Welcome to the C-IV SGOTM 01 Maintenance thread. The purpose of this thread is to give you somewhere to post about non-spoiler issues relating to the game. It is a way of communicating to the rest of the players outside your team, and with the staff about matters that affect your team or everyone. You can post about bugs, rule clarifications, problems with the roster etc. Please subscribe to it so that you are kept up to date with new information as the game proceeds.

This game will be played in Civ4, patched to v1.61.

This first SGOTM will not feature any advanced variant.. the winner simply will be the team that wins the game at the earliest game date with either domination or a diplomatic victory. All victory conditions are still enabled though, with exception of Space Race, so you have to avoid getting another type of victory (and of course prevent the AIs from winning).

Individual start files for all teams will be available on the SGOTM Progress and Results Page (http://gotm.civfanatics.net/submit/civ4sgotm_submission_list.php) at midnight, server local time, at the start of May 12.

Here's the start position.

http://gotm.civfanatics.net/civ4games/images/SGOTM01_start.jpg

Map Parameters
Playable Civ - Hapshepsut of Egypt
World size - Standard
Difficulty - Monarch
Landform - Mystery
Game Speed - Epic

Permanent Alliances are turned on (can form permanent alliances after either communism or fascism is researched)
Space race is disabled.
Egypt is locked into war with Huayna Capac of the Incas.
Egypt is locked into peace with an unknown civilization.

The map is hand built, and therefore may not have a standard configuration.

Please visit the following links to ensure that you are adequately prepared:
Civ4 SGOTM reference thread (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=168439)

Notes:

A. ONLY Civilization4 v1.61 is supported for this SGOTM. All teams will compete for a single award - the Gold Laurels.

B. All teams must play the sponsored variant - victory will be awarded for the fastest victory by either domination or diplomacy.

C. All saved game files uploaded to the server are parsed through software that extracts and archives data about your save, including reload count for each turn set.

I apologize if this has been mentioned already somewhere..

Do we decide our own order in which we take turns, or is that pre-determined for us?

[edit]
Never mind, found the answer

The team captain will be responsible for maintaining the roster, and skipping people. He will also be responsible for the nomination of a scribe. He will act as a conduit between the team and the staff. For your team, he is the law.

Team and player names are in alphabetical order
The Teams may choose their own Captains once they are assembled

I wouldn't presume to tell you how to run your team. Team orders are determined entirely by its members and leadership. As long as you work within the rules of the competition, as defined in the C-IV SGOTM Reference Thread (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=168439) you can do whatever you need to do to make your team as efficient as possible.

[EDIT] You found a better quote :thumbsup:

Ok, quick question on turnset-length... are we locked into 20 turns each, or can we set something a little longer to start, and then move to 20 turnsets after the first round?

On Epic, there's just not much going on the first 50 turns or so...

Turn set lengths are whatever you want them to be. I know the general guidance for Civ3 SGs, but can't advise on how this varies for Civ4.

The Submission system will handle any save you throw at it, so don't worry if you don't end on a multiple of ten or whatever. I would only ask that you operate as a team, and give every (live and breathing) member a fair turn with the mouse.

I understand that we will be uploading our save through the submission page and then next in line will receive the file from the same page.

Are the other players (not up) allowed to download and view the save as well?

Are the other players (not up) allowed to download and view the save as well?

The other players are allowed to download the save and look at it, but cannot make any moves that would grant that player information that the team doesn't already know.

I understand that we will be uploading our save through the submission page and then next in line will receive the file from the same page.
Actually thre are two pages. A Submission form, and a Progress and Results page. The Submission form is where you upload your file. It then becomes the latest linked file for your team on the Progress and Results page. You can see the way this works if you go to the Civ3 SGOTM Submission Page (http://gotm.civfanatics.net/submit/sgotm.php) and the Civ3 SGOTM Progress and Results Page (http://gotm.civfanatics.net/submit/sgotm_submission_list.php). The latter page also gives some progress graphs indicating relative performance of the teams.

Are the other players (not up) allowed to download and view the save as well?As Methos has said - look, but don't do anything that would expose new information that wasn't already available in the save, such as moving units, building cities, doing deals, fighting battles etc.

what is the time limit for every team?(1 month ,1 year???)

We need to see how this one plays out. We don't generally issue a time limit at the start because this is primarily a friendly competition adn we want players to enjoy it. We guess anywhere from one to three months, but previous experience with Civ3 might not apply here. We'll start tightening the screws when we see a few teams lagging behind, as we will want to start the next game in the series sometime before hell freezes over.

If you stick to an average of 48 hours per turn set and 10 turns per set it'll work out around 2 months, I guess.

@Gyathaar - I've never played with locked peace or locked war before. Can you (or someone else who has) give a broad overview? Eg. do you need to maintain good relations with the peaceful civ in orer to trade, or are they more willing to?

@Gyathaar - I've never played with locked peace or locked war before. Can you (or someone else who has) give a broad overview? Eg. do you need to maintain good relations with the peaceful civ in orer to trade, or are they more willing to?
Relations works like normal (except you can never get a negative modifer for declaring war on them ofcourse for the always peace one.. and you do get that modifier for the always war civ)

So our locked-in-peace civ is free to move in and out of wars with our locked-in-war civ, right? Those two aren't locked into any sort of relationship, are they?

Does Always War cause War Weariness with the Incas?

Do Always War/Peace holds for all other civs we meet, or just for those 2?

Do Always War/Peace holds for all other civs we meet, or just for those 2?
Just those 2.. your relations to other civs and relations between the AI civs are not locked

Just checking in...:wavey:

Quick question - are any mods allowed? HOF mod?

Hi Gyathaar,

Could you give us some information how war weariness is working when we are locked at war?

Thanks

Ronald

Hi Gyathaar,

Could you give us some information how war weariness is working when we are locked at war?

Thanks

Ronald
Actually, I am not totally sure.. but I believe it works like no normal game and was at war entire game.

I guess we will know for sure after this game has finished :)

Ofcourse, if someone wants to dive into the SDK and try to find out then be my guest ;)

Quick question - are any mods allowed? HOF mod?
I answered this in one of the other threads.. but there will be no mods for SGOTM01.
Reason is I dont want to risk any extra complications that could be caused by mods in a game that is likely to last for months.

It is very likely it will be used for next SGOTM though (after any potential problems has been weeded out by use in normal GOTMs).

You can however use any graphical mods you want (like Blue Marble).

We also plan to provide you with the game event log when saves are submitted (your own comments can be inserted using the ingame chat functionality).
Not sure if this will be in place from day one though.

@Team coordinators:

1. Please ensure that you PM your missing players to get tehm to sign in. We have a few players on standby, and if there's a team that's seriously light we can rearrange rosters to resolve it, but I need to know where the problems are soon.

2. I'm seeing some discussion of team names, and have received a couple of name changes, but I need the rest of them please .... today!

How do you lock two people in war or peace? Is this via the WB? If so, can you provide some instructions?

