We are a few people (so far it´s Drendor, Pinktilapia and the_monarch) who wanna start a succession game with the mod found here:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=111682


We have not yet decided how many we are gonna be so write a post in this thread if you are intrested.

Perhaps 5-6 people is appropriate?

We also need to discuss wich version to play and if we are gonna mod it some or use any houserules.

I suggest that people who are unfamiliar with the mod but still are intrested to read the rules found in the thread.
There are alot of new units and wonder/improvements and you need to know the basics to take part in this game.


Alea jacta est!


Consul Linkowicius

I like to take part in this game. I know and still play civ 3 because of this scenario/mod. Thanks again for the mod pink.

who will go first, how many turns for each player?


Recomendations:

Conquer southern italy, commision foriegn legions in southern italy.

Build up velites/ granerys and research enginering.

Game version.... 275bc easy..

I'm played this from the start but have never passed pontus. I've conquered Syria but longest i've played was til 50 AD

We should also have 6 players with good experience ....

anyways thats my input!

Count me in, sizzlechest!

Ok we are 5 people so far. I think that´s enough but I want to hear what Pink and monarch have to say as well.

We also need to start discussion of game variant, difficulty, rules and strategy.

I am IN ! :)
I would go for the easy version, if you ask me, for it would optimize our chances of success in completing the game. I fear I am a poor Civ3 player (you will call me Commodus, you will see).

For house rules, let me start:
(1) Barbarian cities locked into ancestral forests must not be claimed in a peace treaty
(2) The same goes with Parthian/Persian cities located on Persian Hearthland terrain

More...?

For the succession game's rules, is there some standard around already? Like how many turns one player plays before sending its save, etc.

I also have a proposition, that might be a good idea or not. Do you want me to first compile the update long promised (I will do it before Friday) and start a succession game based on it? The good side: fixed little bugs and game balance issues, new features. The bad side: a serious risk for new flaws and bugs. A compromise (and yet more work for me *yuck*) would the big update for the 1 player game only, that we be further tested, and a slightly fixed BIQ for our succession game (just the few bugs that still exist in version 1.03). Which way to go folks?

Can't wait to start!

I think you'll find that you're not the worst player on board, Pink! Trust me, I know about these things. I've never even met a persian yet! (in the game, that is!)

Ah, but I never went through the Carthaginians ;)! (don't quick me out of the team please!)

Ha ha! We're both crap!

Is there one spot left open? I would like to join too (as I overwrote my 175AD or so file recently) but I have never played a succesion game before and I don't know how much time it would require and so on.

Well I would like to give this succession game a whorl (though it would be my first one). If someone is not able to play give me a pm and I will fill in there position. ;)

That's 7 if I don't mistake. 3 more and we could well have two games running!

I'm back from the tedious university work and should be able to play freely. In my game (the second one that I'm bound to take to the finish I got all the way till 16AD (Egypt and Mesopotamia were the last bunch) and I'm pretty close to history, with a little advance on Germania and Dacia (Decebalus has only Tomis left for now). Anyway I kinda "cheated" (well I found my way around the rules) by dennying Pontus their Mithridates unit and Dacia their Furores Dacii, but I've seen plenty of Legio Antonii :). I tell you this because you might want to make these civs stronger BEFORE they enter a war with Rome (like you did to Carthago Nova :goodjob:) and make their spawning units their swan's tune. I wrote my complete "SPQR chronicles" if anyone wants to see them. I too think the hard version is quite a challenge unless you manage everything and don't use tricks like the foreign legions so I'm okay with an easy version but I vote for the new patch that needs to be tested anyway.

So. When do we start? Nobody seems to have much experience about the late part of the game, isn't it? How do we designate the number of turns? And the following order?

As for the house rules, I halfheartedly agree :mad:. I wrote on the main thread that the Roxolanii joined the Empire by a "cultural" conversion and I wrote about my intention to take 3 (three) Persian cities on Persian Heartland to permanently secure the eastern borders. All coastal German cities could easily fall to amphiboius Scipionii, (one even has a landing zone next to it) and I planned on razing the cities that are beyond the limes (like Dacia and Britannia if I can't hold on to them but I will refrain from any such "devil's work" from this game as I agree they spoil the (frustrating) fun :lol:. I suppose the free foreign legions are allowed (and historical even) right? I ussually load these "precious" units into armies for better protection and so their terraform handicap is negated. This way the army costs only as one unit, not as three.

Any other suggestions about what shouldn't be allowed?

I agree with the houserules stated by Pink.
Maybe we should forbid ROP-raping as well?

The easy biq is fine by me. Gives us a chance to play without using the "holy reload button".

hmm 7, should we try to wait for a few more ppl and start up two games?
Or maybe 7 ppl is enough already for two games?

Maybe not so much a house rule as to keep it interesting. How about limiting the number of Legios before the Marius reform to the number of cities Rome possess? Make more reliance on the auxiliary units, other than just building them more for cheap defense.

Well I am up for two games if we gather enough people.

If we get a few more people to join in we could have 2 people do 10 turns each. Seeing how Rome had 2 Consul before the 44BCE, we could delegate two different responsibilites to each Consul. Say one is in charge of the army (though each would control a single Legio Consularis) and one for domestic duties (buildings, wonders). Then other things like tax rate, ROP, war, could be discussed among the Consuls. Heh, then we could claim which one of us is Dictator for Life, to oversee the general direction in which Rome will conduct herself. :)

Maybe not so much a house rule as to keep it interesting. How about limiting the number of Legios before the Marius reform to the number of cities Rome possess? Make more reliance on the auxiliary units, other than just building them more for cheap defense.

Well I am up for two games if we gather enough people.

If we get a few more people to join in we could have 2 people do 10 turns each. Seeing how Rome had 2 Consul before the 44BCE, we could delegate two different responsibilites to each Consul. Say one is in charge of the army (though each would control a single Legio Consularis) and one for domestic duties (buildings, wonders). Then other things like tax rate, ROP, war, could be discussed among the Consuls. Heh, then we could claim which one of us is Dictator for Life, to oversee the general direction in which Rome will conduct herself. :)
Yeah! :) Let's start a democracy game based on RFRE!

I say 10 turns before sending the save should be good but 2 persons on the same save file could be a bit difficult.
House Rules : well, due to the difficulty even in the easy version of conquering everything on time, I say no rules except for the ROP-rape which kinda ruins eveything. And of course, no conquering ancestral forest city or persian heartland city.
For early strategies, we have 2 options :
1) Do it as in a history book
2) Conquer civs before they have their uber-unit meaning some civs will be left overs for the end
Plus, let's play RFRE on the newest patch

Ok - I am working on the patch. Try to be done with it tomorrow and hopefully an upload on Friday. We could then start playing Monday!

As much as I love the idea of having 2 players/consuls playing together 10 turns, I don't see how it can be practically done. One thought I had, easier to implement, is that a senate (players) vote must take place everytime Rome wishes to declare war, with a 2/3 majority required to be able to do so. We could add other major decision along this line (building wonders, contracting alliances). Also, a similar 2.3 majority vote of all players could also force the current player out, naming another one to play 5 turns (Dictator anyone?) afterwhich the previous player resumes his remaining turns of play.

House rules:
(1) Barbarian cities locked into ancestral forests must not be claimed in a peace treaty
(2) The same goes with Parthian/Persian cities located on Persian Hearthland terrain
(3) No ROP-rape allowed
(4) 2/3 majority needed for
1. Declaration of war
2. Building a wonder in a specific city
3. Naming a Dictator for 5 turns
(5) Provide basic report of each turn (support costing troops raised, conquests, diplomacy, net income, major builds, etc.)
(6) ...

I would let the Senate decides where war will be waged according to rule 4.1, we don't needed to necessarily follow history (although it should come to this practically).

I'm new to succession games but I'm not sure about the rest of you. Would it be an idea to play a mock run of a few turns each to familiarise and refine how we're going to do this?

Indeed your idea sounds more practical, and I can live with those house rules. I was wondering what we would do after dictator perpetuus is built? Maybe jocky for position, something like curring favor with other players, secret email assasination plots, or the old favorite of taking Rome by force (not that this is doable of course...). :devil: Maybe dictator for life could be chosen by those who suggested actions netted the most territory/city gain? Or something else, or not at all. Just throwing some ideas out there.

One thing we should do after dictator for life is declared, that is if we go that route, is divide a certain amount of cities to each player for control. Most likely have governors for each major province in the Roman Empire. Of course only if it is feasible to do so. Just would be fairly interesting if we set it up somewhat on the governing ways of Rome.

Well this democracy game sounds like a lot of fun. Never played one and I'm sure we can work out the mistakes if we think together, but we need a "consul" to oversee all other governors (if we chose to have any) AND to run the army, basically run the game.

However I almost never waged war on two fronts so it seems impractical to divide control of the army. One consul always stayed home, you know...

Also I don't see any other practical way of actually doing this than a Senate meeting once every 10 or 20 turns when the mandate expires for the current consul. The Senate should then analyze his rule, give a grade to him and even penalize him (maibe skip a few turns next round). The only actual responsability would be to control the army effectivelly and we all know that's very much dependant on the random factor. However if someone manages to lose an army he should have some serious punishment :lol: . Just kidding.

Btw I took Suza and Hamadan yesterday with the help of 20 velites and the 6 armies but it was quite hard. Works perfectly that Persian Heartland terrain. They had just 3 saggitarrius inside only one was veteran and the pounding took forever. Velites withdrew to deny them becoming veteran. I guess that border is secure forever :). Got Sarmias in negociations too. It's quite historical if you come to think of it as Assyria WAS a Roman province for a short period of time. :mischief:. Well I'm off to Armenia now.

I'll be able to start a game on Monday too, but no way sooner.

Indeed your idea sounds more practical, and I can live with those house rules. I was wondering what we would do after dictator perpetuus is built? Maybe jocky for position, something like curring favor with other players, secret email assasination plots, or the old favorite of taking Rome by force (not that this is doable of course...). :devil: Maybe dictator for life could be chosen by those who suggested actions netted the most territory/city gain? Or something else, or not at all. Just throwing some ideas out there.

Sounds like you want a multiplayer game like Rome Total war :)

Ok - I am working on the patch. Try to be done with it tomorrow and hopefully an upload on Friday. We could then start playing Monday!

As much as I love the idea of having 2 players/consuls playing together 10 turns, I don't see how it can be practically done. One thought I had, easier to implement, is that a senate (players) vote must take place everytime Rome wishes to declare war, with a 2/3 majority required to be able to do so. We could add other major decision along this line (building wonders, contracting alliances). Also, a similar 2.3 majority vote of all players could also force the current player out, naming another one to play 5 turns (Dictator anyone?) afterwhich the previous player resumes his remaining turns of play.

House rules:
(1) Barbarian cities locked into ancestral forests must not be claimed in a peace treaty
(2) The same goes with Parthian/Persian cities located on Persian Hearthland terrain
(3) No ROP-rape allowed
(4) 2/3 majority needed for
1. Declaration of war
2. Building a wonder in a specific city
3. Naming a Dictator for 5 turns
(5) Provide basic report of each turn (support costing troops raised, conquests, diplomacy, net income, major builds, etc.)
(6) ...

I would let the Senate decides where war will be waged according to rule 4.1, we don't needed to necessarily follow history (although it should come to this practically).


These suggestions sounds splendid to me.

Should we make a list with the seven players and decide who goes first?

Hum... I don't see the point of naming a dictator because by the time someone's going to post "Errrr, guys, I think I screwed up. Just lost Rome to Gallia Cisalpina", it's going to be way too late. Except if we reload, but then we simply have to make another player play.
Only reason why we should have a dictator is if we play with 2 consuls. It will mean less bickering and more fighting.

Ok - I am working on the patch. Try to be done with it tomorrow and hopefully an upload on Friday. We could then start playing Monday!

As much as I love the idea of having 2 players/consuls playing together 10 turns, I don't see how it can be practically done. One thought I had, easier to implement, is that a senate (players) vote must take place everytime Rome wishes to declare war, with a 2/3 majority required to be able to do so. We could add other major decision along this line (building wonders, contracting alliances). Also, a similar 2.3 majority vote of all players could also force the current player out, naming another one to play 5 turns (Dictator anyone?) afterwhich the previous player resumes his remaining turns of play.

House rules:
(1) Barbarian cities locked into ancestral forests must not be claimed in a peace treaty
(2) The same goes with Parthian/Persian cities located on Persian Hearthland terrain
(3) No ROP-rape allowed
(4) 2/3 majority needed for
1. Declaration of war
2. Building a wonder in a specific city
3. Naming a Dictator for 5 turns
(5) Provide basic report of each turn (support costing troops raised, conquests, diplomacy, net income, major builds, etc.)
(6) ...

I would let the Senate decides where war will be waged according to rule 4.1, we don't needed to necessarily follow history (although it should come to this practically).




(3) No ROP-rape allowed

what does this mean?

Never tried to experience that myself. If I understand right, this were you first sign a Right of Passage, then position your troops at key areas in your 'friend's' territory, then declare war and massacre him in a turn or so.

:ack: Bad!

How exactly will the feedback be delivered between the current "consul" and the Senate? I mean will he pause after every turn and wait for the Senate to allow him to continue his mandate or will he play all his turns in a row and, in this case he will just present the saves of all his turns and the Senate will decide if a L.O.A.D. is necesarry and someone else will replace him from that turn as a dictator.

Also we still haven't decided the number of turns to be played by each consul. How about the range is between 10 and 20 according to the Senate grade the player receives at the end of his mandate. This could cause some beneficial competiton between players but also some political schemes so it might be both fun and annoying. We should clarify all this stuff to the numbers until Monday as time is running out.

How exactly will the feedback be delivered between the current "consul" and the Senate? I mean will he pause after every turn and wait for the Senate to allow him to continue his mandate or will he play all his turns in a row and, in this case he will just present the saves of all his turns and the Senate will decide if a L.O.A.D. is necesarry and someone else will replace him from that turn as a dictator.

Also we still haven't decided the number of turns to be played by each consul. How about the range is between 10 and 20 according to the Senate grade the player receives at the end of his mandate. This could cause some beneficial competiton between players but also some political schemes so it might be both fun and annoying. We should clarify all this stuff to the numbers until Monday as time is running out.

As Pink suggested earlier I think that the Consul only needs to consult the senate when he commits major actions like declaring war/peace or binding alliances or when a wonder is being built.

I suggest that we all start with 10 turns per person and then we can modify this later when we know eachother better....

I'd agree. One qualification might be considered. 10 turns involves a lot more in the later stages than it does early on. Maybe no. of turns should be staggered with this in mind. Then again, maybe it doesn't matter. Thoughts?

I'd agree. One qualification might be considered. 10 turns involves a lot more in the later stages than it does early on. Maybe no. of turns should be staggered with this in mind. Then again, maybe it doesn't matter. Thoughts?


Yes we could reduce the number of turns to 5 when our empire has reached it´s peak sometime AD. We don´t wanna reduce the turns too much though as I think that each one of us feels like they wanna have time to acomplish something during each and own turn

Agreed. But once the empire has reached it's peak there shouldn't be much except for defensive maneuvers at least for a while. My opinion is that the number of turns should increase rather than decrease during Pax Romana. But it's not that important anyway. So should we draw strings to see who goes first?

As Pink suggested earlier I think that the Consul only needs to consult the senate when he commits major actions like declaring war/peace or binding alliances or when a wonder is being built

Well... yeah, but I mean this will have to be done before he starts playing, right? I mean he gets the sav and states clearly that on turn 2 or 3 he will attack because the Senate will only gather between the mandates, right? Or would you rather go for a broadcast play where we all IM each other and take decisions on spot? This could be hard to achieve for 7 people on all continents. And for him to stop playing every couple of turns to post a thread and wait days for 2/3 of us to give him the right to build Imperium Pompeianus sounds like a waste of time. Wonders (except for the negative ones like Crux Iesii) should be built right away, and most of them are buildable only in the proper place anyway. I think research priorities are more important, but that can be decided earlier on and only the tax rate should fluctuate. Lot's of decisions so we need to come together and think about this seriously.

My suggestion of first ten turns:

1:th to 3:th turn wipe out Pyrrhus and capture his cities with as few casualties as possible. (there should be no casualties with the troop advantage we have on easy biq) Try to build foreign miles socius in the new cities?
Build velites and mercator in some latin cities

4:th to 6:th turn. Move forces close to Syracuse and Bovanium and declare war on the western greeks. We need Syracuse fast for the wheat and fine timber.
Start build Mare Nostrum, maybe in Neapel? When first punic war is researched.

After this we could either go after the celts in northern Italy or declare war on Carthage and try to capture the whole of Sicilly.
The advantage of going after Carthage right after western greeks is that our main army is already positioned on Sicilly.
The advantage of waiting is that we have had time to build Mare Nostrum to get some corvux who can capture enemy ships.
By waiting and going north for the celts and later east for the Illyrian cities we boost our production alot because those cities have little corruption and should be conquered as soon as possible to get maximum benefit for the empire.

I also think that we should build tons of velites and miles socius.
The miles socius have the same combat values as the legion but two hp less.
But it costs 1 pop instead of 3!!!!!!!!!! and 55 shields instead of 60. When Marius arrives all of our Miles can be upgraded to regular legions.
We have to build some legions for road building though. The mlies auxillary cant build roads....


thoughts?

So the only way this Consul and Senate is going to realistically work is if the voting is limited to just voting for dictator? We all play our alloted Nth turns as we see fit, and when we decide its time to go to war (or the AI declares war on us), we vote to see who the dictator will be to lead the war effort? I could not really see it being very effective if a dictator plays 5 turns and then it is my turn to play. Instead of having a exact time the dictator is in for power, would it not be better to have them stay in power (playing) until such time peace is declared (or the AI is conquered)?

Personnally, I don't think the concept of Senate, Consul or Dictator will work in a succession game of 7 persons. It will take a lot of time and most decisions (such as building wonders) are very straightforward. I say, let's try, at least for our first SG, a normal game where every 10 turns we switch player (and maybe 20 turns in the latter periods). Only usefulness of a senate comes when we need to declare war. At the same time, the mandate for war should include the power for the current player to make all necessary alliances. Sure, sometimes we are going to sign unwanted alliances, but that can reflet bad consuls or bad emperors. Plus in times of war, you don't question autority :p .

Suggestion for the first 10 turns :
1 to 3 : Conquer Epirus with as little losses as possible and hurry Legio/Miles Socius in conquered cities. On the second turn, when we have possibly captured at least 1, if not the 2 cities of Epirus, sign ROP with all nations except Cartago and Magna Graecia.
Micromanage : this is about the only part that I micromanage. Build in Neapolis the most costly thing (60 shield). Make sure that either a) it will be done in 12 turns in order to change it to Mare Nostrum at the exact time we discover First Punic war or b) build a little something and after that be sure to have the 60 shields accumulated for the 12 turn. We can change production when we discover a tech by clicking on What's the big picture and then Domestic Advisor and then change Neapolis' production which will be completed as soon as you quit the Advisors panel.
4 to 12 : Well, Magna Graecia can be a usefull ally in a war against Cartago as they will lose Syracusa to Cartago (at least in my games they always do). What I normally do, is put most of my army in Messana and wait for Cartago's declaration of war (we need to make it very angry by demanding a city in tribute for 10-20 times, they declare war soon after). After a few turns, I take Syracuse and Panormus. Meanwhile, the other Consular army with a couple of Miles Socius go after Corsica and Sardeigne. If we play this right, by the end of the war, 250BC-230BC, we can have all western Mediterranean islands, Sicile and Valentia Edetanorum. If we are lucky, the greeeks are going to lose everything excep bovianum and we can take their coastal cities and declare war on them right after. Anyways, the first 20 turns are going to be critical for the rest of the game. So, in case of continuous bad luck, we can esaily restart.

Capt Beaver, I wrote this at the same time as you posted. Let's feel free to ignore my complex throughts below! Your suggestion is actually wise. A simple SG would do well. Anyway, since I typed it, so I post it:

--------------------------

Players

1) Drendor
2) ApolytonCivFan
3) Traianus
4) Pinktilapia
5) Captain Beaver
6) Gaias
7) The Monarch

House Rules

1) Barbarian cities locked into ancestral forests must not be claimed in a peace treaty
2) Parthian/Persian cities with a Parthian Garrison must not be claimed in a peace treaty
3) No ROP-rape allowed

Democracy Rules (at least for the Republican period of the game)

1) Once the current player get the SAV, he submit a plan of action for his forthcoming turns
2) Action plan must includes the following:
a. Overall objectives of the consulship
b. Diplomacy (declaration of war, alliance, tentative to sign a peace, RoP)
c. Commission/cancellation of wonders
d. Research to be undertaken
3) Other actions are up to the player (building for troops and improvements; tax rate, move of units, etc.)
4) Action plan must be endorsed by the Senate, with at least a 50% of votes (current player do not vote), otherwise modified until accepted
5) The player then undertakes his consulship for 10 turns (unless modified, see below), reporting main events and achievements every turn.
6) The player does not need to wait for feedback when submitting his turn report and can proceed at his pace. However, if he want to undertake some of the actions mentioned in (2) not previously accepted by the Senate, he will need to submit these and wait for approval. A carefully designed action plan will ensure this is not needed.
7) At the end of his consulship, a detailed report is submitted. If the player is found having done some of the actions mentioned in (2) without approval of the Senate, he can be sanctioned a certain number of disapproval points (if 50% of Senate approve so). The Senate can judge his consulship (through again a 50% majority):
a. Outstanding (1 or more approval points)
b. Good (no effect)
c. Negative (1 or more disapproval points)
8) For each point received (MAX 5 approval or sanction points), the player next consulship length will be modified (e.g. with 2 approval points, the next consulship will be 12 turns; with 3 disapproval points, his next consulship would be 7 turns)
9) During the consulship of a player (or at the end of it), the Senate can evoke a state of emergency (based on the current player reports, with a >50% majority). A Dictator will play until the Senate revokes the state of emergency (with a 50% majority, dictator do not vote). After which normal playing sequence is continued.


--------------------


Is that acceptable? Clear? Comments? Modifications?
I suggest the thread creator starts on Monday (if patch uploaded for I am facing a bug in game that seems difficult to fix, otherwise the update is completed actually).

So first (for 10 turns): Drendor. Next can be selected randomly, or following the list of post in this thread as above. Ok, back to my update!

I still favor the Senate for flavor :p. It will always be comprised by 6 people so a vote of only 3 (4 if you must) will be enough to asure a majority. This can be abolished later by the time of Marius or Sylla or if we see it doesn't work at all or it's becoming a formality. But it could be fun.

Ok. Strategically I think captain beaver's 10 turns are perfectly sound. My personal suggestion would be to hurry Foreign Legions rather than Miles Socius. 2hps can make a difference and you won't be able to train new "priceless" foreign legions from Tarentum and Croton once the time passes. Save a place (or two) in the second consular army for one of those FLs. Also for better record we should number the legios and rename the consulars: Consular Iulii and Consular Brutii for example. You should load if you lose any of them :lol:.

Research path is clear for now. The only time when I chose to bypass a tech was when it envolved an army generating wonder go obsolete but that's later on. If the First Punic War ends up with all cities on the islands (including Palma) and Valentia Edetanorum I think the player should receive maximum votes. There should be this incentive, in my opinion. One less city or army should count as a -1 on the grade. Also the mandate should be extended if war takes too long to continue with a maximum of 2 turns (this should be the Dictator like mandate if you ask me and it should be deducted from the next consular mandate - the consul will become dictator at his own will but all abuses should be avoided). Consuls should not be able to declare war in their last 2 turns to avoid stalling (unless they are sure to win in 2 turns :lol:). What's the purpose: basically a safe, flexible and easy transition that avoids leaving the conflicts for others to solve. Only major wars should be left unsolved in a mandate.

So as not to waste time, and since I agree that that there should be a senate vote every 10 turns to decide the strategy involved, (maibe even beforehand we receive the chronicles to hurry things up) I vote positive for pink's suggestion about the consulship. But let's try to keep it simple. Also I think that, since we are seven, we should all have "a day of consulship" each. Play in the morning (GMT) and discuss with the Senate in the afternoon-till night. I understand there should be some time problems but no vote requires unanimous presence so as soon as 3 have voted positively it should pass. The grades will have to be given by all 6 so an average could be made but the next round will be only in a week so there is plenty of time for the grade to be claculated. Sounds fair to you all?

To make things faster, point 2 could/should be discussed beforehand and point 6 I suggest should be abolished. He should make any changes he sees fit (the consul is not a puppet) and the grade will determine if he was right or wrong to do so. The report should be in one single post, including:
-tax rate adopted (from...BC-to...BC)
-wonders started/built
-diplomatic changes (including foreign to foreign)
-newly conquered/lost cities
-newly built/lost legios (should be hard to keep track for all other units
-any notes (future recommendations, hints, bugs etc)
all the saves should be kept in archive for further examination so as to be fairly graded. (:lol: I deliberatley wanted to sound bureaucratic here but maibe it's not a bad idea to have them for backup)

I will be gone this weekend but I agree with Pinks last thread.

I can begin our quest for territory on monday evening.


D

I concur with the guidelines that Pink has given.

i agree, everything looks good. lets start on monday, plunder the world on tuesday :)

This might be interesting although a bit too complicated for our SG.http://demogame.civfanatics.net/

Ok since everyone agrees, let's try it with a Senate. But The_Monarch "day of consulship" will be a bit hard to do. Personnaly, I have school, homeworks. a job and my (real) life that keeps bothering me so I will probably only be able to post what I want to do once and after approval, play my turns. Only exception is on weekends as I have more time for Civing.
Also, how much time do we allow each player to use to post his plan, dl the save, post his turn summaries and finish his 10 turns? 48 hours sounds good for my workload. After those 48 hours, the current consul, even if unfinished, should immediatly post his save.

Actually there are more people in this game than active in the Civ3 democracy game, I think.

I can agree to a maximum of 48 hours to complete your turns or your time is defaulted. Would give us enough time to make plans and suggestions to the Consul.

Might I suggest that we increase the allotted turns that a player must complete to 12? My reasoning being that Pink has always suggesting that research should be kept at a minimum of 12 turns. It would make sense considering that RFRE technology tree is mostly a time indicator. There is enough techs before (and including) Dictator, that each Consul could have associated to their rule. Would give each player a bit of flavor as they would be responsible for building this great work or traing this great army. Just a thought. ;)

@captain beaver: You are right, of course. I was kinda naive with that 1 day. I myself am in a prolongated weekend after the "halfdiploma" and have a little time on my hands and around the clock connection but I think this will soon expire (around tuesday or so). Maibe even 2-3 days should be required for a consul. I mean early turns shouldn't take more than 5 minutes but later on it will take a lot more just to scroll through the cities. At least one day should be required to asure tranzition alone from one consul to another. But if we play the whole game (500 or 600 turns!) it's gonna take many months. So I agree with the 48 hours/10 turns mandate.

So how about discussing the strategy with the senate before getting the savefile and let the consul adjust the changes afterwards by his own judgement and the recommendations of the former consul too. Do you all favour the grading as well? This would mean, Gaias, that turns/ consulship would vary from 8 to 12. Besides not all techs will be researched in 12 turns anyway for various reasons (we should keep the army generator wonders running for at least two armies of each scipionis, caesaris, traianis and belisarii). But if we all get good grades we should all have 12 turns anyway :D.

Actually there are more people in this game than active in the Civ3 democracy game, I think.

Thnx for the encouragement. Maibe we can revolutionize the main democracy game if this works out fine :lol:.

So I go first on monday?

Should i play with version 1.03 or wait for a patch?

I defeat Epiros, build legio in conquered cities, ally with western greeks and provoke Carthage? Start prebuild in Neapel.

I dont know if its possible to leave one space "open" in the Consular armies for the foreign legios and still defeat Pyrrhus armies easily.

So I go first on monday?

Should i play with version 1.03 or wait for a patch?

I defeat Epiros, build legio in conquered cities, ally with western greeks and provoke Carthage? Start prebuild in Neapel.

I dont know if its possible to leave one space "open" in the Consular armies for the foreign legios and still defeat Pyrrhus armies easily.

Pink said he'll release the newest patch during the week-end, so I guess wait until it is released to start. And since you may have spare time, start planning your objectives to allow us more time to vote.
For the Consular armies , load them with the Legios available. It doesn't matter if we have 2 Roman Legio in a consular army with 2 foreign Legio somewhere else or 2 foreign Legio in a consular army with 2 Roman Legio somewhere else. It costs the same.

It actually does make a little difference. If you have a 'Roman' Legion army you pay supportx3, whereas with one foreign legion you pay supportx1. That's something that The Monarch posted unless I'm mistaken.

Exactly. Well one FL and one Roman Legio means you pay for the army and the Roman legio (still just 2 units :D) but the real reson is because if you have a FL outside the army it is more likely to get killed than within. I usually (well, only tried it once but it worked ok) load 2 legios in the first army and manage to defeat the Pyrrhos unit and only one in the second army and still manage to defeat the other elephant. The rest should be done with the other legios. Once you have a FL you can suplement that free spot in the second army.

But it's not that important since we're playing easy version anyway :). However if we still have any FL's by the time of Scipio (I had a few from Illyria and Gallia Cisalpina) we should load them into the armies. I also mentioned that foreign units have only 50% terraform so if you load them into the army that won't matter (the terraform of the army loaded or empty, obviously stays the same).

Pink said he'll release the newest patch during the week-end, so I guess wait until it is released to start.

Yes, it is done and uploaded, courtesy of 3D Downloads :) You will find the link on the first post of the RFRE thread. I am glad if we play on this, but they are risks we might encounter bugs that forces us to restart the game. I hope not, I tested it as much as I could.

To our game now! (that was the carrot on the stick that helped me working on this update for 3 full days!)

And since you may have spare time, start planning your objectives to allow us more time to vote.

Where is the plan :crazyeye: ? Anway, I still think I was a bit too much excited when I wrote these guidelines. Maybe the first few turns can be more flexible and we can later adopt a game a bit more in line with the "Senate style". Otherwise, it is nearly scary to play your own turn ;)

Drendor, you play!

Might it be wise then to wait for the senate decisions until everyone has played once through? I think at least, it would give us a good indication on each others playing styles and strategies.

Or maybe just let Drendor go through his turn without any influence from us to get the ball rolling?

While we are still discussing, why don't we come up with some simple guideline/form on what essential information needs to be posted? That way we can have some model that all can adhere, to keep things somewhat organized and coherent (considering at times I have little of both :lol:)?

First of all thnx to pink for his huge effort :).

I say let Drendor play! Give the consul liberty! The main purpose of this game is, in my opinion, to find out the bugs and make it even better than it is. And to have fun in the meantime, of course :D.

The only think we should take into consideration should be the effects of his rule. And because it's a whole new patch maibe we can skip the grades for the first round. So in my opinion anything that's good with Drendor by the time he finishes his 10 turns should be good for us. We are no Gestapo here :lol:. And the guidelines for his 10 first turns are already here:

Just wait for Carthage to declare war (you might wanna enfuriate them first) and be ready to strike back. You should negociate for Valentia once you conquer Palma and that's about it. May the force be with you! Strength and honor! Do you guys agree about what I posted should be in the final report? I got it from a demogame report I've seen on that link and thought it was pretty satisfactory.

