View Full Version : AI offers free tech...!


Severus
Apr 15, 2006, 01:03 PM
I'm currently trying my first ever OCC game, small map, continents, 5 civs, epic speed on prince.

Needless to say i'm doing badly.... (mainly because i don't really have a clue what i'm doing, what the best techs to beeline for are etc.) I've ended up on my own continent with a lot of good resources like marble out of reach until my culture becomes legendary :cry: though i did manage to get the pyramids and the oracle (dont usually go for the pyramids in normal games as i never run representation on prince level until much later in the game but i figured i should be aiming on GPP and creating superspecialists to carry my science and get me back in the game.)

Anyway i'm isolated on my island apart from a size 6 barb city which keeps annoying me with archers but i dont mind as its nice xp for my units, and the only other civ i've met is Mali who are 2 squares away over the sea and who, at 1270AD, have a score of 1784 to my pathetic 477. I've got a healthy economy though due to my prophet superspecialists and have bought 3 techs from them to pull back to within 800 techs :lol:

I'd tried to buy another tech for cheap but Mansa refused. Fair enough i thought i'll just wait another couple of turns and see what happens next time when out of nowhere he offers me Horseback Riding for nothing!! (See screenshot)

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/musaoffersmaths.JPG

I didnt know whether to be happy or feel severly patronised, although needless to say i took it ;)

Anyway after all that i get to the point of my post. Has this happened to anyone else and is there some sort of power correlation that goes along with it (ie. if he's 8 times stronger than you he starts to take pity on you or something?) we weren't even on good terms, the only mod was the +1 for years of peace as you can see from the shot. Any ideas anyone?

Zanmato
Apr 15, 2006, 01:09 PM
Must be bug. :lol: Should report it.
I never get anything like that on Noble, never mind Prince. If it's free though I will take anything.

Severus
Apr 15, 2006, 01:18 PM
Oh i was definitely taking it no doubt about that!! (After hanging my head in shame for a couple of seconds)

Or it could be that the three techs i bought off him cost me much more than they're worth (at least than what i think they're worth.)
I cant remember exactly but one was definitely monothaism, about 180 beakers on epic i think which i paid 350 gold for, and the other two i definitely paid about double the gold compared to they're beaker value.

Could be if you do that enough the AI, or at least mansa, will gift you a tech off they're on back? (It's the fact that he contacted me with the idea that amazes me most).

smjjames
Apr 15, 2006, 01:24 PM
yea, haven't had an AI civ give me a free tech, usually if they give me a tech, they want something in return (usually some gold or another tech)

bigotry
Apr 15, 2006, 01:25 PM
Wow... I can't beleive what I am seeing. :o

Zanmato
Apr 15, 2006, 01:26 PM
Then I'm slighty surprised as to why it doesn't say '+n Our trades have been fair and forthright.' if you have been buying techs from him. I don't play too often at Prince but perhaps since the AI may not consider you a threat (yet) or perhaps they will want something else when they need it, they'll kind of 'butter you up' with freebies.

The-Hawk
Apr 15, 2006, 01:32 PM
Must be bug. :lol: Should report it.
I never get anything like that on Noble, never mind Prince. If it's free though I will take anything.

I've had an AI offer me a free tech in Immortal and Deity games. Also, on several occasions, I've asked for a free tech and they've given it to me.

Severus
Apr 15, 2006, 01:44 PM
but perhaps since the AI may not consider you a threat (yet) or perhaps they will want something else when they need it, they'll kind of 'butter you up' with freebies.

This is exactly what i'm thinking :) After i accepted he said words to the effect of "i am so glad you accepted, i'm sure this will benefit both of our peoples".
The thing is i've got nothing which he'd want, no tech which he doesn't have; only about 200 gold (and when i've got more i'll be buying another tech off him hopefully); and no military whatsoever (only 5 archers).

I dont know if playing with permanent alliances has anything to do with it? I've never played with this on before but thought i'd try it and see what happens.

Severus
Apr 15, 2006, 01:53 PM
I've had an AI offer me a free tech in Immortal and Deity games. Also, on several occasions, I've asked for a free tech and they've given it to me.

Yeah i've asked for and got free techs fairly regularly on Prince (especially from Hatty for some reason). Never played above Prince yet although i win 9 times out of 10 at this level. Have to make the leap at some point though (especially if this sort of thing happens more regularly... how easy must Deity level be with AI's giving you techs all the time??!) ;)

scooter
Apr 15, 2006, 02:35 PM
Wow thats something. Never seen an AI just show up and offer you one. I've gotten them for free by asking, but never been offered one.

InFlux5
Apr 15, 2006, 02:49 PM
It's happened to me. It would seem that it happens if you are lagging far behind, but have good relations.

