One morning, Bella woke up, dissatisfied. At first, she thought because she was a woman and that this morning would be like any other. But then, she remembered. Being a woman wasn't hard enough as it was, she had to be a woman in power. My god! was the pressure of ruling her city painful. Don't you go talking about a second one ... you get so much pressure for being a woman in the first place.

She looked over her castle's tower and figured it would be much less stressful if she could make her advisors stop comparing her to other women with power. They're just not quite as pretty anyways. And the men ... men don't deserve to rule. They have no feelings. So it was set: she'd go at it and take the heads off the other rulers.

Isabella, after seeing that her will was enough for 2 handfuls of contenders (and she knows the meaning of "2 handfuls"), decided that some of the contenders had to be put to the test. At one point, enough is enough, and getting rid of one of them sounded like a brilliant idea. Namely, Whomp and Tubs. But to please the lady, there had to be some sort of challenge to test their virtue ...

C3C 1.22 Patch
Level: Emp
Variant: Always War :hammer:
Map Type: 'Pelago 70%
Size: Small

Civilization: Spain
Age: Rocky
Temperature: Med
Climate: Med
Barbarians: Restless
Rivals: Random
AI Aggression: Medium


Victory Condition:All enabled
Culturally linked starts: Off
Respawn: Off
Preserve Random Seed: On
Cultural Conversion: On

It will be a relaxed OCC, ie: if the opportunity presents itself, we may hold 3 cities for a turn and build an army.

Please be a DG+ player to sign in. I will honor my invitations and former partners first, but otherwise the roster is re-opened. Please take a minute to read the rules; if you're unsure about any exploit, ask, or better even, refrain.

Roster, Team A:
Mathias
Tubby Rower
Own
Iroquois Plisken

Stolen from Handy, with some shame but great reverence:
No looking at techs, cities, resources, etc in deals unless we have a spy planted with that civ.


Always War Boilerplate as we play it.
You may only trade when you first meet a civilization, and must declare war on the same turn after trading is complete. If you see a new AI unit, you must make contact & declare war that turn. Absolutely no GPT trades allowed. If you see a new face on F4, you are obligated to declare war that turn (after trading). Players must declare war if they are exploring and see AI units, but are not required to actually attack the units they come in contact with. No peace treaties, ever. You may check F4 as often as you like to spy on the AI's tech, resources, luxuries & city count.

Discuss any move that seems exploitive before doing it with the team. Although there are not too many exploits available in AW, we’ll follow the forbidden blatant exploits banned by GOTM and RBCiv such as no "Free Wealth". Other normal game exploits such as "Baiting the AI" with an empty city to create a kill zone are an AW tradition and are allowed. Also, you ARE allowed to initially keep a city, move a settler to the same spot as the city, and then abandon and immediately resettle. This is considered an exploit in RBCiv rules, but is okay in our AW games. In addition if you need to build a city one square deeper into enemy territory just to move borders to steal a resource, go for it. We may keep or raze cities, and can keep slaves. You may whip at will, including captured cities or cities where all citizens are unhappy.

SG Stuff
You have 24 hours for an "I got it" and 72 to play. If you need a one day extension, then mention this before the 72 hours are up. Players can work out skips between themselves, just post a message to the thread. If you can't play within 72 total, switch places or ask for a skip. [10 turns each always.]

Lucky candle to light the way.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads7/HNDY02_luckycandle.gif

I've decided to start this SG after finding this start with mapfinder:

http://archimede.mat.ulaval.ca/~fbolduc/B/B06-Fishy.jpg

I haven't tested it, so it might be a dead-end start. Would we be unable to make it on this map, we may want to try either of these: one is dead north with a good hill/wheat combo, great for production and isolation. The other has ivory - period.

http://archimede.mat.ulaval.ca/~fbolduc/B/B06-North.jpg

http://archimede.mat.ulaval.ca/~fbolduc/B/B06-Ivory.jpg

Edit: I forgot to keep the minimaps. Fish one is halfway south from dead center. Ivory start is about ¾ north, across the left-right border of the map. North one is the very NW corner of the map.

