View Full Version : Epsilon Foreign Ministry
General_W May 19, 2006, 12:25 AM Epsilon Foreign Ministry
(Term 2)
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Welcome to the center of all Foreign Activities & Intelligence.
Here we'll discuss the what’s going in the world abroad.
Please post all comments and foreign-related discussion here.
Departments:
Department of State
Department of Trade
Department of Intelligence and Analysis
Department of Propaganda
For now – discussion for all department will take place here. We can create separate forums when the necessity arises.
Epsilon Foreign Review:
Turns 1-20
Turn 2 – 3290 BC:
http://img160.imageshack.us/img160/6596/239207ca.th.jpg (http://img160.imageshack.us/my.php?image=239207ca.jpg) http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/5042/23920top55cv.th.jpg (http://img108.imageshack.us/my.php?image=23920top55cv.jpg)
Epsilon – 37
Aloha – 37
King Kong – 37
Saggioun the Wise – 37
Pifflenatress – 37
Turn 5 – 3800 BC:http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/2139/53800demo4xv.th.jpg (http://img108.imageshack.us/my.php?image=53800demo4xv.jpg) http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/2940/53800top53xi.th.jpg (http://img108.imageshack.us/my.php?image=53800top53xi.jpg)
Epsilon – 37
Aloha – 37
King Kong – 37
Saggioun the Wise – 37
Pifflenatress – 37
Turn 10 – 3600 BC:
http://img160.imageshack.us/img160/3540/103600demo0vq.th.jpg (http://img160.imageshack.us/my.php?image=103600demo0vq.jpg) http://img160.imageshack.us/img160/7092/103600top57nc.th.jpg (http://img160.imageshack.us/my.php?image=103600top57nc.jpg)
Epsilon – 53 (+16)
Aloha – 46 (+9)
King Kong – 46 (+9)
Saggioun the Wise – 37
Pifflenatress – 37
Turn 15 – 3400 BC:
http://img160.imageshack.us/img160/3910/153400demo7dx.th.jpg (http://img160.imageshack.us/my.php?image=153400demo7dx.jpg) http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/2885/153400top51rh.th.jpg (http://img108.imageshack.us/my.php?image=153400top51rh.jpg)
Epsilon – 64 (+11)
Pifflenatress – 53 (+16)
Aloha – 46 (+0)
King Kong – 46 (+0)
Saggioun the Wise – 46 (+9)
Turn 20 – 3240 BC:
http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/8530/203240deom1dq.th.jpg (http://img108.imageshack.us/my.php?image=203240deom1dq.jpg) http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/4228/203240top57ok.th.jpg (http://img108.imageshack.us/my.php?image=203240top57ok.jpg)
Epsilon – 64 (+0)
Pifflenatress – 57 (+4)
King Kong – 53 (+7)
Aloha – 46 (+0)
Saggioun the Wise – 46 (+0)
As of turn 20, Epsilon controls 25% of the world population, and 1.2% of the world’s land.
(I’ll be tracking the ups and down’s of this more closely going forward)
Analysis Highlights:
* On turn 10 (3600BC) Team King Kong discovered Budhism. They converted on turn 11
* On Turn 12 (3520BC) Someone discovered Hinduism. It appers this was team Saggioun the Wise One… although they have not converted. (StWO gained 9 points that turn, Pifflenatress only gained 6 points, no one else gained any)
* Epsilon began the game with 20% of the world population, we grew to 25% by turn 10, and again to 27.27% by turn 15. We had fallen back to 25% as of turn 20.
This update format will change a bit when I run my first full turn. I had to do things a bit different to catch us up to the present.
If there’s any info you’d like to see that isn’t here – please post a request, and I’ll do my best to help!
Also – feel free to offer any insight you have from analyzing these numbers – I’ll be looking to gather the key info together in a special thread as soon as it is warranted.
That’s all for now!
:salute:
Memphus May 19, 2006, 06:35 AM very very nice :clap:
Good Job!!!
Maybe we shoudl keep this thread though for you reports / screen shots and have discussion elsewhere? (It looks so clean and professional right now ;) )
Not to mentioend it would be easy to read and catch up :goodjob:
General_W May 19, 2006, 11:45 AM Thanks Memphus! Glad you like it.
I'm thinking I'll actually make a new thread for the Department of Intelligence and Analysis that can keep a running log (like above) of everything that's gone on. I'm hoping it can be a long-term thread, that each new CFM can just keep updating for the whole game. I really want feedback on this idea, so here are some more of the specifics of my idea... (borrowed extensively from Fe3333au)
I'm thinking it'll be laid out like this...
* A new post for each and every turn we receive.
* Score comparisons from the last turn (who's moving up, and by how much)
* Significant Demographic Changes from turn-to-turn
* Information based on anything we can see on the map of other Civs
* Summary of foreign trades that we know are happening
Here's what it would look like:
------------------------
- Team Epsilon -
Turn 21
Foreign Headline News:
* Any Big News Headline Here
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – 64 (+0)
2) Pifflenatress – 57 (+4)
3) King Kong – 53 (+7) up from 4th place
4) Aloha – 46 (+0) down from 3rd place
5) Saggioun the Wise – 46 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Tech: X
From Pop: X
From Wonders: X
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1)
2) Epsilon Eridani (down from 1st place)
3)
4)
5)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/4228/203240top57ok.th.jpg (http://img108.imageshack.us/my.php?image=203240top57ok.jpg)
Epsilon Treaties and Trades:
Aloha - No Contact
King Kong – No Contact
Pifflenatress – No Contact
Saggioun the Wise - No contact
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong - X% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (2520BC) by ?StWO? – X% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 25%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* It's all in the dark…
The Numbers:
http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/8530/203240deom1dq.th.jpg (http://img108.imageshack.us/my.php?image=203240deom1dq.jpg)
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
------------------------
At least that's what I'm thinking.
Looking forward to getting feedback and comments on this format.
If everyone likes it. I'll go back and get all the info from turns 2, 5, 10, and 20 – and will do this for every turn from 21 until I retire and pass the baton to the next CFM.
Thoughts?
Memphus May 19, 2006, 12:30 PM Yeah that is cool, actually really neat and can help analize the game into mroe depth.
However it is alot of work, and dont' want to burn out trying to pull that off
But I would be in favor of seeing that for sure!!
General_W May 19, 2006, 02:15 PM I don't think it will be too much work at all - and it will really help us grasp the big picture of what is going on... and will REALLY help those that can't open the save.
Besides - there's not much to report right now, and I plan to be comfortably retired from the CFM office by the time this becomes a lot of work ;)
peter grimes May 19, 2006, 07:23 PM See everyone?.. This is precisely why I said that General_W was eminently qualified and a terrific choice for this positon.
The format seems like a great start, but I'm sure it'll be tweaked as the game progresses.
One thing that I've been hoping we could do is Graphs of data. A graph may make this data easier comprehended: 1) Epsilon ? 64 (+0)
2) Pifflenatress ? 57 (+4)
3) King Kong ? 53 (+7) up from 4th place
4) Aloha ? 46 (+0) down from 3rd place
5) Saggioun the Wise ? 46 (+0)
General_W May 20, 2006, 03:56 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 20
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* No News is Good News
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – 64 (steady)
2) Pifflenatress – 57 (steady)
3) King Kong – 53 (steady)
4) Aloha – 46 (steady)
5) Saggioun the Wise – 46 (steady)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 10
From Land: 0
From Tech: 33
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1)
2) Epsilon Eridani (Steady)
3)
4)
5)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/5547/203200top55tz.th.jpg (http://img294.imageshack.us/my.php?image=203200top55tz.jpg)
Epsilon Treaties and Trades:
Aloha - No Contact
King Kong – No Contact
Pifflenatress – No Contact
Saggioun the Wise - No contact
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong - 16% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by ?StWO? – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 25%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* It's all in the dark…
The Numbers:
http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/315/203200demo0cy.th.jpg (http://img216.imageshack.us/my.php?image=203200demo0cy.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Nothing very exciting to comment on here. I’ll be organing an “Inteligence Thread” that will just contain this kind of info without any commentary here as soon as I get some more time. But again – feel free to discuss and comment in this thread – and point out any analysis points that I miss.
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
General_W May 22, 2006, 08:07 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 21
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* No News is Good News
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon (Huang) – 79 (+15) :wow:
2) Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) – 66 (+9)
3) King Kong (Gandhi) – 61 (+8)
4) Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) – 57 (+11) up from 5th
5) Aloha (Catherine) – 54 (+8) down from 4th
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 10
From Land: 9
From Tech: 39
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1)
2) Epsilon Eridani (Steady)
3)
4)
5)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/2347/213160top50qu.th.jpg (http://img53.imageshack.us/my.php?image=213160top50qu.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi )- 16% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 25%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* It's all in the dark…
The Numbers:
http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/3791/213160demo6gb.th.jpg (http://img53.imageshack.us/my.php?image=213160demo6gb.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* We’ve not only maintained, but expanded our point lead! Way to go Epsilon!
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
Memphus May 22, 2006, 08:56 PM I figured this might help everyone else as well (with all the leader names etc) and possibly this could be psoted in the Foreign Stikied thrad:
Team Aloha ==> Catherine (Russia) ==> Cheif Aloha (Red)
Team Innovia ==> Saladin (Arabia) ==> Saggioun the Wise (Green)
Team Piffle ==> Elizabeth (England) ==> Pifflenatres (White)
Team Loco ==> Ghandi (India) ==> King Kong (Purple)
General_W May 22, 2006, 09:01 PM Good idea Memphus!
I'll add that into my updates from now on.
:hatsoff:
EDIT: and added above... with color! :)
DaveMcW May 22, 2006, 10:10 PM I'm sure Innovia founded Hinduism, unless another team popped Mysticism on turn 1.
General_W May 23, 2006, 09:45 AM yeah - I'm sure you're correct.
I've removed the question marks. I'm just bothered by the fact that they haven't converted.
I wonder why?
Maybe they think the other teams aren't paying close attention... little do they know! :evil:
Kentharu May 23, 2006, 09:53 PM great job with this its like the through the looking glass thread
General_W May 25, 2006, 09:14 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 22
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* No Team gains any points this turn
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon (Huang) – 79 (+0)
2) Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) – 66 (+0)
3) King Kong (Gandhi) – 61 (+0)
4) Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) – 57 (+0)
5) Aloha (Catherine) – 54 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 10
From Land: 9
From Tech: 39
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1)
2) Epsilon Eridani (Steady)
3)
4)
5)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/5523/223120top53bj.th.jpg (http://img234.imageshack.us/my.php?image=223120top53bj.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi )- 16% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 25%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* It's all in the dark…
The Numbers:
http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/810/223120demo9lc.th.jpg (http://img61.imageshack.us/my.php?image=223120demo9lc.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* It was a quiet turn on the International Front. No point jumps, no contacts, not much of anything.
Back to sleep… :sleep:
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
General_W May 30, 2006, 02:42 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 23
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Team Aloha (Catherine) Leaps Forward in Points. The Foreign Department suspects they have discovered a new technology.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon (Huang) – 79 (+0)
2) Aloha (Catherine) – 68 (+14) :wow: Up from last place
3) Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) – 66 (+0) Drops from 2nd place
4) King Kong (Gandhi) – 61 (+0) Drops from 3rd place
5) Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) – 57 (+0) Drops from 4th place
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 10
From Land: 9
From Tech: 39
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1)
2) Epsilon Eridani (Steady)
3)
4)
5)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/9958/233080top50ev.th.jpg (http://img251.imageshack.us/my.php?image=233080top50ev.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi )- 16% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 25%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* It's all in the dark…
The Numbers:
http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/4044/233080demo8ru.th.jpg (http://img251.imageshack.us/my.php?image=233080demo8ru.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Sorry this update was slow in coming. Stayed really busy over the long weekend.
* I suspect that Aloha's big point jump is due to discovering a technology. Anyone with more experience than me want to speculate on what it might have been? I don't know of anyway we could tell.
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
General_W May 30, 2006, 03:01 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 24
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Pifflentress regains their #2 spot by gaining 7 points.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon (Huang) – 79 (+0)
2) Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) – 73 (+7) Up from 3rd place
3) Aloha (Catherine) – 68 (+0) Down from 2nd place
4) King Kong (Gandhi) – 68 (+7)
5) Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) – 57 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 10
From Land: 9
From Tech: 39
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1)
2) Epsilon Eridani (Steady)
3)
4)
5)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/6586/243040top59hh.th.jpg (http://img140.imageshack.us/my.php?image=243040top59hh.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 16% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 25%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* It's all in the dark…
The Numbers:
http://img273.imageshack.us/img273/4231/243040demo9zh.th.jpg (http://img273.imageshack.us/my.php?image=243040demo9zh.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
*2 teams (Piff & Kong) gained 7 points, but I'm not sure it's possible to tell what caused this.
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
General_W Jun 01, 2006, 09:59 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 25
3000 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Epsilon Team soars ahead in points! Experts puzzled as to why. Some attribute the gain to the inherent superiority of Epsilon Team.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon (Huang) – 93 (+14)
2) Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) – 85 (+12)
3) King Kong (Gandhi) – 77 (+9) Up from 4th place
4) Aloha (Catherine) – 68 (+0) Down from 3rd place
5) Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) – 67 (+10)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 10
From Land: 23 (+14)
From Tech: 39
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1)
2) Epsilon Eridani (Steady)
3)
4)
5)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/3809/253000top55zy.th.jpg (http://img208.imageshack.us/my.php?image=253000top55zy.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Known Towns:
?Aloha Capital? = no ocean tiles in city radius
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Known Towns:
?Innovia Capital? = 9 land tiles ( 3 ocean)
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Known Towns:
?Piffle Capital? = 10 land tiles (2 ocean)
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Known Towns:
?Loco Capital? = 8 land tiles (4 ocean)
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 16% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 25%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* From point gains, and the great analysis from Memphus and DaveMcW, we now know a bit more about the starting locations of all the teams.
Aloha (Catherine) +14 = no ocean tiles in city radius
Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) +12 = 10 land tiles (2 ocean)
Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) +10 = 9 land tiles ( 3 ocean)
King Kong (Gandhi) +9 = 8 land tiles (4 ocean)
The Numbers:
http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/9299/253000demo3tz.th.jpg (http://img208.imageshack.us/my.php?image=253000demo3tz.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
*I'm not sure why we gained 14 points on our land this turn? Anyone know about how the score is calculated?
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
Memphus Jun 01, 2006, 11:06 AM From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
*I'm not sure why we gained 14 points on our land this turn? Anyone know about how the score is calculated?
My guess is because we built a worker. ? :confused:
DaveMcW Jun 01, 2006, 11:25 AM Land doesn't count towards your score until you have controlled it for 20 turns.
General_W Jun 01, 2006, 11:33 AM See - I initially was thinking something like what you said DaveMcW, but then - why didn't everyone else see their score jump by 14 points? They've all controled their expanded radius for just as long!
:confused:
DaveMcW Jun 01, 2006, 11:47 AM Aloha is Creative, their borders expanded 2 turns earlier.
The other civs must have built near ocean tiles, which don't increase your score.
Memphus Jun 01, 2006, 11:54 AM Which makes sense because we were shoked by thier +14 two turns ealier ;)
So that beign said
Aloha is in the mioddle of the land (because we are and got + 14)
Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) (+12)
Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) (+10)
King Kong (Gandhi) (+9)
Based on these increase and DaveMcW's statement that land ocean doesn't count the above have some ocean tiles:
Asumming 1 land tiles = 1.16666 points (we got 12 new ones for 14 points)
Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) +12 = 10 land tiles (2 ocean)
Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) (+10) = 9 land tiles ( 3 ocean)
King Kong (Gandhi) (+9) 8 land tiles (4 ocean)
General_W Jun 01, 2006, 11:56 AM Brilliant!
I'm so glad we had this conversation.
I'll add this info to what we know about the teams. Could be useful later.
Great work Gentlemen! :goodjob:
General_W Jun 05, 2006, 02:12 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 26
2960 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* No News is Good News
* No teams gain any points
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon (Huang) – 93 (+0)
2) Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) – 85 (+0)
3) King Kong (Gandhi) – 77 (+0)
4) Aloha (Catherine) – 68 (+0)
5) Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) – 67 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 10
From Land: 23
From Tech: 39
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1)
2) Epsilon Eridani (Steady)
3)
4)
5)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/2792/262960top56ex.th.jpg (http://img103.imageshack.us/my.php?image=262960top56ex.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Known Towns:
?Aloha Capital? = no ocean tiles in city radius
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Known Towns:
?Innovia Capital? = 9 land tiles ( 3 ocean)
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Known Towns:
?Piffle Capital? = 10 land tiles (2 ocean)
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Known Towns:
?Loco Capital? = 8 land tiles (4 ocean)
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 16% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 25%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/3857/262960demo9ro.th.jpg (http://img103.imageshack.us/my.php?image=262960demo9ro.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
*Sorry this update was a little slow in coming.
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
General_W Jun 06, 2006, 07:04 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 27
2920 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Saladin gains 7 points… punts Team Aloha down to last place.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon (Huang) – 93 (+0)
2) Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) – 85 (+0)
3) King Kong (Gandhi) – 77 (+0)
4) Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) – 74 (+7) Up from 5th
5) Aloha (Catherine) – 68 (+0) Down from 4th
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 10
From Land: 23
From Tech: 39
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Piffle Capital?
2) Epsilon Eridani (Steady)
3)
4)
5)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/7060/272920top59aq.th.jpg (http://img149.imageshack.us/my.php?image=272920top59aq.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Known Towns:
?Aloha Capital? = no ocean tiles in city radius
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Known Towns:
?Innovia Capital? = 9 land tiles ( 3 ocean)
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Known Towns:
?Piffle Capital? = 10 land tiles (2 ocean), 3 population?
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Known Towns:
?Loco Capital? = 8 land tiles (4 ocean)
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 16% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 25%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/825/272920demo6cl.th.jpg (http://img119.imageshack.us/my.php?image=272920demo6cl.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
*Fairly quiet turn. I’m beginning to speculate that Team Piffle must be the team with the #1 city in the world. They don’t have a religion, and yet they have stayed in second place for quite some time. The score can’t be attributed to land area… of course it’s possible they are just benefiting from some luck goody hut pops, but all things being equal, I think it’s fair to assume that they are the other civ with a 3 pop capital.
Other thoughts?
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
General_W Jun 08, 2006, 09:59 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 28
2880 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Epsilon Eridani Drops to 3rd best city in the world.
* Epsilon's share of world population falls 1.62% to 23.38% as foreign capital grows.
* Buddhism soars to 23% of world population - King Kong's Capital Grows to size 3.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon (Huang) – 93 (+0)
2) Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) – 85 (+0)
3) King Kong (Gandhi) – 81 (+4)
4) Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) – 74 (+0)
5) Aloha (Catherine) – 68 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 10
From Land: 23
From Tech: 39
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1)
2)
3) Epsilon Eridani (Drops from Second)
4)
5)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/9855/282880top53oj.th.jpg (http://img87.imageshack.us/my.php?image=282880top53oj.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Known Towns:
?Aloha Capital? = no ocean tiles in city radius, 2 population
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Known Towns:
?Innovia Capital? = 9 land tiles (3 ocean), 2 population
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Known Towns:
?Piffle Capital? = 10 land tiles (2 ocean), 3 population?
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Known Towns:
?Loco Capital? = 8 land tiles (4 ocean) now = 3 population
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 23% of population (+7) :wow:
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population (-1)
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 23.38% (drops from 25%)
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/6711/282880demo6ej.th.jpg (http://img87.imageshack.us/my.php?image=282880demo6ej.jpg)
The Whole Known World:
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/1995/282880map2nq.th.jpg (http://img87.imageshack.us/my.php?image=282880map2nq.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* King Kong (Ghandi) had their capital grow this turn. Buddhism jumped in % of world pop - so it only makes sense. We can now say with confidnce that King Kong has a size 3 town.
* I've also added a "whole known world" map to my updates. I'll take these shots with the culture overlay… hopefully it will be helpful – especially as we meet other people.
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
General_W Jun 11, 2006, 11:12 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 29
2840 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Epsilon Eridani Drops AGAIN to 4th best city in the world.
* Epsilon's share of world population falls again to 21.43% as Aloha capital grows to size 3.
* We learn pottery and gain 7 points
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon (Huang) = 100 (+7)
2) Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 85 (+0)
3) King Kong (Gandhi) = 81 (+0)
4) Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 74 (+0)
5) Aloha (Catherine) = 72 (+4)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 10
From Land: 23
From Tech: 46 (+7)
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1)
2)
3)
4) Epsilon Eridani (Drops from Third)
5)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/6919/292840top50hm.th.jpg (http://img230.imageshack.us/my.php?image=292840top50hm.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population (+1) [no ocean tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 2 Population, :religion: Hindu Holy City [9 land tiles, 3 ocean]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 3 population [10 land tiles, 2 ocean]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 3 population, :religion: Budhism Holy City [8 land tiles, 4 ocean]
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 21% of population (-2)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 14% of population (-1)
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 23.38% (drops from 25%)
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/3359/292840demo4ih.th.jpg (http://img148.imageshack.us/my.php?image=292840demo4ih.jpg)
The Whole Known World:
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/339/292840map4jp.th.jpg (http://img148.imageshack.us/my.php?image=292840map4jp.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Sorry this update was slow in coming – I somehow missed that we had turn 29! Duh!
* You’ll note that I made some updates to the turn 28 report. I missed the growth in the religions last turn – which allowed us to say for sure that King Kong (Gandhi) grew their capital to size 3. This turn, we can say with almost total certainty that Aloha also grew to size 3, and that Piffle has been there for a while now. Only 1 civ still has a size 2 capital, and it must be Saggion (Saladin) – as they have Hinduism and they have declined to having just 14% of world believers.
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
General_W Jun 12, 2006, 10:09 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 30
2800 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) gains 6 points. Suspect they discovered a technology.
* Shadow Tiger has uncovered what appears to be a connection to another land! Perhaps the Foreign ministry will really get put to work here soon?
