View Full Version : Technology avoidance
atreas Jan 23, 2006, 08:39 PM We all have seen the statement about the technology alternate routes that exist in CIV4. I thought it would be helpful to write a post about the "avoidance" routes that are available in the game - meaning, technologies that you can ommit. I have noticed at least two major of them, but maybe you can find and tell us some more.
Divine Right
If you happen to see someone else discovering this tech much earlier than you, you can safely avoid it completely. This tech gives a new religion (that someone else already got) plus two wonders: Versailles (not the most powerful wonder, especially after the State Property civ) and Spiral Minaret (very useful, but usually the one that found the religion will build it first). Chances are that the best thing you can do is to ommit Divine Right completely (in some cases, Theology is also in the same place).
Military Tradition
As it is (regrettably, IMHO) this tech also leads nowhere - so you can ommit it if you like. But be aware that this tech gives a very strong unit (Cavalry), a very nice National Wonder, plus the ability to have Pacts. If you think you can get Tanks in time you can still ommit this tech, but be aware that your cottages won't be able to live for long in the case you are attacked by Cavalries (say nothing about Cossacks).
Later Techs
Communism and Fascism immediately come to mind, but I would say that only Fascism is an option. Communism not only gives a very important civ, it gives two wonders (Kremlin, Scotland Yard) that are extremely powerful. For Kremlin much has already been written, but I must say that the Spies are probably even more powerful (if you have the cash) - you just pillage all oil squares in your next opponent territory, and finally enter with your tanks.
Medicine also is a "so-so" discovery, as it depends on your current health situation. Usually the problem at that time is military, so you can skip it easily.
Napo981 Jan 23, 2006, 08:57 PM Meditation, masonry, horseback riding
You can delay them until you can buy them cheap unless you REALLY need them.
Monasteries can easily be skipped at first. Masonry is not useful unless you have stone or marble near you, or you want to take a shot at building pyramids. Horseback riding is costly in the early years and have no benefits if you have no horse/war.
Music
A dead-end unless you run for a culture victory
Military tradition
Still a must-have for the national wonder that gives +2 XP. Can delay it unless actively in war.
Artillery
No utility because plane are already available or really near.
Mass Media
Can be skipped if you don't have happiness problems.
atreas Jan 23, 2006, 09:09 PM You are very right about both Artillery and Mass Media (hadn't noticed, especially the 2nd, since my game has finished up to then), but the others arent dead ends (so cant be avoided). Music leads to Military Tradition, and maybe that technically gives an option of avoiding TWO technologies (although both of them are very useful).
Btw, a close look at the chart shows clearly the reason AI statistically prefers Polytheism from Meditation - Meditation can really be delayed as you correctly noted.
Bezhukov Jan 23, 2006, 10:14 PM All the early religion techs can be postponed nearly indefinitely, but its better to clean them up later with 1/2 turn research than to trade for them, or you'll end up later with a bunch of "we fear you are becoming too advanced" messages.
I find cavalry to be underpowered, but West Point rocks the house (I tend to focus one city on mil production the entire game - which is ideal for this wonder. Given that I usually don't have the requisite experience for West Point until Infantry, the tech can wait until then. To prevent cavalry pillaging, don't build cottages near the front, use diplo to give those units better things to do, or move some rifles/infantry with guerilla promotion onto hills across the border in enemy territory. They will draw attacks from the cavalry that would otherwise be pillaging your land.
alexti2 Jan 23, 2006, 11:17 PM Artillery
No utility because plane are already available or really near.
Near? Flight, Combustion, Railroad, Steam Power, Assembly Line, Corporation, Consitution, Economics. That's if I didn't miss some other techs. You can conquer literally half of the world with artillery while researching all those :)
ElJojo Jan 24, 2006, 08:57 AM Meditation, masonry, horseback riding
Artillery
No utility because plane are already available or really near.
Mass Media
Can be skipped if you don't have happiness problems.
It depends on victory conditions. You need artillery to get rocketry to get apollo so it's quite necessary.
Same with Mass Media.
Lots of techs can be skipped according to your goal. Don't go for military tradition if you aim a diplo victory but then you should get mass media etc.
And most of the early techs can be ignored if you're able to get to alphabet first and trade them for one advanced tech with many civs.
snipafist Jan 24, 2006, 09:21 AM artillery is not a tech to avoid. I've had immense amounts of success with oodles of infantry and artillery advancing and grinding an enemy down while I use the time to research tanks. By the time that war is over, I likely just got to tanks and I'm building up to pursue another war. Avoid artillery at your peril, the unit dovetails wonderfully with infantry.
MrCynical Jan 24, 2006, 09:25 AM I'd agree with some of these, but not all.
Divine Right: I wouldn't write off getting the Spiral Minaret just because someone else was first to the tech. This isn't much use if the wonders have been built, so then it can be left until it can be traded for cheaply.
