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Second Revolution 2.0
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l158/ringworldwu/civicsscreenie.jpg
Read my strategy guide (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=167984)
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l158/ringworldwu/Civ4ScreenShot0001-1.jpg

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/24675/pcgamerarticle.jpg


I've really enjoyed making the first version of this mod. For any who don't know, this is a fictional mod based on the idea of armed revolt. It is set in an imaginary world of politics gone wrong. It is set one of the most unusual of all modern settings' regions: North America


Playable civ's:


http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l158/ringworldwu/calderon.gif
Leader: Felipe Calderon


http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l158/ringworldwu/harper.jpg
Leader: Stephen Harper


http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l158/ringworldwu/castros.jpg
Leader: The Castro Brothers


http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l158/ringworldwu/marcos.jpg
Leader: Subcommander Marcos


http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l158/ringworldwu/rebels.jpg
Leader: None (Syndicalist commitee)

Leader: George W. Bush
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l158/ringworldwu/BushSalute.jpg


This is the old thread (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=157111) from the early beta testing phase of Second Revolution 1.62c.

This is the current release compatible only with Civilization 4 1.62. The new Warlords version is being written right now! , the first playable beta is out.
Please feel free to post bugs or gripes here! I am tired of political flaming posts, so see above strategy guide to blast me there, in the joke thread.

Curret Civilization 4 1.62 compatible version!


Please use the Civfanatics File database to get these files first!
(http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=2764)

Telefragged 3d downloads mirror (59mb)
download v1.5 (65mb) (http://www.3ddownloads.com/Strategy/Civilization%204/Mods/Second%20Revolution//Second_Revolution_1.5.zip)
second mirror at Civ4Files.com (http://civilization4.filefront.com/file/Second_Revolution;60986)
PATCHPatch v1.6C for versions 1.5 and up here at my homepage!! (http://ringworldwu.googlepages.com/downloads)
PATCHPatch v1.6C for versions 1.5 and up here at 3d downloads!! (http://www.3ddownloads.com/Strategy/Civilization%204/Mods/Second%20Revolution//Second_Revolution_1.6Cpatch.zip)

Screenshots! (some of these are out of date)
Here's the new map for the Warlords edition, still in it's early stages. It is smaller than the old map.
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l158/ringworldwu/preliminarymap.jpg

Here's the F-35 near a civilian mob and a Canadian Patriot Missile:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/2Rscrn1.JPG

Here's Zapatistas and Mexican G.A.F.E. somewhere in Central America:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/2Rscrn3.jpg

Here's Castro's Red Guard, ready to storm the Pentagon:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/2Rscrn4.jpg

Readme will go here,
as well as a list of contributors!!

Reservemated

love the intro screen :rockon:

now i'm actually goning to play the game.

now that i've got the updated beta, i'll start working on that supersoldier you want

also, as someone who's trying to work on the mod...i vote we have a central place for open discussion of progress and otherwise -- i think i suggested this to you in email once

sigh...after about 20 minutes of loading my computer restarted....:sad:

don't worry it has nothing to do with your mod, and everything to do with my crappy computer.

Great work finishing up the beta! The F-35 is awesome. However, as a first edit, I'd suggest having the Zaps start with Neomarxism. After all, they're sometimes even defined as a marxist or socialist group.
Also, I turned on the whiteflag toggle for the civs that needed it.
Here's the wbs file with that edit.

I also uploaded the new flag decal for the Rebels, and new versions of the other flags that needed black alpha channels. I thought I had emailed these to you, Garret, but I guess not.

Enjoy the updates!

sigh...after about 20 minutes of loading my computer restarted....:sad:

don't worry it has nothing to do with your mod, and everything to do with my crappy computer.

LOL hey bro i have a P4 2.8ht and 1.5gb ddrpc2700, geforce 5200 fx 256mb:thumbdown, and i have to run everything on low, and it takes five minutes to load the map now and five minutes for first turn, then it speeds up slightly. If you were running below minimun requirements this thing would be ungainly. :crazyeye:

for anyone who could get this to run...what do you think. im starting game now, and I have to swear not to mod it until it glitches or i win.:king:


also, as someone who's trying to work on the mod...i vote we have a central place for open discussion of progress and otherwise -- i think i suggested this to you in email once

What do you suggest?

oh yeah but first let me contradict myself and upload the patches robo magic man sent me.
i think it prompts you a little into the game for civics change.

uploaded patched version

Another suggestion, change the gamespeed to normal or at the very longest epic. Marathon is way too long. It was set to take over 1000 turns to research any tech in the beginning of my game as the zapatistas.

Sweet I'll have to play this mod when I get the time, as school is almost over for me.

@crazyace
I hope you enjoy, but just remember, its a beta, so if you let me know a glitch, i will try to fix it for you right away!

Another suggestion, change the gamespeed to normal or at the very longest epic. Marathon is way too long. It was set to take over 1000 turns to research any tech in the beginning of my game as the zapatistas.

hmm that sounds reeeeeeally glitchy. lemme check it out. if i put it on something other that marathon, usa researched sh!t in like 7 turns (what fun):rolleyes:

hey robo,
why dont you recopy the mod files from link, its at 1.12 right now. the zapatistas were about 14 turns till research after being nuked a couple times.

Hm, what is the scenario name?
-edit-
Nevermind, I didn't move the map to public maps, however if it all were to just have to be extracted to the Civ 4 folder instead of having to shift folders around. I'll post more after I actually play it. The music is wonderful.
-edit 2-
I believe that the civics should be modified to more adequately define the nations they are supposed to represent. While Fidel Castro is a bit repressive, he isn't quite a police state, while GW under a state of emergency would be more likely to fufill that civic. Fidel is more of a Democratic Centralist with a heavy empahasis on security. Labour also needs work. While those under capitalism are indeed slaves, I believe 'wage slaves' would more adequately define the modern situation.

Also, I think certain civics should be restricted. I doubt Castro plans on becoming a free market anarcho syndicalist nation, nor do I ever believe in such a situation would Bush decide it's time for free speech and democracy.

Nukes are annoying, really really annoying, and if anyone plans on ruleing anyone elese, I doubt they would nuke the territory they plan on taking. I am also rather sure that Castro, Marcos, or the Anarchists would bomb the people they want to liberate. No nukes please.

Also, I doubt the UN would still function under such circumstances.

vive la commune!

vive la revolution!

hi lief good to hear from you again!

#1 the scenario is the "Second Revolution" but could also be called Second Revolution of the Americas.

#2 I like your idea about nukes, unfortunately this will make the scenario even harder for the revolutionaries. I will leave them avalible to allies ang take em away from rebels (the rebels wouldn't use the deathstar, would they?)

#3 As far as the civics, i only have one measley column of custom civics because my brain is to small to figure out a whole page of them. if you have better ideas, let me know. as far as the AI switching to unusual civics, when i played last, Castro immediately turned to Free Market (go figure). i cant change the AI until SDK comes out!!! :mad:

#4 I plan on taking more functionality away from UN by increasing the percentage of votes needed to pass a regulation (as i have already done for diplo victory)

Please keep up the correspondance, and after i get enuf suggestions, ill patch the map & mod again.

thanks!:goodjob:

EDIT: teaser image is now attatched. enjoy. any reccomendations? leave a reply!

also note: i havnt decided where to put the bracing handle or even what type of butt to use(foldable, extendable, modular...)
if you have a suggestion as to where or what type, let us know!



Original Post:
just got 3DS reinstalled after a nearly-disasterous drive failure last night. i'll be editing this post and showing you a teaser sketch for the new GeneteTrooper weapon. i'm making an all-new modular weapon system from the ground up, based off the design of the OICW. first step is to model the machinegun element...then the grenade launcher. i'll be submitting a sketch first sometime this afternoon/evening and then the model render(shading only) tomorrow. i'll be working on the textures for some time as i want it to be low-resolution but high-detail

holy sh!t bro that looks badass. are you godlike nuf to animate this one too!
:worship:

sorry to hear about drive faliure! i just poured coffee into my new keyboard 2 nights ago and had to format, losing all of my files for scenario. fortunately the mod was backed up online!

the model may not be done until this weekend.
college, my screwed up car and my personal life have all swirled into a massive wad of "WTF". i'll keep everyone up to date as i actually progress -- if i get the free time, that is.

Is it possible to get an explination of this Mod? It sounds cool but I would like to know what I am getting into before I download it and give it a run!

the model may not be done until this weekend.
college, my screwed up car and my personal life have all swirled into a massive wad of "WTF". i'll keep everyone up to date as i actually progress -- if i get the free time, that is.

sounds cool to me. i got a 1 month old so (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=159592) i know how you feel with not having personal time, im busy playing with my baby boy! but let me tell you, i am excited. are you gonna do the python?

@BFD8656,
im going to update the top posts with material from the old post so look to the top!!

yeah, you told me about the kid and i read it awhile back...but as far as...
are you gonna do the python?
i'll have to look in to how Civ 4 handles it

yeah, you told me about the kid and i read it awhile back...but as far as...

i'll have to look in to how Civ 4 handles it

yer the man!! when u figure it out, magically teach me some how!:lol:

Okay, I'm posting this thread into the weekly downloads section, as i've updated.
@roAm
when you get the Gene Mod tech troop model done, I'm going to resubmit the mod and also add any updates at that time.

Okay, I'm posting this thread into the weekly downloads section, as i've updated.
@roAm
when you get the Gene Mod tech troop model done, I'm going to resubmit the mod and also add any updates at that time.

not a problem...if i dont get the model done, i'll at least get the GeneTrooper's code or defaults working alongside of some texture editing(make him look like i think he should and just change the weapon slightly as far as textures)

i dont want to push my computer more than nessecary right now as its running at 75*C idle, which is extraordinarily hot. probably due to the drive being removed and now theres a big air gap above one of the intake fans...but, if i can get my temperature down(hopefully this weekend), i'll work on that model

EDIT: i may try to oil cool my rig...i've seen some nice results and can get some non-conductive oil fairly cheap

what rig are you running with?

please dont give up on that model! i know you can do it. i think its going to be hella badass.

fixed link temporarily

I can't decide if I want this Mod or not, please put some screenshots so I could see how cool the mod is :)

what rig are you running with?

please dont give up on that model! i know you can do it. i think its going to be hella badass.

i run a custom-built box running an an Athlon XP 2400+, 1gb of PC2700 DDR, 400gb storage(3 drives, 160, 80, 200...and yes, i know thats way more than 400gb but 40gb are automatically taken away from certain essentials(apps and stuff i keep long-term) on an Asus A7V8X motherboard. GPU is an ATi x800 XT PE overclocked slightly(its a cpu temperature issue, not gpu...gpu stays cool)

as far as the model, i havnt given up, but i may postpone it for a week or so. i'm trying to make arrangements for a trip to europe. my personal life fell apart and i dont feel like dealing with any of my family anymore...so...the soon-to-be-ex-girlfriend of a friend is probably coming with me

Posted Screenshots on post #3!!!!!

@roAm
I hope everything works out at home. Keep in touch fer sure!

#3 As far as the civics, i only have one measley column of custom civics because my brain is to small to figure out a whole page of them. if you have better ideas, let me know. as far as the AI switching to unusual civics, when i played last, Castro immediately turned to Free Market (go figure). i cant change the AI until SDK comes out!!! :mad:

Just tie any civic you want to disallow to anyone to a unique tech, then give that tech only to the people you want to adopt it and deny it to everyone else (there's a <DisableTechs> tag in the CivilizationInfos XML files).

can you exlplain more? can you show me a lump of xml fer me to cutty-pasty?

