0.11c

Download here: (retired)

Yes I know its a full build. I won't be supplying a patch for this version, sorry. To much changed.

To see what has already been checked into the next version see the first post in this thread: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=171497

Fixes:

1. Loyalty only effects living units (reported by pa12ick).
2. Regeneration is now castable (reported by pa12ick).
3. Inquisitional Halls now wipe any religion expect the Order instead of the Order (reported by AndrewDJ).
4. The creation of any civ specific hero no longer keeps all civs from making civ specific heroes (reported by Whitefire).
5. Purge the Unfaithful no longer kills buildings of your state religion (reported by Frozen Vomit).
6. Genesis no longer replaces ancient forests with normal forests (reported by Whitefire).
7. Governors Manor's no longer boost all engineers and merchants across the empire (reported by Gladi).
8. Engineer specialists can now be correctly assigned.
9. Train Maceman ability now works (reported by jimi12).
10. Halls of Granite now gives -40% trade modifier, not -40 trade routes (reported by Black Whole).
11. Religious heroes can no longer get the Cult of the Dragon promotion (reported by Chammadai).
12. Ring of Flames doesn't error when AI players have it (reported by Shqype).


Additions:

1. Malakim and Luchuirp diplomacy text (Corlindale).
2. Clan of Embers and Lanun diplomacy text (Wilboman).
3. Added the Basic Care compassion civic. Basic care is "neutral" and provides no benefit or attitude modifier form other civs.
4. Added the Crusade religion civic (bannor only) (Loki).
5. Added the Demagog unit (crusade only).
6. Added the Flagbearer unit (crusade only).
7. Added the Morale promotion.
8. Added the Roar ability.
9. Added the Breath Fire ability.
10. Added the Evangelist promotion.
11. Added the Shieldbearer unit (bannor only, replaces pikeman) (Nikis-Knight).
12. The Guardsman promotion now makes the unit more liekly to defend the tile, even if it isn't the most powerful unit.
13. Added the Elven Warrior unit (ljosalfar only, replaces warrior).
14. Added the Elven Scout unit (ljosalfar only, replaces scout).
15. Addded the Floating Eye spell (divine, mind 2).


Balance changes:

1. Cult of the Dragon reduces non-Sheaim and non-Kuriotate cities by 2 culture per turn instead of 1 (recommended by Loki).
2. Destroy Undead increased from 20-40% damage to 60-130% damage (recommended by Onedreamer).
3. Vampires reduced from 8 to 7 iCombat (recommended by Kendric).
4. Adepts increased from 60 to 90 cost.
5. Treants can no longer be built (they are only acquired through the Summon Treant spell and temporaily spawning to defend tiles).
6. Reduced the chance to spawn Ancient Forests (it only checks every 5th turn).
7. Sacrifice the Weak civic allows production hurrying by sacrificing population.
8. Public healers civic is only available to good leaders.
9. Jonus leader gains the Spiritual trait.
10. Sheelba leader gains the Barbarian trait.
11. Vampiric Governor reduced from +2 trade, +2 hammers and +1 culture to +1 trade, +1 hammer and +2 culture.
12. Vampires Feast ability now causes unrest.


Cosmetic changes:

None

Woo first post! Thank you kael, but why didnt you add my change?

The one about reducing mud golems hammers to 75??

I must have a mention at least once! :crazyeye:

Woo first post! Thank you kael, but why didnt you add my change?

The one about reducing mud golems hammers to 75??

I must have a mention at least once! :crazyeye:

Loki is working on the Luchuirp right now. When that is done we apply his recommendations and see what needs to be balanced.

I tend to think they don't need to have their cost reduced though. They just seem to be when compared to a normal worker. Did you know that they work twice as fast as a normal worker? Did you know that they can cast fireball if they are built in a city with a blasting workshop?

Loki is working on the Luchuirp right now. When that is done we apply his recommendations and see what needs to be balanced.

I tend to think they don't need to have their cost reduced though. They just seem to be when compared to a normal worker. Did you know that they work twice as fast as a normal worker? Did you know that they can cast fireball if they are built in a city with a blasting workshop?

I knew they owkr faster, but fireball :eek:. *curses playing all races"

Argh! Where's the link?

Argh! Where's the link?
isn't yet :(

I know. :cry:

Here is my comparison of macemen and vampires, if anything here is incorrect let me know. (Using new patch notes)

Tech path to education(what you need to get vampires)
750 beakers total(note somebody said you need ashen viel but you don't)

Tech path to ironworking(what you need to get macemen)
2150 beakers total

Vampire strength 7.7 vs everything

Macemen strength 7, 8.4 vs melee

Vampire cost 180 hammers

Macemen cost 120 hammers

Vampire resource needed: none

Macemen resource needed: iron

Other: vampires can eat units to heal and population at cost of unrest to gain xp. They can also transfer their buff to certain high level units. They can heal 5% extra in friendly\enemy territory.
Some posters have claimed that being the vampire race has been thought to cause computer players to hate you but this does not seem to happen in the multiple multiplayer games we have played. There is nothing on the ai's like\hate list that says Your a vampire -4. It may be bugged or just not strong enough, or just a myth. Vampires can caste haste so are in a sense 2 movement. Vampires can summon skeletons which will have their combat buffs and hang around indefinatly creating a meat shield to attack on the same turn they do.

I think they need to be pushed farther back into the tech tree and the problem will be fixed. How about putting them somewhere around 2000-3000 beakers. Not needing iron is a huge deal also, notice in vanilla civ how jaguar warriors(swordsmen) get pushed from 6 to 5 because they need no iron

Hope this comes across as trying to help rather then complaining :)

So should we install this in its own directory or over 11b?

So should we install this in its own directory or over 11b?
Shouldn't we wait until there's a link to ask such questions?

I'm fairly certain it will install to its very own directory. That's how all the previous alpha-versions worked.

Brand new full install.

Well I actually just finished playing one game. 500 turns for a cultural victory with the ljosalfar. Some things I noticed that I was going to put in the "b" version bug thread but I guess its better to put the here since I do not see them on the change list.

Bugs:

When using fireballs and meteors from stacks of units I managed to get whole stacks deseased. I think it was because the fireball/meteor attacked a deseased unit and then passed the desease on to the caster/stack it came from.

I needed a mouse with a mouse wheel to look at the slider bar on the resource page on the city screen. I could not left click and drag the slider. Possibily because I had too many resources? I did have about 11 different mana nodes and a very large number of food/happy resources.

When I attempted use the "go to mode(all units)" button with a stack that had a unit with a hawk attached to it. The only thing that would happen is the hawk would activate. I had to move the hawk to a city or move the unit with the hawk off the stack in order to use the button.

At the end of each turn when I would click the red button I would get a odd random sound. Never consistant always random.

Possible Bug:

I could not get the Inquistors to remove religions from anywhere. My own cities or opponents. Maybe I was not useing the correctly but seems to me I should be able to remove the odd religion that spread to one of my cities at least.


Odds and Ends

I have attached the end game save the turn after the victory in case you wanted to look at it (version "2.11B").

The Malakim are building Blight in their capital. I have all my Queen of the Lines loaded and headed that way. I tried to sabotage it twice to no avail. I would cost 8000 gold to try it again. I started building Blight, Armgeddon and Wrath in some of my cities just to be able to see what would happen.

Lack of cultural buildings made for a long cultural victory. I know about animals and carnivals and of course the culture I was useing was not ideally suited for a cultural victory. It might be nice if along with captureing animals you might be able to create not only a carnival but some kind of zoo that would allow animals to be built or have a random chance of breeding? but I am getting off topic....

Hope that all helps.

At the end of each turn when I would click the red button I would get a odd random sound. Never consistant always random.


I got that as well. sometimes it was a weird sound I'd never heard before, other times it was a lion growl. Started maybe 20 turns in. There was a sound every time I hit the button.

And I think its better to ask how to install it while waiting so we get it right the first time!

Not to be rude, but why is it taking unusually long to upload this?

He started this hours ago.

I don't know if you mentioned fixes to the civilopedia so maybe these have been addressed already, this is from version b:

there are two darven soldier entries, one left over from FFH 1. Also at least one of the golem entries (stone I think) is still the old version...


(Should we even post those at all, or have you a list of entries that still need work anyway?)

great fun playing so far :king:

Not to be rude, but why is it taking unusually long to upload this?

He started this hours ago.

Uploading takes much longer than downloading.

Not to be rude, but why is it taking unusually long to upload this?

He started this hours ago.

It's a full version, not a patch.
So it's probably a couple hundred megs or so. Hence the wait time.

I'm off to finish my 11b game. I promise I'll get it done before I download 11c.

Its up. Sorry for the wait, Im having technical issues on my end. (my hard drive started posting errors today so my first priority became getting the mod files burned to cd and getting these files uploaded so the mod wouldnt be lost by drive failure).

You can install it over the old version, it uses the same directory structure (I should have bumped it to 0.12 but I forgot).

I am going back to America tomorrow and I probably won't be able to check in until Saturday. Have a good time and let me know what you think, and any issues you guys find.

Have a safe flight bub. :)

I've already noticed that "Pact" of the Nilhorn is back.

I needed a mouse with a mouse wheel to look at the slider bar on the resource page on the city screen. I could not left click and drag the slider. Possibily because I had too many resources? I did have about 11 different mana nodes and a very large number of food/happy resources.

Actually it's nothing to do with having a mousewheel - I can't scroll it at all either. I'd still like to see mana resources displayed together on the list (or even separately) too.

@pa12ick: What's wrong with that? Read the description, it sounds right to me. You reckon it's meant to be "pack" or something?

the usual propaganda.... this is the best mod ever, and vanilla civ4 can't even reach it's heels...

as for feedback...

i played a small game as the ljosafar with the version 0.11b and found a few problems...which i haven's seen in the bugboards

i wasn't able to build elven immortal at all

i figured quite late / turned runes of kilmorph to spread religion/ that i can't build their priest... turned out the map only contained one set of gems... you might want to add to that handy map application that makes sure there are at least 3 of iron, mithril, gunpowder etc....

also the ai for the workers was horrible, a lot of unused land, set to fully automated and they would just sit on their butts in the cities...

as for the elven archer.. when playing as the ljosafar you get two of them... one as the religion fellowship of leaves and one as the civilization unit... but one of them starts with the woodsman 2 promotion and the other has garison promotion available, yet you can't choose which one you want to build...

btw. great models for elves, the archers with their capes rule... my respect to sezereth


as for the vampire thing, i also believe some balancing is in place, but not by decreasing its strength...
vampires have always been powerful but you always needed a specialized tactic against them...
i suggest them having a -50, 75, 100% whatever reduction for amphibious attack... they are afraid of water, so you should probably protect tiles on both sides of the city so that they can't simply attack from there. that would probably also allow for them conquering cities early on a bit less
also, i would recommend a negative bonus for attacking disciple units, since religious units usually are focused at conquering the undead, using specific methods...

also the ability that allows you to consume population for exp should be nerfed so that it can only be used once a turn... i built a vampire in a size 15 city, reduced to size 7 and had a fresh vampire with 92 exp ready for promoting...

...just finished reading Bram Stoker's Dracula... :yumyum:
also, from your description of units i understand that you wanted to make a vampire gain the immortal promotion for one turn each time they kill a living unit... so far they gain it permanently-until killed, but can't get it again later...

possibly make the vampires undead/ immune to disease

is a utility possible, like saving a build list in the cities that would allow you to set order for workers to build mana node types? coz automated, they usually build the same nodes multiple times / build nodes for which you have mana from wonders/palaces...

once again a fantastic mod everyone

- With the new basic care civic the old standard (fend for themselves) is pretty weak ;) , why would i ever change to a civic that is worse then the one i started with.

i wasn't able to build elven immortal at all

Immortals cannot be trained, just like with casters you have to upgrade very experienced units into them(lvl 6 is the minimun, I think).

- With the new basic care civic the old standard (fend for themselves) is pretty weak , why would i ever change to a civic that is worse then the one i started with.

Hopefully we will see some other bonus from Fend for Themselves in the future. I could imagine it giving a little extra xp to military units, for example.

Twisted Spire is not adding any money? I have Runes of Kilmorph as state religion and I definitely have built a bunch of kilmorph temples as well.

Twisted Spire is not adding any money? I have Runes of Kilmorph as state religion and I definitely have built a bunch of kilmorph temples as well.

Ahoj
Worked for me in previous versions.

- The elven scout doesn't have the elven promotion. (has the commando promotion instead?, edit: has commando from trait...)

- The elven scout and elven warrior units are very far appart (they are neary outside of the tile they are standing in).

One issue... pleas load up the new SDK source as well... just to be sure. Oh and of cours for me to start coding again these days ;)

Oh, and could the extract file be made "smarter"?

Regarding: "Fend for themselves" vs "basic care" civics. If "fend for themselves" has a lower upkeep cost then in some situations it might be better than "basic care".

Personally I would be more surprised if anyone ever used the "guilds" civic

I think Pact is what it's supposed to be. You're making a Pact and thus get some free Giants to kick ass with. :)

I think I found a bug concerning Loki. I attacked a city with only Loki and an Adept in it. The adept fell, I took the city and Loki seems to have died too. According to the Civilopedia entry, he is supposed to run away from all fights. He was neither surrounded nor was the city I captured the last one of Balseraphs.

By the way, I think the AI doesn't know how to use Loki. He stayed in his capital all the time although Balseraphs was at war with me.