Edit2: #1 and #3 have been edited so as to not have "Respawn AI" on. By some odd strike of luck, I couldn't get either start 2 or 3 to be the exact same as they were: #2 was totally different and #3 is located a few tiles W, right by the ivory (still on a lake though). I did not change #2 for that reason.

In answer to your PM, I will join this. It looks really tough though. I would go for the first one, lack of BG may be a problem though.

Fog-gazing says 2NW is a BG, W-SW a grassland forest (one in 3 chance), and we've got a plains cow, hill+mountain. It's AW material without a doubt :p

Yeah, I knew about that BG, but still not much. By the way, don't you think those huge BG graphics are cheating :P , it's impossible to fog gaze BG's in firaxian graphics.

Signing in (figured I might forget if I waited until morning ;) ).

This is going to be tough: I've never won an AW game, and I've never even played a OCC before, but I've always wanted to.

I'm split between 1 and 3. I'm leaning towards 1 since it seems to have plenty of food and shields. That looks like a freshwater lake the city will be on, though, so we'll have no ocean access (well, with the relaxed OCC rules, that's not as much of a problem).

I'm so in. I would suggest 1 as well. @B Did you check the tiles to see if it's fresh or salt water?

You can stop twisting my arm... I'm in.

Edit:
RE freshwater/saltwater: Seafaring

And so the cards are laid.

Roster (closed, sign-in order, say so if you'd rather have a fancy timezone one or not have to play after me):
Cmdr Id. B - too lazy to move the settler
Own - starts writing on his "eternal Own vs B disagreement" paper
Lt. Sr Id. IP - will soon learn that AW and OCC don't mix :lol:
Major Id. Whomper - has removed his christmas hat .. or was it :queen: Bella ?
Math - curing the evil blisters

It is indeed salty water, with a touch of fresh water, on each. I'll move worker to cow and settle on the spot, tomorrow.

Thanks for the interest :D
For the others, :newyear: and I hope it'll bring a good lurk :)

This SG was filled too fast, can you open extra slot for me? :hmm:
First start is most acceptable, imho.

i would have chosen start 1, but seems...
Sleep, Sleep, Macbeth hath murdered Sleep
ill lurk this one :(
but i would shut up, mind you!!! :D

Holy cow!!! Already filled... I have to stop going to bed so early.

I'll lurk this one. GL

With so much interest, perhaps we should do two groups. It could even become a friendly competition. :D

Well, my God, I thought I'd barely even get a roster for a C3C game.

We're 8, how about two teams of 4 ? I'll randomize the rosters and orders and open a new thread if it is the general wish. I played my set but will refrain from commenting, spoiler issues ...

OCC games are more fast then normal ones, can we manage 8-players roster? :rolleyes:
Maybe make this SG public?

I'm liking the 2 rosters idea.

Ok So I took the order of posting for designation:
1. B, 2. Own, 3. IP, 4. Whomper, 5. Math, 6. Smart, 7. Soul, 8. Tubs

I asked the calculator for log(2)/pi, and took the order of decimal appearances from 1 to 8: 5823 6714

That means roster 1:
Mathias
Tubby Rower
Own
Iroquois Plisken

and roster 2:
Smart
Soul Warrior
Whomp
Beorner

That is, if all the people who have just missed the game haven't lost all the mojo inducing dream of leading Isabella's pimps to an OCC AW victory over the world. The saves and screenies are all in here at everyone's disposal. If I get positive comments about this I'll start a second thread for my B team and lay sportsmanship rules for the competition. Every word of input will be considered with all due idiocy :crazyeye:

Teams like SGOTM? :hmm:
I don't think that it's a good idea, better is to start second SG ;)
And what do you think about making this SG open?

I'm fine either way B. I'd like to try the OCC AWE. I'm always up for beating Whomp down :lol:

Do you want me to open the other thread in order to keep things seperate? The only problem is that some of the players of the old TR (loser series) games might get jealous.