I explained it somewhere in the signup thread I think

Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4006244&postcount=152) it is. Thx.

Just checking in

The start files are now available on the main CIV SGOTM Progress Page ( http://gotm.civfanatics.net/submit/civ4sgotm_submission_list.php).

Plese ensure that you download your own team's file, as they are individually branded for each team.

After each turn set upload your save here (http://gotm.civfanatics.net/submit/civ4sgotm.php). After uploading you will see a summary of the status of your game, and a log dump for you turns. You may want to copy this information to help you write your turn log.

Alan - two things. My name is shown as 'riff_hi' on the list of team members on the results page. Secondly, and more importantly, I cannot open the save file 'locked assets'. I tried with my usual custom assets and then with a completely empty set. What is the configuration that I require to be able to open the save? Are there some customassets that it was set up under (ie BlueMarble)?

ruff... I had that problem with the GOTM and (I think) it had to do with civscale. Start up civscale and press deactivate all. I am running bluemarble and the SGOTM load worked perfect. I also have HOF installed and your mods.

unfortunetely I can't open the save as well, and no, I have nil mods in my game...

I was able to load the save successfully although I didn't try doing anything after that. I have the HOf mod version 2 installed on my system but no other mods at present.

@ruff_hi: Apologies on my typo, now fixed. It was an all-night session for Gyathaar and me to get the pages and database and saves set up. If that's the only error I'll be very surprised :eek:

Sorry to hear a couple of you are having trouble loading the game. Graphical mods should have no effect as graphics files are not protected. I'm sure Gyathaar will be able to help when he surfaces today. The most likely problem is a modified file in your main assets. Your custom assets should not be looked at or used by this game.

Meanwhile, please can any other players with loading problems report them here.

A reminder: NO SPOILERS HERE, please.

@AlanH: I have a rules clarification request. Are all players in a team allowed to open the save, or only the "up" player?

Edit: I had no problems opening it, BTW, but I have 0 mods, 0 custom assets, and a clean re-install as of yesterday.

I am now able to open the save. I have bluemarble, my mod and some civscale changes as my normal setup. I had to revert to the standard setup in civscale (page 1 - clouds, zoom, etc - changes here are done in the xml files) to get it to load. I didn't have to change my colour scheme (page 2 of civscale changes here are done in the theme).

None of my custom asset mods loaded (which is normal with 'locked assets' game) so no reminders, autologger, etc.

BUT - I can actually play the game!

@AlanH: I have a rules clarification request. Are all players in a team allowed to open the save, or only the "up" player?

Any player may open the team save. Only the current player may take any action that could disclose more information than is currently avaiable at that save point. So, no unit moves, no new cities, no unit actions .....

...changes here are done in the xml files) to get it to load. I didn't have to change my colour scheme (page 2 of civscale changes here are done in the theme).Exactly. Changes affecting XML files will trigger the asset check failure.

... so no reminders, autologger, etc.When you submit you save at end of your turn set you will receive feedback, including a listing of all logged player events, including any you have entered via the chat interface. So at least you have some logging capability.

Good to see you are working.

So we just have ThERat with a problem currently?

... including any you have entered via the chat interface.The what? I only play single player games against the AI and a) don't like talking to myself b) the AI never answers anyway.

How do I activate that?

Dunno. It's something Gyathaar used during our log output testing and referred to in a recent post ... I may have got the name wrong :blush: Please note that the Tiger-X in my avatar, plus my User title, give the game away. I am a Mac user, and do not have access to Civ4 yet. So all ths is Greek to me :D

[EDIT] See Post #21 - top of this page for me, but YMMV.

Hey ruff, try Alt+f4 <evil grin>

Okay, that should have gone in the trash-talking thread. Anyhow I think it's shift+tab.

Meanwhile, please can any other players with loading problems report them here.I noticed that it loses the .civ4savedgame file extension on downloaded. But, after renaming the file, it loads just just fine.

The what? I only play single player games against the AI and a) don't like talking to myself b) the AI never answers anyway.

How do I activate that?If you go into the event log (Ctrl+TAB Key), you will notice 3 tabs at the top of the dialog box. The middle one is chat log. You can see all of the chat messages or enter a new one. Alternatively, you can just press the TAB key from the main interface to enter a quick chat message.

I noticed that it loses the .civ4savedgame file extension on downloaded.
I think this is an Internet Explorer "feature" (can I say "bug"?). I eventually put a download script on the standard GOTM saves folder to overcome it. I'll have a look at doing the same for these saves.

Just to be absolutely positive, the trash talking thread is open to all correct? I haven't tried it yet as I wasn't for sure if some team that it would be hilarious to name their team that. It's better to ask and look stupid, than be disqualified.

Just to be absolutely positive, the trash talking thread is open to all correct? I haven't tried it yet as I wasn't for sure if some team that it would be hilarious to name their team that. It's better to ask and look stupid, than be disqualified.

Yes, it's open to all. But that would have been a good name.

I believe it's there to allow you to communicate greetings and felicitations to the other teams, and to wish them well in their endeavours :p

It's nothing to do with me ... except as a moderator. As a moderator I will close it forthwith if there is any spoiler information posted in it, or if it becomes a pure spam-fest, or if it strays from the paths of righteousness as laid down by Thunderfall in the Great Forum Rule Book.

I remembered that I changed the Civ4Detailmanager setting to allow for a better view. Thus, went to reinstall 1.61, but to no avail.
Found out that there isn't even an uninstall option for Civ4 :crazyeye:

Anyway, I don't really want to do that. Maybe there could be another solution, otherwise I simply sit this out.
Now I remember that I had no issue loading GOTM2/3.

Have you tried starting Civ4 with the magic key combination that clears the caches? Sorry, I can't remember what it is.

Found out that there isi't even a uninstall option for Civ4 :crazyeye:

You should be able to uninstall by going to the control panel, then add/remove programs. Civ4 is listed as "Sid Meier's Civilization 4".

Have you tried starting Civ4 with the magic key combination that clears the caches? Sorry, I can't remember what it is.

Holding the shift key down during start up.

ok, will try the clear cache thingy. I know how to uninstall programms :lol: Am not a total computer newbie ;)
But one would have expected the uninstall option to be part of the package...

Just tried it..nope, doesn't work as well. I am going to download the latest GOTM and check whether I have an issue there

But one would have expected the uninstall option to be part of the package...


:confused: Why would anyone want to uninstall Civ4?!? ;)

Why would anyone want to uninstall Civ4?!?good one, but for example since that save protection works so fantastic...something I cannot comprehend. Here we have a game that is moddable par excellence and once you touch the xml files, you are nicely excluded from GOTM/SGOTM...

anyway I also can't load GOTM6 I just figured

Rat, I had similar issues yesterday when I tried to uninstall Ruff's Mod Pack to play nicely with this game. I had issues with the GOTM, so I uninstalled C4 and put it back on and downloaded the patch. There is now joy in Mudville.

