Greetings Civilians

Im a stout civ supporter, but at this time I don’t have the expertise to design a civ. I there is some one out there who can assist me to design an Afrikaner civilization, I will gladly assist in any way.

Regards

What do you reckon of for leaders - two out of Retief, Kruger and Smuts almost certainly, but which two?

And commandos of course. It's hard to imagine a civ with a more obvious UU :)

Thank you for the interest.

Good question. All three are significant.

Retief was definitely a leader made a large contribution to the identity of the Afrikaners, although overshadowed by death and Bloedrivier. A true Christian Afrikaner Pioneer.

Paul Kruger had a major impact on the Republics and the Anglo-Boer War, together contributing to Afrikaner identity as an Christian Afrikaner statesman. Some say that he shared in the popularity then with that of Mr Nelson Mandela has today.

Jan Smuts was one of the great driving forces of the League of Nations that became the United Nations. Played a great role in South Africa during the Anglo-Boer War and both World Wars. Although not criticised for not being an Afrikaner Nationalist he was definitely a man before his time. An Afrikaner General and Christian Statesman.

Retief being a my favourite and an example of an Afrikaner Christian, he did not make an significant international contribution in comparison with Kruger and Smuts.

The difference between a Politician and a statesman is that a politician thinks of the next election, whilst a statesman thinks of the next generation.

If I would name the 5 greatest statesmen coming from South Africa, they would be as follows:
Nelson Mandela
Mahatma Gandhi
Paul Kruger
Jan Smuts
PW Botha (Maybe)

But as Afrikaner leaders for CIV4 I would nominate Kruger and Smuts.

Regarding the UU, it seems that you are well informed. The commando actually started during the 'Groottrek'. Militia on horseback, later revered to by the English during the Anglo-Boer War as Mounted Cavalry (Kommando). I also know that its written that the Mounted Cavalry (Kommando) was the best mounted cavalry the English have ever fought against and used guerrilla tactics which was name by the Boers(Afrikaners) as Blits (Blitz) that was studied by the Germans before the WW2.

The Elite Special forces that dominated special forces during the 70' and 80's was known as the Recces(Recce) and were significant for defeating communism in Angola. My opinion is that the culture from the Mounted Cavalry (Kommando) was just brought over to the Recces.

In conclusion:
Paul Kruger
Jan Smuts
Kommando (Mounted Cavalry) as UU.

Please let me know were I can assist.

Regards

I very much like the idea of the Afrikaner being one of the civilisations included, as they had an icredible impact on the world then and now. I also like Smuts as a great leader, but wonder what you would say about Andries Pretorious? He is remembered by most for the battle of Blood River, but he was instrumental at the formation of both the brief Republic of Natalia(?) and the Transvaal or Zuid Afrikaanse Republiek.

He was an established diplomat with regular contact with both British and local African tribes.

But the impact of the Afrikaner is undeniable.

Great day!

You might find some people who can help you in the "Creation & Cusomizations" section. There would be people in that area who could help you with the development side of it, if it interests them.

There is a "New Civilizations" sub section there, but I think that might only be for finished civ mods. Have a look and see (if you haven't allready).

Thank you for the support.

Yes, Andreis Pretorius was a great Afrikaner Commandant-General and no Afrikaner can dispute his greatness. Thael described him as "the ablest leader and most perfect representative of the Emigrant Farmers.

The question is how he compares with Kruger and Smuts? Yes he was a influential and diplomatic in the negotiations with both natives and British, but Kruger and Smuts had a greater International contribution. Both the latter made significant contributions towards the Afrikaners ever struggle for recognition - which I believe Pretorius did as well - but reading history and comparing them, one get the a clear picture that Pretorius is shadowed a bit by Kruger and Smuts.

Cobus, what is your opinion regarding the UU?

Thread moved to Creation & Customization.

Mahatma Gandhi
Woohoo man, he was Indian ;)

Maybe will try it... But later... Now here's a lot of work to do.