<English>[COLOR_UNIT_TEXT]The Drown:[COLOR_REVERT] (Demon) The Octopus Overlords special unit is the games earliest Demonic unit. They are just as strong as Axeman without the requirement for Copper and without the vulnerability to the units that gain bonuses against Melee units. As Demons they are also immune to disease, making them a good counter for an opponent fond of Diseased Corpse units. The Drown can be upgraded to Stygian Guards.</English>

The italiced part is not true - I just saw an axeman get a Melee bonus against my Drown. Is this merely a wrong info text or a bug?

Traceback (most recent call last):

File "CvSpellInterface", line 15, in cast

File "<string>", line 0, in ?

File "FFHSpells", line 651, in spellFeast

AttributeError: 'CyCity' object has no attribute 'setHurryAngryTimer'
ERR: Python function cast failed, module CvSpellInterface

8. Engineer specialists can now be correctly assigned.

I think this change messed up the assignment system of all other specialists.

I should be able to hire 4 priests and 2 sages in this city, but the hire buttons are hidden by the fire buttons.

http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/3005/civ4screenshot00083tr.th.jpg (http://img108.imageshack.us/my.php?image=civ4screenshot00083tr.jpg)

Hello everyone,

after playing FfH and reading the threads for what seems like ages I finally decided to register.
Since everybodys first post begins with praising FfH I will not bother you with telling how much I love this Mod. ;)

Just two things I noticed:

1. The problem with the Ashen Veil Temples causing CtDs is obviously still around.
I play on huge maps with epic speed and therefore my empires tend to have many cities with loads of buildings.
I have never had any CtDs except for when I played with the Veil.
Usually around the time when I am ready to build Mardero I can count the turns until a crash happens.
As a matter of fact I have never seen him in action, because by the time I get close to having him or bringing him into position for an attack the game will crash every couple of turns, thus making it unplayable (unfortunately I do not have a savegame).

2. In my last game I played as Perpentach from the Balseraphs and due to financial problems had to play as Runes for a very long period.
When I finally switched to Veil (I mean he is bad, isn't he?), Alexis from the Calabim paid me a visit and cancelled trade agreements because I was now evil.
Hello, shouldn't I get a relation bonus towards the Calabim by becoming evil???

Not to mention that it did not matter because a couple of turns later when I had some Veil temples in place the game crashed as usual.

I would love to being able to establish a dark reign under the veil, but unfortunately this issue keeps me completely from using it, at all.

Except from this a truly great Mod, and my highest regards and admiration to those who have brought it to life!

Horacio

I think this change messed up the assignment system of all other specialists.

I should be able to hire 4 priests and 2 sages in this city, but the hire buttons are hidden by the fire buttons.

http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/3005/civ4screenshot00083tr.th.jpg (http://img108.imageshack.us/my.php?image=civ4screenshot00083tr.jpg)

Aye aye, I too encountered problem with overlapping buttons.

When I finally switched to Veil (I mean he is bad, isn't he?), Alexis from the Calabim paid me a visit and cancelled trade agreements because I was now evil.
Hello, shouldn't I get a relation bonus towards the Calabim by becoming evil???

Maybe Alexis was neutral at the time. If she also used Kilmorph her alignment would have switched from evil to neutral, and when you switched to Veil from Kilmorph you'd then receive a double hit in diplomatic relations -being evil while she is neutral, and being Veil while she is Kilmorph. I don't know if this was the case, but it would seem a likely explanation.

http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/2772/civ4screenshot00099oh.th.jpg (http://img224.imageshack.us/my.php?image=civ4screenshot00099oh.jpg)

After researching fanaticism, I could change my civic to Crusade although I am not playing as Bannor. This was only possible right after researching it, not through the civis screen.

Did you check to see if it actually allowed it? Pop-ups will also show for the religion-specific civics when you don't have the religion, but you won't be able to switch to them. That confused many people until we added the "XXX only" tag, which seems to appear correctly here.
It would probably be best if we could remove the pop-up if it wasn't relevant, don't know if that is possible, though.

I think Pact is what it's supposed to be. You're making a Pact and thus get some free Giants to kick ass with. :)

Well, I've seen it as both. If it's supposed to be "Pact", then why did it change to "Pack" with version "b"? If that was an error, I guess I just missed it on the boards.:confused:

Maybe Alexis was neutral at the time. If she also used Kilmorph her alignment would have switched from evil to neutral, and when you switched to Veil from Kilmorph you'd then receive a double hit in diplomatic relations -being evil while she is neutral, and being Veil while she is Kilmorph. I don't know if this was the case, but it would seem a likely explanation.

You are perfectly right.
It was me who spread the Runes to her, in the first place.

Did you check to see if it actually allowed it? Pop-ups will also show for the religion-specific civics when you don't have the religion, but you won't be able to switch to them. That confused many people until we added the "XXX only" tag, which seems to appear correctly here.
It would probably be best if we could remove the pop-up if it wasn't relevant, don't know if that is possible, though.

yep I did, and I could indeed change to crusade.

2. In my last game I played as Perpentach from the Balseraphs and due to financial problems had to play as Runes for a very long period.
When I finally switched to Veil (I mean he is bad, isn't he?), Alexis from the Calabim paid me a visit and cancelled trade agreements because I was now evil.
Hello, shouldn't I get a relation bonus towards the Calabim by becoming evil???
I had this issue in the opposite direction ("Evil" civ liked me for being good because they adopted Order) and asked Kael about it. Religion can change the alignment of the race. so if the Calabim had adopted something besides OO or Veil, they would have had an alignment shift and may have preferred you to be good! confusing, yes, but I think its a good role for religion to play.

@pa12ick: What's wrong with that? Read the description, it sounds right to me. You reckon it's meant to be "pack" or something?

Oh, and if it's "Pact" then shouldn't it be "Pact WITH the Nilhorn"?

I brought this issue up after playing a game with the 'b' mod. Basically, I couldn't understand how AI civs were allying with the barbarians. The latter were attacking me with relish (playing Prince with raging barbs) while they ignored Jonas Endain's crew, for example.

One member was nice enough to point out the reason was that Jonas Endain had the BAR trait which meant peace with the barbarians.

I started another game using the 'c' mod today... and same story. Only this time Sheelba has the BAR trait and thus, peace with the barbarians.

Not a bug, but I think a balance issue. If you enjoy playing with raging barbarians, and who doesn't, this BAR trait really renders the feature obsolete.

There is no way you can catch up to the AI Civ with the BAR trait who is busy exploring the map and expanding its Civ with impugnity while you are fending off waves of barbarians.

Yes, I suppose you could pick and choose the AI Civs to eliminate those with the BAR trait, but I think part of the fun (for me anyway) is selecting RANDOM and enjoying the surprise of seeing who your competition is. Unfortunately, it seems at least one Civ with the BAR trait is always selected.

I suppose this would cause a slight balance issue without selecting raging barbarians too, but not nearly as much.

Anyway, I still play one other game without raging barbarians, and that is great fun. But, I wish there was some way you could select raging barbs in FFH2 and stay in the game with Civs having the BAR trait.

Any suggestions are welcome. :) :)

Oh, and if it's "Pact" then shouldn't it be "Pact WITH the Nilhorn"?

Maybe The Pact with the Nilhorn? or Pact of the Nilhorn? I agree as is it's a little funny sounding.

I brought this issue up after playing a game with the 'b' mod. Basically, I couldn't understand how AI civs were allying with the barbarians. The latter were attacking me with relish (playing Prince with raging barbs) while they ignored Jonas Endain's crew, for example.

One member was nice enough to point out the reason was that Jonas Endain had the BAR trait which meant peace with the barbarians.

I started another game using the 'c' mod today... and same story. Only this time Sheelba has the BAR trait and thus, peace with the barbarians.

Not a bug, but I think a balance issue. If you enjoy playing with raging barbarians, and who doesn't, this BAR trait really renders the feature obsolete.

There is no way you can catch up to the AI Civ with the BAR trait who is busy exploring the map and expanding its Civ with impugnity while you are fending off waves of barbarians.

Yes, I suppose you could pick and choose the AI Civs to eliminate those with the BAR trait, but I think part of the fun (for me anyway) is selecting RANDOM and enjoying the surprise of seeing who your competition is. Unfortunately, it seems at least one Civ with the BAR trait is always selected.

I suppose this would cause a slight balance issue without selecting raging barbarians too, but not nearly as much.

Anyway, I still play one other game without raging barbarians, and that is great fun. But, I wish there was some way you could select raging barbs in FFH2 and stay in the game with Civs having the BAR trait.

Any suggestions are welcome. :) :)

If you have the barb trait you obviously are missing another one. Also, your scouts will never capture animals, you'll never get cheap xp by having goblins mindlessly attacking your fortified archers, and you'll never pick up free cities that the barbs own. I agree on raging barbs the AI might get an advantage in early settling, but they are missing out on some pretty nice bonuses as well.

I think it's balanced fine other than you should be able to attack animals without declaring war on the barbs. Silly, but I think it's a core issue. :crazyeye:

nice one with the new mod

Firstly the Mana concept is BRILL, even if i dont understands its levels properly without coming back to the forum FAQ :p ... cant wait till the pedia is updated

some things i noticed on a couple of quick plays:

- The elven archers bug as mentioned before, why are there two types of elven archer? Is it also possible to make the unit actually worth its production cost?! Regular archers are useful for the city defense bonus, which the elven archers dont get, and dont get anything similar in value. Hated playing as the civ with elven archers (replacing my city defenders until longbowmen) as specialist units cause they are a complete waste of time imo.
- Is there an issue with undead units as police? My drown have no effect on the population of my cities, who still 'want military protection'.
- Why are there three different types of 'Summoned' promotion?

Anyways, top mod as ever... (off to play FFHI tho...for a couple more releases at least :p)

Hello everyone,

1. The problem with the Ashen Veil Temples causing CtDs is obviously still around.
I play on huge maps with epic speed and therefore my empires tend to have many cities with loads of buildings.
I have never had any CtDs except for when I played with the Veil.
Usually around the time when I am ready to build Mardero I can count the turns until a crash happens.
As a matter of fact I have never seen him in action, because by the time I get close to having him or bringing him into position for an attack the game will crash every couple of turns, thus making it unplayable (unfortunately I do not have a savegame).

I play with the same options as you do (Epic speed, Ashen Veil, lots of buildings in every city), and I had that problem as well in 0.11a and 0.11b. I haven't tried 0.11c yet, but the changelog doesn't mention that this CTD has been fixed. This upsets me a bit because every time I start to get the really cool units (Archmages, Liches, Mardero) I must abort the game. I've never seen a 3rd level spell in action yet...

I have supplied a savegame of 0.11a in which this occured after a maximum of 2 turns (sometimes even on load, often after ending the turn and sometimes when I selected the next construction in the popup menu on the start of the next turn). Unfortunately, 0.11b was released just when I uploaded the savegame here and it seems to have been ignored because it was outdated.

I think I'll play one more game, now in 0.11c, and I guess I'll reach the point where it gets unplayable before the new patch comes out. Maybe I'll cheat a little as it's really tiresome to build up a working economy and start all over when the greatest fun begins.

Is Valin suppossed to abandon you when use the 'Crusader' civic? Because he left me when I did that. :(

Also, what does the 'Hope' and 'Loyalty' spells actually do?

edit: Sphener abandoned me as well when I adopted to crusade. Is this inteded?

Not sure about Valin. Haven't explored that side of the mod yet. Sounds like it would probably be an over sight though.

In regards to the Spells though:
+Sorcery 2. Hope- When cast in a city it temporarily boosts culture output and happiness of that city. (Loki)
+Sorcery 1. Loyalty- grants the Loyalty promotion to all units in the same tile, units with Loyalty will die before they are converted to other civs.

Well I had a CtD I was useing Ashen Veil with the Vampires. I had just finished researching Infernal Pact and the pop up menu for the research tree comes up. I reloaded a couple times and no matter what research slection I choose it Crashes. I have attached 2 save game files from the auto save the one right at the crash and the one 4 turns earlier. These are both .11c version.

Hope this helps. If you need more information on what I am running the game on or anything like that PM me.

Just a note to others...remember this is a beta, you can't expect every bug to be fixed right away. It seems to me these guys are putting a hell of alot of work into this for our enjoyment/fun. Go easy on 'em if they don't get these crashes fixed right away.

Hello,

I need some help. I have been experimenting some corrupt graphics with the following units: Pyre Zombie, Lizardman Druid, Elven Immortal, Infernal Lord, Law Bringer, Fire Elemental, Losha Valos, Elven Macemen, Sect of Flies, Goblin, Skeleton, Treant and Orc Spearmen, as showed by the following picture:

http://img146.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ffh27iw.jpg

Other units like the others lizardmen, the Executioner, the Orc Axemen, the Doviello Axemen, the Elven Rider, the Elven Paladin, Basium and the Elven Warrior change models when walk. Basium, for example, is a blue-skinned warrior when static and a floating helm and skull club when walking.

I hope anyone can help me and congratulatins, again, for the mod.

Orthus seems to appear very early in the game. He attacked me when I had only 2 cities and 2 warriors defending them, and at that point I had'nt even seen any ordinary barbarians yet. Despite quickly setting my research to 0% and using the money to upgrade Branding to a Warrior with a gazillion promotions and Melusine to an Adept that could cast all buffs imaginable on him, Orthus still slayed him and destroyed my empire easily. He already had his Combat V promotion at that point, he was completely unstoppable.

Playing as Ljosafar, I have been worshipping Fellowship of Leaves, with the "Guardian of Nature" for around 100 turns, and don't have a single ancient forest yet.