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon (Huang) = 100 (+0)
2) Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 91 (+6)
3) King Kong (Gandhi) = 81 (+0)
4) Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 74 (+0)
5) Aloha (Catherine) = 72 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 10
From Land: 23
From Tech: 46
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1)
2)
3)
4) Epsilon Eridani (Steady)
5)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/5986/302800top59vx.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=302800top59vx.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [no ocean tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 2 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [9 land tiles, 3 ocean]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 3 population [10 land tiles, 2 ocean]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 3 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [8 land tiles, 4 ocean]
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 21% of population
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 14% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 21.43% (drops from 23.38%)
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/9139/302800demo8ju.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=302800demo8ju.jpg)
* Our enemies average approval rate fell 2% down to 60% - we’re now the 3rd most popular government. (strangely, our people still fell the same about us)
The Whole Known World:
http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/4003/302800map3cy.th.jpg (http://img126.imageshack.us/my.php?image=302800map3cy.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Not a lot happened this turn. We lost another 2% on our share of world population, but no foreign capitals grew that I can tell. I’m not sure how to explain that?
* The average approval of our enemies dropped this turn – I suspect someone’s capital is being threatened… but there’s no way to tell whose – that I know anyway.
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
General_W Jun 14, 2006, 02:22 PM So, I was thinking, there is a high probability that as Shadow Tiger continues south we’ll soon meet our first foreign power.
Since the turns can move quite quickly, I thought that right now might be a good time to draft some boilerplate for rapid sending to the first team we meet. Here’s my rough draft, I look forward to getting comments and suggestions!
Dear [insert new friend/enemy’s name here] ,
Greetings from the golden halls of Epsilon Eridani! The Leader of Epsilon Team sends you his warm regards.
We have met your brave [insert first unit we’ve spotted here] on the [type of terrain] of this glorious land. We are pleased to learn that we are not alone in this world, and look forward to mutual cooperation with your glorious people.
Although it should not be mistaken for a sign of weakness – we are a naturally peaceful people, and if you’ll agree, we believe there is much we can learn and trade togeather.
So how say you? What are your intentions for this world?
We eagerly await your reply.
Sincerely Yours,
Foreign Minister General_W
Epsilon Team!
Allright team! Break out those silver tongues, and let’s polish this baby up :)
Memphus Jun 14, 2006, 03:15 PM Overall Looks Great!!
Thoughts:
a prepreprepared paragraph for if they were the foudner of a religion?
Suggest an offering of peace and working together: allow them to name the continent, or maybe this is a barganing chip left for later?
DaveMcW Jun 14, 2006, 04:30 PM I think the land bridge is narrow enough that our landmass counts as its own continent.
lost_civantares Jun 14, 2006, 08:07 PM Or we could just say "Northern Epsilonia" or what ever we want to name our part of the contanent.
General_W Jun 14, 2006, 11:57 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 31
2760 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Epsilon Eridani grows to size 4! Our score rises +3, and Epsilon Eridani is now the 2nd best city in the world.
* Our new citizen working our mine makes Epsilon Team the world leader in Mfg. Goods! We now lead in Mfg, GNP, crops, and population! Way to go team! :thumbsup:
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon (Huang) = 103 (+3)
2) Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 91 (+0)
3) King Kong (Gandhi) = 81 (+0)
4) Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 74 (+0)
5) Aloha (Catherine) = 72 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13 (+3)
From Land: 23
From Tech: 46
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi)
2) Epsilon Eridani (Up from 4th)
3)
4)
5) Innovia Capital (Saladin)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/6553/312760top50dd.th.jpg (http://img133.imageshack.us/my.php?image=312760top50dd.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [no ocean tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 2 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [9 land tiles, 3 ocean]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 3 population [10 land tiles, 2 ocean]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 3 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [8 land tiles, 4 ocean]
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 20% of population (-1%)
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 13% of population (-1%)
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 26.67% (UP from 21.43%)
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img129.imageshack.us/img129/2109/312760demo6nr.th.jpg (http://img129.imageshack.us/my.php?image=312760demo6nr.jpg)
* We’ve jumped from last place up to second place in Mfg. Goods! (Thanks to our new mine!)
* We are now the most unpopular government in the world. (due to threatening barbarians) Down from 3rd.
The Whole Known World:
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/8769/312760map9zp.th.jpg (http://img148.imageshack.us/my.php?image=312760map9zp.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* With our last population jump, we can now determine what 2 of the other cities on the top 5 list are. City #1 must be Loco City (Gandhi) – due to their higher culture as the Holy City of Buddhism. Last place has to be the only civ still with just 2 population… Innovia City (Saladin).
* Thanks for the feedback so far on the letter. I’ll draft some ideas for if we meet the founder of a religion when I get some time tomorrow.
That's it for this turn!
Kylearan Jun 15, 2006, 03:58 AM Hi,
Last place has to be the only civ still with just 2 population… Innovia City (Saladin).
I wonder if they built something like warrior-warrior-settler? Would be an interesting opening for sure...
-Kylearan
General_W Jun 15, 2006, 02:57 PM Here are some religion paragraphs that can be added to my proposed letter if we meet the founders of Hinduism or Buddhism.
Dear [insert new friend/enemy’s name here] ,
Greetings from the golden halls of Epsilon Eridani! The Leader of Epsilon Team sends you his warm regards.
We have met your brave [insert first unit we’ve spotted here] on the [type of terrain] of this glorious land. We are pleased to learn that we are not alone in this world, and look forward to mutual cooperation with your glorious people.
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpgBuddhism:
We admire your enlightened following of the Buddha, and in honor of meeting you, we have lit our incense sticks, and spent time reflecting on the Noble Eightfold Path.
Speaking of the Eightfold Path – in pursuit of 'right action' we are a naturally peaceful people, and if you are as well, we believe there is much we can learn and trade together.
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpgHinduism:
We admire your mystic following of the Vedas, and in honor of meeting you, we have lit our incense sticks, and spent time reflecting on our Karma.
Speaking of Karma, we are a naturally peaceful people, and if you are as well, we believe there is much we can learn and trade together.
Non-Religious:
Although it should not be mistaken for a sign of weakness – we are a naturally peaceful people, and if you’ll agree, we believe there is much we can learn and trade together.
So how say you? What are your intentions for this world?
We eagerly await your reply.
Sincerely Yours,
Foreign Minister General_W
Epsilon Team!
It's short and sweet – but I don't think we want to overwhelm any new nation with too much syrup.
Comments, suggestions, additions, or deletions are always welcome!
:salute:
peter grimes Jun 15, 2006, 05:15 PM I like the letter, General_W. I only hope that we're not barking up the wrong tree.... There's a very real possibility that we won't meet anyone for another 20 turns :(
But in all likelihood, whoever we meet will be more glad to meet us than we are glad to meet them ;)
General_W Jun 17, 2006, 06:13 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 32
2720 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Piffle’s Capital grows from 3 to 4
* Aloha discovers a tech and moves up to 4th place
* Hinduism and Buddhism are back in balance at 17% of followers each
* Foreign Minister General_W pins down each of the top 5 cities in the world!
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 103 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 94 (+3)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 81 (+0)
4) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 79 (+7) (Up from 5th)
5) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 74 (+0) (Down from 4th)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 46
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi)
2) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth)
3) Innovia Capital (Saladin) – up from 5th
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang) – down from 2nd
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img78.imageshack.us/img78/2104/322720top55gg.th.jpg (http://img78.imageshack.us/my.php?image=322720top55gg.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [no ocean tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [9 land tiles, 3 ocean]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [10 land tiles, 2 ocean]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 3 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [8 land tiles, 4 ocean]
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 17% of population (-3%)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 17% of population (+4%)
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 23.53% (DOWN from 26.67%)
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img78.imageshack.us/img78/4489/322720demo0id.th.jpg (http://img78.imageshack.us/my.php?image=322720demo0id.jpg)
* We’ve fallen to second place in crop yield. One of our opponents now has 15mb – to our 11mb. Quite the jump!
* We have climbed out of last place in popularity. Yaay! However, this isn’t due to any change in our actual approval rating.
The Whole Known World:
http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/805/322720map9ab.th.jpg (http://img85.imageshack.us/my.php?image=322720map9ab.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* With the recent movements in population and religion status, we can now pin down exactly which cities hold what place in the top 5. This has been a personal goal of mine, and I’m quite pleased to have achieved it. :D – we may not be able to perfectly keep track from here on out – but it is interesting to know for now!
* Unfortunately, based on what we can see from this turn by Shadow Tiger – we may actually need a galley to meet another team :sad: - we’ll just have to see.
That's it for this turn!
General_W Jun 19, 2006, 03:18 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 33
2680 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Religious Civs now dominate the Top 5 cities. (Innovia and Loco)
* Innovia's Capital grows to size 3
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 103 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 94 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 81 (+0)
4) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 79 (+0)
5) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 78 (+4)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 46
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi)
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin) (Up from 3rd place)
3) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth) (Down from 2nd Place)
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang)
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/8840/332680top53td.th.jpg (http://img132.imageshack.us/my.php?image=332680top53td.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [no ocean tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [9 land tiles, 3 ocean]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [10 land tiles, 2 ocean]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 3 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [8 land tiles, 4 ocean]
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 17% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 17% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 23.53%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/3737/332680demo1ob.th.jpg (http://img205.imageshack.us/my.php?image=332680demo1ob.jpg)
* We’ve fallen to third place in crop yield. We're down from 1st place just 2 turns ago.
* We are down to 2nd place in Soldiers. Although I believe this is mostly due to falling behind a bit in population?
* We're back down to our normal position as last place in popularity.
First Place in:
- GNP (gold)
- Mfg. Goods (production)
- Population
The Whole Known World:
http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/9796/332680map2ov.th.jpg (http://img58.imageshack.us/my.php?image=332680map2ov.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Nothing really exciting – the smaller Founding religion capitals have risen to the Top5 city status.
* We pretty consistently have the lowest popularity rating of all governments… I take this as a good sign. It means the others must be protecting their capitals… which means they have fewer units out scouting and/or have delayed other builds in favor of military.
That's it for this turn!
DaveMcW Jun 19, 2006, 11:24 PM I spent some time calculating the score breakdowns.
Land Tiles in the Fat Cross
Epsilon = 20 land
Aloha = 13 land (highest in the world at turn 4)
Innovia = 12 land (disappeared from lowest in the world after the hindu city reached radius 3)
Piffle = 18 land (lowest in the world after the creative & spiritual civs reached radius 3)
Loco = 15 land (by subtraction)
The Civ4 scoring system has 4 categories.
population = 5000 points
land = 2000 points
technology = 2000 points
wonders = 1000 points
The score breakdown tells us how many of each category is on the map.
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/566/score6ke.gif
max population = 1430
land tiles = 1671
technology = 301 (ancient=1, classical=2, medieval=3, renassance=4, industrial=5, modern=6, future=7)
wonders = 230 (world wonder=5, national wonder=5, shrine=5)
So we can calculate how much an individual item is worth.
1 population = 3.4965 points = 5000 / 1430
1 land = 1.1969 points = 2000 / 1671
1 ancient tech = 6.6445 points = 2000 / 301
1 wonder = 21.7391 points = 1000 / 230 * 5
And assuming that only one item is added per turn, we can conclude:
3-4 points = population
6-7 points = technology
21-22 points = wonder
So examining the scores through turn 20, we get:
Epsilon Score Breakdown
From 3 Pop: 10
From 0 Land: 0
From 5 Tech: 33
From 1 Wonder: 21
Piffle Score Breakdown
From 3 Pop: 10
From 0 Land: 0
From 4 Tech: 26
From 1 Wonder: 21
Loco Score Breakdown
From 2 Pop: 6
From 0 Land: 0
From 4 Tech: 26
From 1 Wonder: 21
Aloha Score Breakdown
From 2 Pop: 6
From 0 Land: 0
From 3 Tech: 19
From 1 Wonder: 21
Innovia Score Breakdown
From 2 Pop: 6
From 0 Land: 0
From 3 Tech: 19
From 1 Wonder: 21
Things get tricker as the game goes on, but I believe these are accurate for turn 33:
Epsilon Score Breakdown
From 4 Pop: 13
From 20 Land: 23
From 7 Tech: 46
From 1 Wonder: 21
Piffle Score Breakdown
From 4 Pop: 13
From 18 Land: 21
From 6 Tech: 39
From 1 Wonder: 21
Loco Score Breakdown
From 3 Pop: 10
From 15 Land: 17
From 5 Tech: 33
From 1 Wonder: 21
Aloha Score Breakdown
From 3 Pop: 10
From 13 Land: 15
From 5 Tech: 33
From 1 Wonder: 21
Innovia Score Breakdown
From 3 Pop: 10
From 12 Land: 14
From 5 Tech: 33
From 1 Wonder: 21
I see 3 distinct jumps in Innovia's population (turn 11-15, turn 21, turn 33), but they only have 3 pop now. I would guess this is due to a pop rush in turn 25, the same turn they discovered Bronze Working and expanded borders. A very busy and confusing turn!
With everything accounted for, we can see the water distribution around the capitals.
Epsilon: radius1 = 8 land, radius2 = 12 land
Piffle: radius1 = 8 land, radius2 = 10 land
Loco: radius1 = 4 land, radius2 = 11 land
Aloha: radius1 = 7 land, radius2 = 6 land
Innovia: radius1 = 6 land, radius2 = 6 land
It would be really nice to have a global score breakdown for every turn played so far. Then we could guess at technology research and build orders. But I need a break now. :)
Kentharu Jun 19, 2006, 11:26 PM nice job mate, you guys are to smart :p
General_W Jun 22, 2006, 12:47 PM Ok Dave,
Thanks for that great analysis. Awesome work. :hatsoff:
I'll take up this challenge – but I may have to do it in stages.
I'm putting this into an excel spreadsheet, as I believe it's much easier to follow that way. Everything is working out nicely, but I think I've got a small problem with Aloha's score. I'll be posting it all later – I think I'll start a totally new thread for tracking this info on an ongoing basis.
Here's the Aloha numbers – if anyone can see where I've gone wrong, I'd love to hear it!
They seem too low on Tech, and there's an unexplained gain of just 1 point on turn 33. Help!!
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Aloha_33.jpg
Just for reference, here's one that I'm pretty sure I've got correct.
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Piffle_33.jpg
EDIT: I'm thinking now that maybe we were wrong about how many land points Aloha gained on turn 23. Perhaps they just gained 7 land tiles for 8 points... and the rest of their +14 that turn came from tech? This seems to make the most sense. Anyone disagree?
DaveMcW Jun 22, 2006, 12:55 PM Try double-checking Aloha's score on turn 32. I think you copied it wrong.
And yes, I think Aloha gained a tech on turn 23. Looking at the turn 4 save, they must have 13 land.
For more accurate population numbers, the pattern goes like this:
size 1 = 3.4965 = +3
size 2 = 6.9930 = +3
size 3 = 10.4895 = +4
size 4 = 13.9860 = +3
size 5 = 17.4825 = +4
Decimals are always rounded down.
Please re-read my previous post - I spent a lot of time getting those numbers right and some are different from what we discussed before.
General_W Jun 22, 2006, 02:42 PM Thanks Dave, I appreciate your patience.
I somehow missed your land/water distribution analysis.
Aloha is now corrected, and I'll be posting everything as soon as it's all done. Life's been really busy lately – so I haven't had as much time as I would like.
General_W Jun 22, 2006, 04:45 PM Yaay – I got a bit of down time here, and finished up the repots. I created a new thread for them – the Epsilon Central Intelligence Agency (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=175163)– please take a look and let me know what you think / if you find any mistakes.
Please post any comments here in this thread.
Again – a BIG thanks to Dave for getting this all rolling and helping me along the way.
I hope it helps the team!
:salute:
General_W Jun 22, 2006, 07:35 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 34
2640 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* We discover Mysticism and gain 7 points
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 110 (+7)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 94 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 81 (+0)
4) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 79 (+0)
5) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 78 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 53 (+7)
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi)
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin)
3) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth)
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang)
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/5738/342640top52gd.th.jpg (http://img216.imageshack.us/my.php?image=342640top52gd.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 3 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 17% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 17% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 23.53%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/7383/342640demo7xb.th.jpg (http://img90.imageshack.us/my.php?image=342640demo7xb.jpg)
* We’re out of the cellar again on Popularity.
First Place in:
- GNP (gold)
- Mfg. Goods (production)
- Population
International Force Alignment:
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/4374/342640mapmil9mb.th.jpg (http://img100.imageshack.us/my.php?image=342640mapmil9mb.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Since President DaveMcW has been posting a shot of the whole world in his State of the Empire Updates, I’ve decided to do something a little different here – so as not to duplicate efforts. Now I’m showing the whole world as seen by our military advisor. Hope this is a helpful view for everyone!
* I’ve now updated the capital land/water data to the correct numbers and added a link to each civ’s intelligence report.
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
lost_civantares Jun 23, 2006, 07:07 AM Just a minor nit pick: On turn 27 Innovia popped a tech. :)
I corrected it and uploaded it to imageshack for you, so just use
http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/3463/innovia337bs.jpg
Hope I'm not being annoying or anything, but you did ask for us to tell you any mistakes! :p
Quite an amazing job you have done, I've never realized how much you can figure out just through some knowlage of how points are earned! :hatsoff:
General_W Jun 23, 2006, 08:12 AM Glad you like it Lost Civ!
Thanks for the updated table.
I'm uploading it now.
:thumbsup:
DaveMcW Jun 24, 2006, 09:05 PM I went through turns 2-20 and collected the individual turn scores.
Piffle
Turn Score Pop Land Tech Wonders Notes
2 37 1 0 2 1 Capital has 8 land, 1 water
3 37 1 0 2 1
4 37 1 0 2 1
5 37 1 0 2 1 Capital expands; 18 land, 3 water
6 37 1 0 2 1
7 37 1 0 2 1
8 37 1 0 2 1
9 37 1 0 2 1
10 37 1 0 2 1
11 40 2 0 2 1 Capital grows by 1 (average 2.2 food/turn)
12 46 2 0 3 1 New Tech!
13 46 2 0 3 1
14 53 2 0 4 1 New Tech!
15 53 2 0 4 1
16 53 2 0 4 1
17 53 2 0 4 1
18 53 2 0 4 1
19 57 3 0 4 1 Capital grows by 1 (average 3 food/turn)
20 57 3 0 4 1
Aloha
Turn Score Pop Land Tech Wonders Notes
2 37 1 0 2 1 Capital has 7 land, 2 water
3 37 1 0 2 1 Capital expands; 13 land, 8 water
4 37 1 0 2 1
5 37 1 0 2 1
6 37 1 0 2 1
7 37 1 0 2 1
8 40 2 0 2 1 Capital grows by 1 (average 3 food/turn)
9 46 2 0 3 1 New Tech!
10 46 2 0 3 1
11 46 2 0 3 1
12 46 2 0 3 1
13 46 2 0 3 1
14 46 2 0 3 1
15 46 2 0 3 1
16 46 2 0 3 1
17 46 2 0 3 1
18 46 2 0 3 1
19 46 2 0 3 1
20 46 2 0 3 1
Innovia
Turn Score Pop Land Tech Wonders Notes
2 37 1 0 2 1 Capital has 6 land, 3 water
3 37 1 0 2 1
4 37 1 0 2 1
5 37 1 0 2 1 Capital expands; 12 land, 9 water
6 37 1 0 2 1
7 37 1 0 2 1
8 37 1 0 2 1
9 37 1 0 2 1
10 37 1 0 2 1
11 37 1 0 2 1
12 46 2 0 3 1 Capital grows by 1 (average 2 food/turn); Polytheism; Hinduism founded
13 46 2 0 3 1
14 46 2 0 3 1
15 46 2 0 3 1
16 46 2 0 3 1
17 46 2 0 3 1
18 46 2 0 3 1
19 46 2 0 3 1
20 46 2 0 3 1
Loco
Turn Score Pop Land Tech Wonders Notes
2 37 1 0 2 1 Capital has 4 land, 5 water
3 37 1 0 2 1
4 37 1 0 2 1
5 37 1 0 2 1 Capital expands; 15 land, 6 water
6 37 1 0 2 1
7 37 1 0 2 1
8 40 2 0 2 1 Capital grows by 1 (average 3 food/turn)
9 40 2 0 2 1
10 46 2 0 3 1 Meditation; Buddhism founded
11 46 2 0 3 1
12 46 2 0 3 1
13 46 2 0 3 1
14 46 2 0 3 1
15 46 2 0 3 1
16 46 2 0 3 1
17 46 2 0 3 1
18 53 2 0 4 1 New Tech!
19 53 2 0 4 1
20 53 2 0 4 1
General_W Jun 25, 2006, 03:55 PM Thanks Dave! you must either have a lot more time than me, be a lot more dedicated to the team... or both! :hatsoff:
I'll probably steal this format for the CIA thread - for tracking on an ongoing basis.
peter grimes Jun 25, 2006, 08:37 PM General_W and DaveMcW have provided an extremely useful service here, and I sincerely hope everyone understands and appreciated the work that went into it.
We clearly have an Eye on the World ;)
General_W Jun 28, 2006, 09:49 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 35
2600 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* King Kong Capital Grows
* Hinduism now 22% of world adherents
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 110 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 94 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 84 (+3)
4) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 79 (+0)
5) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 78 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 53
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi)
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin)
3) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth)
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang)
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/8372/352600top57ir.th.jpg (http://img57.imageshack.us/my.php?image=352600top57ir.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 22% (+5) of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% (-1) of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 22.22%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img105.imageshack.us/img105/2135/352600demo6ld.th.jpg (http://img105.imageshack.us/my.php?image=352600demo6ld.jpg)
* We've dropped to second place in Mfg. Goods.
First Place in:
- GNP (gold)
- Population
International Force Alignment:
[http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/6339/352600mapmil0fb.th.jpg (http://img66.imageshack.us/my.php?image=352600mapmil0fb.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Sorry this update was so slow in coming. It's been a crazy week!
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
General_W Jun 28, 2006, 09:55 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 36
2560 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* No Point movement
* We regain our #1 position on Mfg. Goods – but someone is now ahead of us on GNP.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 110 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 94 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 84 (+0)
4) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 79 (+0)
5) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 78 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 53
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi)
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin)
3) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth)
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang)
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/2743/362560top56bl.th.jpg (http://img530.imageshack.us/my.php?image=362560top56bl.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 22% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 22.22%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/1862/362560demo7nd.th.jpg (http://img72.imageshack.us/my.php?image=362560demo7nd.jpg)
* We've back to first place in Mfg. Goods.