Woohoo man, he was Indian ;)


That is what I like about this forum, an opportunity to share info and the opportunity to learn. :)

My referral was statesmen from South Africa. Gandhi's development as a statesman started in South Africa from 1893–1914. He moved to Natal when he was 24 year old which up to today is sometimes revered to as little India. With the largest Indian community outside of India living in Durban. He continually suffered from stage fright when acting as a barrister.

South Africa changed him dramatically, as he faced the discrimination that was commonly directed at blacks and Indians in that country. One day in court in the city of Durban, the magistrate asked him to remove his turban. Gandhi refused to do so, and stormed out of the courtroom. In another incident, he was thrown off a train at Pietermaritzburg, after refusing to move from the first class coach to a third class compartment, normally used by colour peoples, while holding a valid first class ticket. Later, travelling further on by stagecoach, he was beaten by a driver for refusing to travel on the footboard to make room for a European passenger. He suffered other hardships on the journey as well, including being barred from many hotels on account of his race. This incident has been acknowledged by several biographers as a turning point in his life that would serve as the catalyst for his activism later in life. It was through witnessing first-hand the racism, prejudice and injustice against Indians in South Africa that Gandhi started to question his people's status, and his own place in society.

But let us return our focus to the Afrikaners. ;)

Aren't Afrikaaners just Dutch people opressing blacks in South Africa?

Let's not start the flaming and trolling.

But let us return our focus to the Afrikaners. ;)

Well, let's see what is needed.

Graphics (I'm not a graphic maker):
-cavalry reskin for the UU (I think a reskinned cavalry would to do the job)
-cavalry button reskin
-Flagdecal
-Civbutton
-Pictures of the Leaders
-Buttons for the Leaders

Xml:
-list of cities
-civipedia for UU
-civipedia for the Leaders
-civipedia for the Civ itself
-some xml to make it work

Chamaedrys

I have started with some of the steps mentioned in 'setup of a civ' by Charcoal, but I’m having some difficulty. My email address is abriek@acdp.fsl.gov.za. Email me then I will send you what I have thus far. I will help as far as possible.

I got as far as the buttons. But I don’t get the development of the buttons that clearly. Maybe some1 can do that for us?

Maybe we can run this as project, with everyone chipping in. I make myself available to assist with future projects similar to this one.

South Africa changed him dramatically, as he faced the discrimination that was commonly directed at blacks and Indians in that country. One day in court in the city of Durban, the magistrate asked him to remove his turban. Gandhi refused to do so, and stormed out of the courtroom. In another incident, he was thrown off a train at Pietermaritzburg, after refusing to move from the first class coach to a third class compartment, normally used by colour peoples, while holding a valid first class ticket. Later, travelling further on by stagecoach, he was beaten by a driver for refusing to travel on the footboard to make room for a European passenger. He suffered other hardships on the journey as well, including being barred from many hotels on account of his race. This incident has been acknowledged by several biographers as a turning point in his life that would serve as the catalyst for his activism later in life. It was through witnessing first-hand the racism, prejudice and injustice against Indians in South Africa that Gandhi started to question his people's status, and his own place in society.

He also indulged in a bit of it himself.

http://www.trinicenter.com/oops/gandhi.html

Turner, thanks for putting the discussion back on the right track.

It seems that there is no dispute as to the uu. Either everybody is very informed, or not informed enough to make a suggestion... I like the first reason! Mr. Kilian has the right idea with the cavalry unit, but I think a better choice for a name might be "ruiter" or rider. The ruiter is the unit to whom so much is attributed including evolving gorilla warfare, being incredible scouts, firing accuratly while riding or dismounting and ending the British use of cavalry equiped with a lance. "Kommando" refers to the collective of ruiters forming a 'squad'.

