you know who you are.

here's the save:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/issues1.SAV

lets discuss the vc.

Subscribed and eager to watch what AK has come up with.:)

pix to follow

ohoh...what now? OK I'm in.

oscillating all war, that's it. if i did it right this is tiny. who wants to go first?

Where's all the people? :)

bede and harriet commited on PMs

Are you going to have lurker turns? :D

EDIT: Sorry about the spam, I had accidentally unsubscribed.

ansar, now I have to do a roster. and there will not be lurker turns.

bede, cause my city placement sucks
harriet, cause tis always good to go after bede
whomp, cause he hath no hair and likes cookies
scout, just cause
ak
ansar, cause you've responded too many times.

membership is now closed

Oscillating war... is that where we alternate whacking others? What do we do if we're stuck on a landmass with only one neighbor? How will we "oscillate"?

Oh yeah - count me in for a slugfest...

IIRC, NOW works like you are AW against the first person you meet and stay AW until you kill them, which then you declare AW on another civ and kill it and further...

Reporting for duty. :salute:

I'm scared to ask what civ and level. Maybe the Zulu at Sid? :eek: Guess I'll soon find out, huh? :hmm:

Ooooh, I wanna watch!

How about this variant, no optional techs?

How about this variant, no optional techs?
You have GOT to be kidding. No Monarchy or Republic, no knights or cavs? I don't think so.

I checked the game settings. We're the Iroquois at Monarch, but it's not a tiny map. It's a standard 70% archipeligo, wet, temperate, 4 billion, roaming barbs. It also has respawn AI turned ON and scientific leaders turned OFF. Our 7 opponents are Germany, Inca, England, Maya, Aztecs, Sumeria and Arabia.

If we're on a small island, we may not have anyone to fight at all for awhile. :mischief:

The only governments that you would legally be able to have is either Despotism or Feudalism. This will be a challenge.

The only governments that you would legally be able to have is either Despotism or Feudalism. This will be a challenge.
Um, we just recently finished that 100k game and I kinda think I speak for all of us as having had our fill of feudalism for awhile...an MMing nightmare challenge. :p

That solves it then. You will stay as a despot for the whole game then. ;)

Another variant we could consider is adding a "defiant" element for civs we're not at war with.
-No caving into demands (it's rude to demand our cash)
-Terms of peace must be to our benefit (compensation for their rudeness)
- Boot orders (it's our land and trespassing is not allowed)
- No ROPs, MA's, MPPS's, embassies (we won't walk on their lands if they won't walk on ours and we're a proud people so we don't need help)
- if one of our cities is razed we are at AW with that civ until they're finished off and we must raze all of their cities (This would be the ultimate insult. If they raze one of our cities our people will never forget and will raze all of their cities until they're finished)...Moral of this story is don't let a city get razed.

Another variant we could consider is adding a "defiant" element for civs we're not at war with.
-No caving into demands (it's rude to demand our cash)
-Terms of peace must be to our benefit (compensation for their rudeness)
- Boot orders (it's our land and trespassing is not allowed)
- No ROPs, MA's, MPPS's, embassies (we won't walk on their lands if they won't walk on ours and we're a proud people so we don't need help)
- if one of our cities is razed we are at AW with that civ until they're finished off and we must raze all of their cities (This would be the ultimate insult. If they raze one of our cities our people will never forget and will raze all of their cities until they're finished)...Moral of this story is don't let a city get razed.

Sounds fun. :goodjob:

Tupacatha added the fun element that you couldn't build workers once you sacked your first AI city, and for every two slave worker captured, you had to return one native worker to a city's pop. Pretty soon you have only slave labor. Kinda fitting for a proud civ. Oh, and you could never keep a city, only raze it. Just to up the blood-thirsty quotient. Of course, if you're playing as the Iroquois, that would be almost the same game as Chief Tupacatha's Most Excellent Adventure (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=162964) but what the heck. Still fun. Constant challenge, especially at the start when you can't give in to extortion. gmaharriet should love it.

Checking in the lurker's hotel.

Constant challenge, especially at the start when you can't give in to extortion. gmaharriet should love it.
OK, I see 4 separate challenges being proposed here:
1. Always at war with someone.
2. Defiant to others who we are not (yet) at war with.
3. No good governments or horse units with no optional techs.
4. Replace our faster workers with slaves only (on an 'peligo map?).

I'd see it as plenty challenging to do #1 (AK's original proposal) plus maybe one of the others...either #2 or #4. I've never tried any of them, and all 4 at once I'm having trouble getting my Idiot mind around. :crazyeye:

I'd say the no good governments restriction is a game-killer. But that's just my comment from the sidelines. Will be watching this one with much interest regardless.

I'd say the no good governments restriction is a game-killer.
I'm in complete agreement with you about that!!!