Rat, I had that problem with GOTM. I uninstalled and reinstalled Civ4 and it fixed it fine. Took 10-15 minutes I guess, but make sure you back up your saves and HOF and whatever else you want to keep.

... including any you have entered via the chat interface.

The what? I only play single player games against the AI and a) don't like talking to myself b) the AI never answers anyway.

How do I activate that?
Hitting TAB brings it up..

anything you 'Say to All' will show up in the log

Rat, I had similar issues yesterday when I tried to uninstall Ruff's Mod Pack to play nicely with this game. I had issues with the GOTM, so I uninstalled C4 and put it back on and downloaded the patch. There is now joy in Mudville.
Uninstall my mod pack. Easy - change 'customassets' to 'customassets-ruffmodpack' and it is done.

uninstalled the whole game, made sure no customassets left somewhere
reinstalled vanilla and 1.61, loaded the game...get the same message that the save cannot load in order to make sure assets have not been modified, so much about how easy that is

So, now I have vanilla +1.61 freshly installed, no customization and the game doesn't load, guess I will just sit out those games.

uninstalled the whole game, made sure no customassets left somewhere
reinstalled vanilla and 1.61, loaded the game...get the same message that the save cannot load in order to make sure assets have not been modified, so much about how easy that is

So, now I have vanilla +1.61 freshly installed, no customization and the game doesn't load, guess I will just sit out those games.
Did you delete the Assets (not customassets.. customassets dont matter for this) folder after uninstalling, but before reinstalling?

thanks Gyathaar :goodjob: that did it

Well done, ThERat.

So we have no other open issues on locked assets currently? (Apart from players suffering from mod withdrawal symptoms :()

No reload means we have to play our 20 turns straight then save and upload?
What if I get to a point I must/should consult with my team but there's nobody online and it's late and want to go to bed? Can I save and continue the next day after hearing from my partners?

@ruff_hi: Apologies on my typo, now fixed. It was an all-night session for Gyathaar and me to get the pages and database and saves set up. If that's the only error I'll be very surprised :eek:
My compliment to you doing all this work... principaly for our enjoyment. Kudoo's really :goodjob:

No reloading means no going backward and redoing a turn if you messed up or the RNG screws you over, for instance. You can, obviously, save the game partway through and come back to it (with or without discussion with your teammates).

No reload means we have to play our 20 turns straight then save and upload?
What if I get to a point I must/should consult with my team but there's nobody online and it's late and want to go to bed? Can I save and continue the next day after hearing from my partners?
What BeefontheBone said.

There's no problem with saving, quitting, and then playing forward from that save. Just don't do it too often, otherwise we begin to worry that it may be being abused. There's *absolutely* nothing wrong with saving for security and continuing without quitting.

We are simply trying to ensure a level playing field where no one plays with prior knowledge of the map, or of the way the game will develop. Always have this simple criterion in mind when judging your actions.

So don't ever go back to a save to replay a turn or a move or a decision to try to change the outcome. The only acceptable exception to this is if you suffer a crash and have to reload and replay. In that case replay from the last autosave (you do have Civ4 set to autosave every turn, don't you?) and replay your previous moves as accurately as you can.

Edited to include mention of saving without quitting

Can you make CIV do any other saving? Autosave = every turn by default right?? If not please tell me how I can change that...

It used to default to 5 turns. Don't know if the default's changed in a recent update. Theres a setting somewhere to control turns between autosaves. I'm sure a Civ4 player will be along soon to tell you where.

Can you make CIV do any other saving? Autosave = every turn by default right?? If not please tell me how I can change that...
By default it autosaves every 5 turns I think

Change the following value in the CivilizationIV.ini file:

AutoSaveInterval = 1

It was set to 4 on my ini.... changed some other settings too... Thanks...

Setting the graphics tab in CivScale back to original specs allowed me to load the save.

I've noticed that when I zoom out to globe view everything in the fog of war goes black. It's fairly annoying since I can't really get a good view of all the known world on one screen with the non-globe view and it doesn't take long before I need 4 screenshots to cover what I could in 1 with globe view. It seems to be SGOTM specific since none of my other 1.61 games have that problem. Does anyone know if there's a way to work around that, or if it's just something we're stuck with for the SGOTM?

Signing in on this thread.

I've noticed that when I zoom out to globe view everything in the fog of war goes black. It's fairly annoying since I can't really get a good view of all the known world on one screen with the non-globe view and it doesn't take long before I need 4 screenshots to cover what I could in 1 with globe view. It seems to be SGOTM specific since none of my other 1.61 games have that problem. Does anyone know if there's a way to work around that, or if it's just something we're stuck with for the SGOTM?
Is this affecting anyone else? We aren't aware of any reason why it should be so. Are you using any graphics mods?

Now that we've played more and explored more of the world I realize it's *not* the fog of war, just a particular part of the globe going black, which explains why I couldn't see it on some of my other games. I think it's probably a hardware/driver issue (My install is clean/modless) and not an issue with this particular game so I'll explore the tech support forum to see if I can find a fix.

Hello. Could you ppl post this map as noble and prince difficulty?
I'm not in the competition but i would like to play this map just for fun, but Monarch difficulty is just to hard for my newbie arse :)

A big "Thank you" to the moderators for this setup!
But I think since we are 19 teams it's time to face the need for the silver and bronze laurel also 2. and 3. place in this competition really is a worthy achievement IMHO. What do you think?

@saint1979: Maybe when we are further through the actual competition. However, there are plenty of Noble-level players on the teams - see the siugn-up thread, so maybe you should focus on following the threads and replaying the efforts of those teams. It's a great learning opportunity, rather than playing what amounts to a different game at another level.

@Marc Aurel: Yes, I think that's a good idea. I'll see if my artistic skills are up to the challenge.

@saint1979, to back up what Alan wrote, I would think it'd be an amazing learning opportunity to lurk all 19 games and see what 100+ people have to say about the same start. I fully intend to read every one when this is done.

@Marc Aurel: Yes, I think that's a good idea. I'll see if my artistic skills are up to the challenge.
If you ask Mistfit real nice, I bet he'd have you some laurels in a jiffy! You've done plenty of work setting this up. :goodjob:
Time to do a little delegation... :mischief:
Unless, of course your creative side needs a little nurture? :p
:lol: :lol: :lol:

@ AllanH & @ rex_tyranus,
Yeah, I'm following 5 teams that i think that they are good at publishing their thorughts and strategy. Very usefull, i learned so much allready, but when i played few hours my self, i was behind the tech tree so much that its no funny hehe.

Well, i guess i will watch the game istead.

Some notes on how to read the progress charts:

The colours are sometimes difficult to distinguish. Nineteen teams have stretched the palette somwhat :eek:. One clue to discovering your team's line is the date at the end of each line. Look vertically above the date/turn that you have reached on the X-axis. Your curve will end at that date, so you may be able to spot it.

Another option is to reduce the number of lines displayed. You can use the check boxes next to the team names in the top table to select only the teams you are interested in. Click the "All" checkbox at the top of the team list to select or deselect all teams, so you can deselect All and then add in just those you want to see. If you are only interested in the early turns then you can restrict the maximum date. Click Refresh to update the graph with your new selection.