You also made a good suggestion with the "recce". They deffinetly were the best followed by the rest. Reading up on some of their exploits amazes. But now we have to look at the impact they had. Even though they dominated covert opperations in the 60's, 70's and 80's not much is known internationally about what they did. Not that fame should be a guideline (Pretorius) but how much evolved, changed and developed from their actions. So much can be attributed to the ruiters, but can you think of something lasting that the recce's can be credited for?

So can we expect the Afrikaner to be completed and ready to be included in the expantion?

I have an import question: Which Flag should the Afrikaaners use? I played a bit with my dds editor and created the blue-white-orange tricolor. Did you think this represented the Afrikaaners well?

Definetly not! The orange, white and blue represents something that was not originally Afrikaner. That flag was adopted for the whole country including the British influance. No offense meant, but that takes away from as accurate portrayal as possible for the Afrikaner. The two options would be the "Vierkleur" or Four Colour of the ZAR (Zuid Afrikaanse Republiek) or the flag of the Republic of the Orange Free State. Give me a minute to produce them for you...

122533
122534
I hope I did the attaching correctly... These are the flags to consider.

OKay. I think the first flag would look better on the game stag poles.

Thanks for all the assistance.

Although we have respect for both republics and both flags, the 'Vierkleur' is a bit more senior than the flag of the Republiek van de Oranje Vrijstaat. We could add both, but that will just look like a circus.

To concede, I would suggest the 'vierkleur' for the simple fact that most Afrikaners still primary identify with the Vierkleur and secondary with the Oranje Vrystaat.

The UU naming is between the

1. Boere Kommando (Collectively)
2. Ruiter (Singular)

Both are recognized. I probably depend on you graphic settings! Hehehe! The question that I believe needs to be answered is: Does a Civ unit represent a group of the same unit or a single (3) unit?

I think that a unit in the game represents several units in the real world.



now i have do some work ;-)

Chamaedrys

It seems that there is a problem with the link. I did revere it to the administrators.

Chamaedrys, you’ve given me an idea. I suggest we use the 'Vierkleur', the flag with the green inside and make the color of the civ orange, which correlates with the oranje flag.

What do you think? I hope you received my email earlier today which clarifies the issue on which flag is more senior than the other.

Sorry, Abrie but I don't received your email.

Now, I have made a vierkleur flag and a button. I think it would fit with the orange colour. Orange would make sense and it provides a good contrast agaist the English White and and the Mali Brown.
If you send me pictures of the Leaders I could make the Leader portraits (no animations, of cause) and the Leader buttons.

So it is now to bring more information into the mod. Could you make Pedia texts about the Leaders, the UU and the Civilization it self?

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/Kommandokaapstad.JPG

Great stuff! It looks good.

It seems that I'm having trouble to send email to you. If you dont mind, I have spoke to White Rabit and requested a UU. He realy seems good with the designing of units.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=163041&page=4

I have requested a few changes to the traditional look of the cavalry. Have a look at the above thread.

I will post the names of towns in to this post. I will also forward you the images and the pedia info.

Regards

I have allready made a cavalry reskin (brown cavalry). In the picture above you can see it without gun belts, in the unit-graphics-thread is a screenshot with gun belts.
With the pedia and the pictures, the Afrikaaners are ready to step in the Civ4 universe. :)

Here are the town names:

Pretoria
Johannesburg
Bloemfontein
Pietermaritzburg
Potchefstroom
Lydenburg
Zoutpansberg
Vryheid
Swellendam
Graaff Reinet
Winburg
Goshen
Peit Retief
Utrecht
Vryburg
Windhoek
Klerksdorp
Walvisbaai
Rustenburg
Potgieters Rust
Middelburg
Heidelberg
Nylstroom
Heilbron
Frankfort
Witbank
Kroonstad
Bethlehem
Vereeniging
Sasolburg
Springbok
Nelspruit
Pietersburg
Louis Trichardt
Grootfontein
Keetmanshoop
Welkom
Oranjemund
Orania
Calvinia
Hertzogville
Petrusburg
Reitz
Koffiefontein
Dewetsdorp
Ventersdorp
Bothaville
Ficksburg
Ventersburg
Paul Roux
Paulpietersburg

Chamaedrys

Im emailing you a short and long history of Paul Kruger. You can choose which one you want to use.