Consul Linkowicius has now played 10 turns. Here is the report:

All in all we have had some bad luck with the RNG. This has resulted in some heavy casualties.
Due to insane results with the RNG i had to replay turn 1 three times before I got a result YOU could live with. Heck one time one of our armies got slaughtered when trying to take out one of Pyrrhus elephants

Turn 1: I attacked Pyrrhus army and lost no troops. I shipped troops from Messana and landed them on a hill south of Croton (just in case)
Troops from northern peninsula moved south leaving only weak garrisons.

Began the production of a mixture of military units (legio, miles soc and velites and eques)

Set lux to 10% due to war weariness and began researching 1 punic war at max speed.

Computer moves a peltastes out from Croton and kills one of our Miles socs on hills (he has velite support) :mad:

Turn 2: Begin siege of Tarentum. We capture Croton! :goodjob:

We attack one epiros ship with our veteran triremis graeci but loose.
Our next ship attacks and wins but does not get promoted to elite..:mad:

Gah!!!! We need one elite ship to begin Mare Nostrum.

Lux set to 30% due to war weariness.

Computer makes two land attacks but loose


Turn 3: Tarentum is captured! :goodjob: I set lux to zero

Some diplomatic actions: I sign ROP with Magna Greacia, Aetolia, Achaia, Macedonia, Pergamum, Gallia Cisalpina and Athenae. For this we get a total of 470 gold :)

turn 4: Legions build a road south of Croton. Preparing for war with Carthage.


turn 5: preparing for war, moving troops to Sicilly. Begin building domus discendi in Pisae, maybe this should be changed to granary now when we soon have wheat connected?

turn 6: main army situated on Sicilly: Could have attacked Magna Greacia for grabbing Syracuse but some of you thought we should ally with them instead so I held the attack.
I provoked Carthage.


turn 7: I provoked Carthage (got them furious) We built a foreign legio in Tarentum (cost us 170 gold to rush it) Croton is too small to build a legio so we are building a miles socius there at the moment.


turn 8: WAR!!!!! Carthage wont declare war so WE declared war on them.
We go for Panormus. The 12:th velite manages to destroy the city wall.
The velites have really been nerfed with the lowered bombard value.
The two consular armies and 3 legions attack the city and it falls! :goodjob:

We ally with Magna Greacia against Carthage but it is expensive, 350 gold :eek:

Achai and Aetolia are more friendly they ally with us against Carthage and pay us a total of 34 gold as well :lol:

Pergamum agrees to ally with us as well and charge us only 50 gold.

We could have allied with Macedon but I thought it was too expensive for the moment.

BAD LUCK FOR ROME!!!:mad: Two Phanlanx invade Panormus from sea. We have costal fortress but no city walls. They manage to kill 2 veteran legions at full hp. The marines stay at ships and have 1 hp left each. GAAHHH!!!!!!

Turn 9: Revenge. Our velites bombard Carthagian ships. Our navy manage to sink one Quinqueremis summa and the cumba with the two naughty invaders...
Still no elite ship for us.
Bought walls in Panormus.


Turn 10: 2 velites dies when storming the walls of Lilybaeum. City on hills..
Other velites are lucky when storming and manage to kill and wound alot of units including Hamilcar Barca. Our army and legions go in for the kill and captures city!! :goodjob:

A veteran ship of ours attack a Quinqueremis summa that we bombarded down to 1/5 hp with our velites. Still our veteran ship loose!!!! Gahh Neptunus is not on our side. Many naval casualties and I dont know how we are gonna get an elite naval unit.:eek:


Next player should try to connect some wheat from Sicilly and build granaries where they are needed. Remember that some cities (Rome, Neapel and Messana have granary functions on their own)

I have tried to micromanage the city production. Advice to next player:
Change production where you see fit ( i think Rome and some other city are perfectly set at the moment though)
Remember to always try to match shield production with food production.
So that the granary gets full the same turn that the pop-costing unit is finished. I believe that if you finish a pop-costing unit and the granary is filled to 3/4 you loose that food when the unit is produced, cause granary is emptied when city is reduced in size due to pop-costing units.


Good luck! And "Strenght and Honor"


Consul Linkowicius

266BC

In a turn of events, Consul Linkowicius stepped down as consul and the Apolyton family defeated all rivals of the senate for the consulship. Consul Civfan stated “It’s great to be consul. Many changes will take place during my family’s reign. I’ve proposed several changes to the military, senate and government.

First I’ll increase revenues for the state by development of roads to Ravenna and Mediolanum, and a road to the iron deposits near Mediolanum, to use as a trade source to other nations. This will be accomplished with 3 legions. These roads will also serve as a highway to other parts of the world.

Second, we will build up more troops for war against Carthage. I’m planning on building foreign legions from these Carthagian’s worker slaves captured in our war against Carthage, build up more Velites soldiers and create some ballista’s for are conquests. I’m going to take personal command of the army against the Carthagian city of Agrigentum.

Third, will build the First Punic war technology and continue on with development of Civic Engineering. “

After his speech, Senator ApolytonCivfan walked to the Senate house and was given the skeptor for Consul. Consul Civfan plans on leading personally the Legio Consularis army against Carthage in Sicily.

Well at least, this is still the beginning so we can still restart if the attack stalls.
Critics to Drendor :
You should probably have waited a bit before invading Panormus. Cartago will make suicide attacks on the Consular army garrisonned in Messana and after a few turns like that, when the steady flow of invaders stop, it is time to attack. That's my tactic. Beside, Cartago also puts more focus on Syracuse in this situation.
Did you send the second consular army with a few Miles Socius after Corsica and Sardeigne? We still need those islands. Or is it in Sicilia fighting against Cartago?
Do we have any boats left? It seems 2 were lost so it means we have 1 or 2 left? I vote for a restart if we lose them all. It will be too expansive to build new ones and try to make them go from a 2 hp regular to a 4 hp elite.

Critics for CivFan :
Sounds good to me, althought you might want to take notice of what I said for Drendor.

Watching intently! The luck of the gods fly with you!

@captain beaver

I think we should play this through some more, as Pink has said this wasn't extensively tested. Might as well get us all to have our turn at least once to see if we run into any major bugs. If we do not, then we can decide if a start over is necessary or that our current game is continuing smoothly.

@Drendor

If we start over, what I would suggest you do for the elite ship is to take both your Tririeme Graeci and sail them down to Messana. The two Tririemes in Messana can strike at Navis Piratae units that usually infest the south eastern waters from Croton.

I will agree with captain beaver on the point of maintaining your forces in Messana for 2-3 turns. Considering that Carthages main power initially comes from their amphibious assaults, an fortified Consular army can easily defend Messana. Taking any cities before the Carthage use up their amphibious units just creates to large of a front to defend properly.

I have a question for you Drendor. Did Carthage manage to capture any cities of Magna Graeci in Gaul and Iberia? More specifically, did the capture Saguntum, Narbo, or Masillia?

@Consul Civfan

Unleash the dogs of Mars and show these barbaric curs what real mettle is made of!

After Consul Civfan reached the province of sicily, many problems were arising. It seemed that Magna Graecia was blocking the passage of troops to the city of Agrigentum. After taking over the Legio Consularis army, Civfan marched his troops around the blockading Magna Graecia army and attacked Agrigentum.


264bc bombaraded carthage cumba with velites and killed it with a triremes graeci which became elite.

263bc With the terrible lost of 3 velite soldiers, the Carthaginian city of Agrigentum fell to Consular Civfan and his elite legions.

260bc a desperate battle fought outside the city of capua with saminite warriors resulted in the dealth of many soldiers. Capua was saved by the last efforts of a velite soldier. The first foreign legion was commissioned at croton from epiris, the completion of a road to Ravenna was also accomplished.

259bc. A landing party arrived outside the Carthagean city of Carales. Croton city will now be garrisoned by a legion and some velites soldiers against future samanites attacks. A new legion was commisoned by the SPQR in Rome. We have 16 legions on the army lists. Going to attack Carales next turn.

258bc, carthage requested peace with us, I told them to shove it. Prepare for your slaughter.

257bc Both legio consularis armies plundered through the defenced of carales city. The city fell to roman might. Road was completed to Mediolanum.

256bc olbia is the scene for the next battles against carthage. Two consular armies are approaching this city from carales with legions and velites as their escorts. Not much else to report.

Jan 1, 255BC. Consular Civfan of the Apolyton family was taken ill this morning as he approach the senate house. Many admires of this great person were worried on what would happen to the Republic with this great champion ill. News finally came that Civfan was stepping down as Leader of the Roman republic due to health issues. It’s been a great 10 years with Civfan as Consular of the Republic. Many achievements were realized and war against Carthage took a very strong role.

Consular Civfan did make one last speech before retiring stating that the next consul of Rome should focus on taking the Carthage city of Olbia, take the islands from Carthage and prepare war for those Celts to the north. Build up more velites and focus on sending ships to the east. WE SHOULD FOCUS ON CREATING WARS IN THE EAST. Communications with Egypt, Syria, Galia and Parthia is important in our taking the east.

:yeah: :yeah:

Senator Olivero is now starting to mobilize his cronies at the Senate to ensure he will soon secure a consulship. Too long has his family been waiting for this honour. His eyes are firmly north and east, for his estates on the Adriatic Sea have been too long suffering from Illyrian attacks. Or will the freshly named upstart secures this land before Olivero get the consulship?

Traianus, you play!

I realize that this, properly summarized, will consist of the best walkthrough I could write. Great!

After Consul Civfan reached the province of sicily, many problems were arising. It seemed that Magna Graecia was blocking the passage of troops to the city of Agrigentum. After taking over the Legio Consularis army, Civfan marched his troops around the blockading Magna Graecia army and attacked Agrigentum.


264bc bombaraded carthage cumba with velites and killed it with a triremes graeci which became elite.

263bc With the terrible lost of 3 velite soldiers, the Carthaginian city of Agrigentum fell to Consular Civfan and his elite legions.

260bc a desperate battle fought outside the city of capua with saminite warriors resulted in the dealth of many soldiers. Capua was saved by the last efforts of a velite soldier. The first foreign legion was commissioned at croton from epiris, the completion of a road to Ravenna was also accomplished.

259bc. A landing party arrived outside the Carthagean city of Carales. Croton city will now be garrisoned by a legion and some velites soldiers against future samanites attacks. A new legion was commisoned by the SPQR in Rome. We have 16 legions on the army lists. Going to attack Carales next turn.

258bc, carthage requested peace with us, I told them to shove it. Prepare for your slaughter.

257bc Both legio consularis armies plundered through the defenced of carales city. The city fell to roman might. Road was completed to Mediolanum.

256bc olbia is the scene for the next battles against carthage. Two consular armies are approaching this city from carales with legions and velites as their escorts. Not much else to report.

Jan 1, 255BC. Consular Civfan of the Apolyton family was taken ill this morning as he approach the senate house. Many admires of this great person were worried on what would happen to the Republic with this great champion ill. News finally came that Civfan was stepping down as Leader of the Roman republic due to health issues. It’s been a great 10 years with Civfan as Consular of the Republic. Many achievements were realized and war against Carthage took a very strong role.

Consular Civfan did make one last speech before retiring stating that the next consul of Rome should focus on taking the Carthage city of Olbia, take the islands from Carthage and prepare war for those Celts to the north. Build up more velites and focus on sending ships to the east. WE SHOULD FOCUS ON CREATING WARS IN THE EAST. Communications with Egypt, Syria, Galia and Parthia is important in our taking the east.


Well done! Btw, we have two foreign legions now. One was comissioned from Tarentum under my rule.

Wow! A lot has happened since I last looked.
@Drendor: First my sincerest condoleances to Consul Linkowicius for his terrible bad luck:(! I thought I was the only one harassed by such a tedious harpy :lol:. The only thing I would hold you accountable for would be the fact that you signed a RoP with Magna Graecia and Cisalpine Gaul, our long hated enemies. Well time will tell if I'm right. Congrats on the two FL's though and many more to come!
You said you were also training some Miles Socii and Eques. I doubt a 2hp cavalry is worth supporting. My hope was that pink gave the eques normal hps. Oh well, one unit I'll never bother with although I liked its graphics.

@Consul Civfan: you seem to have saved the day with that elite ship and the rest. Tell me, did you have to load the game? Well it doesn't matter only for my curiosity (because if you haven't, you're one lucky b@st@rd - hope you take it as a compliment :D). Also I was curious, by the time you got "ill", what were the westernmost cities controlled by Rome? Did we manage to get a hold on Valentia? I think this city is vital to meet Hannibal in battle as it's near Carthago Nova and conveniently beyond a river. Anyway great report.

@Traianus: I'm sure the people of Rome will be tired of war by the time you ascend to power but I'm also sure you will be the one to tell them there's no other way to greatness. I'm guessing you're gonna go for Cisalpine Gaul? Wouldn't it be easier to take Bovianum and Syracusae before, now that the main army is south? Those Samnites were asking for it. Just a thought.

@Pink: I've only now managed to download the patch and I like what I see.
Well I liked your version of the pyramids more too ;). I hope you don't mind me taking that and some of the wonder splahes from RFRE. Cool leaderheads too. But the best part of all is the playable stuff I suppose. I'll just familiarize myself with the biqs before my turn which will probably coincide with Hannibal's march :eek:. Wouldn't miss out on that one for the world :D!!

Well good luck to you all since that seems to be the main difference between the king and the pauper!

It´s time for senator Linkowicius to answer and take resposneability for his time as consul:

Captain Beaver: You are right about that I could have waited with my troops in Messana after the war declaration. Still though: I have never seen the AI attack a city with a full hp army stationed in it throughout my games so I dont know about the "let them invade on army until they are no more"-tactic.
Besides, it was darn bad luck to get two veteran legions at full health fortified in coastal fortress wiped out in two attempts out of two. Such bad luck is hard to take into consideration.
Also: one disadvantage with waiting 3 turns is that you only have a limited number of turns to work with after a war declaration until its time to sue for peace again due to war weariness.
As you know i assigned both consular armies to Sicilly. Wich resulted in the rapid conquest of all Carthagian strongholds on Sicilly except Agrigentum.
I´m extra satisfied with the smooth conquest of Lilybaeum, a city with walls and harbour on hills with a fortfied elite troop with 6 defense.
I left Sardinia and Corsic island for my successors.

Gaias: I did move those ships to Croton and Messana area but I had no luck in finding pirate ships. Note: I always end my naval movement in port so the 8 point movement units have a search radius of 4.
I did win 3 naval combats with veteran units but BAD LUCK AGAIN prevented our ships to promote to elite.

To your specific question: I dont know what progress Carthage made against Magna Greacia in the Massilia, Narbo and Saguntum area. I had no opportunity to send troops to that area anyway so I focused completely on Sicilly.
Maybe ApolytonCivfan knows more about this?

Monarch: Dont underestimate the new eques. They now have 8 attack instead of 7. They have an improved antislave-value and NO popcost so I do think they have their uses. I somtimes build them when I´m waiting for a city to grow it´s population. The miles socius shouldnt be looked down upon either. When it´s time for the reforms of Marius every Miles socius will be very valuable. 1 pop instead of 3 makes a HUGE diffrence. I agree that building legio is important but a miles and eques here and there will help as well.
The velites then? Hmmm... they have been nerfed but they are still very good against units with 1 point movement (read hoplai). They will be useless against the barbarians when we fight in AD.

Congratulations on the long waited for elite ship!!!!!!

Strength and Honor!

Senator Linkowicius

Consul Marcus Licinius Traianus will make all all efforts to extend the influence of the Roman Republic. It is more than our duty. It is a simple question of destiny. However, only the fool attempts war on all fronts and it appears obvious then, that with the Carthaginian curs currently being tamed to the south we will have the luxury of choosing only one further target during the coming consulship.
I therefore move that we consolidate our position as masters of Italia and I respectfully request that the senate grant me leave to send emmisaries to the outlaw cities of Bovianum and Syracusae with a simple ultimatum; that they dismantle their military forces and surrender their gates to the senate and people of Rome... under pain of death.
It has, of course, not slipped my mind that we need ever be watchful of the treacherous Gauls to the north, however, I feel at this time that they are cowed by our growing strength and will not be tempted to betray the hospitallity of our borders with their filthy hordes. In short, senators - they can wait!
I feel I must raise the question of raising our legionary strength further in the conflict to the south. Lilybeum and Carales both seem ideal locations for recruitment of our cheap foreign legions. They will be needed if a final push to rid the medditerranean islands of the phoenician threat is to be realised.
Further I wish to address the request of outgoing consul civfan that an expedition be sent to contact the nations of the eastern Medditerranean. It seems a reasonable goal with one caveat in the form of the threat of piracy. I request the council of the senate on this matter.
A final thought. At first glance, I find the decision to commision 'Mare Nostrum' in Pisae somewhat quizical! Surely a port of more strategic value would be more suitable. I personally would nominate neapolis. I believe that further dabate is needed. However, I remind the senate that, with the completion date of c.253bc approaching, a decision will have to be reached promptly.
Strength and Honour.

Consul Marcus Licinius Traianus will make all all efforts to extend the influence of the Roman Republic. It is more than our duty. It is a simple question of destiny. However, only the fool attempts war on all fronts and it appears obvious then, that with the Carthaginian curs currently being tamed to the south we will have the luxury of choosing only one further target during the coming consulship.
I therefore move that we consolidate our position as masters of Italia and I respectfully request that the senate grant me leave to send emmisaries to the outlaw cities of Bovianum and Syracusae with a simple ultimatum; that they dismantle their military forces and surrender their gates to the senate and people of Rome... under pain of death.
It has, of course, not slipped my mind that we need ever be watchful of the treacherous Gauls to the north, however, I feel at this time that they are cowed by our growing strength and will not be tempted to betray the hospitallity of our borders with their filthy hordes. In short, senators - they can wait!
I feel I must raise the question of raising our legionary strength further in the conflict to the south. Lilybeum and Carales both seem ideal locations for recruitment of our cheap foreign legions. They will be needed if a final push to rid the medditerranean islands of the phoenician threat is to be realised.
Further I wish to address the request of outgoing consul civfan that an expedition be sent to contact the nations of the eastern Medditerranean. It seems a reasonable goal with one caveat in the form of the threat of piracy. I request the council of the senate on this matter.
A final thought. At first glance, I find the decision to commision 'Mare Nostrum' in Pisae somewhat quizical! Surely a port of more strategic value would be more suitable. I personally would nominate neapolis. I believe that further dabate is needed. However, I remind the senate that, with the completion date of c.253bc approaching, a decision will have to be reached promptly.
Strength and Honour.


You had better check that we have no diplomatic agreements with Magna Greacic before you declare war on them.
The celts in the north would be the next logical target when Bovanium and Syracuse haave been conquered. After that we can either turn west and go for Massilia and get starting positions for the second punic war. I favor a push east after the celts are defeated though. The Illyrian cities are close to Rome and therefore has little corruption, meaning they have good production.
We should also capture the Thrakian goldmines as soon as possible but of course our main foe Carthage decides how much effort we can spend in the east.

A naval expedition to make contact with the eastern empires seems like a good idea, I´m all for it. Maybe we should wait until we have the more sturdy corvus? The expedition could consist of one trireme for defensive bombardment and scouting and one corvus for battle and a possibility to capture enemy ships. I don´t know wich route is the best though to avoid hordes of pirates. Maybe sail south towards Carthage and then head east towards Alexandria following the north african coast?

I also think that it would be much better to build the Mare Nostrum in Neapel. Our corvus would arrive much closer to the action.

I checked the diplo. We have ROP(2) and Alliance v.Carthage(7) agreements with Magna Graecia. No gpt though. I suppose it's a reputation hit vs. the addition of two high production cities. Being a new war effort, will the senate will need to vote on this?
Also, I was thinking. Would it be an idea to number all new legions? I normally do this in my own RFRE games. I started it for fun but found it useful afterwards.

For senate meetings

war with magnia graecia. I vote NO for war. reasons: need to for fight against Carthage later.

war with northern celts. I vote YES. reasons: take control of italy. Wait though till rop with them is finsihed. dont want to ruin our reputation.

When alliance with Magnia Graecia is over against carthage, make peace with carthage. wont ruin are reps. Demand massive amounts of gold per turn plus their treasury

I see your point. But it's for that very reason (Italian unification) I wish to take Bov. and Syr. However, there is the rep. damage to consider and we are living in a Republic afterall so I'll wait for further senate votes before proceding.

I, Publius Monarchus, leader of the hawk party vote yes for war with Magna Graecia first and with Cisalpine Gaul afterwards. We shall not permit the Samnite threat right at the gates of Rome. As for them beeing allies... You should really see if Massalia is on their side or in Carthaginian hands. In both cases I think that city is vital to our defense against Hannibal. After Massalia the Cisalpine Gauls should be surrounded on all flanks and shall submit to Roman authority right away.

I don't believe peace with Carthage brought all island cities to our influence, has it, consul? Could it be that we've lost all hope of gaining a foothold in Olbia, Aleria, Palma let alone Valentia? Rome's borders need strongpoints.

Tell us, consul Marcus Licinius Traianus, for my curiosity is still unappeased, what is our current situation? We, the Hawks, ensure you of our faith that Rome, under your leadership, however short, will prevail.

Btw, seems that 24 hours is more than enough for you guys to get a grip on things so I best prepare myself for an early blood and Carthaginian bacon on Sunday morning :D. Best of luck Traianus.

But you could amass the troops before the RoP expires and declare war right after that to Magna Graecia. Ufffff, Drendor's "doves" and their RoP with our hated enemies!! Sorta reminds me of civ 2 and senate interference :lol:.

I must remind the honourable senator that peace is not yet on the table as far the Punic dogs are concerned. They have yet much blood to shed by way of Roman steel. The islands will be secured. It is a fact!
Senate votes to date are 1 for war with the Gauls and 1 for war with the Greeks. I wonder if we are working with the consular veto in case of a tie? As it stands, I would be in favour of a military build up in greek territory with a view to complete invasion in 248BC when this false treaty expires.
We Romans are a proud race. I cannot abide the presence of greek cities a mere stone's throw from the walls of Rome. If you call me intolerant, then I say I am intolerant! Better that, than accept a foreign power on rightful Roman land. My coleague, senator Civfan himself has said that Italy must be controlled... and I agree with him. The Gauls will pay for all past sins. However, which do we look to first? A distant horde of filthy inbred savages who seem not to have the inclination, never mind ability, to organise themselves into anyting resembling an army... or the Greeks on our very own doorstep? And they are organised and, need I remind the senate, they have memories of crushing defeats not twenty years old in their heads and hearts. Some will say that it was not these Greeks under the command of the accursed Pyhrus but I say a Greek is a Greek! I do not trust them and I do not want them within the confines of Italia.
I, of course, am bound by the rule of the senate and people of Rome. I will follow with a full heart and strong swordarm, whatever path is laid before me but I urge you good men of the senate to sanction the elimination of, from Roman lands, these Greek intruders.
S.P.Q.R.
Strength and Honour.

How important is our reputation? We will loose the ability to make trade deals in the future that involves us paying in gold/turn if we have bad rep right?

I dont think we will need to make that many deals of those.....

Any other bad side-effects with negative reputation?

How is the war against Carthage faring? What happens with rep if we make peace with Carthage before our alliance with Magna Greacic expires?

One alternative strategy: Move forces north and conquer Cesalpine celts. If western greeks still hold Massilia we position our troops against Massilia, Syracuse and Bovanium after the celts are subdued. This way our reputation remains intact and we only need to declare war on western greeks once to conquer them.

To the hawks: the rop with cesalpine celts and western greeks will soon be over and I wanted to protect our weak northern borders while we were busy on Sicilly. Vote for Linkowicius Vote for pragmatism! :king:

Consul Traianus, it would be advisable for you to decree the immediate production of 3 to 4 triremes for our emissaries travelling to the east. Reports of large pirate activity is known around the island of Crete and the Aegean Sea. Make it known that the captains of the ships that these vile barbarians of the sea should be eliminated once they are spotted.

WHEN our emisarries reach Asia Minor (as I expect no less than resounding success in this endeavor), I would be interested in the establishment of embassies in both Bithynia and Galatia. These... countries (if they would presume themselves to be :rolleyes: ) could easily be persuaded to aid us in future agendas that we will have in that area. Then again, when one becomes a ally with Rome, the are a province of Rome, its usually they who do not know it yet! *laughs abrubtly*

Would it not make perfect sense to start the immediate production of a Portus Naves in Agrigentum. One can not known when such a port stronghold could be used, though Carthage does come to mind. We could use the such fine timber that Sicily is known to have in that area. It would have been convenient to have had Syracuse under our domain to make a sister Portus Navis. But then again you cannot be held accountable for another consul's past mistakes? Imagine what a grand port we could make with this fine timber from Sicily in Rome? Grand dreams indeed.

Of domestic concerns, would it not be wise to focus on mines near Rome. Our quota of baser metals and precious stones has been low of late. There are many rich hills in and around Roma, it would be well advised to start mining there about with our aquired slaves. It would greatly increase the production of the citizens of Roma to be able to obtain such high quality metals and stones from a local source. Also increasing our coffers with new taxes such trade would bring in.

I have given praise and sacrifice to Jupiter, Mars, and Neptune for all your future endeavors and garanteed successes!

Many thanks , Senator Gaias. Your words of encouragement will add weight to our noble cause.


War with Carthage is still far from complete. Olbia, Aleria and Palma still await the sword. Any peace deal should include Saguntum or Valentia. I would think I'll be spending the entire consulship at war with them. How long has this war been going? Is war weariness likely to be a major factor?

I, Senator Gaias, vote for the systematic conquest of the city Bovainum. Long has Magna Graeci catered to the whims of Samnite devils. Let them be cleansed from Latium once and for all! They dare attack citizens on Rome, and we worry what others might think of us? Let them think we are stong and not to be triffle with, less those that oppose us err on the side of our wrath! Down with the Samnites once and for all!

Though my ways are not of the warrior, I do believe that Illyria is a more viable target after our skill with Carthage is over. It has considerable strategic value to the lands in the east. Such value in fact, that one might be able to ferry over troops with ease if our eyes linger on the east more than a glance. Then of course if we hold the lands to the south and east of Gallia Cisalpina, we hold them on two fronts. Much easier to crush and and with two hand instead of one, don't you think?

Also Consul Traianus, when you demand peace reparations for Rome, make it known that Rome wants the control of Malacca. It is a fairly small colony within the Carthagian influence. If you are to negotiate a reclamation deal for it, it would give us a foothold in Carthage territory in Iberia. Could be quite useful if Carthage procedes itself with expansionistic tendicies, and we are forced to show Carthage its wrongful ways. :lol:

Then I guess it's settled. Bovianum must fall before daybreak, consul. Not a single Samnite must come of it and defile Roman land. Senator Gaias is a long time reputed member of the hawk party. We shall overlook the doves transgression with their RoP on one condition: that they, and their cunning skill for diplomacy manage to "persuade" Pergamum and Bithynia to join our cause and "will" their cities to Rome. Of course serious funds are required for this endeavour so consul Traianus is expected to extract severe war taxes from the impudent Carthaginians, whenever time is right. Do not haste to make peace, haste to position your troops accordingly. We all agree that by the end of your mandate the whole of Italy MUST be Roman.

However senator Gaias should also think of an expansion westwards towards the luxuries of Narbo and to the link between Valentia and Massalia if both of them shall become Roman. We shouldn't expand in too many directions and although I remeber from my youth experiences that Illyria was not that hard to overcome and that it was a rich farm for foreign legions, I also remeber I never looked eastwards until the west was secure. We must deny the strong their comfort, in this case we must make Carthage pay (delende Carthago), for we all know that an adventurous campaig eastwards will leave the road wide open for the western scum.

I see you ask of war weariness. But my dear consul it is you who should answer that question for it is to you that the advisors account to. My opinion is that, since WE were the ones that declared war on them and since that war is slow and tedious the Romans will take to the streets and riot as we speak. But an iron will will put an end to the mob. It is up to you to cover yourself with laurels or shamefully fade into oblivion...

Salve! Into history we advance.

To senator Drendor: for a dove, my fellow senator you do not prize the value of reputation and diplomacy well enough. For no sooner shall we start to break our engagements than we shall find ourselves attacked from all fronts. As a republic we cannot afford to lose our reputation. When an emperor shall have a stronger army than any other foe can yield he might, by his own will, offend our neighbours' trust. But until then we must asure our borders. I suggest making Egypt our friend for they are among the last to be conquered on our list and their port of Alexandria will surely benefit our trade in the east once we get there.

However other matters are of strict importance right as we speak: the 3 island cities are your first objective, consul. Then, by the middle of your mandate you should amass your troops near Syracusae and Bovianum. Make sure Bovianum is attacked by our consular armies to minimize our losses for it is well fortified. Once these two cities fall peace shall reign in the south. By the end of your mandate you should have amassed all offensive troops at the northern border. We shall discuss weather east or west should be our next objective but I say even now that the legions will proudly march westwards. For the reasons I mentioned above. Imagine the disaster when the second punic war starts and we are ingaged in an unhistorical struggle with Illyria. They shall not bother us before we reach Carthago Nova for they lack the Animus Barbarii. That is all for today: strength and honor!

Agreed, senator Monarchus. We will meet you at the northern border. Does the senate have any response to my proposed reform of the legions? I believe the common soldiery would appreciate a more personalised approach to their designation. They are, afterall, a superstitious lot. With the aid of the past consuls, new legionary insignia could be decided upon very quickly. For my part, I vow you would see a legio XVII 'Syracusa'.

I see the wisdom and truth of your words senator Monarch when you say that westward is the key to the strength of Rome. My statement was hinged on facts of wealth and resources, not of tactical logistics. Once again I claim my lack of a warriors grace, for my skills lie more with domestic administration. I concede to the wisdom and honor of the hungry eagles that lay their eyes to the west.

Consul Traianus, let your enemies feel the strength of your sword arm and tremble at the size of you manhood!

The ROP is now defunct between us and Magna Gr. However, the All.v.Carhago still has five turns to go. Will rep. be damaged by war now or is it ok to procede?

:thumbsup:

Breaking the alliance will damage our reputation. I would recommend to wait for the alliance to pass. We will need a good reputation to organize a war effort later on against Pontus. To me they are a real threat to the future.

As the ROP is now over, you can mass troops outside the territory of Magnia Graecia. As it seems this will be the next target for roman expansion.


Apolyton family.

*suddenly waking up after a nap during the long senatorial session*
*hearing about a vote pointing toward a war with the Samnites*
*Choking*
*Standing up with a reddish and infuriated face*

The greeaaaaat (and definitely chubby) Senator Olivero won’t stand another war in the South. Northern lands must be protected and the Gauls and Illyrians have been daringly raiding through our borders again and again! Hear me brothers!

Tell me Consul Marcus Licinius Traianus, what benefits we could have from a backwater village lost in the Apennines. Bovianum has no economic or strategic importance, it is isolated and worthless. In addition, my spies report that conquering this eagle stronghold (250%+40% in defence!!!) would be a hazardous undertaking, and losses are likely to be very high unless you Consul want to set a siege for the forthcoming 10 years?