Alright Tubs, a Whomp beating it is. However, I got randomly assigned to Team B (pun intended :p) so this thread is hereby yours. Or Math's, or anyone's for that matter. I'll start B06-B when I get to write my turnlog. If you want me to change anything in the header just send a pm.

If more players show up, they'll be added in the team of their liking, default would be A-B-A-B if they are weakly opinionated.

As for a competition proper, I think beating this will be a good challenge enough. Remember I left all VC's, so 20K is an option. If we both get the axe grinded and the world to Bella's feet, I'd be cool with declaring the winner on either fastest finish or most culture. If either team goes 20K, it'll have to be fastest finish. If you think score means anything :nya:, it can also be considered - though we'll have plenty of time to settle on this. It's not like it was a top concern anyways (except for Tubs and Whomp).

I'll dress my Whomp for war and have at it :ninja:

I throw down the gauntlet at Tubby's feet.

The only thing I see saving him is the quality of individuals surrounding him. For that he is blessed.....I say bring it on brudder!

I'm liking this, too. I'll play my turnset tonight.

My opening move for this game may be a bit controversial - I built a curragh. Being on an archipelago map, I figured that we may be isolated or have only one rival. The curragh didn't get very far before the land mass seemed a bit larger than first expected.

A Russian scout was seen in the east in 3700 BC. We made contact with their leader in 3650 BC, trading Alphabet for Bronze Working and 10 gold. We then declared war because she wouldn't trade Pottery for our Ceremonial Burial, a tech of equal value, even though we offered to sweeten the deal with gold.

Those Russians are strange. They conscripted some barbarians to spy on us from the mountains in the east. Perhaps we could convince those barbarians to relay false information?

In 3450 BC, our curragh sees signs of a civilization in the northeast. (We see a pink border.) The crew is apparently xenophobic, because they didn't approach. Instead, the silly buggers turned the boat around and headed for home. Hopefully, our warriors will be a little less cowardly.

Russian military forces arrived in 3400 BC. Reports indicate that two spearmen and two warriors have joined the conscripts. They approach our city, but we are prepared. Our spearman defeats all 3 warriors and is promoted to elite. The Russian spearmen are less willing to die - they run back into the mountains! One of our warriors follows to watch their retreat, and to be on the lookout for the next assault.

Having recently discovered Warrior Code, we are now able to train Archers to rain death upon the Russians. We are now studying The Wheel. We have 28 shields invested in a Barracks, which could instead be a Temple.

Edit: Attached save removed - see below

As Mathias pointed out, AI respawn is ON for all the saves (why on earth is that ... oh well) so I'll edit the saves post and fix that. I'll ask Math to re-play the same stuff the same way, and I'll do the same on my side. If anything doesn't go as played, use your imagination ;)

Sorry for that, it's a potentially major problem. I don't know how it works at all, and I've played military games with it on where it didn't affect anything, but it shouldn't have to be a gamble.

Edit: all done now. Sorry again, and that's the last you'll see of me beyond page 1. Although it really itches my whole curious being, I haven't read your log :p If you need anything, just do as he did and throw a pm over.

I don't know exactly how it works, but an AI will respawn only if there is an unclaimed area on the same continent at least large enough for a city. I'll replay and post save as soon as I get the fixed 4000 BC save.

I believe they also can only respawn once. So, while we probably could have played on with it on, it would have been annoying.

And I'm not sure about that curragh (too late now, anyway, but oh well). I thought in AW games, you should stay isolated for as long as possible. :confused:

I had a very slightly different experience with the neighbor (which you obviously probably know, so I don't think this is spoiling anyone), but nothing major at all. Although the other outcome was better for me, it's all the same in the end - that game won't be won or lost by a single unit, I don't think so.