Im working on Jan Smuts.

Chamaedrys

I have emailed you the history on Smuts. Chech your mail.

Regards

Chamaedrys

I have emailed you the history on the Afrikaners. Chech your mail.

Regards

Chamaedrys, to assist you with the Great People list, I have condensed it and categorized it accordingly. I welcome people to make suggestions and I’m open for change.

Great Prophets
Siener van Rensburg
Beyers Naudé
Piet Retief
Johanna Brandt
Johan Heynz

Great Merchants
Anton Rupert
Frederik van Zyl Slabbert
Prof. F.R. Tomlinson
Louis Trichardt
Prof. D.G. Franzsen
Raymond Ackerman
E.H.D Arndt
S.S. Brand
G. De Kock
G.L. De Wet

Great Artists
Totius
Charlize Theron
A.G. Visser
Leon Schuster
C.L. Leipoldt
Casper de Vries
N.P. van Wyk Louw
Koos Kombuis
D.J. Opperman
Koos du Plessis
T.T. Cloete
Arnold Vosloo
J.M. Coetzee
Breyten Breytenbach
Olive Schreiner
Eugene Marais
Richard E. Grant
Lina Spies
T.T. Cloete
Ettienne le Roux
Ernst van Heerden
Antjie Krog
André P Brink
Athol Fugard
Laurens van der Post


Great Engineers
J.B.M. Hertzog
Andries Pretorius
Dr. M.M. Loubser
Hendrik Potgieter
F.W. de Klerk
Dr. W.L. Grant
Louis Botha
Dr. N. Stutterheim
P.W. Botha
Dr. J.J. Wannenburg
D.F. Malan
Dr. H.G. Denkhaus
J.G. Strijdom
Prof. L. van Biljon
Jan Breytenbach
Prof. D.G. Kröger
Willem Boonzaier
Prof. J.D. van Wyk
Prof. G. van R. Marais
Prof. J.A.G. Malherbe

Great Scientists
Dr Christiaan Barnard
Dr Wouter Basson
Dr. E.C.N. van Hoepen
Dr.T.E.W. Schumann
Dr.P.J. du Toit
Dr.H.O. Mönnig
Dr.A.I. Malan
Dr.R.J. Ortlepp
Prof. C.G.S. de Villiers
Prof. D.L. Scholtz
Dr.S.J. du Plessis
Dr.R. Campbell Begg
Prof. S. Meiring Naudé
Prof. H.L. de Waal
Dr.A.J. Hesse
Prof. J.J. Theron
Dr.D.G. Steyn
Prof. H.A.W. Verleger
Dr.L.T. Nel
Dr.F.J. de Villiers
Dr.T.J.W. Jorden
Dr.C.S. Grobbelaar
Dr.C.R. van der Merwe
Prof. W.O. Neitz
Dr.A.J. Petrick
Prof. D.J. Malan
Dr.L.D. Boonstra
Prof. I. de V. Malherbe
Prof. M.W. Henning
Dr.J.N. van Niekerk
Prof. H. Rund
Prof. H.G.W.J. Schweickerdt
Prof. G.W. Perold
Prof. T.W. Gevers
Prof. B.J. Dippenaar
Prof. O.S. Heyns
Dr.A. Strasheim
Prof. G. Eloff
Prof. J.D.J. Hofmeyr
Dr.P.R. Enslin
Prof. D.M. Joubert
Prof. A.J. Brink
Prof. Jan H. van der Merwe
Prof. P.A.J. Ryke
Prof. D.G. Roux
Prof. D.R. Osterhoff
Dr.W.P. de Kock
Prof. W.E. Frahn
Prof. H.P. Wassermann
Prof. H.S. Steyn
Prof. J.A. van Eeden
Prof. V. Pretorius
Prof. John de Villiers
Prof. D.G. Haylett
Prof. P.H. Stoker

Chamaedrys

The discription on the UU is going to take some time, but I will make work of it and have it ready asap.

