...

I'm going to stop there after eight turns.
Good luck to next leader...

... building a ton more rails
... consolidating our victory on Kent
... choosing a next target and when
... enjoy the fruits of iron works (and built a factory asap!)
both it and suffrage due next turn
... research Scientific method and get us going on the big Theory of Evil

Charis

I've got the game...

I love it when a plan comes together. Great work on the invasion, General Charis.

The swordsman upgrade is intentional. It's not a direct upgrade (it goes through swordsman). All the ancient units are upgradeable in the British Isles mod.

1: 1520 AD
Manx wants an MPP, but I just give them the worldmap, and Cornwall lands on our Island with a knight. The knight is bombarded and eredicated by a zerker...
Seems like someone discovered Electricity, 5 turns left before, now 1 turn.
(BTW, as Charis said, Iron Worx and Universal is built)

2: 1525 AD
Manx and Ireland has a Pact against Cornwall.
The scots wants an Alliance against the Sussex, but we aren't ready for that know are we?
We lost our supply of dyes and something(forgetful me...).
We lost many more luxaries... :(

I just realized that I don't have time to play any more so I stopped...

Our WLTK-days ended in many cities, so if the next player can, try to get som more luxaries if you can.

You're up then, Xrang. Everything okay with the computer?

I've got the game. Any extra tips as to what I should do? The PC's fine, btw...

If there's enough of a strike force left you might consider taking a trip to Cornwall to liberate some of their oppressed populace. We're short on workers so could definitely use a little 'forced immigration'.

Turn 1, 1530 AD
I see two Breton Galleons by our shore so I move Ironclad next them. O don’t know what to do with the ships in the ocean between Sussex and us so I just move them closer to the shore. MMOW. I see those Manx Galleys...

Turn 2, 1535 AD
Cornwall and Wales have signed a military alliance against us! OH BOY, NOW I’M SCARED! Our 11 gpt/incense deal with Brittany has ended....London has produced Coal Plant, now Worker. Hemel produced Worker and is now producing another one. MMOW.

Turn 3, 1540 AD
Our RoP and 6 gpt deal with Brittany has ended. London has completed Worker and starts a new one. Trafalgar made Marketplace now Bank. Stithenaece made Temple now working on Marketplace. MMOW.

That’s all because when I tried to play last night ‘You have performed an illegal operation’ came up (...that never happens...) And when I restarted my machine and Civ3...well what do you know it happened again! 5 mins...10 mins...15 mins...you get the picture. I’m sorry for the short turn but at least my PC worked (that’s what I call ‘working’ at least).

Tips for the next player

Just kidding :P...I’ve always wanted to do that!

Richard

I've got the game. Will post tomorrow (Tuesday).

1540 AD (Pre-turn) Coastal guard reassigned to military police duties in large cities. 3 unemployed workers from Loidis put on railroad construction. Kent Expeditionary Force begins assembling back to the fleet, leaving a weak guard over conquered Kent (rifle and cav in each city, 4 cannons spread around). They will be traveling to Cornwall to "liberate" the poor, opressed Cornish citizenry. Temples purchased all over Kent to seal up the landmass. Cash and Incense to Ireland for Espionage, Corporation and spices. Dyes from Sussex for Espionage and Corporation and cash. Ivory and furs from Scotland for Espionage and Corporation and cash. Cash from Man and Brittany for Espionage and Corporation. How's that for swanky trading? Woo hoo! Shiny happy people everywhere. Essex proper is cranked to get factories out asap. There will be some population loss but that can be recovered quickly. Research reduced to get the treasury back to optimum levels. Specialists tweaked to bring research back up. Scientific Method in 7. Wow, check out Coal Mountain Valley (Southwest Essex). 1 population, no growth and 5 shields! They need a harbor.

1545 Man doesn't want to renegotiate our ROP as it expires but they leave our waters peacefully. Brittany and Wales sign a trade embargo against us. That might bother me if either of them had anything worthwhile to trade. Our people want to build the Intelligence Agency. London uses that as a prebuild for Theory of Evolution. Essex defense fleet set to picket positions. Two ironclads sent to harrass the Cornish coastline. Southern assault force is going to be short by 1 galleon. Chatham purchases one.

1550 Polution rears its ugly head. Yuck.

1555 Wales declared war on the Irish. I can't even find a Welsh city. Where are they declaring war from? Wales declared war on the Manx too! These pissants are irritating me. Steps will be taken. Sussex and Brittany are bribed to make war on the Welsh. Brittany seems embarassed that they were seduced by Welsh propaganda and had agreed to embargoe us. They quickly reinstate normal trade relations and declare war on the Welsh. Sussex seems as eager as we are to get rid of the little pest nation, they just needed an invitation. The entire world (excepting the soon to be in serious pain Cornish) are at war with Wales. Wherever they are hiding, they'll be dealt with soon. Cornish assault fleet takes to the waves. They're taking the eastern route to avoid irritating Sussex (will take 11 turns instead of 10).

1560 Same old Same old (SOSO)

1565 SOSO

1570 Sussex and Ireland signed a peace treaty. It looks like Ireland did not fare at all badly in the war. Enfield begins prebuilding for the Hoover Dam. First ironclad arrives at Camberon coast, Cornwall. Bombardment of Cornish improvements begins.

1575 Ireland and Scotland sign an alliance against Man. Irish ironclad pops up next to ours and merrily joins in on the shelling of Camberon coast. Rails south of Camberon destroyed by our ironclad. Aelle gives 17 g/t plus Replaceable parts for Silk. Brittany pays 11 g/t for Incense and 16 g/t for Silk. Silk to Ireland for 10 g/t. Silk to Man for 12 g/t. Iron to Man for 33 g/t. Theory of Evolution in 5 (London). Research turned off as there's nothing we can finish before we get it for free with the TOE. Treasury begins growing like kudzu in June.

1580 The Welsh want peace. Sure, that could happen. Hahahahahahaha. They've got such a sense of humor!

1585 Cornwall and Sussex signed an alliance against Cornwall. This is one messed up, crazy world war. The rampaging Irish have destroyed the Welsh! Way to go, Brian Boru. We make a small gift to Brian in recognition of his feat. Irrigation and roads destroyed near Camberon. Our ironclad is having a blast (pun intended).

Crap. Time to go to work. Charis, sorry I'm leaving you in the middle of a turn. You might want to put one citizen on science. I don't know what happens if you get the TOE with no research at all. The treasury is in amazing shape, the assault fleet is closing on Cornwall. Cornwall has infantry now so you might not be as successful as planned. Maybe just rampage around for a while and destroy things until they sue for peace. You're loaded with cannon so they won't be able to do much to you if you stay in a stack or two. Try to get a foothold on the mainland for future assaults. Essex proper has factories in all the important places. Many coal mines being built. Might want to switch some of those off to other improvements as we'll be getting the Hoover Dam fairly soon. Rail construction across Essex is going very well. We can probably spare a boat load of workers for Kent.

One more thing - Coal Mountain Valley has completed it's harbor but can't grow itself. It can support quite a few population but just can't get that extra food for growth without sacrificing massive production.

You can have the research set to 0% and still get the techs with T of E that you are "researching".

Wyvern Monarch will be joining us as our 5th player. He's in the rotation after Xrang.

Welcome aboard Wyvern Monarch! :cool:


Note to Charis:
You're up, Charis O'Saebert. Are you taking the reigns of leadership?