Military Tradition: I generally play builder-style games, so this tech usually gets left. In any case I don't regard this point of the game as a very good one to go to war at.
Meditation: I agree, I almost always end up trading for this after I've invented Alphabet. Even if no one else has it yet, it's rather a gamble going for Buddhism on the higher levels.
Masonry:Nope, don't agree here. I'll often have one of stone or marble I want hooked up, and in any case this is a mandatory prerequisite for monotheism. Judaism is the easiest of the early religions to get, and organized religion is a very useful civic. Being able to build the Pyramids is also handy. Masonry is usually in the first 4 or 5 techs I research.
Horseback Riding: Can obviously be ignored if you don't have horses, and also is fairly useless unless you are in an early war. Horse archers can be useful if you like early attacks though.
Music: Worth going for the great artist if no one else has it, and Notre Dame is quite a good wonder. I often get this fairly early, but if someone else gets there first it can be ignored for a while.
Artillery: Artillery is a verystrong unit when it appears, and in any case you need this for rocketry, so this can't be left for that long.
Mass Media: Not too important if Diplomatic victory is off, but Hollywood is still worth having. If Diplomatic victory is on then this is one of the most important techs in the game so you can get the UN, and guarantee you are a candidate.
emills Jan 24, 2006, 09:27 AM I agree that divine right can be avoided the whole game, but I think music has some great advantages. Mainly the free artist.
In fact, if you are not at war that very moment in the game, I will beeline for music (free artist), then liberalism (free tech), then econimics (free merchant).
Music is great for trade, and the specialists can add to a power city early enough to really conquor in the late game.
Artillery is a must since stealth bombers and mechanized infantry come so late in the game. Since your stack is moving one square at a time anyways, then the artillery do not get left behind and make quick work of fortifications and splash damaging a bunch of troops. (In a late game conquest, modern armor + mechanized infantry + stealth bombers can crush rivals way fast, too fast for artillery).
shadow2k Jan 24, 2006, 10:23 AM You can pretty much ignore a lot of techs for a long time, depending on the situation. Fishing/Sailing might be useless in one game, if you're landlocked. In a recent Emperor start that someone posted, I reached 200AD without having researched Agriculture...because without Civil Service, there was one tile total that I could have irrigated, so there was no point.
Divine Right though...that seems to be a pretty worthless tech to me in most cases. I've never researched it myself.
punchandpie Jan 24, 2006, 11:00 AM Artillery is a must since stealth bombers and mechanized infantry come so late in the game. Since your stack is moving one square at a time anyways, then the artillery do not get left behind and make quick work of fortifications and splash damaging a bunch of troops. (In a late game conquest, modern armor + mechanized infantry + stealth bombers can crush rivals way fast, too fast for artillery).
I agree, Artillery plays an important part in Conquest/Domination victories since the units above come so late, that I can't get them built/upgraded fast enough.
atreas Jan 24, 2006, 06:54 PM Divine Right: I wouldn't write off getting the Spiral Minaret just because someone else was first to the tech. This isn't much use if the wonders have been built, so then it can be left until it can be traded for cheaply.
If someone else has already found Divine Right AND you haven't yet started to search for this tech, percentage play is clearly to avoid it completely. Most probably he will have built the wonder by the time you discover the tech (especially in higher levels) - and even if he hasn't you will have extremely low odds to catch up his lead (unless you have a ready to go Great Engineer or a whole buch of almost pre-cut forests - very rare case and difficult).
Another small note: "avoid" isnt the same with "delay". It's another thing to delay a tech, and another to end up the whole game without ever discovering the tech. In that respect, only "dead-end" discoveries can really be avoided - all others can just be delayed.
Nestorius Jan 24, 2006, 07:41 PM How come no one has mentioned 'Flight'? I never research it anymore because the space race comes right around the bend and everyone is too busy building rocket ships to engage in war. I'm waiting for the day I regret avoiding that tech but so far I consider it pointless to research.
BlackMage Jan 24, 2006, 08:58 PM How come no one has mentioned 'Flight'? I never research it anymore because the space race comes right around the bend and everyone is too busy building rocket ships to engage in war. I'm waiting for the day I regret avoiding that tech but so far I consider it pointless to research.
Turn off Space Race and Diplomatic, then see how useless Flight can be.
AtriumComplex Jan 24, 2006, 09:31 PM Just for reference I did a quick experiment with the tech tree to see what was and wasn't needed to win a space race. I followed the rather standard progression of:
Pottery
Alphabet
Democracy
Assembly Line
Rocketry
Computers
Space Techs
The following techs weren't required:
Agriculture (!)
Hunting
Animal Husbrandry
Archery
Horseback Riding
Literature
Drama
Music
Divine Right
Liberalism
Military Tradition
Communism
Flight
Fascism
Medicine
Mass Media
Composites
Of those techs, Agriculture, Hunting, Animal Husbrandy, Communism and Liberalism (if first) seem that they could be useful in a Space Race.
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