There are better ways to extend to grandeur of Rome. Let’s bring civilization to these Celtic wretches! Let’s us show to pirates who rules the Sea. Let’s make my…uh… our estates more wealthy by securing new fertile lands along the Po river!

I -senator Olivero- vote for a WAR in the NORTH as soon as we are done with the Punic rats. Let’s us deal with the remaining Greeks later on (when we have many ballista), as they are harmless (to my estates) and have shown to be good friends in adversity against Carthago. We Romans must respect our allies and protect our friends.

On another note, I agree here with my colleagues that our new shipyard would be better located South in Neapolis (although Ariminium came to my mind as well) while indeed any legion should be properly named. And that’s not just a number but also a nickname from the Consul was has raised them. It remains to me to wish you Consul, great success against our enemies.


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Looking good! I have no access to internet over the weekend, so I hope I could be done with my turn beforehand. Or maybe get the sav on Friday but then it will be hard to consult with my peers?

*looks over to Senator Olivero with bemused tolerance*

Ahhh! I see our GREAT and PORTLY Senator Olivero has grace us with his spoken exuberance. So good of you to join us finally Senator. It would seem your late night trist with the Macedonian envoy kept you up till the early hours of night. One must claim sleep where one is able, especially in the halls with matters of state at hand. *chuckles derisively*

Come now Senator Olivero, I jest. Your many years and vast knowlegde of such matters are a boon to us all. We would all be wise to heed the words of one such as Senator Olivero. I mean, if not wise with patience, how else would he have survive the tedium of these meetings? Hmmm? *slow smile spreads across Senator Gaias face*

To the war with Magna Graeci, Senator Olivero's insight cannot be ignore nor taken lightly. Greatly would I like to see the seething snakepit of vile contempt that is Bovianum, I am convinced by Senator Olivero that such an action is not worth the price of the Roman Legions... yet. Mark my word. Jupiter will strike down the Samnites with great vengence and Mars will crush all the remain beneath his might boot. The gods cannot be denied!

Ah yes, for the matter at hand. I do concur to the naming convention that Consul Traianus and my fellow Senators has brought forward. Might I be so bold as to make a suggestion? Considering the great honor we depart with these titles to the Roman Legion, should we not reward those with the most battle experience. Perhaps the elite of the elite should be rewarded with names such as "Legio IV Syracuse"? To show the prestige and strength of such Legios.

The hour is late and I must retire these procedings. Consider all we have said Consul Traianus and pick from it what you will. I have sleep I am in need of catching. For unlike other *glances over a Senator Olivero* some of us prefer the comfort of a bed and warmth of a woman, to the cool, hard embrace of the stone Forum.

I am outraged that this republic as fallen so low that we break our ROP and military alliances on a flicker of thought. Imagine the consequences when, in the future, we will want to wage war. Not a single nation will forget the honorless blood that will stain our hands and faces. They will ask exhorbitant prices for their help and will not even hesitate to back stab us, since we did the same to others. Is this the reputation of Rome we want abroad? Nay. We cannot allow our hunger for battle and riches dictate our decisions. Magnae Graecia will be Roman, of that I can promise you. But not this turn or the next. We must wait for the natural expiration of our contracts with them or risk losing the ability to divide other nations by creating wars serving no one's interest except Rome's. We need Macedonia against Greece and Dacia, Syria against the whole of Asia Minor and Egypt and we still need the Numids against Cartage. Have you all forgotten that this war is not finished? We cannot break Cartage today, merely reduce its size. The final assault on their capital will require help, help that only the barbarian Numids can offer.
For those reasons, I vote for WAR but against the northern Celts. Mediolanum will serve Rome's interests far more than Bovianum or Syracuse. Moreover, they will allow us to gain land routes to the barbarians of Illirycum and to the capital of Magna Graecia.
Concerning the Legion's reforms, I vote in favor of naming them after places and giving them a number.
Also, I would like to remind that, had we waited a bit more in Messana with the bulk of the army before venturing forth, the Cartaginians would have done a fine job for us of conquering Syracusa. Alas, I cannot change pasts mistakes, merely hope that they won't happen again.

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Edit : Damn, just realized 2 posts were made while I was typing. Well, it is kinda hard to write well in a foreign language and to find a style that matches a senator's.
@Pink : Personnaly, on friday, I am errrrrrrrr... taking vacations in bars and clubs so count me out to discuss our strategies on that day.

*Sneezing peacefully*

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PS. Traianus - when do you expect to finish your sequence? Should I wait the weekend over before starting my game, as I won't be there on Friday as well?

*in a hurry to a meeting*

I vote for northern celts first, Greeks later!

Ok it's settled then. Our armies shall march north but be warned that we shall not tolerate the Samnites for long. We should discourage their raids as soon as the Cisalpine Gauls are defeated.

The alliance should expire as soon as we sign peace with the wretched Carthaginians (this will of course damage our reputation if sooner than the military alliances against them expire anyway but that is something we will have to live with). Once peace is signed we have no more obligations towards the Gauls or the Greeks since, as I'm told, our RoP with them expired. So, in a swift blow (as I believe the roads to Ravenna and Mediolanum are complete) we shall overtake the scum of Gallia. But then I strongly suggest that, from a strategical point of view it is imperative to eliminate the gaps between our borders: Bovianum, Massalia and Syracusae (I wouldn't call the largest city on Sicily a mere village, senator Oliviero...) And the need of prime timber shouldn't even allow us a second thought.

If we manage to take Saguntum and/or Narbo the Hawks shall be most pleased and affirm their continuous support for the consul's upcomming mandates :D. Let us not forget the opportunity of Gaul goods in the area and the grip on Carthaginian soil. From my past experiences, I again recolect that apart from a few pirate raids, the Illyrians and Germans didn't pose any danger until our ancestors subdued Carthago Nova in a different simulation. So, by the time the 20 turns of peace with Carthage expire we should have our borders secure. Hannibal will not wait.

One more thing consul, when imposing a peace treaty you should really impose a regular tribute on Carthage (of at least 1gpt) so as to be able to "declare" war once the 20 turns expire and they will be less eager to pay :devil:.

Perhaps you senators should take a look at the main forum as there is another debate there. Of course senator Oliviero has the veto there but I hope he will see it our way.

About the legio naming, I suggested that earlier. Here's a list of historical legion names I employed in my earlier games :list of Roman Legions (http://www.unrv.com/military/legions.php)

Ever amenable and even-handed, the good senator Monarchus has demonstrated his vast knowledge of foreign affairs. Others in the senate would do well to pay close attention. The Greeks are not our friends. They never will be. However, enough arguement. The senate speaks and I obey. It will be the gauls who feel Roman steel in their gizzards this consulship.
On the matter of the punic expedition, I feel talk of peace is still somewhat premature. Our legions stand ready to take Olbia. Aleria must follow and boats have been commisioned to ferry a task force to the Balearic islands, where I hear the climate is most accomodating. The vast force assembled in Agrigentum will provide much of this army since it is now not required for the conquest of Syracusae. Therefore, our Reputation will be beyond reproach. The agreements with the Greeks should be long gone by the time peace is an option with Carthage.
In short, senators, be assured that I will first wring the necks of the Carthaginians before I squeeze their coffers dry!
I envisage this plan unfolding this very evening, senator Olivero. I see no further need of discussion. The sword has seen enough of it's scabbard and I intend to present a report and save of the grand exploits of the Taianii family's first consulship by morning.
May Saturn protect the senate and people of Rome!

255BC
Construction of Mare Nostrum moved to Neapolis. Legio begun in Lilybeum, Agrigentum and Pisae. Corvus in croton, Trireme in Tarentum, Eques in Roma,
Granaria in Capua.
Some forces moved towards north. Two further legions advancing towards Olbia.
254BC
Amphibious attacks repeled at Carales.Eques completed in Roma. Production of Velites begun. Completion of further stretches of road near Mediolanum.
Extra forces moved to northern border.
253BC
Further Amphibious attacks on Carales. No Casualties. Tarentum completes Trireme, starts Praesidium. Neapolis completes Mare Nostrum, starts Granaria.
Capua completes Granaria, starts f.Magnus.
Forces advance to Aleria with reenforcements shipped from Lilybeum to Carales.
252BC
Legio XIX completed in Pisae, began cumba. Miles socius in Arminium, began portus. Velites completed in Roma, began velites.
Legionary forces kill three defenders in Aleria without loss although our consular army is reduced to 2hp in the first assault. It appears that Aleria
is defended by funditores alone now. Samnite peltasts emerge from the vicinity of Bovianum and threaten a large contingent of our workers. They are under guard of one legio and two miles socii, however.
The newly commissioned forces are sent to the northern border.
Completion of a foreign legion is rushed in Agrigentum at a cost of 156g. A carthaginian troop of slaves is added to city population.
251BC
The samnite outlaws are defeated in a hail of pila. They retreat in the direction of Bovianum.
Completion of Carthaginian legio XX in Lilybeum, praesidium begun. SPQR legio XXI commisioned in Roma.
Velites bombard and critically wound the remaining defenders of Aleria. Legio X finishes them, becoming elite and earning the title 'Gemina'. Are you watching,
Caesar? The bull is born!
Cumba rushed in Panormus for 44g. Further roads begun in the direction of Genua. The ROP agreement here is expired but still in effect.
250BC
Mare Nostrum produces it's first corvus. Corvus produced in Croton, began Trireme. Further advancement of troops and road building in Cisalpine Gaul.
Roma produces velites, now producing opes in order to allow it's population to recover.

Our army numbers 21 legions now. Three of these are FL. My plan for my reminaing turns is to send forces from Pisae to Aleria, from Carales to Palma. When the current tyle of road is finished near Genua, I wil cancel the ROP and declare war next turn when they demand I leave their lands.
Should I renegociate the other expired ROP's. None of these civs seem to be very afluent at the moment.

Well done so far!

Dont sign peace with Carthage until our alliance with Magna Greacia expires.
Try to conquer all islands if possible but sign peace before lux is at 50% cause of war weariness.
When signing peace; either ask for a city, preferably in north africa to get a stronghold there OR in Spain so that we get a base close to Carthage Novo.
Or we could ask for their treasury and a hefty amount of gold per turn.
One trick with asking gold per turn is to for example ask for treasury + 41 gold/turn and offer peace + 1 gold per turn. Since we are actually giving them 1 gold per turn they will be reluctant to break the peace treaty before the 20 turns expires.

You know that we dont need a granary in Neapel until portus Campania gets obsolete? The same with Rome and some other cities.....

Renegociating ROP with Pergamum, Aeatolia, Achai and other nations that we wont encounter in a long time could add some nice extra gold coins to our ever hungry treasury.

When signing peace; either ask for a city, preferably in north africa to get a stronghold there OR in Spain so that we get a base close to Carthage Novo.

Valentia, Valentia, Valentia!!!! Cartenna will be negociated AFTER the second Punic War.

One trick with asking gold per turn is to for example ask for treasury + 41 gold/turn and offer peace + 1 gold per turn. Since we are actually giving them 1 gold per turn they will be reluctant to break the peace treaty before the 20 turns expires.

Is this a bug? Double deals don't work in peace negociacions in my game. One side must pay tribute so I can never negociate to actually give something other than peace in return for their tribute (although I'd have liked to at some points when he is "very close to striking a deal" but won't accept money for it :mad:).

Btw: great job, consul Traianus. Senator Drendor is right about the last RoPs.

250BC - Adendum
Production switched from granaria to Pharos in Neapolis. ROP signed with Aetolia, Achaia and Eastern Greeks. gold and 1gpt.
249BC
Pergamene fleet arrives off Sicilia, heading for Carthage. Their timing is perfect as we are about to sail for Palma and will need all the distractions
possible. Eight units board and sail. The plan unfolds. All velite units currently stationed in Sicilia coordinate a massive bombardment of Carthaginian
ships near the shore, heavily damaging a quinquereme. Simultaneously, our new corvus fleet sails toward Carales in order to distract the remaining Carthaginian fleet.
248BC
Our ruse works perfectly. The Carthaginian fleet ignores our task force in an attempt to engage the combined Roman/Pergamene threat.
Once again our velites bombard and injure the already weakened punic boats. The corvus fleet follows up with two kills and a promotion.
The Balearic taskforce safely lands near Palma as a smaller force disembarks north of Aleria.
Roma switches production to Eques to coincide with population growth in 3 turns.
Our Alliance with Magna Graecia is now expired, however, we feel it prudent to leave the agreement in place... for now.
More roads completed in Cisalpine Gaul. Our forces there are sizeable but not overwhelming. We will postpone our declaration of war until the last stretch of road to Genua is completed. Maybe by then we can free some of the forces engaged against the Phoenicians.
A cumba is rushed in Croton at a cost of 44g. We will need to start ferrying some of our Sicilian forces back to the mainland so that they can head north.
247BC
The Pergamene fleet mounts a direct invasion of Carthage, landing near Utica. We wish them luck, for they will surely need it. Brave men.
Our forces near Aleria as the attack begins on Palma. A cavalry charge rips through the first line of defenders without taking casualties, however the bombardment of our velites is without effect and we lose our first unit of miles socius all too easily. The second unit prevails, as do both legions, but the Punics still have a least five more units defending and their funditores are inflicting heavy casualties. It appears we will need more soldiers.
The up side is that war weariness seems to have had little effect so far.
We rush another cumba in Olbia so that forces maybe ferried north to Aleria.
246BC
Samnite Peltasts once again emerge from Bovianum, this time heading for Capua. A unit of velites intercepts them doing some damage.
War weariness finally rears it's ugly head, causing shortages in some punic cities. The lux slider is set to 20%.
Palma has received a bolster to it's garrison so our assault there has stalled. reenforcements will take time to arrive. Elsewhere, the city of Aleria is surrounded and will be the scene of heavy fighting soon.
The Carthaginian fleet is on the move again, but with no obvious target.
We have seen no more of the Pergamene fleet.
245BC
The Pergamene fleet returns from out of the fog, looking distinctly battered. The Phoenicians launch two amphibious attacks on Messana, killing the Mamertin but losing to a praesidium. Our fleets destroy a quiquereme and cumba near Lilybeum. Two velites are despatched to aid the Balearic taskforce but more will be surely needed if that city is to fall.
The consular army at Aleria defeats a defender followed by a nail-biting encounter when a velite, reduced to 1hp, kills a phalanx libianus. Legio IX completes the capture of the city.

I graciously hand over control of the armies now to incoming Consul Olivero. I wish I could say that the Punic campaign was complete, however, some work remains if Palma is to fall. I have begun the enlistment of funditores in both Olbia and Aleria. These units are quite effective in attack and defense, as we found out near Palma. As legions currently cannot be trained here, these will make excellent foreign units.
Our troops are positioned in the north, with more on the way, for the upcoming Cisalpine campaign. Again, I had wished to begin this invasion myself but I feel sure that my successor will redress this shortcoming.
Regarding the numbering of the legions; I have begun this process but, with the blood lust upon me, I left it too late to complete the task. I trust my successors will carry on this tradition.
Wishing you the speed and luck of the gods.
S.P.Q.R.
Outgoing consul Marcus Licinius Traianus.

Edit. My save game repeatedly refused to upload which is why I zipped it. I'm a little afraid now that it won't work on another machine. Let me know if so and I'll upload an original format version.

Good job Consul Traianus! The Senate applauds your exploits and will welcome you with all the honors due to your rank. We have elected Senator Olivero as replacement to continue the war with the Cartaginian scum.
The honor of putting an end to this war will surely fall to you, our newest Consul. But bear in mind that we still need contact with the eastern nations to sow the seeds of war in these far away lands. They will mature slowly, but once fully grown, the benefits will be simply overwhelming.

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Edit :
I just finished a tour of our forces to see if they could be contacted properly (meaning the save works), and I have found cause for alarm in some situations which natures had escaped me before. Please excuse me for my poor hearing of former Consul Traianus' report to the Senate, but some of his words have been lost to me due to, shall we say, a slight snoring made by a certain attentive Senator. However, it is now in my opinion that the war with Cartage cannot be ended with the simple capture of our pre-war objectives. The Cartaginian, although quite sloppy when it comes to military planning, were still able to conquer from the Greeks Narbo and Saguntum.
*Count on the Greeks to run away like women when fight is involved!* someone whispers, releasing some nervous laught
Thank you for your assessment of the situation senator. But mere jokes will not make Cartage abandon its prizes. I would like to vote on a measure extending our objectives to any city Cartage takes from the Greeks. These new targets will of course make the war longer and our citizens angrier, but it is imperative that we do not allow the ennemy to keep outposts between our provinces, effectively cutting the Republic into two separate territories. More troops will be needed, more legionnaires will die, but in the end, let us all remember that it is for the good of our children and their children that this war is fought.
Strenght & Honour.

Consul Traianus, I commend you on your bravery in the face of adversity from these Carthagian dogs. Your continuous victory (as their was no doubt) will surely strike fear into the citizens of Carthage. Though the war is all but finished, your tactical superiority has left nothing but for others to clean up.

Your inability to capture Palma quickly and easily in unfortunate, but not unexpected for such a target deep in enemy territory. It would served us well to have such a jewel of the sea in our grasp, to launch future attacks against our enemies. Rome is mighty and strong, yet even we are not immune to the failings of others. Learn this well.

Roma is the centre of all prestige, glory and wealth. We should not be wasting our time training the great citizens of Roma to Velite units. Our commanders train the citizens of Roma hard and produce soldiers that are twice the man of any other. We should constrain ourselves to training only worthy unit formations; Legio and Eques are strong, proud units that any citizen of Roma would be honored to join.

Our decision of training foreign nationals in the Legio formation is a stroke of genius. Using the newly captured citizen of conquered cities will bolster the might of our armies. Let us not forget that much of Latium still lays fallow and untapped. Reintergrating our captured slaves into Roman cities, while they could be used to work these fallow fields is not a wise decision. What is the strength of Rome if we cannot feed our own army? Think on that well.

Overall Consul Traianus you rule with iron determination and formiddable skill. We of the senate of Rome, commend you for your loyal service of office. The people of Rome commend you for the riches you have brought them. The gods of Rome commend you for the glory that you have brough in their name and the name of Rome!

(Although having arrived a bit late at today's senatorial session, Senator Olivero looks relativly fresh for an early morning speech)

My dears friends and collegues, Senators, we thank Senator Marcus Licinius Traianus for his efforts. It is with great honour that I take the nomination from the Senate to serve (use) the Republic once more. Although I must soon head in my Ariminium estate for private state affairs that will keep me busy for the weekend, I will do my best to discuss with you of the most urgent matters and strategic directions today. But first, I will need to hear from our envoys a more detailed account of the situation. I ask you Senators to delay the senatorial session for a couple of hours, so that I might plan our strategy (and take a nap) carefully and submit it to you before leaving to the North.

Very well so!

Very well, I have heard enough from our envoys.

Senators, for time is short and the seats of the Senate cold in this early spring, I will do it quick.

Outgoing Consul Traianus has left Rome in a very peculiar situation. It seems we are at a crossroad with many choices to make. For his successful war against Carthage, I say, the Consul and his predecessor have done a great good. Our armies are ruling the islands and I am sure Palma will fall soon. I won’t take the merit for such a take, for Palma -except for his good wine- is still a very small fish to catch, like the other islands we took and anyway, the prize for these new Roman provinces, even if small, will go to my young friend Traianus.

Now, you have wisely elected me to guide you as we are slowly coming out of our war with the Punics and looking north. Yes, NORTH, senators, NORTH where the great rivers flow out of the snow-covered mountains to water rich and fertile grasslands, NORTH where we will be able to open new horizons toward more trade with foreign nations, and I am sure more conquests. But it is also NORTH, the land of the Celts, these dogs and their bragging leaders, the like of Brennus, who thought they could plunder Rome and yet prosper. It is our duty to eradicate these people, or at least to put their wives, young men and children into slavery, while building news colonia and estates in these lands that are rightfully ours.

Let me come back to the current situation, as left by my young colleague Traianus. First, always first, on Italia. I observe that the Pharus has been commissioned in Neapolis. I doubt this is a wise choice, for the Mare Nostrum has been already built in the city and there is little need to have another military shipyard in the same port. If you ask me, Senators, I would keep this wonder for a much later time, it might come a day we will need the Pharus to connect new lands to Italy. With our war going north, we will soon no longer need to sail the seas on these aberrant and expensive ships.

I also notice a great deal of conscription is going on in the provinces of Italy. I understand we are in a war but at this pace the population of the whole Italy will soon be inferior to any of the Greek City state! I propose to start distributing grain and build granaries in the main cities of Italy, to encourage a healthy grow of our population.

Seeing how fast the Republic is spreading abroad, who knows, we might soon have a foothold in Spain; I also suggest that we put our next efforts on increasing the number of praetors to make sure new provinces are wisely managed (plundered). With your agreement, I will make sure this is undertaken in less than 2 years from now, although only my successor (unless you name me for a second mandate of course!) will be able to actually undertake the reform.

I also heard from outgoing Consul Traianus that he was too busy sailing go and forth between islands for actually properly rename our brave legions. I ensure you brothers than this will be done and proper tribute paid to the bravery of our soldiers. Each legion will be given a proper number, while it will remain the prerogative of the current consul to nickname a legion reaching the elite level.

Now, of matters of war, I will strike a peace with Carthage as soon as acceptable. I will of course get Palma first (so that we may get their nice wine readily available for our states parties) but I will not further strike them in their Spanish colonies, unless there is majority for it naturally, including those they stole from the Greeks (Narbo, Saguntum). The peace will involve hopefully the secession to us of one of these (or Valentia) and I will make sure I get some gold from them (with the possibility a little few of it goes to the Republic). In the matters of the war against the descendants of that wh*re, Dido, I believe our expensive navy is now quite able to fight them further and will make sure some of their ships roaming around Sicily are sunk before any peace is signed. It is time for some daring naval undertaking, especially now that my son has been named admiral.

For I will be away to Ariminum and not able to consult with you before Monday, I also want to seek with you whether you would agree, if the war against the Gauls goes well as it should, that I proceed with a quick strike on the Illyrians and their so-called ‘queen’ Teuta. I believe that for little costs, we could further use the troops mobilized north and extend our possessions. This will also ensure we have some good supply of timber, something we will really need if the so called hawk-party *eying Senator Monarchus (that’s a hideous feeling, to be looked upon by the dead fish eyes of Consul Olivero!)* keeps in mind a strike on Bovianum. You will need a great many siege engines to take the eagle nest!

To close this speech, and hear from you what you could possibly add (oh bother!), I have to share with you some concerns I got from a Macedonian friend of mine that a union between Carthage and Macedonia seems to be in the works, and they are some likeliness that they will consummate this union by striking our very close friends the Pergamenes. This is something I will have to confirm if happening, but it is disturbing nonetheless.

*Reading his notes*

Oups, and I quickly add that indeed, as soon as done with the nearby Punic navy, my son will sail east and make good contact with the Greeks of Aegypt and Orient.

Senator Olivero said:

"I also notice a great deal of conscription is going on in the provinces of Italy. I understand we are in a war but at this pace the population of the whole Italy will soon be inferior to any of the Greek City state! I propose to start distributing grain and build granaries in the main cities of Italy, to encourage a healthy grow of our population."

I agree but remember that cities with commercial ports and Rome with the senate dont need granaries. But building granaries in all other cities is mandatory.

Well, I have to go now. Without a clear signal from at least a few of you considering my bold strategies above, I will do my best and hope not upset too many follow senators!

Maybe should we start communicating by SMS :lol:

Good luck, Senator Olivero. May the winds of war speed you to your destiny!

From the proud city of Neapolis and from the mountain top that oversees all Latium, the old Vesuvius, inspired by our Brother gods of Mars and Vulcan I adress ye, my fellow senators:

The proud Hawks, which I humbly represent, have made me swear that I, senator Monarchus, as long as my body still breathes, shall not allow the Carthaginian child sacrificers a rest. Also they have called upon me to asure that proper respect is given to them as one of the leading parties in the senate (the oldest by far) for some "fishy" arguments have risen to test their knowledge in the arts of war. It is therefore my duty to sum up, point out and share with you, my fellow patricians, the battle plan that the Hawks have developed for further deliberations among the respected members of the Senate.

First I also would like to thank consul Traianus for his strong effort and welcome him back to the Senate. I will keep this as short as I can in replying to young Consul Olivero's mandatory speech. First allow me to coloquially jest that, his insatiable apetite for wine is matched only by my voratious apetite for Carthaginian blood. Therefore Palma is in both of our agendas.

Since the dreaded war lingers and since consul Traianus has left a sizeable reserve force in the north I hearby affirm:

After Palma is eventually subdued, we must make one final effort to overtake at least one other Carthaginian poorly defended city (Narbo seems the best choice as for it's luxury resources are not to be ignored and the dreaded merchants of Moloh will never give it peacefully to us). Who knows, maibe Mars favours us and sends his furies upon Carthage and they might even decide to give us both Saguntum and Valentia in exchange for peace afterwards. This will unite our holdings in Spain and let us prepare for the comng 20 years of peace to meet the best these Barbarians can throw at us. For fear not, in 20 years there will be war again!

The troubles of internal affairs I trust entirely on the consul's decisions. I would however say that Pharus and the Praetorian office are far to premature as they both cost large amounts of upkeep and little benefits for the time beeing. Also take care, proud consul not to establish Granaries in cities that already have them or cannot outgrow the colonia status for that would be a waste of precious time. Conscription shall also cease as soon as we have reached our maximum supported army and should consist mainly in Legios, foreign of course were possible, but, in my warlike opinion, no sooner.

As for the Foreign Affairs, the debate is only just begun (I see a certain fear in a certain magistrate's eyes, but fear not for Hawks stand for justice rather than blind meaningless confrontations). A few logical arguments:

Say by the middle of Consul's Olivero's mandate we shall have a cease fire in the South. The immediate course of action is, of course north. We all agree. The Eagle's fortress although feared shall fall to the hawks cunning attacks only after the Gauls are defeated.

This leaves us with a choice: Shall we secure the timber from OUR righteous island of Sicily, take it's largest port for our own, subdue Massilia and her riches AND put an end to the Samnite threat that requires us to maintain legions in southern Italy OR shall we adventure in the very short time allowed (we'd have to batter the Gauls first, lest you not forget) against the Illyrian pyrates in a long and treacherous journey through the Adriatic, leaving our western front entirely open to Carthage, disregarding the luxuries of Narbo making a new (and permanent) enemy out of them AND dennying them the possibility to act as a buffer between our lands and those of the Macedonian greedy ruler Antigonos.

I think my vote is clear WEST and I expect yours soon, my fellow patricians. Surely the current consul would like to say that the Doves are better than the Hawks but I will let the Senatorial vote decide. This is NOT a war between Romans however (for now at least) so let us not be carried away by hasty impulses: we all want the republic to flourish (for now).

Stwength and Honow, my fellow Patwicians.

I was just typping when you slipped through my fingers little fishy! Well if you can hear me, wherever you are you might wanna start work on Circus Maximus right away, the Romans want entertainment: panem et circensis, you know! We're falling behind in research! Let's try to stick to the 12 year/advance or we'll become barbarous ourselves. My spies report that Narbo is not so well defended and will fall easily to an army consulares and 2 or three legions. Same for Massalia and Bovianum. Syracusae is better defended. The Gauls I doubt pose any real threat. But please don't go after the Illyrians now! Not until we subdue the Greeks. To many fronts, mein Fuhrer, too many fronts. I'm going to rest my pen for it is writing in vain :cry:.

Ok - I have played all my turns last night, for the weekend will be busy will real life stuff and I didn't want to freeze the game for too long seeing how we proceed fast. 10 turns went much faster than expected and you will find (I hope!) I followed the Senate wishes. The notable exception is with waging the war with Carthage beyond Palma. I didn't do that - wanted to go NORTH and didn't feel landing in that bee nest either. But I got something you wanted anyway. Ok, there we go with my (long, I won't do that next time ;)) report:

EDIT

@Monarch

- Haven't thought about buidling the circus - that is left for the next Consul!
- You will be glad I had not enough time to attack the Illyrians :)
- For next move, don't wait for my vote if decision is taken over the weekend. I would go for Illyria but can agree a war to take Syracusae. I am also curious of what would happen to an attempt to take Bovianum. I would however cherish a greek Massilia!

244BC

- Consul Olivero completes a tour of Italia, and ensures the municipalities of Pisae, Ariminum, Corfinium and Barium that granaries will be completed soon in these cities. Production in Neapolis is switched from the Pharus to triremes, not without some waste of shields.
- At the same time, legions are properly labelled with numbers. It seems legions XII, XIII and XIX are missing in action and one might consider using these numbers when numbering newly enlisted legions in the future. Some of the idle forces in Italy are ordered moving north toward Cisalpine lands.
- A shortcut road is commissioned to be build to connect Pisae with Ariminum, so that the Consul might have a shorter and less rugged travel for his frequent trips to his estates.
- Once back to Rome, Olivero is surprised by a kind and spontaneous festivity in his honour, as the people celebrate a “we love Consul Olivero” day thing.
- The Pergamene fleet (or what remains of it) is resting near Syracusae while a Punic Navy roams along the Sicilian coast; another Punic naval corps is spotted approaching the Campanian coast, and there are fears that a land attack might be staged on the relatively unprotected coast. As the Mare Nostrum spawned a Corvus, the ships under the daring leadership of Olivero’s son, who wisely stayed on land to control the boats more effectively, attacked and defeated one of the Punic Quinqueremes, effectively enslaving it.
- No assault is staged on Palma, as the troops there are quite exhausted, reinforcement of velites commissioned by previous consul Traianus are proceeding though and further forces (two legions) are shipped there from Carales, as we ignore the real forces garrisoning the Balearic Islands.

243BC

- Macedonia allies with Carthage, that is against Pergamum. It seems Attalus will have to deal with problems at home from now on. Indeed, the Pergamene fleet remnants are now heading home the tail between the legs. The Punic and Syracuseans seem to be laughing at them...
- Rome is now fully controlling the art of civil engineering and as promised, Consul Olivero now undertakes to extend the number of praetors to ensure a smooth management of the new provinces. This will take 12 years to achieve (not including building the wonder!), and the treasure is now loosing 29 gpt!
- On this basis, we decide that more schools are needed, Neapolis starts building some.
- With the arrival of fresh velites in Palma, troops resume the assault! One legio reach the elite level and is named after the Consul to commemorate his great leadership. The core force of 5 velites then effectively storm the outer walls, with 1 loss, and even the seriously previously wounded troops charge again in an attempt to take the fortress. They meet success but the city yet don’t fall.
- Sicilia’s governor is gathering a small fleet at Lilybaeum in hope to strike the Punic next time they come by (chance that will never come); meanwhile the Punic fleet near Capua looks frozen into position, probably scarred to death by the endearing initiatives of the Roman admiral, who is celebrating his victory with his friends in Neapolis’ hot quarters. The victorious corvus and the captured quinquereme are being fixed at the shipyard. These will be the core of the fleet that will sail east toward Orient to make new ‘friends’. An additional trireme is commissioned in Tarentum to complete this fleet.
- Rome spawns a new legio (XXVI) which is promptly send down to fortify the iron mines near Bovianum.
- Some spying is commissioned (28gold) on the Cisalpine capital of Mediolanum to have some idea of the Gaul’s military strength. One tribus magnus and 2 tribus barbarus. We laugh!