Note that the Display Format menu allows you to select other charts, not only Firaxis score. You can also see graphs of Power and Culture, and there are detailed lists of all team saves submitted, and an analysis of team thread posts.

Warning: The team post analysis is provided to indicate and encourage genuine levels of team interaction. It is NOT a post count competition, nor is it an invitation to spam your team threads. Team threads with a lot of irrelevant posts are counter-productive, as the real team communication gets lost, and I reserve the right to delete pure spam.

Some notes on how to read the progress charts:

Thanks AlanH! I didn't realize you could uncheck/check teams. Thanks for the help!

A very useful tool. Thanks to SGOTM staff for it.

@AlanH, is there a breakdown anywhere for how the Jason score is calculated? If I'm to get the wooden spoon, I'll need every advantage I can muster.

Thanks.

@AlanH, is there a breakdown anywhere for how the Jason score is calculated? If I'm to get the wooden spoon, I'll need every advantage I can muster.
Jason score is not relevant to Civ4. If there''s a reference to it somewhere in the Civ4 pages, then let me know where and I'll delete it.

Civ4 Firaxis score is calculated according to the formulae in the Python code. You need all your wits about you to comprehend it, and I have inadequate wits :p

@AlanH: I think the bottom text on the Results page came from the Civ3 SGOTM and wasn't modified for Civ 4, I think it just needs to be revisited/edited.

EDIT: Nope, not there. Dang, where did I see it? :hmm:

I did fix some left-over copied and pasted references yesterday :mischief:

Yes, Alan. It was previously in the first post of the reference thread. The wooden spoon description line. You got it, though. Thanks.

Can we download saves other than the first one to take a look as long as we make no moves ?

Yes ... only for your own team.

Yes ... only for your own team.

Will it be ok to look at other team's threads and saves once your own team has completed the game (and as long as no comments are made)?

Of course. That's one of the true great joys in life, and a principle motivation to complete the game :)

@Marc Aurel: Yes, I think that's a good idea. I'll see if my artistic skills are up to the challenge.

Great! Thank you very much. :worship:
I am sure you will outclass yourself with the design.:goodjob:

For some reason the date selector on the progress page only allows me to select 4000 BC or the latest date that a save has been posted for. :( I'm using IE 6 SP2. Not sure if it's one of my settings or not.

Whoops :blush: Some debug code I left lying about. Sorry!

Landform - Mystery

I'm sure you already know this but when you get done playing a game and start a new one those settings are set for the new game. I just came across this today after playing the SGOTM and then hosting an MP game. This can be exploited and players can know all the settings of the game if they are supposed to be a mystery.

I just thought I would point this out so that the people who don't know about this are not at a disadvantage to players who do use this exploit. Is there any way to prevent this?

I'm sure you already know this but when you get done playing a game and start a new one those settings are set for the new game. I just came across this today after playing the SGOTM and then hosting an MP game. This can be exploited and players can know all the settings of the game if they are supposed to be a mystery.

I just thought I would point this out so that the people who don't know about this are not at a disadvantage to players who do use this exploit. Is there any way to prevent this?
I am aware.. those settings can also be seen on the settings screen.. so I changed them to different settings than the original map was generated with.. :p
Not that it would matter, since the map was also manually modified ;)

so I changed them to different settings than the original map was generated with..
Not that it would matter, since the map was also manually modified

Nothing like a little protection... and backup protection for that protection! Anyhow, I :worship: at the admin's time and attention to detail put into these games! Thanks so much.

Er... say 'hypothetically' a friend has forgotten to upload a save game, and you want to keep the game going along... how would it be for m--- I mean, my friend to upload it for another person?

No problem. Upload it using the actual player's name in the upload form ... whoever it was :confused:

Ok... we dealt with it

:D :goodjob:

sorry wrong forum

We've just had another one of our rostered players check in and they want to play. Are there any problems if they hop into the rotation? We assumed it'd be all good, but we thought we'd just check with you first.

- Madviking's team

Regarding the late checkin for team madviking: Sockboy is referring to me. Sorry to check in late. I'd like to play, and me team is ok with this, but I'm also happy to lurk if this causes a problem for the staff.

As long as you are happy to handle a nine player rotation, I guess it's no problem for me. The only concern is the length of time between each player's turns - if it gets too long then players can (a) forget they are supposed to be part of the team and (b) lose track of what the game is all about and what the team strategy is. If your team runs a 72 hour rotation then it will be almost a month from one player's turns to their next, and some teams struggle even to do 72 hours. As long as you believe you can maintain momentum with nine players then, fine, go ahead.

Hi,
How about provinding a start save file for all of us who are not part of any team but want to get their fingers wet while following the progress of the experts? Or maybe there is one (I couldn't find one after about 20 minutes of searching)
Thanks,
Alexandru

Hi,
How about provinding a start save file for all of us who are not part of any team but want to get their fingers wet while following the progress of the experts? Or maybe there is one (I couldn't find one after about 20 minutes of searching)
Thanks,
Alexandru
Go to the SGOTM Progression page : http://gotm.civfanatics.net/submit/civ4sgotm_submission_list.php

in the 'Display format' pulldown list, select 'List of saves' (and make sure 'Start file list at' is set to 4000BC )

This should give a list of all the teams saves, including the starting saves..

Since you are not on any team, you can download whatever start save you want.

Go to the SGOTM Progression page : http://gotm.civfanatics.net/submit/civ4sgotm_submission_list.php ...

Thanks a lot :)

Exploit (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=171604) found. Just wanted to alert everybody in the SGOTM thread (especially the mods).

Please see the response here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4081648&postcount=46). It is not allowed to be used in GOTMs, and since SGOTMs refer to the same exploit lists, it is not permitted here, either.

[edited url - thx ChrTh]

Here's (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4081648&postcount=46) the specific post. Heh, you can take the city with a scout too.

Are we going to have spoiler discussions - say, game up to 1000BC?

1000 BC has been found to be a bit too early for any useful discussion in the monthly GOTM, particularly for Civ4. We'll open a thread shortly, though, and the criterion for viewing will be that you have contact with all civs on the map, or their remains.

1000 BC has been found to be a bit too early for any useful discussion in the monthly GOTM, particularly for Civ4. We'll open a thread shortly, though, and the criterion for viewing will be that you have contact with all civs on the map, or their remains.Ok - just pulling 1000BC out of the air. Do we know how many civs started the game? If not, how do we know if we have met them all?

You should be getting popups telling you how you are doing relative to the other civs. I think they give you all the names, regardless of whether you have met them, so if you count the names you'll know how many you have to meet. That's assuming you note these informative events in your logs, of course :mischief:

No, you don't get names if you don't know them. It just states "A far away civilization has built The Pyramids" or whatever wonder it is. Similar message for religions.

I'm referring to the screens that rank your power or whatever against other civs.

You don't get the names of the civs if you haven't met them, but you do get a count.