:D Yeehaw!:D
I stupidly didn't install this in the public map place, but this still is the funniest mod ever!!!:clap: I'd sit there, and Fidel Castro pops up and talks to me, I laughed so much. :yumyum: Then, yes I'm still not done ranting, I met Bush, those words were pure comic genius, you should be a stand-up comedian if you get the time.:old:
Again, kudos. This is a brilliant mod!:yup: :yup:
Please fix this too:
The non-nuclear nuke, (hooray for oxymorons) doesn't move, I can't nuke with the nuke:confused: Why is that? It doesn't even have a range either.
I also hope that you'll add some more techs and fill up the gene mod tech.
GOOD WORK!!!:goodjob: :clap:

Is it possible to get an explination of this Mod? It sounds cool but I would like to know what I am getting into before I download it and give it a run!


just do it and have fun :nuke:

tried to download

the link takes right back to page 1 of this thread

@ prext and anyone else, i got in with telefragged 3d downloads and now have a (hopefully) non-crappy mirror. Go get it !

@tycoon101
i tried the fusion bomb on the map as bush by placing the bomb in city while in the World Builder. i then went back to play and launched it at Seattle and it launched, but got shot down by SDI. so it looks like it working. These units never move from the place they are built. i will further playtest it.
The roAm is currently working on a trooper for gene mods tech that will carry a modular assault rifle and will also (if we can figure out the python) have enhanced healing ability after battles.

keep the responses coming in! thanks everyone :)

Ok, so there will be lots of lag once i start playing.... i need to get another 512 MB Ram card.

Hey, any chance of making Texas an independant civ?:mischief:

@ darkedone02
i hope it runs for you, its actally rather challenging and fun on noble

@ The Omega
that would be crazy. no seriouslysomeone should do a texas mod like SoCalian is doing for california


i am going to add more download mirrors as soon as i find them :D

Hmmm...

I love the concept for this mod.
Your intro music and title screen are fantastic - they really set the mood.

A few problems/suggestions:

1. The prime minister of Canada is Stephen Harper - not Harpers.
2. Make the st. lawrence a navigable river (ie: lakes) - this makes for much more realistic strategy
3. Why not make another Civ - french Canada. Seperatists have been active in Quebec for years.
4. The placement of some of the cities is way off. You have the St. Lawrence travelling due north, which makes Montreal north of Ottawa. Also, you left out Canada's primary industrial city - Hamilton.
5. Buffalo is not on the eastern seaboard.
6. I think that there are a few too many northern Canadian cities. Perhaps bring the number down, and make them actual cities, rather than 'forts'.

I haven't had time to test the gameplay, but I look forward to it. I might tweak the map a bit and send it to you.

Also, might it be possible to get a write-up for the scenario itself. When, Who, What, Where, Why, How, etc?

Great job so far. Keep it up. :goodjob:

PS: I had no problems loading and the load time was not that bad. Although I would suggest scaling the map down for playability factors.

@zxe
I have noted your comments on a little post-it note. I will have to put these changes in 1.24. i have messaged you too.

I kinda like your mod, here are some things that i suggest you put to make this mod better

-More Music then your opening theme
-More Custom Units
-Try working on Animated Leaders
-Different Religions(Own Custom Civ Religion)

I kinda like your mod, here are some things that i suggest you put to make this mod better

-More Music then your opening theme
-More Custom Units
-Try working on Animated Leaders
-Different Religions(Own Custom Civ Religion)

You're posting this kind of suggestions everywhere right. That sure helps a lot!:rolleyes:

@darkedone02
I had been thinking the same thing about the music. Im trying to think of only bands that couldn't possibly sue me (rage)
as for the units, send me some models and i'll add units right away! seriously though, im looking for someone who can model either a police land unit (3 person stlye infantry type) or a police cruiser vehicle. I would like them black uniform and american style.
animated leaders wont happen unless someone gets CivArmy or one of the other bada$$ leaderhead makers.
i need help with religions. if you email me i would appreciate it. the adress is on third post.

@darkedone02
i need help with religions. if you email me i would appreciate it. the adress is on third post.

Based on the theme this mod has, what if you simply looked at religion as the underlying ideology of each faction? So instead of trying to think up new religions or make existing ones make sense, you'd be focusing on creating ideologies that spread, such as freedom/democracy for GB or socialism for Castro, etc. Maybe if your oppenent concentrates on "winning the hearts and minds" of your people he could flip your city or create unrest. Just a thought anyway but I would think something like that would work within the current religion model.

i like it. i like it

I was also just thinking that the missionaries could be called propagandists instead. You might have already thought of that though.

i aint dead yet. expect an update by monday.

By the way, if anybody likes this mod or thread, could ya rate the thread :goodjob:

@LuvToBuild
why dont you start the coding then! lets do it

@roAm
HELL YEAH!!1 can you give a teaser on what you gots???

EDIT: the death of a good friend has slowed progress down -- friday night there will be a big update, hopefully

a teaser will be edited into this post by(edit: the end of) this weekend

what i've gotten partially working:
**genetetrooper healing ability
**a few new types of ballistic missiles(non-nuke, all using same model so far[temp])
**a spreadsheet to help ease the work involved in unit modification -- it gives you reccomended values for other units when you modify the strength of one(based on easy formulas)

what the teaser will include:
**genetetrooper weapon schematic...same as previous posting...only more detailed, from more angles *and* upgraded
**a better, more-realistic breakdown of proposed unit strength/ability changes(spreadsheet that *will* be compatable with almost all office apps)

sounds great!! i bet that spreadsheet will be useful for many other mods too!

Hey All. Have you guys seen this (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=165591) unit yet?
I could see it as a police-state style armoured vehicle.
Could be a great addition...

heck ya im gonna use it! thanks bro. i think im gonna make it into some kinda APC.. hmmm

*to be continued...

I have some great additions for the mod, ive replaced the T80 skin with a more complete model (using snafusmith's T72 model)
added nautil's MiG 21 as a easy jet for civ's with guerrilla, taking yet more heat off of having to research composites. i also added rabbit white ACV as a mech infantry iwth power of 40, 30% intercept, and transport for 1 (will this work?)

soom: i will edit the map a wee bit and clean up canada!

@roAm
how's the update coming? Can we get your unit in before next week's downloads??

a friend died on saturday, funeral was last night. wednesday is always a tough day at school for me...so i wont be able to work until Thursday...but for all those eager...it'l be worth it :)

aw man, im sorry. i had a best friend pass last april 12th. i was grieving for 50 days, according to buddhist tradition. i hope you feel better soon, my friend.

I successfully downloaded your mod. However, the game would not load. When I selected the mod, it would begin to load, and said the green progress bar got all the way to the end, but then the program just started churning and would never actually load or let me play.:confused:

@sgtfury
what pc are you running? mine takes 3-5 minutes to load the game in my estimate, maybe more. have patience, my friend. anyway, i have a NEW PATCH (http://www.3ddownloads.com/Strategy/Civilization%204/Mods/Second%20Revolution/Second_Revolution_1.3.zip) that could help, but has way way way more content so it could take longer (although it really didnt take longer on my machine.

UPDATE IS OUT

if anyone has downloaded this big one, can you tell me what you think?

I will try it with the patch and see if that helps. It was "loading" for more than 15 minutes, so I figured that was enough time and had to unplug the computer to get it to stop.

Oh, BTW:

Regarding Religions:

I was planning on instituting the following two religions for my MOD(however, they should work fine for yours as well):

1. Socialism
2. Fascism

This way, you can concievably make certain Canadian cities Socialist (Hamilton), while others could be Fascist. Just be sure to explain the differences for people who don't understand. You could use the results of the last election to determine who is who (ie:all Hamilton ridings voted NDP).

with

Socialism essentially being: an economic and social system where the means of production are owned by the people: ie: public water, public hydro, public welfare - often public factories.

and

Fascism described as: A system of government that exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with belligerent nationalism. ie: modern federalist U.S.ofA.

This way you can have certain buildings buildable only in cities with socialism (ie: hospital, school, etc) or only fascism (ie: military base, indoctrination centre, concentration camp) or give a +25 military bonus or whatever...
------------
Or something as simple as right and left, although thats a bit reductive, especially in the U.S., where the right is Skull and Bone Republican G.W. Bush and the left is his Skull and Bone Democrat cousin Kerry. :crazyeye:
------------
Just for an alternative, I toyed with the idea of "what we worship" as the major religons:

So: currency(capitalism), stuffs(materialism), community(socialism), etc
------------

My only reason for not suggesting any actual religions is because for your MOD you have the US, led by Bush, who is a 'Christian' who also worships Moloch (ie: skull and bones), so I had a hard time imagining how you could fit all that stuff in there. Just some ideas, as requested by the new readme.
-----
It would be great to have religions in, though, just because it gives you a meaningful relationship with other civs.

Will be playtesting the map today.
Keep it up:thumbsup:

Ok. I made some major changes to the northeastern seaboard. What do you want me to do to the cities before sending it to you? I can set them up with accurate populations, etc...

I think you should place the units, just because I don't want to skew it gameplay-wise. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised with the new map, plus it will let you add a couple of wonders: Niagara Falls and Stelco-Dofasco. Plus it gives the rebels a bit more resources in the east.

Hey as far as the map goes I can't believe you have Edmonton as a city and not calgary. Calgary is not only Larger than Edmonton its way more popular and better developed. Also how is there not oil near Edmonton or in Western Canada (Alberta mainly). They have the massive oilsands that is the second largest oil deposit in the world not to mention tons of natural gas. Just google "Athabasca Oil Sands" or better yet look it up on wikipedia. So I would really like to see these 2 changes. Thanks.
Paul

@zxe
can you please email them to me. i will PM you dont worry. by the way, download the new patch! maybe we can get your updates out on a newer patch b4 weekly downloads!

@paulk
thanks for the interest, and as you can read above, we are updating as we speak! keep yer eyes open for the next update!

Since you are busy on updating the game, i got a question for you, are you going to make a Second Civil War Mod? I got the perfect Idea for the main plot.

@darkedone02
start a new thread for that and i will post there :goodjob:

if only there was a mod request forum, i be happy to post it there.

post it strait into civ4 customization and creation

look at my Sig and click the link, there is my topic of the idea for the Second Civil War Mod.

sorry for such the long delay...the teaser will be up by Sunday, 5PM EST

i'm probably going to be kicked out of my house in 2 weeks, so i've had to find someplace to stay so that took priority over this mod. things are sorted out, i hope...anyway, if for some reason i'm offline and dont update for awhile after the teaser, dont be surprised. however, the teaser will likely include some of the coding modifications and otherwise. i've already tested the genetrooper abilities and i just want to refine them some more...as for the skillbuilding spreadsheets, they're almost done, i've been working on them while at school :)

Do what you gotta do bro. i know exactly where you are coming from. just dont be like me and join the army when you get kicked out :rotfl:

played your mod and liked the concept. some points I had issue with was the syndicate rebel faction combat crippled at start. points follow.

1. starting with prop fighters in 2007 - obsolete arn't any.
2. T-80's ain't any in north america.
3. rebel faction units (modern armor) at full strength getting killed my 1/2 strength infantry units but never will a 1/2 strenght rebel unit kill a full strength U.S. or canadian unit.
4. peblo bay a isolated size 3 U.S. city getting a unit of modern armor every turn form nowhere I could figure.

givin the sitution the rebel faction would start with the same type of armor and aircraft as well as infantry besides the girialla and rebel units it would just be a matter of numbers and they would still have a long row to hoe concidering the length of time it takes to pacify captured citys and the long production time for replacement units and such.