Thank you

1. Boere Kommando (Collectively)
2. Ruiter (Singular)


Go with the singular - the game as a whole does.

Here are the text for the civilopedia, thus far. Im working on the text for UU.

Thank you

O.K.

I have added the City list and the English pedia texts for both leaders and the Afrikaaners themselves.
You posted a lot of Great Afrikaaners, so I will add some of them as Great People.

Let us see what is left:

-Pictures of Paul Kruger and Jan C. Smuts
-Pedia text for the UU
-Some graphic improvent :rolleyes:

I wanted to hear your opinion about some settings I have made:
I gave the Afrikaaners 'Agriculture' and 'Hunting' as free techs.
Jan Smuts gets the 'Industrious' and the 'Organized' trait to simulated his statesmanship. Paul Kruger gets the 'Financial' and the 'Aggressive' trait because these traits are useful in his historical situation.

Jan Smuts 'Industrious' and 'Organized' traits seems to fit the profile 100%

Paul Krugers 'Aggressive' trait in don’t know, I'll have to think about that one. His financial trait I understand with the whole discovery of gold etc.

Here are the photo's. Just indicate if you are not satisfied. I will see what I can do.

Hunting and Agriculture seems fine. We could've used mysticism as well, due to the Afrikaners stout Protestant Christianity.

In general it's fine.

Will the Afrikaners be able to participate in Multiplayer games?

Do you want me to condense the Great People for you in the 5 categories?

the bottom flag is the way to go id say. they both depict the afrikaaners heritage but the influence of the top one is a bit less... in my opinion.. id like the old south african flag as the civ flag, but thats my personal preference and i know you wouldnt use it as it wouldnt be accepted by the majority of people who recognise what it stands for... how about a voortrekker instead of a settler?? (lol)

what about cape town?? thats where the first afrikaaner settlement was... they eventually moved from there when the british took over but it was theirs initially.. call it kaapstad mayb. im not the most clued up on the afrikaaners history though so if u have other reasons not to include it then fair enough.. i like u having pietermaritzburg in at 4 though thats where im from lol

edit:mayb i should have read the whole thread before making this suggestion lol or at least waited for the pictures to load...looks great!!!

id also like to know what ur gonna have the leaders say in a game... although i probly wouldnt play as anyone else once ive got this civ, ill always have the other one in there..too bad you cant do it in afrikaans... that would really bring the game home... mayb some historical references?? if i had any i would suggest them but my knowledge is massively lacking on south african history unfortunately...

Hallo everybody! I'm back after a nice vacation.

So, where are we? Okay:1. Great work with the towns. I think there are a couple of interesting place-names. Good stuff!

2. I agree with Jan Smuts as Organised and Indus., however the agressive with Kruger is maybe a bit debateble. Diplomatic would have been great, but what about expansive or spiritual?

3. Wow! I'm very impressed with the flag, colour and the uu! It looks great!

4. I also agree with hunting and agriculture, although the Christian theme throughout the Afrikaners is very strong.

5.I'll do some research on the ruiter as well as I do have a lot of info, but it is scattered and not very structured. The ruiters for example helped to bring an end to the British cavalry with a lance. They were pioneers of gorilla warfare. And then there is the skill: how they grew up on horses on how that contributed to being able to shoot while riding, dismounting and then be off again before being fired upon. Oh, and not just shooting, but doing it accurately!

Soooo.... what's next?

@Hallo Flippie

Thank you for your participation. Kaapstad was established by the Dutch and not the Afrikaners.

We will make work of your suggestions. Thank you verry much.

@Hallo Cobus.

Nice to have you back.

@Cobus

Wat dink jy van my Groot Persone lys? Ek het bietjie navorsing gedoen en die lys van Havenga- en Hertogprys wenners op gespoor. Daar is nog baie mense wat bygevoeg kan word.