Orthus seems to appear very early in the game. He attacked me when I had only 2 cities and 2 warriors defending them, and at that point I had'nt even seen any ordinary barbarians yet. Despite quickly setting my research to 0% and using the money to upgrade Branding to a Warrior with a gazillion promotions and Melusine to an Adept that could cast all buffs imaginable on him, Orthus still slayed him and destroyed my empire easily. He already had his Combat V promotion at that point, he was completely unstoppable.

Just bad luck, I guess. Same thing happened to me last week. Had the craziest starting position with 2 gold, reagents, cows, grassland river, corn, copper. Orthus comes out of nowhere and eats my scout. My two fortified warriors were wetting their pants, so I just world builder'd Orthus' ass into oblivion.

I've been really enjoying this mod, however I have a savegame which crashes at the end of the turn or in a few turns after that. It must be something the AI is doing (perhaps creating a building or unit). I'm attaching the savefile.

I tried to use the 'transmutation' spell but i couldn't get it to change from copper to gold. I tried with and without mines, on a plain and a hill.

I tried to use smartmap with this mod, but it seems I always end up with very few mana and mithril resources about one or two each, in a 6-8 player game. I'm not sure how many are suposed to appear, but having so few really limits the available types of mana. Of course it might just be the map script.

Ok ,that's all for now.
I'm really enjoying this mod, despite the crashes, so thanks! :goodjob:

I concour with "Corlindale" I have been unlucky twice where he has appeared nearby and wallopped me. I chalked it up to bad luck and started over. There was no way I could have survived. I think the one time I even had 3 warriors and a palicade built.

Also playing the Ljosafar like "upthorn" I have yet to see an ancient forest about 150 turns in. Finally I am assumeing that the elven scout does not have the elven trait because it would just be too fast for that early in the game?

On the other hand, I've seen half of the AI's forests gone Ancienct during the first ten turns after researching Fellowship. Pretty weird.
What's more I'd suggest making all religious units, not only the heroes, immune to the Dragon Cult promotion. It's just weird what a disciple of Leaves turns out to be a dragon cultist... How could he then spread religion he doesn't really believe in? Or maybe they could just spread the Dragon Cult instead of their normal religion. That would be pretty interesting. especially in the hand of the AI.

Cheers

I rarely get a religion. Right now i was playing, and rushed to get the Leaves, and managed to get the religion tech, but the holy city turned to be an foreign city??????

Is this a bug, or thats how its supposed to be? How lame! I worldbuild'ed the holy city back to one of my cities, but left the game a few minutes later... i cant stand to play a game i just cheated. Still, thats not fair! I sacrificed alot to get a religion and someone else gets the holy city!

The AI may have discovered the tech the same turn you did.

The AI may have discovered the tech the same turn you did.

That is, unfortunately, true. I have more than once cursed the AI for researching certain tech a turn before I did. It has never happened that the AI got a holy city for a religion I founded, even if I played an Agnostic civ, though.

Cheers

My latest game was quite bug-free. I noticed just two small things:

1.) Are you supposed to be able to build roads on water? If you have workers loaded on a ship and you select them, you can choose the "Build Road" button (and it works). Three turns later you have a nice road in the sea. It doesn't allow land units to walk on water, but it allows ships to travel twice or thrice as fast. That really made unit transport to my colonies a lot faster, but the road network on the water looks a bit weird.

2.) Also, summoned units seem to cost upkeep. Is this a feature, a display error or a real bug?

If you have the barb trait you obviously are missing another one. Also, your scouts will never capture animals, you'll never get cheap xp by having goblins mindlessly attacking your fortified archers, and you'll never pick up free cities that the barbs own. I agree on raging barbs the AI might get an advantage in early settling, but they are missing out on some pretty nice bonuses as well.

I think it's balanced fine other than you should be able to attack animals without declaring war on the barbs. Silly, but I think it's a core issue. :crazyeye:

Thanks for your response. I think the advantages you mention come into play in later game stages - and, as it is very likely with you being the only one having to deal with barbarians (others wiped out), you will not be able to keep up and use these advantages. During a raging barbarian game, you are not able use the captured animals very much (busy with military rather than culture) and even capturing the animals become perilous once the barbs appear on the scene.

I agree that the number of goblins attacking can be insane, but once the Lizard Dudes, Axemen and Horsemen appear, it is a different story. Meanwhile good ole Sheelba is expanding its civ and moving on.

I encourage you to try a game with raging barbs at a high setting with an AI civ having the BAR trait and see how it goes. :) My point on the balance issue is that it would not be possible to win this game. I have never made it that far, but wouldn't the barbs just keep coming until you are dead and only the civ with the BAR trait remains? Despite having a different trait and those advantages you mentioned I just don't think they could help you win the game if you aren't around to compete.

My only suggestion to solve this, and it probably is not possible, is to suppress the BAR trait when raging barbs is selected. Or, just not allow one of the civs with the BAR trait to be selected if you are using raging barbs.

If anyone else who plays with raging barbs has a strategy to overcome this, I'd love to hear it.

Thanks again woodelf for your reply.

I concour with "Corlindale" I have been unlucky twice where he has appeared nearby and wallopped me. I chalked it up to bad luck and started over. There was no way I could have survived. I think the one time I even had 3 warriors and a palicade built.



It's funny how it goes because in my last two games I had little trouble with Orthus.

In Game One he came later in the game with about 50 other barbs (playing raging barbs) after destroying two other civs. I was playing Hippus and had managed to get several Raider units. The funny thing was on three successive turns, he killed my Raiders, but rather than not attack and gain some health he attacked and was killed by a Warrior.

In Game Two he was 'born' just outside my limits and came straight for my capital. It is true that nothing in the mod browns your shorts more than this event. However, I was shocked when his first attack on my city resulted in his defeat by a lowly Warrior and the Axe being passed to me.

In a third game I never saw Orthus, but I noted the Axe changed hands many times away from my civ.

I can confirm the experience of one of the upthread posters--Ancient Forests no longer seem to appear when the player founds Fellowship of the Leaves. I'm 278 turns in, and I have no Ancient Forests at all. :( I've attached my most recent savegame.

Twisted Spire is not adding any money? I have Runes of Kilmorph as state religion and I definitely have built a bunch of kilmorph temples as well.

it will add money in the city where you built the religious building (like temple of kilmorph), not in the city where you built the wonder (unless you build a temple there too).

If you have the barb trait you obviously are missing another one. Also, your scouts will never capture animals, you'll never get cheap xp by having goblins mindlessly attacking your fortified archers, and you'll never pick up free cities that the barbs own. I agree on raging barbs the AI might get an advantage in early settling, but they are missing out on some pretty nice bonuses as well.

I think it's balanced fine other than you should be able to attack animals without declaring war on the barbs. Silly, but I think it's a core issue. :crazyeye:

What if, instead of at 'peace' with the Barbs, the Barbarian traits gives something like a 25% chance that a defeated Barb will join your Civ in awe of your power.

@bebematos: Sounds like a T&L problem to me - those all display fine for me. What graphics card are you using?

Are you guys without ancient forests adopting Leaves as your state religion? That's the trigger, not founding it.

@bebematos: Sounds like a T&L problem to me - those all display fine for me. What graphics card are you using?

Are you guys without ancient forests adopting Leaves as your state religion? That's the trigger, not founding it.

I didn't say I founded leaves, I said I was following it.

Plus: You can't use the "guardian of nature" unless you adopt leaves.

Are ancient forests appearing properly for you? If so, what civ are you playing as?
I think they may have accidentally been disabled for elves.

@bebematos: Sounds like a T&L problem to me - those all display fine for me. What graphics card are you using?

Are you guys without ancient forests adopting Leaves as your state religion? That's the trigger, not founding it.

I didn't say I founded leaves, I said I was following it.

Plus: You can't use the "guardian of nature" unless you adopt leaves.

Are ancient forests appearing properly for you? If so, what civ are you playing as?
I think they may have accidentally been disabled for elves.

Like upthorn, I was playing with Fellowship of Leaves as my state religion, Guardian of Nature civic, Ljosalfar.

@DMN - that's an interesting bug. :crazyeye:

@Sarisin - no problem. I don't think I could handle raging barbs though...

I can confirm the experience of one of the upthread posters--Ancient Forests no longer seem to appear when the player founds Fellowship of the Leaves. I'm 278 turns in, and I have no Ancient Forests at all. :( I've attached my most recent savegame.


Uuupps... Sorry that my error. Missed an Integer in the New code for ancient forest growth to be distributed over five turns....

For Kael: The right code should read like this:


iStartingPlot= CyGame().getGameTurn() % 5
for i in range ((CyMap().numPlots()-iStartingPlot) / 5 ):
pPlot = CyMap().plotByIndex((5 * i )+ iStartingPlot)


Really stupid error... Right know only the first fifth of the map is cheked :(

I lost a hero with the immortal promotion in my last game without him being resurrected in the capital. I don't know how it happened because I didn't even notice it at first, but my guess would be that he was killed by a spell. Would it be possible to move the immortality-check from onCombatResult to onUnitLost?

Normally spells kill by combat two. I see only to possibilies to bypass onCombatResult.
1) changing your state religion
2) Plague

So on unit lost would trigger for state religions too... or on upgrade (ok seldom for heros, but possible for other immortal units (blood of the phoenix))

Python is a bugger to check with wordpad. There's no "Find" option.

I found that spot CHalid and I'll try it in about 6 hours. No time to test now unfortunately.

I noticed as well that founding and adapting Fellowship of the Leaves brought no ancient forests into my territory. My neighbour who converted, however, had soon enough plenty of ancient forest tiles. :ack:

The Priest of the Leaves' spell 'Bloom' does nothng more but play an animation and change the tile description to 'plains/new forrest'. Unless it's sipposed to take 20+ turns for the new forrest to appear.

The Priest of the Leaves' spell 'Bloom' does nothng more but play an animation and change the tile description to 'plains/new forrest'. Unless it's sipposed to take 20+ turns for the new forrest to appear.

A forest appears, but there isn't any graphic for new forest in the game yet, so it is invisible at the moment. It still gives its production bonus.

Civlopedia Bugs

UNITS

Adventurer ---- No Promotions?
Pit Beast
Guardian Vines
Harlequin
Hell Hound
Hippus Summoner
Host of the Einherjar
Hunting Demon
Imp
Infernal Lord
Iron Golem
Lanun Galley
LightBringer
All Lizardmen
Losha Valas
All Malakim
Mud Golem
Nightmare
Ogre, Ogre Warchief
Nullstone Golem
All Orcs except Archer
Pitch Wagon
Privateer
Pyre Zombie
Raider
Rathus Denmora
Rhuin Archer
Runeguard
Sand Lion
Sect of Flies
Shaman
Skull Catapult
Spartiatoi
Stoneskin ogre
Taskmaster
The War Machine
Treant
Trojan Horse
Tuurngait
Vampire
Wind Knight
Witch Doctor
Wizard
Worg Rider
Wraith

History = TXT_KEY_UNIT_ + units name for all the above units.

BUILDINGS

Dwarf Cage
Dwarf Smithy
Elf Cage
Governors Manor ---- Placeholder is all it has in history
Human Cage
Large Animal Stables
Orc Cage
Palisade
Wall of Stones

History = TXT_KEY_BUILDING_ + buildings for all the abovue building unless otherwise stated.


Fruit of Yaggdrasil has a TXT_KEY_ description

All the leaders except Os-Gabella, Alexis, Auric Uvin, Einion Logos, Perpentach, Tebryn Arbandi, Valledia The Even, Varn Gosam, have a TXT_KEY_ description.

Hidden, Scorched Earth, Summoner and Arcane Traits dont list what bonus the trait grant.

Can someone with missing Ancients forest try this one?

The file contained in the zip goes into the "Mods\Fall from Heaven 2 011\Assets\python\" folder of your FfH2 installment. It should solve the problem with not growing ancient forests and new forests. It does not invalidate any of your savegames.

Civics:

God King is still not working as it's supposed to: it should give +50% prod, +50% commerce (not gold).

Sacrifice the weak is too weak to be a specific civic. It has huge penalties and the only real advantage is hurry production, but now many civics allow that...

Fend for themselves is also quite pointless now.

I think Pact is what it's supposed to be. You're making a Pact and thus get some free Giants to kick ass with. :)

You are correct, it is supposed to be "Pact"

Can someone with missing Ancients forest try this one?

The file contained in the zip goes into the "Mods\Fall from Heaven 2 011\Assets\python\" folder of your FfH2 installment. It should solve the problem with not growing ancient forests and new forests. It does not invalidate any of your savegames.

Ill check it out and get it included in a patch. Thanks Chalid.

One issue... pleas load up the new SDK source as well... just to be sure. Oh and of cours for me to start coding again these days ;)

Will do Chalid, Im trying to get everything moved over onto my home machine right now (not the laptop with the dying hard drive).

The Pillar of Flames spell seems broken..if not, overpowered. Haha. It killed the target and did damage to the stack that looked like this:

91%
54%
74%
90%

The Pillar of Flames spell seems broken..if not, overpowered. Haha. It killed the target and did damage to the stack that looked like this:

91%
54%
74%
90%

Pillar of Flames is a rank 3 spell, meaning it should be as powerful as Meteor Swarm. Were you hitting t4 units with it? Were they demons/undead (if cast by an order high priest) or disciples (if cast by a veil high priest)?

A funny thing happened to me on the way to the Cult of the Dragon holy city.