I due like the mob tho - just offering some points for concideration.

Cheers

yeah, i play as rebel alot too. i would definately recommend Noble or less.

1. i have added MiG-21's-still obsolete, but more believeable

2. T-80's give up 2 power for 10% withdrawl and more than half off price. i did get hung up a bit though now that i remember, what is your advice?

3. I had no problem with this beyond the normal getting pissed over statistics. use guerrilas more that t-80's is my advice. after fusion power, all land units get +1 movement, so infantry, with the advanced mobile technology, can move 2 spaces. what would your suggestions be?

4. pueblo bay, is that in texas?

some of the other problems like extra units, has been aliveated with the newest patch, including a great canadian fix by zxe.

Please keep it coming!
Download at top post

my advice would be to to replace the t-80 with 1/2 the number in modern armor units.
I was playing warlord diff and basicaly pissed off most the t-80's in a failed attempt to take los angeles in the first few turns. just as a test you might try and see how many t-80 a single mec inf fortified in a town can hold off and judge from there.

pueblo bay is in the upper left of the map.

focus more on using guerillas against LA. the Battle for Los Angeles will never be an easy one :p

i am currently playing as castro on the yet-to-be-released 1.4 version. the music i added makes this scenario quite playable, in my opinion.

Yesterday i played as Rebel Coalition and took western half of the United states, before castro and marcos declared peace! so i made peace with bush (not after taking a 'piece' of his country)
LO and behold, canada, with whom i had made peace with early on, declares war on me. so i start taking bites outta the canucks (jk)

my castro game is going good. i invaded hard into florida and up through georgia, and now i finally took Washington DC. BTW, guess where the palace jumped to? ...Dallas TX :rotfl:

1.4 Patch is out! see top

looks like 1.5 patch will have to wait until i debug the 1.61civ4 patch version.

:bump:
i think i will have an entire upload section for the Second Revolution 1.5
this will be a complete conversion to the civ4 1.61
i will have it reading in a day or so.

i sent you an email with the map fixes.

two concerns:
1. Stephen Harper - not Harpers
2. I think the tech cost is too high - but I'll know for sure when i have some time to play it through

cheers:beer:

1. im still trying to find the file in which it is still "harpers", im lookin though
2. LOL that sucks, coz i just raised the prices about 2,000 rp

:goodjob:

Comeon everyone! Use Mexico to conquer the free world! The mexico fix is out if you've been dissapointed before.

:bump: :bump: :bump:

The new Versions for 1.61 are OUT!
see top post

Probably temporary, but 3ddownloads gave me an error when I tried to download 1.5.

and

is 1.5 the version compatible with civ1.61? Because above the link it says that it has only been tested with civ 1.52.

jeez, facking versions drive me insane.:crazyeye:

LOL sorry bout that! i clicked it and it brought me to the waiting window with a 5 minute wait. try again soon see if it comes. if not i will have my second mirror soon

Sorry. Should have been more specific.
The link is fine. I was sent to the same window. (6 Minute wait)

When I click the download link I get the following error:

----------------------------
File Not Found TeleFragged

We're sorry, but the file or directory you requested could not be found.

Chances are that the URL you used to get to 3D Downloads was incorrect or old, and that the file you wanted has moved or was deleted.
-----------------------------

trippy holmes.
i got it to start downloading somehow... oh well just try later i guess and civ4files should have their mirror soon

Come get the 1.61 revision and Check out my strategy guide for Rebel Coalition!

Just wanted to drop a line about my enjoyment while playing this mod. It is an obsession to play the Syndicalists and screw around there. The soundtrack is good, and I am rather pleased all in all with the mod's presentation. Much obliged for it.

PS- Almost took Washington with the Syndicalists until Bush dropped a nuke on the troops outside of D.C. True to life, true to life!

Just wanted to drop a line about my enjoyment while playing this mod. It is an obsession to play the Syndicalists and screw around there. The soundtrack is good, and I am rather pleased all in all with the mod's presentation. Much obliged for it.

PS- Almost took Washington with the Syndicalists until Bush dropped a nuke on the troops outside of D.C. True to life, true to life!

Thanks alot! I enjoy syndicalists too. you might want to look at the strategy guide for rebels at the very very top of thread.
I hope you downloaded the newest version (1.53), it has a whole bunch of new music!

Looks like an interesting mod. You've obviously put a lot of hard work into it. :goodjob: I will have to download it and give it a try.
I have tried to be acurate as possible with city placement, but any suggestions would be welcome.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/2Rscrn2.JPG
Here's a couple that I noticed. Hope it helps ...
Philadelphia should be closer to DC and NY
Atlanta is south of Knoxville
Knoxville should be moved slightly southeast (what about Nashville?)
Jacksonville should be in Florida, about level with Tallahasse
Plainview and Amarillo are both WAY TOO far north

My personal favorite, though:
You have included Del Rio and Acuna but left off San Antonio! :lol: For some odd reason,
this just cracks me up! :lol: Most folks have never heard of these two towns. Good job
on placing them! ;)

I was born in Del Rio LOL



I hope you enjoy it one of the hardest things in this mod was city placement on the grid.

You have Philadelphia where Kansas City should be...

And why is New Orleans size 16 in 2007?

Also, you still have Topeka and Wichita KS, those could replace the "Southern Survivalists".

For between NO/Mobile and Memphis, you could have Jackson, MI

http://www.united-states-map.com/usa948c.gif

Also, where Kansas City is, the Kansas river should run from connecting to the MO river to the Arkansas river.

Kansas should also have oil wells as well as crops such as corn and wheat.

I was born in Del Rio LOLThat it explains it! :lol: I spent several years at Laughlin.

thanks, my map pretty much sucks, but i can always improve it for next patch!! i will check here in a day or two to cunsult for patch. BTW nice map....

You have Philadelphia where Kansas City should be...

And why is New Orleans size 16 in 2007?

Also, you still have Topeka and Wichita KS, those could replace the "Southern Survivalists".

For between NO/Mobile and Memphis, you could have Jackson, MI

http://www.united-states-map.com/usa948c.gif

Also, where Kansas City is, the Kansas river should run from connecting to the MO river to the Arkansas river.

Kansas should also have oil wells as well as crops such as corn and wheat.

Bugs:

I'm noticing that on a lot of the units, techs, and civlopedia stuff there's this wonky text like BLAH_blah_blah. Also, most of those custom units don't have avatars for that little circle thing that points to them when you have them selected but off of your screen. It's also very slow. The history for the Syndicalist Comittee (sp?) is missing, but you probably already knew that. I tried running this on multiplayer with a friend of mine, but Gamespy disconnected us after a while. I'm not sure what's up with that, it may have just been random.

Suggestions:

I've always thought civ was missing something by not having generals. It's not huge, but it would be cool. On the other hand, assassins would be huge. You could make the actual leaders great people, and then make it possible for assassins to take them out (or make regular spies capable of assassinating). Likewise, you might need to watch out for assassins. It spices things up a bit. You've either got to keep your leader moving, keep him surrounded by troops and spies of your own, or both.

I think that covers it. This a great mod, I'm completely addicted.

great expect a patch for next weeks dl's

thanks, my map pretty much sucks, but i can always improve it for next patch!! i will check here in a day or two to cunsult for patch. BTW nice map....

I happen to, um, have a map of US military bases. I can help you out here. I'll just list a couple of places that might be important here.

There are submarine bases in San Diego (CA), Norfolk (VA), Norwich (CT)?, Portsmouth (NH), The farthest north island of Hawaii with cities, and Guam. That's probably not complete, but something to think about.

Whiteman air force base is located south east of Kansas city. It has Minuteman nukes and B2 stealth bombers.

Minot air force base also has nukes, and it's just north of Minot (ND). Also in North Dakota is Grand Forks air force base. It's west of Grand Forks (ND), and it has nukes too. Lastly, there's Malstrom air force base, located east of Great Falls (MN), and it also has nukes. Again, this probably isn't complete.

In total, the US presently has enough nukes to wipe out the entire surface of the Earth. Most of that comes from nuclear submarines, but at least a third is probably land based. Something to consider.

Oh, which reminds me of a criticism. When you start the game, you have more military power than the US. That's fun, but in all seriousness, the US has the most powerful military force in the world at this time, and you're playing as a bunch of rebels. I was able to take Washington before my first turn had ended. I mean, that's just weird.

At least on harder difficulties, your military should be way smaller. I can see starting off with major cities, those would be prime grounds for urban guerrillas, and nearly impossible to control against popular support (Bush is at 33% support right now, and dropping, so if a war of this type did break out, you can expect it would be hell for him to try and control the major cities).

The main areas you would expect to see guerrillas would be the blue spots on this map:

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/countycartlinearlarge.png

It looks all twisty because it has been rescaled based on population. Here's the same map before rescaling:

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/countymaplinear.png

As you can see, large population centers have a lot of democrats. That means more passive and active support for the rebels.

Another thing that bothered me about this was the old Soviet stuff. How did Russia get involved in this? That would probably be best fixed with an entry in the Syndicalist Comittee entry. But without that, I imagine the best you'd have would be jeeps outfitted with some AK-47s and junk armor, or possibly stuff stolen from US army bases. That's not really good enough to handle the most powerful military force in the world.

Edit: Before I forget, I got composites and I got a lot of stuff that composites didn't say it would give me, and didn't get a lot of stuff it said it would. I didn't get a stealth bomber, I did get mobile artillery, for example.

Oh, which reminds me of a criticism. When you start the game, you have more military power than the US. That's fun, but in all seriousness, the US has the most powerful military force in the world at this time, and you're playing as a bunch of rebels. I was able to take Washington before my first turn had ended. I mean, that's just weird.

At least on harder difficulties, your military should be way smaller. I can see starting off with major cities, those would be prime grounds for urban guerrillas, and nearly impossible to control against popular support (Bush is at 33% support right now, and dropping, so if a war of this type did break out, you can expect it would be hell for him to try and control the major cities).

...

As you can see, large population centers have a lot of democrats. That means more passive and active support for the rebels.


Two responses come to mind:
A- I realize the military is a mighty force indeed, but it is made up of people. I kind of assumed when I played this game that what I was looking at was a coup of the people, and it was a light fictional interpretation, not a serious attempt at predicting what a Revolution would look at. I mean, as much as I enjoy playing a bunch of anarchists bent on beating back fascism, Anarcho-Syndicalists are not known for their war streak really. They kind of turn to beating at each other for involvement in the machines of power as was displayed in the Spanish Civil War. That said, imagine it more like factions in the US army turning over to the Rebels. Training and discipline can crack under sheer social audacity.
B- I don't know if being Democrat or Republican has much to do with supporting rebels. I live in New Hampshire, and our Republicans are the old guard type in theory, interested only in keeping the government from getting too insane. "Live free or die," had to be approved by more than one political party I assure you ;) . Republicans up here might actually support a rebellion, and I am sure others would as well depending on the circumstances.

That said, I hope this is a fair counter-point there Norseman, and thanks for helping Garrett. I love this mod, so any support is right on.

That said, imagine it more like factions in the US army turning over to the Rebels. Training and discipline can crack under sheer social audacity.