* We've lost our #1 spot in GNP
First Place in:
- Mfg. Goods
- Population
International Force Alignment:
http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/8048/362560mapmil0zd.th.jpg (http://img529.imageshack.us/my.php?image=362560mapmil0zd.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* I will now be updating the CIA reports on all the empires, using DaveMcW's format. Thanks Mr. President!
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
Agarwaen Jun 28, 2006, 03:18 PM Someone changed from production to gold? maybe started a worker/settler? (chenged from forest/hills to a floodplain or something like that?
lost_civantares Jun 29, 2006, 07:17 AM You can't produce gold till currency. How much effect is there from changing from a mining square to a floodplains? Would it be all that much even at this stage of the game?
General_W Jun 29, 2006, 11:43 AM On turn 35, we switched a worker from a Floodplain to a Mine. I believe the flop in ratings is due to our actions.
Meaning we dropped by 1 gold and gained 4 hammers. This completely explains the reversal. We're only out of 1st place in gold production by 1 gold.
Memphus Jun 29, 2006, 03:37 PM On turn 35, we switched a worker from a Floodplain to a Mine. I believe the flop in ratings is due to our actions.
Meaning we dropped by 1 gold and gained 4 hammers. This completely explains the reversal. We're only out of 1st place in gold production by 1 gold.
The loss of 1gp...or more specifically commerce ;) will be more than made up by the expediated completion of the library which will multiply our commerce by 25% (as long as we run 100% science which we will until we can't) and it works out to a larger gain. :)
General_W Jul 01, 2006, 12:24 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 37
2520 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Innovia Learns a New Tech – score jumps 6 points! No longer in last place.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 110 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 94 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 84 (+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 84 (+6)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 79 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 53
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi)
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin)
3) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth)
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang)
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine)
World Wonders:
* None
http://img116.imageshack.us/img116/417/372520top52cy.th.jpg (http://img116.imageshack.us/my.php?image=372520top52cy.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 22% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 22.22%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img128.imageshack.us/img128/664/372520demo8lv.th.jpg (http://img128.imageshack.us/my.php?image=372520demo8lv.jpg)
First Place in:
- Mfg. Goods
- Population
International Force Alignment:
http://img128.imageshack.us/img128/3672/372520mapmil1gc.th.jpg (http://img128.imageshack.us/my.php?image=372520mapmil1gc.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Nothing really exciting to report. Innovia gained a new technology – but that’s about all that happened.
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
General_W Jul 05, 2006, 01:38 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 38
2480 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* King Kong (Gandhi) learns a new tech.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 110 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 94 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 90(+6)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 84 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 79 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 53
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi)
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin)
3) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth)
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang)
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine)
World Wonders:
* None
*no images this turn. Sorry!
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 22% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 22.22%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
* No image this turn, sorry!
First Place in:
- Mfg. Goods
- Population
International Force Alignment:
* Nope, no image here either. :blush:
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* King Kong picked up a new tech, but not other movement was detected in the world.
* I was able to access the save file (long story, don't ask) but wasn't able to get any screenshots out to where I could post them. Anyway – at least I got all the data!
* It's likely I'll be on vacation for the next turn or 2 (or 3) – so this department's reporting can either go into "sleep mode" while I'm gone, or someone will need to volunteer to take over. It's possible I'll get brief access to the internet while on vacation – if so, I'll check in and try to post an update. I have figured out an internet solution for my home, but won't have it running till I'm back from vacation.
That's it for this turn!
:salute:
DaveMcW Jul 14, 2006, 07:39 PM Life expectancy analysis
Life expectancy = 100 * health / (sickness + health)
Here is a table of life expectancy for different sickness/health combinations.
sickness/
health life expectancy
1/4 80
1/5 83
1/6 85
1/7 87
2/4 66
2/5 71
2/6 75
2/7 77
3/4 57
3/5 62
3/6 66
3/7 70
4/4 50
4/5 55
4/6 60
4/7 63
5/4 44
5/5 50
5/6 54
5/7 58
6/4 40
6/5 45
6/6 50
6/7 53
So now to analyze the data:
Turn 2:
Epsilon: 2 sickness, 5 health (71 LE)
Piffle: 1 sickness, 5 health (83 LE)
Aloha: 1 sickness, 5 health (83 LE)
Innovia: 1 sickness, 5 health (83 LE)
Loco: 1 sickness, 5 health (83 LE)
All teams get 2 health for prince level. That means everyone has freshwater and 2-3 forests. Or 6 forests and no freshwater. We are the only team with at least 3 floodplains/jungle.
Turn 10:
Loco and Aloha gain 1 pop
Loco: 2 sickness, 5 health (71 LE)
Aloha: 2 sickness, 5 health (71 LE)
Turn 11:
Piffle gains 1 pop
Piffle: 2 sickness, 5 health (71 LE)
Turn 12:
Innovia gains 1 pop
Innovia: 2 sickness, 5 health (71 LE)
Turn 16:
?????: 2 sickness, 6 health (75 LE)
The only way to get health this early is by connecting seafood...
Turn 19:
Piffle gains 1 pop, and a team reaches 66 LE.
Piffle must have the seafood!
Piffle: 3 sickness, 6 health (66 LE)
Turn 28:
Loco gains 1 pop
Loco: 3 sickness, 5 health (62 LE)
Turn 29:
Aloha gains 1 pop
Aloha: 3 sickness, 5 health (62 LE)
Turn 32:
Piffle and Innovia gain 1 pop
Piffle: 4 sickness, 6 health (60 LE)
Innovia: 3 sickness, 5 health (62 LE)
Turn 34:
Piffle connects a health resource
Piffle: 4 sickness, 7 health (63 LE)
Another team connects a health resource
?????: 3 sickness, 6 health (66 LE)
Turn 35:
Loco gains 1 pop
Loco: 4 sickness, 5 health (55 LE)
Turn 36:
Loco connects a health resource
Loco: 4 sickness, 6 health (60 LE)
Turn 37:
Another team connects a health resource
?????: 3 sickness, 6 health (66 LE)
?????: 3 sickness, 6 health (66 LE)
The only teams with 3 pop are Aloha and Innovia
Aloha: 3 sickness, 6 health (66 LE)
Innovia: 3 sickness, 6 health (66 LE)
The really disturbing thing is that Innovia never gained or lost health during the time I predicted they pop-rushed. I may have to recalculate their score distribution. :(
General_W Jul 19, 2006, 02:51 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 39
2440 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* No Points Movement
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 110 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 94 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 90(+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 84 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 79 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 53
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi) - 4
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin) - 3
3) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth) - 4
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang) - 4
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine) - 3
World Wonders:
* None
http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/2121/392440top5eb5.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=392440top5eb5.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 22% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 22.22%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/3786/392440demoak4.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=392440demoak4.jpg)
First Place in:
- Mfg. Goods
- Population
International Force Alignment:
http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/6126/392440mapmiluw8.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=392440mapmiluw8.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* I'm finally starting the catch-up process. I'll be updating the CIA thread here soon also.
:salute:
General_W Jul 19, 2006, 02:58 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 40
2400 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Team Piffle Learns a new Technology!
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 110 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 101 (+7)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 90(+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 84 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 79 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 53
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi) - 4
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin) - 3
3) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth) - 4
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang) - 4
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine) - 3
World Wonders:
* None
http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/1822/402400top5ch9.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=402400top5ch9.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 22% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 22.22%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/2846/402400demozs2.th.jpg (http://img65.imageshack.us/my.php?image=402400demozs2.jpg)
First Place in:
- Mfg. Goods
- Population
International Force Alignment:
http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/209/402400mapmilwh7.th.jpg (http://img125.imageshack.us/my.php?image=402400mapmilwh7.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Piffle got a new technology, but again, we have no way of knowing what that might be. Piffle now has 7 technologies, 5 of them are unknown.
:salute:
General_W Jul 19, 2006, 03:13 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 41
2360 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Loco's Teritory Expands. Early expansion from Holy City!
* Aloha discovers a new technology and gains 6 points
* Piffle drops to 3rd place, Saladin/SwO falls to last
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 110 (+0)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 102(+12) :wow:
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 101 (+0)
4) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 85 (+6)
5) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 84 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 53
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi) - 4
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin) - 3
3) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth) - 4
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang) - 4
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine) - 3
World Wonders:
* None
http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/6781/412360top5da5.th.jpg (http://img79.imageshack.us/my.php?image=412360top5da5.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 22% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 22.22%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/2378/412360demogy3.th.jpg (http://img207.imageshack.us/my.php?image=412360demogy3.jpg)
First Place in:
- Mfg. Goods
- Population
International Force Alignment:
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/1366/412360mapmildf9.th.jpg (http://img207.imageshack.us/my.php?image=412360mapmildf9.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Loco (Ghandi) gained an impressive 12 points this turn. The only plausible explanation for this that I can come up with is that they built an Obelisk and are now enjoying the early cultural expansion from that. This makes sense, as Loco started with Mysticism – so no problem getting the necessary technology.
I'd love to hear any other/better theories.
:salute:
lost_civantares Jul 19, 2006, 03:30 PM How many points would be gained by a new city?
General_W Jul 19, 2006, 03:34 PM That's a very good question lost Civ - it would depend on how much new territory the new city grabbed.
However – in this case, I believe we can rule out the possibility of a new city. Our share of world population didn't budge - as it will when a new city is founded.
General_W Jul 24, 2006, 09:52 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 42
2320 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* We discover Meditation, and expand our lead by 6 points!
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 116 (+6)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 102(+0)
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 101 (+0)
4) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 85 (+0)
5) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 84 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 59
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi) - 4
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin) - 3
3) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth) - 4
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang) - 4
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine) - 3
World Wonders:
* None
http://img78.imageshack.us/img78/2592/422320top5mz7.th.jpg (http://img78.imageshack.us/my.php?image=422320top5mz7.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 22% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 22.22%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/2044/422320demojj1.th.jpg (http://img211.imageshack.us/my.php?image=422320demojj1.jpg)
First Place in:
- Mfg. Goods
- Population
International Force Alignment:
http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/5459/422320mapmilph4.th.jpg (http://img211.imageshack.us/my.php?image=422320mapmilph4.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* I won't be updating the CIA thread this turn – as nothing changed with our enemies scores.
* Good turn team! This term could be pretty exciting, as I believe we're on the cusp of meeting a new team to our south!
:salute:
General_W Jul 24, 2006, 09:55 AM No one has responded to my question about Loco (Ghandi) gaining 12 points last turn (41). The only plausible explanation for this that I can come up with is that they built an Obelisk and are now enjoying the early cultural expansion from that. This makes sense, as Loco started with Mysticism – so no problem getting the necessary technology for the building.
I'd love to hear any other/better theories. (2 new techs?)
EDIT: and I'm still not clear on why some techs are worth 7 points - and others are worth 6. Is this just a rounding issue that depends on how expensive the technology in question is?
DaveMcW Jul 24, 2006, 11:33 AM Loco hit radius 3 at turn 21, and now twenty turns later it finally counts towards their score. Compare it to the land area growth in demographics on turn 21. We can expect Innovia to get a similar boost next turn.
Techs are worth exactly 6.6445. The final number is always rounded down.
2 Tech: 13.2890 = 13
3 Tech: 19.9335 = 19 (+6)
4 Tech: 26.5780 = 26 (+7)
5 Tech: 33.2225 = 33 (+6)
6 Tech: 39.8670 = 39 (+6)
7 Tech: 46.5115 = 46 (+7)
General_W Jul 24, 2006, 12:04 PM Thanks Dave! Still trying to learn this game.
So - am I correct in assuming that to get to size 3 radius, Loco must have built an obelisk?
DaveMcW Jul 24, 2006, 12:16 PM They built a holy city for +5 culture.
General_W Jul 24, 2006, 01:56 PM Doh! :blush:
Thanks for your patience Dave.
Memphus Jul 24, 2006, 05:20 PM They built a holy city for +5 culture.
When can we "build" ourselves one of those ;)
We will "found" a holy city in roughly 1000 years :)
General_W Jul 25, 2006, 10:06 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 43
2280 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Aloha Founds a New City!! :wow:
* Innovia (Saladin) culture expansion now counts (from Holy City) +20 points
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 116 (+0)
2) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 104 (+20)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 102(+0)
4) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 101 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 88 (+3)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 59
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi) - 4
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin) - 3
3) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth) - 4
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang) - 4
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine) - 3
World Wonders:
* None
http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/7892/432280top5yz2.th.jpg (http://img72.imageshack.us/my.php?image=432280top5yz2.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
Aloha City #2= 1 population [Unknown Territory] – est. t43 (2280 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 22% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 21.05%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/4972/432280demoat2.th.jpg (http://img223.imageshack.us/my.php?image=432280demoat2.jpg)
First Place in:
- Mfg. Goods
- Population
International Force Alignment:
http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/4699/432280mapmilgo1.th.jpg (http://img53.imageshack.us/my.php?image=432280mapmilgo1.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* The biggest news is Aloha's founding of the first new city in the world. (I can tell, because they gained +3 points = 1 population, our share of world population droped, and their capital city didn't grow on the Top 5) This helps explain why they are lagging behind in points… producing an early settler. Tracking new cities is going to get more difficult for a while, now that it will be harder to judge if a rise in population is due to growth in a city we can't see, or the founding of a new city. Still, we should be able to make some educated guesses.
* I'll be updating the CIA thread here soon.
:salute:
General_W Jul 26, 2006, 03:06 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 44
2240 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* No Point Movement this turn
* We've fallen from 1st to 3rd place in MFG – but this is due to our own actions.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 116 (+0)
2) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 104 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 102(+0)
4) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 101 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 88 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 59
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi) - 4
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin) - 3
3) Piffle Capital (Elizabeth) - 4
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang) - 4
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine) - 3
World Wonders:
* None
http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/6209/442240top5as0.th.jpg (http://img57.imageshack.us/my.php?image=442240top5as0.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
Aloha City #2= 1 population [Unknown Territory] – est. t43 (2280 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres - No Contact
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Known Towns:
Piffle Capital = 4 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Nothing Yet
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 21% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 15% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 21.05%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* All in the Dark
The Numbers:
http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/9028/442240demome8.th.jpg (http://img57.imageshack.us/my.php?image=442240demome8.jpg)
First Place in:
- Population
International Force Alignment:
http://img60.imageshack.us/img60/9632/442240mapmiliy7.th.jpg (http://img60.imageshack.us/my.php?image=442240mapmiliy7.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* I went back and reviewed our score tracking for Innovia, based on what DaveMcW discovered via his Life Expectancy analysis. Indeed, the prediction of a pop-rush looks wrong – as we didn't observe any movement in the population scores of the top 5 cities either.
However, this beggs the question, "What happened on turn 33??" Innovia gained 4 points… which we assumed was their capital grown to size 3 (again) – but it can't be that. If their capital had grown, it would have been to size 4, and only been worth 3 points. It also should have showed up in the Top5 cities as a size 4 town… which it doesn’t.
ALSO – someone still had a size 2 town on turn 31 according the the Top5 screen… it goes away on turn 32 – but the only teams to gain points are Piffle (explained by their capital growing to size 4) and Chief Aloha who gains +7 points apparently from Technology.
Is there some way Innovia's capital's growth could have showed up in the Top5 a turn before it showed up in their points? (it doesn’t ever seem to work that way for anyone else) – assuming not… this must mean that Aloha's capital actually grew to size 3, while Innovia's had been size 3 all along. But then, how to explain the other 3 points Aloha gained that turn?
I'm really lost and out of my league on solving this riddle.
DaveMcW? Help?
:help:
P.S. hopefully the records I've maintained here will help solve the puzzle... since I don't seem to be very helpful otherwise.
General_W Jul 29, 2006, 05:00 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 45
2200 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* First Contact is made with Piffle!
* Piffle Founds a New City!
* Piffle Capital is called “Balderdash” and grew to size 5 this turn
* Aloha’s Borders expand (early due to Creative trait) +9 land tiles
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 116 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 108 (+7)
3) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 104 (+0)
4) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 102(+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 99 (+11)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 13
From Land: 23
From Tech: 59
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi) - 4
2) Balderdash (Piffle/Elizabeth) - 5
3) Innovia Capital (Saladin) - 3
4) Aloha Capital (Catherine) - 3
5) Epsilon Eridani (Huang) - 4
World Wonders:
* None
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/2668/452220top5jo9.th.jpg (http://img215.imageshack.us/my.php?image=452220top5jo9.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
Aloha City #2= 1 population [Unknown Territory] – est. t43 (2280 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres
Contact: turn 45 – 2220 BC
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Piffle Official Embassy: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 5 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
Piffle City #2 = 1 population [unknown territory] – est. t45 (2220 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 19% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 14% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 19.05%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle is apparently to our south, where there appears to be a 2nd land bridge.
The Numbers:
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/5990/452220demore2.th.jpg (http://img221.imageshack.us/my.php?image=452220demore2.jpg)
First Place in:
- Nothing!
International Force Alignment:
http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/9559/452220guessljx0.th.jpg (http://img66.imageshack.us/my.php?image=452220guessljx0.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Massive stuff happened this turn, but I believe I’ve got it mostly sorted out. Piffle gained 7 points this turn, but we know that 4 of those points come from their capital (balderdash) growing to size 5. So how to explain the other 3 points? Well – our % of world population dropped all the way to 19.05% - which tells us that the world gained 2 other citizens. This makes sense if Piffle founded another town for +3 points to their population score.
We have met our most dangerous (so far) opponent in this game - Piffle. We must proceed with caution!
* I went back and reviewed our score tracking for Innovia, based on what DaveMcW discovered via his Life Expectancy analysis. Indeed, the prediction of a pop-rush looks wrong – as we didn't observe any movement in the population scores of the top 5 cities either.
However, this beggs the question, "What happened on turn 33??" Innovia gained 4 points… which we assumed was their capital grown to size 3 (again) – but it can't be that. If their capital had grown, it would have been to size 4, and only been worth 3 points. It also should have showed up in the Top5 cities as a size 4 town… which it doesn’t.
ALSO – someone still had a size 2 town on turn 31 according the the Top5 screen… it goes away on turn 32 – but the only teams to gain points are Piffle (explained by their capital growing to size 4) and Chief Aloha who gains +7 points apparently from Technology.
Is there some way Innovia's capital's growth could have showed up in the Top5 a turn before it showed up in their points? (it doesn’t ever seem to work that way for anyone else) – assuming not… this must mean that Aloha's capital actually grew to size 3, while Innovia's had been size 3 all along. But then, how to explain the other 3 points Aloha gained that turn?
I'm really lost and out of my league on solving this riddle.
DaveMcW? Help?
:help:
P.S. hopefully the records I've maintained here will help solve the puzzle... since I don't seem to be very helpful otherwise.
General_W Jul 31, 2006, 09:23 AM It appears I've made a rather stupid mistake. :blush:
Somehow I got it in my head that Koondrad was a member of team Piffle – and included him on recent PM I sent out to several members of team Piffle.
Obviously, I know now that Koondrad is a member of Loco – not Piffle.
I don't believe I've done much damage – fortunately my e-mail only gives away the fact that Epsilon Team and Piffle have met (and that Piffle has a warrior named Bubba).
I have notified the Admins of my mistake – I'll let you know when/if I hear anything from them.
I sincerely apologize for my stupidity/haste.
I thought I'd post all this here, so that everyone knows what happened – and as a warning to others to double check correspondence!
Here's the letter I got from Koondrad
Dear Foreign Minister General_W,
I'm afraid I don't know who this Piffle man you speak of is. I'm afraid that your envoy may have got lost along the way.
Best Regards,
Executive Leader Koondrad,
Team Loco.
sorry everyone :wallbash:
Memphus Jul 31, 2006, 09:33 AM Well that just made my day :)
haha We all make mistakes, but looking at the positive
We now know of somethign else, Loco has not yet me Piffle ;)
Also that Koondrad is the go to player on Piffle :goodjob:
General_W Jul 31, 2006, 12:00 PM glad you got a chuckle out of it at least. :)
Heard back from Ginger Ale...
Thanks for letting us know; no harm, no foul. Don't worry about it, we all make mistakes.
So hopefully that closes this sad chapter in our Diplomatic History.
peter grimes Jul 31, 2006, 08:41 PM No offense, General_W, but I really love it when someone makes a mistake and it's not me!!!!!!
Thanks for letting me laugh a little at your expense ;)
classical_hero Aug 01, 2006, 07:41 AM I think we better fire that diplomat that sent this via the wrong pigoen carrier. :ar15:
General_W Aug 03, 2006, 11:10 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 46
2160 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Piffle (Elizabeth) and King Kong (Gandhi) both discover new technologies!
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 120 (+4)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 115 (+7)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 109(+7)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 104 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 99 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 17
From Land: 23
From Tech: 59
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi) - 4
2) Balderdash (Piffle/Elizabeth) - 5
3) Epsilon Eridani (Huang) - 5
4) Innovia Capital (Saladin) - 3
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine) - 3
World Wonders:
* None
http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/9518/462160top5kn4.th.jpg (http://img103.imageshack.us/my.php?image=462160top5kn4.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
Aloha City #2= 1 population [Unknown Territory] – est. t43 (2280 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres
Contact: turn 45 – 2220 BC
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Piffle Official Embassy: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 5 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
Hamburger = 1 population [unknown territory] – est. t45 (2220 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 18% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 13% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 22.73%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle's second town is named "Hamburger" as revealed by the Diplomacy screen.
The Numbers:
http://img102.imageshack.us/img102/5104/462160demoyr1.th.jpg (http://img102.imageshack.us/my.php?image=462160demoyr1.jpg)
First Place in:
- Nothing!
International Force Alignment:
http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/2296/462160mapmiltu5.th.jpg (http://img103.imageshack.us/my.php?image=462160mapmiltu5.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Our rivals are advancing scientifically, but we'll get our own tech-score boost next turn.