I laid siege to the Cult's holy city with some units that had the cult upgrade. It took a while but eventually one of them converted to the opposition. That was anticipated, what I didn't expect was that it converted straight back to my cause on the same turn. (I got a unit has deserted message followed immediately by a unit has joined your cause message) I think, only 95% sure, that it moved a square before rejoining me. Oddly enough it had the homeland promotion when it started the turn which it lost as soon as it moved. It was an elven horseman and so it would have had that promotion if it was in my elven territory. Curious no?

A few other things, the cult promotion only seemed to occur if the cult was the only religion in the city producing the unit. Once I spread the leaves to the city the units it produced stopped having that promotion. Is this by design?

Also elven villages in forests would grow to towns. I thought I read that they would only grow to villages not all the way to towns.

When they did grow to towns there was almost no space for trees on the tile so it became impossible to tell which towns were in forests and which weren't.

Furthermore cottages, hamlets, villages, towns etc. in forests next to a river didn't get the +1 for being next to a river and the ones outside forests did. Is this by design?

Hope this helps,
Redradish

The 'Overseer's Residence' and the 'Theatre of Dreams' give -1% trade route yield. I think they should give -1 trade route.

Normally spells kill by combat two. I see only to possibilies to bypass onCombatResult.
1) changing your state religion
2) Plague


Hum, neither of the two applied for me. Well, I guess I'll never know what happened to her (Losha Valas).

Welcome back Kael!!

Pillar of Flames is a rank 3 spell, meaning it should be as powerful as Meteor Swarm. Were you hitting t4 units with it? Were they demons/undead (if cast by an order high priest) or disciples (if cast by a veil high priest)?

Ah, think they were t3 units, at least most of them. About 1 t4 unit (druid) in the stack. They were Elves and it was an Order High Priest that casted it.

I know this has been in since FFHI, never really brought it up, but are work boats supposed be considered military units for purposes of switching to the Warfare Civic to build work boats with food much faster? I like it if so, but not sure if work boats should really classify under military units.

You are correct, it is supposed to be "Pact"

I thought it was "pack" as in "pack of wolves".

Except they are , you know, giants.

Anyway, a bug, I'm playing the khazad, I'm researching in this moment Dwarven studies (9 turns away) and I can build a dwarven soldier right now even if it say that I need Dw studies for it.

There are two Dwarven Soldiers, one a uniqie Khazad unit, and the other a religious Kilmorph unit.

I know this has been in since FFHI, never really brought it up, but are work boats supposed be considered military units for purposes of switching to the Warfare Civic to build work boats with food much faster? I like it if so, but not sure if work boats should really classify under military units.

And is it intended that Bambur is NOT a military unit and thus isn't built with food?

There are two Dwarven Soldiers, one a uniqie Khazad unit, and the other a religious Kilmorph unit.

Hes right. I ned to name them something different (and the elven archer) to get rid of the confusion.

Dwarven Warrior?

The 'Overseer's Residence' and the 'Theatre of Dreams' give -1% trade route yield. I think they should give -1 trade route.

You are correct, that will be fixed in the next version.

Can someone with missing Ancients forest try this one?

The file contained in the zip goes into the "Mods\Fall from Heaven 2 011\Assets\python\" folder of your FfH2 installment. It should solve the problem with not growing ancient forests and new forests. It does not invalidate any of your savegames.

I tried the new file and it seems to do the trick.
Before the file I was in turn 689 without a single ancient forest (Ljosalfar, Fellowship founder), and the first turn after I installed it ancient forests started to appear throughout my territory. :goodjob:

@bebematos: Sounds like a T&L problem to me - those all display fine for me. What graphics card are you using?

Are you guys without ancient forests adopting Leaves as your state religion? That's the trigger, not founding it.

Beefonthebone,

I am using a intel 82845 graphic card, and it could explain the corrupt models. However it would not explain the units that have a model when static and other when walking. I have no clue of what could be causing this ...

First of all, I gotta say that this is a great mod. That being said, I've noticed a couple of what I think were bugs.

Both of these were in the same game playing as Tebryn Arbandi in version C.

The first bug that I noticed was that one of my cities suddenly was reduced to a population of one from a population of 5 or so and listed the growth rate as stagnant, even though it had grown normally before from a population of one (that is, I didn't cheat or something to boost the population artificially). Unfortunately, I'm not sure if it was in starvation beforehand, but I don't believe it was. It may be that sometimes in starvation, rather than population being reduced by one, it's reduced to one, though I purposely starved another city without that happening.

The second bug was that during a revolution, I received a message stating that one of my cities could no longer continue building the Eternal Flame wonder, and that my hammers had been refunded to me in gold. Initially I thought this was because one of my rivals had completed the wonder before me, but when I examined the city later, lo and behold, it had the Eternal Flame in it, even though it said that the wonder was cancelled.

First of all, I gotta say that this is a great mod. That being said, I've noticed a couple of what I think were bugs.

Both of these were in the same game playing as Tebryn Arbandi in version C.

The first bug that I noticed was that one of my cities suddenly was reduced to a population of one from a population of 5 or so and listed the growth rate as stagnant, even though it had grown normally before from a population of one (that is, I didn't cheat or something to boost the population artificially). Unfortunately, I'm not sure if it was in starvation beforehand, but I don't believe it was. It may be that sometimes in starvation, rather than population being reduced by one, it's reduced to one, though I purposely starved another city without that happening.

It sounds like someone may have completed the Apocylpse or Blight armageddon spells.

The second bug was that during a revolution, I received a message stating that one of my cities could no longer continue building the Eternal Flame wonder, and that my hammers had been refunded to me in gold. Initially I thought this was because one of my rivals had completed the wonder before me, but when I examined the city later, lo and behold, it had the Eternal Flame in it, even though it said that the wonder was cancelled.

Ethernal Flame requires access to Fire Mana. If you lose the fire mana while you are building it it will cancel the wonder.

Animals can enter enemy territory without open borders (possibly just enemies with the BARB trait, not sure) - is that intended?

Is it possible that the ancient forest process isn't working properly when using the marathon speed or if played on random maps? In my last three games the ancient forest growth was... weird.

In one game ancient forest showed up in only half of the towns (you could see perfectly well which towns had ancient forests and which not). This was played on the fantasy map 2.

The two games on the two random maps (one gigantic, one duell, both marathon) had no ancient forest at all. Not even severall hundred turns after the development of the leaves religion. Given that my empire on the gigantic map had almost 100 forests for a couple of hundred turns, the chances that not even one ancient forest shows up are...

Many players have been having trouble growing ancient forests in the c version, but thankfully Chalid found the solution: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4094606&postcount=83

I'm having a problem where when I start a game I lose after 19 or so turns, the first game I played was a time victory by another AI opponent and the second just reported that I lost. I didn't surf this entire thread but I did surf a few pages and no one else seems to have this problem.

Animals can enter enemy territory without open borders (possibly just enemies with the BARB trait, not sure) - is that intended?

Yes, player controlled animals (or allied as with the barbarian trait) dont care about borders.

I charmed some units, but they attacked me anyway. The 'charmed' promotion doesn't seem to work.

I charmed some units, but they attacked me anyway. The 'charmed' promotion doesn't seem to work.

I experienced this too. My Adept thought he could calm down a vicious bear...he got eaten...:(

I have problem with crusade civic. Im playing Bannor and when im take crusade civic Ive lost state religion (The Order). All my religious heroes are gone:(
looks like a bug

New FfH is superb. Ive loved FfH 1.0 but now I can play only in new version :)
Brilliant work Kael & Team

My guess is that the python function onBeginPlayerTurn is at the very beginning of a new turn - even before all units are reset (moves/attacks/healing). Thus, the pyton code that sets the remaining attacks to 0 has no effect.

I haven't double checked this yet, but I have the impression that when a player switches to a religion of different alignement compared to the one before, all your diplomacy modifiers with that player will be reset.

I experienced this too. My Adept thought he could calm down a vicious bear...he got eaten...:(

I think I mentioned this pre-Beta. It's never worked for me...

I think I mentioned this in 011a, but here is again. I've attached a save file. I have a Great Commander. When I try to use its Recruit ability, I get a CTD within seconds.

I've used Recruit a couple of times without a problem. Four or five fairly decent units showed up in the same tile the Great Commander was in and the GC went away. The game kept on playing.

The one time I used Recruit I got all of two mediocre units. No crashes, though.

Zurai, YNCS, were you guys using recruit in a city or on an empty tile? My crashes with Recruit have always happened when using the ability in a city and in the late game. I did get it to work once, when I popped one as a GP in the early game in 011a. Every other time, I've had crashes.

Zurai, YNCS, were you guys using recruit in a city or on an empty tile? My crashes with Recruit have always happened when using the ability in a city and in the late game. I did get it to work once, when I popped one as a GP in the early game in 011a. Every other time, I've had crashes.

You're right, if you had TECH_TRADE learned you would try to spawn a UNITCLASS_HORSE_CHARIOT. The real name of the unitclass is UNITCLASS_CHARIOT, so it would crash on the bogus name.

It will be fixed in the next version.

I think I mentioned this pre-Beta. It's never worked for me...

I will test sometime in the world builder to find out for sure; but I think the charm spell does work, but not on barbarians.

I had great fun casting wither on the barbarians though, they wander around pillaging while they slowly die :lol:, (I really hate the barbarians in this beta, they are the strongest civ! :mad: )

It seems like when you move a stack with a caster in it, when the stack is in position if you cast from the grouped stack you can cast spells as many times as you want, I don't think the 'casted' effect knows what unit to place it on. I did this with the Contagion spell.

Also in regards to the Contagion spell...how is it supposed to work? I targeted a stack in a city and selected the target, it disappeared completely. This left me confused so I tried it again from the stack on the same turn, when I tried again it made another unit vanish as well. The second time I used it I shuoldn't have been able to either, only had the one unit with that spell. I didn't think it would outright kill the unit which is why I tried using it again, I was kind of bummed too because the unit I targetted had Orthus' Axe and it went poof, when I was actually hoping to acquire it for myself.

edit1: I also have a question about Lumbermills and Ancient Forests. So I can put lumbermills in forests before they turn into Ancient Forests but after they turn into Ancient Forests no more lumbermills. This makes the Hidden Paths bonus for lumbermills kind of pointless seeing as it comes soo early before you can even make lumbermills. If you don't prioritize getting Iron Working all your forests will be Ancient Forests long before you can even make lumbermills. Is this intended?

edit2: Oh yeah one last thing too...what's the cap against barbs meant to be? In the .11a it seemed like it was unlimited, in .11b it went back to 100, in .11c it seems like it's unlimited again, but I had a conquest in 351 so I did more fighting against the AI that grants xp, but in between civs were some barb cities that I definately got xp from on my way through them, units were already upwards of 150xp so I was definately over what I thought was the cap.

edit2: Oh yeah one last thing too...what's the cap against barbs meant to be? In the .11a it seemed like it was unlimited, in .11b it went back to 100, in .11c it seems like it's unlimited again, but I had a conquest in 351 so I did more fighting against the AI that grants xp, but in between civs were some barb cities that I definately got xp from on my way through them, units were already upwards of 150xp so I was definately over what I thought was the cap.

In .11c none of my units gained more than 100xp from Barbs.
But on the other hand I had a Ritualist which was up to 105xp without fighting at all.

Yes, I have the same situation in my current game - my units capped at 100XP, but my Ritualist has over 100XP. His summoned creatures have done some fighting for him though. Love those sand cats!:)

Continuing with my Raging Barb Adventure...

I have managed to make it to the year 1000. Six of the other eight civs have been wiped out by the barbs.

As expected Sheelba remains due to being at peace with the barbs.

However, I was surprised to see Lanun/Falamar still around and winning the game. Falamar does not possess the BAR trait. And, after my religion spread to 3 of its cities I have been able to keep a close eye on what is going on there.

I have never seen a barb in Falamar's territory. The workers and slaves are busily making improvements without any barb incursions.

On the other hand, every time I think many the bad barbs went away they appear again. Now they are throwing only Lizard Rangers (the sneaks really like parking themselves on inland water and attacking from there - got to get a fireball spell after them) and pesky Barbarian Mercenaries at me. I'm still wondering if there ever really were Barbarian Mercenaries. ;) The Lizard Rangers have been promoted to Level Five. Although the numbers are not insane like the early game (usually 5-6 at a time), their movement points make them a real nuisance.

Anyway, I have fallen hopelessly behind the other two civs in points and will likely not catch up. It is odd playing a huge map with only 3 civs left, and plenty of open spaces and barbs - although they are building many cities too. But, it is still fun defending my civ (I have only 5 cities) and trying to build improvements while dealing constantly with the barbs.

I still maintain that if you play a civ with the BAR trait and raging barbarians you cannot lose. You can just create a few scouts and let them scout the land without worry while picking off the goodie huts. Then sit back and develop your civ while your buddies, the raging ones, pick off the other civs one by one. You can win a Conquest Victory without ever having to declare war on anyone. Or, if you are bored you can send a few troops to another civ to help the barbs out.

Oh, one more thing. I noticed some of Sheelba's units wandering around with 5 Level promotions. I cannot figure out how they got that high as they are at peace with the barbs and no wars were declared.

Years ago I did some beta testing for Blizzard and I have to say the beta testing for FFH2 has been much more fun!:)

as for the dwarven soldier/elven archer issue...

why not rename the religious unit versions to forest archer/hill soldier???

what about this ?