A count is all you need.

I'm referring to the screens that rank your power or whatever against other civs.

You don't get the names of the civs if you haven't met them, but you do get a count.

I think that "popup" reference is what fooled me :)

The Demographics "Info Screen" will tell you your value, rival best value, rival worst value, and your rank. I guess if you know you're last in something, then you will get the number of players ;)

Actually, I do think your right, somewhere you can find out how many rivals you have but I can't place my finger on where it's located. It's not the info screen, but may be somewhere in the Demographics menu.

I suppose, if you really wanted to, you could stop working all of your commerce tiles, then look at the demographics screen. You'd be bound to be last in GNP that way. Then use Graham's logic and you know how many civs there are.

I suppose, if you really wanted to, you could stop working all of your commerce tiles, then look at the demographics screen. You'd be bound to be last in GNP that way. Then use Graham's logic and you know how many civs there are.That would work unless the b!%@#$d notice what you are doing and stop working all of their tiles too - trickly AIs!

That would work unless the b!%@#$d notice what you are doing and stop working all of their tiles too - trickly AIs!

Come on, Ruff! I was hoping VQ would try it!

Come on, Ruff! I was hoping VQ would try it!

Yeah, unlike the stragglers, we're pretty confident we've conquered met everybody already.

Does anyone have that 'wrong forum' graphic ... we actually need the 'wrong thread' in this case as I am fairly sure that above two should be in the sledging (trash talk) thread.

PS - what is the code for strikethru? blah blah blah

I think that "popup" reference is what fooled me :)
Sorry if "pop up" means something different to you. Are you guys saying you haven't seen any screens that have headers like this? ...

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/Greatest-Civs.jpg

Ohhhhhhh...that. Yeah, we've seen it in our game. Never called it a popup though (usually just call it the 'list').

Ruff_hi: The strikethrough is just an 's' in brackets

PS - what is the code for strikethru? blah blah blah

blah blah blah = blah blah blah

Never called it a popup though (usually just call it the 'list').
Well, it pops up, I think. Seemed quite descriptive to me, but there you go! :(

Victory conditions, conquest->eliminate all rivals->rivals left : x.
You need of course to remember how many civs you eliminated :)

You need of course to remember how many civs you eliminated :)

Not really. You can see all the eliminated civs in the score chart at the bottom right hand of the screen. Their the ones with the score of zero. They will remain on the score chart the entire game.

I have posted the first Spoiler thread, for mid-game discussions between teams on your progress so far. Here are the details from the first post, laying own the ground rules for participation in that thread, so you don't even need to read the thread to determine whether you qualify to do so:


To qualify to READ in this thread your team must know all the rivals in the game, or know of their demise.

You can determine that you have met or eliminated all your rivals by

(a) checking the Victory Conditions screen to see how many rivals you would need to eliminate for a Conquest victory, or

(b) watching for the messages that tell you how you are doing relative to the other civs. When the screen lists no Unknown civilizations you have found them all.

To qualify to POST in this thread a nominated scribe from your team must post a summary of your game up to the point defined above.

Your summary should include your early decisions on city placement, research, units and improvements, and the milestones in the development of your economy, civics, contacts and diplomatic relationships.

When posting, please do not discuss future events beyond the date you met the spoiler condition. And remember that your viewing public will be looking out for literary flair, historical accuracy, humour, and strategic insight. Comments on the SGOTM experience so far will also be welcome.

So, how was it for you? Still alive and kicking?

I have posted the first Spoiler thread, for mid-game discussions between teams on your progress so far. Here are the details from the first post, laying own the ground rules for participation in that thread, so you don't even need to read the thread to determine whether you qualify to do so:
Opps, I read it before I read this ... :D

But as part of Team VQ ... I think I can even read the second spoiler thread (if there is one) without any slightest doubt of qualifying or not. :D

The second thread will be the final report, when you've won or lost or given up in disgust :) So no, I don't think even VQ has qualified for it yet.

I don't know whether this has been brought up or should be discussed, but what are the exact conditions for permanent alliances in this game. Or are they disabled due to permanent war?

I don't know whether this has been brought up or should be discussed, but what are the exact conditions for permanent alliances in this game. Or are they disabled due to permanent war?
I believe that post 1 states that they can be used after researching the relavant techs or am I misunderstanding your question?

I don't know whether this has been brought up or should be discussed, but what are the exact conditions for permanent alliances in this game. Or are they disabled due to permanent war?
Not sure if I should answer this, since you could figure this out yourself with some test games or reading articles/SDK... but ok.. being at war does not prevent permanent alliances..

thanks Gyathaar, I am asking since our team is having discussion about the conditions. We might find out what happens during the course of the game ;) No spoilers here of course

I by mistake submitted a wrong save befor submitting a rigth one
(wrong one mean save I download to play my turns).
Hope it would not be a problem.

Thanks for letting me know. I've deleted the incorrect upload.

Is it too late to join in on C-IV SGOTM 01 Egypt, Monarch? The Lunatics (only thread I've read) are still at 2320 BC..

Probably not, but just wanted to ask.

Post moved from GOTM thread. SGOTM is over here.

The Lunatics have eight active players, and are fully staffed up, I'd say, but you could PM Jericho Hill and ask if they want another player. He will have to let me know if you do join them, so that I can add you to their roster on the database.

I realized a mistake I made uploading a game a while back. I tried to upload the save game from my first turnet instead of the second. It said it worked so I did not recognize the error. Later when the next player uploaded the game and found it was at the beggining of the turnest instead of thwe end I went back and upkoaded the right game, everything went fine from there as he picked up the rigth save and we continued on as normal. If you look at are thread (aroung page 7 or 8) you will find the where I am talking about.

The system seems to have survived. We appear to have three copies of your 2050BC save on record, all identical as far as I can tell. We never overwrite saves, so there's no need to keep uploading copies, just let me know if an error is made and I'll revert you to the correct save.

They all should be identical. It sound like everything is fine.

I just realized that our second-to-last save was not uploaded to the correct page, but only to our team thread. What should I do about that?

Upload it now? The system doesn't care what order they arrive in.

Okay, thanks. I was just making sure.

******* :mad: I just clicked on the spoiler thread by mistake. Luckily I clicked on the "back" button before the window displayed any contents.
Isn't there a way to implement security restrictions to this forums??? :confused:

Not unless we want to exclude spectators.

Not unless we want to exclude spectators.

Don't we? What about Team threads. Nobody should look at them but the team members.

This is a spectator sport. You should expect lurkers to be reading your team threads.

This is a spectator sport. You should expect lurkers to be reading your team threads.Indeed - I am considering sitting out the next SGOTM so that I can provide suitable cutting commentary on everyone's game.

Indeed - I am considering sitting out the next SGOTM so that I can provide suitable cutting commentary on everyone's game.

Um, can we force people to be on a team?

The other option is that I am on ALL teams as the resident critic.

The other option is that I am on ALL teams as the resident critic.