As a member of the US armed forces (USAF), I have to say I definitely disagree.
Yes, we are made up of society and as such are affected by things that happen in and around us just like anyone else. However, most of us love our country, and that's why we're a part of the military. I personally think seeing it fall apart would only strengthen our resolve to keep it together. Now, I'm not saying that this isn't a good premise for a mod (and I LOVE, this mod) and there have been times in the past (only 1, the Civil War that I can think of), where something like this has happened, I just don't see it happening anytime soon.

Just my 2 cents. My main point is to try and be a little more sensitive to who might be reading what you post. Some things do strike close, regardless of whether you meant it.

-Smitty

Two responses come to mind:
A- I realize the military is a mighty force indeed, but it is made up of people. I kind of assumed when I played this game that what I was looking at was a coup of the people, and it was a light fictional interpretation, not a serious attempt at predicting what a Revolution would look at.


Exactly. That's why the units I had confused me. It's all soviet surplus, there aren't any hijacked tanks or stealth bombers or anything, like you'd expect.


I mean, as much as I enjoy playing a bunch of anarchists bent on beating back fascism, Anarcho-Syndicalists are not known for their war streak really. They kind of turn to beating at each other for involvement in the machines of power as was displayed in the Spanish Civil War. That said, imagine it more like factions in the US army turning over to the Rebels. Training and discipline can crack under sheer social audacity.


Which is why I was wondering why it was all soviet, and not US equipment. In the opening engagement of such a war, I would expect the regular US military to face a lot of betrayals, spies, and people fleeing the army, taking what they can with them. The rebels wouldn't have the military advantage, they'd have classified information, war plans, and such (whereas the US military will have lots of satellite and aerial recon, but not so much intel about the motives and plans of the rebels). War plans make it easy for the rebels to concentrate their forces where the enemy isn't.


B- I don't know if being Democrat or Republican has much to do with supporting rebels. I live in New Hampshire, and our Republicans are the old guard type in theory, interested only in keeping the government from getting too insane.


Democrats are generally not going to be supporting Bush, even if a lot of republicans wouldn't support him either.


"Live free or die," had to be approved by more than one political party I assure you ;) . Republicans up here might actually support a rebellion, and I am sure others would as well depending on the circumstances.


I'm sure. In fact, in the event of a revolution, rebellion, or whatever, those kinds of people would be essential. They're going to have all the good guns, and they'll know how to use them.


That said, I hope this is a fair counter-point there Norseman, and thanks for helping Garrett. I love this mod, so any support is right on.

Likewise. What I'm asking for here is probably quite a bit of work, so it's best we make sure it isn't a waste of time.

Hmmm.

For me, this mod is representative of Chomskey's notion of People vs Power.

I don't imagine that any type of armed resistance would be possible without the "treason/patriotism" of American generals, whose units would join the rebels. These units would certainly form the core of the rebel army (just like in any other civil war.)

I can't speak for Garret, but I imagine the reason (beyond the obvious gameplay reasons) for having so many troops in New York, Hamilton, etc is due to the fact that it is the 'People' who fighting for these cities.

Unlike the forces of Bush/Fox/Harper - these cities are led by the people, and fought for by the people.

In this scenario, 3/10 New Yorkers would be taking up arms against Power, vs 1/25 (Washington) actually defending the power. Also, keep in mind that most of the U.S. arsenal is elsewhere. There are few massive domestic buildups (200 000+) of troops. In contrast, if New York were to rebel, around 2-3/10 citizens would need be involved - hence the numbers. Keep in mind that population and numbers are the two greatest weapons the rebels would have.

In contrast, Bush has the advantage of time. Given time, he should be able to harness the productive power of his remaining cities, and the vast resources of an international army to wipe out the rebels.

My Suggestions:

1. Provide a history or chronology of events, so that we can understand why there are T-80s on the west coast. China? Russia? Where do they, and the MIG's come from? (Maybe you could put this history in the empty Rebel Coalition Civpedia entry)

2. Rename some of the units. Hamilton, for example, would not be able to field the number of troops currently present in the mod. BUT, if the MGers were renamed something like MG-citizens, etc, then it would make much more sense.

3. Provide some U.S. techs which could recall troops from Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. Perhaps a wonder which spawns troops. (Keep in mind that you would have to have a negative consequence of this - perhaps less oil?)

4. Could we add some end-game options? Maybe some kind of diplomatic solution (yes, diplomacy sometimes works ;)) or some kind of spacerace (maybe a race to a new energy source?).

5. I think that oil should become a HOT commodity and that it should be much more limited.


@Everyone: In general, keep in mind that it would not be that difficult to capture Washington, especially if the citizenry of NYC strongly supported the cause. (Although I do think that some of Bush's continental army should be beefed up, particularly in D.C.) Washington has already been sacked once before (hence, the white house) and its location is not exactly defensible. Rather, Bush must play a little like WWII Russia. Pillage those cities which cannot be defended and build for a massive counter-attack which CANNOT be defended against.

Whoops.
An unrelated point for Garret - my download from 3ddownloads didn't work because of NoScript - an extension for Firefox. (I highly recommend both Firefox and NoScript, by the way - changed the internet for me). If anyone else is having similar problems, you will have to enable 3ddownloads in Noscript.

cheers

:worship: I love you guys *tears in eyes*

I think i will add some Abrams to the rebels, and some stealths to the US forces. If you think that this scenario is easy, try it on a difficulty higher than Noble (you may not have fun though).

As far as realistic unit placement for US forces, I wish I could, but even I was in the military enough to know that you dont know US unit placement LOL

As far as democrat-republican: i dont give these divisions much weight as i used to before i went "politcal". now they just seem like popularity contests. the real divisions come with ethical values, not moral political factions. (my 2 cents :p )

@norseman2
Thank you for such cool maps! they would have been really useful in week one of mod creation LOL.
if you dont take washington on first turn, the rebels aren't dong their job and wont be able to take it. (and will probly lose NYC too)
also, those unit placements you gave me WILL BE IMPLEMENTED


@skavian
your right about anarchists, they dont really want to fight. Squishy, my most radical friend, cant stand the warlike nature of my scenario, and i have to admit i might have been venting a little when i made it lol. BTW thanks for support.

@snafusmith
Good to hear from you and thanks for all my units im using LOL. i agree that US mil units wouldn't often switch over directly too oftenly. but i do think that some would outright desert (i would have) and become units like "Snipers" or "Guerillas" or perhaps command the T-80's

@zxe
good to hear from you too homie. how would i create a good description. which text.xml is this spot for this? i want to do the timeline thingie for next patch!

Thanks everyone, once again. keep the suggestion coming!

I wish there was a way to represent Organization vs. Morale. I saw that as a fairly interesting aspect in Hearts of Iron 2 by Paradox. I'll admit I pushed in that game for Anarcho-Syndicalists as well by doing everything in my power to win the Spanish Civil War as Republican Spain then entering WW2 under a completely different pretense. The Nazi infantry had better organization in that game, but not as great morale in comparison to the Republican Spanish troops. I don't know if that is even replicable in Civ 4, but it might be something to look at or think about. Maybe withdraw or increased defense bonuses, or something along those lines anyways, for certain kinds of troops to represent them getting whomped and still being able to get back together.

Just a suggestion there, and thanks for the input Norseman, I like your rebuttal. As for Snafusmith, I am not attacking the US military, I am just suggesting a plausibility in a fictional scenario in a user mod for a computer game. No harm intended.

Thanks for the work Garrett, keep it up.

I will. I'm now trying to figure out how to add events (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=168218)

can any of you lover's of revolution help me figure out how to intensify the war?

Well, I don't know the history of the game's fictional setting, so maybe that would be a good thing to produce. Then I could analyze it and provide some ideas. One of the ideas I can suggest is certainly using events to give a linear chronology to an extent for things happening. For instance, the Rebels getting foreign support in the form of units, or perhaps the US cashing in on foreign debt to get a money increase.

As for things to intensify the war, I think adding atmosphere would be a good thing. The international community plays very little in the game (though I like the wonders of building "support" from various other countries). Maybe making "barbarian" spawn events would make sense with extremely hostile troops from other countries coming in to pacify warring factions would be a good idea. UN Peacekeepers or the like.

Right now, also, it seems Culture doesn't play as big a role as a military battle. Some sort of culture clash accenting would be really nice. Might help show the waning support of the people for the various sides.

I think southern survivalists should be renamed Lawrence, for Anarchists have a very strong prescence there. Kansas Mutural Aid, the IWW, an Revolutionary Solidarity Library, Food Not Bombs, quite a place for revolution.

And while I don't believe it's as clear cut as stated, but democratic states are more likely to have an socialist, anarchist, or communist prescence. For example, large cities typically have more democrats, and thus free thinkers, but other than the areas deemed survivalist (and hopefully Lawrence), cities in the boondocks typically could care less about social safety nets, openly embracing Walmart.

However, to state that the Democrats would help Communists or Anarchists, that's another arguement.

vive la revolution

@skavian
i have had a few ideas since the inception about events, just no ideas whatsoever about how to do it!

Help!

However, to state that the Democrats would help Communists or Anarchists, that's another arguement.


Um, if Bush started nuking cities... yeah. If you're a Democrat, you're going to be going for the guns. Republicans, I don't know about. I've seen some crazy stuff on FSTDT, such as people asserting that Bush should end the elections and nuke Iran. I can't anticipate what kind of propaganda would be going on, but I'm willing to bet Democrats will be listening to their own propaganda, and Republicans theirs. If a Republican starts nuking domestic cities, the Democrat propaganda is almost guaranteed to support revolution. A lot of Republicans, namely the ones I would call genuine Republicans are going to see the government abusing its power, and they'll join the revolution too. The rest, I don't know about.

For Bush to maintain the military, he would need to enact regulations like in a draft, or worse. Knowing him, it wouldn't be a huge stretch to label anyone who deserts a terrorist/traitor or something (and it would be plausible, since most the people who leave the military will be doing so because they can't support what the military is doing, and will probably end up on the opposite side of the conflict). Traitors can be locked up indefinitely without a trial and tortured. Done like in Vietnam, you can force many of them to fight even though they oppose the war.

I don't know if you have all heard about this, but some scientists recently found it was possible to determine your political affiliation based on your (uncontrollable) brain response to propaganda. This technology could be used to guarantee a new and perfectly loyal military. Torture and reeducation techniques could also be empirically tested, and theoretically made feasible given enough time. Basically, we're talking about the possibility of working mind control.

Here's the thing, though. If people were to find out about that, there would be an attempted revolution. People would arm themselves, the military would break up, and there would be a new civil war if anyone still supports Bush. If the army is purged of dissenters, and filled out with a draft (preferably before-hand, so the potentially dissenting draftees can be sent on suicide missions), and the draftees are properly indoctrinated, the army stands a good chance of keeping aloft. Rebels simply are no match for a trained army. If a bunch of civilians tried to storm Washington, the military would (or could) hit them so brutally that the rebels in the back realize that they want to live. They would collapse. An assault would just be impossible. For the opening of the war, the rebels would need to hold what cities they can and start getting foreign support, while a capable military force is organized, disciplined, and armed.

@norseman2
The scenario begins after half of the country goes into general strike, and then organizes. and yes, bush nukes some cities in america, cities that the rebels had expelled the loyalist police and military units.

i suppose you could say democrat/republican, but i dont agree. yes, most republicans, in my uneducated guess, would not support the rebellion. but not all democrats are anarchists, remember? I think you are a bit left of the spectrum, norseman2 my friend (as am I)

also, people who fear the goverment, "criminals", and rebels will leave their cities to travel to the rebel regions and increase their strength. in civ terms, this would be immediate, as one week is a single turn, you can get almost anywhere in a week of continuous driving.