Severus
Apr 15, 2006, 02:55 PM
This is turning into one of my most memorable games.... (mansa does it again!!)

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/musagivescalendar.JPG

It goes without saying i'm still around eight tech behind mansa, i've now made contact with the remaining civ's bismark, isabella and monty (there goes my hopes a peaceful game i think! i'm confucian, bismarck is christian, isabella is buddist and monty is hindu :scared:

I've already been dragged into a war against monty after bismarck asked me to join him and issy, but sued for peace and it only cost me 60 gold, a couple of turns later mansa comes calling... :)

Has anyone had the AI offer tech twice in one game before??

Severus
Apr 15, 2006, 02:58 PM
It's happened to me. It would seem that it happens if you are lagging far behind, but have good relations.

Damn!! Thought i might achieve a small slice of civ fanatic notoriety :lol:

GiantRaven
Apr 15, 2006, 03:01 PM
Wow MM is so friendly! He rules! :p

I think he must want to be a PA partner with you, that should help you win some

Sisiutil
Apr 15, 2006, 03:13 PM
The AI has never done that for me (and yes, I'm jealous and bitter). Though, as others have said above, I've asked for and gotten techs with the "Can you spare this for a good friend?" option. The closest I ever came to something like this was Louis giving me something like 1400 gold (all he had) out of the blue for an old, non-military tech--Calendar or something like that when it was around 1400 AD.

Now, if I were playing as Mansa and you were a low-scoring AI, I'd likely be doing this because I was looking to shore you up so you can be a cat's paw/buffer versus a rival Civ.

If that's what the AI is doing...wow. Smart AI.

murphy54
Apr 15, 2006, 03:40 PM
every action has a consequence ...so nothinq is for free...

Severus
Apr 15, 2006, 04:13 PM
Yeah Mansa is definitely a friendly guy...

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/musagiveseconomics.JPG

@ Sisiutil, I think you're right he wants me as an ally against spain and aztec. Bismarck's pleased with him while Issy's annoyed and Monty's furious (and i'm currently fighting Monty).
I can also get Bismarck to convert to confucianism for 330 gold; 2 defensive pacts and 2 PA's would be very sweet... (and military tradition will be researched in 11 turns... if Mansa doesnt give me it first ;) ) :lol:

GiantRaven
Apr 15, 2006, 04:20 PM
You can only have one PA

Wow...that's amazing...

Moonsinger
Apr 15, 2006, 05:44 PM
Must be bug. :lol: Should report it.
I never get anything like that on Noble, never mind Prince. If it's free though I will take anything.

They offered free tech to me all the time, and it was on Deity. I have noticed that whenever the AIs decided to offer me free tech out of their own free will and from the bottom of their good heart, it has been always something I really need. I guess they can read my mind.:blush:

Smokey McDope
Apr 15, 2006, 09:09 PM
You have to be REALLY far behind, such that you are the only civ without a tech, and an AI will toss you a bone. Consider it a bad thing to see AI offer you techs, you probably have a very slim chance at victory.

Zanmato
Apr 16, 2006, 05:07 AM
Maybe I should start playing at a higher level. I never lagged far behind on any of my Noble games to see an AI offer free techs although I never seem to gain that much of a tech lead either. It is indeed a smart Musa AI - he'll ask you to declare war next on a third party.

Severus
Apr 16, 2006, 05:08 AM
You have to be REALLY far behind, such that you are the only civ without a tech, and an AI will toss you a bone. Consider it a bad thing to see AI offer you techs, you probably have a very slim chance at victory.

Yep i was really far behind, but only to mansa in terms of tech. The third time when he offered economics he was the only civ to have it. Anyway like i said i was expecting to be really far behind seeing how it was my first ever attempt at OCC.

Anyway we formed a defensive pact and then a few turns later he elected to join his puny empire of around 43% of the world's land and pop to the glorious city of Beijing and about 20 turns later i'd wiped the Aztec, Spanish and Germans off the map to claim a conquest win :lol:

salty mud
Apr 16, 2006, 05:11 AM
I think he feels sorry for you! :lol:

I've had the AI offer me gifts before.

Severus
Apr 16, 2006, 05:13 AM
Maybe I should start playing at a higher level. I never lagged far behind on any of my Noble games to see an AI offer free techs although I never seem to gain that much of a tech lead either. It is indeed a smart Musa AI - he'll ask you to declare war next on a third party.

You should step up to prince. I played on Noble for a while, winning easily every game till i got the basics down but the step up to Prince makes it a FAR more enjoyable game. That said, i'm finding it easy to get and maintain a tech lead now so i'll be stepping up to Monarch next couple of games.