Hallo Monarch of the Wyverns! :D

Aye, I'll be trashing some Welsh or Briton or some-kinda tush tonight! :hammer:

(Was up til 2 finishing off two other SG's last night, got hit with 4 games coming up with my turn at once, after 2 days of no game. Tnx for the reminder though, those never hurt)

Charis

1585 AD (0) - Back in power so soon??! Charis O'Saebert was quite surprised.
It seems like only days ago when he was rolling over and wiping out the
Kent Island. Who now was our enemy that came a beggin' for justice??!

Well durn!! Someone gets a big pat on the back, look at that worker army!!!
:hammer: This does his heart very glad indeed :P 61 workers digging
them new roads. 52 rifles and 23 cav - a bit on the offense, but we have
just come through many years of war. The whole world is at war now, with
one exception, Briton. We're just at war with Cornwall, who is at war with
almost everyone. Theory of Evo due in two turns and we're set to snag
Atomic and Electronics followed by a quick Hoover??! And we're prebuilt for it??
Woot!! [party] The AI may not yet know it, but... they're toast. Their end
is near. It may be far, and yet, it is near! (Does that make ANY sense?!)
(Exactly 50 shields production at Enfield? My heart be still, nice)
Looks like Wales just went poof recently, and Cornwall only has six
cities. Did you say it might be rougher because Cornwall has infantry?

Well, ya know what... with our offense THIS low, cavalry only and not many,
and with us now with a huge tech lead, their demise can wait for tanks.
Build up infrastructure, science, cash lead now and as SOON as we get the
tanks, whoever we set our sights on is history. With each of the lesser civs
having only 6-10 cities, it won't take but one players turn to knock out the
whole civ. Two if we're frisky and have tanks :P With seven mainland cities
and one city right next to our colony, and with a Trade Embargo against us,
Briton comes to mind as a potential target at that time.

Hmm, currently tech seems at parity though. Briton has Refining, and once
we're one turn from TOE we'll swap that for sci method. Hmm, full world
wide tech parity, everyone has it. Hmmm, where IS our offense anyway.

OMG!! Look at that naval stack of doom!??? Do you guys know how to come up
with an invasion armada or what??? Wow! Second thoughts already, given
their state of readiness! Hmm, but... we have the tech for infantry and have
zero?? Wonder if we JUST got it - must be, no artillery either. Not gonna send
those boys out to die as mere riflemen. Gonna upgrade them to infantry and
canon to the HUGELY more efficient artillery (with their range of 2).

There is merely one small but repeated instance of weed visible...
With Hoover Dam about to arrive we're building (and almost have complete)
about 8 COAL plants??? We swap off the early ones and on Hatfield, almost
done, we switch to Police Station, others to infantry. (Hoover and Hydro
plant replace, do not add to, Coal Plants.) We also call off the dogs on
worker production, such as Southampton with its 46 shield production rate.

Hrmmm... is this a bug Shaitan??! Cavalry upgrades to tanks????
This can't be right? (Or is it?) The AI will be using it, so it's a "rule"
that's "ok" as far as this game, and I start cranking out more cav, something
I would avoid like the plague usually this close to tanks. Coal Mtn Valley
shifts to Granary, then will switch for a few turns to food, and perhaps
eat a few workers later :P I think I'll send one Galleon of workers down
to the colony too. Another bug, or maybe intended, but the berzerkers
follow the pikeman upgrade chain not the swordsmen. So one day they
will be mech infantry :P Right now, infantry are in every way better and
so when/if we get cash, we'll do that. (Keep one for historical purposes ;)

Wake up a rifle, Shift-U, bam! 33 are updated to infantry for 660 gold.
The rest must be sitting in non-barracks cities and so next turn I
will have to do the "RAX Shuffle!" [dance]

1590 AD (1) - Expensive upgrades, glad we're running zero science at the moment
and have surplus 380 gold per turn!

1595 AD (2) - Sussex doesn't so much like the incense for wines deal.
Ha!! Who needs them?! We're a HAPPY people and we can use the money to make
upgrades of troops to overrun your scrawny neck someday!? How 'bout dem apples!?
Although, we'll let you addicted to OUR stuff at 200 gold and 24 gpt!

In other news, Briton and Ireland have allied vs Isle of Man (this is GREAT!
these clowns are going to fight each other and keep each other weak, with
no victor emerging, while we amass HUGE production bonuses with 100% railroad
coverage and the Dam! :lol: ) (Example: Southampton, our FP went from
54 to 64 shield output by finally filling up his radius with rails - due to
both shield bonuses and a food bonus allowing to shift off one more 'food'
square' to work a 'shield square')

The ToE arrives and we snag Atomic and Electronics, and start on Sanitation.
With our superious landworking we can handle much larger cities now.

An iron source of ours near London disappears and moves next to Salt Lake City.
Enfield switches from placeholder to Hoover Dam, due in 11. No, make that 9
after we switch tiles between cities to give it the very best squares.
(Thought prebuild was higher, but the 'Palace' showing #shields bug prevented
seeing how close it was)

Now that ToE built, we broker SciMethod to our Sussex (make him pay the most)
and see he'll give BOTH Steel and Refining for it... *AND* 550 gold :P
Try to sell it to all other civs, but... wow... they're poor as church mice!
When they can afford to pay through the nose, we'll sell.

Ah, those new techs mean.. oil. Two source on mainland, NONE in the colonies.
And that tiny island next our colony. Briton has oil there 8-\ And that
tiny Irish city-island to the north they just barely stole from us? It too, oil.
They also have it at home as does Cornwall. Everyone has it at home. I plunder
one square that has oil on it to avoid a very unlucky double-loss of oil.
We're not working the square now anyway. If you want to trade oil (and
no one needs it), reconnect.

1600 AD (3) - Intelligence agency completed in Salsbury. (We'll probably want
to prebuild UN at some point)

1605 AD (4) - More movement of Workers (MMOW)

1610 AD (5) - Cornwall and Ireland sign a peace treaty. On our colony island
I note a 'gap' both in border and in coverage of good squares, and pop out
a settler.

1615 AD (6) - That settler founds "Enefelde". New source of coal discovered near
Enfield. (Don't confuse the two names :P )

1620 AD (7) - Saltpeter dries up!! :eek: But it reappears right nearby at Hemel.
We readjust squares to hit 60 in Salsbury, 40 in Bradeford.
The workers from mainland are now on the rail task in the colonies. The
two galleons are heading to Hastings to be able to assault Vannes of
Britton on their own power, whenever it comes time to take down Briton.

That'll due me for now, it's taken a while already.

With Hoover Dam due in 4 turns and Sanitation in two, I would think the current

buildup of infrastructure and cash-producing power will work very well for us
until the right conditions appear for a war. Besides, the AI has to build some
rail for us to better blitz them once we land :P So we can do hospitals in
several cities soon. With sanitation, and with rail ALL done at home, we can
absorb several workers into some towns to grow them a little more quickly.
Just leave a healthy stack around to fight pollution, and plan on taking over
about 8 to build rails when we do an invasion.

Good luck!
Charis

I've got the game...

The upgrade path for all swordsman type UU's was fixed in later versions of the mod. They all pass through rifleman now (as does the base swordsman).

The Cavalry upgrade to tank is intentional. The intent was to allow the upgrade of all old units. I've been thinking of getting rid of this one though because a successful early conqueror (like us) will have a virtually unstopable army of tanks as soon as the tech is learned. Normally there is a break after infantry become common until sufficient numbers of tanks can be produced. With the cavalry -> tank upgrade there is no break in offensive actions.