I plan on adding a few rougue military units, represented by an abrams or a SEAL, but i think that the majority of the rebel army would be self-organized, and would consist of the type people i when i mentioned emmigration, earlier.

@norseman:

Keep in mind that just because an army is rebel does not mean it isn't well-trained. Often, rebel armies are not only better-trained, but have a higher level intelligence than their follow-the-leader counterparts. Take a look at South America. Most of the continent is controlled by US-backed police states who are stemming the tide of populist democracy. These populist movements normally defeat their fascist opponents, only to then be assassinated or removed by coup.

In simple terms, I think the rebel army would be comparable to the Canadian forces: better training, older/disfunctional toys.

i like that analogy, although i wouldn't f@ck with canada, no no

@zxe

Armies aren't made in days, especially not rebel ones (mobs maybe, but not armies). This war would have to have been brewing for at least a few months beforehand, while the rebel armies were formed. I don't know how you would sneak T-80s and MiGs into the country, but I know that would take some time as well. While this is happening, the US forces would be assembling at key places like Washington, especially if a nearby city is a rebel stronghold. Hence, you aren't going to be taking Washington on the first day.

one sec..... i got something of a teaser for the next patch (after i figure out python :p )

War is a terrible finality. Revolution and war are almost always one. This war is no different. A general strike in large portions of America and Canada have shut those countries down. All of South America is at arms against their northern oppressors.

Where protesters do not rule, martial law governs all. The protests last for three months, until in Jaunary 3rd, 2007, the so-called "Rebel Coalition" has all loyalists thrown out of their cities, while mass migrations of rebels from Bush-controlled cities goes on all over America.

When this happens, Castro, who is now dying, plays his last gambit, surrounds Guantanamo and lands troops west of Miami. Marcos enrages Vicente Fox by besieging Oaxaca and Velacruz.

George Bush resorts to nuclear methods...

Nice Mod garret, i really like it and I really love the soundtrack, could you recommend me more music like that?
By the way in the musical aspect you could add more songs to hasper, fox, castro and marcos themes. One suggestion : I've no played with fox yet but zapatista's voices are in german, you could change it to spanish voices to make them more realistic i think.

Anyway a great mod :goodjob:

ive got a new patch that deals with that, but it aint out yet. as far as the music themes for those leaders, i havent thought of what tunes to use. i want some chiapas rebel music for zaps, cuban folk, and some el presidente musica for mexico.
if you like those bands there is a playlist.txt file that tells you the band names. some you probly couldn't know coz they are local bands from phoenix, az.

For Harper: I recommend something from the Tragically Hip or "Taking Care of Business". Or any country song...

Played a game as Canada last night. I quickly took Hamilton (they sent there forces towards Toronto, and I snuck in and got the city) and Quebec City. Over time I expanded north and west, re-capturing all of Canada's original territory. In addition, I liberated several American cities: Valdez, Chicago, Minneapolis(?), Spokane, and Michigan Militia. The rebels gave me Vancouver in return for peace.

Now I think I might go to war with U.S. Just to see how it will go...

LOL you are a Crazy canadian! i love it! im guessing canada is the civ you want to use for the scenario!

Second Revolution 1.6 is out!!!

Hey zxe and everyone else!

i fixed the musica for marcos, castro, harpers and fox so it plays custom music now and i fixed command sounds from units, so when you click em it should be in the right language for the civ. i also touched up map like added topeka, and little rock and orlando.

im going to start the multiplayer tests soon with PBEM. zxe suggested this and if anyone else is really interested and wont quit, PM zxe and me.

download at top of thread

Here's the thing, though. If people were to find out about that, there would be an attempted revolution. People would arm themselves, the military would break up, and there would be a new civil war if anyone still supports Bush. If the army is purged of dissenters, and filled out with a draft (preferably before-hand, so the potentially dissenting draftees can be sent on suicide missions), and the draftees are properly indoctrinated, the army stands a good chance of keeping aloft. Rebels simply are no match for a trained army. If a bunch of civilians tried to storm Washington, the military would (or could) hit them so brutally that the rebels in the back realize that they want to live. They would collapse. An assault would just be impossible. For the opening of the war, the rebels would need to hold what cities they can and start getting foreign support, while a capable military force is organized, disciplined, and armed.
Could you site a source for this?

i feel that no matter how pissed the world gets at bush or demagougues like him, there will always be many many supporters of them, not because that they like the leader, but because they fear losing what they have. Disrupting the status-quo does not sit well with many. I couldnt really care less (but then I'm an anarch).

Could you site a source for this?

Of course not. It's never happened before. But think about it. What would you do if Bush started nuking cities, and purging the military of people who aren't perfectly obedient to him? I know what I would do, and I think I'm fairly normal here. Hell, we had a civil war over slavery, where none of the major people involved were even personally affected by slavery. But a nuking in our own country, by our own country, well, there's no question about what kind of havoc that could cause. Perfectly obedient soldiers and mass murder are just too reminiscent of Nazi Germany, and you can ask anyone what they think of Nazis.

If you were referring to the second part of my paragraph, about people realizing they want to live, then you can refer to How to Make War, fourth edition. When regular people get shot at, they very quickly lose their will to fight.

I like your mod and stuff, BUT, i like to start from scratch and build my own empire, and play on different maps, but cant cause there are no settlers??? I know its Second Rev but after you play the Five or so Empires whats next? same ole game then. But if you can start from scratch you can lead into other maps and stuff, if you know what i mean. And by the way Great look of units and the soundtrack, AWESOME!!

@Norseman2:

1. Food for Thought: Few rebellions make it past the 'protest' stage without fairly large-scale support from some level of the military. I would assume that if the Rebel Coalition could take as many cities as they have (in the scen) than they must have been supported by a major military defection (most likely led by ousted generals).

2. Was the American civil war over slavery? Because I have read a great deal of information that says this is false. Especially when both congresses were attempting to pass slavery-abolishment legislation. (Although I'm Canadian, so my knowledge of the American civil war is amateur.) Interestingly enough, the first American civil war followed the pattern identified in point #1.

3. Some trivia regarding Bush and Nazis. Prescott Sheldon Bush was Bush's grandfather. He married the daughter of George Herbert Walker, who was the director of Brown Brothers Harriman & Co.. Walker gave Prescott Bush (who was working as a tire salesman) a position within his firm. Alex Jones and his sources attest that these two men should have been tried for treason. The Harriman bank was the main Wall Street Connection for German Companies and was eventually shut down by Roosevelt. These companies include Hamburg-American shipping line - the first company shut down by Roosevelt. Fritz Thyssen, also known as "Hitler's Angel", had over 3 million invested in this bank in 1942. Bush, Dupont, Remmington, J.P. Morgan are also (accused) of leading the attempted overthrow of FDR during WWII.

So, maybe we should ask George W. "what he thinks of Nazis"...

Ok everyone! the newest update to the patch is out. 1.6C has the new riot police unit by rabbitwhite (i believe) check out top post for DL!

@zxe

1. Consider the case of Gandhi. Without any military at all, he was able to win. Consider the American revolution, where combat began before the Americans had any formal military force, and the Americans won. With a movement which is popular enough, against a government which is unpopular enough, you will win. Now, I don't know about neomarxism, or anarchosyndicalism, but I believe I what I said holds true for today. If the government becomes unpopular enough (say through nuking our own cities) and a new movement comes along which is very popular among the people, there is a good chance there will be a sucessful revolution.

2. Going with what wiki has to say, and what I've been told in my history classes, slavery was the issue which made the South secede from the Union. If not slavery, what do you think it was?

2b(?).In the American civil war (which hopefully was the last) entire states chose loyalty to one side, or the other. Conceivably, the same could happen here. However, that was more the rebellion of the Confederates than of the Union. The Union had more than double the GDP, population, and number of soldiers of the Confederates. Not surprisingly, the Union won. This was despite some of the military helping Confederates. I think what it boils down to is that the military isn't as important as the people.

3. Which means... what?

@norseman2
i feel you have made some invalid or at least partially invalid points:

1. Gandhi was interested in passive resistance, yes, but India is a big place and what my government never teaches is that there were battles raging across India at the same time his movement was 'peaceful'. And these battles were Indian vs. British, Indian vs. Pakistani, and Indian vs. Indian. So the US gov't lies when it teaches it's childeren that India's revolution was bloodless, it was far from it. 13000 slaughtered.

2. Slavery was NOT the reason that the secession occurred, it was just what the public was told at the time. Believe it or not, the slavery issue increased the violence towards blacks in the north. The south seceded because of the taxation and tariffs that the north was leveling at the productive and lucrative south. It was literally an economic war, but what war truly hasn't been that kind?

2b. The states didn't completely take sides. People were trapped on one side or the other, much like east germany in cold war. And people were trying to emigrate to their families on the other sides.

Please come to me with references and you will change my mind then.

I love the new police-unit. Perfect for this mod...

yeah, i requested it a while ago. i bemped that thread alot

@norseman2
sorry for ranting at you

@GarretSidzaka

1. This completely misses the point. zxe said "Few rebellions make it past the 'protest' stage without fairly large-scale support from some level of the military." Even if what you say is true, it doesn't matter. To my knowledge, India had little to no assistance from any regular military.

2. Source?

2b. This is relevant to my point, how?

Umm, wasn't one of the major reasons the South seceeded that they were going to change the way that slaves were counted when taking census numbers, which would have give the far more populous North a huge advantage in the House of Representatives?

@ ERLoft
i had heard this as well. wars do usually have more that one reason.

@norseman2
You dont need a regular army to have horrible bloodshed, now do you?

@GarretSidzaka

What is your point? How is that relevant, at all? :confused:

But think about it. What would you do if Bush started nuking cities, and purging the military of people who aren't perfectly obedient to him?

Live out fantasies I've had since childhood.

Live out fantasies I've had since childhood.

*raising his hand* OOOH! OOOH! I know I know!:mischief:

Umm, wasn't one of the major reasons the South seceeded that they were going to change the way that slaves were counted when taking census numbers, which would have give the far more populous North a huge advantage in the House of Representatives?
No, the north already had a huge lead in the House of Representatives, and even counting slaves as one full person in the census wouldn't have changed that. If you read the Lincoln-Douglas debates, you'll notice that Lincoln was running on a pro-slavery, pro-tariff platform; he was a racist who supported "black codes" and the Corwin amendment (the original 13th amendment which would've made slavery permanent), and he was also a big proponent of the (un)"American System" of mercantilism. (Note: For the record, I think both sides sucked.)

Mercantilism is a lot like socialism, only a different criminal gang benefits from the redistribution of stolen wealth, and the weakening of the economy isn't as great, since the beneficiaries of the redistribution are typically people who already have some skill in creating new wealth, and so the thefts are somewhat offset by new wealth creation. Also, unlike socialism, mercantilism doesn't generally require a full-blown police state to maintain, because it lacks the strict price and wage controls present in socialism, which naturally lead to shortages, then rationing, then black markets, then a police state to combat the black markets, due to the disruption in the natural pricing system. For more details on that chain reaction of events, see this article (http://www.mises.org/story/1937). Oh, and if you want to fully comprehend the folly of both socialism and mercantilism, I recommend you start by reading Frédéric Bastiat's That Which is Seen, and That Which is Not Seen (http://bastiat.org/en/twisatwins.html).