GiantRaven
Apr 16, 2006, 10:27 AM
:lol:

I just realised that Cyrus and Asoka tend to do this a lot in my games

Or at least offering plentiful trades that work well for me

Cristoval
Apr 17, 2006, 03:50 PM
I have also been given a free tech, but from Asoka, when I was playing as Persia on a crowded pangea map, cant remember what tech though. Asoka had the biggest empire, and was the most advanced. I have to say I did horrible that game, civs kept declaring war on me, like Rome! Guess i'm good enough for noble yet.( Yes noble.)

Mad Professor
Apr 17, 2006, 07:57 PM
You have to be REALLY far behind, such that you are the only civ without a tech, and an AI will toss you a bone. Consider it a bad thing to see AI offer you techs, you probably have a very slim chance at victory.

<chuckle> I don't know - the sheer novelty would be worth being that far behind. I had to pick my jaw up off the floor after the first post of this thread. I'm not sure what metaphor to use now I'm onto reading the second page.

I'm hoping someone will say there's a secret to getting this kind of generousity in AI's and not just being so far behind. It doesn't make a great strategy if the only way to get it is to get way behind! :(

Mad Professor
Apr 17, 2006, 08:00 PM
You should step up to prince. I played on Noble for a while, winning easily every game till i got the basics down but the step up to Prince makes it a FAR more enjoyable game. That said, i'm finding it easy to get and maintain a tech lead now so i'll be stepping up to Monarch next couple of games.

You've nearly convinced me. Maybe I've been playing Noble for long enough ;)

FastWorker
Apr 17, 2006, 10:09 PM
Were you playing with the new patch? It seems that since I downloaded the patch, other civs are offering me some pretty sweet trades regularly.

ArminM
Apr 17, 2006, 10:59 PM
I have played quite about 10 games, all on Noble as I just started, and I have found out that it doesn't matter if I am trailing behind badly. I have had other Civs offer me techs when they are friendly. Now I found that you have to be trailing behind them so they can offer you techs. BUt I did not find a difference if I am trailing by 2 techs or 10.

Older than Dirt
Apr 18, 2006, 09:46 AM
Mr. Musa is one of the last leader that I'd expect to do this. I always find him to be a sharp trader. I still have my doubts about this being true. This ain't some late April Fool's gag is it? You must not trust the AI when it offers free horseback riding. Remember the Trojan Horse (not a condom brand name)! Also beware of prions in the meat and to not let any enter the food chain. So, if instead of accepting the offer what if you decline it and then go and ask for it from him? Does he give it? Will he give it if you ask for it prior to the turn he volunteers it? (If you reload does he always offer it?)

The Keeper
Apr 18, 2006, 09:53 AM
I had it happen 4 times in one game from 3 different leaders. I was also playing OCC on prince difficulty.

Playing OCC, your score is much much lower than everyone elses, even though your one city is a powerhouse. But they will obviously out tech you eventually. If you keep really good relations and they dont see you as a threat, they dont mind giving your techs. If they are giving you techs, there is a better than good chance they will accept a Perminant Alliance with you.

In my OCC game, Mansa, Asoka, and Fredrick all offered me free techs.

Nanocyborgasm
Apr 18, 2006, 07:34 PM
Anyway after all that i get to the point of my post. Has this happened to anyone else and is there some sort of power correlation that goes along with it (ie. if he's 8 times stronger than you he starts to take pity on you or something?) we weren't even on good terms, the only mod was the +1 for years of peace as you can see from the shot. Any ideas anyone?

If another civ likes you and you're way behind, they will sometimes give you gifts out of pity, or offer deals at discount. By 1200 AD, almost everyone has horseback riding, so it's no wonder that he's so willing to give it up. Furthermore, the AIs remember when you give them gifts, and will return the favor if you ask them in the future. If an AI that you are on good terms with asks you for something, you should grant the request, because they'll remember and owe you later.

anglosaxon
Apr 19, 2006, 03:27 PM
I think you have to have the religion as he does, have open borders and he has to be freindly towards you. Notice the big bonus for same religion....

I never get anything like that, the AI always tries to screw me on trading with crap offers i.e. I'll give you Hunting if you give me Industrialism!

DaveMcW
Apr 19, 2006, 04:12 PM
I'm hoping someone will say there's a secret to getting this kind of generousity in AI's and not just being so far behind. It doesn't make a great strategy if the only way to get it is to get way behind! :(

The AI needs to be at least twice your empire size.

themoffster
Apr 20, 2006, 04:30 AM
I get offered techs for free all the time on Emperor games as I am that bad on that level.

Conquestador
Apr 20, 2006, 08:36 AM
I've also got free tech from AI, but not remember wich one only i'm sure i was playing Mali so he was'nt Mansa Musa.
I've never got a tech when i've asked for it aniway.:(