What are your thoughts?

I don't personally like the idea of Cavalry upgrading to Tanks.

First of all it's not realistic, and second, as you said it won't be a break in the Offensive chain. The one with the most horsemen from the start wins. No good.

Take away the upgrade chain.

And I think you should do the same with Swordsmen. That's a part of building them, you know they can't be upgraded and you then take a risk of ending up with obsolete units thats a part of the game, and a very well balanced part as it is...

I won't have time to play anytime soon so if someone would like the game to keep flowing please take the save and play.

Now I'm going to bed...ZZZzzz...

Originally posted by Grey Fox
I won't have time to play anytime soon so if someone would like the game to keep flowing please take the save and play.

Now I'm going to bed...ZZZzzz...
You're up then, Xrang. PC hanging in there?

Got it! I'll see what I can do...

Turn 1, 1540 AD
Our RoP and 6gpt deal with the Manx has ended. And now he have -32 gold per turn!? Whoa! I'm truly overwhelmed!
Oh boy. Brittany and Wales have signed a trade embargo against us?! ...like they have anything to offer... London has created
a Worker and begins on another one. Enfield finishes factory, now working on Coal Plant. Stanstead Abbots made a
Bank now Factory. Welingum made Aqueduct, now Marketplace. MMOW.

Turn 2, 1545 AD
London built Worker, now another one? OK. Southamptom produced Coal plant, now Worker. Salsbury has produced Factory
now Coal plant. Caol Mountain Valley made Temple, now Aqueduct? MMOW.

Turn 3, 1550 AD
Brittany and Sussex have signed a MMPP! Brittany and Cornwall have signed a military alliance against us! london built
Worker, might as well build a Police Station... Southamton created Worker and starts another. DontMessWithUs produced Bank
now Factory. Hemel has produced Worker, now Marketplace. Hempstead Aqueduct, now Marketplace. Herpendene Temple, now
Granary (2 b changed...). MMOW.

That's all for me. i wasn't expecting to play now so forgive my short turn. The computer is running well now so I'll most
likely be able to play all of my turns. Charis please read my ending in the RBD13 thread (like u already haven't :P).

Okay, you're up Wyvern Monarch. Good luck and kick ass. Watch out for Brittany. If we attack them or one of their units, Sussex will declare war against us. I don't think we're ready to take on the world's other BIG DOG.

Looks like our new recruit is MIA. I've got the game.

1555AD (turn 0) Let's try to describe this global mess here. We're at war with Cornwall and Brittany. Brittany has a MPP with Sussex. Sussex is at war with Scotland and Ireland. Ireland is at war with Sussex and Cornwall. Scotland is at war with Sussex and Isle of Man. Cornwall is at war with Ireland, Isle of Man and us. This means that Isle of Man is at war with Cornwall and Scotland. Egads. We declare Peace against Cornwall. Get Espionage and The Corporation in the bargain. Southampton switched to Intelligence Agency. Brittany won't talk to us. Fine. It's not like they can actually do anything. Wow. Our resources and luxuries are worth nothing on the global market. Everybody else's are apparently worth about 40 gold per turn. Very irritating. Except Iron - that's still valuable. We give Iron and ROP to Man for 28 g/t. Research lowered to gain cashflow in the treasury. 5 turns to Scientific Method. Wait a minute. Scientific method? Where is the Hoover Dam construction? Something is very, very wrong here. The Welsh are still in the game. Did I pick up the wrong save file? A quick check on the Forum shows the problem. Charis left off at 1620. Xrang picked up the wrong save :( Okay, I've got Charis' save now. Let's try this again.

1620AD (turn 0) Ah, that's better. The global situation is much nicer. Only 7 wars across the globe. We are at war with Cornwall. Isle of Man is at war with Brittany, Cornwall, Scotland and Ireland. Add Cornwall vs. Scotland and Scotland vs. Sussex and that sums it up. The domestic scene is Hoover Dam in 4. Currently doing some massive army construction. I like it. Sanitation in 2 turns then we'll start working towards tanks. Build up the treasury so we'll be able to upgrade our cav when that happens. Cornwall would like peace with us but they've got nothing at all to appease our wrath. No dice, Mr. Bettlesworth. No payola, no peace-ola.

1625 Man got spice from someone else? I thought we had a lock on spice. Anyway, they don't renew our 7 g/t deal. Our ironclad near Camberon has ringside seats as the Scots move against Cornwall. 2 infantry die in Camberon. 1 injured conscript infantry holds the city. Wish I had that invasion fleet now. Ironclad bombards Camberon - scores a hit on their library. Coal Mountain Valley is brought up to a population of 6. It's the biggest little production center in Essex!

1630 Sussex wants an alliance against Ireland. Sorry Aelle, not today. Isle of Man and Ireland sign a peace treaty. Can't wait for tanks. Cornwall is getting pasted right now. The assault fleet launches. ETA 4 turns. We shop around Atomic Theory and Electronics from Sussex we get 52 g/t plus wines for AT and 89 g/t for Elec. 10 g/t plus 350 cash for AT from Brittany. 23 g/t and 80 cash for AT from Scotland. Isle of Man and Ireland have nothing. Nobody except Sussex had enough to bother with the second tech. Try again in a few turns.

1635 Cornwall approaches us for peace again. Go away, John. Peace is for the strong. Your fate is somewhat different. Sussex is building the Hoover Dam. We'll invite them to see the completed work in 1640. Turns will be getting much faster now. Essex is one huge railroad. Many workers added to cities. London is huge. Salsbury (Iron Works) will be huge as soon as they finish a hospital. Remaining workers put on auto polution patrol. It works now. Computer sends 8 to clean up a nasty spill in 1 turn.

1640 Hoover Dam is complete. Massive celebrations across the land tempered by the groans of the soon to be out of work coal plant workers. All coal plants on the continent are sold for scrap. An addition is put on the palace. Trade agreements for furs, ivory and dyes expire. We get them back at considerable cost. Size 20 cities mean that luxuries aren't luxuries any more. They're necessities. Still cheaper than raising the lux rate to keep the peeps happy though. London is now cranking at 90 shields.

1645 Salsbury is cranking 102 shields now. Assault fleet lands on Cornish shore.

1650 Ireland wants to renegotiate our Spice for Incense trade. We give them the ancient tech of Atomic Theory and a fistful of dollars. Another addition is put on the Palace. It looks quite nice. After a furious bombardment, cavalry take Henlistone. One berzerk lost in the battle. Elite berzerk force heads for Camberon and will coordinate with sea bombardment. Artillery, Infantry and Cavalry move on Cornish capital of Bodmine. We offer Cornwall peace in exchange for Camberon but they decline. We'll see how they feel after Bodmine is so many ashes.

1655 Isle of Man and Scotland sign a peace treaty. Cornish cavalry attacks the elite berzerk force heading for Camberon. The berzerks win. Temple and Marketplace of Bodmine destroyed by artillery. Barracks purchased in Henlistone. Cornish Infantry on route to Camberon are slaughtered by Essex cavalry. Cavalry run amock in the Bodmine countryside, cutting the Cornish capital off from their cities. Ironclads pound Camberon reducing its lone garrison to one health. Elite berzerker force moves into place to take Camberon next turn. John is suddenly more tractable and agrees to surrender Camberon and 3 Cornish workers in exchange for peace. Essex is at peace for the first time since our agression against Kent started. We have a beachhead on the continent and a slew of troops ready for upgrade as soon as the tech is available.