All of South America is at arms against their northern oppressors.
:lol: voluntary mutually beneficial trade == oppression :lol:

...(Note: For the record, I think both sides sucked.)...

Now your talking! Thats what I like to hear!! :goodjob::goodjob::goodjob:

I believe that this scenario is not too unrealistic...I mean that revolution in USA might be close...This could happen for example IF mr.Bush do send his troops to IRAN...That could (or actually I believe it would) make some of military generals not loyal to Bush...There are great amount of spanish speaking generals for example and most of the soldiers are from poor parts of people...And as far as I know Bush (white rich America)is not TOO popular among poor...

War agaist IRAN would also cause nuclear war, because US military can´t beat Iran EVER without Nukes...And shooting of nukes to Iran would cause world wide reaction...I guess nobody would allow it...And specially NOT americans...

We saw what happend in New Orleans Not too far ago...Totall anarchy...Imagine if that kind of disaster would happend when US troops are fighting in Iran and President wouldn´t be liked too much?
Natural disasters can destroy local infrastructure, Rebellions in the Huge cities could keep up easily against Lauzy (TOO modernized) US military...

Misarable situation in war and homefront could make bush to use nukes agaist his own people (casue he don´t care a **** about others expect money)
And nukeing his own people could cause other cities to join the rebel...(and with the generals not loyal to Bush, Rebellians could collect a great military)

If such a ball would start rolling I think things could get really BAD and really FAST...It´s a heavy Ball ;)...

I guess USA will have their first spanish president sooner or later ;D Ha haa...
And half of the planet is destroyed...

Great scenario indeed...I started to play as Canadians...I started to make my country as productive as possible...Regina, winnipeg ,port royal are great cities...

My plan is to take first Canada back on my hold and then start kickng off Bush...let see how it goes...Soon I´ll have EU and China and Japanise support...

But my computer is little too slow for this scenario:((...

Would it be possible to make small map?Like about half of the cities...

I believe that this scenario is not too unrealistic...I mean that revolution in USA might be close...

...If such a ball would start rolling I think things could get really BAD and really FAST...It´s a heavy Ball ;)...

...But my computer is little too slow for this scenario:(...

...Would it be possible to make small map?Like about half of the cities...

I'm glad you like the scenario. I think I'm about due to start 'beta testing' it some more if you know what I mean.

Yes, it's a darn heavy ball, and i hope it never rolls on me! :D

What are you running? there are some things you can do to the Civ4Config to use the memory freeing thing that disables "Alt-Tab" function. Im running 2.8 P4ht; 256 GeForce 5200 fx (overclocked); 1.5 GB PC2700 ram; and it takes about 10 seconds for a turn; also a bit choppy scrolling across complecated map areas.

Small map? hmm........ lemme think about it. :)

What is your favorite support wonder?
my favorites is probly split between Japanese Support and Russian Support. After that is Chinese and European.

That could (or actually I believe it would) make some of military generals not loyal to Bush...

AHAHAHA!!!! Anyone loyal to Bush even now is funny! Last I looked, everyone in the US Military swears to 'uphold and defend the Constitution...' not the president. If Bush did something to move against the Constitution, then there would be problems... until then, not even a war with Iran (which we would win) would cause those levels of problems.

I love this scenario, end all the awesome discussion is spauns!

AHAHAHA!!!! Anyone loyal to Bush even now is funny!...

I love this scenario, end all the awesome discussion is spauns!

Thanks im glad you like it. We'll need good airforce people like you for the revolution! LOL:lol:

First I apolgize my english...I might use some wrong words when I try to explain what I mean...English isn´t my mothertongue...So don´t take it word by word...

To Garretsidzaka
Uups...compared to yours, I think my computer is ancient :D...
I running P3 :)...ha haa...

EU support seems qite effective, but I haven´t managed to bulit it yet...
Japanise one gives a good help for science, wich is somewhat needed, but I think commerce (money) is more important than science, at least after fusion...
rushing a huge military is more important than techlead...IMO...Or what do you think?

To Snaufusmith:

Military is loyal to the president, president is the one who decides(of cource with the help of others) when the country enters the war and when it makes a peace...

And I believe that there might be some generals with their troops that could turn agaist president(even when bush doesn´t do anything specific agaist constitution)

And About Iran...hmm I don´t belive that USA could win IRan...It might sound crazy to you ;) but US military is not the strongest nor is the American society...Your country is ful of foregin people (for example about 10 milj. iranian) almost everything is relying on electricity...Imagine what would happend when those foregin people for example working in your nuclear powerplants (you have them right ;)? heh and they have been really good workers already for 5 years and Nobody expect taht...;) buuuum
When your citeies are without electricity there will be HELLhound running around...horrible disaster...
Also your military is relying too much on electricity and modern tecnics...

With IRAN there are some of the stongest countries...China for ex. wouldn´t allow US to occupy Iran...If someone is about to take Iran China wants to be the one, you know...And also russia has a word or two to say...
Iran china and russia are of course way behind your military in technology...But in numers of patriotic soldiers...you lose...Attacing to Iran will cause WW3 (because of nuclear weapons) and that will be the war where USA and Europe are going to put to our knees...

WW3 will be the kind of TOTAL war where you don´t much do with modern guns...it´s better to have working oldstyle rifle...Atleast you can only waste 1 bullet at the time...Cause you won´t have too many to use...

Well :D anyway
I wish you great first of MAY weekend! Enjoy the weathers and good time!

interesting ideas, Heeringas. Im glad you like the scenario too. (Im glad you P3 actually runs it! you must be patient!)

Military is loyal to the president, president is the one who decides(of cource with the help of others) when the country enters the war and when it makes a peace...

NO. The US military is loyal to the CONSTITUTION. Because the president is elected by the people to run the country, and because the constitution appoints him commander in chief, we obey his orders. It looks like we are loyal to him, but that's only because it's in the Constitution. We are NOT loyal to one man. We are loyal to the ideals of freedom and liberty for all spelled out in the US Constitution.

Sorry to muddle up this thread with discussion completely off topic, but certain things need to be set straight.

NO. The US military is loyal to the CONSTITUTION. Because the president is elected by the people to run the country, and because the constitution appoints him commander in chief, we obey his orders. It looks like we are loyal to him, but that's only because it's in the Constitution. We are NOT loyal to one man. We are loyal to the ideals of freedom and liberty for all spelled out in the US Constitution.

Sorry to muddle up this thread with discussion completely off topic, but certain things need to be set straight.

I think that this conversation is decidedly not off topic as this is the revolution mod! LOL

Ok, I was in the army Snafu, and i remember the whole "we serve the constitution" thing. But here's some food for thought: what do you serve if you know that the current administration has shitted on the constitution??

:lol: voluntary mutually beneficial trade == oppression :lol:
Free trade is a contradiction

NAFTA is good.........not!

I believe that this scenario is not too unrealistic...I mean that revolution in USA might be close...This could happen for example IF mr.Bush do send his troops to IRAN...That could (or actually I believe it would) make some of military generals not loyal to Bush...There are great amount of spanish speaking generals for example and most of the soldiers are from poor parts of people...And as far as I know Bush (white rich America)is not TOO popular among poor...

War agaist IRAN would also cause nuclear war, because US military can´t beat Iran EVER without Nukes...And shooting of nukes to Iran would cause world wide reaction...I guess nobody would allow it...And specially NOT americans...

We saw what happend in New Orleans Not too far ago...Totall anarchy...Imagine if that kind of disaster would happend when US troops are fighting in Iran and President wouldn´t be liked too much?
Natural disasters can destroy local infrastructure, Rebellions in the Huge cities could keep up easily against Lauzy (TOO modernized) US military...




You place way to much importance on Iran. Iran is a nation of sheep herders and peasents and would get stomped, their only possible saviour would be China. At which point we sell Taiwan in a "tit for tat" scenario. :mischief:

You seem to have a meager understanding of politics in general. In fact, due to Bush's proposals on immigration he is gaining vast support in the latino community. Remember, people are stupid, it dont take much to coddle them into subsiervence. :king:

As far as your Katrina allegory, it did happen when our troops were in Iraq, so how would being in Iran be different?

Scenario looks sweet. Jacksonville is to far north, it should be South, as its under the panhandle, it appears north of the panhandle on the map.

Also a driver behind Cuba would add to the realism, lets face it, Castro isn't leading anything soon without some serious help. Perhaps Islamic or Chinese backing.

well, if you play as castro, you will notice a large navy and modest invasion force coming around greenland from ...... russia!

well, if you play as castro, you will notice a large navy and modest invasion force coming around greenland from ...... russia!


nice, I stand corrected then :)

and you can get support from EU (gives free banks), japan (gives free labs), russia (+30% city defense), australia (bonus coastal trade), and china (+2 population per city)

any civ can get these

and you can get support from EU (gives free banks), japan (gives free labs), russia (+30% city defense), australia (bonus coastal trade), and china (+2 population per city)

any civ can get these
Im convinced, downloading now :)

enjoy my friend

dont forget the patch too!

Ahh I see now, Atlanta should be just a tad north of where you have Jacksonville now. You currently have it way to far north. And Jacksonville should be about 30 degrees north east of Tampa.

Also flip flop Boston and New York City, Boston is south of NYC. Phillidelphia is also east of Indianapolis, about half way between Indianapolis and New York

i see, well, map updates are a pain, so until i get some more units, pretend you dont know geography better than the author :lol:

Or rename Philly to Kansas City, as thats about where KC is.

I'll go back to my corner now lol

oh crap, download the patch!!!!!!!!!1

1.6c is the one you need, it links to my homepage for it. although not everything is fixed, you really need it!

Ahh, you fixed it in a patch? :) I was going off the screenshots you have on page one :)

ahh, that screeny is original old skool from months ago and it sucks
(i should probly replace it LOL)

i don't know why, but i had serious problems with dowloading the patch. i was being disconnected every 60 seconds or so. i finally did manage to download it but it was rather frustrating. any idea what could be the problem?

were you at my website at the downloads page?

yes, i was downloading from your homepage

hmm, i can dl no problem. could it be the browser? do you want to try again real quick?

im going to upload to a separate site okay?, but this will take some time.

Ok i uploaded to 3d downloads, but they have to approve it, unless you know a uploader that will work? 8mb file

Five-Hundredth Post! 500 500 500 500 500 500

*removed* :)

ok i have added a new download mirror on our website to get to the patch. it is at the top post next to the mirror to my homepage!
Enjoy

Sorry to take this on the table again ;)...

You place way to much importance on Iran. Iran is a nation of sheep herders and peasents and would get stomped, their only possible saviour would be China. At which point we sell Taiwan in a "tit for tat" scenario. :mischief:

Iran is not just "a nation of sheep herders"...(Yes, they do have them, because the meat is great)...But Americans should respect Iranians, how they are...They are not terrorist...It´s amazing how USA has terrorized Iranians for long time already.(and still accused that Iran is terrorist nation???)..Why USA doesn´t want that Iran could be Iran?? What´s the damn problem? Your president Mr. Carter already tried to do some **** on them (and also did)
But Iranians just want to be what they could be...If you know the history of PERSIA you know that Iran has always been mighty...Let them be mighty again...

Ok I think China and USA could make a deal like Germanny and USSR made in the last War, that you can take that and we take that...But When things go so far...you can´t prevent USA vs.CHINA WAR anymore...