:twitch: ... lurk away! :bounce:

The other option is that I am on ALL teams as the resident critic.
This does bring up a question, I am not sure if it addressed anywhere or is really relavent.

Are lurkers who have read more than one team thread allowed to post in those team threads? Spoiler information could be inavertently given. Even something as inocuous as "You guys are doing really well" or "Wow you guys have a lot of cities" could give away informatino about you and / or other teams and so change how the team would play.

Watch the SGOTM page and click on the mods, and you'll find they lurk all the team threads. I fully trust them [mods] to catch the talkative lurkers and deal with any problems. Hopefully the lurkers instead find the interest to sign up for the next SGOTM.

Lurkers are welcome in my opinion. That's how I got involved in the Civ3 SGOTM.

Lurkers are welcome in my opinion. That's how I got involved in the Civ3 SGOTM.
Do not get me wrong, the spectator sport aspect of SGOTM is very important and I fully support encoraging partisipation. However, even with the clear GOTM rules about posting spoiler info some people still make mistakes. Perhaps some sort of "lurkers charter" could help by setting out what sort of post you should avoid.

I do trust the mods to remove any offending posts as soon as they see them, but a team member is sure to beat the mods to reading any random post surely? However if it has not come up as an issue yet I would not worry about it much.

I see no indication that lurker comments have had any significant effect on teams' activities. Random lurker posts are actually fairly low level.

The Civ3 community has managed to play ten SGOTMs pretty well, in an honour-based competition with minimal rules and lightweight referee-ing. I hope the Civ4 community can see its way clear to maintaining that tradition. I really don't have time or energy or enthusiasm to create a complex structure of rules and regulations and policing activities. If SGOTM gets to the point where it needs that to survive then it will be sad ... and someone else will have to run it.

I see no indication that lurker comments have had any significant effect on teams' activities. Random lurker posts are actually fairly low level.

The Civ3 community has managed to play ten SGOTMs pretty well, in an honour-based competition with minimal rules and lightweight referee-ing. I hope the Civ4 community can see its way clear to maintaining that tradition. I really don't have time or energy or enthusiasm to create a complex structure of rules and regulations and policing activities. If SGOTM gets to the point where it needs that to survive then it will be sad ... and someone else will have to run it.

Hear, hear! This is a gentlemen's game. If anyone feels the need to cheat or act on information from an accidental spoiler, that person can put his laurel on his resume and I wish him the best of luck. The rest of us can continue to have fun under minimal supervision.

Hear, hear! This is a gentlemen's game.

.... and ladies'. Let's never forget the ladies ;)

Howdy everyone :)

My question isn't about SGOTM1, but I didn't want to sully the board with an extra thread for a simple question... what's the time frame for the SGOTM's? When will SGOTM2 come around? I'm eager to play!

There's no fixed timetable, particularly in this case, as it's the first of a breed and we don't know how long the teams will take. When we get to a point where the fastest teams have finished we'll probably specify a guillotine date. Results will then be announced. By that date we'll have started the next game.

There's no fixed timetable, particularly in this case, as it's the first of a breed and we don't know how long the teams will take. When we get to a point where the fastest teams have finished we'll probably specify a guillotine date. Results will then be announced. By that date we'll have started the next game.
Go VQ go... Go VQ go :D

"fastest teams" is plural. One streak of lightning will not determine the timetable for this game.

Well, we finished. I suppous that mean now we can freely lurk everywhere?
Just cheking.

Yes, you can lurk the other team threads.

You are obviously new to the competition. It's generally a bad idea to tell everyone you've finished. The other teams can see your last save date in the graphs, so you have given them all a target to beat.

Bah, more fun. Graph shows it anyway. Just look on this vertical line with cross on top, a blind can see we finished.

Yeah :blush: That's my fault! I hadn't suppressed the last save in the graph as I usually do. Sorry! Fixed it now.

people will figure it out anyway when our line is not moving for a week:) .

Quite right :) ... Another good reason for not rushing through the game.

I do not think we rushed. We played in resonable time frame, making it better for every member of the team. No one had to remember what was that game about just because they did not see it for a mounth and loose interest.

I think we had optimum speed of playing, good discussion and eager members.
All of that is good.

So we're allowed to admit noticing that then?

So we're allowed to admit noticing that then?
Well, it's been announced here by the team. It's hardly a secret :confused:

It was not a secret the moment graph went vertical with a cross on top :)

Clarification of 'lurking' question:

If two teams are finished, are they allowed to start posting in each other's thread (congrats, etc.)? I imagine a finished team can't post in an unfinished team's thread.

I think it would be an impolite distraction to post in another unfinished team's thread, but there's no problem with exchanging posts with other teams that have finished.

If would actualy like to remove Mutineer post that gave specifics of the end of the game. But other than that I am willing to take the disadvantage over finishing early since it mahy the game more enjoyable that it flowed quickly.

As an infrequent visitor to civfanatics, I discovered this GOTM far too late to enter so I played this game solo. Then I replayed it (not using any significant player knowledge) to see if another logical pre-knowledge strategy would have been better. Subsequently, I've been lurking in the various team threads and found the variations in thinking really interesting and I've tried some of their ideas.

Long story short, I think the scenario is extremely interesting (even for non-teams) and waiting for the games to finish to discuss seems less than ideal since no deadline has been established. I can't help but compare the SGOTM to the "Kasparov vs the world" event several years back which was absolutely riveting for me.

I was wondering if there was an Official Lurker/Solo Thread anywhere?

I would have removed it if I thought no one had seen it. But removing it after some teams undoubtedly had seen it would be either (a) unfair to those in different timezones who hadn't seen it or (b) irrelevant if everyone had seen it.

PS @starbolt: No, there isn't a lurker/solo thread. There are opportunities to discuss the game in the spoiler threads, and in the individual team threads when they finish.

Hi AlanH,

The power graph currently shows the Firaxis score :sad:
Could you fix it?

I took a look at the other team threads and a 1/3 saw Mutineers post and some caught the spike in the score graph before it was removed. So removing it does not seem to do much good.
just hope no one beats us by a couple of turns.

Let them see our finish date, hopefully it will put them off more than encourage them :crazyeye:

I wouldn't have said we rushed it though and had team input from most players every turnset which was critical. Good effort from all involved with no long delays or major mistakes.

Go Team One !

Hi AlanH,

The power graph currently shows the Firaxis score :sad:
You're right! Broke it when I hid the last save point.
Could you fix it?
Done.

It's a little bit of a bummer that everyone knows where we came out, but at the same time, we know that the graph was out there. Of course, its not necessarily the case that you can extrapolate how people are doing based on the score.

Alan - it's quite cool having the graph!

I would love to see an on-going list of results for GOTM or some other kind of benchmark during the month.

To be honest, what alerted me was Mutineer's post. I then did see the spike in the graph but the post made me look.

Well, I am new to all this SGOTM stuff, but it never even come to me that the fact we finished could be a secret, because graph did show it.

I am unable to upload my save for team VQ? Can someone please have a look?

I've replied in your thread.