242BC

- Palma seems to mobilize even their children to man the walls. A new garrison has been set in place over the winter. Hardened troopers storm the fortress again, and following the example of the great Legio XXV Olivera, they capture the Castrum Baliaris with no further loss! Rome has a new province!
- We are now very much looking toward the North and time passes fast. Olivero contact the Carthaginian ambassador and calls for peace. Rome proposes peace on the current borders with Carthage further returning two cities of Spain/Magna Graecia. This is refused, but as Consul Olivero doesn’t have much patience for long negotiations, an agreement is finally reached on Narbo + 12 gpt. We have PEACE! Rome mobs are cheering!
- The reinforcements for Palma are from now on diverted to Narbo, which is without any garrison. The local Greeks are surprisingly friendly to Rome. More troops will be progressively shipped from Palma to the mainland.
- Meanwhile, less than 10 days after the peace with the Carthaginians (treasure +15gpt as war weariness vanishes and the people rejoice), Consul Olivero evokes some obscure cassus belli and declares war on the Cisalpine Celts. Although they are some mix feeling in the population, overall, this is not consider as a real war and the parties continues in Rome unabated.
- A two throng attack on the Gauls is in order. The attack on Genua is a complete success. It is nearly too simple (and the modder seriously think about tweaking the Cisalpine up, he changed his mind later on!). No losses, an elite legion (called Liguria). Fresh slaves are put to work a way between Genua and Massilia/Galia Comata/Narbo.
- The attack on Ravenna is a complete opposite story and Consul Olivero doesn’t like to speak about it very much. The assault was launched by a core forces gathered by the previous Consul, one legio and three miles socii. In the first hours of the attack, two socii and the legio are killed in action, with only one enemy defender killed! Velites are unable to go through the rustic yet strong walls. Some eques are sent to further test the garrison but barely manage to survive. It seems Ravenna’s garrison is huge and Rome has no more nearby fresh troops. All that at the doors of Ariminum! Some rich senators are now selling their estates nearby!

241BC

- RoP with Pergamum and Macedonia expire and there is no will from them to renew it. We guess they have better things to do at home.
- A new force of Samnite Peltats is spotted near Capua, with the fort not yet completed. We don’t want to interrupt the construction, so we send some velites, which weaken the Samnites. Hope is that the legio on hills (busy fortifying) will hold to it.
- The 2nd Consular Army and Legio IX, freshly disembarked at Ostia from Corsica are promptly pushed out of their camp toward Ravenna. No rest for the Republic’s soldiers!
- The diplomatic fleet is gathering near Tarentum, the triremis there is rushed (140 gold).
- Foreign legio in Genua is also rushed (236 gold), local army rests.
- No assault is undertaken on Ravenna, but the siege continues.

240BC

- A pirate fleet (1) appear near Tarentum and attack our ships near the port. Although damaged, we win.
- The Samnites attack the ore mine of Capua and… aaargh!... destroy the newly commissioned legion. These are sad time for Rome. The Velites manages to finish off the raging hillmen. Senator Olivero swears to Baccus he will see Bovianum razed to the ground (speak of changing your mind ;)).
- Lots of Punic troops (Libyan phalanx) are moving nearby Narbo, heading north. The strong garrison in the new province could hold to Punic treachery but we fear for Massilia.
- In Galia Cisalpina, the siege of Ravenna continues and some skirmishes take place in the central hills near Pisae, with no Roman losses. We realize some funny engineer ‘forgot’ to build a road on Roman hills to connect the newly built network near Mediolanum with the Tuscan one! We will have his head chopped down.

239BC

- F. Magnus is completed in Capua; we decide for an aquaeduct as the city is size 5 with good crops and a happy population.
- The first Balearic Slingers are spawned in Palma. As other local forces, it will be shipped to Narbo.
- Genua’s Army starts its long march on Mediolanum. This is a harsh terrain, especially with an incomplete road system and it will take time.
- The attack on Ravenna is resumed now that the 2nd Consular Army under the personal leadership of Consul Olivero has arrived. With many wounded but no real loss, four defending units are destroyed, yet it seems the garrison is still strong. The Consul starts loosing is hairs.
- Meanwhile, the consul’son put the “diplo fleet’ in move, heading for Greece. Before he even reaches Sparta with the fleet foreguard (2 triremes), he meets a massive fleet of Pirates (2). The triremes destroy one, but a counter strike of the pirate sinks a roman ship. The slow and cumbersome corvus, not even able to spot pirates on their own are useless and left behind.
- Near Narbo, idle legions start a road that will connect us Rome to the Gallic goods. Luxuries yum!

238BC

- More pirates arrive and wound the remaining triremes. The diplo fleet, taking example on the admiral ship, run back to Croton where damaged boats will be fixed at great expenses. What are the Greek fleets doing? Are the eastern seas ruled by pirates? Olivero’s son don’ really care and discover exotic pleasure in the Greek city.
- The Pergamenes ask our help against Macedonia. We very kindly refuse.
- More Punic troops moving north near Narbo!
- Siege of Ravenna continues with one more defending unit destroyed.

237BC

- Massive Carthaginian landing near Syracusae! This includes Numids and light cavalry.
- Neapolis starts to build its own aquaeduct.
- A final assault is launched on Ravenna, killing one legion in the process, senator Olivero has no longer any hair, but the city is finally taken after 6 years of siege with the loss of two legions and two miles socii. One must not underestimate the Gauls!
- Meanwhile, troops keep their forced march north toward Mediolanum, bypassing the many rivers of the area. We have to be quick for the Consulship is finishing and fresh Gallic warriors are coming through the Alps from the west.

236BC

- The Antigonids ask our help against Pergamum. We send them to hell!
- Serious battles take place between Carthage and the western Greeks. In Sicilia, the Punic expeditionary forces meet success and defeat Greek hoplitai, capturing all the local Greek workers. Near Narbo, phalanx and Peltats fight each other in the hills with heavy casualty on each side.
- Messana starts a temple, Corfinium is judged big enough to start a school.
- Troops from Genua and Ravenna keep their forced march north and west toward Mediolanum
- Rome spawns a new legio (called XXVI again!) which is promptly send down to fortify the iron mines near Bovianum and mask the death and shame of the previous one!

235BC

- Peace is declared between Macedonia and Pergamum. As far as we know, there has been no land change between the two. Maybe they can now address the piracy problem!
- Fighting between Greeks and Punics continues in Sicily.
- A Greek fleet, likely with embarked troopers, head from Syracuse toward the Carthaginian mainland. Wish them good luck, but also that they were more clever and defeat the enemies at home first!
- Capua completes its aquaeduct!
- Assault on Mediolanum! 3 legio, 1 miles socius, 5 velites and 5 eques storm the hilly capital! With the velites and eques first, charging to weaken the garrison, legio XVII finally take the palace and capture the Celtic king (the legio became elite and I let to my successor to nickname it, I suggest Celtica). The Cisalpine lands are OURS!

Conclusions:

- We now have a sizable fleet of 4 triremis and 6 corvus; we might want to use this. I suggest a change in leadership concerning the admiralty.
- Our troops are now near the Alps, ready to head either west or east. This is a choice we want to make NOW.
- Another small army is being assembled in Narbo, which can be used if war goes west or as a buffer against Hannibal (who will come soon enough now!).
- Italy is prosperous and populated with granaries and at least 3 cities with the scope the become metropolis soon.
- I failed to contact new civilizations east due to intense pirate activity. The corvus is very unsuitable to fight piracy, as it is slow and vulnerable in defence. ASAP, we need to upgrade our corvus into quinqueremis summa and fight off piracy (or let the Greek navy get decimated by the pirates?)
- The West Greeks, if to survive at all, will need our help very soon against Carthage. Although we could let the Punics take Syracuse (so that we can take it over next Punic War), Massilia should not become a Carthaginian stronghold! I would actually love it to stay Greek (as a Roman ally) for the time being, at leats until Caesar’s times.

With that, Consul Olivero, seats down on his senator chair, and before even an hour, is soundly sleeping, a self contended smile on his face. He definitively looks much older and worned out than before his consulship.

The save file is here (235BC). (http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/Olivero,_235_BC.SAV)

hi all, one question. how do you rename the units in the game?

Who dare disturbing my sleep ;)
Somewhere in-game, select the preferences option, then flag something like "advanced control for unit". You will then have new icons available for your units, including a rename one.

As long as we are here asking questions, I have one too (which answer would have been handy last night): how do you cancel a RoP (which already expired but is still ongoing, if it makes any difference)?

Back to sleep.

As long as we are here asking questions, I have one too (which answer would have been handy last night): how do you cancel a RoP (which already expired but is still ongoing, if it makes any difference)?

Back to sleep.


Contact the civ, click make a deal, and at the bottom there should be a little button labeled "active". Click and cancel.

*Newly appointed Consul Castor (I believe it's beaver in latin) rises to speak to the Senate*

My fellow senators, I most humbly accept the honor of governing the Republic. As we have been at wars for years and our forces are spread as thin as butter on a toast, my consulship will begin with a tour of all of our provinces. It is my hope that my splendid sight will raise the spirit of our troops and cause barbarian women to faint in front of my splendor.

*Goes out, calls his slaves and gets transported on their back up to Mediolanum*
*There, adresses the happy crowd*

Newly conquered and soon to be prosperous slaves, err, no citizens, I am Consul Castor and I....

*the crowd starts trowing rocks at him and yells "ROP-raper! ROP-raper!"*

-------
Yes Pink, you did it. You ROP-raped the Gauls. I tried to sign new ROP with Pergamum and they ASKED 230 gold for it. Macedonia asked 330 gold. Well, this is going to make the rest of the game quite interesting to say the least. I'll play my turns on friday (maybe) and saturday.
For my plan, I will either a) ask Cartage to get out of our territory and they will declare war or b) take on either the Greeks or Illirycum.
BTW Pink, why is there still a Consular army in Carales?

Castor is definitively Beaver... in french.
Now, I had some bad feelings last night (between two real glasses of wine!)when not finding out a way to cancel the RoP. I figured out that since it expired, it would not count. So much for your love stories with blonde women of Mediolanum. My bad :shame:!
As for the consularis #1, I left it there as it wasn't needed anywhere by the time it got its HP back. I guess it is as good as anywhere else as it can be quickly shipped to Spain, Sicily, Italy or Narbonensis as dictated by your strategies.
Good luck in your undertakings Consul Castor!

Consul Castor! I've only just awaken from the senatorial slumber (something rather common in my real parliament too unfortunatelly) to find a lot of things have been going on during the night. I trust it will take a bit to read through all this, examinate the sav and still make a coherent suggestion to you. If you however wish to hear my opinion, stick around for a couple of hours (or come back before you start playing). Thnx. Now I will start my humble analysis... BE VEWY, VEWY QUIET! I'M HUNTIN' WABID!

The Samnites attack the ore mine of Capua and… aaargh!... destroy the newly commissioned legion. These are sad time for Rome. The Velites manages to finish off the raging hillmen. Senator Olivero swears to Baccus he will see Bovianum razed to the ground (speak of changing your mind). .

@Pink: I hate to tell you: I TOLD YOU SO!
You sure wrote an in depth report there :goodjob:.
Some things: I've seen you had a lot of bad luck :(, XXVI legions my @ss :lol:, more like 17+4FL which should be kept safe from harm and loaded in the Scipions as soon as available. So a new numerotation seems in order -minor thing.
Good job with Narbo! although your friendship with the Doves didn't make a good impression as we didn't capture Valentia too but hey, not your fault. The RoP could've been cancelled peacefully :mad:. Surprisingly we are on schedule with history (almost), the only thing missing is... Syracusae. We definitelly should take a vote WEST or EAST, but I think my arguments are quite clear where I'd like to camp for the winter. Besides, historically Illyria was included in the empire way later-they needed it as a buffer against Macedonia too! You should think that in 20 years Hannibal is coming... And, thanks to yours trully and other "would be historical accurate nincampooches :D" he is twice stronger than usual!

@Consul Castor (more of a Greek name but hey, it falls upon you to fight the Greeks :)). Syracusae was strong but since the Carthaginians are battering it it should make it a lot easier for us so here's a battle plan:

-move close to Massalia (which has just 3 units and can't hold on to Carthage alone!). Massalia will fall if we're not carefull so we must make sure it historically falls to us! The forces in Genua and Narbo should be more than enough to finish it off right NOW!

-As the Carthaginians have weakened Syracusa, take both consulars there (don't use the FL's to attack for they are too precious, only to finish off).

-Bovianum will require ALL our troops (from South and North) to converge there. The loss of legions and the risk of spawning even more Samintes through enslavement is an abominating thought for me. Better lose one or two legions now then live with fear.

A dirty trick: if you force the Greek capital at Bovianum it will obsolete their walls and allow your velites to bombard the garisson rather than the wall. You should then attack with the Eques, then with the armies and then with the legios and Miles Socii to minimize the losses.

So bottom line: let the samnite and Peltasts get out of Bovianum and defeat them in the open then, after swiftly overcoming Syracusae and Massalia. Take their last bastion. The armies alone, at full strength should take care of the units. Of course if you lose an army you would have to load the game...

These three cities will of course finalize the conquest of Italy and allow us to focus entirely on the outside!! Well, gentlemen, vote.

I believe the senate knows where my vote lies. You can imagine my half-stifled cry of frustration when I heard of the obliteration of an entire legion at the hands of the Greek rats. Oh, I realise some in the senate will point out that these attackers wore not the colours of the Western Greeks, but are we really in any doubt as to their origin or allegiance? They have crossed us yoo many times and now the moment is right. They are weakened by war with Carthage and will fall.
We should attack and occupy both Masillia and Syracusae. Let them come to us from the walls of Bovianum. We can colour the hills with their blood! And are we now in a position to build siege weaponry? This seems the will of the gods, no less.
It is time for the war to go west.

Right you are, senator Traianus. That's already 3 votes if you count pink's and I'm sure senator Gaias will see it our way too. The Illyrians will have to wait.

Consul Olivero's rule turned out to be very beneficial despite the bad luck. The Republic stretched it's influence furthest and no army or foreign legion has been lost. The rest we can live with

However there are only 13 turns left of peace with Carthage so we should finish this quickly and amass troops in Narbo. Perhaps we should sign a RoP with Iberia and wait for Hannibal on the hill surrounded by rivers north (or the one west) of Tarraco. They seem willing to agree to a RoP once we establish an embassy and even give us 70+ gold for that!!. We should build a fortress there (or two) and two more right in front of Genua if that is to fail. He is not to go to Italy. Remember that we have to weaken him seriously by defending before we can attempt a counterattack on his 30 def.

The good side is that he should be alone as the main force will probably attack sooner than he spawns. Serious preparations are crucial in my opinion.
Do you all agree? I will be less active before my own consulship (around Sunady, I guess) but fear not for I will do my duties to Rome but post only when very much needed. Good luck consul Castor and don't forget the Circus Maximus-far more important in war time than the expensive Praetor! Of course we will need Saguntum for that...

@Senator Olivero. Are you sure you could not find Legio XIX. I'm pretty sure my three new legions were numbered XIX, XX(Carthaginian) and XXI.

Ave fellow Patricians!

I have some opinions regarding the management in our cities.
(I just examined the current save)

Tarentum: You should micromanage food/shields so that population increase in 4 turns and Praesidum is finished in 4 turns.

Olbia: This city will loose 16 food if the praesidium is built with current production planning, this needs micromanaging or change of production. Maybe to a non-pop costing funditore?

Palma: Same problem as Olbia. The city will loose 18 food with current build strategy. I understand that these cities need new garrisons fast but maybe the praesidiums could be micromanaged to that units that require pop are finished the same turn that the city grows?

Pisae: I guess you are building eques to let the population grow? I like the eques. We will need them to fight slave unrest later and they are good against hoplai and other units with 1 point movement. But now we can build BALLISTA! We need those both against Bovanium and later against Hannibal, curse his name! I suggest changing production in Pisae to ballista.

Barium: Micromanage the city so that population increase in 2 turns and granary is still finished in 1 turn.

Capua: Do we need more praesidium in this city? If we follow our current plans with a threepronged assault on Magna Greacia we will not need any more garrisons in the city. We have just built an aquaductus, I suggest we let the city grow. Decrease shields and increase food! And build a non pop costing ballistae instead....

Agrigentum: Do we really need fabrica here? The production is low and Syracuse will use the timber and hills after we have conquered it.

Corfinium: The city has 12 commerce as it is. The 6 science will become 9 with a school? Is it really worth it at the moment? I suggest a ballista instead.

Otherwise I´m impressed my the work of the recent Consuls and I wish Consul Castor the best of luck!


At the papyrus: Consul Linkowicius

P.S Maybe the 4 servi should be evacuated from Palma? Much of our core lands are still undeveloped and they are better needed there. D.S

I had set olbia and Aleria to produce funditores for the above reasons and also because they are support units and will be free if built in these cities. I wonder have they been produced already. I didn't see anything about it in Pink's report, though I might have missed it.
All in all, though, I think he should be applauded for a haul of 4 cities in 10 turns.

Fellow senators, night has been very inspiring and I have come up with a new battleplan which will need your approval (or disapproval). I'll admit it is very ambitious, but so is the spirit of this Republic. This is my proposal :
a) ask Cartago to leave our territory. They will declare war but we have enough unit in Narbo to hold the city. Plus, we could sign MAs with other nations which will be willing to contribute financially to our war effort. We have also enough units in other provinces to beat down Cartaginian scum.
b) After cartaginian units around Massilia are defeated, I will declare war on the greeks and take Syracuse and Massilia. Defensive actions will be taken around Bovianum until the front with cartage is secured.
c) The consular army currently stationned in Ravenna will be moved to Massilia, Narbo and will launch an attack on Saguntum with others forces in the area. The offensive in Spain will stop at Valentia. Then, peace will be a turn or 2 away.
d) After peace is signed, I will move the Consular armies to Bovianum and take the city.

Advantages : We will be at Valentia before the dreaded Hannibal appears. We will hold all of Italia, Sicilia, and the western Mediterranean coast. We will have another profitable peace treaty with cartago as they will be the one to break the current one.
Disadvantages : We know that the Greeks are weak and that Cartage's ability to fight are lower than before, but if losses are high, it could delay severely the conquest of Illirya and the third Punic war. Plus, the entire expedition could be a disaster.

I know that a vote as already been made in the favor of war with the Greeks, but I would like another to see in which direction I must go.

Consul Castor!

I´m not sure our forces are strong enough for a plan of that scale.

Our garrisons on Sicilly are only 1 legion plus a couple of auxillary per city.
Our garrisons on our newly conquered and hardfought islands are thin as well.
A renewed war with Carthage would probably lead to dangerous assaults from the sea, escpecially on Sicilly.

Are our forces strong enough to guard against Bovanium, guard Sicilly (an assault on Syracuse might as well be good if we are to attack Massilia), guard the islands and still conquer Massilia and beat Carthage in the Narbo area?

I cannot, given my experiences as consul, condone this course of action. I had planned to make war on two fronts, one being the relatively weak Cisalpine Gauls, but found that the Carthaginians were more than enough to handle by themselves.
The consul Castor says it best himself, '...the entire expedition could be a disaster'.
My vote is no, but I commend the bravery of the consul. I'm sure he will give those scheming Greeks exactly what they deserve.
S.P.Q.R.
Senator Marcus Licinius Traianus.

I hear the Senate, and I will stick to its original vote. My consulship should be finished today.

Good Consul Olivero! I see that your rule was not without its... misfortunes. To say that your loyal senator gave you the insight to the tragety of leaving a rabid dong unchained, would be a disservice. Rather, I would say your misgivings about putting down the rabid dog, have displeased the gods. Who is to say that your most unfortunate military losses against the Cisalpinians, was not because of your misgivings? Then again, who amongst us knows the will of the gods?

It does my heart good to see that one amonst us still remembers who we all represent. I was being lead to believe that all of us were as eagles in a sea of mice. One can gorged oneself until fat, but one must remember,their are others that are not so fortunate as to be eagles. Yor commision of Graneries, Consul Olivero, shows the wisdom of your many years of service. For what are we, if not servants of the people. The people have shown great love for their representative with lavish parties and sweet calling of his name. Remember, this is what and who we all do this for. The people of Rome.

It seems to me, Consul Olivero, that your son hasn't inherited your wisdom and forsight. His... we will say, untimely retreat from duties of diplomacy, was not so unexpected. Long has Rome known of the pirates that have festered in Illyrian territory, in which they so conviently deny. As hard for me it is to say, Carthage was a great reason for their small of numbers. Now that we have destroyed most of their war vessels, these pirates infest the waters like locuts in the heat of a Nubian summer. Blame not your son, for we all had little misgivings about such an endeavor, as the gain outweighted the risk.

I regret now of my lack of forthcomingness. I had merely stated a question to Consul Drendor of the military progress of Carthage against the Greeks. The gods had given me visions of consequences with our proposed alliance with the Greeks. Though barbarians they may be, the Punics are stronger by far than the sheeps that call themselves Greek. It was inevitable that such a misdirection of power would lead to the strength of the barbarians. I once again give my sorrow for being quiet of mouth and lack of wisdom of not bringing forth my concerns on the matter.

But now we have a new eagle! Consul Castor! A new eagle and one with even sharper claws it seems. Why, pray tell, is one mouse not a good feed for you? Is it imperative that you prove to us the sharpness of your claws? Especially to a mouse yet alive, that possess equally sharp talons? A good hunter will slay a single beast at a time, as it allows them to focus all their skill and bravery to one target.

My council to you Consul Castor, is to let these barbarians have their Masillia. We should care not what these Punic dogs take, as we have already proven we can take back what was given to them. So let us give them Masillia and focus our concentration of was cities are left the Greeks are going to present to us. Take both Bovianum and Syracause, as they are both more worthy prises and of better strategic value against our enemies.

Be quick about getting your talons wet with the blood of the greeks, as its past time for peace. We must make our people fat and rich for them to love us more. Once our people have become rich and fat, they will have forgotten any past transgressions. This will make them more willing and plentiful for us to make war again.

Heed all what the senators speak to you of, Consul Castor. For many Consuls before you have listened with only half an ear.

Senator Gaias, your eloquence simply astonishes me, for lack of a better word. While it is true that my plan was a gamble, it could have payed off far more than what we invested. Alas, the Senate does not share my view of the word "reasonable risk". While it is sad that I cannot duel the Cartaginian dogs during my consulship, and perharps never if my sucessors are favored by the gods, it has enabled me to concentrate our invincible forces on the Greeks. As much as I love war and destruction, I must say this campaign has left me with a sour taste in my mouth as it was all too easy. Not even half of my consulship was over that already, all of Magnae Graecia was bowing in front of me and their women were entertaining me. Here is my report for the period covering the 235-230 Bc era.

--------------

235 BC :
Switch some production and micromanaged some cities accordingly with Drendor and others.
Moved the Consular army from Carales to the cumba in Olbia with a velites and made the cumba go near Rome where the troops disembarked
Moved the cumba in Pisae to Aleria
Signed ROP with Hispania for a net loss of 40g (113 g embassy and 73g ROP) but will be useful to get to Saguntum
Blocked the passage beside Narbo with a velites and rushed a praesidium there
Declared war on the Greeks
Signed alliances with Aetolia and Achaia against the Greeks for a net gain of 21g
Signed ROP with Pergamum for a surprising 4g (must be a bug because last time I checked the save they asked for 220g)
Moved most units in Sicilia beside Syracuse
Moved most units in Narbo toward Massilia

234 BC :
Made units beside Massilia cross the river to attack with a better angle, the veteran Eques of that group attacks after bombardment from velites and wins against an elite Hoplite without getting hit! He is afterward named Eques Felicis (Lucky)
Units in Mediolanum start to heal
2 Legios sent from Mediolanum to build a road with 4 servus between that city and Pisae
Consular army in Ravenna is sent toward Massilia
Consular army which landed near Rome goes to Bovianum with 2 velites
4 Legios in front of Syracuse attack and defeat 4 Hoplite but there is still at least 2 other left

233BC :
Syracuse taken by a lucky velites who doesn’t get hurt while killing a regular Hoplite and a FLegio
Massilia taken
So far, no loss. I should rename myself Consul Castor Felicis.
To summarize the rest, some troops moved
I try to build a road between Massilia and Genua as fast as possible because I can’t rush Legio without ore
2 Consular armies are redirected to Bovianum from which only a Hoplite comes out
1 praesidium killed there

232 BC :
Move some units around
Started road to Massilia and put it on no growth option
Syracuse gets into civil disorder, no rush this turn
2 praesidium are killed in Bovianum by the armies, a Hoplite is left
Legio rush in Lilybaeum where a slave joined to make 4 pop


231 BC :
Praesidium(!) commissioned in Tarentum (forgot to micromanage)
First ballista built in Capua
A Peltastes appears in Bovianum, due to it’s high hp and the high def factor of the terrain, I decide to let him play catch the servus
Foreign Legio built in Lilybaeum
Foreign Legio rushed in Syracuse
Discovered Praetor and started work for Cisalpine and Illiryc war due in 12 turns
Praetor not built because it will not make save any money right now (we have 25 cities, Praetor costs 20 gpt and even if we could save 1 gold per city from corruption it would barely be worth it)

230 BC :
Cartago’s navy goes into the sea between Italia and Illirya (I don’t remember the name), I hope they get sunk by pirates
The Peltastes falls for the trick and goes out of Bovianum
The armies (which healed in between turn, don’t ask me why, they just had a lot more of hp suddenly) attack and kill 2 hoplite, 1 remains and is killed by waves of velites
Magnae Graecia is now completely conquered
Nest target Illirya

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I will position our forces near Illirya and begin the assault. Or should I ask a vote from the Senate to confirm my orders to the army?

Does an eagle ask the mouse if it wishes to be eaten?

I must heed the words of Senator Monarchus, that our fortune and fame lie to the west and not the east. I fear that we not heard the last of the Punic mongrels. It would be ill advised on my part to give concent to attacking Illyria at this point. Such a gem can wait for another to claim upon themselves.

It is time once again to turn our attention to the lepers of the south. For lepers they are, speading their wicked ways and blasphemous Baalism. For such things should not be forced on the dear future citizens of Rome. Marshel the Legions to Narbo, as the pathetic Carthagians have their evil sights on Hispania. It is our duty... no, divine right, to protect those lost and confused souls that inhabit Hispania.

My the gods grant you strength as the people of Rome grant you our might!

After 10 years of holding the reins of the Republic, I, Consul Castor, ask of this Senate the holding of elections for the next Consul. I have accomplished my task as well as I could although I could not go as far I would have liked. Ultimately, it will be up to you, my fellow senators, to decide what history will remember of me.
This is my last report for the period covering 230 BC- 225BC :

-----

229 BC :
Velites built in Barium
Start healing of the units that participated in the Bovianum assault
Move some units
Pirates doesn’t attack Cartage’s ship
We are over the free unit limit but still making 72 gpt

228 BC :
All quiet
Rome builds a faber
Ariminium builds a Legio with Senator Olivero’s son at his head, lets all whish him the best of luck

227 BC –226 BC :
Not much, stacking troops for the invasion which will begin next turn
Forgot what built what, sorry
First Pirate cut and sunk, creating a quinquiremis
Repositioning troops so as to be able to fight Illyria while fighting Cartage (the Second Punic war will be for you Gaias :) )
Road network completed between Rome and Narbo
Declared war on Illyria

225 BC :
The triremis and the quinquiremis are lost near Barium after heavy pirate counter attack
Of the anti-pirate fleet only the corvus remains
The troops advance in Illyricum
A pedites is killed
Roads begin to be built between Narbo and Tarraco

---------------

As you see, my naval expeditions haven't been well planned, leaving ships stranded in a pirate infestec sea. On the other hand, on land, I can proudly thank the Gods for helping minimize the losses, with only a velites lost in Bovianum.

Task Force Illirycum :
Consular army
3 Legio
3 Eques
7 velites
1 ballista

Task Force Sicilia :
10 Legio
5 Miles Socius
5 velites

Task Force Narbo :
8 Legio
Consular Army
5 velites
2 Miles Socius
1 eques
1 funditor

Navy :
3 triremis
10 corvus

As much as it hurts to wait and loook with desire at the fertile lands of Illyria I tend to agree with senator Gaias and senator Monarchus. It´s time to prepare for another war with the punic dogs.

I think armies heal some, even in enemy territory. Required that they pause for a whole year and do nothing.

Congratulations on the victories over the greeks, lady fortuna smiled our way for sure!

Hmm I don´t now who that Drendor guy is. Sounds like a persian scholar...

Hum, sorry Gaias, I got a bit impatient and made my moves anyway. Well, the army in Narbo is still important and Sicilia is well secured with Legios and Corvus. The war in Illirycum can be ended quickly by taking 1 or 2 cities if you really wish it.
Be careful : Cartaginian units have been seen going into Gallia to scout, so a declaration of war will make them come back behind the Narbo front. Also, some cartaginian ship went to the east.
You can make Cartage declare war at any time on us by asking them to leave because they have a stranded eques Numidicus in Sicilia. I kinda protected him by taking the city so fast.
Overrall, we are above our free unit limit but with a healthy economy. Feel free to change some production (such as Pharus in Pisae, I didn't know what to produce next).

I think armies heal some, even in enemy territory. Required that they pause for a whole year and do nothing.
That's the problem, they had just attacked and I put them in sentry mode because they had 1 move left. Anyways, just tell if it happens to any of you.

Well consul Castor Felix your luck is impressive. Your triumph over the Greeks has earned you our respect. We have feared the Samnite scum too much as it seems (well some members of the Senate have).

However: although my warrior instincts would have gone to a march against Illyria myself if I had the time, I must say that your actions have violated the rule of the Senate, which is not to be taken lightly, at least in the times of the Republic. You have made us vulnerable to Carthaginian counter attack now that there are only 3 years of peace left. The year is 225 BC the precise year Hannibal spawns in Carthago Nova. He's there I've seen him :).

But I still think that with a little luck we can defend Narbo and Massilia AND wage a "little" war on Illyria. Your bravery reminds us of our youth, consul Castor and we therefore laugh with great pleasure and commend you for it.

Consul Gaias, our joint consulship will probably see the second Punic war. I suggest meeting Hannibal on the hills next to Tarraco. However you shouldn't let the Legio Consularis defend but rather take a normal (sacrifice) legion or two on the hill and wait with the consul to strike back. We should've had both consuls in Narbo but iit's a little late for that.

I also suggest rushing the Fabrica in Agrigentum and building a Portus there ASAP for both growth and defensive purposes. A dirty tricK: to lure the amphibious Phalanx Libianii let Messana ungarrisoned so they circle Syracusae to get there and finish them of with the Corvii before they do!

I see we have a lot of FL's. We should try to keep them in reserve so as not to lose them. Our army is quite strong as brave consul Castor has proven his allegiance to the Hawks ancestral ideals. Great job except for the Illyrian part where I foresee some casualties :(.

Senator Castor: Have you ever heard the expression, "Don´t push your luck"?