You seem to have a meager understanding of politics in general. In fact, due to Bush's proposals on immigration he is gaining vast support in the latino community. Remember, people are stupid, it dont take much to coddle them into subsiervence. :king:

Well for this I answer that I´m not Living in your country...I have been living some years ago...So I don´t know much details about the politics of your country...But Don´t say I have meager understanding in general....Tell me what you know about my country?(Finland)
But I do know that USA have been using and rapeing L´America quite long time already and I think people down there don´t want to be footsacks much longer anymore...You know...there comes a time when bad king is kicked off from the throne


As far as your Katrina allegory, it did happen when our troops were in Iraq, so how would being in Iran be different?

Difference is that when Katrina hit USA wasn´t in war...IRaq should have been "peace of cake" to US military (it was kind of exersice)...
When US troops are in Iran... The whole World is on war...so Situation is very much different...


Well anyway...:) enjoy the summer...we have it finally here in the north...

I´m little bit warmonger ;) as you can read, I hope I don´t step on anybodys feet...these are just thoughts...

regrds,
HE

I don't know what the US are up to, but I do know that British troops will almost certainly be in Iran soon and I seriously doubt one half of the Alliance would operate without the other. The war will happen soon, to ensure it happens before Iran have nuclear weapons.

The US will not go to war with China.

I created a "how to defeat george bush thread" that is just begging for political arguing. but are we really going to get anywhere? Can liberal convince a conservative. Can a conservative sway a liberal. the answer is no, so stop trying :lol:

Let's hear something about the game. I plan on releasing a big patch soon. one that allows the UNITCOMBAT_SNIPER command added by TheLopez. But i still have to figure that one out. And i need to do some map fixes. And I'm looking for anymore cool units to add.

TheLopez has a copy of the mod and told me that he converting the two to go together. As soon as i get that back, I'm going to make the map fixes, and hopefully find a cool unit to add. I hope to get out 1.7 as soon as possible.

There seems to be sometrouble converting the map. im working on it now

I might finally have some time to try your mod now Garret so I'm hoping you get your map issues resolved. :)

Any radioactive Lizardmen here?

good to hear from you

well, woodelf, the current version somehow actually works in 1.61, although any multiplayer is out besides hotseat, and its incompatible with all the cool SDK and python mods :cry:

good to hear from you

well, woodelf, the current version somehow actually works in 1.61, although any multiplayer is out besides hotseat, and its incompatible with all the cool SDK and python mods :cry:

That's too bad. Are you going to rebuild from scratch or hope to make your mod compatible somehow?

That's too bad. Are you going to rebuild from scratch or hope to make your mod compatible somehow?

well, im working on the compatability issues. right now im stuck trying to transfer plots from a 1.52 build map to a 1.61 build. for some reason i get an immediate crash to desktop. Oh Well. :(

Im thinking about rebuilding map to be on a smaller scale, maybe a third less area and writing mod from bottom up (after writing down on paper all unit abilities first)

well, im working on the compatability issues. right now im stuck trying to transfer plots from a 1.52 build map to a 1.61 build. for some reason i get an immediate crash to desktop. Oh Well. :(

Im thinking about rebuilding map to be on a smaller scale, maybe a third less area and writing mod from bottom up (after writing down on paper all unit abilities first)

Restarting from the bottom up may not be too painful since I'm sure you've learned a lot about modding over the last several months. I know I've discovered better ways to do certain things.

I was think the same thing earlier today. but, will i have to "bottom-up" everytime firaxis releases a patch with absolutely no update support? (ie. warlords)

I dont see why you have such problems converting the map? took me 1 minute with notepad to change all occurances of the 3 troublesome strings (no 4th one since no Mao on that map)

lemme upload my xml files.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/newerxmls.zip
newerxmls.zip

i wonder if there are bugs in here?

Way OT ---- but I love that picture of the cat. :D

Kitty is Scared! You made kitty that way!

:( :( :(
Looks like I'm not releasing another patch for Second Revolution. This is the complete product. Unfotunately python mods and SDK mods do not work for this scenario as well as PBEM.

I may release a quick fix for map errors and an additional song for soundtrack, but give me some time ;)

First of all, let me say I love the mod! Ending evil (how you look at it) around America is fun...

I noticed a couple of geographical errors in the American Southeast. It shouldn't be "Talahassee," it should be "Tallahassee," with two "l"s. Also, Jacksonville should be on the same latitude tile-wise as Tallahassee. Atlanta shouldn't be as far north as Knoxville, since Georgia is never north of Tennessee. D. C. should be closer to the Atlantic, shouldn't it? And, is there a major Philadelphia in Missouri?

@pacesplace
thank you. i dont know how i could have made those errors (well, i did make most of this scenario early in the morning :) ) please make sure to download the patch at the top of this forum, it cleans up a few of the map errors! enjoy

You really need to have Utah as a civ. Call it the "State of Deseret" and make their preferred civic theocracy.

Oh also, Aztlan, Texas and Ecotopia (N. Clifornia, Oregon, Washington, British Columbia) should be civs. You might also consider having the Confederacy make a comeback.

Ooo ooo ooo! Quebec!!

i lumped all of the various rebelious factions in the northern part of continent into the "Rebel coalition". it represents a group of made up of factions with very different ideolagies, but one common goal...

You really need to have Utah as a civ. Call it the "State of Deseret" and make their preferred civic theocracy.

Oh also, Aztlan, Texas and Ecotopia (N. Clifornia, Oregon, Washington, British Columbia) should be civs. You might also consider having the Confederacy make a comeback.

What's Aztlan? Also, Texas was a part of the Confederacy, and the Confederacy was founded on the basis of states' rights, which was brought into question by slavery... Why would the Confederacy rise again 141 years after its dismantling by the Union?

What's Aztlan? Also, Texas was a part of the Confederacy, and the Confederacy was founded on the basis of states' rights, which was brought into question by slavery... Why would the Confederacy rise again 141 years after its dismantling by the Union?

Aztlan is the theoretical merging of several states and some or all of Mexico, IIRC. As to the Confederacy, in a lot of places in the South and bible belt you'll still find a lot of Confederate flags flying. I doubt any unifiction over racism and slavery could ever occur in the South, but the general idea of those states breaking off and forming a Confederacy is still plausible.

i gave the south new orleans. thats it. i think that the redneck would overcome the rebel in the south.

jk any southerners

Aztlan is the theoretical merging of several states and some or all of Mexico, IIRC. As to the Confederacy, in a lot of places in the South and bible belt you'll still find a lot of Confederate flags flying. I doubt any unifiction over racism and slavery could ever occur in the South, but the general idea of those states breaking off and forming a Confederacy is still plausible.

While you do see a lot of Confederate flags in the South, the CSA rising again isn't that likely... I doubt they would reestablish a Confederacy with the same name, since their founding principles would most likely be different... Yeah, it's possible, but I don't think it would happen.

i agree totally. i think that it is reasonably evident, given my paltry knowlage of real politcal affairs that the south would rebel. i only gave up neworleans to the rebels because of the Katrina holocaust.

I know alot of Kansan Anarchists went to New Orleans to show solidarity and help rebuild, too bad they got paid sub-minimum wage because of the laws passed to basically screw over workers in the name of 'progress'....

well, less about modern politics... As my thing says, I live in Kansas and I see alot of Confederate flags, which confuses the **** out of me because Kansas fought against the south and for the rights of slaves. It infuriates me (I hate haters), and confuses me.

Smash the state

leif it is good to hear from you again. i think that the confederate flag could have meant freedom from oppresive centralized government and self-determination of local communities; but instead it has become a sign of rascism and hatred because of the unending ignorance of the people who wave it. yes, i said it. thats why there are no southern states in the rebel coalition.

looks good but is missing pittsburg & philly.

check. im planning to do a complete overhaul after warlords comes out. if anyone has a decent map of north america showing major cities only

Great game. The atmosphere is perfect, especially how you made Bush look all evil. I could definately see Newyork as one of the revolutionary cities.

thank you. problem is, the AI for bush always seems to want to nuke New york on turn one :p

hey there!
very interesting mod, being from mexico and all it was a refreshing, but utterly tough experience playing as Sc Marcos in warlord difficulty:

1)why is Fidel kind of hostile towards Marcos?
2)why are the canadians hostile towards Marcos?
3) after a few turns my patrolling fighters(all kinds) stop patrolling, why is that?
4)future tanks are useless, they take a long time to produce and require uranium, but when fighting they're total wimps (both defending and attacking).
I'm asking those things because once I started, I began attacking veracruz(there's a typo there by the way, it's veRacruz and in the mod it's veLacruz) and oaxaca city, conquered them both and started fortyfying them.
Fox attacked me but I could fend him off, however Fidel declared war on me and attacked my rear guard, taking one of my cities, so I got really pissed at him, left my newly conquered cities with 4 a zapatista garrison and a sniper each. Movilized half of my conquering armies: one to mexico city, and the other to try and recover my lost city(something that utterly failed since Fidel's red guards were like terminators) every turn I tried to make peace with the canadians and GWB and both refused (sure, I would expect such a behaviour from GWB but from the canadians?). So after struggling a little and finally taking my lost city from Fidel, GWB's and the canadian forces mass attack me and make me not only lose my newly conquered cities, but Guatemala as well, leaving me defending one narrow central american pass.
At that time, when I was getting my butt kicked by all those people (everyone except the anarchosyndicalists) fidel decides to make peace.
After that, the game got very boring since I mass produced zapatistas and mech infantries, to try to recover my lost cities and failed, I just couldn't seem to defeat anyone.

all in all great mod, I just think it needs a little bit of balancing :)

thank you guspav for playing!

#1 Fidel starts out heavily swayed towards peace with marcos, but in this game i choose not to have locked alliances, so later in the game, the tides of war can shift. i think i was attacked by fidel as marcos too, and i must say zapatistas have the toughest of all sides in the game.
#2 canada is sided with america (for obvious reasons) but are more likely to make peace with the rebel factions than any others of that side. you have to be very diligent diplomatically as soon as you get the option, and above all do not attack canadian units so you can be more likely to have peace with them sooner, and even more likely to get them to go to war with bush. DONT USE NUKES ON ANYBODY ;) (not saying that you did)
#3 im not sure why the fighters are glitching, i didnt notice that problem, but i think im gonna go ahead and play as marcos again tonite and take over the world
#4 Future tanks (theoretically) should be the strongest unit at power of 50. i'm not sure why you were getting wasted when using them. i should lower the cost though if they arent that strong.

btw, my patch is being put off in favor for a total re-structuring of the mod, which im planning as soon as warlords expansion comes out. it will be Second Revolution 2. please keep the advice coming, especially game balance.

What are your ideas about having a smaller (75%) map??

Ok i have a few problems with this game, and they should be fixed.

A moron can win the game as a rebel with all the units you gave them.
Just 1 rebel city has more troops then ALL of America... while the Americans has at the most of 2 defense units in each city with a few planes scattered around...

It’s very obvious that the maker of this game is anti bush at the very least. I don’t really care about your personal feelings but you really should be more realistic.

Now don’t get me wrong, this has the foundation to be THE greatest civ game ever created, just remove the far left ideology out.
Don’t put it far right or left, keep it central... trust me your ratings would skyrocket.


US Government
Police State <== actually keep this, if a war like this ever broke out damn strait we would have it... so im fine with it
Nationhood <== not freedom of speech, ehh during a war im sure this would happen, It did during the civil war, it makes sense if your trying to restart national pride so ok.
Cast System <== not emancipation? I think you should remove the cast system out of the game period since its historically obsolete anyway.
Neo Colonialism <== now this is starting to sound like a far left ideology, and should be renamed, I also have a problem with the more American choice Progressivism, has a democrat symbol on it... I personally think that a game like this should be very central put both party symbols in it or the white house or whatever...