Yeah thanks problem solved..

http://gotm.civfanatics.net/submit/civ4sgotm_submission_list.php gives a "gotm.civfanatics.net cannot be found" error. Can anyone help?

Is it acceptable to get the save off the last player by some other method?

Apologies. There's currently a domain name server (DNS) problem for civfanatics.net, so the server is not reachable. You may use any alternative available to you to transfer the saves while this problem persists, but please upload them to the SGOTM page once the server is back on line. Options are forum post attachments if size permits, email, or your own web space.

Apologies. There's currently a domain name server (DNS) problem for civfanatics.net, so the server is not reachable. You may use any alternative available to you to transfer the saves while this problem persists, but please upload them to the SGOTM page once the server is back on line. Options are forum post attachments if size permits, email, or your own web space.
I do not know a lot abou thiese things, but could you not just post the IP addres (something like 205.123.456.789) and we could then use 205.123.456.789/submit/civ4sgotm_submission_list.php

ICBR of course.

There are several virtual servers on that host, so it is not possible to reach the correct one using just the IP address. www.civfanatics.net, gotm.civfanatics.net and hof.civfanatics.net are all on the same address, and the server relies on the host name in your browser's request to identify the correct one to respond from.

There are several virtual servers on that host, so it is not possible to reach the correct one using just the IP address. www.civfanatics.net, gotm.civfanatics.net and hof.civfanatics.net are all on the same address, and the server relies on the host name in your browser's request to identify the correct one to respond from.
Well.. it would work if you added the hostname and ip into your hosts file (C:\WINDOWS\system32\drivers\etc\hosts in windows) :P

Hardly worth the effort assuming the DNS record is going to be restored fairly soon

Moved from the SGOTM Frequency Thread

Mutineer's views and proposed solutions in the SGOTM Frequency (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=175605) Thread may be somewhat extreme. However, I do think a dedline is now in order. The game started on May 8th and has been running for almost two months. With the vacation season looming things can only slow down further, so I propose we aim to declare the results on August 8th, giving a total of three months.

This proposal is open for brief discussion. If teams feel strongly that it is unreasonable, then they should state a case for an alternative deadline.

Any team that hasn't finished by the deadline will, of course, not be eligible for an award, but will be free to continue the game for interest's sake. Uploads to the server will still be permitted, and team threads will not be closed.

As an aid to discussion, the current average time between saves is over two days and increasing.

I think that this is reasonable, it seems that there are only 2 teams currently that may have some trouble finishing before the proposed deadline, but even those teams can make it if they speed up a little :) I also think that maybe we should start the next game a little bit earlier then the deadline, at least the sign up process.

In Civ3 SGOTMs we usually do start the next game signup before the previous deadline. I see no reason to change things here.

I'm certain you don't need my vote but, as a representative of one of the lagging teams, I think August 8th is more than reasonable. We've lost two players (one is me when my computer broke), but I'll be back in the pocket within a week.

If we don't finish, big whoop. None of us (my team, that is) is interested in the Laurel anyway.

As an aid to discussion, the current average time between saves is over two days and increasing.

Are teams slowing down? I haven't been monitoring the statistics, but I have the general impression that each team is maintaining a roughly constant pace, and the average time is going up because the faster teams have finished.

As I stated in the other thread, I don't see any need for the deadline. I don't think people will play significantly faster with a deadline: the result will just be that people who are less able to play quickly will stop participating in the future. But you're running the event, and if you want one, fine.

If we're going to have 3-month deadlines in the future, then I think six players taking 15-turn sets (at Epic speed) would probably work better than eight players taking 10-turn sets.

I populated "random" teams with eight players because past experience has indicated that one or two don't show up at all and/or one or two drop out early in such games. Past experience was not a good guide in this situaitons, as most eight-player teams have stuck together well.

The rate of play is slowing a little - 2.2 days per save over the last 14 days, 2.33 days per save over the past seven days. This is within the 72 hours max, but if the average is that high then there are certainly a significant number of turn sets taking over 72 hours. Also, the number of turns per set is probably reducing as the turns get more complex.

I *do* think a deadline focuses the minds of the team leaders. I see it in the Civ3 game threads. They'll skip a player more readily if the 48 hours 'got it' limit expires, and generally keep the ball rolling better.

As the team leader of the slowest team :blush:, I can only agree with what AlanH says. I will pick up the :whipped: and get the game moving at a higher pace. Like AlanH says, we've been in the same situation before in Civ3 SGOTM and it worked well then.

The rate of play is slowing a little - 2.2 days per save over the last 14 days, 2.33 days per save over the past seven days.

Just to repeat: I don't think this means anyone is slowing down. It just means there are some teams that are averaging <2 days per save, and some teams that are averaging >2.5 days per save. When the faster teams finish, the average goes up because it's only counting the slower teams.

I *do* think a deadline focuses the minds of the team leaders. I see it in the Civ3 game threads. They'll skip a player more readily if the 48 hours 'got it' limit expires, and generally keep the ball rolling better.

OK, that makes sense.

Just to repeat: I don't think this means anyone is slowing down. It just means there are some teams that are averaging <2 days per save, and some teams that are averaging >2.5 days per save. When the faster teams finish, the average goes up because it's only counting the slower teams.That's why I only looked at the averages over the last 14 days.

OK, that makes sense.Whew! That's a relief! I was beginning to think I was cast into the same category as Mutineer. To misquote 'When Harry Met Sally': "I'll have what s/he's NOT having." :p

That's why I only looked at the averages over the last 14 days.

My point, again, is this: The fact that the average time between saves is going up, from week to week, does not imply that the teams are slowing down. Right?

Right?
During the period concerned there were only 7 saves uploaded by teams who have now finished, and they were distributed 4 and 3 in the two weeks I looked at.

If you only count saves uploaded by teams who are still playing, the full numbers are:

53 saves between 19 June and 25 June inclusive = 1.85 days per save per team
43 saves from 26 June to date = 2.28 days per save per team

I interpret that as meaning the teams still playing are slowing down.

I interpret that as meaning the teams still playing are slowing down.

So it does seem. Thanks for the data.

(Edit: Ainwood's point is right, I know we lost significant time due to DNS problems, I assume this is true for other teams too.)

53 saves between 19 June and 25 June inclusive = 1.85 days per save per team
43 saves from 26 June to date = 2.28 days per save per team

I interpret that as meaning the teams still playing are slowing down.Or that people were affected by the DNS problem :mischief:

During the period concerned there were only 7 saves uploaded by teams who have now finished, and they were distributed 4 and 3 in the two weeks I looked at.

If you only count saves uploaded by teams who are still playing, the full numbers are:

53 saves between 19 June and 25 June inclusive = 1.85 days per save per team
43 saves from 26 June to date = 2.28 days per save per team

I interpret that as meaning the teams still playing are slowing down.

pwned :p



Or that people were affected by the DNS problem :mischief:


pwned :p

:D

A fair point, although the DNS problem would have had little effect if teams had passed the saves around via forum attachment or email. Let's see if the pace picks up again this week.