Combustion is due next turn. Battlefield Medecine will be complete in London in 4 turns. The treasury is only at about 850 but should be sufficient at current growth to cover troop conversion when tank tech becomes available. The fleet is harbored at Henlistone. There is a galleon waiting at Watford to transport workers down to Kent or to the new Cornish protectorate. 4 workers in Southampton will be ready to go next turn. We're pumping out a couple of infantry each turn. This will change to a couple of tanks each turn soon. Once we get Flight, an airport in all the big production cities plus an airport in the new Cornish protectorate will make it possible for us to steamroll the entire continent if we wish. These little countries have no hope against the Essex juggernaut.

Oops. Forgot to attach the file. Here it is.

WHERE DID I GET THAT FILE?! :suicide: SORRY FOR THAT DISGUSTING DISPLAY OF STUPIDITY! :o

Well THAT was quite an "oops!" :lol:

Xrang, why don't you take the game now, a turn that will count. I'm up in several other games atm anyway. Then I'll hop back in and then Grey and back on sequence...

Charis

There really is no excuse for that, sorry. I'm playing two other games right now... I'll play but give me 48 hrs... Shaitan what do you think, about my playing and all? Well, sorry again! cya :P

It's fine with me, Xrang. Don't beat yourself up too badly for grabbing the wrong file. It's an honest mistake. You grabbed the last one on the page, you just weren't on the last page.

Thank you, Shaitan. Please give me 48 hrs. . And I think we'll just say that my mistake was a 'weedy move'! Ok, back to Civ...

Turn 0, 1655 AD
Cornwall wants me to get out of his territory. Yhe only reason I say ok is because it saves
me the trouble of doing it manually :P. The Scots had some victories against the Cornish...
We have discovered Combustion, now researching Mass Production. We have so many troops...
I hate to not use them :P. MMOW.

Turn 1, 1660 AD
Cities finish production... Nothing else, really... oh yeah MMOW :P.

Turn 2, 1665
Lots of cities complete improvements/units. We dicovered a new source of iron in the
Cornish colony. MMOW.

Turn 3, 1670 AD
Ireland want our territory map in exchange for ours... Ok. Frncis II of Brittany
wants a military alliance against the Manx. These guys don't understand that that's the idea,
let them beat up on themselves and we'll move in for the kill :P. We've completed Battlefield
Medicine in London. Production finished in many cities. MMOW.

Turn 4, 1675 AD
Brittany has signed a peace treaty with Isle of Man. More
production in cities. MMOW.


Turn 5, 1680 AD
Our deal(12 g/t for silks) with the Manx has ended. Our deal(18 g/t for silks)
has ended as well. pollution patrol
and MMOW.

Turn 6, 1685 AD
Maybe we should join in the fun... MMOW.

Turn 7, 1690 AD
Mass Production
has been discovered. We're now researching Motorized Transportation. MMOW.

Turn 8, 1695 AD
MMOW.

Turn 9, 1700 AD
The Silks and 10 g/t deal with Ireland is done with. MMOW.

Turn 10, 1705 AD
MMOW.


That's all, folks! There was another weedy move but I won't tell you what happened...

You're up O'Charis. Kick some buttock.

Charis, can you take your turn or should Grey Fox go ahead and take his?

I'm on it, thanks for the cattle prod :P

I got about a third done last night when a dread tired came upon me. The extra time is because there is a bold plan afoot :p

Charis

Ooooh! I just LOVE bold plans. ;)

1710 AD (0) - Hmmm... relative peace, eh? Cornwall fights against Manx and
Scotland, and Irelands joins him against Bruce of Scotland. Sussex remains
an overgrown bully. Cornwall has 4 cities left, Manx has one, both are
completely toast. I've seen no discussion of victory conditions this
millenium, so let me broach the topic.

Cultural? We have 41,557 for the civ, gaining 450 per turn. That means
100K in 130 turns. Tis 1710 AD, so that means 100K no later than 1972.
For 100K to win you have to have double culture of next civ. We have every
civ but two doubled - Scotland and Sussex (ouch). So that route would require
Sussex to be annihilated. If we (can) do that we can just dominate the world
quicker. Domination means Sussex must fall, and since it's enabled WOULD
happen before conquest. 20K in one city cultural victory? London is our only
shot with 4379 plus 33 per turn. Reaches 20K in (cough) 474 turns. Bzzzzt.
We gave up on that option back in ancient era with our handling of London.

Diplo? Hmmm... we're 3 techs away from UN. It would basically take getting
everyone at war with Sussex then calling for a vote. I look around and NO ONE
will "ally vs Sussex." They ALL will take an MPP, and we could declare war on
Sussex then get attacked and have the whole world at war with him. Alas, with
other countries at war, the MPP drags us in and makes some enemeies perhaps.
Dicey. I can't remember well, has Sussex been a bad boy facing everyone, or
kind of nice? We've been nice to civs that (cough) we've not wiped off the
planet.

Space Race? Tech? We have Mass Production while they have Flight. We have
Motorized in about 3 turns, and TONS of cash. That will give us a small tech
lead, and with Hoover and better city management, a big production lead.
For example, IronWorks city Salsbury has 100 shields/turn. How many techs to
complete a space race? 13 techs. To build our first part... 5 techs. The nation
is blissfully happy - score here would be good.

Domination? We've got *SEVERAL HUNDRED* units of infantry and cities to conquer.
If we go there expect VERY long turns. If you've not gone this route before it's
kinda fun. If you have, or are in other SG's right now, it's not so welcome. One
**HUGE** advantage we have in this mod is that cavalry upgrade to tanks.
Shaitan explained the reason for this, we got one dissenter, and I would add
to the ranks of "I still don't think it's a good idea". Yet, for this game,
it's here. On round one we get tanks we have *37* tanks to go crush things
with.

So... "good" options: Domination, Space, Diplo. The former is going to be a
real slog (or great time, depending on your view of monstrous wars), the
latter is dicey, and the middle one is dead quiet for the next 20 turns,
then 40 turns of building parts. Because this is a SG however, this isn't as
boring as it sounds, everyone basically has one to two turns left, that's it!

Here's my plan then... i) Get Tank tech then convert our 40ish cavs to tanks.
ii) Load 'em up on transport, iii) get set to land at Seolesiae, which is
SMACK DAB in the middle of Sussex. It literally would cut the country in two
and make later annihilation easier, if we choose that route. iv) at same
moment, surround their 3 islands to take them immediately. v) setup MPP's with
most countries, then declare war on Sussex and capture the chokepoint city of
Seolesiae. vi) Garrison the chokepoint city to the hilt, and raze Elge and
Crawley to the south. vii) Setup next leader to then wipe out all of North Sussex
in about 10 turns, viii) declare peace. If they won't quit or get uppity, we
pillage and park on ALL their rubber, oil, coal. ix) If they're a contender
in the space race we pillage/take all their uranium and aluminum ;P

Turn zero: All wealth cities turned to cavalry in prep to upgrade, or
artillery. Increase science to get Tanks in 3 turns, not 4. Prepare some
transports.