If they really only respawn once, on the same continent, they probably wouldn't be too threatening (assuming you have the armed forces already there that beated their whole civilisation thingy). Anyways, GL guys, keep in touch, and I can tell by the look on Whomp's face that Tubs is going down :evil: :lol:

Oh and sorry but IP gave me something ... a curragh ... I just knew I had to read that turnlog. But ... will ... resist ... (hurries and presses send reply before scrolling up)

Well, history has been rewritten. I made several attempts to duplicate the original turnset, but Russia refused to show up in 3700 BC. From that point, I played as though I didn't know Russia was nearby.

Our curragh still saw pink borders in 3450 BC, again without venturing close enough to make contact. But instead of returning to our city, which I did only because we already knew Russia, I explored around the other side of our landmass.

In 3350 BC, a French warrior approached from the northeast. Of course, they start with Alphabet, so all we had to offer in trade was Ceremonial Burial. All they would offer in return was 10 gold. I reluctantly accepted the deal before declaring war, figuring that selling cheap was better than not selling at all.

On the following turn, we discovered Warrior Code. I started research on Bronze Working and switch production from a Temple to an Archer. One turn later, a Russian spearman approached from the southeast. We trade Alphabet and Warrior Code for Bronze Working, Masonry and 35 gold, then declare on them as well. Research set to The Wheel.

We have trained a second Archer, and production is now set for a spearman.

As for building the curragh, I know exploration goes against AW philosophy, but I fully expected to dart off to another island and trade with someone who wouldn't be an immediate threat after we declared war.

What about the colossus? Even in AW it's necessary. To conquer enemies we'll need tons of cash for the unit support.

Oh and sorry but IP gave me something ... a curragh ... I just knew I had to read that turnlog. But ... will ... resist ... (hurries and presses send reply before scrolling up)
:eek: Oops...:blush: Damn. Sorry about that. :rolleyes:

Colossus would be good. We should make sure the Russians are not a threat before we start it, though. I don't want to end up with a half-built Wonder and too few units when the Russians show up with 10 swords.

OK.. I'll play this afternoon after more discussion.

We should make sure the Russians are not a threat before we start it, though. I don't want to end up with a half-built Wonder and too few units when the Russians show up with 10 swords

i don't think it's possible to make them not a threat before the colossus gets built by an AI. And ten swords won't happen either, that's AWD like stacks at this time and in the near future.

sorry about not getting to this today. SGOTM9 took ~ 1.5 hours to play and my daughter got the rest. I'll try tomorrow.

t0 - move warrior 1 E to hill

t1 - move warrior back
move archer to mountain to find 2 russian warriors
(so now we have 2 French warriors to the north and 2 russian warriors to the east)

t2 - IBT - we now have 4 French warriors to the north & 2 Russian warriors and a russian spear to the east
take out a russian warrior with archer on mountain losing 2 hp on our archer but he promotes
take out a French warrior on a plain flawlessly
move warrior to cover

t3 - IBT 3 French warriors attack. 1st two die.. 3rd kills our archer
Ruskies warrior attacks archer on mountain and dies
spear goes south and there is a new city down there
Madrid spear -> archer


t4 - move a warrior out of Madrid
healing warrior and archer

t5 - move 2 warriors to hill near two French warriors

t6 - IBT - a French warrior attacks and kills a warrior.and the frog promotes
Madrid archer -> temple

t7 - vet archer takes out reg French warrior advancing loses 2 hp
warrior moves to cover

t8 - archer moves to be with vet archer and warrior

t9 - IBT - vet French warrior dies only doing 1hp damage to our warrior
Wheel - > IW
Madrid temple -> Collossus

t10 - not much

<< Save >> (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/B06A_2550BC.sav)

http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/6364/bef067qw.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

I have the worker roading that plain to make it easier to get to the spices upon culture growth in about 10-15 turns. We also have horses right outside our borders.

The Frogs and Ruskies have stopped sending troops for the past couple of turns. I think that it might be prudent to hold steady for a bit. The collossus has 1 turn of shields under it. If we don't want to go that way and get more units out then the next player should switch the build before they press enter. An archer or spear might could be built next turn, if not then it will get built in 2.

Wow, those Russians are pretty close!