Speaking on behave of Chaos (Munterpipe is on a break), we finished the game inside of two weeks and have just been string everyone alone with our slowish pace. We decided that we didn't want others to feel left behind, it was not the right thing to do.

We did have a bit slow period between days 5 and 7 (I think it was someone's birthday). But we picked up our pace after that. We have been waiting to post in the spoiler log - someone is writing a whip cracking story that should be out any day now.

A deadline is the right way to go.

Thanks for making your position so clear. Not at all the sort of cryptic message we've learnt to expect from Chaos Towers.

Thanks for making your position so clear. Not at all the sort of cryptic message we've learnt to expect from Chaos Towers.No problem. It just takes us a little longer in the discussion phase.

I think the deadline is perfectly fair and the only way you can end this game. Can you imagine anything interesting that just goes on forever?:crazyeye:

Also thanks to AlanH and Gyathaar for their efforts :goodjob: .

Btw. what do you all think about creating an award for best spoiler? It might increase the interest in making one!!

I guess we could have a poll at the end for the best spoiler. maybe attached to the Results and Congratulations thread? I'm certainly not going to set myself up as judge and jury for that sort of competition :eek:

I don't think that would be fair to some of the teams that already posted their spoilers. Even though each team should have given their all when reporting, some might have given a little extra with a recognition on the line.

It's definitely a good idea for next SGOTM, though.

D'you think we need to have a poll to decide whether to have a poll? :p

Yes, but first we need a committee to detirmine feasibility of the pre-poll poll. An additional thread should be open for the voting on committe chair and other assorted officers. I'll assume standard parlimentary procedure?

Probably best to form a committee to address that concern.

Surely we need a committee to discuss the best way of addressing that concern?

I'm not so sure, I think we should vote on whether a committee is needed.

Nice to see there are so many brothers and sisters of the movement. Hail the PFJ ! [party]

Whoa whoa whoa slow down there ... I don't think we're ready for a vote until we have a pre-meeting.

Alan, never tell a joke that others can roll with. You'll always regret it. :)

I need an agenda before I can even consider a meeting about a council on a vote for this poll.

And I need a vote before I can put together an agenda for the meeting about a council on a vote for this poll.

Alan, never tell a joke that others can roll with. You'll always regret it. :)
What's to regret? They're having fun. I can always pull rank and stop the spam ... if I so choose.

quick question, I missed out on this SGOTM, do you have a timeline for when signups for the next one will start, Alan?

No one has so far come up with a cast iron reason to change from my previous suggestion that we declare results for this game on 8th August. I'll leave it a day or so more, because some of our US friends may still be celebrating their Independence this week.

However, if this deadline stands we'll open sign-ups in the last week of July for a SGOTM 2 start early in August.

I guess we could have a poll at the end for the best spoiler. maybe attached to the Results and Congratulations thread? I'm certainly not going to set myself up as judge and jury for that sort of competition :eek:

I came close to suggesting a poll myself - now I'm glad I didn't :D . Anyway it might be a good idea to wait with this until the next SGOTM. By then we should have the necessarry bureaucracy in place to handle every aspect of this important competition. I suggest in the spirit of the European Union that we require all spoilers to be translated into French, German, Italian etc. Maybe also Albanian - they might become members in a few years. To give you an idea what this would be like I have translated AlanH's comment into Danish:

Jeg tænker at vi til sidst kunne have en afstemning om bedste "spoiler". Måske i sammenhæng med tråden for resultater og lykønskninger? Jeg vil bestemt ikke selv stille op som dommer og jury i den slags konkurrence :eek:

my 2 cents :D

Serbian
Smatram da bismo trebali da imamo anketu na kraju za najbolji "spojler". Mozda nakacen na tred Rezultati i Cestitke? Ja sigurno necu postaviti sebe kao sudiju i porotu takvog takmicenja :eek:

Yeah! Yeah! Enough of the simultaneous translations, already! It wasn't that memorable a quotation :p

So I should stop doing the redneck translation?

"I reckon ya'll aughtta just raise yer hands when the fat lady sings..."

Arrrr - rats, guess I cannot put inthe aussie translation either ...
I reckon we could do a poll-thingy at the end for the bonza spoiler. Howza-about we stick it on the results and congrats thread? Struth, no way I'm gona set myself up as roust-a-bout for that sort of comp.

Yeah! Yeah! Enough of the simultaneous translations, already! It wasn't that memorable a quotation :p

Then, why don't you give us something memorable to translate? :D

We are just trying to do our best with the material you give us :mischief:

I haven't seen anyone raise any significant concerns about setting a deadline of 8th August, so we'll go with that.

So the motion passed! We can chalk that up as a win for Robert's Rules then.

who's Robert? I move for a motion to rename it Alan's Rules.

I've opened the Final Spoiler (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=177783) thread. Post, and discuss, your triumphs and disasters there once you have completed the game, or given up in disgust.

I'll also take this opportunity to remind you that there are just three weeks left before we declare the award winners from those teams who have completed the game at that time.

I know when the game ends in Civ3 more tabs are shown than just score, culture, power.

One thing that would be very nice for Civ4 is to show the number of towns built. It would be nice to see how other teams handled the expansion issue (where too many and too few towns are both bad). Population would probably be a seperate tab as well.

Number of workers would also be of interest.

Not sure if this is hard to do or not (or if you have already done it).

Yes, the Civ3 system exploits capabilities developed mainly for the QSC to extract data from the saves. I'll see if I can provide some extra stats for this game along those lines.

Alan..could you register me with Captain Insano..

I have opened the sign-up thread for the next game here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=178766).

Will we make it to 20 teams this time?

Once we're done, we're allowed to view other threads even if we haven't posted in the final spoiler thread right?

Yes ....10

As this seems to be a Frequently Asked Question, I'll try to save you sending more PMs by pointing out the following text on the Progress Page:

In order to limit spoiler information on this page for games in progress, team progress information does not include the final result scores and victory conditions until the game is declared finished.

The GOTM server seems to be taking a vacation. Please use forum attachments or Upload File to exchange saves until normal service is resumed. When the server comes back, please upload any backlogged files.

UPDATE] It seems to be back in business

... and it's gone again!

Please note that the new team threads are now open for SGOTM 2. Please make sure you use the correct threads for the two games during the short overlap period.

Re. the deadline for this game, I'll use the GOTM definition of the deadline: midnight at the end of August 8 at the International Dateline. So that gives the remaining teams another 36 hours from the time of this post to finish, and I'll publish the results shortly thereafter.

(It also gives me a few more hour to get my act together!).

Where the heck are the other final spoilers? I am a bit disappointed to say the least. :confused:

Final spoilers in the SGOTMs have never been very well supported. I think the teams tend to breathe a sigh of relief when they finish, and their feeling is that there's already a lot of information in their threads that other teams can read once the game is over.

I'll post something on behalf of the Queen's Men. The play might have sucked out loud, but we can still make a story of it. ;)