Well you just did. Eventhough three senators recommened against it you opened up a new front in Illyria three years before the cease fire ends with Carthage.
This could prove to be a serious stratetgic mistake. Lucky for you that your brother hawkes support you.

Well the damage is done. I suggest limiting the war in Illyria to a limited assault.
And make sure the Consular army protects the other units.

The advice regarding a non garrisoned Messana is wise. Keep a scouting ship in Messana or Croton though, to make sure there are no punic ships in the eastern waters that may sneak in from behind and capture an empty city.
And make sure the velites hurl their pilum before our corvus attack the mighty punic ships.

The naval debacle near Barium annoys me: Those ships should have been in port now that we were in war with Illyria. We should be more careful with the foreign ships conquered by our corvus. Those quinquiremis can later be upgraded to the mighty quinquiremis summa with no support costs.

Summary: Your military tactic skills astonish me but you have much more to learn about grand strategic plans and how the senate works.

To the next Consul: I hope that Jupiter and Lady Fortuna favors you as much as they did you preccessor.

Strength and Honor!

Senator Linkowicius

Do you also favour that we should start grading the consulships from now on (starting with consul Linkowicius's second consulship)? A 8-12 turn mandate should be given to all depending on their skills (and luck?).

Edit:
Senator Linkowicius. I've only seen your post. We do not encourage deliberate Senate overruling methods from ANY consul. Due to his bravery in war and because we have not yet established the grading system we cannot but foresee this action and make it a one time only mistake. Do you all agree?

May the wings of Death fall swiftly on the Phoenician dogs!

Regardless of the strategic (or otherwise) reasons behind Senator Castor's move eastwards, it might be for the best. A limited campaign in Illyria might be worthwhile. They will not have the stomach to stay at war with mighty Rome for too long and will gladly accept a crushing peace settlement after we take1 or 2 of their cities. Of course I leave to the next consul to decide how much is too much, but I would suggest that getting an early start on our push towards the Greek homelands would be appreciated in the longrun. Savaria should be left as a buffer against the fierce forest dwellers further north.

As a matter a fact, as we agree for two Illyrian wars, Savaria should be negociated for, for it is very distant and hardly accessible and (maibe) loaded with enemy troops. Taking it by force would require a split of our armies and that's not such a good idea. If we take Aquileea, Salonae and Savaria it should be enough. Perhaps, consul Gaias you could delay the war with carthage for a few turns (it is within your power to accept a white peace and ask them to withdraw whenever the war with Illyria is decided.

Senator Gaius Junius Domitian stands upon Capitole Hill, surrounded by important delegates of the Roman Empire. Today, the people of Rome have chosen Senator Gaius for the position of Consulship. Senator Gaius motions to the Legion soldiers to quite the cheering mob. As the soldiers bang their pilums upon their shields, the mob of Romans quites to a hush.

*says in his best stately voice, loud and clear*

Saluto my fellow Roman citizens! It is with great honor and reverence that I accept the mantle of leadership you have bestowed upon me. With the wisdom of the Gods, may I rule with a just hand. With the might of the Legions, may I fight with an iron fist. With the virtue of the Citizens, may I judge with an open heart.

My mandate is simple, spreading the words and teachings of the Gods to all corners of the Roman Republic. It is with a glad heart that I am allowe this opportunity to spead the glory and divinity of our Pantheon.

Too long has the voices of past Consuls talked and made war. Too much has the whims of past Consuls bled the land of bread and lost the sons of mothers. Too far has Rome spread her touch without the whispers of promises come to fruitation. Too late has the people of Rome gone without the dedication and devotion to the Gods.

Beginning immediately, will I start the reintergration of the Pantheon into our daily lives. Cities that are able to will convert their resources to the production of a Templum. If a city cannot support such a grand structure, the production of Delubrum. Once again each city will begin the production of said holy buildings as soon as it is feasible. Such is the decree I have spoken.

Greatly have the eagles been in the past Consuls, yet it is all the citizens of Rome understand. I have been given the unforunate duty of wearing the eagle's talon. War is upon us once again, with the Greek state of Illyria. I have no desire or animosity with Queen Teuta, yet I will not show her myself to be weak. I will take the city of Aquileia with the forces marshalled at the Illyrian boarder. It will be known to Queen Tueta the might of Rome, and that might can be brought to bear at anytime we desire it. I state with full confidence that she will willing offer a peach treaty, to which I will sign unhesitantly.

It is unfortunate that I must decree the deployment of our Legions overseas to the west. Do not be saddened to much as our goal is a noble and divine one. Once again Carthage oversteps its place and masses troops upon our doorstep. Such a travesty will not come to pass as I stand ready as Consul!
The phoenician dogs WILL be beating into submission, or may Jupiter strike me down where I stand!

Glory and praise to the Gods! For it is in their hands all fate is decided.

And so the roman empire was transformed into a theocraty.

Nice speech Consul and Pontifex Maximus Gaius.

So shall the peaceloving Pontifex postpone the war with Carthage untill all troops are assembled in Narbo or go ahead and provoke the Carthaginian dogs?

Also none of you has voted weather we should instate the law of post consular judgement in the form of grades given to the former consul, grades that will effectively lengthen or shorten the period of consulship for the next turn.

So shall the peaceloving Pontifex postpone the war with Carthage untill all troops are assembled in Narbo or go ahead and provoke the Carthaginian dogs?

Also none of you has voted weather we should instate the law of post consular judgement in the form of grades given to the former consul, grades that will effectively lengthen or shorten the period of consulship for the next turn.

Yes maybe we don´t need to rush the war with the punic fiends. Hannibal has probably already appeared so we cant stop that anymore. We would slaughter them easily if we wait for reinforcements from the Illyrian theater. Especially the other consular army would be useful in the Hispanian front.

A grading procedure sounds fun. So if I make bad manouvers my next period can be limited to 8 turns and if I do well it may be 12 turns instead?
And maybe consuls should be somewhat excused if they encounter really bad luck?

I agree with the grading system for the post consular examination. Though I would like to hear what Pink has to say when he comes back after the weekend.

Well he used this idea in his rules too. I was more radical (as usual :D) by saying we should have a 10-20 turns mandate upon the votes but he came up with the numbers 8-12. Seems more ballanced this way, I guess. But there should be some penalties for disregarding Senate votes and stuff. Well I'll take over in the morning, Pontifex Maximus Gaias.

There are some things I would like to clear out since it seems many in the Senate judges my actions without their consent severely. True, I did not wait for your vote, but the rules of vote during a mandate have never been set. Without rules, I decided that, being the consul, I was the sole master on this ship. I'll admit it is a lame excuse and, looking back on my actions, I should have waited for your word. My haste to finish my mandate made me disregard the procedure of our great Republic. Unfortunatly, what is done cannot be changed. But I can assure you that what happened on that day will never be repeated.
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Concerning my vilitory victories, it was purely luck that I did not lose any unit when assaulting Syracusae and Massilia. Looking back at the odds, I should have probably lost 2 Legio's. The siege of Bovianum was made painless by the Consular armies who took down 2 units every turn. Only when I stormed the city using velites was there a loss. My only military prowess in that particular war was the use of servus to lure a Peltasta Samnitis out of Bovianum and the effective use of our forces. Positionning them in the right place is a key component of sucess. I do not believe that I am really better in that area than the rest of you.
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As Senator Monarch said, I have also contributed to the creation of FL. I am quite proud of that particular phase of my mandate as at least 4 FL were commissioned, 1 from Lylibaeum, 1 from Massilia and 2 from Syracusa.
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The naval debacle near the shores of Barium was effectively caused, as Senator Linkowicius said, because I pushed my luck. The pirate ship was 3 squares away. Near enough for the corvus to sink it, but far enough to be unable to return. After the victory and the capture of a quinquiremis, I made the triremis and the quinquiremis stand guard near the corvus. Alas, a pirate came, sank the quinquiremis, captured enough ships to form a second unit of pirates and sank the triremis. I had hoped that either, there wouldn't be any pirates in range, or that they would lose. Had that scenario happened, Roman navy would be bigger by now.
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I vote in favor of the grade system. Although I would probably be punished had that system been in place, it is still a good idea to stop future Consuls to overstep their autority. My only question is will every senator vote +1 or -1 turn, making the next consulship between 3 turns and 17?
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Lastly, I feel the need to clarify my actions in the war with Illirya. We need to go east. Our time alloted to conquer all of Moesia is very small and I thought that making the first conquests now would help later on. I know that a second war with Cartage approaches, but as the situation in Narbo will be defensive for a while, it seemed appropriate to me to divert some of our forces toward Aquileia and Salonae. the advantages of holding these cities are multiple :
a) After building roads, we will have trade routes with all of Greece. We will then be able to sell some of our goods.
b) With Massilia, Agrigentum and Syracuse, this is the fourth city which will be able to build a portus naves. 2 of them are required to build the Portus Ostiae and 4 to build the Portus Migrare. Having Salonae gives us the possibility of having an out of the way city building that structure.
c) We will get contact with Dacia with whom we should declare war on and get Macedonia into it as well. Not now, but in a near future (say 40 turns, depending on the situation then), when our western borders will be secured. This will weaken the Macedonians and allow to capture key Dacian cities easily.
I thus contest senator Linkowicius words : "you have much more to learn about grand strategic plans". I believe that a short war with Illirya will be a lot more beneficial than having all of our forces in Narbo. War with Cartage does not depend on the end of a peace treaty as we can make them declare war on us at any time with their stranded Eques Numidicus in Sicilia.
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At any rate, it was fun :D , we saw the Senate fonctionning appropriatly and I do recognize my errors. It's also only a game, we will all probably do stupid things from time to time :crazyeye: .

There are some things I would like to clear out since it seems many in the Senate judges my actions without their consent severely. True, I did not wait for your vote, but the rules of vote during a mandate have never been set. Without rules, I decided that, being the consul, I was the sole master on this ship. I'll admit it is a lame excuse and, looking back on my actions, I should have waited for your word. My haste to finish my mandate made me disregard the procedure of our great Republic. Unfortunatly, what is done cannot be changed. But I can assure you that what happened on that day will never be repeated.

Qui s'excuse, s'accuse, mon ami :lol:. Don't worry I'm on your side. But as long as the Republic is in place we should debate everything before.

As Senator Monarch said, I have also contributed to the creation of FL. I am quite proud of that particular phase of my mandate as at least 4 FL were commissioned, 1 from Lylibaeum, 1 from Massilia and 2 from Syracusa.

Yes, I commend you for that!!

I vote in favor of the grade system. Although I would probably be punished had that system been in place, it is still a good idea to stop future Consuls to overstep their autority. My only question is will every senator vote +1 or -1 turn, making the next consulship between 3 turns and 17?


Just 6 Senators so between 4 and 16. Interesting but radicall. Who would want to play just 4 turns! On the other hand if somebody messes things up or (more likely) receive the proper bonus for a great deed like trapping Hannibal it should be a good idea.


Lastly, I feel the need to clarify my actions in the war with Illirya. We need to go east. Our time alloted to conquer all of Moesia is very small and I thought that making the first conquests now would help later on. I know that a second war with Cartage approaches, but as the situation in Narbo will be defensive for a while, it seemed appropriate to me to divert some of our forces toward Aquileia and Salonae. the advantages of holding these cities are multiple :
a) After building roads, we will have trade routes with all of Greece. We will then be able to sell some of our goods.
b) With Massilia, Agrigentum and Syracuse, this is the fourth city which will be able to build a portus naves. 2 of them are required to build the Portus Ostiae and 4 to build the Portus Migrare. Having Salonae gives us the possibility of having an out of the way city building that structure.
c) We will get contact with Dacia with whom we should declare war on and get Macedonia into it as well. Not now, but in a near future (say 40 turns, depending on the situation then), when our western borders will be secured. This will weaken the Macedonians and allow to capture key Dacian cities easily.
I thus contest senator Linkowicius words : "you have much more to learn about grand strategic plans". I believe that a short war with Illirya will be a lot more beneficial than having all of our forces in Narbo. War with Cartage does not depend on the end of a peace treaty as we can make them declare war on us at any time with their stranded Eques Numidicus in Sicilia.

Indeed. Illyria proved quite a FL farm for me when I first discovered that strategy! It also seems the foreign nationals tend to be less well asssimilated once their country is totally subdued (they become a peacefull minority, like in the case of Epirus) which is actaully great.

Bottom line, From Consul Linkowicius' second term we shall have a grading system. It is only fair to decide exactly how before he goes in action.

*SPQR chronicles of an aging Senator, with Dictator lust :king:.*

captain beaver: Don´t take my criticism personally. It was senator Linkowicius´s words from the senate to the consul Castor. Everyone seems to write nice speeches and immerse alot so I felt the need to do the same and defend the republic against a tendency of dictatorship. We were 2 or 3 i think speaking against actions in the east.

the naval debacle: I see now that you (WE) had a stroke of bad luck there.
Maybe we shouldnt attack pirates if we cant end movement in port or under the protection of the quinquiremis summa?

All in all you played well. :goodjob:

Drendor

I think the senator is too hard on himself. His only sin was to rush ahead without senatorial consent. His territorial gains were quite impressive and his tally of FL's equally so. Those who would cry that it was lucky should remember that fortune is the greatest friend to all great generals.
I vote yes also to the grading system although I fear I may be an eventual victim of the system as I would rate my playing skills as modest at the best of times. But it wil add more flavour and that can't be bad.

captain beaver: Don´t take my criticism personally. It was senator Linkowicius´s words from the senate to the consul Castor. Everyone seems to write nice speeches and immerse alot so I felt the need to do the same and defend the republic against a tendency of dictatorship. We were 2 or 3 i think speaking against actions in the east.

the naval debacle: I see now that you (WE) had a stroke of bad luck there.
Maybe we shouldnt attack pirates if we cant end movement in port or under the protection of the quinquiremis summa?

All in all you played well. :goodjob:

Drendor
Oh ok! Well I guess I didn't see it that way. I was more under the impression that it was really your opinion that I lacked foresight because I think you were the only one of the 3 that made direct accusations. At least we cleared that up. No harm done then. :)

Well it seems my journey to drunkeness last night was a complete success. :p

I am going to post the saved game now and give my report in a few hours. I still think I need to sober up some to be able to complete it in a coherent fasion :lol:

Sufficient to say we are at war with Carthago. I have taken the cities of Valentia Edetanorum and Saguntum, and most of our armies are in those two cities. I will have a more detailed report later on this day.

122015

I didn't want to keep Senator Monarchus from his duties. ;)

Waah, that a lot of text!!! Of a great readibility, folks. You are amazing me - this is as good reading as it could be!

Quick asnwer to some questions concerning Olivero's consulship:

Mistyped missing legion: it is XIV not XIX.
Funditores - I stopped building them for I needed garrison - din't think much about spoiling food, as I said, I am not a very professional civ player ;) I am glad to learn though!

I have to increase the defense bonus of Bovianum even more - gosh what will it takes to stop the Roman legions long enough?

"No animosity with TEUTA!!?", screams Senator Olivero, his faced tainting with a very unhealthy yet royal deep purple colour. He sudenly collapses over his seat, crushing follow senators in a quite unpleasant manner.

For the grading system, I can agree, but I think (after playing my consulship) that 10 turns should be considered as the minimum time of play. Below that, it will impossible to carry-out something significant in one consulship. Let's say from next round, starting with Drendor, a consul is named for 12 turns, which can be reduced to 10 turns or increased to 14 turns if the Senate agree so with a majority. I also tend to agree that pure luck related results should not play a role in the assement of the consulship so as not to encourage reloads.

Also, I recon it is not always easy to wait for an vote and endorsement from the Senate for the consul's actions, especially when there is a need/will for fast turns. A broad direction set by the Senate, for a timeframe suiting the Consul's mandate lenght, is very much needed, so as to avoid the situation where Cpt. Beaver was, with a war asked by the Senate taking only 5 turns and nothing to do for the next 5. Senator Castor's actions are forgivable as his achievements were great, but his infraction should not set a precedent, at least not until we reach the imperial times.

It is let to me to also ask the Senate to forgive my honnest mistake as well (that ugly RoP-rape of the Gauls)...

Which legion, manned with brave Ariminum men, is under the genius leadership of Varius, son's of Olivero?

Senators close to great swelling carcass of Senator Olivero can hear him muttering: "I TOLD you about the piracy problem! I TOLD YOU! DEATH TO TEUTAaaa!"

I will take a look on the latest BIQ, for I am very curious of last consuls achievements! Look forward to your report Consul Gaius, once Bacus has left you sober.

Letters to the Senate

Winter, 225 BC
I have claimed power of Consul for no less than a month, yet I am compelled to attend war councils not of my doing. A significant force of Legio formations and Auxiliary formations are poised to invade northern Illyria. The exact numbers are 1 Consular Army, 3 Legio Units, 3 Eques Units, 7 Velites Units, and 1 Ballista Unit. This contingent was sent by the late Senator Castor, as he deemed it necessary to follow his own 'brilliance' and not heed the wishes of the Senate. None can argue his effectiveness as a superb tactician, but one wonders if glimpses of grandeur were within his eyes. No matter, as I must finish events in motion, irregardless of the outcome.

Nothing much happened on my way from Rome to Ravenna. Though I did find it curious to see a great building being constructed in Pisae. I believe Consul Castor had deemed it worthy to build this monstrosity of a lighthouse. I put an end to that and send all the masons and laborers to training in a new Velites formation. These trained men should come in handy, more than a great pile of stone and wood.

Spring, 224
Boarder skirmishes with Illyrian forces are started in earnest. Preliminary reports from scouts indicates a force of 3 Pedites formation being sent from Savaria to the north and 3 Pedites formation from Salonae in the south. I have deployed 1 Legio and 1 Eques formation to combat 2 Pedites formation to the west of Aquileia. Legio unit engaged a Pedites unit and was victorious, with only light casualties. Eques unit was again victorious over the Pedites unit, but suffered heavy casualties. I have sent my 7 Velites units to harass a Pedites unit to the south of Aquileia. The Velites have met with minimum success, inflicting only light casualties to the Pedites unit. It seems that Queen Teuta underestimates our strength and determination of our Legions, much to her folly. What else can you expect from a woman?

The Senate has sent reports from the governors of Corfinium and Neapolis, that each has trained a Velite formation. Inform the governors that all is well in hand, and I am not in need of reinforcements. Tell the governors of Neapolis and Corfinium to send these units to Narbo. Their is disturbing new about raiding activities in the area. Reports are sketchy at best, but sources say that these raiding parties are coming from Gallic lands.

Representatives from Carales have arrived to me will ill news. The governor reports of riots in the streets, Carthaginian foreign national stirring up mis content. I have advised the governor of Carales that I am sending 5 Legio units from Lilybaem. They will make port in Carales on their way to Narbo. I have sent a letter to the commanding officer informing him to quell any such uprising while he is there. We cannot have the former citizen of Carthage thinking that we are weak, and they can dispense justice as they see fit.

I have given orders to the generals to fortify the island of Sicily with 5 Legio units, 5 Miles Socius units, and 6 Velites units. One can never be sure of the intentions of Phoenicians dogs. Reports of Carthagian navy movement have been coming out of Agrigentum of late. I must inquire into this further.

Fall, 224 BC
Disturbing rumor are coming in from Carthaginian territory in Hispania. I have received letters from reliable resources that a large contingent of units are massing in or around Carthago Nova. It seems that Hannibal Barca is up to something, yet I do not know what. I will look further into this matter after I have dealt with Illyria.

My forces are now poised outside the walls of Aquileia. This force consist of 1 Consular Army, 3 Legio units, 3 Eques units, 7 Velite units, and 1 Ballista unit. The city of Aquileia will fall within a year, you have my word on that.

I have commission the building of a Ballista unit in Neapolis. These units have shown great success in the past and it is high time we train and utilized more. My personal goal of setting up great Templum in all major cities in Italia has commenced. I have ordered the governor of Corfinium to have his masons and laborers start the constructions of a Templum. Such religious activities will do well to make the local population content with life... and the actions of Rome.

Spring, 223
Though the camp is well stock with food and fuel, it has been an arduous wait for spring. I have given the command to siege the town of Aquileia. Reports of the garrison strength of Aquileia stand around 4 Praesidium units and 4 Pedites units. Battle ensued for many days, but were are victorious and have capture the Illyrian city of Aquileia. My Consular army lead the initial charge, managing to destroy a Praesidium unit while only have light casualties inflicted. Similar success was gain by a Velite unit, defeating a Pedites unit while only suffering light casualties. Though our success was not without failure. Two Velites units were destroyed by and equal number of Pedites units. Another 2 Velites units were routed with sever casualties on both sides. As the battle was engaged, 2 Eques units were able to defeat the severely injured Pedites units with light to moderate casualties. I sent 2 Legio units to storm the western wall, while a contingent of 2 Velites units attack the southern wall. My tactic worked flawless as the Legio and Velites units smashed the last remaining 3 Praesidium and 1 Pedites units left in the city. The city is ours!

I was able to acquire a number of Illyrian slaves from this encounter. I have send them with a number of Celtic slaves to build a road to this newly acquired city. I must garrison my units in this city for the winter as their is still great amount of resistance from the local population. Hmmm. I wonder what Queen Queta is contemplating right now?

A report came from Carales, telling me of the success of the Legion quelling the uprising. I
have sent back a letter of congratulations and that the commanding officer is free to continue his voyage to Palma. It seems that a Velites unit was left for garrison, yet it was not reported to me by the governor. I have ordered the Velites to embark on the journey with the Legio units. I have order that 2 Corvus units along with the transported troops sailing off from Carales.

Our current treaties with the Iberics is a good one. Legions from Narbo will very soon have the road connecting Narbo to Tarraco complete. It will allow us to reinforce this area with great efficiency when the need arises. I have given the order for 4 Velites units, 2 Eques units, and 1 Funditor unit to be transported to the Iberic/Carthaginian boarder. Investigations into the resent reports of troop movement have me concerned with the ill intentions of our restless southern neighbours.

Fall, 223 BC
It seems the Queen of Illyria has not the stomach for war, though this is merely no more than a boarder scuffle. She has offer treaties of peace and I am not in a mind to refuse. I am not a weak negotiator as I have demanded compensation for my time spent here in Illyria. For a treaty of peace I have procure 1 gold per turn and Queen Teuta entire treasury of 13 gold. It is a small gain indeed! The Greeks must be bleeding themselves dry with battles against its enemies. This Illyria is a fine land. Mayhaps we shall return here some day to claim this land for ours. Was it not Senator Olivero that had estates in this area? I shall go visit upon him if I am able to stay my work.

Letters have been received by many different governors of late. Reports from Barium state that their work on a Fabrica is nearly finished. It would seem this shall increase their productivity as it will allow them to build their own tools. I have ordered the governor to begin work on a Templum immediately. This newly acquired productivity should go well for establishing the Teachings of the Gods. It would seem that Pisae has completed training a Velites unit. I have given leave to the governor to continue with the training and recruitment of such units. It seems the governor of Palma was able to complete a near impossible task, the training and armament of the islanders into a coherent Praesidium unit. Wonders will never cease! I have instructed the governor of Palma to commence with the production of a Fabric, considering how much it has improved Barium. It seems that our governor of the treacherous city of Bovianum had design to train the local population to a Praesidium unit. I have given order to cease and desist on this course of action. I have instructed the governor of Bovianum to start production of a Aquaeductus to keep busy the hands of vile Samnites. I have sent a Miles Socius to garrison the city of Bovianum and to keep an eye on the local population. Both the cities of Carales and Panormus have finished their training of Praesidium unit. I have directed Carales to start the building of a Fabrica and Panormus to continue training a Praesidium unit.

It would seem that my time in Aquilea, Illyria in general, is almost done. I head to the city of Narbo to directly supervise the construction of the road and rumors or raids and army buildups. Most of the local population has been quell to peaceful unresistance and the train of this mock "foreign national" Legio unit is well under way.

Spring, 222 BC
On my travel to Narbo, I have been contemplating my endeavors into Illyrian territory. Did I go far enough? Should have I continue until the capital Salonae? It would seem that the late Consul Castor has a larger plan indeed. In his vision Salonae, along with Massilia, Syracusae, and Carthago Nova, would have become great port of importance. I prayed to the gods that I would have had such wisdom as to come to this conclusion earlier. Yet such insight was not made to me until such time was gone. History repeats itself and future reveals itself not.

My time in Narbo has been informative indeed. The small contingent of Auxiliary formations I have send to the boarder bear disturbing news. I moderate force of 6 Phalanx Libianus units are spotted, not to the south in Carthago territory, but northwest of Tarraco! I like this not and will sure to have meaningful words with the Iberic delegates. The road between Narbo and Tarraco was complete at last. Their is a problem, one that angers me to no ends. The Iberics have taken upon themselves to guard the bridge north of Tarraco. They are not any to pass without payment of duties to keep such an important and expensive bridge in service. Bah! Bandits in Iberic clothing is what they are. The Warchief of the Iberics has much to answer for!

My Consular army and 3 Legio units have joined forces already stationed at Narbo. The remaining task force I left within Aquileia to regain the strength and numbers. While en route to Narbo I have requested from the Senate a general increase of taxes to 90% for 3 years. It would seem our expenses abroad have become unreasonable. Such a high tax should be able to alleviate most of the burden our armies inflict upon the treasury.

I have ordered another expedition into the treacherous water of the Ionian Sea. I believe this is a third such attempt to make contact with other leaders from Asia Minor. I do not know if I am repeating the follies of the past, but it must be done for the greater good of the Republic. I have in the port of Croton, 3 Corvus units and 1 Triremes unit for the expedition. I pray for their protecting at sea from raiding pirates and hellish weather.

Fall, 222 BC
The Carthaginian forces by Tarraco have been spotted advancing north to Narbo. Similar reports have come in from Sicily of Carthaginian navy activity off the coast of Agrigentum. I was in the mind of sending an envoy to Hannibal demanding the removal of his troops in the area, but I though better of it. Treaties sign 20 years ago are about to come ahead and my forces are not nearly marshalled enough if this comes to war. I have instead sent a envoy to Hannibal stating we wish to renew the peace treaty, extending another 20 years.

Roma engineers have completed another Ballista unit for deployment. These Ballista will be of great service indeed in any upcoming conflict. I have put a request into the Senate about the construction of a Praetor Headquarters. It is high time we started having a greater influence into the areas of our direct influence. Genua has finished train a local garrison of a Praesidium unit. Because of this cities's backwater condition, I am force to build a temporary place of worship. I have ordered the building of a Delubrum, bring a place for these barbarians to worship true gods. The reinforcement of Sicily goes unabated. Agrigentum has complete training of a Praesidium unit for garrison duty. I have given instructions to the governors of Sicily to keep fortifying our position, and Agrigentum continues training local citizen to a Praesidium unit.

Spring 221 BC
The convoy of ships on diplomatic mission to the east has been launched from Croton. I pray to Neptune to watch over them and Mars to strike down all those that oppose them in the open waters.

Reports are coming in slow and much is at a stand still. I have deploy 7 Legio units and Ballista unit to the boarder. Another contingent of 2 Funditor units, 1 Velites, and 1 Miles Socius have landed at the boarder, from Palma. It would seem that war with Carthago is inevitable. I am well aware of Senate's wishes for discretion on these matters, yet I am of an opinion this war will start, regardless of our actions. It would seem only time will tell and the large Legion formation that will be fortified at their boarder in Hispania.

I have reversed my decision about the Samnites still inhabiting Bovianum. I have order the rapid training of a mock Legio unit, comprising solely of Samnites Greeks. Though the infusion of money to complete the training of this unit has cost us 84 gold, I do believe the cannon fodder that the represent will serve us well in the future.

Fall 221 BC
A trader from Sparta has reported seeing our convoy being attack by Navis Piratica units. He reports that 2 Navis Piratica units set upon our ships and sunk 1 Corvus unit. Another Corvus was able to repel the attack of the 2nd Navis Piratica and sink it. It seems this mission to the east bears ill tidings. We shall see what becomes of this convoy as I wish them all speed and luck.

On the home front, the engineers has produced another Ballista unit. I have informed the Capuan engineer to keep up their production of the Ballista units, for their need will be great in future events. The dry docks of Neapolis have finish up a Corvus unit and it is ready to sail. Our mock Legio unit has completed its training in Bovianum. Let the sons of dogs be nothing more than fodder to those that would oppose us!

Spring 220 BC
My fellow senators, it would seem no manor of diplomacy will persuade Carthago to cease their match northward. I have sent an envoy to Carthago to makes demands to the immediate removal of forces to their boarder that are marching towards Narbo. The dogs have sent back his head with the words "Never" carved into his forehead. I bit dramatic, but a clear sign that Carthago answer is war. Please give regards and condolences to the family of our late envoy.

I have given orders to the remaining forces that I had to leave behind in Aquileia to starting marching towards Narbo. I have sent reinforcement to the boarder from Narbo and the transports from Lilybaeum have arrived to dispense of their troops at the camps. This gives us a force of 12 Legio units, 1 Miles Socius unit, 2 Eques units, 6 Velites units, and 1 Ballista unit. I have commanded the immediate fortification of position when the Legion formations are able.

Fall 220 BC
It would seem that Hannibal was indeed busy in Carthago Nova. An elite force, this Exercitus Barcae, surprised attacked a Legio unit building palisades across the river, completely destroying it to a man. It would seem our spies have been ferreted out of their holes, as we had only rumors of such an army. This new Hannibal army unit was indeed satisfied with the destruction of the Legio unit, as it did not test our fortification anymore. To the north, we were set upon an advance raiding party of Carthaginian Equitatus. These Equitatus were able to moderately wound our Legio unit in that area, before being routed with serious casualties.

It would seem that I have been lax in reports of troop movements of the Carthaginians. Their are reports of a unit of Numidian Eques riding straight for Syracusae, and inflicting moderate casualties to a Legio unit stationed there. It was routed as sever casualties were inflicted, riding off in the direction of Agrigentum. The units garrisoned at Agrigentum, were not so fortunate. Though the assaulting units from the ships of Carthago were indeed severely injured, they managed to destroy 1 Praesidium unit and 1 Miles Socius unit garrisoned there. I had opted not to follow the plan laid out to me by the Senate. Where I was to ungarrison Syracusae to lure Carthago to a easy jewel, in which Carthago was to send most of its ships and troops to that area, where my Velites units were to bombard those ships and the Corvus units to destroy them when sufficiently damaged. It would seem some of the Phoenician tacticians do not know of the saying "Run away, live to fight another day". The Numidian Eques, severely injured as they were, launch another attack on Agrigentum and were systematically destroyed.

I have not abandoned my quest for infusing spiritual enlightenment in the Republic. Ravenna is now garrisoned with a Praesidium unit, to which I have order the immediate creation of a Delubrum.

It would seem that our convoy to the east has met with considerable success. The ships of Rome were engaged in battle when a Carthaginian Quinqueremis Summa unit arrived at the scene. Two Navis Piratica unit detached its attacks from our ships and attack the Quinqueremis Summa, to which the Carthaginian ships responded by sinking these units. Our ships were able to destroy one Navis Piratica and capture the other, at which time Carthaginian ship deemed it prudent to attack our convoy. These Carthaginians were rightfully sunk by our forces when it decided to attack our new ships, though not before it completely destroyed our newly acquired Quinqueremis.