* I'm still waiting to see if DaveMcW (or anyone else?) wants to take up the challenge of figuring out what happened on turn 32 (details below) – until then, I'm leaving the pop-rush theory in there, because it's just as close of any explanation as anything else I've heard. I suppose it's not a big deal in the long run – but it would be fun to know the whole scoop.
* I went back and reviewed our score tracking for Innovia, based on what DaveMcW discovered via his Life Expectancy analysis. Indeed, the prediction of a pop-rush looks wrong – as we didn't observe any movement in the population scores of the top 5 cities either.
However, this beggs the question, "What happened on turn 33??" Innovia gained 4 points… which we assumed was their capital grown to size 3 (again) – but it can't be that. If their capital had grown, it would have been to size 4, and only been worth 3 points. It also should have showed up in the Top5 cities as a size 4 town… which it doesn’t.
ALSO – someone still had a size 2 town on turn 31 according the the Top5 screen… it goes away on turn 32 – but the only teams to gain points are Piffle (explained by their capital growing to size 4) and Chief Aloha who gains +7 points apparently from Technology.
Is there some way Innovia's capital's growth could have showed up in the Top5 a turn before it showed up in their points? (it doesn’t ever seem to work that way for anyone else) – assuming not… this must mean that Aloha's capital actually grew to size 3, while Innovia's had been size 3 all along. But then, how to explain the other 3 points Aloha gained that turn?
I'm really lost and out of my league on solving this riddle.
DaveMcW? Help?
:help:
P.S. hopefully the records I've maintained here will help solve the puzzle... since I don't seem to be very helpful otherwise.
General_W Aug 03, 2006, 12:15 PM Here's some bonus material for those of you (Like Peter who requested this a long time ago) have a hard time following the "score tracker" part of my updates.
Hope you like this!
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/ScoreGraph_46.jpg
General_W Aug 09, 2006, 04:36 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 47
2120 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* We learn Priesthood and gain 7 points.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 127 (+7)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 115 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 109(+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 104 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 99 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 17
From Land: 30
From Tech: 59
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi) - 4
2) Balderdash (Piffle/Elizabeth) - 5
3) Epsilon Eridani (Huang) - 5
4) Innovia Capital (Saladin) - 3
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine) - 3
World Wonders:
* None
*need to get pic
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
Aloha City #2= 1 population [Unknown Territory] – est. t43 (2280 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres
Contact: turn 45 – 2220 BC
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Piffle Official Embassy: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 5 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
Hamburger = 1 population [unknown territory] – est. t45 (2220 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 18% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 13% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 22.73%
% of LandMass = 1.2%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
The Numbers:
* need to get pic
International Force Alignment:
*missing pic
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Trying to catch up from getting very behind. Sorry!
* I went back and reviewed our score tracking for Innovia, based on what DaveMcW discovered via his Life Expectancy analysis. Indeed, the prediction of a pop-rush looks wrong – as we didn't observe any movement in the population scores of the top 5 cities either.
However, this beggs the question, "What happened on turn 33??" Innovia gained 4 points… which we assumed was their capital grown to size 3 (again) – but it can't be that. If their capital had grown, it would have been to size 4, and only been worth 3 points. It also should have showed up in the Top5 cities as a size 4 town… which it doesn’t.
ALSO – someone still had a size 2 town on turn 31 according the the Top5 screen… it goes away on turn 32 – but the only teams to gain points are Piffle (explained by their capital growing to size 4) and Chief Aloha who gains +7 points apparently from Technology.
Is there some way Innovia's capital's growth could have showed up in the Top5 a turn before it showed up in their points? (it doesn’t ever seem to work that way for anyone else) – assuming not… this must mean that Aloha's capital actually grew to size 3, while Innovia's had been size 3 all along. But then, how to explain the other 3 points Aloha gained that turn?
I'm really lost and out of my league on solving this riddle.
DaveMcW? Help?
:help:
P.S. hopefully the records I've maintained here will help solve the puzzle... since I don't seem to be very helpful otherwise.
General_W Aug 09, 2006, 05:00 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 48
2080 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Loco Capital (Ghandi) grows to size 5
* Innovia Capital (Saladin) grows to size 4
* Innovia has +4 points un-accounted for?? :confused:
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 127 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 115 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 113(+4)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 111 (+7)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 99 (+0)
Our Score Breakdown
From Pop: 17
From Land: 30
From Tech: 59
From Wonders: 21
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
1) Loco Capital (Gandhi) - 5
2) Innovia Capital (Saladin) - 4
3) Balderdash (Piffle/Elizabeth) - 5
4) Epsilon Eridani (Huang) - 5
5) Aloha Capital (Catherine) - 3
World Wonders:
* None
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8895/482080top5mf9.th.jpg (http://img204.imageshack.us/my.php?image=482080top5mf9.jpg)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Full Report on Aloha: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193944&postcount=3)
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = 3 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
Aloha City #2= 1 population [Unknown Territory] – est. t43 (2280 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Full Report on Innovia: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193948&postcount=4)
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = 3 Population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg Holy City [12 land, 9 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres
Contact: turn 45 – 2220 BC
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Full Report on Piffle: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193938&postcount=2)
Piffle Official Embassy: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 5 population [18 land, 3 water tiles]
Hamburger = 1 population [unknown territory] – est. t45 (2220 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Full Report on Loco: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4193957&postcount=5)
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 4 population, http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg Holy City [15 land, 6 water tiles]
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: Foreign Science Status:
* Nothing Yet
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)- 20% of population
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 15% of population
Epsilon Victory Status:
% of Population = 20%
% of LandMass = 2.09%
Cities with Legendary Culture = 0
Spaceship Parts = 0
Info Learned from Other Sources:
The Numbers:
http://img55.imageshack.us/img55/2410/482080demopj8.th.jpg (http://img55.imageshack.us/my.php?image=482080demopj8.jpg)
International Force Alignment:
http://img55.imageshack.us/img55/1038/482080mapmilik8.th.jpg (http://img55.imageshack.us/my.php?image=482080mapmilik8.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Any idea why Innovia got that extra +4 this turn? Please help!
* I went back and reviewed our score tracking for Innovia, based on what DaveMcW discovered via his Life Expectancy analysis. Indeed, the prediction of a pop-rush looks wrong – as we didn't observe any movement in the population scores of the top 5 cities either.
However, this beggs the question, "What happened on turn 33??" Innovia gained 4 points… which we assumed was their capital grown to size 3 (again) – but it can't be that. If their capital had grown, it would have been to size 4, and only been worth 3 points. It also should have showed up in the Top5 cities as a size 4 town… which it doesn’t.
ALSO – someone still had a size 2 town on turn 31 according the the Top5 screen… it goes away on turn 32 – but the only teams to gain points are Piffle (explained by their capital growing to size 4) and Chief Aloha who gains +7 points apparently from Technology.
Is there some way Innovia's capital's growth could have showed up in the Top5 a turn before it showed up in their points? (it doesn’t ever seem to work that way for anyone else) – assuming not… this must mean that Aloha's capital actually grew to size 3, while Innovia's had been size 3 all along. But then, how to explain the other 3 points Aloha gained that turn?
I'm really lost and out of my league on solving this riddle.
DaveMcW? Help?
:help:
P.S. hopefully the records I've maintained here will help solve the puzzle... since I don't seem to be very helpful otherwise.
General_W Aug 09, 2006, 05:10 PM Ok – I don't have the files I need here at work to finish my updates for the next 2 turns anyway… and I don't really want to move on till I figure out what happened to Innovia's score on turn 48.
They gained 7 points
+ 3 of the is clearly from their capital growing to size 4.
So where is the other +4 coming from?
It's not a second city – clear from the number of points and the lack of an extra bump in % of world pop.
They just got credit for a territory expansion on turn 43 – it seems to soon for a 2nd round of that? Then again – it seems like they did just that on turn 21 and 25.
I guess that must be it – how DOES that work?
Any help is appreciated!
Thanks so much
:salute:
P.S. I'll post the other updates as soon as I have time to get the saves and look around at them.
Sorry I'm so behind – life's been crazy, and my scarce MTDG time has gone to MIA on the Civ3 MTDG. (we just got involved in a big war :evil: )
General_W Sep 26, 2006, 05:32 PM Proposed Oracle announcement for the UN thread:
Dear People of the World…
Epsilon Team would like to formally announce that we have completed work on remarkable structure we’re calling, The Oracle.
All World leaders are cordially invited to the dedication ceremony.
As for directions to the Eternal City of Epsilon Eridani…
Well… er… we’re north of some trees, and south of some water. But that’s not really helpful, because we’re also south of some other trees, and north of this other spot of water…
Well – anyway… we’ll save a seat for you!
Oracle under construction:
http://x5.freeshare.us/122fs406747_th.jpg (http://x5.freeshare.us/view/?122fs406747.jpg)
Artists Conception of the finished grounds:
http://x5.freeshare.us/122fs406832_th.jpg (http://x5.freeshare.us/view/?122fs406832.jpg)
Any questions about the future may be submitted in writing to Foreign Minister General_W, who will then (For a small fee) ask the questions of the Oracle. Then for a minor response fee, typing fee, and letter mailing fee (as well as any applicable hazardous delivery fees) – will be happy to give you the Oracle’s answer.
I’ll wait for feedback before posting this in the UN.
:salute:
Memphus Sep 26, 2006, 07:37 PM I Like it alot
Although any team with half a brain will put 2 and 2 together realizing we are the ones who have done a CS sling :lol:
Do all the references to the "fees" have a suttle bureacracy undertone because that is just genius :evil:
DaveMcW Sep 26, 2006, 10:14 PM We could add some sample questions & answers from the Oracle. I'm not as good as the Internet Oracle (http://cgi.cs.indiana.edu/~oracle/bestofs.cgi), but here's a few:
twistlok: There are barbarians everywhere! How can I prevent our troops from getting hurt?
Oracle: Use line of sight and defensive bonuses to keep the barbarians away. Some forest hills give 75% defense and +1 visibility, but that's nothing compared to our capital. It has 60% defense, +4 line of sight, plus up to 3 levels of city garrison! Not to mention the terrain bonuses. So keep all troops in the capital for the ultimate in self-defense.
You owe the Oracle the secret of Hereditary Rule.
lost_civantares: Where are all the happiness resources?
Oracle: There are happiness resources all around you. Rice can be brewed to create sake. Horses can be used for many sports. Hemp is useful for more than just bowstrings. Be creative!
You owe the Oracle some rolling paper and a bowstring.
Memphus: At last, I have tricked the citizens into giving me absolue power! MUAHAHAHAHA! But how can I prevent usurpers from deposing me?
Oracle: Every Evil Overlord I've read about in books or seen in movies invariably gets overthrown and destroyed in the end. I've noticed that no matter whether they are barbarian lords, deranged wizards, mad scientists or alien invaders, they always seem to make the same basic mistakes every single time. With that in mind, allow me to present... Peter's Evil Overlord List (http://www.eviloverlord.com/lists/overlord.html).
You owe the Oracle a useless trinket of purely sentimental value.
DaveMcW: Will I win the 18 player pitboss game?
Oracle: If you can prevent anyone from launching a spaceship, you will win in 2050 AD.
You owe the Oracle a spy unit and 100,000:gold:.
Kylearan Sep 27, 2006, 01:03 AM I like the text of the announcement a lot, although I'm not sure how wise a move it will be to make it public that we built the Oracle. Won't that incur a diplomatic penalty with the other teams? I know I would secretly conspire against a team which has successfully pulled of a CSS...
-Kylearan
Memphus Sep 27, 2006, 06:23 AM Well I am sure they will figure it out anyways (well Pfiffle will know this turn for sure once they see us change to bureacracy)
As for Dave's Comments I definetly think those should be added :goodjob:
General_W Sep 27, 2006, 09:38 AM Thanks for the feedback! And yeah, the “Fees” was a subtle dig at the soon to be expanding Epsilon Bureaucracy. Don’t want to make it too obvious, it’s just for internal humor.
@ Dave - That's Brilliant! I LOVED the Evil Overlord List especially. Laughed so hard. I’ll add all your comments in a spoiler.
@ Kylearan – I agree, we do face a potential backlash… but any team that isn’t paying enough attention to notice that “someone” built the oracle this turn and that Epsilon mysteriously jumped from 2nd-to-last all the way to first place… well, they can probably be easily manipulated. Bottom line, any competent team will know we built the oracle, and the best thing for us to do is to try to downplay it a bit with some humor.
I’ll be posting this in the UN with Dave’s addition here very soon.
:salute:
Kylearan Sep 27, 2006, 09:44 AM Hi,
but any team that isn’t paying enough attention to notice that “someone” built the oracle this turn and that Epsilon mysteriously jumped from 2nd-to-last all the way to first place…
Good point, I forgot about our sudden increase in score. :)
I'm curious to see whether and how "mfg goods" values (average and/or best) change during the next turn... :mischief: Might give us some indication whether not not we've beaten some other team to the wonder.
-Kylearan
peter grimes Sep 27, 2006, 03:55 PM If someone else was constructing the Oracle, will their hammers be converted to gold? That's happened to me in single player. I was furious that the AI was able to do that (I suspect a Great Engineer that had been hiding), but I used the gold wisely, and eventually came out ahead.
Anyone know if the hammers/gold thing works the same in Multiplayer?
Kylearan Sep 27, 2006, 04:02 PM Hi,
If someone else was constructing the Oracle, will their hammers be converted to gold?
Yes, all hammers invested into the wonder will be turned into a certain amount of gold, which is nice for compensation but not as good as getting the wonder itself. :)
-Kylearan
DaveMcW Sep 27, 2006, 10:59 PM BCLG100: Aloha would like to congratulate Team epsilon on building this maginficent wonder, word being passed around is that the 'Oracle' gives the people that build it a scientific advancment of some sort, we were wondering whether this was true and just how you advanced following this build?
Oracle: It is easy to determine how advanced Epsilon Team is. Simply compare their cities to this reference screenshot.
http://x5.freeshare.us/122fs532314_th.jpg (http://x5.freeshare.us/view/?122fs532314.jpg)
You owe the Oracle a postcard of an Aloha city.
robboo: how much wood would a wood chuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?
Oracle:A woodchuck would chuck as much wood as a woodchuck could chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood, silly.
You owe the Oracle a more interesting question.
robboo:how many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsie pop?
Oracle: It depends.
If you're a wise old owl: 3
If you're a child: a mean of 89.2, normally distributed with a standard deviation of 23.1
If you're a porn star: infinity
If you're Madonna: 1
If you're a zen master: you are one with the Tootsie Roll center of a Tootsie Pop
If you're Marv Albert: none, I bit it right away, but I thought that's what it wanted
If you're OJ Simpson: I licked it because I loved it
If you're Bill Clinton: I ate a Tootsie Pop, but I didn't lick
You owe the Oracle a normal lollipop.
General_W Sep 27, 2006, 11:35 PM You're good at this!
Oracle Dave! ;)
I'll post those responses.
But I'm adding this to the tootsie pop question...
"If you're a nearly all-knowing super computer: 42"
:) yeah, I'm a geek.
classical_hero Sep 28, 2006, 06:02 AM Dave is truly all knowing. :bowdown:
General_W Oct 29, 2006, 12:28 AM I'm working on a much more complete update to this thread - but in the meantime, I don't think anyone posted about this, so for those that aren't aware: King Kong built Stonehenge on turn 72. :wow:
I’ve always found it to be a pretty useless wonder – but maybe they really want the culture boost?
DaveMcW Oct 29, 2006, 12:52 AM Stonehenge is a cheap source of GPP. But the culture is not that great, especially if you have a religion already.
Kylearan Oct 29, 2006, 01:22 AM Hi,
I like Stonehenge quite a bit. If you don't have a religion, the cheap border expansions can be very valuable, allowing your cities to have access to second-ring resources quickly.
In King Kong's case, I'm almost sure they built it to get an early great prophet to build the shrine for their religion. Or to lightbulb CoL or CS with him later, which is also a common use for him.
-Kylearan
General_W Oct 29, 2006, 09:48 AM oh....
Well I stand corrected!
Good thing I'm just in the observation and reporting business! ;)
(I'm getting such an education about this game... thanks again to all the skilled players who take the time to educate me!)
Memphus Oct 29, 2006, 09:56 AM Should we question out in the open forum why no one came forward to announce the completion of Stonehenge? :evil:
General_W Oct 29, 2006, 11:07 AM How about something like this?
Kindly spoke the Oracle:
I have seen from afar and sources asunder
News I must share of
Greatness and wonder
Kindly send this message
Over to them that has built it, I saw it in my dream
Nice job with Stones, it’s a fine and wonderus circle
Great wishes from us at Epsilon Team!
Memphus Oct 29, 2006, 11:13 AM I think that is Genius!!!
Absolute Genius
It congradulates them and recognizes that we really know what's going on in the world, not to mention it is something the "oracle" should know!! :)
I suggest it gets posted right away!
Memphus Oct 29, 2006, 11:14 AM With the Title Stonehenge for the thread or something else?
General_W Oct 29, 2006, 02:01 PM Glad you liked it Memphus!!
Now posted in the UN
Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4697588#post4697588)
General_W Nov 01, 2006, 05:55 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 77
950 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Foreign Update returns with New Format!
* Innovia LOSES 7 points! :wow:
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 238 (+11)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 195(+0)
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 169 (+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 165 (-7)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 164 (+4)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/77-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi : Stonehenge
Epsilon International Relations Report:
Aloha / Catherine / Cheif Aloha - No Contact
Creative, Financial, Cossack
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Size 5
Aloha City #2
----------------------------------------------------
Innovia / Saladin / Saggioun the Wise - No Contact
Philosophical, Spiritual, Camel Archer
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Size 7, Holy City http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/HinduismSM.jpg
----------------------------------------------------
Piffle / Elizabeth / Pifflenatres
Contact: turn 45 – 2220 BC
Philosophical, Financial, Redcoat
Piffle Official Embassy: Here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population
Hamburger = ? population / est. t45 (2220 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
Loco / Ghandi / King Kong - No Contact
[I]Spiritual, Industrious, Fast Worker
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 6 population / Holy City http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/BuddhismSM.jpg / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: Foreign Science Status:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/77-FA.jpg
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Confucianism – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team.
International Force Alignment:
http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/5226/77mase0.th.jpg (http://img73.imageshack.us/my.php?image=77mase0.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Sorry this has been so long delayed. I'm still tinkering with the format – so look for further adjustments as we go along.
lost_civantares Nov 01, 2006, 06:42 PM How much would whipping affect the score?
DaveMcW Nov 01, 2006, 07:42 PM 3-4 points per pop. So 7 would be two citizens.
General_W Nov 02, 2006, 10:21 AM Version 2 of the turn 77 update
(Can't open the new save at work, so turn 78 update will have to wait till tonight)
- Team Epsilon -
Turn 77
950 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Foreign Update returns with New Format!
* Innovia Whips 2 Population - LOSES 7 points!
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 238 (+11)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 195(+0)
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 169 (+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 165 (-7)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 164 (+4)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/77-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood, Writing, Alphabet
Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population
Hamburger = ? population / est. t45 (2220 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 6 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med. Writ. ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Fish, Mas. ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Confucianism – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team.
International Force Alignment:
http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/5226/77mase0.th.jpg (http://img73.imageshack.us/my.php?image=77mase0.jpg)
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Please offer feedback on the new format.
Memphus Nov 02, 2006, 11:10 AM Format looks great, but is it maintainable? (i.e. how much work?)
General_W Nov 02, 2006, 11:46 AM Glad you like it!
Weirdly enough, this format is LESS work – because I dumped a couple time consuming parts that were of only limited value and this will replace a separate CIA thread.
The only part I'm worried about is the "Big Board of Science" part – I'm having some formatting issues with making that work correctly.
Any constructive criticism on how to make this better and more informative is welcomed.
Memphus Nov 02, 2006, 11:51 AM If you could open the save with the HoF Mod then you could just take screenshot of the "technologies" pages as it would give exactly what you are looking for. :) (but I don't know if this can be done or not?)
General_W Nov 02, 2006, 11:54 AM Yeah - I would LOVE to do that - I have that mod and use it for SP, but can't seem to get it to work in PBEM (If you can figgure out how, please let me know)
But that Mod was my inspiration for the Big Board of Science... I think it could be pretty useful - if we can keep up on the inteligence.
lost_civantares Nov 02, 2006, 02:19 PM You would have to change the mod's .ini to allows multiplayer.
I doubt that the hof mod would let you load the game though, it will only load "its" saves, anything else and it will request you to reload the game to the other mod.
gbno1fan Nov 02, 2006, 03:05 PM What if you just typed the information into excel, and uploaded a screenshot of the excel sheet?
General_W Nov 02, 2006, 03:18 PM The excel table is a good idea!
It would be a little more work though (more steps to input and post) so I'll wait and see if I can manage this [code] format first.
In a broader sense - I hope everyone else likes the new format? I want to make it easy to get the key information about International affairs without each post becoming TOO huge.
If there's a key piece of information I'm not tracking or something useless I am - please speak up and I'll be happy to keep refining this till we get exactly what we want.
(*Note: I will be adding religion percentages with the next update)
DaveMcW Nov 02, 2006, 03:20 PM I'd like to know the power relations, as closely as you can estimate. For example, Piffle seems to be 120% of our strength right now.
General_W Nov 02, 2006, 04:35 PM That's a good suggestion Dave - I'll look at that tonight and see if I can figgure it out.
General_W Nov 02, 2006, 09:34 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 78
925 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Piffle receives gift of Writing from The Glorious Leader (still waiting on Metal Casting)
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 238 (+0)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 195 (+0)
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 176 (+7)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 165 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 164 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/78-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population 7
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population 5, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood, Writing, Alphabet
Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population
Hamburger = ? population / est. t45 (2220 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 6 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/ Alpha ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Fish/ Mas ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi) – 18%
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16%
Confucianism – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team! – 16%
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team.