Time to plant spies! Manx is caught (not pleased but still polite). Sussex
succeeds! 140 infantry, ouch! Only 9 cav???? Ha!!!! They can't even take one
well defended city with that! Scotland worked, Brittany failed. The Duke of
Breton is annoyed. Tough pal, deal with it! Ireland worked, as did Cornwall.
Scotland has 61 infantry and 9 cav. Ireland has 29 inf, Cornwall, 7.

Big logistical problem. All our cavs, just turns away from a huge upgrade,
are off the coast of Multiland, not at home, nor at Sussex. Henlistone rushes
Harbor - with that and barracks can upgrade the armada there to transports and
get many tanks on them. We'll "warm them up for combat vs Cornwall probably."

An infantry unit is drafted in every city on our Southern Island. This
frees the cavs (proto-Tanks :P ) to leave for the invasion of Gyldeforda.
(Typo alert, Shaitan - the dom. advisor calls me Magesty - should be Majesty)

The Irish leader O'Charis is not ABOUT to help Sussex get caught up with a
trade, yet we would like Flight. Our newly established spy sees what he can
see... and he finds plans for an airport, and sneaks them back home! :hammer:
So we change orders once more to crank out at least a few airports.

Ok, time to 'start' :D

1715 AD (1) - Getting transports ready, prep...
1720 AD (2) - (Henlistone has an airport rushed, the beachhead on the main
continent will soon be in impregnable fortress)
1725 AD (3) - More of same...

1730 AD (4) - We receive knowledge of how to build a powerful instrument of
persuasion and negotiation. The "Tank." We're VERY quick learners, and we
already have xxx tanks :hammer:

Sussex cuts off our supply of wine. Ha!!! Now is not a time to drink my
friend, unless it is a toast to your demise. Our dyes from him will dry up
in two turns, as will his supply of silks and incense from us. Excellent,
we will then be free from the entanglement of treaties :P

We drop back science reseaarch rate on Radio to one scientist. At least for
a few turns while we have massive upgrades to Inf and Tanks. Also, once we
have ANY foothold city on either front, rush an airport, barracks, and
temple (probably in that order).

1735 AD (5) - Ironically, Sussex sends a galleon and ironclad right by our
shore. I think they're going to invade someone. If they declare RIGHT before
we do, they'll be in over their head, muhahaha!

Ok, I've been the lucky one at least twice this game given an armada full of
troops ready to strike, so this time I'm going to pass off and give such
a fleet to our next leader! (Time is short for me this eve... the fun part
was hatching the plan. I do hope of course it is to your liking :P )

Stocked:
- Transport NW of Wellingum - send at Egeham, take island.
- Transport W of Wellingum - send at East Grinstead, take island.
- TWO Transports W of Hemmel - send at the chokepoint city of Seolesiae.
Land next to it, pillage roads, take and hold the city.
- Transport under Battleship outside coal mtn valley - inf support for above two
- Transport NW of Chatam on our southern Island - take the nearby Gyldeforda isle
- Next turn, transport in Hemel is built - seven tanks in Colneceastre were just
upgraded, load and roll out to either landing zone.
- Next turn, transport in Salsbury is built- fill with Infantry and Tanks scraped
up from around our mainland, also send at Seolesiae of Sussex. Send to where you
think needed.

In total, I think around 24 tanks, 20 infantry, 5 artillery, plus whatever you
scrape up for the Salsbury xport. There isn't much naval 'cover' for these, so
please, declare war and land them ALL whereever they are landing on the SAME
turn! With airports rushed in each spot you can start to 'rebase' bombers and
REALLY start pounding the surrounding countryside. You can also airlift new
tanks and infantry to the Saeolesiae airport you will rush and have enough
reinforcements to take all of Northern Sussex :P (that's the plan anyway)

The transports have NOT yet moved this turn. I would wait until the other two
due next turn can join them (part of the simultaneous landing plan), but feel
free to position or get underneath a battleship.

Those troops on the other 'main continent' -- upgrade when cash is built back
up from cav to tanks (perhaps leaving one or two cav for run in-pillage-run out
operations with their 3 movepts. If any other civ helps Sussex, heaven help
them. With the airport in Henlinstone you can airlift more units in to join
the already potent force and deal retribution. That's why I didn't "pull out"
this force, but left them in place. The boundaries are smallish over there, rush
temples when you get a chance. All cash during the start of this war for upgrades
and rushing, forget science for next 10 turns.

Limited objective war. Three islands and chokepoint, then North Sussex, then
let them beg for mercy and we'll reassess the situation.

Good luck!! :hammer:
Charis

I agree with your reasoning and I love the plan. I've been itching to get in Aelle's face for a while. Kick some Sussex tail, Grey Fox. :die!:

Got the game, if you want to know what happens or help me on the way, I'll be on the CHAT.

Havn't got time to play... Sorry.

Someone play for me instead.

You're up then Xrang. Take no prisoners.

Xrang, please let us know if you are playing your turn.

No responses from Xrang :( so I've got the game. Sussex will rue the day they sought to compete with the grand empire of Essex!

Sorry this is taking so long. Turns take a looooooong time. I'll have the game and recap posted tonight.

Grey Fox - sorry i didn't get Beta 12 to you last night. I spent all my available time on the invasion of Essex. I'll get it to you tonight or early tomorrow morning.

1735 Assault fleet launched. ETA 6 turns. Spice and Silks to Brittany for 24 g/t. Man needs our goods but can't afford squat.

1740 More troops take off for Sussex invasion. Tanks airlifted to Henlistone. Our peace treaty with Cornwall runs out in 3 turns. We'll be ready. Cavalry upgraded to tanks at Henlistone. ROP negotiated with Scotland and Ireland. Troops move into position on Scottish soil to take Bodmine. Brittany won't give a ROP. That's not acceptable. We need to go through their territory one way or another to finish off Cornwall. We'll try again next turn with a bigger purse to wave under their greedy noses.

1745 We start building Elite Ninja Spy units (AKA Explorers). These will run rampant through Sussex destroying their infrastructure. ROP secured with Brittany. Tanks begin moving through Brittany for imminent assault on southern Cornish lands. Bodmine assault force in place. Key units and buildings purchased for air resupply to Sussex beachhead (when we get one).

1750 Sussex Dye supply dries up. The people are bummed. A few entertainers are hired here and there to keep morale up. Ivory and furs from Scotland deal has to be renegotiated. We get raped for 100 g/t.

1752 The assault fleet converging on Sussex looks most impressive! Irish spices must be renegotiated. Grrr. 65 g/t. These insignificant little price gougers are beginning to piss me off. War is declared on Cornwall. Troops move into position for assault. Artillery moves to assault positions. Essex Air Corps prepares to reduce Bodmine to rubble. Several ironclads upgraded to destroyers.

1754 Bodmine and Newton's University are ours. Bombers and artillery pounded them, demolishing the city but leaving the defenders relatively unscathed. Armor took down the defense and elite cavalry finished them off. Now that's combined arms. :) Armor column heads to the southern Cornish holdings. The new Cornish capital of Esse faces the Sussex. All troops in place for assault on Essex in 1756. Disbanded a load of Galleons. We'll never need to upgrade them, they're out of the invasion theatre and are just sitting around costing us cash.