Spring 219 BC
As war is upon us I have no time for any lengthy letters, as all of my time is spend on logistical papers, concise reports, and direct orders.

Here is how the war with Carthago is commencing:
* 9 Legios complete Fortress to defend against Exercitus Barcae
* Praesidium units were rushed in Agrigentum, Lilybaeum, and Syracusae for 224 gold
* Production in Capua and Neapolis changed to Miles Socius
* 7 Corvus and 2 capture Quinqueremis (Rome) defeat 5 Quinqueremis and 3 Cumba (Carthago) near Agrigentum
* 2 Quinqueremis were lost to Carthagian ships
* Amphibious assault from Carthagian ships on Agrigentum results in the loss of 2 Legio, 1 Velites, 1 Miles Socius
* 6 Velites, 3 Funditor, and Ballista bombard Exercitus Barcae, causing severe damage to unit

Fall 219 BC
* Legio that was fortifed was able to defeat Exercitus Barcae!
* Aleria, Agrigentum, and Carales are rioting, and given entertainment by governors
* Lilybaeum and Syracusae finish Praesidium unit and keep building Praesidium units
* Neapolis completes Miles Socius unit and continues to build Miles Socius units
* Mediolanum completes Praesidium unit, ordered to build Delubrum
* Corvus is defeated by Navis Piratica; yet makes contact with Piratae civilization

Spring 218 BC
* Cispaline and Illyric Wars tech researched; tax rate changed to 70%; researching Second Punic War (part 1)
* 5 Velites (Rome) destroy 2 Eques Numidicus and 1 Praesidium Numidicus (Carthago) by Agrigentum
* 3 Corvus defeats 2 Quinqueremis Summa and 1 Cumba by Agrigentum
* 8 Velites and Ballista units bombard Phalanx Libianus by Narbo; 2 Consular Army, 1 Legio, 1 Miles Socius, 1 Eques units defeat 5 Phalanx Libianus by Narbo; 2 Servus are captured
* 12 Velites units are deployed from Narbo and heading to units to the south
* Convoy in the east make contact with Syria civilization; would have made contact with Aegyptus but 'forgot' to contact them first
* Aleria riots are quelled; production is changed from Praesidium to Portus
* A force of 11 Legios, 6 Velites, 3 funditors, 1 Ballista, 1 Miles Socius, and 1 Eques are positioned to attack Saguntum

Fall 218 BC
* Praesidium in Agrigentum defeats 2 Phalanx Libianus amphibious assault
* Capua completes Miles Socius, ordered to build Ballista
* Navis Piratica destroy 1 Corvus an 1 Triremes in the east; expedition to the east is finished
* Mare Nostrum spawns a Corvus unit; Corvus sent to Syracusae
* Massilia completes Praesidium, ordered to build Portus Naves.
* Carales, Agrigentum, Aleria have order restored

Spring 217 BC
* 5 Velites bombard Quinqueremis Summas; Corvus defeats a Quinqueremis Summa by Agrigentum
* 3 Funditors and Ballista bombard Saguntum, Moenia is destroyed; 6 Velites and 2 Eques defeats 5 Praesidium Mercennarius and 1 Equitatus, 2 Velites are destroyed; Saguntum captured and "liberates" 4 gold
* production is changed in Neapolis from Miles Socius to Ballista

Fall 217 BC
* A Carthagian force of 5 Phalanx Libianus, 1 Praesidium Mercennarius, 1 Eques is north of Saguntum
* Tarentum completes Fabrica, ordered to build Granaria
* Pisae completes Velites, ordered to build Velites
* Resistance has ending in Saguntum
* 11 Velites and Legio units make landfall near Saguntum

Spring 216 BC
* A force of 7 Legios, 3 Funditors, 2 Eques, 1 Ballista, 12 Velites is striking range of Valentia Edetanorum
* 11 Velites bombard Valentia Edetanorum and destroy the Moenia
* 4 Corvus defeats 2 Quinqueremis Summa and Cumba off Agrigentum, 1 Corvus destroyed
* 2 Consular Army, 3 Legio, 3 Ballista, 1 Eques units transported from Narbo, heading to Saguntum

Fall 216 BC
* Narbo completes Fabrica, ordered to build Praesidium
* Croton completes Granaria, ordered to build Templum
* Velite scout in Iberic territory is routed by Phalanx Libianus

Spring 215 BC
* 3 Funditor and 1 Ballista bombard units in Valentia Edetanorum, injured 3 units; 6 Velites defeats 2 Praesidium, 2 Miles Alarius Celticus and Funditor, 1 Velites destroy and 1 Velites routed; Valentia Edetanorum
*
* 2 Consular Army, 4 Velites and 3 Eques defeats 5 Phalanx Libianus an 1 Eques by Saguntum, 2 Velites and Eques are routed

Summer 215 BC
My travels back to Roma to the new election of a Consul, I have begun contemplating all I have accomplished in my tenure as Consul. A short yet successful campaign against Illyria has netted Rome new holdings in the east. Yet I wonder if I ended the campaign to early, accepted peace too quickly. Would it been in Rome's best interest to have acquire the city of Salonae. Only time will tell what others will think of my decision on this event.

The initial war with Carthage has gone greater than expected. Through my prowess on the field of battle, I was able to acquire two Carthaginian cities with minimum losses to our armies. Many of our Legion formation in the area are elite and in high morale. Through me, I have left the future Consul in a position to claim the rest of the Carthaginian cities in Hispania. Though I do have concern about location most of Rome's military strength to the area. Was it wise of me to do so? Could a contingent of troops been deployed somewhere else of interests?

The Senate had plans made years ago of a expedition to the east to establish embassies in civilizations there. Two Consuls before me met with considerable delays due to pirates. I was able to contact 2 civilizations yet the fleet that was sent there was destroyed by pirates. Was the cost in ships worth the contact with other civilizations? Should I have build the embassies in Piratae and Syria? I will leave it to the Senate to decide if this course of action I have taken was appropriate.

My mandate I had set forward when elected to Consul is of moderate success, I wonder if the next Consul will allow religion to flourish. Or will it be decided by the Senate that each city which is build religious centers could be used to construct other buildings. These are the ideas and thoughts that run through my head as I travel.

The was is clear for the next Consul. I have no parting advise to give, as each mandate should be made fresh with each new Consul. May the gods guide the new Consul to great victories and great wisdom!

__________________________________________________ _______________

Gah! That took me waaaaay to long to write. Hopefully the effort was worth it. I think in the future I will curb my creativity for writing just a little. :crazyeye:

Congratulation Consul Gaias, you can now come back to your good office of Pontifex Maximus; be sure you will be always invited to stop by Senator's Olivero estate when on your way to visit Illyria again.

GREAT report Gaias, it was pleasure to read through it, certainly worth the effort. I agree it takes an awful lot of time to write this trough (it actually took me more time to wite my report than playing my turns).

Hannibal has been an awful deception -- I am very dissapointed even though we have to remember he is very much weakened in the Easy Version. It seems Carthago days are close to over. With so many good consuls around, maybe should we have undertook the Hard Version instead for a more dramatic challenge... Anyway, we will see.

Well if I wasn't trying to keep a concise short notes about my every action playing my turns, I would have finished up sooner than I did. Keeping a detailed record of your game play is a time consuming activity!

I like to think that my easy defeat of the Hannibal unit was through superior tactics, logistics, and positioning. I WAS extremely lucky with the Hannibal unit used all its MP getting to were I was positioned, thus allowing me to bombard it with 6 Velites, 3 Funditors and a Ballista. Had it been able to move another square away, things could have been much worse for me.

I must congratulate you on your efforts in both matters of gameplay and writing, Pontifex Gaias. Your end of rule left me with exactly what I needed to enjoy a good war: a massive and rested army, very well positioned. I will therefore finish all Carthaginian influence in the peninsula and, if I'm lucky corner the Iberians to only a few cities as well.

I have to live up to your standards although I think Hannibal was WAY too lame. You haven't even lost a legio to him which is unacceptable. Maibe 16 att and 30 def for the easy version and 20 att and 50 def for the hard version is more accurate. I might look a bit radical but think that most of the time he will be alone and still he must take all Northern Italy. Even so with the modern ballistas he will eventually sucumb but at least he should fight his way to Massilia and see the ALPS for God's sake!! Delicii Capuae is useless this way. Besides, think that even for a bad player and even if he marches through some cities, once he will not be able to assemble a storong garrison and you will defeat him right away.

I shall now proceed to the long awaited festivities of consul investiture. It is a pity grading cannot start from right now to commemorate the past rules which have been quite reassuring. We are ahead of history I guess.

The sun of Apollo has risen again in this 540'th year over our Eternal City. The festivities are more glamorous than ever as the new consul, Publius Iulius Monarchus of the House of Iulii, favoured among the Hawks for his efforts of reform in the ranks of the legions, makes his appearance in his sedan chair, surrounded by the Lictores. But dark clouds cover the sun from the west.

The consul's age is showing just slightly but his determination is unchanged. All agree that his longest mandate as a senator gives him the right for the next consulship as the fittest to rule in times of war. The people have been waiting for this moment. Some are fearfull of the terrible dread the consul's eyes inflict, while others know that only such an iron fist can put an end to Carthaginian demands of land and water. Too long have the peaceful consuls tolerated interference in our affairs by the worshipers of Baal. Even the gods favor the new consul as earlier this morning the priests of Mars have seen good omens in the image of an eagle hunting down a dove.

His speech is short, stoic. His resolution unmatched. He shall not rest until all the lands of Carthage are conquered. The enemy is stronger than ever. His leader, Hannibal Barca, although defeated, has striken deep into the fearfull Legions. Word has it he has returned to Carthago Nova to recuperate. Unanimously, all senators offer the mandate of Dictator Perpetuus to the consul and ask for a declaration of Martial Law in these times of strife. The consul reluctantly accepts the dictatorship. His actions shall speak for him. The festivities are short as he sets for the road to Narbo through the cheers of the crowd. Rome will be tended by his loyal assistant, his right hand and heir, proconsul Publius Iulius Monarchus the Younger.

And as the sun fades into the west, following the great army assembled and lead by the newly appointed dictator all the hopes of the Republic go with the brave men...

No suggestions? Then I guess we will go to war with the impudent Iberians once we get rid of the Carthaginians.

I verily well guessed that you would go after Iberia, as that was an influence to my decision of transporting most of Rome's units there. It seems like the most logical choice and fits in with the Senates earlier choice of concentrating on the west.

Good luck and looking forward to hearing your report!

Gaias: A truly awesome story you have told! :goodjob: I must comment it more when I´m not so sleepy.

the_Monarch: Yes I guess its wise to go after the Iberians after our campaign with Carthage is finsihed. I guess we settle for peace when we have taken all of Carthage holdings in Spain? And we demand a city in north africa in the peace negotiations?
So the war against the Iberians will take place during the time we are at peace with Carthage, meaning 20 turns.

I suggest a limited war against the celts in Spain, where we only capture the most fertile and productive parts. I made the mistake in my last single campaign of putting too much effort in capturing the most western parts of the Iberian lands. Those lands will experience alot of corruption even with praetor and civitas.
While we fight a limited war against the Iberians, how about fighting the Gauls in France at the same time? If we could capture the cities close to Massilia it would be a huge boost to our economy since those lands are fertile river lands with hills and they are relatively close to Rome.
When we have captured 2-3 Gaul cities and 5-6 Iberian cities we make peace and start the third and last war with Carthage?

@senator Gaias: Indeed it seemed a great opportunity. Thank you for makig such a wise choice and amassing most of the troops there. I used them all to what I hope will be a satisfactory effect to everyone. :thumbsup:.

Gaias: A truly awesome story you have told! :goodjob: I must comment it more when I´m not so sleepy.

the_Monarch: Yes I guess its wise to go after the Iberians after our campaign with Carthage is finsihed. I guess we settle for peace when we have taken all of Carthage holdings in Spain? And we demand a city in north africa in the peace negotiations?
So the war against the Iberians will take place during the time we are at peace with Carthage, meaning 20 turns.

I suggest a limited war against the celts in Spain, where we only capture the most fertile and productive parts. I made the mistake in my last single campaign of putting too much effort in capturing the most western parts of the Iberian lands. Those lands will experience alot of corruption even with praetor and civitas.
While we fight a limited war against the Iberians, how about fighting the Gauls in France at the same time? If we could capture the cities close to Massilia it would be a huge boost to our economy since those lands are fertile river lands with hills and they are relatively close to Rome.
When we have captured 2-3 Gaul cities and 5-6 Iberian cities we make peace and start the third and last war with Carthage?

Well let's just say that both wars are over. I took all the cities in Spain. Not only the Carthaginian but most of the Iberian too. 11 in total. Just 3 Iberian cities are left. I usually believe that once you go to war with a faction you should completely eliminate it as you cannot trust them anymore. So I made peace with Iberia because we might want to go to Illyria in a couple of turns but left only 3 cities so it might fall easily on a single attack.

This time I can say the west is finally and totally subdued and, as somebody I know would gladly back me up on this one I'd finally go east. Wouldn't want to tackle the Gauls now as they outnumber us (or so the advisor says) and we should get ever closer to Greece and Pergamum. As for my report... well enjoy:

It is a grimm day for the Republic! All seems lost as the divine dictator Publius Iulius Monarchus Africanus has passed away. Will Rome be plonged into civil war as his son, Publius Iulius Monarchus the younger will try to take control of the magistrature of dictator as well or will he allow a new consul to be elected? Fortunatelly as the grief overcomes Monarchus the Younger he does not wish to temper the gods and attempt to overthrow the Republic. Although his father was dictator for life for more than 10 years his main goal was the good of his people. Monarchus the Younger will just have to wait for his turn to rule (again).

But let us not mourn the departed for too long. His rule will be remebered as glamorous in the eyes of others. He, of course had the help of his son, the young proconsul, who undertook several reforms for the benefit of Rome. His younger son was appointed admiral over the last few and certainly fared better at some aspects. Although Romans have never been to keen on sailing, this young admiral proved he was bold beyond his ears and established embassies with Syria, Aegyptus and the Nabathean city of Petra with no naval losses. All of them were regarded as friends to Rome and are Polite to us. They have agreed to pay tribute for a RoP and Rome's coffers are full. So it was a perfect foreign affairs success.

But the young admiral proved even better: he perfected the art of the corvus, more effectivelly enslaving Quinqueremes than any of his predecessors. He never lost a battle and now, the fleet is proud to have 4 new free support quinqueremis.

And yet, the young admiral was the least successful of the family! His older brother ruled Rome while his father was in campaign against the Carthaginian mercenaries. His reforms included an industrial reformation which allowed for the construction of Fabricae and large Aqueducts in most of the cities. He also favoured culture and the gods so no less than 3 temples were built during his government. His high cultural ideas matched his father's military successes as, as soon as the first punic war was complete he undertook the more liberal ways of educating the masses rather than enslaving our own folk. For now, the young proconsul decrees, we shall rely entirelly on foreign slaves. His greatest achievement still remains the completion of Circus Maximus in honor of his father.

And now, for the summary of the life of the one who could be one of the greatest generals Rome has yet seen: Publius Iulius Monarchus Africanus Magnus. His predecessor, general and pontifex Gaias Felix was a great strategic leader. His first victory over Hannibal was resounding. But the Barcas have regrouped in Carthago Nova where his brother, Hasdrubal tried to stand against the might of Rome. But long enough have the Romans expected in defensive. It is time to take to the steel! The first reformation was that of the legions: the consular armies where renamed into Legio Consularis Iulii (after the house of the dictator) and Legio Consularis Brutii after the other greatest family in Rome. He proceeded to assign Publius Scipio, a young memeber of the Hawks as Second in comand. He set his headquarters in Pisae, strategycally close to both Rome and the Northern borders.

His reforms in defensse of the cities included scraping most of the obsolete Moenias in all cities than now lied way outside the conflict areas or where achieving Urbs status. Only three where kept in Carales, Narbo and Cartenna, the one in Narbo should be scrapped the Moment the Aqueduct is complete. The same goes for the Arx Litoralis which remain (and hopefully only for a couple of turns) in Carales, Agrigentum and Lilybaeum. Thus the great general proved his economic skills by earning Rome more than 150 gold right away with more than 15 gpt due to less maintenance. He favours a future appointment of a new Praetor in Rome, now that his leadership helped almost double the empire in the short years of his rule.

Let us commemorate his conquest before we engage in the yearly chronicles of his reign for trully you will see they where worth it: The whole of Iberia is now Roman! For, along Narbo, Saguntum and Valentia, all the cities of Carthago Nova, Malacca, Gades, Hispalis, Tarraco, Pax Iulia, Emerita Augusta, Scallabis, the remote goldmine at Lucus Augusti and even the African port of Cartenna all bowed to the dictator's sword -11 new cities in total.

His legions will remeber him forever now that he's gone and his son finished the Circus Maximus in Rome in his honor. And now for an unfolding of the events as seen in the chronicles of the well reknown historian Gladius Superbissimus:

It is the winter of 215 BC when the dictator finally arrives in Iberia to asess the damages done by the rampaging Hannibal. He happily discovers the previous consul did his best to stand against the evil son oh Moloh and he warmly congratulates him on his victory. The army is eager to fight and revenge is at hand!

214 BC. After instating the Martial Law and decreeing the above reforms, dictator Monarchus proceeds to amass his troops close to the city of Carthago Nova. He changes order from Ballista to Legio in Capua and Neapolis. His son and admiral sinks a cumba and enslaves a quinqeremis after previous velite bombardment. Quiet before the storm. His fleet is tranded beyond the reach of the harbor. A sound in the night can only mean one thing: Pirates! But the young admiral stays calm and manages to capture yet another Numid Quinquereme!

213 BC. A short break as the proconsul inaugurates the new Temple at Arminium. In the second part of the year Legio Consularis Iulii lead by the dictator finally crushes Hasdrubal. The city is ours with no losses. The city holds a Portus Naves to the joy of the admiral ho comissions his triremae fleet there. A legio is turned to Elite and gets the apelative Monarchicii. No rest as the march continues. The Legios camp outside Malacca for winter.

212 BC. Malacca falls to the besiegers, no wonder. Still no losses. Some units suffer casualties but only minor. An eques becomes elite and joins the Monarchicii elites.

211 BC. A new Legio appears in Rome. The proud city of Gades is taken with just one velite as casualty! Nothing can stop the now very famous dictator. Meanwhile, back in Sicily a large Carthaginian fleet (3 quinqueremis and one cumba) is spotted. The wise admiral believes it is to great a risk to venture so far offshore. The city of Messana will lure the fleet within Bombardment range next year.

210 BC. Just as expected, the Carthaginians fall for the bait. Bombardment is devastating and the corvii finish them off, ensalving two out of four ships! All hail the new admiral! His father pushes on and takes Hispalis again with just one velite as a casualty. He becomes a hero. The Carthaginian envoy is sent to beg for peace. We allow it only for the people become weary of the war. The prize is high: the city of Cartenna, 60 gold and 1 gpt. We meet the barbaric Numidians, not worth spending money for an embassy. The had already lost Thelepta to Carthage. We know because it was offered to us =in exchange for peace. We chose Cartenna still! A short period of peace follows, during which the dictator persoanlly attends to the opening of 2 more temples, but not for long...

209 BC. A velite scout is sent to oversee the remaining lands of Carthage and Numidia. The Iberian allies of Carthage have insulted us for the last time for trespassing into their lands. We declare war in the cheers of the crowd and take the city of Pax Iulia before the month is out. Troops are amassed on 3 separate fronts (we have spies saying the cities are very ill defended).

208 BC. Victory on two fronts of the three with the loss of just one eques (thanks to the devastating power of our siege equipment and Balearic allies - very well worth the support). Emerita Augusta and Toletum both fall within the year. Just one bellator battered by coastal bombardment remains to defend Tarraco with just 1hp!!. Unfortunatelly we will have to wait a whole year to take the city as there are no more units to take the winning shot.

207 BC. As promissed the city of Tarraco falls but not before building another bellator. The Iberians fight desperately. They sue for peace but we have not yet had enough.

206 BC. Winter has been hard. We meet what remains of the bellator force in the fortified city of Toletum just across the river. The cowards will not attack even though there is no army in the city, only full hp elite legions and cross the river tp our side. We finish them off with ease. A slaughter of 5 bellatores with no losses. It is during these years that the admiral's trireme fleet reaches safelly Alexandria and Petra. The route devised by the admiral to the south as soon as war with Carthage was over proved far more beneficial and safer from the pirates. In just 3 years he started and achieved what all others tried before him long ago! Let others say it is luck, We know it is just that the pirates cannot cross south of the high seas barrier and, therefore will have to encounter the powerfull navy of Aegyptus which protected us (as suspected) all the way to Tyre.

205 BC. The aging dictator finds no rest. He takes the city by Scallabis by surprise with his fast moving armies and cavalry. But too much boldness it seems as the gods allow for him to be wounded in battle. Although not fatal, the wound will show it's teeth and although the dictator arbitered over the peace negociacions with the Iberes which practically transformed their remaining tribes into a client state of Rome, and gave complete control of the goldmine of Lucus Augusti to the dicataor's family as a tribute, the mighty general will sucumb to his age by the end of the year. His funeral was most sobre, as was most of his life. His son gave the full ensigns of power to the next consul, ensuring the Republic will survive. His father has lived his entire life by one single creed: Strength and Honor, let history, and only her, judge his achievements...

I would, of course, back you up on that one, Consul Publius Iulius Monarchus. Going east is primordial. The Greeks are rich productive and their lands are fertile, making it a good Legio recruting ground. Plus, althought I commend Consul Gaias' actions in Illirya, I think we should have been at least at Salonae by now. But seeing our huge progress in the west, it is a reasonable tradeoff. Good work both of you.

I agree with Drendor, that a limited campaign in Iberia and Gallia will serve our purpose better. I would advise limiting to 3 or 4 cites at best in the two areas. It would best serve us to take Emerita Augusta and Gergovia, as they can build the Castrum Celticus. Along with Narbo, that would be 3 Miles Alarius Celticus units every 6 turns, upgradeable to Eques Alarius Celticus.

Yes, it is with considerable regret I did not recognise your plan of the great ports Senator Castor. Yet, the action of beseiging Salonae would have delayed the Legions 4 years before they could have fortifed our holdings in Iberia. Though I am not without the understanding that our forces already assembled in that area were great enought to subdue an opposition we found there, I do not like chance taking. I believed it was of greater wisdom to reign in Roman ambition to one state at a time.

I duly note your disagreement of actions, and will take strides to remember patience is key to understanding. It would seem that I was too clear in my vision to see the greater will. I will make it my duty to take yours and the rest of the Senates council under due consideration.

I like to think that my easy defeat of the Hannibal unit was through superior tactics, logistics, and positioning. I WAS extremely lucky with the Hannibal unit used all its MP getting to were I was positioned, thus allowing me to bombard it with 6 Velites, 3 Funditors and a Ballista. Had it been able to move another square away, things could have been much worse for me.

I didn't mean to minimize your good leadership and military genius; just that even with such a good troop setting, Hannibal should be able to find a way through and inflicts some serious casuality before being defeated. I think I will at least double the number of HP of the unit in next update of the BIQs.

@Monarchus

You make it sound so easy!!! Great job - 11 cities in 10 turns, that is indeed a feast.

It seems Senator Olivero will soon rejoin his collegue Monarchus in the grave, although the thought of going against Teuta again has slightly revived the old man. Fare well in your term, Consul Drendor!

I didn't mean to minimize your good leadership and military genius; just that even with such a good troop setting, Hannibal should be able to find a way through and inflicts some serious casuality before being defeated. I think I will at least double the number of HP of the unit in next update of the BIQs.

I agree about Hannibal. HPs are even greater. Will asure his success and atrition in time, but don't forget the attack too. My masochistic pleasure for ever higher challenges probably doesn't see eye to eye with everybody else's self preservation instinct :lol:. But still, he MUST win something.

@Monarchus

You make it sound so easy!!! Great job - 11 cities in 10 turns, that is indeed a feast.

It seems Senator Olivero will soon rejoin his collegue Monarchus in the grave, although the thought of going against Teuta again has slightly revived the old man. Fare well in your term, Consul Drendor!

Well it was nothing as pontifex Gaias provided the logistcs :blush:. The new senator Publius Iulius Monarchus the Younger will gladly fill his father's vacant space in the senate and the Hawk party. He even told me about some new ideas about going eastwards, organizing the Preator offices and, according to his brother, the admiral, favouring the upgrade of foreign quinqueremes into Quinquereme Summae. We need many of these cause what I've seen in my voyages to Egypt pretty much scared the life of me (they are loaded with ships)

About the votes, there are 3 to 1 (sorry Drendor, the consul doesn't have a say and still it would be 3 to 2). As I've said the Gauls shouldn't be upset just yet only if we are to take at least 5 of their cities pretty fast IMHO. Besides the Celtic Alarii are available only later.

I'd like to have another vote about research: I chose education over slavery to allow at least two AMPHIBIOUS Scipionii armies. If we go for Drama afterwards we might have the cheap culture generating theatre (appealing to the young scholar Monarchus) and have 3 (maibe even 4) Scipiones. What dou you say? I vote for culture now, slavery later. The Fabrica I've set up in most cities will take care of the production for now and slave unrests will be a problem if we have too many catastas. Btw where is senator Civfan?

I agree with senator Monarchus in his desire to have Education researched next. Armies are what we need and 1 Scipii army is no fair reward for researching the Punic Wars.

205BC

With only days remaining, the aged senator Civfan gives his senator ring to his son Civfanous and gives him words of advice for the comming elections. In his last public speech, Senator Civfan votes yes for Drendor's plans placed at the senate.

Due to heavy workload I wont be able to start my consul career until tomorrow.

Does the senate have any advice for the future strategies?


Consul Linkowicius


edit: I vote for education and maybe drama so that we may get 2-3 Scipio armies. Woud be nice to put Marius legions in one of them....

edit: checking the save tonight

I vote to only research education. We can use those other optional techs to have more of other armies such as Caesar or Trajan. I'll admit Trajan armies are a bit useless, but Caesar armies will be very usefull to go against Dacia, Germania, Gallia and Britannia and having 2-3 never hurts while Scipio armies become obsolete with time since after conquering all coastal cities, their special power will be useless.

Senator Castor

Trajan... useless?!? I think you must be mistaken, senator Castor. You could not have meant top say such a thing. Civil wars have been started for less!

Trajan... useless?!? I think you must be mistaken, senator Castor. You could not have meant top say such a thing. Civil wars have been started for less!
I meant useless as in not so usefull :mischief: . Sure a Trajan army will start the GA and all that, but it is its only use (beside the obvious battles it will do). A caesar army has 3 moves plus goes through forest and hills. A Scipio army is amphibious. A trajan army is... a big bad army, but without any special advantages.

Damn right it's a big bad army! Don't you forget it! (lot's of self righteous huffing and puffing, etc.)

Well for once it has no hp penalty! But still I'd go for Caesar's mobility (of course he didn't mean to offend you, senator Traianus - says the new Monarchus, apparently much more peaceful than his late father, Pluto rest fhis soul). You should get to Golden Age sooner (with the limes wonders). Senator Castor, you can still have 3 Caesars if you play your cards right (philosophy takes 12 turns and you research Dictator in 18 or more, then you use Dicator Perpetuus to advance through Age of Augustus and Commerce). I know you're gonna say Dictator is expensive but I got it in 18 turns in civil war mostly and with 10% sci rate. Let us not forget Rome is about to become an Empire so potential is big! I even wondered weather slaughtering all those poor people in a civil war was worth it or just go ahead and quick research them but 24 turns is quite a lot of time to waste...

It is with great pride that the house of Linkowicius from Capua announce to the senate that a consul has been elected from our family to lead the roman empire in this glorious age of expansion and and cultural enlightenment.

I Linkowicius junior have studied the economy and come to the conclusion that our economy is weak. For a long time we have drafted legions to spread our sphere of influence and temples to spread lights in that dark barbaric sphere.

But we need gold in those coffers to support our ever growing army and to pay the craftsmen who build the temples.

I will build even more mercators in our empire to encourage trade and crafting.
The senate in Rom will begin to organize a new system of government for our provinces called the Praetorium. We will then assign more Propraetors to fight coruption and encourage trade in our many new provinces. This reform will take time however and will not be completed until the rule of the next consul.

I see that we have a surplus of resources, mostly celtic slaves and wheat that could be exported. The merchants in Carthage offered us 100 gold straight up for a supply of celts over 20 years. I see that we have a peace agreement right now that lasts 15 years. This would mean that we get some nice addition to our empty treasury but we would have to honor the peace agreement for five MORE years. What say you? With our current weak economy we only gain 28 gold per year so extra income with trade, even with the punic dogs can be rewarding. Those extra 100 gold they would give us, means 100 gold less to pay their troops.

I respect senator Gaius reform to build more temples and honoring the gods but I will cancel the building of temple in Tarentum. Those stonemasons and crafters will be ordered to create a forum for trade (mercator) in that city instead.

I also will not tolerate that we in my hometown of Capua have an industry that costs 9 gold/year but sell their tools for 5 gold/ year. That is not the best way to use our most productive industry. I will use their great engeneering to build another manipel of ballista.

I will complete the 4 portus navis so that we may build Ostia as soon as portus campania gets obsolete and so that we may create portus migrae.

I will also decrease the funds to our scholars who research education with one year less funds. This will shift tax revenue to our empty treasury. This will also give Cornelius Scipio time to organize as many armies as possible before the slavery reform takes place.

To summarize my plan for domestic policy: Let trade flourish and our coffers weigh heavy of gold!

Regarding conquest and enlightenment of our barbaric neighbours:

I say, lets hit the gauls in a preemptive attack before they hit us!
Most of our army is based in Iberia at the moment. It would take my whole time of consulship to move that force to the Illyrian borders.
It would however not take long time to move those troops to the gallic borders for a quick strike where we capture the rich lands north and west of Massillia. The gold mine of Tolosa is very important for improving our ability to support our army. Rumours in Mediolanum and Genua speak already how survivors from the celtic cesalpines fled to their gallic brethren and are stirring them up for war and revenge as we speak! Let us strike first and gurantee freedom and safety for our brave merchants and citizens of Massillia!

Advantage with this strategy is that after the war is over it will take little time to move our troops south again for the last assault on Carthage.

I will of course immediately (before the war with Gauls or Illyrians) reinforce our weak garrison in our new colony in north africa, Cartenna.

What say the senate of Rome about my plans?

Consul Linkowicius

I will second to your motions, Consul Linkowicius. First is your plan to trade with the Punics. The extra 5 turns of peace with them we must endure, for the benefits will be worth it. And, in the words of Marcus Aurelius(who won't be born for another three hundred years, senators!), 'There is Always someone else to fight'.
I would also be inclined towards a pre-emptive strike against the Gauls. We should attempt to take Tolosa, Burdigala and Vienna in quick succesion. However, I would urge the Consul not to underestimate the forces which will be needed for such a task and also to guard against Gallic attacks through the Alpine passes.
Thirdly, I am under the impression that Senator Civfan wishes to be put forward for election as Consul once the current term is over. It is strange, as I have not seen the senator 'in' senate in quite a while now. Can any member of this house shed light on this?