International Force Alignment:
http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/4789/78milsg5.th.jpg (http://img208.imageshack.us/my.php?image=78milsg5.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 30,000 (Best: 33,000 / Worst: 25,000 / Avg: 30,000)
Compared to Piffle: 10% weaker
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* I added the power section – eager to hear any feedback. I know Dave guessed Piffle at 20% stronger than us, but I’m not sure where that came from. Looking at our “Power” ranking on the F9 graph screen show us about 10% higher – and that matches nicely if we assume Piffle has the strongest soldier ranking at 33,000… 10% higher than our 30,000.
If I missing something, please help me out!
* As always, if there’s something else you’d like to see me track here, please let me know!
General_W Nov 04, 2006, 12:10 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 79
900 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Piffle Builds the Great Lighthouse!
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 241 (+3)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 199 (+4)
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 198 (+22)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 165 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 164 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/79-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood, Alphabet
Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population / est. t45 (2220 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 6 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/ Alpha ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Fish/ Mas ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi) – 19% (+1)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16%
Confucianism – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team! – 17% (+1)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team.
International Force Alignment:
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/989/79milup6.th.jpg (http://img230.imageshack.us/my.php?image=79milup6.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 31,000 (Best: 33,000 / Worst: 25,000 / Avg: 30,000)
Compared to Piffle: 10% weaker
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Biggest news is Piffle’s Completion of the Great Lighthouse.
* Good news, I was correct about the trades taking a turn to formalize – we can now trade Alphabet to Piffle… no sign of Metal Casting yet… at least they can’t trade with their other “friends” until they make us a deal for Alphabet.
I’m a little ticked they didn’t even have the decency to say “thanks for the free tech” – but maybe that message will come later. Oh well, as the world’s premier nation, I suppose we can afford to suffer small indignities.
peter grimes Nov 04, 2006, 04:18 PM It seems that Piffle and The Leader are on cool terms, at best. I read volumes in her scowl.
I wouldn't go asking them for a thank you note for the trade - best to let sleeping dogs be.
That said, a short congratulatory note on their wonder would not be inappropriate.
General_W Nov 04, 2006, 04:48 PM Don’t worry Peter – I wasn’t even dreaming of asking for a thank you – just thinking out loud.
However, you’re very right about the congratulations note. Look for a draft in the Piffle Embassy soon. Thanks for reminding me of that!
I’m also thinking we may NOT want to post an announcement in the UN for them, like we did for King Kong… just incase they think they’re being sneaky somehow… don’t want to give them another reason for animosity against us.
peter grimes Nov 04, 2006, 06:57 PM Good thinking, G_W.
And to be sure, I didn't think you were planning on hounding them; I too was just thinking aloud [on a forum?...] :)
General_W Nov 07, 2006, 10:12 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 80
875 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Our score drops due to Pop-rushing – no other point movement
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 234 (-7)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 199 (+0)
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 198 (+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 165 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 164 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/80-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood, Alphabet
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population / est. t45 (2220 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 6 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
* Waiting on trade of Metal working for Alphabet with Piffle
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/ Alpha ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Fish/ Mas ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi) – 20% (+1)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16%
Confucianism – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team! – 14% (-3)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team.
International Force Alignment:
http://img83.imageshack.us/img83/351/80milou2.th.jpg (http://img83.imageshack.us/my.php?image=80milou2.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 30,000 (Best: 33,000 / Worst: 25,000 / Avg: 30,000)
Compared to Piffle: 10% weaker
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Nothing very exciting this turn. Still waiting for Piffle to come up with Metal Casting to trade us.
General_W Nov 09, 2006, 11:23 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 81
850 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* King Kong breaks into the 200's! Capital grows to size 7.
* King Kong and Saggion the Wise both gain 7 points.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 231 (-3)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 206 (+7)
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 198 (+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 172 (+7)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 164 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/81-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood, Alphabet
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population / est. t45 (2220 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 7 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
* Waiting on trade of Metal working for Alphabet with Piffle
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/ Alpha ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Fish/ Mas ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi) – 21% (+1)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 17% (+1)
Confucianism – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team! – 12% (-2)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team.
International Force Alignment:
http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/840/81milgc3.th.jpg (http://img61.imageshack.us/my.php?image=81milgc3.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 29,000 (Best: 33,000 / Worst: 25,000 / Avg: 30,500)
Compared to Piffle: ~ 10% weaker
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* King Kong had a good turn – but I'm guessing this was mostly due to population growth. It's also fair to assume that Saggion the Wise One (Saladin) learned a new tech.
* Piffle is still taking their sweet time in getting Metal Casting… let's hope everyone's tech research is going as slowly as Piffle's seems to be.
General_W Nov 10, 2006, 12:24 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 82
825 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Piffle Discovers Metal Casting! (Not able to trade it yet)
* All teams gain points – Epsilon has the biggest jump.
* Epsilon’s power rating soars to #1
*EDIT: Judaism is founded! (by Saggion the Wise One?)
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 248 (+17)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 213 (+7)
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 211 (+13)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 182 (+10)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 167 (+3)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/82-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood, Alphabet, Iron Working
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population / est. t45 (2220 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 7 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
* Trade for Metal Casting with Piffle – hopefully next turn!
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/ Alpha/ IW ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Fish/ Mas/MC ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi) – 20% (-1)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% (-1)
Confucianism – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team! – 11% (-1)
Judaism – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by Saggion the Wise One (Saladin) ? – 1% (+1)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team.
International Force Alignment:
http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/6837/82milis6.th.jpg (http://img218.imageshack.us/my.php?image=82milis6.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 40,000 (Rival Best: 37,000 / Rival Avg: 34,250)
Compared to Piffle: ~ 5% Stronger
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Piffle got Metal Casting this turn, but there must be a 1 turn delay before they can trade?
* Our power/soldier score climbed up to 1st place! Hopefully this will serve to discourage any thoughts Piffle has about attacking… though, iirc, the solder score counts population, and therefore isn’t really the best measure of military power.
peter grimes Nov 10, 2006, 02:05 PM The soldier score counts more than just pop. It also takes into effect certain buildings, techs, and wonders. I'll try to find the article I read about it and post a link.
Here 'tis, written by Robi D :)
Inner Workings of the Demographics Screen (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=163098)
General_W Nov 13, 2006, 10:55 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 83
800 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* First big diplomatic Success! Metal Working acquired in trade with Piffle (we gave writing and Alphabet and promised gold/beaker catchup later)
* Judaism was founded last turn! (by Saggion the Wise One?)
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 265 (+17)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 220 (+7)
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 216 (+5)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 182 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 167 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/83-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood, Iron Working
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population / est. t45 (2220 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 7 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
* Trade for Metal Casting with Piffle! Success!
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/IW ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Fish/Mas ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi) – 21% (+1)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% (+0)
Confucianism – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team! – 13% (+2)
Judaism – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by Saggion the Wise One (Saladin) ? – 1% (+0)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team.
International Force Alignment:
http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/8976/83milup8.th.jpg (http://img64.imageshack.us/my.php?image=83milup8.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 44,000 (Rival Best: 41,000 / Rival Avg: 35,500)
Compared to Piffle: ~ 5% Stronger
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* I somehow missed the founding of Judaism last turn! Hard to say for sure who it was, but it had to be either Saggion the Wise One (Saladin) or else King Kong (Gandhi). SWO seems more likely to me – not only did they gain 10 points last turn, but we know for a fact that they have the prerequisite for Monotheism (polytheism – which gave them Hinduism). If anyone sees good reason to disagree with this conclusion, please speak up!
* The more interesting question, is why would SaggionTWO want to get another religion? As I see it, they are either in a big hurry to have organized religion for the +25% building bonus or else they are looking to religion monger to get extra leverage on the 2 civs without a religion… but if that's true, that seems like a pretty bad plan to me.
The most likely scenario that I can come up with is the SWO met another team (maybe King Kong?), and they are trading for the lower level techs while SWO picks up Monotheism to get the 25% building bonus for both teams.
Anyone have a theory they'd like to posit?
* Thanks for the breakdown on the Soldier score Peter. I'd read that once in the past, but it was a good refresher. Bottom line, our soldier/power score doesn’t mean a whole lot – but will become more meaningful as the game goes on. At least our enemies don't have any more to go on than we do!
DaveMcW Nov 13, 2006, 11:07 AM Organized Religion is a very useful civic.
If Saladin does get 4 religions, he would be a serious threat for cultural victory.
General_W Nov 15, 2006, 11:39 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 84
775 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Piffle has a 3rd town - Teracle Cottage! (And has had it for awhile – Foreign Minster launches investigation to find out what the Oracle knew, and when she knew it.)
* Chief Aloha jumps back into action with a +14 point gain this turn!
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 265 (+0)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 224 (+4)
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 218 (+2)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 182 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 181 (+14)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/84-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood, Iron Working
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population / est. t45 (2220 BC)
Teracle Cottage = ? population / est. t ? (? BC)
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 7 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
* Offer of Mediation for Fishing on the table with Piffle
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/IW ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Fish/Mas ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi) – 21% (+0)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% (+0)
Confucianism – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team! – 13% (+0)
Judaism – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by Saggion the Wise One (Saladin) ? – 1% (+0)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team.
International Force Alignment:
http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/3157/84milpn7.th.jpg (http://img228.imageshack.us/my.php?image=84milpn7.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 44,000 (Rival Best: 44,000 / Rival Avg: 35,500)
Compared to Piffle: ~ 5% Stronger
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* I'm kinda slacking on my tracking here… :blush: looks like Piffle has had a 3rd town for a little while now. I'll go back later tonight and check to see when they founded it.
* Another team has reached 44,000 soldiers, but our power graph in relation to Piffle still looks like we're ~5% higher… either there's a delay on the graph, or someone else has climbed to soldier parity with us.
General_W Nov 17, 2006, 04:14 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 85
750 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Piffle acquires the secret of Hunting
* Piffle knocks Loco out of second place in score.
* Loco (King Kong) loses 6 points… Analysis suggests the whip.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 265 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 229 (+11)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 218 (-6)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 186 (+4)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 181 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/85-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood, Iron Working
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population / est. t45 (2220 BC)
Teracle Cottage = ? population / est. t ? (? BC)
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 7 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
* Piffle appears to have traded with someone for hunting. Added to the big board!
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/IW ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Fish/Mas/Hunt ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi) – 21% (+0)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% (+0)
Confucianism – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team! – 13% (+0)
Judaism – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by Saggion the Wise One (Saladin) ? – 1% (+0)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team.
International Force Alignment:
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/3285/85mildk7.th.jpg (http://img207.imageshack.us/my.php?image=85mildk7.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 45,000 (Rival Best: 46,000 / Rival Avg: 38,250)
Compared to Piffle: ~ 2% Stronger
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Piffle picked up hunting this turn. Whether from trade or from research – I'm not sure it's possible to say for sure. Seems most likely they got it in trade, because they just picked up Metal Casting on turn 82. I suppose they could get hunting that fast on their own… but still, seems more likely to be a trade.
* still no response to my last letter to Piffle…but that's pretty much par for the course for those jokers. I'm just leaving them alone for now. Ball is clearly in their court.
General_W Nov 20, 2006, 04:32 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 86
725 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Pretty quiet turn – Saladin (SwO) gains a tech.
* Piffle is attempting to block the peninsula! Barbarians to the rescue?
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 268 (+3)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 229 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 218 (+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 199 (+13)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 185 (+4)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/86-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood, Iron Working
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population / est. t45 (2220 BC)
Teracle Cottage = ? population / est. t82 (825 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 7 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Neutral to team Piffle
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
* Piffle appears to have traded with someone for hunting. Added to the big board!
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/IW ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Fish/Mas/Hunt ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi) – 20% (-1)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 16% (+0)
Confucianism – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team! – 14% (+1)
Judaism – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by Saggion the Wise One (Saladin) ? – 1% (+0)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team.
* Piffle has a settler looking to make their 4th town to block our access to their land
International Force Alignment:
http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/8797/86milyk4.th.jpg (http://img216.imageshack.us/my.php?image=86milyk4.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 46,000 (Rival Best: 46,000 / Rival Avg: 39,250)
Compared to Piffle: Same
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Nothing greatly noteworthy this turn!
General_W Nov 21, 2006, 04:44 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 87
700 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Massive deal with Piffle goes through! Epsilon learns Fishing, Hunting, and Masonry – Iron Working sent to Piffle.
* Epsilon Team crests the 300 point mark
* Piffle suffers a serious setback as they lose their settler guard to a Barbarian
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 301 (+33)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 253 (+24)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 222 (+4)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 199 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 185 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/87-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population / est. t45 (2220 BC)
Teracle Cottage = ? population / est. t82 (825 BC)
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 7 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
* Trade with Piffle – Epsilon gains Fishing, hunting, and Masonry. Piffle gains Iron Working. Big board updated!
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Pri ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:none ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi) – 20% (+0)
Hinduism – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin) – 15% (-1)
Confucianism – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team! – 13% (-1)
Judaism – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by Saggion the Wise One (Saladin) ? – 3% (+2)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team.
* Piffle has a settler looking to make their 4th town to block our access to their land – serious setback as Piffle loses their settler guard to a Barbarian.
International Force Alignment:
http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/9869/87milzy0.th.jpg (http://img92.imageshack.us/my.php?image=87milzy0.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 48,000 (Rival Best: 62,000 / Rival Avg: 43,750)
Compared to Piffle: Same
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Some big stuff this turn. Another great trade goes through with Piffle.
* Someone got a big jump in military power – but our graph still shows us as equal to piffle.
* Waiting to hear back from Piffle on further trade or alliance type deals.
General_W Nov 22, 2006, 12:13 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 88
675 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* We can now see that Piffle has Archery and Sailing!
* Foreign Minister suspects they are trading with King Kong!
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 321 (+20)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 256 (+3)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 238 (+16)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 199 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 185 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/88-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 5 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 7 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Pries ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Sail/Arch ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 19% (-1) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Confucianism – 17% (+4) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Hinduism – 14% (-1) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Judaism – 2% (-1) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by Saggion the Wise One (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team – I suspect it's King King/Loco/Gandhi
* Piffle has a Galley and an Axeman.
International Force Alignment:
http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/2870/88milds5.th.jpg (http://img63.imageshack.us/my.php?image=88milds5.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 49,000 (Rival Best: 62,000 / Rival Avg: 45,250)
Compared to Piffle: ~10%Weaker
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* I have created this guess at the world map. Makes sense to me. (With Aloha and Innovia being interchangeable) - but it's just pure speculation. We'll see!
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/88-WorldGuess.jpg
* turn 89 update will have to wait till I get a chance late tonight. Sorry!
Memphus Nov 22, 2006, 05:38 PM * Piffle comes up with Archery and Sailing! Who are they trading with? We can be almost positive they are trading with King Kong!
Sorry to Clutter yor thread oh Great General But I had to point out that, because they have sailing and archery does not mean they are trading wiht King Kong.
The reason we couldn't see those techs before is becuase we didn't have the pre-requisites (Fishing & Archery)
It is for the same reason that the only tech that they can see that we have and they don't is Meditation:
When in fact it is
Meditation==>Priesthood==>Code of Laws==>Civil Service
Although the point increase with King kong last turn looked like they could have aquired iron working... :confused: but it may not have come from piffle
General_W Nov 22, 2006, 05:43 PM Oh man! Way to burst my bubble!
Ok - I'm going to scale back what I've got in my report.
I'm still sticking with my gut instinct that Piffle is trading with King Kong. It just fits neatly with the scores over the recent turns. Ie - there seems to be a top grouping of Epsilon-Piffle-Loco .. and then a second group of Innovia-Aloha.
It's pure speculation on my part though.
Thanks for pointing out my oversight.
:salute:
Memphus Nov 22, 2006, 05:50 PM [QUOTE=General_W]
Thanks for pointing out my oversight.
[\QUOTE]
No please don't think of it as that, ultimately this game is for all team memebers to have fun and learn, if assumptions arn't made then nothing fun would happen.
For Example until Maniac came around we were 100% sure as a team whipping a library and forcing 2 scienetist in eternal eye was the only and best way to go...well it semms like that pan has changed ;)
peter grimes Nov 22, 2006, 08:07 PM I love it when a 'pan' comes together ;)
I, too, thought that General_W had it right concerning Loco. I had to go back a few turns, and look at the score increases... There really does appear to be a 'Seed Group' and a 'Chaff Group'.
However, Piffle conducting trades with both Loco and Epsilon is not the only way the data may be interpreted.
In any case, it's all for the best that we are staying vigilant on these things :)
General_W Nov 22, 2006, 11:08 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 89
650 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* This turn showed us Piffle had a Boat, has Copper hooked up… as there’s an Axeman on the boat with their settler.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 321 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 262 (+6)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 238 (+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 202 (+3)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 185 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/89-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood, Code of Laws, Civil Service
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 5 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: Not Yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 7 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Pries ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Sail/Arch ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 19% (+0) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Confucianism – 17% (+0) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Hinduism – 14% (+0) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Judaism – 2% (+0) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by Saggion the Wise One (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team – I suspect it's King King/Loco/Gandhi
* Piffle has a Galley and an Axeman.
International Force Alignment:
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/4225/89mileb4.th.jpg (http://img221.imageshack.us/my.php?image=89mileb4.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 49,000 (Rival Best: 61,000 / Rival Avg: 45,250)
Compared to Piffle: ~20%Weaker
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Finally caught up on this turn! Whew! Sorry for the delay.
General_W Nov 29, 2006, 11:40 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 90
625 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Innovia (Saladin) Builds the Kashi Vishwanath temple to Hinduism!
* We spy the borders of Loco (Ghandi) in the south – will meet them next turn!
* We now know who controls each of the top 5 cities
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/8517/90hinduholypo4.th.jpg (http://img62.imageshack.us/my.php?image=90hinduholypo4.jpg)
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 321 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 264 (+2)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 241 (+3)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 224 (+22)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 185 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/90-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Innovia / Saggioun the Wise / Saladin: Kashi Vishwanath
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Fishing, Masonry
Missing Technology: Meditation, Priesthood, Code of Laws, Civil Service
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 5 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: turn 91 (600 BC)
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740) **
Known Towns:
Loco Capital = 7 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Pries ?
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Sail/Arch ? ? X ?
Loco: ? ? ? ? X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 20% (+1) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Confucianism – 17% (+0) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Hinduism – 14% (+0) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Judaism – 2% (+0) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team
* Piffle has a Galley and an Axeman.
International Force Alignment:
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/4572/90milyy7.th.jpg (http://img62.imageshack.us/my.php?image=90milyy7.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 49,000 (Rival Best: 61,000 / Rival Avg: 45,500)
Compared to Piffle: ~20%Weaker
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Lots of big news this turn! Innovia/Saladin picking up the Hindu Wonder is especially interesting to me – they obviously focused on getting out a quick prophet.
* Next turn will be dominated by news of King Kong – I can't wait to get my hands on their diplomacy screen and see what kind of tech they've got and how many towns they've settled.
* It now seems very unlikely that Loco has met Piffle. I still believe Piffle is trading with someone… but who!? I guess Our list narrows down to Aloha or Innovia. In that race, Innovia has to be the favorite, due to Aloha's surprisingly low and stagnating score. What are those crazy Aloha people doing?!?
General_W Nov 30, 2006, 11:04 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 91
600 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* We meet Loco (Ghandi) !!
* We are greatly advanced beyond Loco in technology – but they are killing us in production!
* Piffle has built a town in a terrible spot, and blocked us from their land.
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 335 (+14)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 271 (+7)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 241 (+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 229 (+5)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 195 (+10)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/91-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco / King Kong / Gandhi: Stonehenge
Piffle / Elizabeth: Great Lighthouse (Balderdash)
Innovia / Saggioun the Wise / Saladin: Kashi Vishwanath
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Archery (60), Sailing (100)
Missing Technology: Priesthood (60), Meditation (80), Code of Laws (350), Civil Service (800)
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 5 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
Brilliant!= ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: turn 91 (600 BC)
Technology to Trade: Sailing (100), Monotheism (120)
Missing Technology: Hunting (40), Animal Husbandry (100), Iron Working (200), Monarchy (300), Alphabet (300), Code of Laws (350), Metal Casting (450), Civil Service (800).
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740) **
Known Towns:
Short Line = 7 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
B and O = ? population
Reading = ? population
Pennsylvania = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Pries Hunt/Ani/Iron+
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Sail/Arch ? ? X Hunt/Ani/Iron+
Loco:Sail/Mono ? ? Med/Pri/Mono X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 20% (+0) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Confucianism – 17% (+0) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Hinduism – 14% (+0) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Judaism – 2% (+0) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team
* Piffle has a Galley and an Axeman.
International Force Alignment:
http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/6679/91miluj7.th.jpg (http://img217.imageshack.us/my.php?image=91miluj7.jpg)
Epsilon Power:
Soldiers: 50,000 (Rival Best: 62,000 / Rival Avg: 45,750)
Compared to Piffle: ~20%Weaker
Compared to Loco: 30%Stronger
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Major, Major stuff this turn!
* All info updated regarding Loco – make sure you stop by the embassy to put your input in on our first letter to Loco.
* In the International Relations Report section, I have added the base beaker value to each teach we're missing or that our rivals are missing. Should help with analyzing potential trades. I'll be updating the first page of both embassies with this information also.
* Piffle, I believe, has made a pretty remarkable tactical blunder. By setteling where they did, they now have a city in a crummy location, that won't even allow their ships to pass between the two oceans!! They obviously settled there to prevent us from reaching their homeland – and that much was a success – but at the price of carrying around a nearly useless city for most of the game?!? I'm not sure that's a very good deal.
Other thoughts on this?
Agarwaen Nov 30, 2006, 03:39 PM Hiw much we need a city that close to Piffle? There are several good city locations near us already, I don't think it was a great move...
General_W Nov 30, 2006, 04:00 PM I'm not sure I'm clear on what you're trying to say Agarwaen? :confused: - but it's good to see you speaking up!
I was just pointing out in my update that it seems to me like Piffle picked a really poor spot to settle. It blocks us from exploring their land, which is sad – but Piffle will be stuck with that near useless city the whole game… or until someone razes it… :evil:
I'm certainly not advocating settling down near there. I DO think we're going to want a city on the connecting isthmus to allow our ships to jump between oceans at some point… but not till our core is more secure (ie, settle the better locations near home first).