I haven't double checked this yet, but I have the impression that when a player switches to a religion of different alignement compared to the one before, all your diplomacy modifiers with that player will be reset.

btw, the spell charm is a global event and it causes OOS in multiplayer. On reconnection the charm effect is removed and the mage can cast the spell again.

edit: charm not wither

also in the version 0.11c...

the two versions of improvements are now separate but it says:
can elven plantation
can build plantation...

you should probably change the text to can build elven plantation, possibly without a linked item


the technologies allowing tier 4 units should say: xxx allows elven immortal
not can build elven immortal, because they are not buildable...
btw great addition, that they are only accesible through already experienced units

It seems like when you move a stack with a caster in it, when the stack is in position if you cast from the grouped stack you can cast spells as many times as you want, I don't think the 'casted' effect knows what unit to place it on. I did this with the Contagion spell.

Also in regards to the Contagion spell...how is it supposed to work? I targeted a stack in a city and selected the target, it disappeared completely. This left me confused so I tried it again from the stack on the same turn, when I tried again it made another unit vanish as well. The second time I used it I shuoldn't have been able to either, only had the one unit with that spell. I didn't think it would outright kill the unit which is why I tried using it again, I was kind of bummed too because the unit I targetted had Orthus' Axe and it went poof, when I was actually hoping to acquire it for myself.

Contagion does a small amount of damage (11-30%) and applies the diseased promotion to all living units in the stack. It can kill units if the 11-30% damage is enough to kill them. And if they killed unit had Orthus's Axe it would be lost (in "Shadow" we will be trying to make the axe a seperate object so it can be dropped and picked up.

edit1: I also have a question about Lumbermills and Ancient Forests. So I can put lumbermills in forests before they turn into Ancient Forests but after they turn into Ancient Forests no more lumbermills. This makes the Hidden Paths bonus for lumbermills kind of pointless seeing as it comes soo early before you can even make lumbermills. If you don't prioritize getting Iron Working all your forests will be Ancient Forests long before you can even make lumbermills. Is this intended?

I will change it so you can build lumbermills in ancient forests in the next version.

edit2: Oh yeah one last thing too...what's the cap against barbs meant to be? In the .11a it seemed like it was unlimited, in .11b it went back to 100, in .11c it seems like it's unlimited again, but I had a conquest in 351 so I did more fighting against the AI that grants xp, but in between civs were some barb cities that I definately got xp from on my way through them, units were already upwards of 150xp so I was definately over what I thought was the cap.

The xp cap from barbarians should have always been 100, that hasnt changed.

what about this ?



btw, the spell charm is a global event and it causes OOS in multiplayer. On reconnection the charm effect is removed and the mage can cast the spell again.

edit: charm not wither

I havent been able to duplicate the alignment problem, it should only effect the pertinent modifiers. If you are at war with a civ and switch religions your opponent will still be mad at you for the war.

And yeah, unfortunatly all the targeted spells cause OOS, Talchas is working on it.

also in the version 0.11c...

the two versions of improvements are now separate but it says:
can elven plantation
can build plantation...

you should probably change the text to can build elven plantation, possibly without a linked item

Ill clean up the text, thanks.

the technologies allowing tier 4 units should say: xxx allows elven immortal not can build elven immortal, because they are not buildable...
btw great addition, that they are only accesible through already experienced units

This is a little harder since the text is auto generated. I'll see what I can do.

I have no idea what is causing this. I have a positive cash flow, but my treasury is going down. At one point I had -3 in the treasury, but a +20/turn? The next turn it was -7 in the treasury! Here's a save. Click enter and watch the wierd cashflow....

This savegame crashes after the end of the current turn.

I play on Epic speed on a standard size map with lots of civs. My religion is the Ashen Veil, I'm quite advanced in the tech tree and I've got lots of buildings in my main cities. In my experience that kind of game always crashed in the late game (in 0.11a, 0.11b and now in 0.11c). Some things I noticed about these late-game CTDs:

1.) Sometimes the savegames from one turn before the crash are invalidated (they crash on load).
2.) Sometimes the game crashes after ending your turn.
3.) Often the crash occurs upon selecting a new construction option in the popup you get when a city finished its production.

In this savegame you also see the bug involving roads being buildable on water with workers that are loadad into ships. The island in the west is connected with the mainland through a road over the sea (makes ships travel faster).

Oh, and I wanted to mention that you're doing an amazing job with this mod. I never play vanilla civ anymore, just FfH2 since the already great flavor of the religions and civs makes for a really great game, or FfH1 when I want a more stable game.


Edit: I just did some more testing with a savegame from turn 508. Sometimes I managed to play from turn 508 up to turn 510, that is one turn longer than in the attached savegame. When I save the game in turn 510, however, that savegame always crashes on load, so I guess something goes wrong after turn 509 and it just doesn't always crash immediately. If you could use a 0.11c savegame that crashes on load because of this bug, I could supply two of them.

We just found a bug in multiplayer (2players and several AIs):
Using the "feed" ability of a vampire causes the game to go out of sync. Also the window to choose the target appears for both players.

I don't know if this is a bug, but playing as the Ljosafar, I could not build Siege Workshops. Also, although my Ritualists have Fire I and Fire II promotions, they can't cast any of the appropriate spells.

As a side question to my crash above....Is there a spell that an AI could cast on me to cause that? I didn't get any warnings about such a spell, but you never know.

I have no idea what is causing this. I have a positive cash flow, but my treasury is going down. At one point I had -3 in the treasury, but a +20/turn? The next turn it was -7 in the treasury! Here's a save. Click enter and watch the wierd cashflow....

I experienced the same effect.
Maybe Perpentach has sent us you some Gypsy Wagons? :confused:

We just found a bug in multiplayer (2players and several AIs):
Using the "feed" ability of a vampire causes the game to go out of sync. Also the window to choose the target appears for both players.

Been reported several times, that - there's a post about it from Kael a few above yours.

@Lobsterboy: Elves can't build siege workshops at all - what kind of elves would chop down trees to build catapults? Not sure about the ritualists, but I think you need summoning or conjuring or something else to go with them. You should be able to cast Scorch with Fire I though.

You should be able to test the Gypsy Wagon theory by turning on "Show enemy/friendly moves".

The xp cap from barbarians should have always been 100, that hasnt changed.

Bright day
Old, but in .0011b version my tamed tiger got well past 100 just killing barbarians.

[QUOTE=Kael] I will change it so you can build lumbermills in ancient forests in the next version.[QUOTE]

Maybe lumbermills should have a chance to reduce a forrest back down to normal if in ancient?


I saw these in previous version, but didn't see that they had been changed:
Lurichip can't build dwarves when he converts to runes. perhaps intended or a side effect.
I was playing as Bannor and sometimes noticed an inspiration in my cities I didn't cast. Is this a side effect of their guardsmen abilities?

And I've seen the AI use adepts with no magic upgrades on them. Could you prioritize them to choose some magic sphere as the first upgrade? They don't need to know how to use all the spheres now, but if they can use any, they should upgrade to one of those before taking combat promotions forever. I know they can use summons well!

I experienced the same effect.
Maybe Perpentach has sent us you some Gypsy Wagons? :confused:

No Perpentach in this game. It's troubling to lose cash when running at 40% research for most of the game!

It sounds like someone may have completed the Apocylpse or Blight armageddon spells.

Hmm, doesn't seem likely, since it was pretty early on in the game...maybe 150 turns in, and I don't think anyone had the required tech levels to access them as all the scores were only around 100-200 points at the time.

Ethernal Flame requires access to Fire Mana. If you lose the fire mana while you are building it it will cancel the wonder.

Well, the bug is that even though it said it was cancelled, I still obtained the wonder, even though it had many turns until completion.

Also, although my Ritualists have Fire I and Fire II promotions, they can't cast any of the appropriate spells.

This may be because there are 3 lines of Fire/every other node type spells. There is the Mage/Archmage line your fireballs meteor storms etc.(enabled by Sorcery). There is your summoning line Conjurer/Summoner this is you Sand Lion/turn grass into desert (enabled by big shock...Summoning :) . There is also a divine line and thats your deciples/cultists/stonewardens/priests... eventually High priests etc. I believe this spell line will give you different spells as well and usually the Priest/High Priests are limited to 3 lines.

Also not all the spells are in yet, like I thought for sure upgradeing my Deamon summoner to Water 3 would get me a Kracken. I have to look through the spells to see if thats in the beta yet. Hope that helps.

Possible Bugs:

Boarding Partys when captureing a ship can get stuck in the water. They do not return to the pirate ship/galleon. So the pirate ship has to move to the spot and pick them up again. Would be nice if they knew to come back. But man are they fun to use. The pirate ships and the boarding parties are a blast. Great concept for the Civ that uses them.

Also one time I captured a ship close to land and the new captured ship appeared on a hill on land on the coastline. It was when I used a boarding party from the coast. I noticed the new captured ship appears in tile that the attack came from. It would be nice if the ship appear on the tile where the old ship was....also if its a Privateer maybe make it a Pirate ship instead of a captured Privateer or maybe thats too overpowered.

There are no combat odds for attacking ships with boarding parties.

I too am running about 40% science in my current game and its hard to get it higher than that I will take a closer look at my cities and see if its just my infastructure or something else.

According to the current changelog, none of the bugs reported on page 2 have been fixed yet. Kael, I suppose you haven't seen them since you were travelling back then.

Boarding parties attacking from coast makes no sense anyway :)

Boarding parties attacking from coast makes no sense anyway :)

Bright day
Ship has dropped anchor near the coast for the night, while most of cre is asleep boarding party carefully swims forward for kill.

what kind of elves would chop down trees to build catapults?

The same kind that cuts up trees to make Bow and Arrows.

Bugs:
slaves captured by waterwalking units attacking from the water will appear in the water.

Potential bugs:
I played a Lanun game with octopus overlords a my religion and farming didn't affect the status of any tiles. Is this intended? Is it because of overlords or lanun?

the farming thing is inteded.. ist because of the lanun. they get extra food from sea. When you have the advanced farming tech your farms will give +1 food (instead of +2 )

Bugs:
slaves captured by waterwalking units attacking from the water will appear in the water.

There isnt a whole lot I can do about these shore/offshore issues. They can move onto land next turn. I have to place captured untis on the winners stack because if I place them in the losers and there is other enemy units in the tiles it will CTD. So i force them to the winners since I know thats safe.

I could check the losers tile and see if there are enemy units and place them there if there aren't, but you are still going to see the issue you mentioned sometimes (when the tile is occupied) so I didnt see that the check was worth it.

Its the same issue with the boarding party and capturing ships from land (the ship starts on land).

The one issue I am working on changing is forcing the boarding party back into cargo (so they arent stranded at sea). The rest you justy move out of next turn, but the boaridng party being stranded is more inconveinant, and will confuse the ai.

I have no idea what is causing this. I have a positive cash flow, but my treasury is going down. At one point I had -3 in the treasury, but a +20/turn? The next turn it was -7 in the treasury! Here's a save. Click enter and watch the wierd cashflow....

You are losing money to the Golden Wood in your capital. We may need to talk about the effect of the Golden Wood.

Two points from my ongoing game at Prince on a huge map with raging barbarians:

1. Something is up with Lanun/Falamar. They do not have the BAR trait, but the barbarians will not attack them and they seem to be at peace. They are 'human pirates' - get along with barbarians? Their cities have 'orc names' but they are not orcs?

2. In the later game I am getting barbarians named 'orc macemen' invading now. They look like the human macemen. I believe it is the same for the worg riders. I know it is just cosmetic, but it would be great if the orc macemen looked like orcs and the worg riders maybe something like the wolf riders from WC2. :)

Woodelf, you were right. With a lot of hard work fending off the raging barbs and the two remaining AI civs who both declared war on me, I have passed Sheelba in points and will soon destroy that civ. Falamar is far ahead of me in points, tech, etc. and has a number of advanced units (heavy crossbowmen, etc.) that are troublesome, but I may be able to destroy them too before time runs out.

The key has been having the XP loaded units from killing so many barbs and, most of all, getting the Baron and being able to create a second army of werewolves.

This game has clearly been the most fun civ game I have ever played. :lol:

PS. The creation and assigning of promotions to adepts, mages, summoners, ritualist, etc. is just outstanding!

i just got a cultural victory in 679 on noble with the 'c' version the hottie redhead lsjuofar ...
this is so much more fun than regular civ thank you

many of the bugs have been noted already - like the forest graphic, the broken spells, but heres a couple of things -

- do ALL the heroes disappear when armageddon comes? because the spell took my valin phanuel and left me with sphener - then a couple of turns later after sphener cured a few people and killed a few monks - he disappeared -- i did not change religions or civics at the time ... in a previous save it took sphener, left me with valin and then a few turns later valin was gone ... neither time was their a notification like "barbarians create valin," or something

- contagion and de-enervate (the exp-sucking one) spells dont work right away , its like the magic user has to wait one turn in his space before the spells work or the city they are directed against have to be weakened some how, i wasnt sure which

- i couldnt get to make high priests - at first because i didnt have incense - but after i went and conquered it late in the game- no matter what i built i couldnt get the option to upgrade a unit to them ... was it just a case that i got it too late and they would have eventually have evolved to it?

- if you clump together workers (only with workers it seems) and then go to move them the screen clicks off them to the next units - a minor annoyance that i think happens in vanilla as well

- really minor minor thing: after you whack a civ out of the game - their attitude toward you still stays on when you mouse over their name - it is funny to see a fallen race genocided and it says "refuses to talk!"