1756 Esse destroyed. Oops. It was just too small to handle the occupation. Troops approach the last Cornish city of Snaefell. MPP signed with Brittany. We no longer have a technological edge. We are behind by radio. War declared on Sussex. The expression on Aelle's face was priceless. Alliances formed with Ireland and Scotland against Sussex. The first Essex carrier takes to the sea with a complement of bombers and a battleship escort. The Essex Expeditionary Force lands on Sussex soil. The northern fleet bombards the Isle of Egeham destroying their barracks and harbor. The main escort fleet bombards the assault target area inflicting heavy losses on Sussex troops. 21 infantry, 24 tanks and 8 artillery units with an escort of 3 battleships for shore bombardment will now face off against the entire Sussex force of 150 infantry and supporting troops. Essex wouldn't stand a chance in a fair fight. Good thing we don't fight fair.

1758 The idiotic Brethon have signed an alliance against Ireland with Scotland. The southern assault fleet takes heavy damage from bomb strikes and fleet engagements. Snaefell is captured. The Cornish are no more. Cornish assault force moves to assault the Manx. Massive shore bombardment and artillery strikes soften up Seoleseia. We have our beachhead on Sussex. Transports disbanded to get an airport functional next turn. There will be no retreat from Sussex. Engagements near Seoleseia produce Sigbert, a great leader! Sigbert will soon lead the first Essex armed assault force. Explorer Demolition Corps takes out the only visible Sussex oil source. Forces deployed around Seoleseia to funnel counterattack into killing fields - forest west of the city. Incoming forces will be trapped for a turn in the unimproved forest giving arty and bombers a chance to pummel them.

1760 War is declared against the Isle of Man. Brittany wants an alliance against Ireland. We tell them no thanks. A new source of oil is discovered in the Cornish Protectorate at Camberon. Peel is taken and the Manx are written into the Big Book of Death. Massive influx of troops through the new Seoleseia airport. Sigbert's new army is successful in its first battle in the killing fields. Salsbury begins building the Military Academy and London starts on the Heroic Epic. Armor engagement produces another leader, Byrhtnoth. Byrhtnoth will be sent back to the homeland to help on the next great project. A total of 28 units were slaughtered in the killing fields.

1762 Massive air battle over Seoleseia. We shoot down 4 enemy bombers but the airport is destroyed. A transport is disbanded to help the purchase of a new airport. Byrhtnoth sets sail for the homeland with a battleship escort. 12 enemy units die, 7 in the killing fields. One of our bombers has been shot down. We begin to expand the perimeter forces at Seoleseia. We need more infantry though and that means we need the airport back.

1764 Another intense air battle over Seoleseia. We lose two interceptors and they lose another 2 bombers. An invasion force lands at the Kent Protectorate. One infantry and one cavalry. :lol: Oh my. Shouldn't have laughed. That lone infantry took out the Kent Defense force (3 tanks). He and the horse he rode in on were finally subdued by Kent's conscript infantry. Airlift to Seoleseia is once again operational. The first carrier group arrives in Sussex seas and assists in demolishing 3 Sussex destroyers. Essex's second carrier group completes formation at Salsbury and steams for the front. 6 tanks destroyed in the killing fields. Perhaps we'll rename these to the training grounds as we are getting a load of elite tanks from here.

1766 We lose 2 more interceptors and take down 1 bomber. Perhaps the Air Corps' early victories went to their head? 4 tanks and 9 infantry die in the training grounds. Sussex is starting to push back harder. They're getting more desperate as well. Conscript infantry was found on the front lines. Thanks to the killing/training fields we now have a stonger military than Sussex. Forces have begun expanding Seoleseia's perimeter northward. We'll aim to take over the continent north of Seoleseia.

1768 Sussex has abandoned air strikes against Seoleseia and are concentrating bombardment on our troops in the field. They've also abandoned their "force reduction" plan of sending troops into our training grounds. Another invasion force hits the Kent Protectorate. This one is a mix of infantry and cavalry, 8 strong. Additional tanks are sent to Kent. The city of Crawley is taken and razed to provide a buffer in the south. Two destroyers and three bombers caught in port and on the airfield when the city fell. Bryhtnoth is home but has no job to do. He parties in London for now. We acquire radio from our allies the Scots.

1770 Sussex is willing to grant peace if we give them one of our loyal wokers. We tell Aelle to go stuff it. This aparently pisses him off severely because Sussex once again launches a full air assault on Seoleseia. 5 Sussex bombers are shotdown, no intercepters are lost. The Military Academy is finished and we'll have a new army unit every 5 turns. The Kent invasion force has been dealt with. A fleet of 5 tin cans (destroyers) begins escorting 2 transports loaded with artillery to the Sussex theatre. They are at the southeast corner of Essex now, ETA 5 turns. Another Sussex destroyer is sunk. The remainder of the Sussex fleet has left the area, ceding control of the seas to us. This is wise as we now have 6 battleships and a carrier in the immediate area.

1772 Sussex sends 3 ironclads to die before our mighty fleet. Theodford falls after heavy bombardment and a lighting strike by Sigbert's Army.

1774 Bixlea falls after heavy naval bombardment and tank assault. Air Corps concentrates on a Sussex counterattack to the south. 9 infantry bombed and then destroyed by tanks.

Game Notes
Sussex is now in anarchy. My guess is they are going for communism.
We have destroyed their entire bombing air corps. They have 6 fighters left but they did not intercept on our last two turns.
Their navy is kaput. They have 3 destoyers and an ironclad left.
I've yet to see a field piece. They have 6 artillery and 12 older pieces somewhere.
Their ground forces are 2 tanks and 108 infantry. I continue to see conscript infantry on the front lines.
On the plus side for Sussex, they have a very advanced force. We annihilated all but 5 or so of their ancient ground troops leaving them with only modern troops. They should thank us ;)
We have about 40 tanks in the Sussex theatre and are producing/shipping in around 5 per turn.
Our air corps has 20 bombers in theatre with a load (too many actually) of fighters for support.
Forces are poised to take Northwic and Staeningum.

Sussex was broken in 1760 with the first slaughter on the killing fields. They are still huge but it is an empty empire. I don't see any need to stop at a few cities. Brehon Law doesn't give us the problem of war weariness, we are producing assault troops faster than Sussex (who's in anarchy now) can produce defenders. We control the skies and the seas. It's just a question of time now as the inexorable Essex ground advance chews through the once mighty land of the Sussex.

There is a transport waiting in Seolesia so tanks can be brought up to take the two northern Sussex islands when the northern mainland is secured.

We have a leader hanging out in London waiting for a wonder.

Science is at zilch to support the massive war production effort but nobody is researching heavily so we're at an even tech level. The only way Sussex can get mech infantry is to research it themselves because the entire world is at war with them.

This was an awesome turn. Charis, your battle prep was excellent. Now take the force you began and have some fun smashing these poseurs.

Here's the file

I hope I will get some waring to do... have no time now though...

Maybe in between my presidential duties.

Charis if you read this Both me and Shaitan want's you as Military Leader in the Democracy game.


P.S. Maybe we should lower the Turn limit to 10 or even 5?

Turns should proceed a bit faster now. They were incredibly long there for a while due to the constant construction tweaking, mobilization, troop movements and combats. The war effort is pretty much on a roll now so it should go smoother. I'd say still go for 15 turns. If you can't get in 15 then put in as many as possible.

Grey Fox, I'm attaching the zip for British Isles Beta 12. It has the new resources you will need for the map. Relics replace ivory and can go in any terrain. Flax replaces silk and can be in plains and grassland. Herbs replace incense and are found in grass land, plains and forests. Mountain only resources are now available for placement in hills as well. Any questions, give me a PM or email.

Thanks!

Forgot the file. Here it is, Grey Fox.

Got it, you can expect the map to be ready very soon.