Is that what you're also saying?
lost_civantares Nov 30, 2006, 05:00 PM They'll could stick another city I guess for a canal, but perhaps they've discovered enough about the map that they feel it isn't needed to have a canal?
Agarwaen Dec 01, 2006, 02:38 PM I'm not sure I'm clear on what you're trying to say Agarwaen? :confused: - but it's good to see you speaking up!
I was just pointing out in my update that it seems to me like Piffle picked a really poor spot to settle. It blocks us from exploring their land, which is sad – but Piffle will be stuck with that near useless city the whole game… or until someone razes it… :evil:
I'm certainly not advocating settling down near there. I DO think we're going to want a city on the connecting isthmus to allow our ships to jump between oceans at some point… but not till our core is more secure (ie, settle the better locations near home first).
Is that what you're also saying?
yeah, I was trying to say something like that. In the early game good spots to cities are too important to do something like Piffle did.
And I support the idea of having a Canal, but later.
General_W Dec 02, 2006, 03:53 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 92
575 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Epsilon loses 7 points to the Whip… Loco picks up 7 points.
* We’re now also up Polytheism on Piffle… but Loco already has it. (Added to trade options below)
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 328 (-7)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 271 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 248 (+7)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 229 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 195 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/92-T5-1.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco: Stonehenge
Piffle: Great Lighthouse
Innovia: Kashi Vishwanath
Aloha: None
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Archery (60), Sailing (100)
Missing Technology: Priesthood (60), Meditation (80), Polytheism (100), Code of Laws (350), Civil Service (800)
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 5 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
Brilliant!= ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: turn 91 (600 BC)
Technology to Trade: Sailing (100), Monotheism (120)
Missing Technology: Hunting (40), Animal Husbandry (100), Iron Working (200), Monarchy (300), Alphabet (300), Code of Laws (350), Metal Casting (450), Civil Service (800).
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740) **
Known Towns:
Short Line = 8 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
B and O = ? population
Reading = ? population
Pennsylvania = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Poly+ Hunt/Ani/Iron+
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Sail/Arch ? ? X Hunt/Ani/Iron+
Loco:Sail/Mono ? ? Med/Pri/Mono X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 20% (+0) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Confucianism – 16% (-1) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Hinduism – 13% (-1) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Judaism – 4% (+2) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team
* Piffle has a Galley and an Axeman.
* Piffle and Loco don’t know eachother.
International Force Alignment:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/92-Mil.jpg
Epsilon Power:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/92-Milpower.jpg
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* I’ve changed the way I do the images here – by shrinking the images before posting, I’m hoping to avoid any need to click on a thumbnail and visit a site outside of CivFanatics. Hopefully you like this new way better! I’m always looking for ways to improve this thread, so please don’t be shy about offering ideas on how I can make this better, more useful, and more accesable.
* Next term this update will be moving to the State of the Empire thread. But for now, please post any general comments here, or talk about specific nations in their embassies!
Thanks!
** Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794) **
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740) **
General_W Dec 05, 2006, 12:32 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 93
550 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Loco continues to gain ground with a +9 point gain this turn (on top of the +7 last turn) – I don’t see any new techs they have though… but maybe it just hasn’t showed up yet?
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 328 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 271 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 257 (+9)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 226 (-3)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 208 (+13)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/93-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco: Stonehenge
Piffle: Great Lighthouse
Innovia: Kashi Vishwanath
Aloha: None
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Archery (60), Sailing (100)
Missing Technology: Priesthood (60), Meditation (80), Polytheism (100), Code of Laws (350), Civil Service (800)
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 5 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
Brilliant!= ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: turn 91 (600 BC)
Technology to Trade: Sailing (100), Monotheism (120)
Missing Technology: Hunting (40), Animal Husbandry (100), Iron Working (200), Monarchy (300), Alphabet (300), Code of Laws (350), Metal Casting (450), Civil Service (800).
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
Known Towns:
Short Line = 8 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
B and O = ? population
Reading = ? population
Pennsylvania = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Poly+ Hunt/Ani/Iron+
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Sail/Arch ? ? X Hunt/Ani/Iron+
Loco:Sail/Mono ? ? Med/Pri/Mono X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 21% (+1) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Confucianism – 16% (+0) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Hinduism – 14% (+1) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Judaism – 4% (+0) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team
* Piffle has a Galley and an Axeman.
* Piffle and Loco don’t know eachother.
International Force Alignment:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/93-MIL.jpg
Epsilon Power:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/93-Milpower.jpg
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* I guess you all must like my updates alright? Since I’m not getting any suggestions – I’ll take that as a compliment! :lol:
* I sent our trade proposal to Loco – nothing to do now but wait to hear back!
* Next term this update will be moving to the State of the Empire thread. But for now, please post any general comments here, or talk about specific nations in their embassies!
Thanks!
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
Kylearan Dec 05, 2006, 03:40 AM Hi,
I guess you all must like my updates alright? Since I’m not getting any suggestions – I’ll take that as a compliment!
Absolutely! I love your updates, they are much appreciated! :goodjob:
Regarding the current in-game situation, what makes me a bit nervous is the fast and steady increase in Piffle's power. :twitch: I hope it's just because they are building some axemen or archers to fight barbs or garrison their cities, but we should pump out some axes of our own real soon (which we've luckily planned to do anyway).
-Kylearan
General_W Dec 05, 2006, 02:41 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 94
525 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Piffle uses the whip! Those murderous thugs! Abusing their people like that! For shame!
* Loco Learns the secret of Animal Husbandry!
* Innovia gains 23 points! (Did I miss the construction of a wonder? I'll have to look when I get home. I must have!)
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 328 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 271 (-3)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 263 (+9)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 249 (+23)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 208 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/93-T5-1.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco: Stonehenge
Piffle: Great Lighthouse
Innovia: Kashi Vishwanath
Aloha: None
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population ?
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population ?, Hindu Holy City
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Archery (60), Sailing (100)
Missing Technology: Priesthood (60), Meditation (80), Polytheism (100), Code of Laws (350), Civil Service (800)
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 5 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
Brilliant!= ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: turn 91 (600 BC)
Technology to Trade: Sailing (100), Monotheism (120)
Missing Technology: Hunting (40), Iron Working (200), Monarchy (300), Alphabet (300), Code of Laws (350), Metal Casting (450), Civil Service (800).
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
Known Towns:
Short Line = 8 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
B and O = ? population
Reading = ? population
Pennsylvania = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
* Piffle and Loco haven't met, and have no known deals.
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Poly+ Hunt/Iron+
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Sail/Arch ? ? X Hunt/Iron+
Loco:Sail/Mono ? ? Med/Pri/Mono X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 21% (+0) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Confucianism – 16% (+0) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Hinduism – 15% (+1) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Judaism – 4% (+0) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team
* Piffle has a Galley and Axemen.
International Force Alignment:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/93-MIL-1.jpg
Epsilon Power:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/93-Milpower-1.jpg
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Thanks for the positive comments Kylearan! At least I know there's ONE other person reading these things!
* And I agree - Piffle rapid rise in military power combined with their recent closed-mouth nature, combined with our belief they have met another team... it all adds up to bad news. We must be ready!
*If anyone saw if Innovia built a wonder, or rather, what wonder they built - please let me know so I can update this even sooner! Thanks.
* Next term this update will be moving to the State of the Empire thread. But for now, please post any general comments here, or talk about specific nations in their embassies!
Thanks!
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
Memphus Dec 05, 2006, 03:45 PM We didn't lose any points for cracking the whip in eternal eye? !?!?
BTW I do read this every turn ;)
General_W Dec 05, 2006, 03:48 PM Oh – we certainly lose points for whip cracking… er… I mean accepting the willing sacrifice of our noble citizens for the greater good… it'll just show up next turn. See turn 92, for example. Shows our point loss from whipping on turn 91.
Did you notice if Innovia built a wonder?
I was in a big hurry this morning and forgot to look!
P.S. I'm glad you're following along! :)
peter grimes Dec 05, 2006, 06:49 PM I opened the save, hunted around in the event log, and even hit enter to end the turn; I didn't see any mention of a new wonder. I also checked the Top 5 cities. No new Wonders.
They may have traded?
lost_civantares Dec 05, 2006, 07:26 PM General_W, Are you sure, I thought I was certain the effect on the score was immediate?
General_W Dec 05, 2006, 10:47 PM It's for sure - there is NO new wonder.
That's quite the point jump they got... I don't think they traded... we'd see the new tech... no strike that... they must have traded, it always seems to take a turn to show up in the diplomacy screen.
I wonder what they got?? Maybe we'll learn more when they finally respond to our letter.
Real thing that's nagging me... WHAT did their trading partner offer them? Must have been something better than our offer. :twitch:
EDIT: oh, and on the whipping - maybe it does register the same turn, but I never do anything with the saves except open them up and take a few screenshots... so I wouldn't see our point change till the next turn.
peter grimes Dec 06, 2006, 08:08 AM Tech trading is a little different here than in Civ3. I remember hearing that when you learn a tech, you can't trade it for a turn. So if we see a point jump due to tech, we won't see the tech available for trade until the following turn.
Or something like that :)
General_W Dec 06, 2006, 10:07 AM I think you mis-read what I wrote :)
(granted, it wasn't the most clear thing I've ever written!)
You're exactly right - I confirmed that it worked this way in our last trade with Piffle.
Next turn we'll find out what Loco traded for.
peter grimes Dec 06, 2006, 01:03 PM I did mis-read - or, more accurately, I simply rephrased what you already wrote :)
General_W Dec 06, 2006, 05:01 PM Loco has had a big run in points lately (92 +7, then 93 +9, then 94 +9 again for a total +25 gain in the last 3 turns) and then Innovia jumps +23 also on turn 94 – without any wonders showing up – this suggest to me Innovia and Loco are trading.
Anyone see any obvious holes in my theory?
Working off this idea, I've crafted a new guess at the map that I'm pretty proud of.
This seems like a good guess at a balanced custom-designed MP map… every civ is connected to exactly 2 other civs, and it'll make for some interesting late game dynamics.
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/94-MapGuess.jpg
…also makes me wonder if Iron (and other key strategic resources?) may be located just offshore in those black areas between continents where there are no land bridges? We should get a boat out and take a peek!
Please offer feedback and further thoughts/point out flaws in my wild speculation!
At the least, it's something to chew on while we want for some kind of confirmation (via letter or getting the save back) on what's going on with Loco.
:salute:
Memphus Dec 06, 2006, 05:06 PM I Like it alot! Looks Great!
What is does point out is that setting up city site E and F (I think anyways) Basically the two coast connecting cities. Is important.
The reason for this is think of the two of the together kind of like the Panama Canal in which we control East and West!
peter grimes Dec 07, 2006, 06:19 AM I like the way Aloha got shafted with the smallest landmass ;)
If there are other 'Treasure Islands' in the black, we could almost certainly access them before Astronomy. I strongly doubt that Sirian would place an early resource like Iron in a location accessible only by techs that come so much later. Let's get some workboats out as soon as is practical :)
peter grimes Dec 07, 2006, 12:00 PM Here are the screenshots from the Trade screen that General_W was asking for. As you can see, there are new techs available to us.
General_W Dec 07, 2006, 12:06 PM You mean NO new techs?
This is so weird!! What has been going on with the scores?!? :confused:
Is there any chance that Christianity was founded this/last turn? I think Theology is the only thing up the Monotheism tech tree that they could have that we wouldn't see.
At least it looks like Loco should still be interested in our proposed deal. I was worried they were going to suddenly show up with IW.
Now… I wonder why they're taking so long to respond…
EDIT: Thanks for doing that Peter!! Much appreciated! :salute:
Memphus Dec 07, 2006, 12:08 PM I am not following? Those techs look the same to me as they did last turn??!?!
gbno1fan Dec 07, 2006, 01:10 PM Could the score increases be due to population increases or any productions being completed?
General_W Dec 07, 2006, 02:09 PM Probably not for that many points... though it could be a part of it.
Only plausible explanation left is massive territory expansion... which I should have thought of sooner. With both Innovia and Loco having holy cities (and 2 holy cities for Innovia) - it must be that their land expansion points are now counting in their score.
peter grimes Dec 07, 2006, 06:26 PM Check in on the Demographics screens. I seem to recall that Loco had mad crazy populations - maybe not a big increase from last turn, but maybe so?
Wait - it was under Victory Conditions. Something like 25% of the population of the entire Planet Sirian are now Hindu (that's what Loco founded, right?)
As for Innovia I dont' know.
General_W Dec 07, 2006, 10:46 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 95
500 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Piffle Capital of Balderdash grows to size 6
* Epsilon Score climbs 13 points with discovery of Literature
* Innovia uses the whip!! Clearly our opponents are bloodthirsty heathens!
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 341 (+13)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 275 (+4)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 267 (+4)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 246 (-3)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 219 (+11)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/95-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco: Stonehenge
Piffle: Great Lighthouse
Innovia: Kashi Vishwanath
Aloha: None
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population 5
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population 6, Hindu Holy City / Kashi Vishwanath
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Archery (60), Sailing (100)
Missing Technology: Priesthood (60), Meditation (80), Polytheism (100), Code of Laws (350), Civil Service (800)
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
Brilliant!= ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: turn 91 (600 BC)
Technology to Trade: Sailing (100), Monotheism (120)
Missing Technology: Hunting (40), Iron Working (200), Monarchy (300), Alphabet (300), Code of Laws (350), Metal Casting (450), Civil Service (800).
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
Known Towns:
Short Line = 8 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
B and O = ? population
Reading = ? population
Pennsylvania = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
* Piffle and Loco haven't met, and have no known deals.
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Poly+ Hunt/Iron+
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Sail/Arch ? ? X Hunt/Iron+
Loco:Sail/Mono ? ? Med/Pri/Mono X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 21% (+0) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Confucianism – 16% (+0) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Hinduism – 14% (-1) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Judaism – 4% (+0) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team
* Piffle has a Galley and Axemen.
International Force Alignment:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/95-MIL.jpg
Epsilon Power:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/95-Milpower.jpg
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* @Peter – Loco founded Buddhism, and it has held pretty steady at around 20% of the world population for most of the game. (As you can see in every update I post… e-hem!) ;) - Innovia was the one with the truly dramatic single turn point jump… but they are the founders of 2 religions (Judaism and Hinduism – which combined make up just shy of 20% of world population )
* Upon further review, it appears the Loco and Innovia have NOT been trading - I think Innovia must have just timed their culture expansions such that they got a bunch of land points all together + maybe some pop growth or a new tech. Similar thing must have happened for Loco – where they had several turns in a row of getting the culture expansion points start to count. We can rule out any trading, because nothing new has showed up on Loco’s trading screen – and the only tech they could have gotten that we wouldn’t see would be Theology… and we would know about that because Christianity would have been founded.
Bottom Line = no panic… it’s just territory points.
* still waiting to hear back from Loco about our trade proposal. I say we give them another full turn cycle before we start to pester them.
* Next term this update will be moving to the State of the Empire thread. But for now, please post any general comments here, or talk about specific nations in their embassies!
Thanks!
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
General_W Dec 10, 2006, 12:11 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 96
475 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Loco Diplomacy Corp in shatters – Epsilon offers trade anyway!
* Work quietly begins on the Great Library in Epsilon Eridani.
* All is quiet… no point movement at all this turn!
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/96-LocoTradeOffer1.jpg
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 341 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 275 (+0)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 267 (+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 246 (+0)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 219 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/96-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco: Stonehenge
Piffle: Great Lighthouse
Innovia: Kashi Vishwanath
Aloha: None
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population 5
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population 6, Hindu Holy City / Kashi Vishwanath
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Archery (60), Sailing (100)
Missing Technology: Priesthood (60), Meditation (80), Polytheism (100), Code of Laws (350), Civil Service (800)
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
Brilliant!= ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: turn 91 (600 BC)
Technology to Trade: Sailing (100), Monotheism (120)
Missing Technology: Hunting (40), Iron Working (200), Monarchy (300), Alphabet (300), Code of Laws (350), Metal Casting (450), Civil Service (800).
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
Known Towns:
Short Line = 8 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
B and O = ? population
Reading = ? population
Pennsylvania = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
* Piffle and Loco haven't met, and have no known deals.
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Poly+ Hunt/Iron+
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Sail/Arch ? ? X Hunt/Iron+
Loco:Sail/Mono ? ? Med/Pri/Mono X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 21% (+0) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Confucianism – 16% (+0) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Hinduism – 14% (+0) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Judaism – 4% (+0) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team
* Piffle has a Galley and Axemen.
International Force Alignment:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/96-MIL.jpg
Epsilon Power:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/96-Milpower.jpg
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Since our last note from Loco made it apparent that their team hasn’t been very active, they’ve really dropped the ball on responding to us. This is mildly frustrating… but also presents an opportunity. If Loco is half-asleep at the wheel, perhaps we can slip some more deals past them without a whole lot of review/oversight… this could be a prime trading partner for us! :evil:
* Next term this update will be moving to the State of the Empire thread. But for now, please post any general comments here, or talk about specific nations in their embassies!
Thanks!
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
General_W Dec 11, 2006, 11:41 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 97
450 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Loco misses another letter response deadline – rejects our generous offer… what ARE they smoking over in Loco land?
* Chief Aloha picks up 10 points… maybe they're trying to get back in the game?
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 341 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 278 (+3)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 272 (+5)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 249 (+3)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 229 (+10)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/97-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco: Stonehenge
Piffle: Great Lighthouse
Innovia: Kashi Vishwanath
Aloha: None
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population 5
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population 6, Hindu Holy City / Kashi Vishwanath
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Archery (60), Sailing (100)
Missing Technology: Priesthood (60), Meditation (80), Polytheism (100), Code of Laws (350), Civil Service (800)
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
Brilliant!= ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: turn 91 (600 BC)
Technology to Trade: Sailing (100), Monotheism (120)
Missing Technology: Hunting (40), Iron Working (200), Monarchy (300), Alphabet (300), Code of Laws (350), Metal Casting (450), Civil Service (800).
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
Known Towns:
Short Line = 8 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
B and O = ? population
Reading = ? population
Pennsylvania = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
* Piffle and Loco haven't met, and have no known deals.
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Poly+ Hunt/Iron+
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Sail/Arch ? ? X Hunt/Iron+
Loco:Sail/Mono ? ? Med/Pri/Mono X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 20% (-1) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Confucianism – 15% (-1) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Hinduism – 15% (+1) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Judaism – 3% (-1) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team
* Piffle has a Galley and Axemen.
International Force Alignment:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/97-MIL.jpg
Epsilon Power:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/97-Milpower.jpg
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Loco continues to stretch our patience by proving incapable of sending even a simple letter when they said they would.
* Given our need for sailing – Foreign Minister is considering pushing for researching sailing on our own if Loco can't get their act together. :gripe:
* Next term this update will be moving to the State of the Empire thread. But for now, please post any general comments here, or talk about specific nations in their embassies!
Thanks!
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
General_W Dec 12, 2006, 10:53 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 98
425 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Piffle Cracks the Whip again… the evil overlords!
* Loco responds – is coy about researching Iron Working – asks for a new proposal… we respond by offering Math.
* All our opponents are within 24 points of each other! – We're 66 points ahead of 2nd place! Go Epsilon!
* Aloha Builds the Colossus!
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/98-Colossus.jpg
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 341 (+0)
2) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 275 (-3)
3) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 272 (+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 253 (+4)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 251 (+22)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/98-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco: Stonehenge
Piffle: Great Lighthouse
Innovia: Kashi Vishwanath
Aloha: The Colossus
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population 5, The Colossus
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population 6, Hindu Holy City / Kashi Vishwanath
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Archery (60), Sailing (100)
Missing Technology: Priesthood (60), Meditation (80), Polytheism (100), Literature (200), Code of Laws (350), Civil Service (800)
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
Brilliant!= ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: turn 91 (600 BC)
Technology to Trade: Sailing (100), Monotheism (120)
Missing Technology: Hunting (40), Iron Working (200), Literature (200), Monarchy (300), Alphabet (300), Code of Laws (350), Metal Casting (450), Civil Service (800).
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
Known Towns:
Short Line = 8 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
B and O = ? population
Reading = ? population
Pennsylvania = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
* Piffle and Loco haven't met, and have no known deals.
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Poly+ Hunt/Iron+
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Sail/Arch ? ? X Hunt/Iron+
Loco:Sail/Mono ? ? Med/Pri/Mono X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 20% (+0) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Confucianism – 15% (+0) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Hinduism – 15% (+0) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Judaism – 3% (+0) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team
* Piffle has a Galley and Axemen.
* Loco is working on learning Iron Working
International Force Alignment:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/98-MIL.jpg
Epsilon Power:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/98-Milpower.jpg
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Loco finally responds to our deal – they're working on IW, and so want a new proposal, which I have sent. We're offering Math (when we finish it) for Sailing and Monotheism.
* Next term this update will be moving to the State of the Empire thread. But for now, please post any general comments here, or talk about specific nations in their embassies!
Thanks!
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
EDIT:
Oh - and I sent this note to Aloha...
Dear Aloha,
We have heard amazing news, from travelers from beyond the great black, of a Colossal Golden Statue that now stands in the harbor of one of the greatest cities in the world… Let us be among the first to congratulate you on your wondrous achievement!
The Leader sends you his hearty congratulations.
All the Best,
Foreign Minister General_W
Servant of the Leader
Epsilon Team!
General_W Dec 14, 2006, 10:40 AM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 99
400 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Trade Success with Loco!! Sailing Arrives!
* Loco discovers Iron Working – passes Piffle in Score! (first major ranking change in a very long time!)
* Epsilon Team! is now a full 100 points ahead of Aloha!
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 352 (+11)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 288 (+16)
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 275 (+0)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 272 (+19)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 251 (+0)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/99-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco: Stonehenge
Piffle: Great Lighthouse
Innovia: Kashi Vishwanath
Aloha: The Colossus
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population 5, The Colossus
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population 6, Hindu Holy City / Kashi Vishwanath
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Archery (60)
Missing Technology: Priesthood (60), Meditation (80), Polytheism (100), Literature (200), Code of Laws (350), Civil Service (800)
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
Brilliant!= ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: turn 91 (600 BC)
Technology to Trade: Monotheism (120)
Missing Technology: Hunting (40), Literature (200), Monarchy (300), Alphabet (300), Code of Laws (350), Metal Casting (450), Civil Service (800).