-- finally two game notes and i will admit i am not a game designer in the least but i have to echo the one guy that said that nexus is really strong - its easier to get than 'glory eternal' or 'blood of the phoenix' and way way way more valuable - i like the feature and if i played against people i would beeline for it but my unusually humble suggestion would be to make it a zillion more hammers or three resources or have sex with grigori to get it ...

-- the other note is that the ai doesnt like to build farms and maybe im not analyzing the game close enough but when i get a chunk of land from say a civ me and another country are divvying up - by me building farms up on it my cities go through the roof population wise and it always jettisons my game score into the top one or two - perhaps if i were playing on a harder level this wouldnt happen - but i felt this was more of a game exploit than a strategy thing

again you must be inundated with this stuff and we out here really really appreciate your hard work

Two points from my ongoing game at Prince on a huge map with raging barbarians:

1. Something is up with Lanun/Falamar. They do not have the BAR trait, but the barbarians will not attack them and they seem to be at peace. They are 'human pirates' - get along with barbarians? Their cities have 'orc names' but they are not orcs?

2. In the later game I am getting barbarians named 'orc macemen' invading now. They look like the human macemen. I believe it is the same for the worg riders. I know it is just cosmetic, but it would be great if the orc macemen looked like orcs and the worg riders maybe something like the wolf riders from WC2. :)

Woodelf, you were right. With a lot of hard work fending off the raging barbs and the two remaining AI civs who both declared war on me, I have passed Sheelba in points and will soon destroy that civ. Falamar is far ahead of me in points, tech, etc. and has a number of advanced units (heavy crossbowmen, etc.) that are troublesome, but I may be able to destroy them too before time runs out.

The key has been having the XP loaded units from killing so many barbs and, most of all, getting the Baron and being able to create a second army of werewolves.

This game has clearly been the most fun civ game I have ever played. :lol:

PS. The creation and assigning of promotions to adepts, mages, summoners, ritualist, etc. is just outstanding!

I will check out the Lanun to see whats up with them and the barbarians,m they definitly aren't supposed to start as allies.

And as for ther unit art, yeah I know some still use the human art pieces. The art team is replacing those as quickly as they can. We generally believe in quality over quantity so it may be a while until they all get done, but I think you would admit that the units the art team has already made are really amazing.

i just got a cultural victory in 679 on noble with the 'c' version the hottie redhead lsjuofar ...
this is so much more fun than regular civ thank you

many of the bugs have been noted already - like the forest graphic, the broken spells, but heres a couple of things -

- do ALL the heroes disappear when armageddon comes? because the spell took my valin phanuel and left me with sphener - then a couple of turns later after sphener cured a few people and killed a few monks - he disappeared -- i did not change religions or civics at the time ... in a previous save it took sphener, left me with valin and then a few turns later valin was gone ... neither time was their a notification like "barbarians create valin," or something

No, its a straight percentage chance that they would be killed. I dont know why a hero would dissapear afterwards.

- contagion and de-enervate (the exp-sucking one) spells dont work right away , its like the magic user has to wait one turn in his space before the spells work or the city they are directed against have to be weakened some how, i wasnt sure which

What are you using to judge if they worked or not?

- i couldnt get to make high priests - at first because i didnt have incense - but after i went and conquered it late in the game- no matter what i built i couldnt get the option to upgrade a unit to them ... was it just a case that i got it too late and they would have eventually have evolved to it?

You can never build high priests. They have to be upgraded from level 6 or higher priests.

- if you clump together workers (only with workers it seems) and then go to move them the screen clicks off them to the next units - a minor annoyance that i think happens in vanilla as well

- really minor minor thing: after you whack a civ out of the game - their attitude toward you still stays on when you mouse over their name - it is funny to see a fallen race genocided and it says "refuses to talk!"

-- finally two game notes and i will admit i am not a game designer in the least but i have to echo the one guy that said that nexus is really strong - its easier to get than 'glory eternal' or 'blood of the phoenix' and way way way more valuable - i like the feature and if i played against people i would beeline for it but my unusually humble suggestion would be to make it a zillion more hammers or three resources or have sex with grigori to get it ...

Im sure Cassiel will be happy to hear that ;) . I'll look at raising the price of the nexus when we begin balancing.

I was playing a very entertaining Lanun game this weekend and noticed a couple minor things:

First, should Lanun have the ability to upgrade captured privateers into pirates? From a balance point of view... eh, maybe, maybe not, but damn, those pirates with boarding parties sure a fun =)

Ring of Fire... I had some mixed results with this spell. First, as has been mentioned previously, since it hits friend or foe surrounding the caster, it might be nice to have a "Do you want to go to war?" prompt or something if a non-enemy is going to get ganked. Second, though it generally does 30% damage to targets, I had it outright kill a few (including my own Saverous, oops). Does it have some sort of extra damage potential built-in? Or am I just hitting something weird like fire vulnerability or something?

Archmage civopedia text, first tab is showing up as [ tab]

Inquisitors weren't, umm, "inquisiting." I'm probably missing a tech requirement here or something, but, though I had the little Spanish Inquisition button, it was grayed out and never usable, even when in cities with non-state religion. What am I missing?

Thanks folks! This mod keeps getting better and better!

Speaking of the Nexus.
It works perfectly for my, but on a cosmetic side the "action button" still shows the vanilla "Air Lift" icon, which I find to be a bit irritating.

Maybe you could change it to the "Obsidian Gate" icon?

Speaking of the Nexus.
It works perfectly for my, but on a cosmetic side the "action button" still shows the vanilla "Air Lift" icon, which I find to be a bit irritating.

Maybe you could change it to the "Obsidian Gate" icon?

i liked the ffh icon that was used and is still used for the dimensional mana node...

I havent been able to duplicate the alignment problem, it should only effect the pertinent modifiers. If you are at war with a civ and switch religions your opponent will still be mad at you for the war.


Well I will tell you what happened with me. I was bordering with the guy of Hippus and his religion was Overlord. I was Grigori so no religion (btw, from what I understood this means Grigori can't cure disease. That's a bummer... is there a way around this ?). He was neutral with neutral religion and I was neutral. So I had the usual modifiers of the case, +1 for many years of peace, -1 for close borders, I was trading with him but not enough to have modifiers yet I think. I don't remember if I had open borders or not. One day he switched to The Order (which I believe would make him good aligned ?) and after that I had no modifiers at all -as if we just met- and he even cancelled the trades (which he re-proposed a coupla turns later).

just finished playing a tiny prince game as the amurites

two things...
a) i wasnt able to promote a level 7 wizard to an archmage... btw since the wizard skin looks so cool, it would be great if there was a arch-wizard or something... just to maintain the promotion line
b) there seems to be a problem with the ai researching religions... i tried to avoid researching unquestioning obedience to see when is the ai going to research it, and finished around turn 380 and still no sign of the order...
this happened to me once before but with the ashen veil not being researched at turn 300 or so...



also by the side, at some point in the game, the barbarians/giants/animals dont go through your borders, one hill giant just walked on 2 tiles right beside my border, 3 tiles away from my city

You are losing money to the Golden Wood in your capital. We may need to talk about the effect of the Golden Wood.

No more Golden Wood for me! I built it and I guess had no idea what it exactly did. I still don't!

Well I will tell you what happened with me. I was bordering with the guy of Hippus and his religion was Overlord. I was Grigori so no religion (btw, from what I understood this means Grigori can't cure disease. That's a bummer... is there a way around this ?). He was neutral with neutral religion and I was neutral. So I had the usual modifiers of the case, +1 for many years of peace, -1 for close borders, I was trading with him but not enough to have modifiers yet I think. I don't remember if I had open borders or not. One day he switched to The Order (which I believe would make him good aligned ?) and after that I had no modifiers at all -as if we just met- and he even cancelled the trades (which he re-proposed a coupla turns later).

Aquea Sucellus allows the Grigori to cure disease.

just finished playing a tiny prince game as the amurites

two things...
a) i wasnt able to promote a level 7 wizard to an archmage... btw since the wizard skin looks so cool, it would be great if there was a arch-wizard or something... just to maintain the promotion line

You can only have 3 archmages in your civ at once. You must have the tech requirement for them (Strength of Will). You must have the bonus requirement for them (reagents). And you must have enough money to perform the upgrade. If all of those things match you should be able to perform the upgrade.

b) there seems to be a problem with the ai researching religions... i tried to avoid researching unquestioning obedience to see when is the ai going to research it, and finished around turn 380 and still no sign of the order...
this happened to me once before but with the ashen veil not being researched at turn 300 or so...

Thats going to depend on the civs you are playing with. Only good or evil civs will research those religions. So if you are playing in a game full of good leader none of the ai leaders will ever research the tech that grants the veil.

also by the side, at some point in the game, the barbarians/giants/animals dont go through your borders, one hill giant just walked on 2 tiles right beside my border, 3 tiles away from my city

Giants will never enter culture radius, they are "wild" creatures. Skeletons wont either.

just checked the save...
there are no reagents nor mithril present on the map... shouldnt the map checker have taken care of that?

i had one wizard and one conjurer... so the limit wasnt the problem...

btw when you use a great commanders recruit ability, you can get a wizard, but it has absolutely no promotions... not even the spell classes from available mana... since he is recreuited from your population which has access to your mana nodes, i think he should have at least those spells, if nothing else...

just checked the save...
there are no reagents nor mithril present on the map... shouldnt the map checker have taken care of that?

i had one wizard and one conjurer... so the limit wasnt the problem...

btw when you use a great commanders recruit ability, you can get a wizard, but it has absolutely no promotions... not even the spell classes from available mana... since he is recreuited from your population which has access to your mana nodes, i think he should have at least those spells, if nothing else...

Could you link a savegame of a map without the reagents.

The wizard should start with a few channeling promotions. But you're right he won't get the mana starter ones. That will probably remain as the cost of getting an instant wizard (I think the recruit ability is the only way to skip the adept step and go straight to the t3 arcane units).

there, that should do it...

there, that should do it...

Thanks, I will check it out.

there, that should do it...

Very odd. You are right that there are no reagents on the map but I can't reproduce the issue, every map I generate gets the right numer of resources. And if I crank the resources up to something crazy like 30 they work right too (so that I can make sure that the code actually is laying the resources and im not just getting lucky).

What map type did you use to create this? Did you do anything odd to make this map (create it in worldbuilder) or is it randomly generated?

I don't know if it was a bug but I am playing as the Calabim at the moment with the Veil as my religion.

Anyway, I had gotten the Cult in one of my cities and decided to use Purge the Unfaithfull to get rid of it. It worked but it also removed the Veil, which was my state religion, from the city and all my trading deals with the other civs got cancelled. Is that supposed to happen?

Very odd. You are right that there are no reagents on the map but I can't reproduce the issue, every map I generate gets the right numer of resources. And if I crank the resources up to something crazy like 30 they work right too (so that I can make sure that the code actually is laying the resources and im not just getting lucky).

What map type did you use to create this? Did you do anything odd to make this map (create it in worldbuilder) or is it randomly generated?

randomly generated...

through play now, i believe...
tiny, pangea, i believe rocky, shoreline natural... definitely no random options in mapmaking...

edit: i now realize i might have regenerated the map in the first round...

randomly generated...

through play now, i believe...
tiny, pangea, i believe rocky, shoreline natural... definitely no random options in mapmaking...

edit: i now realize i might have regenerated the map in the first round...

oooohhhh.... regeneration. I bet thats it. I will have to check it out.

I tried regeneration and my computer froze. I needed task mananger to quit Civ4.

In my late game I heared some screams (about three)between two turns and now the game is loading for quite a while. The Windows Task-Manager shows me that the game didn't crash. Could it be that a wonder like blight needs a lot of time for calculating? :confused:

Playing my third game on 11c right now. Haven't noticed much that hasn't been mentioned already. Did want to mention again that captured animals can still cross borders w/o open borders. And the elf units like the scout and worker could be closer together and maybe a little taller maybe (are they tall LOTR elves or short D&D elves?).

I'm playing as Perpentach, and was wondering how I can tell if Loki and Gypsy wagons are working. I've tried putting them all over the place... in my neighbors cities, in my cities, and nothing seems to affect any players' culture or income. Do I have to be at war in order for them to work? I've been trying for cultural/religious victory so have avoided war. I assumed they needed to be in a foreign city to drain culture so it seems war would negate this. Anyway, can someone who has played Perpentach please tell me how to spot if they are working? I'm going to assume its me and not a bug until I know what its supposed to look like when they work properly.

In my late game I heared some screams (about three)between two turns and now the game is loading for quite a while. The Windows Task-Manager shows me that the game didn't crash. Could it be that a wonder like blight needs a lot of time for calculating? :confused:

Yeah, some of the wonders will take a bit of time depending on your cpu speed.

Playing my third game on 11c right now. Haven't noticed much that hasn't been mentioned already. Did want to mention again that captured animals can still cross borders w/o open borders.

Thats intended, animals ignore cultural borders.

And the elf units like the scout and worker could be closer together and maybe a little taller maybe (are they tall LOTR elves or short D&D elves?).

That will be fixed in the next version (they werent added to the formation file in 11c).

I'm playing as Perpentach, and was wondering how I can tell if Loki and Gypsy wagons are working. I've tried putting them all over the place... in my neighbors cities, in my cities, and nothing seems to affect any players' culture or income. Do I have to be at war in order for them to work? I've been trying for cultural/religious victory so have avoided war. I assumed they needed to be in a foreign city to drain culture so it seems war would negate this. Anyway, can someone who has played Perpentach please tell me how to spot if they are working? I'm going to assume its me and not a bug until I know what its supposed to look like when they work properly.