I will second to your motions, Consul Linkowicius. First is your plan to trade with the Punics. The extra 5 turns of peace with them we must endure, for the benefits will be worth it. And, in the words of Marcus Aurelius(who won't be born for another three hundred years, senators!), 'There is Always someone else to fight'.
I would also be inclined towards a pre-emptive strike against the Gauls. We should attempt to take Tolosa, Burdigala and Vienna in quick succesion. However, I would urge the Consul not to underestimate the forces which will be needed for such a task and also to guard against Gallic attacks through the Alpine passes.
Thirdly, I am under the impression that Senator Civfan wishes to be put forward for election as Consul once the current term is over. It is strange, as I have not seen the senator 'in' senate in quite a while now. Can any member of this house shed light on this?

I thank you for your support senator, I will wait however until i hear the opinion from one or two more senators.

Oh, there has been avote about this, consul Linkowicius. But no worries. You may take it upon your sholders to declare yourself dictator (as Publius Iulius Monarchus Africanus Magnus has done before) and rid the world of the Gaul threat but you should, given the same army fair the same benefits to the Republic once your term expires :devil:. In other words: if you want to fight the Gauls do it! But bring swift victory or we shall have your throat! Not to forget that the Senate grading sessions start with consul's Linkowicius term, these very years :satan:. So the way I see it it's a challenge: if you convince us it was worth it, go ahead (I wouldn't hesitate to act now). Maibe other senators might disagree with me.

About the 5 turns: since they will declare war to us (if they don't like to continue paying the tribute Monarchus imposed on them) we shouldn't care too much, should we? But by turn 15 we should be ready to fight them. 100 gold is not that much but it's better than nothing. Try to sell stuff to others, like the Egyptians and Syrians or Pergamene to further strengthen our diplomacy.

About the Praetor, maibe you should build Ostia first. It's much better on the economy anyway ;).

Public Speaker on behalf of the Hawk Party:Consul Linkowicius must forgive the young senator Monarchus for him overgloryfying his father's rule and instigating you to overrule the Senate. He obviously still has more to learn about politics and we shall demise him from the leadership of the party if he makes further such alegations. His father was most lucky to have the logistics prepared for a blitzkrieg whereas he failed to leave you with the same situation. We must apologize for this :sad:. And we also wish you that fortune smiles upon your reign.

The chronicles of consul Lucius Linkowicius.


205. BC We sold the granary in Rome. Wich merchant was trying to trade wheat behind the senates back? The senate and the senate alone hold the right to distribute grain in our capital. The senate commence the organization of the Praetorium.

Mercator is built in Tarentum and 2 tax collectors are promoted.

Starting production of Ballista in Capua.

Changed production in Croton from a temple to a legio. The city is too small
for a temple.

Sold the claustrum piratae in Aquileia. Rome can´t tolerate brigand basecamps in our home territory. Law and order!

Production in Panormus changed to granary and tax collector promoted

Foreign legio is built in Malacca, two tax collectors promoted.

20 extra gold this year from our newly recruited taxmen.

We have agreed to supply the punic dogs with celtic slaves for 20 years, we got 105 gold for the deal.

Syria bought celts for 23 gold.

Sold celts to macedonia for 6 gold

Sold wheat to Achaia for 20 gold

Starting to move troops (mostly velites) from the Illyrian front towards northern Italy and Massilia.

Legion XXIV moved to Cartenna

The troops in Spain seems pretty battered from the war. It will take some time to rest them up.

The Ptolemains agreed to pay 58 gold for a similar deal.

204. BC (first turn I´m actually playing)

Villagers in Cartenna report a wounded pirate ship outside the coast. The strikeforce from Palma are called in to dispose of the sea wolves. Gah! :mad: Our veteran corvus attacks, loses 1 hp, sink the pirate but does neither get promoted or enslave the ship. Our elite corvus stack with the wounded corvus. Let´s hope no more pirates appear next year.

We continue the building of roads between Scallabis and Emerita Augusta.

We continue roadwork at Tolentum

Start building a granary in Tarentum

203. BC A legion is spawned in Rome and a funditor is spawned in Palma.

Corvus task force outside Cartenna survived and rebase to port

A velite scouts the northern mountain pass and discovers Aventicum. They also discover a Carthagian task force of 2 Phalanx Libianus outside the city :eek:

Eastern naval expedition returns home. May Neptunus bless our ships for a safe journey!

Build a miles socius in Ariminum.

202. BC Illyria wants to renew the peace treaty and we agree. We trade celts for 6 gold to ensure that they stay calm while we are busy elsewhere.

We continue to move troops towards Gallic borders.

People in Messana are unhappy, we change production to a temple and promote an entertainer.

Pisae will train a new velite in 2 turns

Starting granary in Genua.

Starting fabrica in Aquileia

201. BC Neapolis and Capua produces two brand new ballista. both units sent north

We are building a road and a fort in the northern pass north of Mediolanum.

I will continue this tomorrow. Time to get to bed....

*Frothing at the mouth*
WE NEED TO GO EAST! WE NEeeed....
*Dies of a heart attack*

*Senator Castor's son quickly comes to asess the situation*
At last, the old fool died. I'm this step closer to power.
Dear senators, I'm sure you all grieve for my father's untimely departure. Although his consulship was quite controversial, it was also immensily succesful. I plan to follow in his path and to continue his dream. But right now, I must continue his cry to advance in the east. Gallia can wait. Those pesky barbarians can be bought off if they ever threaten our hegemony. However, Greece still defy our every move! Attacking shipping lines, declaring wars upon our allies, paying us only a fraction of what they owe us, their crimes are countless. It is not today that we will be able to stike back at them for their crimes, but we must prepare for it. I fully understand Consul Linkowicius when he says it will take his entire consulship to move our glorious legions into position to take down Illirya and then Greece, but we don't need the entire army for this. Those are small states. Using superior tactics (read slave batting, 1 hp velites, multiple alliances), we can force their generals to leave their cities relatively undefended and strike at the core of their power. Without them, all of their forces will vanish in panic. Yes, it could be a honnorless task, to move around troops, but the Republic, nay, the Gods themselves ask of us to extand the reach our nation to the boundaries of the Earth!
To summerize my vision the years to come, we should move part of our forces to Illirya and renew warfare there with Queen Teuta. Another part should go to Cartenna and wait for the last war with the African scum. A third part should serve as guards in our multiple borders. Spain, Provincia Narbonensis and Sicilia could be easily overwhelmed by honorless barbarians.
At the same time, why not create wars in the far east? We do have contact with many civilizations there, all powerfull and fearless. It might be best to soften them up before we crush them under our boots.

Senator (as soon as I buy enough vote from the plebe) Castor the Second

---------------
Damn, just realized you started Drendor! Oh well, maybe I can influence the vote next time. Or when I'm in charge :devil:

No time. Work at hand. Agree with Castor. If you have the save BEFORE signing trades with Illyria LOAD immediatelly. With the velites and 2 legions there you should've had no problem starting a war there once you brought the two consuls. If you sign peace wih everybody you'll ruin the consulship for not one but two next consuls, beware. I see personal glory trying to overcome the best of the Republic! The Claustrum Piratae was supposed to be sold when we reached Triumvirate for 20 shields. Nothing is left to chance, you know.

I said you could if you had a good reason of success provoke the Gauls and overrule the Senate but not make a useless peace for 6 gold with those peasants!! Hawks very mad :mad:! You're next for supper :lol:...

No time. Work at hand. Agree with Castor. If you have the save BEFORE signing trades with Illyria LOAD immediatelly. With the velites and 2 legions there you should've had no problem starting a war there once you brought the two consuls. If you sign peace wih everybody you'll ruin the consulship for not one but two next consuls, beware. I see personal glory trying to overcome the best of the Republic! The Claustrum Piratae was supposed to be sold when we reached Triumvirate for 20 shields. Nothing is left to chance, you know.

I said you could if you had a good reason of success provoke the Gauls and overrule the Senate but not make a useless peace for 6 gold with those peasants!! Hawks very mad :mad:! You're next for supper :lol:...


Eh...what happens if they want to renew a peace treaty and I say no? I thought there would be war if I said no? And I didnt want war with Illyrians with only 2 legio(working on roads) an eque and a couple of velites at the border. And i thought, if we are gonna renew the peace treaty for 20 turns, why not make a trade at the same time to ensure that they stick to the treaty while we are busy fighting gaul and Carthage?

I thought I had mandate to go after the gauls after the posts by Traianus and Monarch.

I will try to check the autosaves if I have a save before the peace treaty with Illyrians.

I dont agree with your logistic thoughts though. My thought was "fight the enemy where our legions/armies are positioned". We dont wanna move around our troops over long distances. The troops were in Spain--->close to Gaul----far from Illyria. The gallic area is as productive(if not more) as the Illyrian region. After war with gaul it would be easy to keep moving troops east towards Aquileia or reinforce Cartenna for the final war with Carthage.
Bringing the two consular armies to Illyria and then bring them back to Cartenna would take a very long time.

A war with Illyria requires at least 1 consular army to protect the task force.
Should then the attack on Carthage wait until that consular army returns from Illyria?

I´m at work right now I´ll have to get back on this when I´m home

I believe you were given mandate for a limited campaign in Gaul. At least, I stand by my vote on this. I have not changed my mind.
Simply by doing nothing, your peace deal with Illyria will continue with no conditions e.g. no gpt payments or resource payments. You may then declare when it suits you without any damage to rep.
Your strategic thinking is sound to my mind but that deal with Illyria has to go. We will be knocking on their door again quite soon I imagine.

Senators;

Is it true that peace with Illyria will come from this treaty? In Drendor'a current state, if not signing anything will redeclare war with Illyria. If war is declared, its ok. Just fight a defensive war in Illyria and an aggressive war in the limited gallic war.


Senator Civfanous signing off

If he does not resign then the peace deal expires but he will continue to be at peace. In the foreign advisor screen (under the third tab, I forget what it's called) it will show 'Peace Treaty' with no number beside it, whereas before it will have shown 'Peace Treaty(X = no. of turns left)' previous to the 20 truns running out. He does not have to make a new deal to remain at peace. He simply does nothing and peace will continue indefinitely.

If he does not resign then the peace deal expires but he will continue to be at peace. In the foreign advisor screen (under the third tab, I forget what it's called) it will show 'Peace Treaty' with no number beside it, whereas before it will have shown 'Peace Treaty(X = no. of turns left)' previous to the 20 truns running out. He does not have to make a new deal to remain at peace. He simply does nothing and peace will continue indefinitely.

I see. I must admit I was a bit uncertain of the rules there. I thought we had to go to war again against Illyria with most of our troops in spain if I said no. :eek:

I will replay the game tonight before the time when i made a deal with Illyria.

Drendor

If Teuta comes to you, asking to extend the peace then just say yes. If you try to renegociate the deal then it will become a binding 20 turn deal. At least, I'm pretty sure that's the way it works! If she doesn't say anything, then peace is maintained acc. to the conditions I posted previously.
Good luck, Consul. We await your return from the front!

Gah! I replayed for nothing!

As I told you earlier, it is she who comes to us.

I can only answer yes to peace or go to war. I choosed peace again.

Peace means a (20) turn deal. That´s why I traded with them last time.


Drendor

Apologies. It appears it is me who did not understand the rules on this. ...and you're sure that answering yes(not renegociating) ties you into a 20 turn deal?
I was sure that it didn't.
Sorry again.

Arghhh!! Nevermind! We'll just have to go for Carthage then. Just please let us take Numidia with that so as never to return. And then it's all east: Illyria, Macedonia, Greece, Pergamum, Syria, Bythinia, Pontus, Galatia, Syria (if there is something left), Persia (if needed), Egypt and then Gallia, Germania, Dacia, Britannia.

Anybody have another order in mind, like Dacia before Greece (this might be better). Also Iberia should be dispatched also by a secondary swift force as they shouldn't be much of a threat left. Cheers. Good luck consul Linkowicius and hurry a bit. Others are waiting...

The rule of Consul Linkowicius goes on.


End of year 201. BC : We declare war on the barbaric Gauls. We advance to the hills west of Tolosa with and start bombarding with velites with no effect. Amother strike force advance on Vienna. No enemy units appear.


200.BC 1 ballista and 2 funditors bombard Vienna, There are no walls but several Tribus Barbarus Magnus that we injure. Our velites rush in and they fight heroically. We loose 1 velite but they hurt the enemy troops alot wich leads to the death of 3 Tribus Barbarus Magnus and 3 Bellator and we capture Vienna.

A currus threatens the city. We move in velites and legio and hope for the best.

5 legio start to build road to Vienna (this is a war action since it would take 2 turns only to walk there and 3 turns if they help eachother to build a road that they will benefit more from later)

We destroy oppidium in Tolosa and hurt their garrison some.

sorry i have to finish this on friday! didnt have much time today and the time between turns are up to 10-15 min on my computer

Great progress so far. We'll appreciate this so much when it's time to go after the rest of Gaul!

As the Senate continues to bicker about current events, a man goes unnoticed as he enters the Senatus. It is not until this stranger enters the center of the Senatus, that the senators take notice of him. All goes quite before his presence, as expectation of an explanation is thick in the air. This strange man stops and raises his hand, as a sign of apology for this unexpected interruption. Yet even as he stands there, looking at each senator in turn, there is nothing apologetic as he raises his voice to speak.

I come before you, brothers of the Senate, to claim my seat upon this council. It is my right by blood, by family, and by duty. Who am I to claim the right as a Senator of Rome? My former name was Decimus Junius Domitian, as I have claimed a new name that is mine by right. I am the adopted son of the late Pontifix Maximus Gaius Junius Domitian. Is this name not familiar to you, senators? It shouldn't be, as some plebeian son of a Carthaginian whore mangled my good Uncle's name. It would seem my late Uncle was not without a sense of humor, as he allowed this "name" of his be used as his own. Be that as it may, I am now Gaius Decimus Junius Domitian, adopted son of the late Gaius Junius Domitian, and new Senator Gaius of the Roman Republic.

My father let it be known to me, that it is with deep regret he could not send council and congratulations to Publius Iulius Monarchus Africanus in person. It is left up to I to honor the memory of the late Senator and Consul Publius Iulius Monarchus Africanus. A man with such integrity and military genius only graces us his presence, once in a millenia. It is with great pride and reverence that I speak the name of the late Publius Iulius Monarchus Africanus. May he find eternal battle in the halls of Mars!

It is needed by Rome, more men like the late Senator Monarchus to fill the shoes of Dictator. We are not to be disappointed by the men of Linkowicius family, as his consulship shows much in the progress of war. It was indeed the wishes of my late father, for the reclamation of Gallic lands. It would seem though, the best course of action would be a limited campaign in the region. These barbarian's memories are long and too long have we waged war on these people. Let the intentions of Rome be known to the local populace, for it is for they to know how their ruler and master is. Yet only take from them what they would so poorly guard. Let us free ourselves from this investment in the west, and try our hands on different fruit. A fruit so ripe and plump, that we need only to reach out and squash it!

Illyria! This is the rotten fruit in which I speak of. These contemptous pile of oxen dung, that would call themselves 'civilized', must be destroyed! For it was these heinous lepers that killed my real father, before he was able to part unto me the meanings of being a man. The late Senator Gaius was to soft in his position with the Illyria, dealings of peace with these mangy dogs. His quest to enlighten these accursed barbarians with the word of the gods, as allown them to flourish unabated. It is imperative that we crush the armies of Illyria and subdue her cities unmercifully until the people no not what 'Illyria' means. It is with great envy that it will not be me that conquers and enslaves the barbarians and pirates of Illyria!

I leave the Senate now to contemplate current situations and future duties as a senator. It would seem the course has already been laid down by the Senate and Consul Linkowicius. As such, I have no advice to give and only congratulate you on your current success with the incursion into Gallic lands.

A bit effeminate, with a certain Greek appearance which he certainly didn't take from his father, now retired at Ariminum, young Consul Varius seems shy to exercise his talents of orator on his first day to the Senate. It is only when talks of going to Gallia are started that he suddenly show interest in the discussions.

*Slowly standing up*

(My! So many of them!) Senators, greetings, I hear there are formidable discussions whether the war should go east or north. I have heard Celtic make formidable slaves, could be a great threat if left unchecked, and indeed there are hoards of gold to mine near Tolosa which could be put in good use by the Senate to alleviate poverty in Rome. However, in respect for my ailing father, I will not cast a vote on this issue and let the majority, or Consul Lucius Linkowicius, decide instead. Please accept my apologies for my lack of experience in the matter. However, I must mention something I heard north, when my father was negotiating for land and slaves near Ravenna. It seems there is a great Gallic chief mustering troops deep into Celtic lands, his name was too barbaric for me to remember, Verginterus, or something. I therefore urge you not to underestimate the Gauls if the decision to wage war there is made.

Suddenly the doors of the Senate are opened widely.

*Senator Olivero enters; his face is so infuriated that one can barely recognize him.

YOUNG RAT, HOW DO YOU DARE SUPPORTING THIS PARODY OF VOTE!!!?

*Varius faces turns as white as marble*

YOU EXCREMENT OF A CAMEL, YOU ARE MUCH LIKE YOU MOTHER!

*Varius faces turn now red, his lips are shaking*

Suddenly, Olivero seems to finally remark he is the middle of a senatorial session.

YOUNG SENATORS, I THOUGHT YOU HAD MORE RESPECT FOR YOUR ELDERS. I HAD BEEN TOLD THAT AFTER A WAR AGAINST THE GREEKS, WE WOULD FINALLY DESTROY TEUTA. TEUTA YOU HEAR ME! SHE SUNK FLEETS OF OUR MERCHANTS, SHE SENT PIRATES TO RAVAGE THE EASTERN COAST OF ITALY. WHAT DID THE CELTS DO TO US? HOW CAN YOU OVERTURN THE DECISIONS MADE EARLIER,
I...I... AAAAAAARGH... YUCK...

The senator heart has (finally) given away, to everyone relief. His huge body fall noisily on the Senate floor (again) which he loved so much for his afternoon naps.

*Varius seems quite saddened although he is not sure he will be able to survive (politically) the shame he endured today.


---
Sorry, I see too much soap opera these days (not that I want to, but it is difficult to escape the TV in our small house ;))

EDIT - and I wrote this when reading the posts made over yesterday, thinking the thread was ending on page 9. There was a full other page waiting for me it seems! Anyway, great start of the gallic campaign Drendor, and welcome to all the new batch fo Senators!

Let not fear of your political career overcome you, young Varius, for We, the Hawks would like to welcome you and the young senator Gaius Domitianus in our ranks so as to further strengthen the Republic. It seems consul Linkowicius's consulship is taking ever more time. True he has replayed several years and he has shown progress so far but we are ever anxious, in the memory of the late Publius Monarchus of whom senator Gaius Domitianus spoke so fondly of, to finally put an end to the Carthaginian menace and take her people into slavery. (we had agreed for a 48 hour limit, we should, at least try to stick to that for else we will never reach Justinian the Great this year :lol:)

Also the Republic will then encounter some harsh years. We should perhaps think of aquiring some Greek goods to give to the populace. And let our army not outgrow our support limit for too much for we would certainly need the funds to upgrade all legions and Miles Socii to Legio Marii once the opportunity arrives.

Also, Pink, don't you think Caesarauguta should be more historically renamed into Numantia?

They're a little apart. Numantia(although I'm not sure exactly where) was a fair bit west of Caesaraugusta.
Alternatively, it could go closer to the Pyrenees and be called Osca if you wanted a real iberian town. Caesaraugusta wasn't much of a settlement in pre-Roman times.

I had writen a nice report but I managed to close my web browser (multitasking meltdown in my head) before it was sent. :cry:

Any way: Vienna and Tolosa are conquered with only 1 velite lost.

I´m worried over the vast numbers(7) of Iberian bellators that wander through our territory.

Our trade deals with the countires overseas got cancelled when portus campania got obsolete.

We got our first legio Scipionis 196 BC It is near Rome.

I will not play turn 195 and 194 eventhough I could. The time inbetween turns is very slow at the moment (+20 min). I have only a pIII 600 mhz. It will get better later I hope with fewer civs. At least it got better in single campaign.

There are forces on their way to lugundum. Next consul have to decide if to abort that siege and returns troops to Illyrian/Carthagian fronts.
No matter what decision you make, let the legions north of Vienna finish the road. I always think like this: If 5-6 legion could get to a place in 2 turns by walking and it takes 3 turns for them to build a road. I always choose to build the road. This way you get a road created and the units who built the road will catch up with the units who choosed to walk instead.
Call it "moving and building roads as you go along"

Portus Ostia is under production in Rome and portus migrae is being built in Neapolis.

The portus naves are very expensive to maintain (3 gold each)
We should probably keep the one in Massilia (if we want to build a portus commerci there later, or we scrap the portus naves for 50 shields, save 3 gold per turn and rebuild the portus naves +portus commerci when we get the tech) and one on Sicilly to repair our warships.
But the other two can probably be sold?

If you compare this save with the old, you will notice that I have managed to build alot of units and buildings.

My only mistake was probably to oversize the attacking force against the celts. Some of the units could probably have been sent towards Illyria to start that attack earlier. Too bad though Teuta forced a peace treaty upon us with her sneaky diplomacy.
Let the units north of Mediolanum finish the fortress and road to it. It will be useful later.

By promoting taxmen when cities have waste I have also been able to increase our funds. Of course selling some buildings and exporting some goods helped too.

Be watchful of cities that cant grow no more. No need to build aqaducts there. Also remember that we will soon get free granaries on the continent. The old ones should be sold

Good luck to ApolytonCivfan

Fall 196BC

Its a misty morning in the city of Rome, crowds gather near the forum awaiting news of the senator to be the next Consul of the Republic.

Senator Civfanous walks out of the senate house to meet the crowd. "Citizens of Rome, as your new Consul, I propose many new changes, conquests in gaul and establish more diplomatic ties to the eastern nations. I will propose new reforms to the senate for voting on our future and end the gallic war with a profitable peace."


Reforms to the senate:

1. Research First Punic War after discovering Education

2. Send out a naval force to the east to re-establish diplomatic ties with Eastern cities. If possible this term, alliance with Syria in a war against Pontus and Egypt. We should weaken the Eastern nations with war alliances.

3. War against Macadonia with alliances of the Greeks. Wont be any real action till the troops finish from the Gallic war come to Illyia. But this will create much fighting in Greece which will weaken Macadonia.

4. With the Legio Scipionis, I usually add Marius Legions into them but its going to be awhile before we discover that. Should i add elite legios to the one we have now?

Lets vote on this now

Thank you Senators


Consul Civfanous

Fall 196BC

Its a misty morning in the city of Rome, crowds gather near the forum awaiting news of the senator to be the next Consul of the Republic.

Senator Civfanous walks out of the senate house to meet the crowd. "Citizens of Rome, as your new Consul, I propose many new changes, conquests in gaul and establish more diplomatic ties to the eastern nations. I will propose new reforms to the senate for voting on our future and end the gallic war with a profitable peace."


Reforms to the senate:

1. Research First Punic War after discovering Education

2. Send out a naval force to the east to re-establish diplomatic ties with Eastern cities. If possible this term, alliance with Syria in a war against Pontus and Egypt. We should weaken the Eastern nations with war alliances.

3. War against Macadonia with alliances of the Greeks. Wont be any real action till the troops finish from the Gallic war come to Illyia. But this will create much fighting in Greece which will weaken Macadonia.

4. With the Legio Scipionis, I usually add Marius Legions into them but its going to be awhile before we discover that. Should i add elite legios to the one we have now?

Lets vote on this now

Thank you Senators


Consul Civfanous


Researching first punic war? :crazyeye: You meant second punic war?
We need to research slavery before we can advance to second punic war.
If we are to research slavery I propose that we research at a slower rate so that we may get a second army from the Scipio wonder. We got the first army in 196 BC and the next one come in 15 turns, you do the math......

Sorry that i let those triremes sail home. Wich countries did you have in mind to make contact with? IMPORTANT: If you are to sail east again, take the southern route where you follow the coastline of north africa. You should be safe from pirates when guarded by Carthagian and Egyptian navies.

Fake wars with distant nations and alliances with their neigbours might be a good plan yes.

I suggest we put two foreign legios in our first scipio army. We will need to use it well before the reforms of Marius.

We need to decide WHEN we want to start the last war against Carthage. And wich troops are to take part in that fight? When we have decided this, we will now what spare troops we have left for the Illyrian theater.

Will you try to conquer Lugundum? Or will you return south? Whatever you do, dont cancel the road projects I started....

@Drendor: don't worry about the Iberian bellators - they'll retreat and never violate a cease fire if you don't. I often leave cities unprotected because I know there's no chance in hell they're gonna break their word before the 20 turns run out.

Now that you've amassed all troops near Lugdunum it would seem foolish not to take it. Just make sure you minimize losses.

@Civfanous:

1. I'd stick to Drama for the reasons I already listed in a previous post. We need at least 2 or 3 Scipios and slowing research would be foolish. Why not research something else? Drama is useful. I see you still have the research queue in the save. I think that's the best choice on the long term.

2. We already done that. Who do you want to meet? If you want to meet Pontus, you got to be very lucky (meet some ships) or go into the Black Sea which I doubt you'll reach alive. And for what? Syria, Egypt and Nabathea are far more important and we've already done that. My advice, keep the ships home for now.

3. We should ally with the Greeks only AFTER the Macedonians are at war with us or else they'll just get stronger by conquering Greek cities. Also we should watch for Carthaginian trying to take over the Greeks, it once happened to me!!

4. Same as Drendor: definitelly load two Foreign Legions in the Scipio

Onwards to Lugdunum, I say! This war has been easier than expected so far and The Gauls will get better units later on.

Btw, thnx for the map Traianus. I imagined the city was not the same but I was more in favor of naming the cities acording to the Barbarian cities (like Alesia, Gergovia, Sarmizegetusa etc.). That's why I favored Numantia more (it was an Iberian large settlement as far as I know, whereas Caesaraugusta was built much later. I'd rename many more cities to their Barbarian original, but I understand that takes a lot of work.

Also, Condates should really by the Latin/Gallic Condata, the same as Susa.

I'll support the Monarch on that one. It seems to be the best plan we have for the next couple of turns. We should also start to try out war on 2 fronts. The third (and hopefully final) Punic war is coming but at the same time, we are starting to get behind in eastern territories. It won't be that simple, managing war weariness and building troops for 2 battles, but the Greek city-states are easily conquered. As for Macedonia and Dacia, we should probably let them fight a bit together before making our moves.
Plus, I would vote to finish off the Iberians and the Numids while were at it. We don't want to come back later on to tackle 2-3 cities. And it will shorten the borders we have to defend.

I'll support the Monarch on that one. It seems to be the best plan we have for the next couple of turns. We should also start to try out war on 2 fronts. The third (and hopefully final) Punic war is coming but at the same time, we are starting to get behind in eastern territories. It won't be that simple, managing war weariness and building troops for 2 battles, but the Greek city-states are easily conquered. As for Macedonia and Dacia, we should probably let them fight a bit together before making our moves.
Plus, I would vote to finish off the Iberians and the Numids while were at it. We don't want to come back later on to tackle 2-3 cities. And it will shorten the borders we have to defend.

Yes but I think we should ally ourselves with the numidians in the last war against Carthage. Those riders provide good help and it will divert the forces of Carthage when we strike from Cartenna. When the alliance with Numidia expires they should be easily conquered with a small token force. Of course we cant conquer them completely though, because of the ancestral forests.

Making macedonia go to war against Dacia is a good idea and I actually propose that we conquer Dacia before we conquer the whole of Hellas.
The golmines of Transylvania makes the roman tax collectors start to drool.
I think that after Lugundum has fallen we should leave 1 consular army, 2-3 legio, 2 funditors, 2 ballista and maybe 8 velites at the Illyrian borders.
When the peace treaty with Illyria expires we attack them, even if that means being at war against Cartthage and Illyria at the same time.

When Illyria has fallen we could attack one of the small greek city states if we still have our main forces in Carthage.
When our main forces start to return back from the west I think we should alliance ourselves with Macedonia against Dacia and advance into Thrakian lands. We should probably start to build up our treasury by then as well. So that we might inherit Pergamum. Hopefully they lost some ships and troops in the last war against Carthage. We could even ally with them again for that reason. Maybe the city will be cheaper with less military units in it?

The other consular amry + scipio + the rest of our forces should be enough to conquer the heartlands of Carthage. I´m reluctant about using the Scipio army in invasions from the sea against Carthage. Because they still have a navy and the scipio army might do a better job striking from Cartenna togather with the consular army. They can both supply cover for the rest of the troops since AI seldom attack armies in the open if they have most of their hp:s left.

Too many fronts. Finish Carthage, Numidia, (send a few troops to Iberia) AND THEN land everything on the Illyrian coast. We never leave til we get everything there. There are 6 civs and around 20 cities in the Balkans, we need everything we got and quite a bit of time. By 130 we should have enough money to buy Pergamum AND Rhodos. But if we split and make too many enemies at a time it's dangerous. Leave a minimum garrisson in Gallia. Since we have peace for the next 20 turns they'll never break that. Germans are the only thorn in the side.

Btw do we still favor grading?

I have to agree with that. Many fronts make many casualties... for us! Tackling the west as we have done is good at this stage. The balkan campaign will seem quicker as all the cities are relatively close together and there are already many roads in place.
The grading is a good idea for flavour but i'm not sure about imposing penalties. I don't regard myself as an expert civ player. Does that mean I will be doomed to playing 8 turns for the rest of the campaign?

Too many fronts. Finish Carthage, Numidia, (send a few troops to Iberia) AND THEN land everything on the Illyrian coast. We never leave til we get everything there. There are 6 civs and around 20 cities in the Balkans, we need everything we got and quite a bit of time. By 130 we should have enough money to buy Pergamum AND Rhodos. But if we split and make too many enemies at a time it's dangerous. Leave a minimum garrisson in Gallia. Since we have peace for the next 20 turns they'll never break that. Germans are the only thorn in the side.

Btw do we still favor grading?