Please tell me of specific Resources that should be placed in specific resources and whatever else you might want in the map.

The first map will be for 400 AD. The starting positions are:
Cornwall: 50,76
Ireland: 37,51
Man: 51,45
Pictland: 56,18
Scotland: 59,39
Wales: 60,56

For resources:
Use the instances from the .bic file to see how many to use. (Appearance Probability / # civs = # of that resource on map.)
Spawn the luxuries like the game normally does (1/2 of luxury near one area with the rest scattered about) with the exception of relics. Those should be very scattered very randomly all over the Isles.
Heavy coal deposits in Cornwall.
Heavy gold deposits in Wales.
Heavy iron deposits in Scotland/Pictland.
Ireland gets the major source of both herbs and spices.
Put wheat in the south-west corner of Man (represents the Calf of Man).
Put forests with hardwoods somewhere on Man.

I think that's it. We'll eventually get more specific, hopefully with feedback from people who have a better idea than I do what the resource spread actually is ;)

Eventually I'd also like to find the actual locations to place the relics but that won't happen for a little while.

Just got word from Xrang. Those computer problems he was having turned terminal (bad pun in intended ;)). His PC is in the shop and he hopes to be back right quick.

In the meantime - wake up Charis! Phoenatica doesn't need you yet but Essex sure does. ;)

1774 AD (0) - Back so soon to power, Charis O'Saebert had a chance to
take part in the invasion he had planned back in the early 1700's.
This would be a treat. Things looked pretty good, with a very strong
build up on Sussex soil. He was surprised that the islands three transports
were sailing to were still undex Sussex control, but General Shaitan must
have thought every troop was needed on the mainland. O'Saebert had not
given the palty Sussex that much credit :P

The Britons are still in democracy, and Sussex in Anarchy (heading to Comm
or Brehon I imagine). We are at peace with other civs, we have a leader,
And the economy is fair. Widescale tech parity, which means science will
likely stay "off" the rest of the game.

1776 AD (1) - Sussex MUST be in worse shape than I thought... they're attacking
our tank with infantry. They kill one, lose 2. A transport lands on our soil
with... a single tank. (South Island) We capture *ALL* cities in North
Sussex on this one turn (btw, those "goto" moves you had all over the place,
not the ideal thing. After the cities are captured those same moves are 'free',
so now they're stuck with no moves left instead of getting in position for
the assault on Gontabricc next turn :P )

1778 AD (2) - Shfting of forces mainly, almost take Elge, but they have a ton
of defenders.

1780 AD (3) - The once proud city of Grontabricc falls to our Army.

1782 AD (4) - We see several infantry approaching Elge, but not close enough.
Brian Boru, our gracious friend from Ireland, visits us. He would like an
MPP. Usually that means he's about to declare war on someone. Not right now,
Brian, but we'll help beat on your enemies-- Later.

We rebase and shift our 'front' line to Grontabricc.

1784 AD (5) - We trade three tanks in skirmishes in the field. (Would go for
more infantry but they can't keep up :P ) Draft a half dozen infantry home.

We capture East Grinstead. (Did I mention I landed one transport on this island
last turn, and one on the three-city South Island? :P )

At Bedanford the strongest defence we've seen yet, killing two tanks and
forcing a retreat of three elites.

1786 AD (6) - More heavy skirmish fighting, trading a few tanks and inf.

Lygetun falls. This continues the trend of 'divide' and conquer which started
at Seoleiae. What's left of Sussex is again split in two. We also capture the
near North Island, will invade upper ones soon.

1788 AD (7) - Bedanford falls to our elite tanks! :hammer:
Wocchingas falls the same way, right after. Sussex is feelin' a WORLD of hurts!

1790 AD (8) - Sonofabiscuit! We've been shelling 'tiny North Sussex' island for
two turns and letting tank heal. Now their about to land, and in come the
Irish with 3 cav on a wooden ship, landing on the only other square on the
tiny island. Gotta hope Brian takes a beating there :P

More skirmishes in the fields, the AI is considerably more aggressive than
I've seen before, especially for the beating he's been taking.

The people cry out for the Pentagon... maybe we should? Ok, we will.

Cisseceastre of Trip-City island is found with just two defenders, and
easily dismantled. A destroyed and transport caught in dock too.

Sussex is crumbling.

1792 AD (9) - Ouch! Robert the Bruce of Scotland is putting the screws to
us for his Ivory and Furs. Was getting 100gpt, now he gets 145gpt AND some
Wine and Dyes to boot. In 20 years Robert, we'll **TAKE** those as needed.

Brittany doesn't want to extend the ROP? Fine with me. (You're next! :P )

Brettons start the UN! Oh no, no, no you don't!! It's costly, but we
can buy it and rush with the leader we've been keeping. Scots and Brits have.
Almost 3000 gold? Cheaper to stea... er... procure via espionage-based
reseach. We shoot... we score! Fission it is :) We have about 4 Uraniums.

The AI went rabid for conscripts in the field. They killed 3 or 4, but lost
one tank and hurt three so bad they will die. Good trade.

Good bombing run on Steyning, hitting defenders badly for a change. We
press the advantage. The tanks roll in, and crush five weak foes to take
the city! :hammer:

Over on three-city island, Haestingacaester, the last of the three, falls.
The island is now liberated for Essex. There is one buffoon Breton infantry
on the island. 8-\

Ha!! Swithred, a GL, comes out of the battle vs Lancing. I knew with this
major bloodbath and lots of elites, chances were good. But this is faster
than expected. The leader rallies the troops to greater excellence. With
only a 1hp conscript left defending, we try a 1hp tank assault...

... and capture Lansing, with Sun Tzu's Art of War! :hammer:
Having barracks in every city on Sussex' continent is super.

Nine turns is enough, Ten turns is MORE than enough. If I was up in other SG's I
would have stopped at five to seven. (Fifteen is far too long for ~1800 :P )
Been shipping in about 5 tanks or conscript inf per round to Sussex via Seoleaiae.
On the north Island, I've halted bombardment and am keeping the transport ready
to arrive, hoping the cav get themselves killed. Down on the SE coast of Sussex,
a transport just landed to cut-off Petworth. The UN is due next turn, since
rushed. I would NOT hold a vote, we might lose, where military victory is
pretty sure. Spices just renegotiated with Ireland. The treasury should get back
up to 1000 next turn (was low to get Fission) Keep up the pressure,
and come up with a good use for Swithred!

Grey Fox is up I think,
Charis

Great turn, Charis. Sorry about the goto moves. :(

We'll officially change the player turn length to 10 moves.

What's your ETA for total Sussex destruction?

And yes, those "bend over, here I come" luxury deals are getting way out of hand. There will have to be some comeupance once Sussex is dealt with.

You're up Grey Fox. Kick some butt.

Sussex is going down, and going down fast. In just 9 turns they lost their entire north, and lost some not-small, not-poorly-defended cities down south. Capturing SunTzu is going to break their back. The only thing slowing me down on the first half of the turn was our lack of artillery support meaning every attack meant an injury. With one barracks for the whole continent, and never in the town at the front line, re-cupe was slow. Sussex will be dead or within 5 turns of death by the end of Grey Fox turn! When they're dead, give yourself a few rounds to air-transport troops to the other continent (rush build at least 3 more airports in Sussex area), and/or wait for existing deals to expire. This may be 20 turns from now actually, good timing I think. Then MPP with Ireland and take on either Scotland or Bretton. Alone. Then take out the other. If domination is enabled, that's a win. If not, sorry Brian Boru :P

No problem on the goto's -- it's just something we did away with in our other SG games, for pretty much the same reason, the new leader has NO idea where things are going or why, or may be deciding to shift to a different front line city.