They are working but they dont have a very big effect (and I need to include some popup messages). All of the culture effects are on the wishlist right now to be reviewed (consecrate, loki and the gypsy wagon).

Yeah, some of the wonders will take a bit of time depending on your cpu speed.

Ok. Thank you for the quick reply. Then I don't have to restart CIV but to wait... I am curios about the effects - they must be huge.:)

In my late game I heared some screams (about three)between two turns and now the game is loading for quite a while. The Windows Task-Manager shows me that the game didn't crash. Could it be that a wonder like blight needs a lot of time for calculating? :confused:
Do you mean a scream just as if a city was capured/razed, but without the message that "town X was captured by empire Y"?

I had that a few times in my last game, and the last time it appeared was just before my latest CTD (I provided the savegame above). Sometimes this scream was played between turns for no apparent reason. Or is the small message in the upper left deactivated? Then it might be that some city was captured. Odd, since no one was at war at that time, but maybe I missed something?

When I pressed "end turn" in turn 509, I heard the scream and it just said "Waiting for other Civilizations..." indefinitely and displayed the loading cursor until I used Alt-F4.

When I reloaded the autosave and tried to reproduce it, the scream occured, but it didn't load forever. Instead it crashed either after turn 509 or during/after turn 510. (The savegame above is from turn 509, so it always crashes after one turn. I think you can hear the scream in the savegame, just before it crashes.)

The savegame above is from turn 509, so it always crashes after one turn. I think you can hear the scream in the savegame, just before it crashes.

Strange, we did not include a scream sound... must be your CPU that is tortured by some Balors... just joking ...

This savegame crashes after the end of the current turn.

I play on Epic speed on a standard size map with lots of civs. My religion is the Ashen Veil, I'm quite advanced in the tech tree and I've got lots of buildings in my main cities. In my experience that kind of game always crashed in the late game (in 0.11a, 0.11b and now in 0.11c). Some things I noticed about these late-game CTDs:

1.) Sometimes the savegames from one turn before the crash are invalidated (they crash on load).
2.) Sometimes the game crashes after ending your turn.
3.) Often the crash occurs upon selecting a new construction option in the popup you get when a city finished its production.

In this savegame you also see the bug involving roads being buildable on water with workers that are loadad into ships. The island in the west is connected with the mainland through a road over the sea (makes ships travel faster).

Oh, and I wanted to mention that you're doing an amazing job with this mod. I never play vanilla civ anymore, just FfH2 since the already great flavor of the religions and civs makes for a really great game, or FfH1 when I want a more stable game.


Edit: I just did some more testing with a savegame from turn 508. Sometimes I managed to play from turn 508 up to turn 510, that is one turn longer than in the attached savegame. When I save the game in turn 510, however, that savegame always crashes on load, so I guess something goes wrong after turn 509 and it just doesn't always crash immediately. If you could use a 0.11c savegame that crashes on load because of this bug, I could supply two of them.

You certainly know how to attract the errors, there are 3 in this save. One of the AI players is trying to recruit and erroring out because his civ isnt allowed to have that unit type. Another is the veil temple CTD, and the last is an error with the vampire Feast ability.

All three will be fixed in the next version. Thanks!

Playing Ljosalfar (Amelanchier) on huge, tropical, snaking continent archepeligo, low water map with 15 civs, raging barbs. Prince difficulty. Version .11c. (mostly getting my butt kicked)

Bugs
Upon first meeting new civs i get a + relations bonus ranging upto +5 for 'years of ongoing peace'.

Upon sacking an Infernal city captured Infernal settler turned into elven worker.
Infernals guarding their cities with primarly many double strength scouts, often with 1 warrior until thier infernal archer (UU) gets built.

Ljosalfar elven archers (and hunters) not able to pillage. Maybe this is intentional.

Ljosalfar scouts don't get 'elven' promotion (already mentioned i know). If this is intentional to keep them from zipping all over map maybe a different solution could be found as it is weird when my elven warriors are better at scouting than my scouts on some maps.
Possible solution: give Ljosalfar scouts 2 move and ignore terrain penalties and - 1 move in hills if possible?

From .11b game with Balserasph
Didn't see this in the .11c fix list but i was unable to cage my captured orc or goblin slaves in my carnival. The button was present but greyed out.

Keep up the excellent work FfH2 team. Outstanding mod!!

- feydras

as for the vampire thing, i also believe some balancing is in place, but not by decreasing its strength...
vampires have always been powerful but you always needed a specialized tactic against them...
i suggest them having a -50, 75, 100% whatever reduction for amphibious attack... they are afraid of water, so you should probably protect tiles on both sides of the city so that they can't simply attack from there. that would probably also allow for them conquering cities early on a bit less
also, i would recommend a negative bonus for attacking disciple units, since religious units usually are focused at conquering the undead, using specific methods...

also the ability that allows you to consume population for exp should be nerfed so that it can only be used once a turn... i built a vampire in a size 15 city, reduced to size 7 and had a fresh vampire with 92 exp ready for promoting...

...possibly make the vampires undead/ immune to disease


Great suggestions Moon Hunter. Just bumping these up to make sure Kael and others have noticed them.

- feydras

Im answering what i can :
Playing Ljosalfar (Amelanchier) on huge, tropical, snaking continent archepeligo, low water map with 15 civs, raging barbs. Prince difficulty. Version .11c. (mostly getting my butt kicked)

Bugs
Upon first meeting new civs i get a + relations bonus ranging upto +5 for 'years of ongoing peace'.
Upon sacking an Infernal city captured Infernal settler turned into elven worker.
Infernals guarding their cities with primarly many double strength scouts, often with 1 warrior until thier infernal archer (UU) gets built.
Thats intentional (till 0.12 than it will change)

Ljosalfar elven archers (and hunters) not able to pillage. Maybe this is intentional.
For hunters int intentional for elven archers i"m not sure.

Ljosalfar scouts don't get 'elven' promotion (already mentioned i know). If this is intentional to keep them from zipping all over map maybe a different solution could be found as it is weird when my elven warriors are better at scouting than my scouts on some maps.
Possible solution: give Ljosalfar scouts 2 move and ignore terrain penalties and - 1 move in hills if possible?
From .11b game with Balserasph
Didn't see this in the .11c fix list but i was unable to cage my captured orc or goblin slaves in my carnival. The button was present but greyed out.

Keep up the excellent work FfH2 team. Outstanding mod!!

- feydras
You need a freak show to cage humans elfes and orcs.

Great suggestions Moon Hunter. Just bumping these up to make sure Kael and others have noticed them.

- feydras

In FfH Vampires are not undead... The Pop-XP-rushing has been nerved for 0.12.

- contagion and de-enervate (the exp-sucking one) spells dont work right away , its like the magic user has to wait one turn in his space before the spells work or the city they are directed against have to be weakened some how, i wasnt sure which

What are you using to judge if they worked or not?


when i go to cast them at first the cursor changes but the orange box doesnt appear around the target and theres no 'screaming and yelling' ala the sack-city sound when i drop the flu-hammer

as for the enervation - sometimes the choice box comes up to ask me whom i want to drain and sometimes it doesnt ...

Thanks for the responses Chalid. You saved my Balseraph game from deletion.

I'm not sure which thing you said was intentional until a change in .12
the relation bonus or...
captured workers becoming elven or...
guarding cities mostly with scouts...
I am guessing the relation bonus.

I like the vamps not being undead. I just read Kael's entry (over in resource thread) explaining why he doesn't go with the usual myths/attributes about vamps and i agree with you guys. It makes the vamps less cheesy. I've done the same thing in RPGs i've run.

- feydras

Thanks for the responses Chalid. You saved my Balseraph game from deletion.

I'm not sure which thing you said was intentional until a change in .12
the relation bonus or...
captured workers becoming elven or...
guarding cities mostly with scouts...
I am guessing the relation bonus.

I like the vamps not being undead. I just read Kael's entry (over in resource thread) explaining why he doesn't go with the usual myths/attributes about vamps and i agree with you guys. It makes the vamps less cheesy. I've done the same thing in RPGs i've run.

- feydras

In the next patch captuired workers will stay whatever type they were. So its possible to capture an elven worker and get him to build you farms on forest tiles. Or capture a Mud Golem modified to shoot fireballs and you will have a Mud Golem that shoots fireballs, etc.

You certainly know how to attract the errors, there are 3 in this save. One of the AI players is trying to recruit and erroring out because his civ isnt allowed to have that unit type. Another is the veil temple CTD, and the last is an error with the vampire Feast ability.

All three will be fixed in the next version. Thanks!
Wow, three major bugs at once. Now that's impressive! :D I'm glad they're all fixed.

You're really patching the game in an amazing speed. If the crashes will be less frequent in the next version, I'll try to motivate some friends to play a few games in multiplayer. Keep up the great work! :)


PS: There isn't an estimate as to how long it will take to fix the targeted spell OOS errors, is there? Just in case I missed something...

how can i load FfH directly from the desktop without having to load vanilla civ and then the mod? im sure this is somewhere but i cant find it
thank you for your patience

In your CivilizationIV.ini there should be an entry that says: "Mod = 0". Change that into "Mod = Mods\Fall from Heaven 2 011" and the mod starts every time you start Civ4.

There is also a desktop shortcut in the FfH folder in case you want to access both with one click.

Wow, three major bugs at once. Now that's impressive! :D I'm glad they're all fixed.

You're really patching the game in an amazing speed. If the crashes will be less frequent in the next version, I'll try to motivate some friends to play a few games in multiplayer. Keep up the great work! :)


PS: There isn't an estimate as to how long it will take to fix the targeted spell OOS errors, is there? Just in case I missed something...

Im afraid thats a Talchas thing so I can't answer that. He had a purposed fix, but it caused another issue so it hasnt had the bugs worked out yet.

I don't know if this is a bug or not. I got the tech for Fellowship of Leaves and made that my state religion. Later, I got the tech for The Order. I built several temples for both religions. After discovering Priesthood, I can build Priest of Leaves in my FoL temples but I can't build Confessors in my Order temples.

In your CivilizationIV.ini there should be an entry that says: "Mod = 0". Change that into "Mod = Mods\Fall from Heaven 2 011" and the mod starts every time you start Civ4.Pardon me for asking an obviously noob question, but where is the CivilizationIV.ini file? I did a search of the Firaxis folder for *.ini and got results for every mod, but none for the vanilla *.ini.

There is also a desktop shortcut in the FfH folder in case you want to access both with one click.Not that I could find. I remember seeing one in the FfH folder in the Civ4 Modpacks section, but it isn't there now.

Pardon me for asking an obviously noob question, but where is the CivilizationIV.ini file? I did a search of the Firaxis folder for *.ini and got results for every mod, but none for the vanilla *.ini.
I think it should be located in "My Documents\My Games\Civ4\". You can also look for a shortcut in the Civ4 Folder. It links directly to the ini-file in question.

I don't know if this is a bug or not. I got the tech for Fellowship of Leaves and made that my state religion. Later, I got the tech for The Order. I built several temples for both religions. After discovering Priesthood, I can build Priest of Leaves in my FoL temples but I can't build Confessors in my Order temples.
That sounds as if you didn't convert to the Order but kept Fellowship of Leaves as your state religion. You can only build priests of your state religion.

That's what I figured on priests, but I wasn't sure. Now the question arises, if I change my state religion to The Order, do the Priests of Leaves disappear? I'll have to try that.

Thanks for the location of the *.ini file.

That's what I figured on priests, but I wasn't sure. Now the question arises, if I change my state religion to The Order, do the Priests of Leaves disappear? I'll have to try that.



No, but some religious Hero units might abandon you.

Cute little bug - units don't lose their blessed status if they are attacked by a unit that then retreats. Obviously not a biggie. Back to the testing....

Cute little bug - units don't lose their blessed status if they are attacked by a unit that then retreats. Obviously not a biggie. Back to the testing....

I wonder if any spell effects get used when that happens? Not really a bug, but maybe a game engine issue where if the conflict isn't resolved it doesn't count? You get no xp if you force someone to retreat which stinks IMO.

Finished my raging barb marathon. Final stat: 3,127 barbs sent to their Maker.

One question:

Can the AI in FFh create any special barb units?

In vanilla I remember seeing barb heavy crossbowmen, camel archers, etc., but the most powerful barb I saw in FFh (unless you count Orthus) was the Orc Maceman.

The barbs would not need the resources/special bldgs to create the special units, right?

Also, do you have any comment on what I found on the Lanun/Falamar civ as far as not being attacked by barbs yet not having the BAR trait?

Thanks.

Finished my raging barb marathon. Final stat: 3,127 barbs sent to their Maker.

One question:

Can the AI in FFh create any special barb units?

In vanilla I remember seeing barb heavy crossbowmen, camel archers, etc., but the most powerful barb I saw in FFh (unless you count Orthus) was the Orc Maceman.

The barbs would not need the resources/special bldgs to create the special units, right?

Also, do you have any comment on what I found on the Lanun/Falamar civ as far as not being attacked by barbs yet not having the BAR trait?

Thanks.

The barbarian isnt as good at late game because it prioritizes units so much more than buildings that it starves itself in the late game. Which is what the barbarians are supposed to do.

I just played a game as the Lanun and I garuntee the barbarians have no problem attacking them.

Ok this is an odd thing. I have attached the games for you all to look at it. As soon as I hit the turn over button I get an odd random sound sound but its really really loud this time and the computer dosent lock but it does seem like the game freezes between turns. I reloaded it a couple of times and opened the Worldbuilder because I thought maybe one of the computer cities completed Wrath Unleashed or some similar spell. None of them were building any of them. The only other thing I can think of is its the turn I finish researching Divine Essense. I tried just waiting for the computer to catch up but it never does. Might be my computer but this is the first time this has happened to me so I do not think so.