But we can't wait for the entire army to come to Illirya to begin its conquest. The date right now is 195BC? Cartage won't be completely conquered until probably 175BC. Then there is the Numids to take care of. Right after that there is the Iberians to finish. Our main army won't be in the East until at least 150BC, meaning we will probably start to lapse behind, even more so given the fact that after 150 BC, the turns take 2 years. We will have to conquer Greece + Illirya in under 25 turns if we want it all by 100BC. A limited campaign in Illirya will help us a lot here. Cartage can be easily conquered by the combined use of the 2 consular and 2 scipio armies while the third scipio can go after Illirya. With support troops, Illirya will easily fall and war wearinness will only set IF we lose a lot of troops there which I doubt. Same thing for Spain, we don't need a huge expedition there. And when we have all of Illirya, we should make war upon Dacia with the help of Macedonia. Personnally, I have done this many times as there is few exhcange of cities between the 2 : Macedonia breaks itself upon the border guards while Dacia simply doesn't have enough attack units to strike back. This will allow us to take the gold mines if we strike deep enough during the first war with them.
Suggered battle plan against Dacia :
1) Put all the Greeks on our side, and by that I mean all.
2) Wait some turns to defeat the first counter attacks in Northern Illirya. Soutern Illirya can take care of its own as all the Greeks there will protect the city.
3) Make our moves toward Sirmium and Tibiscum to conquer all of Dacia over the Danube.
4) When all alliances are finished, make peace and try to obtain a city.
5) Make sure ROP will be finished at the same time or before.
6) Attack Aetolia.
7) Attack Achaia
8) Attack Athenae but we don't go to Byzantium yet
9) Attack Macedonia
10) Finish Byzantium
11) Finish Dacia
This allows us to make most of the Greeks lose their units or have them in Dacia when we attack them. Hopefully, such a plan can be carried out with a limited number of troops in the beginning as it will be mostly defensive operations. It will give us the time to bring back our forces from the West while effectively depleting Greece.
As for Pergamum, Rhode and Bytinia, I have no idea when we will be able to inherit them. Our continuous use of the treasury to build FLs have left us with small reserves. We should probably start to save now. To build FLs in cartago territory, simply micromanage the cities to have a non-growing pop while building a Legio.

Senator Gaius stands up before the senators, raising his hand for silence.

Greater then we can remember, have we let the rich and fertile lands of the Greek city states, be not in our influence. Has this senate lost all sense of propriety? It is with one stone that one kills a single bird, not two. Let us not dwell on thoughts of war and conquest with Carthage, as we know they are but caged dogs. It is east that our interest and fortunes now lie. I WILL have Illyria crushed beneath the mighty Roman boot!!!

We cannot afford the legions and talents that is draining from our coffers with the current war with Gallia. Though I am loathed to admit, peace talks with Gallia should commence immediately. Then again it might be wise to conquer the nearest cities before such a plan of action is committed. Making sure that we complete roads with our legions before we disembark on our campaign agaist the Greeks.

It should be our three Armies, with the support of our mobile Velites and Eques, that we should launch a quick incursion into Illyrian territory from Aquileia. When we have ingaged Queen Teuta in war, we shall establish contact with Aetolia and Achaia, for an military alliance. Let the Greek people destroy themselves as we can mop up any resistance that may be left. By the time we have conquered the capital and made our way south, most of our legions and auxiliaries will have arrived to Aquileia. Then we let the fun begin!

Has the senators of Rome become owls, instead of eagles in ages past? Learing is fine when it teaches arts of war, but is useless when it teaches talks of peace. It is past time we implimented slave markets for our captured foes. The income and productivity of such facilities will outweigh the minor problems of discontent.

Finally, it has come to my attention that we have idle troops in Sicily. To what purpose is this? Send all or any Cumbas that are in the area for the immediate disembarkment of these troops to Cartenna. We need to show a presense to the Phoenician dogs, for they might be stupid enough to entertain ideas of past glories.

@Drendor

So I guess you had no glimpse of our Vergingetorix friend (he is flagged with defense so he probably hide in Gergovia).

Gauls are far too easy uh? Would many shout and curse me if the basic bellator was to receive better stat or a move of 2?

20 min per turns is certainly an awful lot of time... I had fast turns when I played, and I hope this version will go as fast as 1.0 did, but certainly a P3 will have a hard time running the prehistoric Civ3 engine.

@ApolytonCivfan

Encouraging wars abroad is not very noble, but it might greatly help. I recommend you for undertaking this careful diplomacy when an opportunity arises. Caution however, as reported by the Monarch not too actually reinforce some states when opposing nations of too different strenght.

@The Monarch, Traianus

Numantia as an important celtiberic city should be there. Dunno why I didn't think about it earlier (or did I and the city was renamed???). I will move CaesarAugusta to the proper location and rename it to Numantia.

Next actions

I would go for Lugdunum as well, since we are there. Although we are risking to see the Germanics overrunning the weakened Gauls in the North, which is not a nice thing. Then, I believe we need to listen to Cato and finish of Carthago once and for all (when does our peace treaty expire?). The Greeks won't get much stronger with time, while Carthago still get a great deal of free troops in Africa. If the current and coming Consuls feel strong enough, a two front war (Africa and Greece) could be considered.

I am leaving from Wed to Tue for a week of diving (yeeeepeee, holidays at last), and it is likely I won't be able to play my consulship beforehand. You guys go ahead, I'll join in back ASAP, and hopefully the 3rd Punic War will be over by then.

EDIT
Damn, again, missed reading a full page of posts before posting.

It seems the hawks have lost their sharp talons :) However, seeing that not everybody (and that really include myself) is a Civmaster, a multiple front war decision should maybe be left to the consul to decide. Anyway, this will require a lot of logistic to prepare the campaigns (didn't look at the save but it seems we have troops in many places) and that could mean poor Consul Civfanous will have to spend 10 turns moving armies around and that all the glory (or shame, who knows ;)) will fall on his successor...

Why is it Pink, that most of your posts are made right after mine? Just a amusing coincidence or something more sinister? Hmmm? :p

HERE I AM AGAIN :devil:

It must be a GMT thing. I always post at the same time of the day.

196BC

After his speech to the people of Rome, Consul Civfanous marched to gaul for the theater of war. Many soldiers were positioned at the great Gallic city of Lugundum. The war front was big; it was a long time since Civfanous had seen so many soldiers in one place. Remembering as a child in the camps of his great father Civfan, soldiers fought hard under his fathers leadership to conquer the remaining Punic Sicilian cities. It was his hopes that these Romans would bring the courage that they brought to the war with his father to the Gaulic front.

195BC

Many Legions were drafted this year. Our marvelous SPQR produced another elite corps of Lego for us. We drafted 4 foreign Legio’s in our new Spanish province. In honor of our family’s military history under Consul Civfan, the Roman Legio XV was named to Legio XV Apolytonio. Legio XV Apolytonio led the charged towards the Gallic capital of Gerovia while Lugundum was attacked by an advanced corps of Velites.

3 Velities perished in the siege of Lugundum including a Veleties Saguntis. Lugundum falls to the might of our Foreign Legio XIII.


194BC

Construction continued of roads in our Spanish provinces. Slaves were shipped to the provinces to continue building the roads as our soldiers were needed elsewhere,
We decided also to draft another foreign legio from our Spanish subjects.

Our assault in bombarding the Gallic capital of Gerovia was a total disaster. I’ve never seen so many broken arrows in my so early life. It was also to my attention that alcohol was a big factor in this mess up and I’ve decided that drinking Gallic wine is prohibited. Let us drink only our Italian wine, it effects less our vision in throwing burning arrows at night.

Troops our moving. I ordered soldiers to return to Italy. Many Legio’s started the long march. I also order some to move south to Spain to build up a new front against Carthage.

193BC

Disaster strikes the Apolytonio family. Consul Civfanous has been assassinated in the war camps of Gaul. It seems an assassin past through the Consuls guards and stabbed him to death while he was sleeping.

More disaster follows as the Gallic tribes hear the news of the Murder of Consul Civfanous and rally to attack Lugundum; which falls to their armies. Our Foreign Legio was destroyed to the last man when it panicked and ran. Romans settlers are also murdered in the streets of Lugundum and their heads are on poles outside the city walls.

In Rome some good news was announced as the Portis Ostiae was finally completed. But this became overshadowed when Senators began fighting with each other over Consul Civfanous murder. How could a Consul be assassinated in a war camp? Who was in charge of the guards? Who killed Consul Civfanous?

Troops stand outside in Gallic territory waiting for commands from the Senate. Who will lead the Republic? Who will solve Consul Civfanous’s murder? The actions of Government are not complete. Consul Civfanous is dead, his reforms will need to be continued by a new Consul. Senators, matters are urgent.


Lets put in motion the next player.

Civfan

Suggered battle plan against Dacia :
1) Put all the Greeks on our side, and by that I mean all.
2) Wait some turns to defeat the first counter attacks in Northern Illirya. Soutern Illirya can take care of its own as all the Greeks there will protect the city.
3) Make our moves toward Sirmium and Tibiscum to conquer all of Dacia over the Danube.
4) When all alliances are finished, make peace and try to obtain a city.
5) Make sure ROP will be finished at the same time or before.
6) Attack Aetolia.
7) Attack Achaia
8) Attack Athenae but we don't go to Byzantium yet
9) Attack Macedonia
10) Finish Byzantium
11) Finish Dacia
This allows us to make most of the Greeks lose their units or have them in Dacia when we attack them.

Since we are playing the EASY CAMPAIGN (and this seems to be a decisive factor here), I would go for that after all -2 wars front (and since our talons have been accused for not beeing sharp enough I'm all to eager to show the opposite :lol:). So Illirya is long but badly defended, as senator Gaias wisely proposed it should fall to our Armies, Eques and Velites and just a few close by Legions for strongpoints and defense (I had plenty of Velites in place back in 205BC but consul Linkowicius told them to move out :p). This should be done as the large force battles the Carthaginians. Also wars should be started in the Balkans right NOW(first Dacia against Macedon, THEN all Greeks against Macedon as they are the strongest, this, of course, meaning we go to war with Macedon ourselves but passivelly). All agreements should expire by the time we disembark in Illyria.

When the Third Punic War is over, we should amass 80% of the troops to the newly conquered Illyirian cities to take care of the Greeks. The rest of 20% should easily ake care of the Numids, Iberians and then be moved as garrisson against the Gauls and Germans. This is the blitzkrieg the hawks favor.

@Pink about the Bellator: give us a break, man, this is the EASY CAMPAIGN, remeber? Maibe (even suggested) put some more Great Tribe units in the Gaul border cities but when playing the hard campaign I had to wait 4 or 5 turns for their bellators to end spreading (they also have Eques by then which are f@cking tough too great a defense if you ask me for the Eques -elite Velites loose too often on them). I knew we should've played the hard one out!!

BTW Happy Thai New Year :newyear:

It appears, good senators, that rumours of my demise are unfounded and somewhat premature. I have discovered that one of my three sons thought it would speed my retirement if he was to spread talk of me succombing to an 'ailment of the night' while on holiday in Masillia. There is only one way to deal with such talk and so, I have two sons now. I am telling you this in order to avoid any unpleasantness if any of you should happen to be talking to my good wife, Pernela. Bless her, she just didn't see the need for some good Roman house cleaning!
To Reiterate, Consul Marcus Licinius Traianus, in his seventy-fifth year, is quite ready to take up a second term of office. This grand Republic has grown immensely since i last led the legions and, with the gods on my side, we will see it grow further.
Of course, with such a large frontier we now have many envious eyes apon us. The Barbarian horde wants what we have but would never know what to do with it if they got it. The punics dogs have been put in their place... or should I say, OUR place, for it soon will be.
As I look east, all is as it was. Our progress there has been limited but i believe we were correct to concentrate our efforts on stabilising the west. There is no-one left to threaten us in those lands. The cities of Hispania and Gallia will be great cities, worthy of Roman occupation.
And so I come to matters at hand. Our forces have pushed further than i would have advised into the Gallic Heartlands. However, they are there now. The self-proclaimed King of the Gauls, Vercingetorix, stands in defense of Gergovia and much fighting continues around lugdunum.
So what says the senate on this, I humbly ask. We have 10 further years of peace with Illyria to endure, and 3 years more with carthage.
The legions are now a well ordered fighting machine and i wish to keep them in such condition. Can I ask the previous consul what number legions were lost in the rout of our forces at Lugdunum? Does he know which designation will be next for conscripted legions?
I must commend the efforts of these past consulships. The light that is Rome now lights the way for millions of souls. We have lifted the veil of barbarism from these lands. I will strive to continue this work, though it might yet be the death of me.
Strength and honour.
Marcus Licinius Traianus.

(Now which one of you b$&t*$ds moved my walking stick?)

I only played 8 turns because I had computer problems. I´m curius why you ended your consulship that early Apolyton?

The loss of three velites and one legio and the loss of Lugundum feels terrible!
I thought I moved overwhelming amount of troops to that area. How is the loss of Lugundum possible? Were the celts using currus or eques or how else were they able to surprise us like that?

One advice when storming cities with velites; always try to use the velites against units with 1 point movement and legions against the rest.

If we are embroiled in a siege against Gergovia we might as well finish it. There should be quite many ballista and funditors in that area, try to get rid of walls and oppidium.

After Lugundum is retaken and Gergovia is captured we should sign for peace.
Move the troops south to Cartenna and prepare for the campaign against Carthage. I still think we should send a small task force against the Illyrians but Carthage should be our first priority after the celts.

Dont move too many units away from Sicilly. When we go to war with Carthage they will launch invasions along the coast. Even if we strike from Cartenna we have to be strong enough on Sicilly to defend against invasions.

I have looked at our presnt situation and I am forced to say that our troops are badly out of position. Moving them to Cartenna, Illirya and Sicilia will take years, if not a decade almost. While it may be perfect with Illirya since our peace treaty expires in 10 years, it will mean more delay for actions against our mighty foe Cartage. Every turn we lose is a turn they use to train more soldiers. And those who talk about Numidia as the savior tho this war do not realize that they will be a mere distraction to Cartage's forces as they have been pushed back to the western end of North Africa and have their fighting abilities severely limited. All of this should make us wonder : Are our soldiers dying in a "small" campaign against Gallia or they getting slauthered in a mass invasion? I prey former Consul Linko (I can't actually remember your name......:( ) and the advisors to late Consul Civfanous to give an accurate account our little excursion in these barbarian lands and how many units were lost fighting the scoundrels. I would also suggest that we create a commission to debate if mistakes have been made in the planning of this war and if so, how should we punish them. Personnaly, I would suggest bare hand combat against lions in a stadium.
Strenght and honor
Senator Castor
----------------
Okay, what I said does not represent what I think. I just though it would appropriate for a senator to make such a speech. ;) I just want to know how many units did we lose and what do we plan next.
Since we are about to take 2 or 3 cities from Gallia, I would suggest taking them and asking for peace.
Also, I know that many opposes to a 2 front war and we should make a vote on that.
About Sicilia, we need more troops there. They will defend the isle and then make an attack on Utica.
Don't forget to upgrade the quinquiremis to quinquiremis summaes.
Numidia won't be a great ally, but they can still help.
Whatever you do Traianus, make peace with gallia very soon, moving our troops to the proper places will take time.

Why further weakening the Gauls?
I would let Gergovia free - so as the Celts have still some teeth to bite back the Germanics. Belgica was not and will never be a German province!

PS. BTW, who let that stick on the floor, I nearly tripped over it :mad:

only 1 velite lost under my consulship.


ok then, recapture Lugundum and then sue for peace.

I played two turns last night and Gergovia is not going to fall without heavy losses. I'll post my 5 turn report later but, apart from Vercingetorix, there are at least 4 tribus Barbarus Magnus, 2 Tribus Barbarus and 1 or more eques. i almost killed Vercingetorix but next turn he'll be fully healed! we lost 2 Miles Socius and a number of velites. My question - Why Gergovia? Burdigala, probably much easier to take, is still unconquered and on our doorstep.
I'm not in favour of reloads for little reverses of fortune but If i had known I would have taken Lugdunum and sent the main force immediately south to take Burdigala on the way to Carthage.

Reload and be done with it, consul Traianus :D. Too many losses and too much time is lost as we need the troops elsewhere. If you manage to kill Vercingetorix it would mean a much easier way for Caesar later but better let him do it. I never felt we should go after the Gauls in the first place. Abort :lol:. I too favor the lion treatment :devil:.

Speaking of Caesar, pretty much like Scipio, these guys spawn a bit too late, do't you think? Same with Trajan and Balisarius. I wonder how we could in a further patch make them spawn earlier?

I never proposed a siege of Gergovia in the first place.

Reload. Capture Lugundum if its easy or withdraw. The Celtic affair was meant to be a small campaign in the first place. Maybe i shouldnt have moved all those troops towards Lugundum in the first place.
But I thought the conquest of Vienna and Tolosa went easy, thats why I moved the troops towards Lugundum.

First priority now should be peace with the celts and move troops towards Cartenna (and maybe towards Illyrian border)

If you can lay your hands on Lugundum before the peace treaty its only a bonus, not mandatory.

All in all, I think the celtic affair was a success, Vienna will be a very productive city when it gets to grow. And the new goldmine should also be a useful asset. Lugundum was only a bonus.

Lugdunum is defended by a single currus. We need only walk through the gates!
I did think Lugdunum was an acheiveable goal. But my plan would have been Tolosa, Vienna, Burdigala and Lug only if the others went smoothly. Gergovia was always likely to be heavily defended and, being the capital, always likely to have a certain long-haired hippy-king hanging out, causing problems!

Should we build Praetor yet?

Should we build Praetor yet?


I think so yes.

Why not? We'd have plenty of other things to build later on and it's already a good investment. Go ahead ;)

I would surmise that is it acceptable to build the Praetor now, with our current city claims.

Ok, Hawks. someone has been fast asleep whist naming legions. I've made a list which I intend to keep updated with the legion names and designations. I found 2 legio X's, 2 legio VI's and 2 legio XVIII's. I'll post the list when I have my turn completed.

Well they usually were two of them in reality or even more (like I Italica and I Adiutrix) anyway. It's hard enough to keep track on a single player mode, let alone on 7 players. But I suggest no penalty for this one ;). So how's your war going?

Aventicum and Lugdunum fell quickly. We're moving towards Burdigala and extra forces are Africa bound. Full report when I get home!

Aventicum and Lugdunum fell quickly. We're moving towards Burdigala and extra forces are Africa bound. Full report when I get home!

Aventicum will serve us well as a border fortress against the chaotic germanic tribes.

Question: Does units in Aventicum get the bonus of being behind river when the attacker comes from the hexes north of the city?

Question: Does units in Aventicum get the bonus of being behind river when the attacker comes from the hexes north of the city?

Certainly yes!

Certainly yes!


ok I asked because in my single mode campaign I fortified my units in the city

hills 40% river 60% fortified 25% and walls 50% = 175% and still my praesidium got slaughtered when attacked by bellators and eques. Maybe I had bad luck...

AI cheats! I swear it does! :lol:

Consul Marcus Licinius Traianus (2nd. Consulship)
193BC
we wonder why it is that the outgoing Consul Civfanous finished only half the turn before retiring from office. We immediately use his remaining moves to take Aventicum with the loss of one Miles Socius. An, as yet, unnamed legio finishes the capture of the town, becoming veteran. we will rename him next turn to Legio XXXII.
We note that the legion numbering system seems to have broken down with some numbers duplicated. We will be sure to remedy this during our consulship. Our taskforce lifts the siege of Gergovia, moving in the direction of Burdigala. The King of the Gauls will have to wait for another day.
we finish the turn by moving some loose forces in the direction of Cartenna and Illyria.
192BC
War weariness is setting in.
Mercatus completed in Genua. We begin Aqueductus.
Lugdunum is retaken without loss. Legio XXV Olivera delivers the killing stroke. Extra forces move from Gergovia in direction of Burdigala. More movement towards Cartenna. Legio VI Barcariorum renamed to Legio XXXX Barcariorum. Legio VI Castor already exists. we have begun a series of reforms to have the legions numbered properly. We make contact with Britania but they have no gold and nothing else of interest.
191BC
Funditores and ballista decimate forces approaching Lugdunum. Our velites bombard the defenders of Burdigala but without real success. There are at least two Tribus Barbarus Magnus defending the town. The first forces reach Cartenna as more are sent south from Gaul.
190BC
An injured Lybian Phalanx appears northeast of Aventicum! Our peace deal with Pergamum is renewed. Gallic forces advance on Vienna and Lugdunum.
We begin construcion of two Domus Decendi in Italia and production in Roma is switched to Praetor.
We destroy most of the Gallic forces near Lugdunum and Aventicum but lose a velite to an injured tribus barbarus. The first boats arrive in Carthago Nova as many legions converge there. The road to Lugdunum is almost completed now.
189BC
War is upon us... well, another one! Carthage came to us with a flimsy offer of peace and we naturally rejected it. Carthage must fall! Immediately, they begin naval bombardment and send forces to Cartenna. What a surprise they have coming!
We slaughter the defenders and all present in Burdigala. It will be a warning to the Gauls. Now is time for peace. We get 22 gold. They will not part with any cities. They are proud people still. Legio XXI and XXVI receive special commendation for their efforts.
We set up embassy in Thevesta and the Numidians are only too happy to aid us in the struggle against Carthage. What idiots these barbarians are!
188BC
The numidian Cavalry rips the Carthaginians to shreds at the gates of Cartenna. The Punic response is muted at best. We smell death on them and blood in our nostrils. We have begun production of mercatus and Domus Decendi in many cities. A new foreign legio is rushed in Scaballis - XXXVIII. Our forces drive into the Phoenicians and on to the walls of Cirta. It seems an endless stream of reenforcements are moving towards Carthago Nova.
Near Sicilia we upgrade a Quinquereme and lose 1 corvus in the process of destroying two quinquereme summa and a cumba.

Excellent consul Traianus! Glad to have a new Hawk decimate the Barbarian ranks! But shouldn't you spend a bit more on research?

The science rate is as I found but I'm sure we could notch it a bit. The economy will suffer I'm sure. We are currently at +19/turn.

Well done Traianus!

Good job managing to open up the african front that fast! Keep on reinforcing it.
How many troops do we have in north africa now?
How goes the job of organizing our third army? (the scipio)

Why are we researching drama? To get more scipio armies?

I now we would have education in 1 turn when i finished my consulship.
What happened after that? What was our next project? I´m not sure I understood what Apolytons next science projekt was...
I hope we are not changing projects back and forth cause I think you loose science that way

I don't but you are correct. You lose science that way. We are on drama now and have been since I started playing I raised the rate to 30% as we lost a couple of corvus which were support units. I'm nearly finished so full report soon. In Africa we have 2 armies, a heap of velites, some funditores and about 20 legio. No artillery yet though.

187BC
The Numidians continue to make dirt of all Carthaginians in sight.
We now have a massive force assembled in Cartenna. Our velites score a very lucky hit and destroy the walls of Cirta. Our luck appears to have run out as several legionary forces are severely wounded in the following blood bath but we escape with any losses and take the city. Thinking ahead, we have begun to amass troops at the Illyrian border.
Our naval forces lay waste to 2 quinquereme summa and another cumba. We note that we have rarely ever had such a turn of good luck with this scenario. Long may it last!
186BC
Not much to report this turn. Carthage appears to be a spent force as no new defenders have appeared to replace the dead ones. we move in the direction of Hippo Regius now. A new Scippio army is spawned.
185BC
Desperate fighting takes place near Thelepta as the Numidians cause numerous casualties, only to be ripped apart in a fiece Punic counter-attack. Our velite forces again bring down the walls at Hippo Regius. This seems too lucky. Are these walls of a weaker nature than walls elsewhere? Our forces in Africa are at this stage vast and powerful, although we are relatively weak in artillery. The luck of the velite troops is countering this, however.
We rush a foreign legio in Saguntum. Our economy has recovered somewhat to +27/turn so I will raise the science level to 30%.
184BC
Our supposed friends, the Numidians, send pirate ships to destroy our transports near Cartenna. They are unsuccessful and we gain a quinquereme. Old treacheries will be repaid.
Near Sicilia, a large punic naval force approaches, comprising 3 quinquereme summa and 3 cumba. They must be stopped!
Hippo Regius is ours! The combined attacks of our brutii army, legio XX and XXIII take the city but a unit of eques perish. Many resources are secured with the taking of this city - slaves, wheat and precious building stone. Our veltes kill a further unit of equitatus outside of Cirta.
The naval battle of Lilybeum begins and it is a bloody and costly one. We are victorius but we lose two corvus units. We do, however, gain a quinquereme and totally anihilate the Carthaginian fleet. I wonder how many sacred band are feeding the fish tonight? Admiral Paulus Metellus is to be commended.
We have moved into position at the walls of Utica. I am slightly concerned over the time it is taking to assemble ballista units as I do not think this 'Velite luck' can hold forever. The punic dogs are now cornered and they will not give up this city so easily, I think.
With so many road-building projects to be completed, we have not begun the anticipated invasion of Illyria. Many forces are now gathered and I believe it will be worth it to proceed now. The peace deal expires next turn.
183BC
The phoenician response to our destruction of their fleet is met with a roar of Roman laughter. Their navy is broken - they are a spent force! We muster a force of reserves from Sicilia and ship them to join up with the main invasion force at Utica, in the process sinking 2 quinquereme summa and a cumba. Utica itself begins to burn as the bombardment intensifies.
To alleviate the burden of our science spending, I have recruited numerous tax collectors across the southern cities.
This is where i must leave you good senators now. Consul Olivera will soon take the reins and have the honour of taking Utica and Carthage. I was so tempted to order the attack but, with so many legions exhausted from travelling, it would have been my pride before the Republic. i think you will agree that the African task force is a strong one and capable of the taking of Carthage. You will see also that our army is in place to begin the Illyric invasion. I urge you not to let that ***** Teauta free. Now is the time, senators... now is the time.
I beleieve I might but myself a nice villa in Hispania for my retirement, maybe near Valentia. The affairs of state I leave now in the hands of my son, Junius Vibius. I bid you strength and honour, good Romans.
Marcus Licinius Traianus.

I suggest all techs be researched in 12 turns. Even if it cuts down our funds a bit. We'll have plenty of time later (with census, latifundia, emporium and the rest) to generate loads of income for the hard years to come.

Have any of you played the game until the Byzantine legacy before? I'm only asking because I haven't yet and I'm continuing my old game and am about to reach Constantine. But those Predators are ugly!! And the Legio Mercenaria is dead meat for them because of the low hps. And they are completelly imune to any attacks on their "ancestral forest". I really got angry when I lost a full 7 hp fortified Cohors Imperatoria on hills and limes WITH Catapult support to a Praedator. AND he lost only 3 hps! This random generator is too unpredictable.

I always win with a Velite and lose with a stronger unit, so I'm begining to wonder wether the 2 mov has any effect on overall random during combat (I know it's silly but some fights are actually ridiculous on both sides and luck seems to favor movement against all odds). Anyway, I don't feel the least secure on the limes which I hoped would happen, not even with dozens of Catapultae. Maibe the easier version is more acceptable but this hard version on 1.03 is far harder on defense than it ever was to conquer the whole thing in the first place. And my guess is one Predator every 4 turns in all cities is a bit too much. I willingly accepted the Scythian glove (they wanted 100 gold which was nothing really) just so that they lost some of these ferocious units of theirs before they got too many to kill.

And one last thing: spreading your troops on the limes is silly IMHO. It's an invitation for massacre. You should make a limes so as not to allow them to access with the 3 mov Horses but you should only garisson it in strongpoints and invite them in the less defendable areas of it where ambush is the only solution. The worst thing is the border is so wide with the Germans (I hardly fought the Scythinas at all). And one question before I finally shut up: does the limes provide def bonus for them if they occupy it even inside your borders? My guess would be yes but I had to make sure.

Seems we posted in the same time. Great job consul Traianus. Not only on your luck but your logistic skills too. Bravo! So we should wait for all the consuls before we start grading?

Thank you kindly, Senator Monarchus. We only only aim to follow your example.
Here is the updated Legio list. I'm not claiming it is 100% correct but is not far off.

I checked the save.

Maybe there is no need for Mercator in Aleria and Olbia, they have 3 commerce and 4 commerce so mercator wont make much diffrence.

Rome can be mircomanaged to 58 tax 24 research and still finish the preatorium in 4 turns

Some cities (like bovanium) with low surplus of food maybe wont benefit that much from aqaduct?

We sell some granaries when we have a diffrent government?


/ The gestapo micromanager

That was never my strong point. But your arguements seem strong to me. Consul Olivera will take note, I'm sure.

I am leaving from Wed to Tue for a week of diving (yeeeepeee, holidays at last), and it is likely I won't be able to play my consulship beforehand. You guys go ahead, I'll join in back ASAP, and hopefully the 3rd Punic War will be over by then.
Does it mean I'm the next consul or should we still wait for Pink?

Why don't we give him a double when he comes back? I personally can't wait to see what will happen next. This has been a thrilling civ experience so far! Must be the best sucession game ever! And I should know - I've only played one!

Ok so I'll start tonight as Consul.
Plan :
1) Attack Illirya at last
2) Finish Cartage
3) Finish Numidia
4) Finish Spain
5) And more if time :D

you're just dying to get stuck in, aren't you? I hate those Illyrians! 'Kill zem... Kill zem all!'

you're just dying to get stuck in, aren't you? I hate those Illyrians! 'Kill zem... Kill zem all!'

DEATH TO THE ILLIRYANS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!!!
*charges downhill followed by the disciplined trot of the Legionnaires toward ranks after ranks of tresor-hungry pirates*

I hate Illiryans. Lets raze all their cities and stick Queen Teuta's head on a pole ! :D

First part :
183BC :
Moved some units
Micromanaged rome
Signed a ROP for 1g with Iberia, most of our cities there are defenseless and would fall in case of a sneak attack plus most of our forces are busy elsewhere
Declared war on Illirya and destroyed a nearby Pirate

IBT :
Cartage attacks our small group in front of Utica with 2 Eques. 1 gets killed, leaving 1 hp to the Legio, the other kills a miles Socius while losing 1 hp
Lots of movement toward Aquileia
War weariness sets in heavily and many cities fall into disorder

182BC:
Utica falls without a loss and we avenge the death of our miles Socius
A lone Cartago units in the Alps gets destroyed but at the price of 1 velites
An ennemy quinquiremis summae is sunked near Utica
4 units are destroyed near Aquileia at the cost of 4 velites
To remove the effect of IBT war weariness, I put automated governors in every city to maintain happiness
However, the gpt goes from +6 to –13

181BC :
Killed 2 pirates near Aquileia without loss and a consular army moves in front of Salonae
A consular army kills a sacred band in Cartage
An elephant is killed in front of Utica with a loss of 1 velites
Second Scipio army assembled in front of Hyppo reggius and starts its work with a phalanx libianus
All in all a pretty good turn I think. With our forces in front of Salonae and Cartage, we are about to deal a terrible blow to the enemies of the Republic.
Only problem, I’m running –10gpt deficit. I hope it will be better after Praetorium is built in 2 turns or I’m going to have to make some serious restructuration

IBT :
Romans cry as they hear a terrible news : the city of Gades revolts and joins the Cartaginian empire! We have no troops in Spain to mount a counter-assault. Should Consul Castor go into the Temple of Reloads and pray the All Mighty RNG for better results?
By the way, Traianus, you should have left a least 1 unit in every city without a praesidium and build praesidium in every defenseless city.

Maibe you should.......RELOAD!! And maibe take better care of the poor Velites ;). Good job for the rest!

It really is hard to maintain culture in this scenario, so yes RELOAD!!!!!
Maybe we should raze Gades to the ground for their treachery? :crazyeye:

Yes, take care of our poor velites.

Besides that, good show!

By the way, Traianus, you should have left a least 1 unit in every city without a praesidium and build praesidium in every defenseless city.

Again, I was following the example set by the previous consul, who left many cities undefended. That's not something I would ever do playing epic. But, I have consistently failed to get good results playing RFRE solo. So when I see things like that I asume that these are tactical decisions.

But it won't happen again!