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
Known Towns:
Short Line = 8 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
B and O = ? population
Reading = ? population
Pennsylvania = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with team Piffle – till 1AD
* Piffle and Loco haven't met, and have no known deals.
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Poly+ Hunt/Lit+
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Arch ? ? X Hunt/Alpha+
Loco:/Mono ? ? Med/Pri/Mono X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 20% (-1) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Hinduism – 16% (+1) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Confucianism – 14% (-1) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Judaism – 3% (+0) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team
* Piffle has a Galley and Axemen.
International Force Alignment:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/99-MIL.jpg
Epsilon Power:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/99-MilPower.jpg
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Loco moves up to our Most-Favored Nation in trading! And with their discovery of Iron Working, our new found friends are now the 2nd most powerful (points wise) nation in the world of Sirian.
* Confucianism has fallen to the 3rd most common religion in the world, but this is primarily due to our recent regimen of… citizen volunteers… in rushing projects.
* I finally beat Memphus to an update!! :woohoo:
* Next term this update will be moving to the State of the Empire thread. But for now, please post any general comments here, or talk about specific nations in their embassies!
Thanks!
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
General_W Dec 16, 2006, 02:31 PM - Team Epsilon -
Turn 100
375 BC
Peace is War
Freedom is Slavery
Epsilon is Strength
Foreign Headline News:
* Trade Success with Loco Again!! Monotheism Arrives! Math is sent in return.
* King Kong becomes the second team to pass the 300 point mark. Innovia has just about caught Piffle!
* Epsilon’s Power score is catching back up to Piffle!
* Term 5 Ends… Foreign Minister declares the last term “Highly Productive and Successful” – and looks forward to using his recent electoral landslide ;) to carry forward his agenda of prosperity and security. :thumbsup:
Score Tracker
1) Epsilon – Leader (Huang) = 372 (+10)
2) Loco - King Kong (Gandhi) = 306 (+18)
3) Piffle - Pifflenatress (Elizabeth) = 282 (+7)
4) Innovia - Saggioun the Wise (Saladin) = 281 (+9)
5) Aloha – Chief Aloha (Catherine) = 257 (+6)
Top 5 Cities / Wonders
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/100-T5.jpg
World Wonders:
Epsilon Team!: Oracle
Loco: Stonehenge
Piffle: Great Lighthouse
Innovia: Kashi Vishwanath
Aloha: The Colossus
Epsilon International Relations Report:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Catherine.jpgTeam Aloha
Team Aloha
Leader: Chief Aloha
Civ: Catherine, Russia
Traits: Creative, Financial
UU: Cossack
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Aloha Capital = Population 5, The Colossus
Aloha City #2 = Population ?
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Saladin.jpgTeam Innovia
Team Innovia
Leader: Saggioun the Wise
Civ: Saladin, Arabia
Traits: Philosophical, Spiritual
UU: Camel Archer
Contact: Not yet
Technology to Trade: ?
Missing Technology: ?
Known Towns:
Innovia Capital = Population 6, Hindu Holy City / Kashi Vishwanath
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Elizabeth.jpgTeam Piffle
Team Piffle
Leader: Pifflenatress
Civ: Elizabeth, England
Traits: Philosophical, Financial
UU: Redcoat
Contact: t45 (2220 BC)
Technology to Trade: Archery (60)
Missing Technology: Priesthood (60), Meditation (80), Polytheism (100), Literature (200), Mathematics (250), Code of Laws (350), Civil Service (800)
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
Known Towns:
Balderdash - Capital = 6 population / Great Lighthouse
Hamburger = ? population
Teracle Cottage = ? population
Brilliant!= ? population
----------------------------------------------------
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/Gandhi.jpgTeam Loco
Team Loco
Leader: King Kong
Civ: Gandhi, India
Traits: Spiritual, Industrious
UU: Fast Worker
Contact: turn 91 (600 BC)
Technology to Trade: None
Missing Technology: Hunting (40), Literature (200), Monarchy (300), Alphabet (300), Code of Laws (350), Metal Casting (450), Civil Service (800).
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
Known Towns:
Short Line = 8 population / Buddhism Holy City / Stonehenge
B and O = ? population
Reading = ? population
Pennsylvania = ? population
----------------------------------------------------
:traderoute: Foreign Trade Analysis:
* Nothing yet
:strength: Foreign Treaty/Diplomacy Status:
* Peace with Piffle – till 1AD
Peace with Loco – indefinite
* Piffle and Loco haven't met, and have no known deals.
:science: The Big Board: Foreign Science Status:
. Epsilon Aloha Innovia Piffle Loco
Epsilon:X ? ? Med/Poly+ Hunt/Lit+
Aloha: ? X ? ? ?
Innovia:? ? X ? ?
Piffle:Arch ? ? X Hunt/Alpha+
Loco:none ? ? Med/Pri/Mono X
:religion:World Religion Status:
Buddhism – 20% (+0) – Founded turn 10 (3600BC) by King Kong (Ghandi)
Hinduism – 16% (+0) – Founded turn 12 (3520BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Confucianism – 14% (+0) – Founded turn 66 (1360BC) by Epsilon team!
Judaism – 4% (+1) – Founded turn 82 (825 BC) by StWO (Saladin)
Info Learned from Other Sources:
* Piffle has met another team
* Piffle has a Galley and Axemen.
International Force Alignment:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/100-MIL.jpg
Epsilon Power:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/100-MilPower.jpg
From the desk of the CFM (Chief Foreign Minister):
* Loco continues to move up the leader board… they’ve now passed Piffle and are the second team (after us) to cross the 300 point line. That’s got to make us popular in their book! … it’ll be interesting to see how Piffle reacts to this. If they’re paying attention even a little bit, they’ll probably figure out that we’re trading with Loco.
* It’s been a fun term! Look for these updates to continue in the State of the Empire thread – but you can continue to discuss any broad topics or any comments about my update (format, errors, questions, etc) here in this thread.
As always, please continue to talk about specific nations in their embassies!
Thanks!
**Piffle Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=179794)**
**Loco Official Embassy: (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4818740#post4818740)**
peter grimes Dec 18, 2006, 05:12 PM General_W had asked for theories about Piffle's stand-still score.
They are Philosophical. Maybe they are trying to push out a couple of great people? If they've set up two town, and run +6 gpp/turn those towns might indeed stagnate over the 17 turns it takes to get the first one popped.
Of course, this is purely speculative. They might also run +9gpp/turn for 11 turns, or even pump a few points extra for a turn or two and run down the granary.
Is there any part of the tech tree they could be working that we can't see?... due to us not have a prereq?
Memphus Jan 03, 2007, 05:50 PM We can now see how Much cash everyone has as well as thier techs :)
I have no screen shot But Pfiffle is over 100, are they saving up for a lump sum payment for something? ;)
Memphus Jan 03, 2007, 07:27 PM So It looks as if Pfiffle is running at +36 gpt a turn :lol: :eek: I wonder what thier science % is??
In any event They may be saving up for Civil Service,
I am also thinking that is what Innovia will do.....
Is this trade also on the table as all other techs are??
Personally I am thinking this should come at a premium price no?
peter grimes Jan 04, 2007, 07:19 AM Piffle said that they were almost done with Code of Laws. I would bet that +36 gpt reflects them lowering the slider during the last couple of turns to save a little cash. I strongly doubt they are running +36 consistently.
gbno1fan Jan 04, 2007, 10:13 AM Do we have power curve information on Innovia yet?
General_W Jan 04, 2007, 10:18 AM yes - sorry for the delay - I think I'll have the turn update done and posted here in the next 1/2 hour... maybe sooner.
gbno1fan Jan 04, 2007, 10:20 AM Thanks. Just like you, I'm excited and impatient for the news. ;)
General_W Jan 04, 2007, 11:35 AM In my hurry, I somehow forgot to write down that Loco built the Mahabodhi this turn. This confirms that Zoroaster (born turn 104) was indeed birthed in Loco land as I speculated.
Just wanted to make sure everyone who already looked at my turn update pre-edit noticed this!
:salute:
DaveMcW Jan 08, 2007, 02:02 PM Innovia discovered Civil Service and adopted Bureaucracy! That's pretty impressive from what I would have guessed about their economy. @ DaveMcW – should this adjust the discounts we've been proposing to pass out… esp in any deals to Innovia?
The tech-tech discount is based on our relative economies, so it's something to keep an eye on. But I think our economy is still so strong that we can afford (and they will demand) a discount.
We can offer even deeper discounts when trading gold-for-tech if they promise not to sell the same tech to other civs we know.
General_W Jan 08, 2007, 02:46 PM Ok - great. Thanks for responding Dave.
That makes sense to me - but you're the numbers king! :king:
I'll continue the current policy full-steam-ahead until you start shouting at me! ;)
General_W Jan 08, 2007, 02:58 PM Double post!
On a related topic… we haven't given a great amount of attention thus far to what the other teams may do with our technology once we trade it to them.
I've certainly tried to steer us towards charging higher prices on monopoly techs (ala our 60-70% offer on currency) and also offer very low prices on techs we know are likely to be traded by another nation (ala our recent 40% CoL deal with Loco)…
But here's the question – should we have a more firm policy on what our offers look like? Should we be trying to attach 'riders' to our tech deals to try to prevent others from trading our knowledge right away?
If we try to clamp down on the secondary market for our technologies, we risk coming across as bullies, or just flat out driving away our customers.
If we just continue trading business as usual, then we're risking 2 other nations with a close relationship (read: Innovia and Loco) getting smart and each buying 1 tech from us, then trading it to the other person… effectively halving our already low prices.
Now – we could just hold our noses and let this happen… figuring at least we're in the trading game and not being shut-out. But we would still risk slowing watching our tech lead evaporate… as is already taking place.
Given our options, I know which direction I'm inclined… but I'm really not trying to run the Foreign Ministry like my own little kingdom, so I'd like to make plea for input and feedback… and I'll withhold my opinion till some people have a chance to respond.
If nothing else – if you like what I've been doing and the direction the Epsilon Diplomacy Corps is headed, I'd appreciate your mid-term support! We may need to make some quick diplomacy decisions in the coming 10 turns, and I want to make sure I can act in accordance with the team will even if I can't wait for team feedback.
Thanks!
:salute:
Memphus Jan 08, 2007, 03:31 PM I think it will become evident if other teams "turn around" our techs to each other. We have to be the most involved team for watching all of the little details.
If we notice a team make a profit off of our deal with them the we coudl always increase the price next time.
Or alternatively we could lay out different options:
Ex: Offer a 40% Buy in Cash price and the Gaurantee of no trade for 20 turns.
Offer a 60% Buy in Cash price and Guarantee of no trade for 10 Turns
Offer a 80% buy in cash price and no second party trade restrictions.
This way the ball is always in the other teams court.
DaveMcW Jan 08, 2007, 04:53 PM My 40% number is built on the assumption that they turn around and trade it to everyone they can. Even if they do that, the numbers work out so we make a profit.
If a team guarantees that they will sell it to no one, we can make a profit on as low as 20% gold.
General_W Jan 08, 2007, 04:59 PM @Memphus - That's certainly an interesting idea… but I don't see how it really saves us any from my worry about looking like a bully and/or driving away business.
I mean, it's all well and good to say that they have a choice… but when we're holding a potential 40% cost-increase-gun to their head… they're likely to see it differently! :mischief:
@Dave – really?!? :wow: - that's great news. I need to go see if I can find that math of yours again and see if I can see that.
To me, this means that anytime we're (potentially) competing with another team over a tech deal, we can go even lower than 40% if necessary. ie, anytime we're offering a trade and the potential trade partner knows someone else with that tech, our price can drop even further.
For example, if Innovia buys Currency, we can then move to sell it really cheap to Loco.
Still – the other teams apparently have not done the math on what a "fair" deal is in paying gold for tech… and so I plan to try to continue to negotiate for higher prices whenever it seems possible.
peter grimes Jan 09, 2007, 12:47 PM I'd be nervous about attaching trade restrictions, as these seem difficult to enforce.
Let's just let it ride for a while, and see if it really is a problem. If it becomes necessary, I like Memphus' approach.
gbno1fan Jan 09, 2007, 01:18 PM My theory is that if we have published our prices with all the other civs - meaning they all know they can buy whatever we have for 40% of the cost to research - then the civs we sell to will have to undercut us even further in order to sell it.
Example:
We sell Code of Laws to Innovia for 40%. Innovia then tries to sell it to Piffle for 50% and Piffle says "we can get that from Epsilon for 40%." So Innovia is forced to lower the price below 40%. At levels so low, they may not find it profitable to sell the tech. They'd practically be giving it away along with their tech advantage.
peter grimes Jan 09, 2007, 03:55 PM So Innovia is forced to lower the price below 40%. At levels so low, they may not find it profitable to sell the tech. They'd practically be giving it away along with their tech advantage.
Now replace the term "Innovia" with "Epsilon" ;)
General_W Jan 09, 2007, 04:02 PM Some good stuff here – thanks for taking the time to speak up.
Gbno1fan makes a good point that I had been discounting… which is that teams that buy from us will have some costs that they need to recoup. That doesn’t mitigate the threat of a coordinated effort to catch us, but then again – we're vulnerable to that anyway… at least on our current path we make some :gold: while our enemies plot against the dear Leader.
All-in-all, I feel like I'm getting a pretty good grip on what the team wants – keep selling techs, try to get good prices, and use creative payment plans if necessary to try to stall out the secondary market.
So far, I'm proud of what we've accomplished diplomatically, and I'm optimistic that we'll continue to excel.
Thanks to all!
:salute:
Memphus Jan 09, 2007, 04:44 PM Some good stuff here – thanks for taking the time to speak up.
Gbno1fan makes a good point that I had been discounting… which is that teams that buy from us will have some costs that they need to recoup. That doesn’t mitigate the threat of a coordinated effort to catch us, but then again – we're vulnerable to that anyway… at least on our current path we make some :gold: while our enemies plot against the dear Leader.
All-in-all, I feel like I'm getting a pretty good grip on what the team wants – keep selling techs, try to get good prices, and use creative payment plans if necessary to try to stall out the secondary market.
So far, I'm proud of what we've accomplished diplomatically, and I'm optimistic that we'll continue to excel.
Thanks to all!
:salute:
Building the Great Library and Our Religion Spreading Building isn't going to help our forign affairs... :lol:
Do we expect to see a draft soon?
General_W Jan 09, 2007, 04:47 PM :D - that could be problematic... but given that we've gotten almost NO blowback from any teams except Piffle on having Civil Service so quick, I doubt either of these things will really upset anyone. Guess we'll see!
I'll draft a Great Library announcement tonight... and start work on one for our Holy City....
:salute:
General_W Jan 09, 2007, 05:27 PM Ok - I had a brain storm for our GL announcement, and wanted to post it right away to see if anyone had other good ideas to add to the list … please post your ideas asap, so I can get this announcement out in the UN…
Dear Scholars and Wisepeople of the World…
Epsilon Team would like to formally announce the grand opening of, "The Great Library!"
All World leaders and distinguished thinkers of every land are cordially invited to the opening ceremonies.
Our Chief Librarian, in recognition of the fact that trying to find a book in these vast halls can be rather intimidating, has compiled a Must Read list of books as place for you to get started.
Enjoy!
For the Military Strategist:
"I Win!" by U. Lose
"Danger!" by Luke Out
"Tug of War" by Paul Hard
"Get Out There!" by Sally Forth
"Military Defeats" by Major Disaster and General Mayhem
For the International Diplomat:
" Cry Wolf" by Al Armist
"I'm Fine" by Howard Yu
"I Say So!" by Frank O. Pinion
"Leo Tolstoy" by Warren Peace
For the Domestic Minister:
"Good Works" by Ben Evolent
"More for Your Money" by Max Amize
"Off To Market" by Tobias A. Pigg
For the Wanna-be World Dictator:
"Military Rule" by Marshall Law
"Tyrant of the Potatoes" by Dick Tater
"The Past to the Future" by I. C. All
Any other great ideas to add?
gbno1fan Jan 09, 2007, 05:45 PM That's great. My fiance' and I both had the laugh of the week reading it.
I can't think of any that you haven't already.
By the way, where do you get this stuff?
General_W Jan 09, 2007, 05:55 PM Thanks GB! :) glad you enjoyed it!
The idea just came to me... (don't know what that says about me as a person... :mischief: ) but then I did a google search for ideas on the book names beyond the couple I knew.
peter grimes Jan 10, 2007, 05:57 AM That's FUNNY!
Post it, please! :lol:
peter grimes Jan 10, 2007, 06:03 AM In response to the Mid-Term graphs that the Department of Counting Stuff posted in the State of The Empire:
Why don't Innovia's numbers show up?
Memphus Jan 10, 2007, 07:05 AM I like it alot, but I would like to see a picture in there somewhere :D
General_W Jan 10, 2007, 08:30 AM :D Thanks!
Now Posted... with an image!!
@ Petter... Innovia is the Green Line. (Saggion the Wise One is Innovia)
peter grimes Jan 10, 2007, 03:06 PM :hammer2:
D'oh!
Thanks for making too many jokes at my expense, General Obvious :)
peter grimes Jan 11, 2007, 08:48 AM Hey General - I think you handled Tubby very well in the UN! Just like an expert Diplomat :)
Keep up the good work :salute:
DaveMcW Jan 12, 2007, 11:33 AM Here are the break even tech-for-gold ratios.
Monopoly tech: 39.31%
1 other civ knows it: 37.20%
2 other civs know it: 35.31%
3 other civs know it: 13.44%
Why 13% for the last team?
a. Their beaker cost is 67% due to bonuses from so many civs knowing the tech.
b. If we divide the benefit up into 5 parts, it's fair if everyone gets 1 part.
c. It's still fair for us if we get get 1 part, one team gets 4 parts, and three teams get 0 parts
d. So we offer them 4 parts of the tech for free, while we keep 1 part as payment in gold.
Memphus Jan 13, 2007, 12:03 PM @ Dave Great Math! Very good to Follow
@General_W Are you going to treat us with a sneak peak of our Relgious Building announcement? (Will be built next turn)
General_W Jan 13, 2007, 04:26 PM Ok – decided I wanted to do something kinda special for our religion… so here’s a little memorial to Confucius… (What the Kong Miao is, after all!)
I think I’ll leave the posting in the UN a bit vague – so people have to watch it to get it.
What do you think?
-----------------------------------------
EEN
Headline News:
Special Edition
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/ICON_Epsilon_allseeing_Eye-1.jpg
Ladies and Gentlemen of the World,
By the blessing of the The Leader, we now present, a very special edition of the world’s favorite International TV News broadcast.
A Retrospective…
Click HERE to watch! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psozNvzm9Xg)
(link to youtube)
Memphus Jan 13, 2007, 05:01 PM Fantastic!
I really enjoyed that!
General_W Jan 13, 2007, 06:14 PM thanks Memphus :)
I'll post it in the UN as soon as we've played our next turn. :thumbsup:
DaveMcW Jan 13, 2007, 07:51 PM You would have a lot more quotes if you weren't trying for a G-rated movie. ;)
http://www.google.com/search?q=confucius+say
Memphus Jan 13, 2007, 08:14 PM You would have a lot more quotes if you weren't trying for a G-rated movie. ;)
http://www.google.com/search?q=confucius+say
:lol: Haha!! Those are all fantastic as well :lol:
General_W Jan 13, 2007, 11:50 PM :blush: oh my! :lol:
I see we've got the turn... so I'll go ahead and post our Kong Miao announcement in the UN. Not sure how soon I'll get around to posting my turn update... suffice to say, Loco took Literature (so I'll go ahead and send a note) and Innovia now has Calendar... which combined with what we know from Piffle, means Aloha must have it, and traded it to Innovia!
Nothing else especially exciting.
:salute:
Memphus Jan 15, 2007, 11:52 AM That brings up an interesting diplomatic fact...with Caravels...
In Sinlge Player they can violate borders and explore the coast.
How do you think it will have to be addressed in Multiplayer?
General_W Jan 15, 2007, 11:57 AM That is an interesting question!
In my PBEM games with my friends, if someone is strong enough militarily – they can often snoop on the other humans with their caravels… but it doesn't make them very popular on the trading scene.
Personally – I'd advocating asking permission before crossing anyone's borders.
If the answer is no – then I'd just be sneaky about it… making sure I end my turn with the boat outside their waters every time. :evil: (made easier if you get the +1 move circumnavigation bonus)
Other thoughts on this topic?
Also – how will we respond to others sailing in our waters with caravels? We willing to allow it? Worth a war to stop it?
DaveMcW Jan 15, 2007, 12:06 PM If I don't have active trades with someone, I consider them an enemy and will declare war to kill a caravel.
Maniac Jan 15, 2007, 05:24 PM If the answer is no – then I'd just be sneaky about it… making sure I end my turn with the boat outside their waters every time. :evil: (made easier if you get the +1 move circumnavigation bonus)
Make sure the boat's direction doesn't show it's coming from someone's territory.
Memphus Jan 16, 2007, 06:08 PM @General_W
In a post which I can't seem to find you mentioned how if a deal went sour with someone we could blast them on the UN. hopefully hurting thier diplomatic reputation.
However can we do that if all teams have not met yet? :sad:
General_W Jan 16, 2007, 07:54 PM I don't see how we would be breaking any rules doing that.
Although, if it comes down to it - I'll certainly check with the admins.
In my view, it's not any different than our Wonder Announcements.
We just toss out a "Let it be known, the XXX are liars and cheats - and here's why: ..." and that's that. It's not a pre-meeting negotiation or anything... just an announcement.
Hopefully we'll never have to put it to the test :D
peter grimes Jan 18, 2007, 09:08 AM For further analysis, I have grouped together the relevant snippets that KillerCane dropped in his chat with General_W concerning Aloha, Innovia, and Loco:
the thing is, aloha and innovia are actively trying to recruit us against you
and making us choose who to partner with
but we do have some good information on the other two [read: Innovia and Aloha]
no one seems to know anything about Loco, they are an X factor. Aloha mentioned that Loco is "difficult to deal with
So what can we draw from this? I'd sure like to know that "good information". Maybe we could offer them a little gold?