In summary: Grey will break their back with 10 turns, next up will finish them off and start *massing* troops via air on our outpost on new continent, and boat-transport the armies. Then next leader will kick off our next big campaign.

Charis

I got the game.


Sussex will not ever see daylight again.

Sorry to keep you all waiting... I will play soon.

Urgh... I forgot... Skip me, I going home to my parents for the Weekend.

Okee dokee. Xrang is still down so I'll take the game and post it tomorrow.

Happy Birthday Grey Fox!

Here is a Beta Version of the Uk-map.

Sweet! Thanks!

Is it playable enough for me to start the "You Decide" story? I don't want to look at it yet if I can use it for that.

It has all resources needed for everything(not all luxaries I guess)... I'm not sure how well balanced it is though.

Originally posted by Grey Fox
It has all resources needed for everything(not all luxaries I guess)... I'm not sure how well balanced it is though.
Sounds good for the story line. Who really knows what's out there?

I just got a message from Xrang. His PC is back.

Xrang, go ahead and take your turn. Please post when you get the save file so we know you're alive on the boards again.

I'm back. Celebrate. Have a feast. Give the Gods their worship and sacrifice. If that news isn't enough, I also have the game and will have it up before (or on) Monday morning... Thank you!

Guys, unfortunately I have two weeks of major testing/studying ahead. I didn't realize this when I posted and said that I was back. Once this "trial" is over I'll be able to have more time and Civ3. Sorry for the late news, I was hoping that I wouldn't have this much work... Good luck and happy Civ(3)ing!

That's a bummer. So are you out for two weeks solid then?

Grey Fox - can you take your turn? If not, I'll take the game and play tomorrow.

In the interest of getting this thing moving again I'm going to play a turn now and post it tomorrow morning.

1794 Chichester is bombed into submission and taken. One bomber was shot down. Petworth is taken. Swithred builds the Manhatten Project. Worthing is bombed and taken.

1796 Brittany signed a peace treaty with Sussex. The traitors. Burgess Hill taken with stiff resistance. 9 infantry units slain and 7 field pieces captured. Captured artillery bombards Windsor. Bombers hit Windsor with no effect except one interceptor is shot down. Massive naval bombardment of Midhurst. Tanks take Windsor with moderate losses. Another artillery unit captured. Tanks and artillery moved into position to attack Midhurst and Selsey. Tanks, bombers and artillery moved into position to attack Brighton and Bognor Regis.

1798 Lancing revoltsback to Sussex. Egeham taken. Massive air bombardment of Brighton and Bognor Regis. Massive artillery and naval bombardment of Midhurst. All three successfully defend with their last infantry. What a fantastic set of battles - one for the history books.

1800 Furious bombardment continues on all targets. Bognor Regis taken. Four field pieces captured. Forces assemble to take Lancing, Midhurst and Brighton.

1802 Bognor Regis falls. Midhurst falls. Selsey falls. A Great Leader, Sigered is born from the chaos of battle. Brighton receives unbelievable amounts of bombardment dozens of bombers and a score of artillery batter the once proud city into ruins. Its defenders fight valiantly but no longer have hope. Brighton falls and 14 workers are captured. Arundel falls.

1804 Lancing is taken. The glorious Sussex empire is no more. Airforce begins rebasing to Bodmine. 3 airports purchased in Sussex (all near Seolesiea for convenience) to begin massive ground troop transfers. 3 transports loaded with artillery. Additional artillery musters in Steyning. The fleet begins maneuvers towards the multi-civ continent.

1806 The Scots want a mutual protection pact. We decline but renegotiate our ROP + incense deal to acquire Amphibious War. This puts us current for technology. MMOT (Massive Movement of Troops). 2 Armies arrive on multi-civ land.

1808 MMOT

1810 Brittany and Ireland have signed a peace treaty. Ireland has only a couple of cities left. MMOT

1812 Brittany and Scotland have signed a MPP. MMOT

1814 MMOT

Notes
The air force is assembled in Bodmine. Tank forces assembled to the south of Bodmine and Henlistone. There are two tank armies on multi-civ continent. Two tank armies and an unbelievable amount of artillery in a fleet convoy from Sussex approaching the Scottish/Brethon border. It will take 3 more turns to complete moving all available forces from Sussex to multi-civ via the airports but I'd recommend against this (keep some forces on Sussex in case of an attack). We have more than 50 tanks on multi-civ right now. This is enough to steamroll whoever we want. 16 workers heading from Essex to Henlistone. Workers on Sussex and Essex have been automated (add/pollution only). There's a leader hanging out in Seolesiae with nothing to build.

I automated the workers on Sussex and Essex. It was just taking too fantastically long to get through a turn and with our massive superiority I was comfortable with a bit less efficiency in exchange for speed.

Our tech is on par with the world - still cranking everything possible into cash for artillery upgrades but that's about done now.

We can conquer whoever we want for a conquest victory. We can build temples in Sussex to grow the borders and get a domination victory. We can sit back and wait for a cultural victory. We could even go for a spaceship with little chance of loss. I don't know about UN at this point. Brittany hates us and Scotland is second biggest. That's two for Scotland - a tie at worst and if Ireland went Scotch we would lose.

My suggestion is to take out Brittany. With the force present on their borders they will fall quickly. My plan of attack would be to make a MPP with Scotland and declare war on Brittany. Don't attack Brittany, wait for them to attack. That way, our MPP with Scotland will be activated. If we attack Brittany, Scotland's MPP with them will force them to declare war on us.

I can't post the save file right now. Each time I try, this post stalls before completing. I will try again later.

I had to put it in the upload system. Here it is:

Save Game (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/Essex1814AD.zip)

Could sombody please take a turn? We're almost done with this game - we can have domination in one or two player turns.

While I can NOT play, a couple of questions come to mind.

1 - Is this an open game and you want ANYONE to play.
2 - Or is this a request for an existing player to go?
3 - Will that latest version of the mod work, or is this game on an ealier version?

Ok Shaitan, got it. (tonight anyway, tomorrow at latest)

Thanks for the bump, TheWatcher :P
We've got a closed roster and are ALMOST done. It's with a (significantly) older version of the mod anyway.

Hopefully we can polish off this puppy before 1.21

Charis

Shaitan,

Sorry, have to pass this round. I've been getting sore wrists/hands a fair bit lately, and let them get a bit worse than they should. Not carpal tunnel or anything, just overuse - day job as programmer and playing most nights will do that. Not just this game, I'm taking about a week or two "pass" in all SG's 8-\

I did open your save up, see if by some miracle it was quick or straightforward. We have about 50% of the land+coastal, if I understood the "MapStats" numbers, so domination won't be there until we take out one of the big countries and halfway into the last one.

Recommendation: go ahead and finish this one up, give us the report :P

:(
Charis

Okay, I'll put this baby to bed. Brittany is my target. They've gotten under my skin from the first meeting. I'll rush temples all over Sussex and pound the Brethons and we'll get domination pretty quickly. The reason we show low in MapStats is that there's no culture on Sussex so we only have half of the island in our cultural borders.

Sorry for not been playing.

But I have been kinda busy, waiting for the outcome... :D