Leader Heads
I love the leader heads of everyone, except bush... again it has a far left vibe on it... Centralize it. He has a retarded face and a explosion behind him...:lol: :crazyeye:


Diplomacy
Perfect, but i personally think Mexico would be neutral in this conflict. It could be persuaded to join either side. But in any case perfect.


Game Stuff
Nukes:
Realistically, the US should only have a nuclear capability... I was disappointed when I saw that Mexico nuked Cuba. All countries should have the capability of developing it but right off that bat only the US.

Cuba:
No way in hell do they have a navy anywhere close to that.
Maybe a few destroyers and transports but in this game Cuba has the largest Navy, more then all the other nations put together.

Rebels:
Why are they using Russian equipment? If their revolting in Canada and the US shouldn’t they be mostly infantry/civilian resistance/some American tanks? I don’t understand where the Migs and T-37s came from...

They also have WAY TO MANY TROOPS... just one rebel city has enough troops to take half of the US... a moron could win here on the highest difficulty

Also the rebels shouldn’t have the capability to shoot down nukes until later in the game...

USA:
Not enough troops, and I know why... your making the point that all of our troops are over seas and that’s perfectly ok... *(even though the rebels have more troops then they know what to do with)* but realistically ALL of our over seas troops from every corner of the world would come back home to end the revolution. Not even mentioning our allies in Asia and Europe would send aid. ~ ~ ~ Now im not sure how to do this, or if its even possible but you should make it so that by week 5 or 6 American Reinforcements should show up on the map, or place a huge! Fleet somewhere far out in the map filled with many many troops *(pacific and Atlantic)* so that by the time it arrives at the coast bla bla bla

A really neat thing you could add, make it possible to choose who you want to be leader of the US. Set the year in 2008. Rudolph Gulliane or Hillary Clinton. So that the person can choose a democrat or republican leader. If its possible to choose more then 2 people add a list of reps and dems... that would definitely add some bonus points to this game

Washington, West Point, Norad HQ, etc should be filled with Infanty and F-16's

MUSIC
Absolutely perfect, I loved the America **** yeah XD i laughed my ass off

Overall This game still needs work.. But over all has the potential to be the greatest game ever... just remove the leftist junk...

A polar opposite to this game would be were you have to conquer the world and convert everyone to Christianity... were America has a god shield and Jesus cruise missiles... Bush is a servant of god.. bla bla bla... JUNK, well that’s the opposite of this game..

Just make it fair and balanced in all levels... keep it difficult for all the nations. and this will be rated as professional grade A civ classic

I must agree with Bush's picture, it's a tad silly. Make it sincere and mean (well, you only need to worry about sincere).

LOL im sure that there's plenty of good ones i could use. i just thought that it was fitting, since every time i play, bush nukes everybody!

I just tried it, fun concept, very nice stuff etc. Few major problems though.

The russian tank model is way too huge. (rather minor problem).

As far as gameplay goes, USA is greatly underpowered (Cuba having stronger navy??? LMAO) and Syndicate is way too easy and overpowered.

My proposed solution is that either take away SDI from Syndicate, or give way more nukes to USA to even it out, or give much more conventional forces to USA in some remote area, or nerf Syndicate and Cuba. Cause as far as conventional forces go, USA is just bound to get overrun so fast it's so obvious USA is there just to be taken over by other factions.

Or, Syndicates could have only single city for starter, but have cheap, but numerous, units all over the US, and have them start the game.

What I would rather like to see is if you can pull out syndicates all together and have Bush fight against someone like Michael Moore (ohhh this would be the greatest lol) or someone else who is really liberal and outspoken. Sure it would be unrealistic, but I really doubt this mod was aimed to be realistic, so why not have fun all the way (while retaining balance)?

Or like a game called "Shattered Union", perhaps you could split US into serveral factions.

Not Michael Moore! That guy is bad **** - seriously. He presents Bush and his administration as a bunch of cronies, working for the middle eastern moneylenders. No! They work for the european moneylenders - the same ones who lent money to the Nazis. And Moore actually advocates disaming citizens. I mean, come on!

Check out this video:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6495462761605341661&q=alex%2Bjones%2Bmartial%2Blaw&pl=true

Alex Jones - Rise of the Police State

Then tell me what you think of Moore. He's certainly not on my side....

i dont like michael moore, not because of the info he presents, but because of the propagandist way he presents it; smacking of neo-liberal media

Well Moore was just an example... but regardless, what about the balance issues? Any thoughts on that?

i am dubious on releasing a patch just yet. my next update planned will be 2.0 and i want to do a total rebuild of the project after Warlords is out, intergrating all of the new features. so im waiting till it gets on preorder. I had big problems with multiplayer compatibility (there is none to speak of) so i knew i needed a full rebuild. but i am so sick of firaxis' crappy support for modders, im going to wait for warlords and release one compatible with that expansion. i plan on going over the who of this forum and writing down all changes needed too, so i wont forget anyone.
what do you think of this?

I think it makes sense that you are waiting for the Warlord expansion.

BTW I love the music, the musics should not change :D

im only going going to add one more song because there is still one last vanilla song left. and im going to add a bit more beef to usa as requested, and im going to change picture of bush (but i promise it still wont be flattering ;) ) and there is a host of map errors im going to fix.

Im also decideing on a smaller map size. What do you all think of that?

I think larger map is always better... what are your reasons for thinking of smaller map though?

well, primarily because somethings wrong/incompatible with my current map's plot list, so i will have to remake the map from SCRATCH :cry: . and secondly, i wanted slower end computer users to be able to play better and online play too.

This looks great, but I have one suggestion...
Why don't you try making it so the scenario will WORKS? I downloaded it, moved it to programfiles/firaxisgames/civ4/mods. I moved the worldbuilder save to publicmaps. I ran the mod and I can see your fairly awesome menu, but when I go to play now and then play scenario, the second revolution file ISN'T THERE! How do you make this scenario thingy work!?! :mad: :confused: :mad:

This looks great, but I have one suggestion...
Why don't you try making it so the scenario will WORKS? I downloaded it, moved it to programfiles/firaxisgames/civ4/mods. I moved the worldbuilder save to publicmaps. I ran the mod and I can see your fairly awesome menu, but when I go to play now and then play scenario, the second revolution file ISN'T THERE! How do you make this scenario thingy work!?! :mad: :confused: :mad:

the game is barely compatible after the last patch. are you runnung the newest version of civ? (probly are i know)

hmmm. is it that you cant find the Worldbiuldersave (map) or is civ crashing to desktop?? i will try to help[ you if i can, but im no computer whiz.

alls i can say otherwise, for all second revolution fans, i plan on doing a complete rebuild as soon as Warlords comes out. It will be compatible with warlords and should be much less glitchy and i will attempt to fix my numerous errors.

I got it to work now, great scenario,(the music=awesome;) ) but it runs....really.....really......slooowwwww....
Any suggestions on how to get it to run faster?

I got it to work now, great scenario,(the music=awesome;) ) but it runs....really.....really......slooowwwww....
Any suggestions on how to get it to run faster?

well, first you should try to set the graphics settings to minimum to free up graphics memory, second there is a setting inside of Civ4config that reads:

; Allows some memory savings *** ALT-TAB WILL NO LONGER FUNCTION ***
MemSaver = 0

change this to "1"

this might help. i have a P42.8 ht with 1.5gb ram and it takes forever to load and run the first few turns. let me know what happens

Are they the graphic settings for my entire computer or just for Civ 4? Does it do anything else that's possibly bad if you change that thing to 1? BTW, good luck with your warlords version. I would advise changing the picture for Castro, maybe one where he's not in a whellchair. And he should be wearing his signature green military suit and beard. :D

Are they the graphic settings for my entire computer or just for Civ 4? Does it do anything else that's possibly bad if you change that thing to 1? BTW, good luck with your warlords version. I would advise changing the picture for Castro, maybe one where he's not in a whellchair. And he should be wearing his signature green military suit and beard. :D

the setting above is in the _Civ4config file located in your civ4 directory. This shouldnt affect anything other than civ, but you wont be able to Alt-Tab during your session of Civ, so dont do it, the game will glitch! this parameter is like the Harkonnen memory fix.

As for the wheelchair pic, that was a recent pic when i downloaded it, and i think its fitting as Castro will be dead soon.

Well, I still think a younger picture of Castro would be better. BTW, how old is he now?

Dude, he's is like at least 80 years old! And he is in failing health. That's why i used such an unflattering picture of him.

Sorry To All You Communists. :cry:

the game lags a bit with just the way it is... making the map larger would make it even worst

keep it the same size

i agree, and am thinking about reducing the map by 33%

Any plans for a 1.61 version? I've tried loading the current version and get all sorts of XML errors.

it can run in 1.61. i dont know why but it can. civ4 uses its mod directory to sort of "un-patch" the game when you run it. i can get it to run single player but not multi player.

i plan on releasing a new version around the time that warlords comes out, or when there is a new patch for vanilla civ4 (which ever is first)

i hope you can get it to work tho, it is fun :)

email me if i can give more specific help

Sorry To All You Communists.
There's a Communist around here?!:aargh:

I see you are using some colosseums so here is a stadium:CLICKY HERE (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4227834#post4227834) Also I think you should release a version before Warlords comes out.(for thise who won't get it for a while)

thanks hadrean

note to self:
add stadium reskin
add paved road reskin

btw: i have decided to not make this release for warlords, but i am still waiting for warlords to come out, so that they may patch vanilla again. ive been having severe compatability issues

note to self...add white house and possibly CN tower by Rabbit, white.
also... add T-62 tank for possible early tank by the conquests (i think)

awesome job guys. keep it up.

awesome job guys. keep it up.

im glad you like it. im the only one left, i think the others got tagged by the CIA (just kidding)

i plan on making a complete remake soon, and will add some cool sdk stuff, new graphics and more!

im glad you like it. im the only one left, i think the others got tagged by the CIA (just kidding)

i plan on making a complete remake soon, and will add some cool sdk stuff, new graphics and more!

Great... Even longer loading time..

actually, my goal is to cut down on map size and clean up the xml significantly, so the load times should go down. the graphics im adding are your stadium and roads ;)

note to self..
replace satellite model with rodsgods
add nuke anywhere mod

The Earth Liberation Front in the Pacific Northwest and Animal Liberation Front in California, would allow for more players in this mod.

The Earth Liberation Front in the Pacific Northwest and Animal Liberation Front in California, would allow for more players in this mod.

Thanks for your interest!

If you download the mod, you will notice that all of the pacific northwest from Vancouver to Sanfransico is held by the "Rebel Coalition", which all of the anachistic or reformative splinter groups have united under. It is more than obvious to me that all the of the factions crying out for social change would have to unite against the might of the fascist elements in america.

So is the warlord version out or are you still working on that?

LOL right now i dont have a computer to run civ! My alienware is delayed right now, coz they dont have my motherboard!!! !@#$!@#%~!@

I havent even bothered picking up my preordered copy of warlords, coz i wont have my comp to play it on :p

Heres and article for YA!! It was in PC Gamer magazine. Jul issue. item 173.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=144659&page=9

Here's the direct link: http://forums.civfanatics.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=134980&d=1154947781