So are Piffle and Innovia talking to eachother? It seems so. But it's strange that Innovia would claim to not know much about Loco, as we suspect them to be closer than we are to either of them. I suspect someone isn't being completely honest.
Then the big question: Do we ask Loco to parnter more closely with us? Or will that let the cat out of the bag a bit too soon?
General_W Jan 18, 2007, 09:43 AM So what can we draw from this? I'd sure like to know that "good information". Maybe we could offer them a little gold?
I see what I can get out of a chat with KillerCane at the next opportunity. Hopefully I can get the info for free! :cool:
So are Piffle and Innovia talking to eachother? It seems so. But it's strange that Innovia would claim to not know much about Loco, as we suspect them to be closer than we are to either of them. I suspect someone isn't being completely honest.
Agreed. My bet is Innovia is the one "spinning the truth" here. It would be in Piffle's interest to subtly threaten us with a 4 vs. 1 world if they knew such a thing was shaping up.
However, for Innovia - it's in their trading interest to hide how many different partners they have (witness the fact they apparently didn't tell Piffle that they were trading personally with the big bad Epsilon! :lol: ) so that Piffle doesn't start to worry about the extent to which Innovia would profit from any trade.
At least, that's my read on it.
Then the big question: Do we ask Loco to parnter more closely with us? Or will that let the cat out of the bag a bit too soon?
I think we DO want to pursue Loco... but not just yet. While we're the only team in the 500's, it makes it a little difficult to build up just how big of a threat Innovia is. :mischief:
We need to go out of our way to be nice to Loco... but we don't want to get hasty, imho.
Besides... we've got a great test of trustworthiness coming up when we see if they will deliver on their promise to send us Theology.
peter grimes Jan 18, 2007, 10:38 AM I think we DO want to pursure Loco
:hmm: Did he mean pressure or pursue? There's quite a difference between the two ;)
General_W Jan 18, 2007, 10:48 AM :lol: - wow… that's quite the grammatical feat I performed there!
I meant pursue :)... the friendly one!
Memphus Jan 21, 2007, 10:18 AM Would it be too much to ask to have the current civics that each of the other teams are running.
For Example I was bored so went back into the save and noticed that Pfiffle is Running a Caste System (Not slavery :lol: )
So Far Here is What I found out as of the Last turn:
Loco: Monarchy, barbarism, Slavery, decentralization, Organized Religion
Innovia: Monarchy, Bureacracy, Slavery, decentralization, Organized Religion
Pfiffle: despotism, barbarism, Caste System, decentralization, paganism
Just an interesting tidbit...no wonder Innovia's economy is in the tank...and they are trying to form an alliance agaisn't us. Boy I wish they were closer what and easy target :sad:
Edit: By the way I am using Blue for Pffifle because white just doesn't show up... :lol:
peter grimes Jan 25, 2007, 01:49 PM About the New Format for the Foreign Updates: I like it!!
In fact, I wonder if it makes sense to put the Team Info blocs into spoilers as well, as there's usually very little that changes from turn to turn in those. They are vital for reference and historical research, but I'm not sure we need to scroll through them each time you post an update.
Keep up the good work :salute:
Nota Bene: This does NOT mean that I will automatically vote for you in the upcoming "election" ;)
gbno1fan Jan 25, 2007, 01:57 PM Nota Bene: This does NOT mean that I will automatically vote for you in the upcoming "election"
Ah, but it means I will. ;)
I like the new format, too.
General_W Jan 25, 2007, 04:39 PM Thanks gentlemen! Glad you like the refinements.
That's a good idea Peter - I'll see about implementing that. I don't want to go crazy with the spoilers... but they DO clean things up when used effectively, I think.
@gbno1fan…. Your loyalty will be remembered ;)
peter grimes Jan 26, 2007, 11:01 AM Okay, so I was reading General_W latest letter to Loco, in which he reminds Loco of our offer (the several Phased trade) by using the technique.
And I had a thought... a really intriguing thought..
We're concerned that Aloha and Innovia are trying to recruit Loco and Piffle into an anti-Epsilon alliance. One way for us to stop that from happening is by sowing distrust amongst them. And one way to sow distrust is to make it appear as if Innovia or Aloha are actually being dishonest about the anti-epsilon thing:
We could send a letter to Loco, with the trade part spoilered. But, instead of including the text of our proposal to trade with Loco, we include text of a [bogus] trade with Aloha:
[spoiler]Phase One:
Aloha sends Construction, Epsilon sends Machinery
Phase Two:
Epsilon researches to Guilds, while Aloha researches to Education
Then any tech that either team recieves from Innovia will be shared after a two turn 'breather', to keep it from being too obvious
We look forward to profitable and peaceful trades between our great nations... blah blah blah
The letter is sent, and then, about 5 minutes later, an 'edited' letter is sent, wherein we profusely apologize for having mis-pasted some stuff, so please don't bother reading the other email, as the new email is the correct one, so please just delete it THANKS!
I know this is sort of complicated, but it really could work! Of course, we should only entertain the idea if we are truly scared that Loco will join Aloha and Innovia.
General_W Jan 26, 2007, 11:17 AM :lol: that's a clever idea Peter! (read = :evil: )
Still, I think the potential for backfire there is too great. (seems like we'd just be likely to promot Loco to ask some questions, and then our whole "mistake" becomes quickly transparent, and we look REALLY bad.)
I'd rather not risk that - unless the team is really excited about it?
peter grimes Jan 26, 2007, 11:24 AM Yeah, the backfire thing is something I'm not sure how to handle. I was hoping someone else could solve that problem ;)
DaveMcW Jan 26, 2007, 11:24 AM Let's contact Aloha first before we start spreading rumors about them.
peter grimes Jan 28, 2007, 09:19 AM I was checking out the Foreign update, and I started doing some math.
We're ahead by quite a large margin, beaker-wise:
Over Innovia, we have +750 :science:
Over Loco +2050 :science: :eek:
Over Aloha +? :science:
Over Piffle +1070 -700 :science: (machinery)
I dont' really know why I'm posting that - but if Loco knew this, I think they'd be more likely to come around to our side.
peter grimes Jan 29, 2007, 02:15 PM I really like the new format. It's organized well, and easy to find the numbers when you need to.
Great Term :goodjob:
peter grimes Jan 31, 2007, 10:56 AM So I was just thinking about religion, Open Borders, and Great Merchants.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but a GM can't enter someone else's cultural boundary without an OB agreement. OB's also allow religion to spread, allowing the founder of the spread religion to view the town just as if there were a unit placed next to it.
If we wanted to show another team how safe we are as allies, would it not make sense to have Open Borders, and then systematically spread eachother's religion? If we wanted to seriously ally with Piffle, and they with us, then this would act as a sort of Insurance Policy. We both have lin of sight to eachother's cities. That would really build trust quickly.
As for not getting caught with our pants down, we could simply station whatever 'hidden' units we don't want them to know about somewhere outside of the visible 8 tiles around each town that LOS grants.
Is this a common technique in Multiplayer?
General_W Jan 31, 2007, 11:32 AM I'm not sure what counts for "common" – but I can tell you that I have never once signed an open borders deal with another human in MP, (Except for once with a vassal-in-all-but name player to get his units to come help me destroy another human for the win – he had a long-standing grudge, and I decided to let him get revenge as I won)
Your proposal would be an amazing level of trust and friendship… I just can't imagine doing that with someone I'm trying to beat, however!
I mean, if we were facing an aggressive alliance of 3 nations bent on destroying us… necessity may birth an agreement like that…. Or if one of us is nearly destroyed but wants to stay in the game… but outside of that – I'm not sure I could be convinced to sign an agreement like that… let alone sell anyone else on it.
If we WERE to do a deal like that, how do you propose we eventually win? I mean, we could hide the location of units, but if they're paying attention at all, they'll know how many we have/produced.
I guess if we're going for a space-race win, and think we can simultaneously hold off a desperate invasion and attack when our former ally realizes that they can't match our industry in producing a space ship… AND build said spaceship while fighting off an enemy…
Eh… I don't know. Still sounds too dicey to me.
peter grimes Jan 31, 2007, 12:39 PM Hmmm...
So in General_W's experience, this sort of OB / Forced Religion is something that charachterizes end games and last stands. Once you factor in Victory Conditions, it becomes obvious why this is so.
But that begs the question: How are we planning on winning??
Memphus Jan 31, 2007, 01:57 PM Most likely it will be a Spaceship win...
Or we could always go for diplomatic... :rolleyes:
DaveMcW Jan 31, 2007, 02:52 PM If we get a significant military advantage over a neighbor, I think we should press on and eliminate them.
Eliminate 2 neighbors and it's a domination victory. :)
General_W Jan 31, 2007, 03:10 PM I agree :agree:
We need to get a better picture of where everyone is at in the world (can't wait to get those caravels!) – but the idea of sending some armies over to Innovia (or even Aloha, if they are as in-bed with Innovia as we're being led to believe) is especially appealing.
Either way, I see our victory flowing from overwhelming economic advantage. It's without a doubt our biggest edge at the current time – and if we keep our eye on the ball, we should be able to translate that into a number of different victory options depending on world situation. Our superior economy can produce advanced units for conquest & Domination… or fuel a space race.
peter grimes Jan 31, 2007, 09:19 PM I've just started playing Multiplayer games, and none of them have run to completion yet (tho' I'm about to win by Conquest in a game against Twistlok ;)), but despite my inexperience I'd be very surprised if anyone lets us last long enough to build a spaceship.
But, from what I gathered from the Pitboss game here, that's how DaveMcW cleaned up, right? So maybe it's possible?
peter grimes Feb 02, 2007, 10:41 AM I was just rereading the Piffle thread, and I noticed something that I missed earlier:
Piffle has met Innovia, meaning that they have encountered all the teams.
I wonder how they met? Maybe their galley spied that Innovia wanderer?
DaveMcW Feb 02, 2007, 11:37 AM I assume Innovia send a scout across Aloha just like they did with Loco.
peter grimes Feb 02, 2007, 01:30 PM Wow! If true, then the 5 Hub arrangement that General_W has been postulating would be correct.
Memphus Feb 04, 2007, 07:57 PM How do you know when you're going to win the Multiteam Demo Game?
When Thunderfall posts about the videos ;)
General_W Feb 05, 2007, 09:30 AM :blush: - wow... I know. I had to call my wife down to see that post... and then explain to her who Thunderfall is.
("He's like the Speaker of the House of the world of Civilization. Sid is the President, and...") :lol:
Anyway - now I just need to work up some ideas for a new broadcast!
DaveMcW Feb 06, 2007, 12:04 PM Now that we know all teams, I'd like to offer obsolete techs that 1 team is missing at the bargain basement price of 15% gold.
General_W Feb 06, 2007, 12:10 PM good plan - I agree. Included that in my draft first letter to Aloha.
General_W Feb 22, 2007, 11:03 PM Ok – this discussion got started in the Innovia thread, but I’m moving it here, because it bridges strategy with at least 3 foreign powers (Innovia, Aloha, and Loco).
Here’s a quick summary of what’s been said so far:
General_W initial argument:
Philosophy for Feudalism is a no-go with Innovia.
so I proposed Philosophy AND Drama for Feudalism…which Theoden said was much more likely to be accepted.
Drama (300:science: ) & Philosophy (800:science: ) for Feudalism (700:science: ).
I know it's a crazy 400:science: in their favor – but really, since we're poised to turn Feudalism around into 150:gold: almost immediately with Loco [as Loco will pay as this for Feudalism], and Innovia will have limited re-trade options because: Piffle already has Philosophy and Aloha already has Drama.
Also, imo, neither Drama nor Philosophy are amazing technologies, Drama isn’t a perquisite to anything Innovia can’t already access, and Philosophy isn’t any good without paper – and even with paper, we’ve still got a head start on Education that should make our lead into Liberalism unstoppable.
Therefore - I maintain this is a good trade for us. We get a good tech, we get gold from Loco, and we get to Guilds/Banking/Economics much faster… important to get us the best odds of getting that Great Merchant.
However – I'm very open to counter arguments if anyone thinks I'm giving away the farm.
DaveMcW’s Objection
I still don't understand why you don't want to trade Civil Service to Loco for Feudalism.
General_W response:
Loco doesn't have Civil Service.
[or if you meant the other way around] then I suppose we could wait till they get Feudalism and trade them C.S. for it. I don't necessarily have a problem with that... except it would be a long-time coming.
I was just trying to speed us on our way to Guilds, and then Banking.
But if you think this price is too high to pay, then I can let Loco know they should go back to deficit reserach on Feudalism, and we'll offer to trade Civil Service to them at that point. (if they're willing to go for it).
PeterGrimes Interjection
Here's the thing: Theoden pretty much told us flat out that everyone is watching our every move, trying to hamper our advance. Given that, they will only take a trade that will advance them more than us. So, by proposing Philo and Drama for Feudalism, what do they think they are gaining over us???
What tech are they beelining? What are they hoping to lightbulb with their next Great Person?
Given AloVia's score jumps over the last 5 turns (more than ours alone, but less than Epsilon + Loco + Piffle), I'm starting to think that any trade with AloVia benefits them more than us - let alone skewed so far in our favor!
Don't get me wrong here - I'm not completely against this, but I want to make sure that everyone hears the 'other side' of this proposed trade ;)
On the other hand, any action that speeds us towards more expensive techs is good, right ?
So, I’ve been thinking about this all night (yes, I’m an addict) and Bottom Line, here’s how I see our options:
#1) Go with Loco researching Feudalism, and we trade them Civil Service for it.
PROS:
A) We get Feudalism practically for free, because every other nation already has Civil Service
B) We don’t help AloVia down the technology path at all.
CONS:
A) We delay our Loco Roadmap by at least 10 turns (estimate) and lower our odds of getting the Great Merchant windfall and sneak peek at Loco lands.
B) We miss an opportunity to trade with AloVia and potentially build better relations
C) Piffle may trade Philosophy with AloVia anyway… placing us defacto behind as a non-party to the trade.
#2) Trade with AloVia for Feudalism, and sell it cheap to Loco
PROS:
A) We get Feudalism much faster, and therefore Loco gets Banking much faster, meaning we can get Economics right after we get Liberalism… giving us good odds of getting BOTH the free tech from Liberalism AND the free Great Merchant from Economics… which is money in the bank, and a free trip of LOS gathering to the heart of Loco land.
B) We pick up 150:gold: from Loco… helping us deficit research even faster.
C) We get a trade under our belt with AloVia, perhaps defrosting relations a bit.
D) We potentially prevent Piffle from trading away Philosophy and profiting without us on that knowledge.
CONS:
A) We pass out a tech that AloVia is currently missing, Philosophy, which they’ll certainly need, - and this is a group that was pretty much formed with a mission statement of “hamper Epsilon”
B) We put ourselves in more potential risk of NOT getting our free tech with Liberalism, if AloVia gets a great scientist and tries to Lightbulb education… but I think this is a very small risk because I’m pretty sure they don’t have a Great Scientist (correction anyone?) and if they do get one, they’d have to use it on paper, or if they wait till they learn paper, the lightbulb won’t be enough to get education all the way, and with our head start, I think we can still probably beat them to the punch on Liberalism… esp with our extra gold in the bank from Loco.
So – lined out like that – you can see why I’ve been torn up over it… but I still have to come down on the side of trying to make a trade happen with either Aloha or Innovia.
Hence I’m sending the letter to Aloha, and not sending a retraction to Innovia.
Now – if discussion gets going in here, and we change our mind – I can always decline AloVia’s acceptance by saying that the offer got vetoed by the team. I hate to do that – but we certainly can. We don’t have much to lose with AloVia.
But until we reach that point, I’ve laid out my reasoning, and I’m going to go with this plan.
Please, Please offer your comments and reasoning.
Thanks!
:salute:
Memphus Feb 23, 2007, 05:33 AM If we can get the :gold: from Loco 100% I am all for it (trading Philosophy and Drama)
Another food for thought.
1. We just found Aloha's Borders. They now See that we have an explorer in thier back yard.
2. Pfiffle now knows that we have a Caravel.
peter grimes Feb 23, 2007, 07:18 AM Another thing I'd like us to consider:
How will all this look to our trading partners?... By trading Philosophy to AloVia, we are locking Piffle out of a potential trade. That could really tick Piffle off. Likewise, once we have Feudalism, Loco may not really feel like giving Epsilon even more cash - cash they have a hard time accumulating. Tho' cheap, 150 :gold: for Feudalism may still be too rich for their blood.
Then, looking at the best case scenario for Epsilon, wherein we get to both Economics and Liberalism first: Piffle and Loco may realize (depending on how much they are talking to eachother) that we've effectively gamed them both. In order to soothe ruffled feathers we may have to spread even more of the wealth around.... Just something to consider :)
But I'm not exactly against this trade! Thanks for compiling all this, General_W.
General_W Feb 23, 2007, 09:47 AM If we can get the :gold: from Loco 100% I am all for it (trading Philosophy and Drama)
This is a basic assumption of mine. Loco hasn't written back, but the appear to have switched to 100% Economy last turn... so I assume that means they are on-board. I'll send a follow-up letter today.
Another thing I'd like us to consider:
How will all this look to our trading partners?... By trading Philosophy to AloVia, we are locking Piffle out of a potential trade. That could really tick Piffle off.
That's always possible, of course - but Piffle has had some time now to try to trade Philosophy, and they haven't done it. Also - we didn't agree to any trade restrictions... they can always do the same thing to us with technology we trade them. If it's really a big deal to them, I'd expect it to come up in negotiations. They may be annoyed, but I'd hope they won't be too mad.
Likewise, once we have Feudalism, Loco may not really feel like giving Epsilon even more cash - cash they have a hard time accumulating. Tho' cheap, 150 :gold: for Feudalism may still be too rich for their blood.
Actually, Loco now has 61 gold, they were projected to make +49 last turn, giving them 110 gold to start this turn. If they run at 100% economy for just one more turn - they can pay us in full. Since they told us "about 25 turns for Feudalism and Guilds" - 41% of those beakers are Feudalism = about 10 turns for Feudalism... making the 150 gold a very good deal for them.
Then, looking at the best case scenario for Epsilon, wherein we get to both Economics and Liberalism first: Piffle and Loco may realize (depending on how much they are talking to eachother) that we've effectively gamed them both. In order to soothe ruffled feathers we may have to spread even more of the wealth around.... Just something to consider :)
I suppose that could be true - but we can cross that bridge when we get there. I expect Pifle to be pretty happy with getting the free tech, and Loco doesn't seem to be paying a lot of attention - my guess is that they'll be pretty happy with their gold and the nice tech deals we're giving them.
food for thought:
1. We just found Aloha's Borders. They now See that we have an explorer in thier back yard.
2. Pfiffle now knows that we have a Caravel.
1. - yeah :wow: that was a bit quicker than I expected! But as a side note, I'm pleased to see my map guesstimates have been close to right! :smug:
I guess we can follow up on Open Borders now.
2. Indeed - but I don't see any real diplomatic repercussions from this. Do you?
peter grimes Feb 24, 2007, 06:07 PM I wonder if we should start tracking people GP production? We know that Homer was born on 134 to Aloha... I don't remember any of the others off the top of my head. But it might be useful to know what lightbulb options our 'friends' have available.
General_W Feb 24, 2007, 06:35 PM That's a good idea... but only of limited use- due to uncertainty about how/if a Great Person was used. (For instance, creation of Academies, or joining to cities don’t show up in anyway I can measure)
Still – we should probably do it. I just don’t have time today to make the list. If someone would like to – that’d be great. Otherwise, I’ll try to get to it later. I’m starting to think the Philosophy trade with AloVia isn’t going to happen anyway, so getting this list isn’t likely to be as high of a priority in the short term.
Like I said though – great idea!
General_W Feb 26, 2007, 11:59 AM Ok, it's time for a bit of
Epic Strategy…
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/GeneralW/EpsilonWarRoom.jpg
I got some time to think over the weekend, and I've come up with an idea to help solidify us on the path to victory.
It's a bit detailed, but hopefully I can make myself clear…
Major Goals:
Start a war with Aloha – Piffle and Epsilon vs. them
Solidify alliance with Piffle and Loco
Sub-Goals:
Get to Cavalry and Galleons asap for war effort
The Plan:
Piffle
(Piffle should be researching Printing Press right now to trade us for Education)
Have Piffle then research Liberalism (1400) while we get Nationalism(1800) first and give it to them.
Piffle then finishes Liberalism and picks Military Tradition(2000) as their free tech, and shares both with us.
Then, we tell Piffle that after Nationalism, we'll start work immediately on getting Guilds (1000) and Gunpowder (1200) – as soon as we have both, we'll give it them for Replaceable Parts (1800).
Once both of us have Military Tradition and Gunpowder, we propose that we start a joint attack on Aloha. :evil:
Loco
We offer to give Loco Civil Service (800) immediately, to help speed them on their way to Feudalism (700) which they'll give us as soon as they get it.
Loco then gets Guilds (1000) as fast as possible, and trades it to us Compass and Paper (1000 total) – as per our roadmap deal.
Since we're getting guilds from Loco, we can take a detour to pick up Astronomy (2000) before moving on to gunpowder, as per our agreement with Piffle. This allows us to make an across the ocean attack on Aloha!
Epsilon Research Path:
So that makes our research path look like this:
Finish Education (trade it to Piffle for printing press)
Race to Nationalism (trade it to piffle – expecting Liberalism + Military Tradition back shortly after)
Get Astronomy (while Loco finishes Guilds)
Get Gunpowder (trade guilds and gunpowder to Loco for Replaceable parts)
Go to war with Aloha!
Ok there's a lot here – biggest problem I see is the lag time we're likely to suffer due to Loco getting guilds before we can complete Astronomy. Still, even with that slight delay, we should beat the other teams by a wide margin to Cavalry.
What does everyone think?
EDIT: I guess Piffle will also need Feudalism, if they don't trade for it elsewhere, we could offer it to them for their world map?
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