Laat weet wat jy dink daarvan.

Groete

Hi
I think it is a great Idea to include the Afrikaner in the Civilization family. I feel that Paul Kruger would be the right person to nominate as a leader; he played a major part in the recognition of the Afrikaner as a nation.

The commando would be a good choice for the UU, but then we need to make it very unique. Maybe after we figured the Afrikaner civilization out we can include a scenario, just to complete the package :)

Any one knows what program can be used to create the units, 3D studio Max, maybe?

And then there is the skill: how they grew up on horses on how that contributed to being able to shoot while riding, dismounting and then be off again before being fired upon. Oh, and not just shooting, but doing it accurately!

They certainly showed up our extremely complacent, decadent military establishment. You may know Kipling's famous 'The Islanders'...

http://www.poetryloverspage.com/yevgeny/okudjava/islanders.html

Fenced by your careful fathers, ringed by your leaden seas,
Long did ye wake in quiet and long lie down at ease;
Till Ye said of Strife, "What is it?" of the Sword, "It is far from
our ken";
Till ye made a sport of your shrunken hosts and a toy of your
armed men.
Ye stopped your ears to the warning-ye would neither look
nor heed-
Ye set your leisure before their toil and your lusts above their
need.
[...]
Then were the judgments loosened; then was your shame
revealed,
At the hands of a little people, few but apt in the field.
Yet ye were saved by a remnant (and your land's long-suffering
star),
When your strong men cheered in their millions while your
striplings went to the war.
Sons of the sheltered city-unmade, unhandled, unmeet-
Ye pushed them raw to the battle as ye picked them raw from
the street.
[...]
And ye vaunted your fathomless power, and ye flaunted your
iron pride,
Ere ye fawned on the Younger Nations for the men who could
shoot and ride!
Then ye returned to your trinkets; then ye contented your souls
With the flannelled fools at the wicket or the muddied oafs at
the goals.
[...]

Greetings Chamaedrys

What is the status of the development. What do you still need?

Regards

gooi more.. it must be close by now.. plz god say its close!!

Hallo Abrie!

I adapted the xml to the new patch. What I still need is:

-A portrait of Jan Smuts

-A portrait of Paul Kruger

-A Text for the UU

-Unique Diplomatic Greetings!!! You know: Julius offers salad, Kathrine offers ..aehm...relations, Genghis says that his troops are superior and so on. I just figured out how to add these Greets. So we can let them say something special. The Greetings shouldn't be long just something that reflect the personality of the leader and the civ.

Gruß

Chamaedrys

Greetings Duitser

I have posted portraits of J Smuts and P Kruger on the second page. Are those fine?

Please take note that I have ammended the Town names and the great peoples list. Compare it to the files that you created.

Regards

PS Hey Flippie. We are almost finished. Chamaedrys is doing a GREAT job at it. Regards

Hallo Everyone!

I have made the first release of our mod. Now every player can download and enjoy it.;)

Thank you Chamaedrys

Consider me a friend and assistant. In my limited expertise I will assist you with some of your projects.

I'll have the info we still need ready, asap.

I refer you all to the unique unit release page of the Afrikaner Unit. White Rabbit did a GREAT job and incorporating it with Chamaedrys complete package, it will realy look absolutelty stunning.

Boer Commando (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=168535) by White Rabbit

Thanks guys.

Chamaedrys, I believe we still need the following:
1) Leader(s) greeting
2) Text for the UU
3) ?

I will make work of these. I just want to remind you that 'Afrikaners' is actualy spelled with 1 'A'.

Thank you

WOW! This is great! Thanks to everybody who helped with this. The Afrikaner can be proud with this piece of workmanship. I love the beard and ammo belt!

Will I now be able to play with the Afrikaner multiplayer as well? (After I download the mod obviously)

It's a great work what you've done.
What would be the Unique Building for the Warlords expansion? (Please, give ideas, even if you don't think about adding the UB)