18 turns for Colossus, not as bad as I thought it would be. How many units do we have?

I think that we have a warrior and spear in Madrid, 2 archers and a warrior off to the east.... and the curraph.

I've been up this whole time :blush: . Play tonight.

Pre-turn- Looks good.

1. Advance on Russian city.

Ibt- Nothing

2. Discover the city is Novgorod.

IBT- Barb appears

3. Get only defender down to one HP and fail to take it :mad: .

6 IBT- Russian archers appear

7. Madrid grows, colossus in ten. Worker goes to road spices, will be done the same turn the borders expand.

IBT- One archer advances, as the other was wounded by a barbie.

8. Nothing

IBT- No attacks yet.

9. Nothing!

IBT- Lose a spear, and kill an archer. Madrid goes disorderly.

10. Nothing, but the game could, and likely will be over next turn. I'll play to find out.

IBT- yep, it is. That loss was on me. I kept building the colossus and stupidly attacked novgorod when we needed defenses. Oh well, what say we try again?

Holy cow.... that's the quickest loss that I've ever had.

You could have left the last turn for IroP to play since he didn't get a chance to play in this one :lol:

I didn't think it was worth a save download. All we could have done was press enter.

Got it. Play tomo--

Wait...scratch that.

Um, so what now? Do we start over from Own's turns or start a new game?

I'm gonna take a guess and say we lost the competition. ;)

Let's start again. That loss was my fault, I underestimated Russia. I'll play more cautious next time.

Oh... Second SG ends in Own's turnset :lol: :goodjob: :lol:

P.S. I dont spoiled any info from other team's game, just open updated threads and saw this :wow:

I've glanced at the other team's thread, and they've gotten up to the 2550BC save. Don't think that I've been spoiled too much if Own wants to re-do his set (a little more cautiously). Especially since I won't play for another 30 turns. I'll just shut up until it's my turn again.

But I would know to play more cautiously, which is like reloading, so I can't do that. We can try again, hopefully we'll have a start as good as this.

Or, I could play what would have been Own's turns, since I haven't looked at a save yet, and don't really know the situation as well as the rest of you do. I know I'll have to be cautious of the Russians, but I won't know much beyond that...

Or we could just start over. Has Beorn been informed yet?

Ok I'm informed now. I think Whomp officially won the gauntlet vs Tubs (with a cleverly assigned random team). I personnally would like to keep playing that map, since WE guys are on a roll :lol: (sorry, but I just had to say it :p).

Well, if you want my approval (sort-of) for what happens now, anything that's fun-oriented is cool :) If Own wants a replay and manages to keep his defenses up, we can still call the ballgame open. If you guys want a part of either other start, I'll be eager to see it happen. Another thing that could be fun is to try it on the more OCC-friendly RaR.

So whatever everyone is up to, if you want this AWOCC thing rolling, just keep 4000BC saves posted so we can share the fun :hammer:

Ok, I'm cool with anything, I'll jsut go with the flow.

I did lose this one, but ask Whomp how the [civ4] PBEM is going :lol:

Talking of MP civ, have they fixed 'real-time' multiplayer in CIV? I know C3C is laggy beyond comprehension on a LAN, but I sure would hope CIV would be LAN friendly :mischief:

EDIT: I just tried RARAWEOCC (yikes, what an acronym); summary: easily contained the opponents (1 on my island), got Slave trade, Colossus and Silk Road, but I got totally absolutely devastated by the MA barbarian uprising. It wasn't pretty. If you try it, put barbs off or sedentary by all means.

I did lose this one, but ask Whomp how the [civ4] PBEM is going :lol:
Wow. One warrior and you think you're Mr. Big Shot Cool Guy on a horse. All I wanted was a cup of sugar. :sad: How about we say "we'll see" because if I recall you don't even know where I'm located. :smug:

Mr. Big Shot Cool Guy on a horseI certainly wouldn't want to stand in that guy's way !

If any of you want in the other team, feel free to just tag along. Smart has just resigned, and we could use the extra heads.