My concern about switching to slaves only on a 'peligo map is the logistics of getting slaves back to our home island in the relatively early game. We'd not only need boats to move our military out, but also to get the slaves home, initially on boats with small passenger capacities. By the time we get to rails, there may be few or no workers to build them. Not saying it's a bad idea, but I'm having trouble visualizing it. I haven't read the game you mentioned.

I have an additional idea. When you get in the IA, you have to beeline for Fascism and be fascist for the rest of the game.

Please, no more variant suggestions. Admiral Kutzov, please... please
Tell us what variant this is going to be
give us the other details (world size, tribe, etc.)
post an order-of-go
post a screenshot
start the game already.

I panicked and reverted to classic mode:

C3C 1.22 Patch
Level: monarch
Variant: Always War
Map Type: panagea
Size: tiny

Civilization: Gandhi
Age: 5B
Temperature: warm
Climate: arid
Barbarians: hmm?
Rivals: Random
AI Aggression: hmm?

Stolen from Handy, shamelessly:

Always War Boilerplate as we play it.
You may only never trade when you first meet with a civilization, and must declare war on the same turn you meet a civ after trading is complete. If you see a new AI unit, you must make contact & declare war that turn. Absolutely no GPT trades allowed. If you see a new face on F4, you are obligated to declare war that turn (after trading). Players must declare war if they are exploring and see AI units, but are not required to actually attack the units they come in contact with. No peace treaties, ever. You may check F4 as often as you like to spy on the AI's tech, resources, luxuries & city count.

Discuss any move that seems exploitive before doing it with the team. Although there are not too many exploits available in AW, we’ll follow the forbidden blatant exploits banned by GOTM and RBCiv such as no "Free Wealth". Other normal game exploits such as "Baiting the AI" with an empty city to create a kill zone are an AW tradition and are allowed. Also, you ARE allowed to initially keep a city, move a settler to the same spot as the city, and then abandon and immediately resettle. This is considered an exploit in RBCiv rules, but is okay in our AW games. In addition if you need to build a city one square deeper into enemy territory just to move borders to steal a resource, go for it. We may keep or raze cities, and can keep slaves. You may whip at will, including captured cities or cities where all citizens are unhappy.

SG Stuff
You have 24 hours for an "I got it" and 72 to play. If you need a one day extension, then mention this before the 72 hours are up. Players can work out skips between themselves, just post a message to the thread. If you can't play within 72 total, switch places or ask for a skip. We will play 10 turns at first, and possibly fewer later (5) if the turns begin to take too long.

Lucky candle to light the way. I can't seem to upload the save or picture at this time. tommorrow. hopefully scout can sleep tonight

ansar, now I have to do a roster. and there will not be lurker turns.

bede, cause my city placement sucks
harriet, cause tis always good to go after bede
whomp, cause he hath no hair and likes cookies
scout, just cause
ak
ansar, cause you've responded too many times.

membership is now closed
I presume this is still the "order of go". :)

Lots of good challenges for me here (translated: things I've never tried), but at least I get the general idea. My last AW was at Regent last summer, and it's my first try at pangea, arid, or India, so this should be interesting. I'm looking forward to seeing the map. :D

I'd ask for a clarification of the rules on one point. The most current Handy Rules, IIRC, forbid trading at all times, even on first meetings. The AK post is unclear on this.

Just thought I'd try to help. Before the mayhem begins. Please let me know if I'm in line for a time out.

Handy may have changed his current rules, but this seems pretty clear as AK posted it (with the exception of the "n" in (n)ever and looks like a typo. :p
You may only never trade when you first meet with a civilization, and must declare war on the same turn you meet a civ after trading is complete. If you see a new AI unit, you must make contact & declare war that turn. Absolutely no GPT trades allowed. If you see a new face on F4, you are obligated to declare war that turn (after trading).

AK, can you confirm this please?

You can only never trade.

Yes, it seems... how can I put this...foolish?:joke:

classic handy rules. I'll start this when I can breath normally again. Nose still hurts.

classic handy rules. I'll start this when I can breath normally again. Nose still hurts.
What happened? Did you have a cold? or did you run into a door? :confused:

see the out of pocket thread

see the out of pocket thread
http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-5/180352/VerySad.gifOuch!!! I'm sorry to hear that. http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-5/180352/642731hugs.gif

So many idiots, so little progress.

lets wait till September when gma is free to play. :hammer:

lets wait till September when gma is free to play. :hammer:
Aw, thank you for your thoughtfulness, Ansar. I don't want to hold things up if others want to get this going, but I am looking forward to the opportunity to learn more about how to approach an AW game. I have VERY little experience at it. Learning with friends is always a delight. :)

Hey it is October, almost November. What happened?

I would join AWM...a week later