EDIT: the picture got cut off and I used bad grammar
http://img128.imageshack.us/img128/2590/muhahahaha1nv.png (http://imageshack.us)
an impressive list of promotions ey?
are these bugs?
you can use the pollute spell on water tiles.(the ai will never be able to clean them!)
start with an archmage,with death 3, and make him into a flesh golem with something. you can use lichdom and they stlil -ends up still gaining xp and promos.... from level 1.... with all the additional promos from the golem that he can't even aquire normally...
you can summon krakens on land tiles and land units on water tiles without transports?(even fire elementals?)

well, not necesarily bugs, but:
in the loading screen it say that thing that built mages have only fireballs, but upgraded mages have haste as well... i dont think it applies to ffh2 anymore

also the message with the werewolves...
it say that units killed by werewolves became werewolves, but it should be that they become werewolves, since the past tense doesnt apply...

edit: jsut started a new game and found out that my starter elven scout doesnt have the elven trait, although i displays him correctly as elven scout

Again a percent bug:
The Tomb of Basium gives -2% Great People. It should give -2 Great People, shouldn't it?

Again a percent bug:
The Tomb of Basium gives -2% Great People. It should give -2 Great People, shouldn't it?

Thanks, it was supposed to be -25% great people.

it might not be a bug, but at least it is a huge exploit...

Scenario:

I have a neighbor, whom I want to declare war on.

Problem: He has 3-4 defensive pacts with other strong neighbours, and that is too much to handle for me.

Solution (exploit/bug): Move all military units needed for the campaign to their "starting locations". Place confessors that can cast the ring of flames along the border (haven`t tried in their land, might work there as well). As soon as one of my neighbours units are within a tile of the confessor, I cast ring of flames. My neighbor declares war. Even if I`m the aggressor, he declared war, so the defensive pacts ceases to exist, and I`m only at war with him :D

This can`t be intentional? As I see it, I actually attacks him, (even if I don`t declare war formally...) so his defensive pacts ought to be activated?

Discovered this by a mistake when I tried the ring of flames for the first time, and by accident my confessor was standing next to the worker of an AI I had a defensive pact with... But I`ve succeeded in using it later. Eases campaigns a bit.

2 bugs:
a) the AI doesnt seem to know how to use the elven improvements which leave forests... might have something to do with settings when automated workers leave forests???

b) again after regenerating a map a 3 times in the beginning, the ancient forest dont seem to grow well, i am ljosalfar, with fellowship of leaves, but forest arent growing very well and definitely arent maturing into ancient forests, although there are 7 ancient forest tiles in my territory, but those seem like theyve been there before... outer borders of my empire...

Playing as Perpentach, I was unable to select Public Healers as a civic. I had already discovered medicine, but looked in the civic screen like I had not yet discovered the technology.


I'm confused about Crusades. Is it supposed to be only accessible to the Bannor? Or does it just have certain extra effects for the Bannor? I tried it as Clan of Embers and it caused me to go from Ashen Veil to no religion for the turn of anarchy. After that turn it was back to Ashen Veil but I had lost Rosier the Fallen because of the turn with no religion.

Playing as Perpentach, I was unable to select Public Healers as a civic. I had already discovered medicine, but looked in the civic screen like I had not yet discovered the technology.


I'm confused about Crusades. Is it supposed to be only accessible to the Bannor? Or does it just have certain extra effects for the Bannor? I tried it as Clan of Embers and it caused me to go from Ashen Veil to no religion for the turn of anarchy. After that turn it was back to Ashen Veil but I had lost Rosier the Fallen because of the turn with no religion.

Only the bannor are supposed to be able to do it, I will check it out.

Okay, found the problem where it was wiping your religion. Now I need to find out why you were able to pick it in the first place.

No idesa why you were able to select it abman. Im not able to as the Clan of Embers with all the techs.

I was playing the Doveillo [sp?] the one with the barbarian trait, I started in the classical era ( with raging barbarians) & two bears then a barb horseman attacked my units. I've got two saves, the initial & one from right after it happened if you want them.

Fader

Here's a save the turn before fanaticism is discovered, at which point it'll let me try crusade. I looked at it a bit closer and it turns out that I only adopt crusade for 1 turn. I am probably able to because I am at war. For that 1 turn I lose my religion. After that turn, the game resets that civic to paganism (though I was on organized religion beforehand) and I lose my religious hero.

Kael in the last few games I have played when I finished researching Fanatisism (I think) ...whatever the tech is that allows the Bannor to get the Crusade civic. I got a pop up menu describeing the civic "Crusade" and that I could choose to change to it. I decided not too both times because I didnt want to switch at the time. Then when I would go to the civic menu I could not select it anyways. It may be that the pop up menu coming up when the tech is researched is allowing anyone to switch? Just a thought....

No idesa why you were able to select it abman. Im not able to as the Clan of Embers with all the techs.

That's why :) (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=4091946&postcount=41)

Kael in the last few games I have played when I finished researching Fanatisism (I think) ...whatever the tech is that allows the Bannor to get the Crusade civic. I got a pop up menu describeing the civic "Crusade" and that I could choose to change to it. I decided not too both times because I didnt want to switch at the time. Then when I would go to the civic menu I could not select it anyways. It may be that the pop up menu coming up when the tech is researched is allowing anyone to switch? Just a thought....

You're probably right. Hmm...

i got the same thing with the crusade option pop up and i was playing penterpach the balseraph with the leaves religion .. i didnt opt in and had no other chance to check it out

The barbarian isnt as good at late game because it prioritizes units so much more than buildings that it starves itself in the late game. Which is what the barbarians are supposed to do.

I just played a game as the Lanun and I garuntee the barbarians have no problem attacking them.

Thanks for your explanation, Kael. It is interesting that the 'barb civ' will build some large cities complete with many improved tiles if you don't go after them.

You are probably right about the Lanun/Falamar, however, here are the reasons I thought barbs were not attacking them:

1. My religion (ROK) spread to 4-5 of Falamar's cities. I have 'Show Enemy Moves' turned on. If barbs approached these ROK cities, I would have seen it.

2. By the middle of the game, I counted at least 15 Falamar cities with plenty of improved tiles. I just cannot see how anyone could protect that many cities and improvements from raging barbs. I had all I could handle protecting my measly 3 cities and still lost improvements constantly to Worg Riders and Barb Mercenaries.

3. On several occasions I would see Falamar units in my territory. With a barb unit, my unit and the Falamar unit all adjacent to each other, can you guess which unit the barb unit attacked each time. Yep, mine. I wonder if there is an AI-controlled feature that has the barbs attacking you first, then other AI players later?

Thanks again. I have started another raging barb marathon game as Flavos this time. I love the variety in units in the Calabim civ, BUT...no copper within many miles of my civ, so difficult to build the Moroi.

One question I could never find the answer to:

When starting the Custom game, the Fantasy Map (my favorite) the choices for Resources Appearances:

Illogical
Logical
Crazy

Could anyone explain this?

Thanks.

it might not be a bug, but at least it is a huge exploit...

Scenario:

I have a neighbor, whom I want to declare war on.

Problem: He has 3-4 defensive pacts with other strong neighbours, and that is too much to handle for me.



Thanks for this strategy. I will try it.

One thing that drives me crazy is how the AI creates all the Defensive Pacts in later game making it impossible to declare war on any civ, especially those bordering your civ. Civs far away may not have the Defensive Pacts, but it is a logistics pain attacking them.

The trick, as you say, is to try and get one or more of those with the Pacts to attack you.

Otherwise, the game gets a little dull IMO until you can get to some of the serious end-game features in FFh. Gotta have a bit of war to make things more fun.:lol:

Great mod. I've spent about the last hour looking through threads here to find out if what I'm experiencing is intended or truly a bug. If feels like a bug, thus my post.

Backdrop: I started a "play now" default game and took a random civ(Doviello), picked up the Runes Kilmorph and have Bambur.

Issue: I'm not entirely sure when it began, but a number of my units appear to be gaining xp for no reason. I'm not killing anything- just sitting in town. I tried to examine my civics, etc. Bambur has never seen a lick of combat yet is somewhere around 50ish xp(I think he gets 1 per turn). It doesn't seem that all of my units are gaining xp at the same rate. At first I thought I had missed assigning a promotion here or there, but it kept going back to a witch doctor I had sitting fortified and giving him promotions. I started paying more attention and thought that I had something in a city that might be doing it. So I moved Bambur out of the capital and torward the border of my future target- he's still gaining xp.

I have multiple saved games in various states. It seems out of place that my guys are just beefing up on air, and that it seemingly applies to some but not others. Have I missed something that makes this okay? A combination of some effect? I can go through my units and start tracking who is gaining and who isn't, but I figured I should check here first to make sure I'm not concerned over something intentional. Maybe there is a reason behind it that makes sense, but I haven't uncovered any general comments about units "training" during downtime.

Thanks for reading.

Welcome! Two types of units will experience this free experience:
1) Heroes, which are most unique units (only one per game) and tied either to a civ or a religion. (Balon Duin is an exception but check him out anyway!) Heroes gain 1xp per turn up to 100, plus whatever they earn through combat.
2) All spellcasters. They gain at a slower rate than heroes and cap out sooner, and since they usually don't see combat, this is likely their exclusive means of gaining new spells and abilities.

it might not be a bug, but at least it is a huge exploit...

Scenario:

I have a neighbor, whom I want to declare war on.

Problem: He has 3-4 defensive pacts with other strong neighbours, and that is too much to handle for me.

Solution (exploit/bug): Move all military units needed for the campaign to their "starting locations". Place confessors that can cast the ring of flames along the border (haven`t tried in their land, might work there as well). As soon as one of my neighbours units are within a tile of the confessor, I cast ring of flames. My neighbor declares war. Even if I`m the aggressor, he declared war, so the defensive pacts ceases to exist, and I`m only at war with him :D

This can`t be intentional? As I see it, I actually attacks him, (even if I don`t declare war formally...) so his defensive pacts ought to be activated?

Discovered this by a mistake when I tried the ring of flames for the first time, and by accident my confessor was standing next to the worker of an AI I had a defensive pact with... But I`ve succeeded in using it later. Eases campaigns a bit.

I think a similar thing happened to me when i cast wither on an opponent right before i was going to declare war on him. He declared war on me instead.

- feydras

Welcome! Two types of units will experience this free experience:
1) Heroes, which are most unique units (only one per game) and tied either to a civ or a religion. (Balon Duin is an exception but check him out anyway!) Heroes gain 1xp per turn up to 100, plus whatever they earn through combat.
2) All spellcasters. They gain at a slower rate than heroes and cap out sooner, and since they usually don't see combat, this is likely their exclusive means of gaining new spells and abilities.

Cool. Well that makes some sense and maps to what I was seeing. Thanks for the illumination.

Machiavelli would be so proud of that Ring of Flames exploit :satan:

I did some more testing with World Builder and Loki. (As I mentioned earlier, he died in one of my games although he should have escaped).

In those two cases Loki dies when he shouldn't.

1. He is surrounded by units, no matter of which civ --> even his own units stop him from escaping.

2. He is in a stack of two units and the stack is attacked --> both the defender and Loki die.

I did some more testing with World Builder and Loki. (As I mentioned earlier, he died in one of my games although he should have escaped).

In those two cases Loki dies when he shouldn't.

1. He is surrounded by units, no matter of which civ --> even his own units stop him from escaping.

2. He is in a stack of two units and the stack is attacked --> both the defender and Loki die.

Both will be fixed in the next version. I added some logic in so Loki checks out all of the surrounding tiles, he will prefer to flee into allied cities, if none of those exist he will flee into stacks of fellow units, and if those dont exist he will just run into a random tile he can get into. He has also been given 1 iCombat (but not the ability to attack) so he won't be automatically defeated if another unit in his tile is taken.

Is it intentional that Genesis plants forests on mountains but not on deserts changing into plains? I can see the idea behind it (every tile is upgraded) though forests on mountains look just weird. Though if there is a spell allowing to flatten mountains into hills (earth sphere I suppose?), then it would make perfect sense. Wait, how could anything survive when a mountain shrinks into a hill?

Is it intentional that Genesis plants forests on mountains but not on deserts changing into plains? I can see the idea behind it (every tile is upgraded) though forests on mountains look just weird. Though if there is a spell allowing to flatten mountains into hills (earth sphere I suppose?), then it would make perfect sense. Wait, how could anything survive when a mountain shrinks into a hill?

Yeah, its intentional that the forests pop on mountains. Do you guys think I should remove it?

Yeah, its intentional that the forests pop on mountains. Do you guys think I should remove it?

nah...

but now that it has come to this... i had a forest (maybe ancient) grow into the city tile for my elves... dont know if it is intended, but since the elven archers do get the woodsman promotion, it increased the defence bonus even more...

Originally Posted by Moon Hunter
as for the elven archer.. when playing as the ljosafar you get two of them... one as the religion fellowship of leaves and one as the civilization unit... but one of them starts with the woodsman 2 promotion and the other has garison promotion available, yet you can't choose which one you want to build...


I had this problem as well. Except in my situation i did fellowship of leaves first, was able to build archery range, archers, etc. But as soon as I researched the standard tech, all of my cities that were building archers said they had completed building them (they didn't) and I had to build all of the archery ranges all over again. :lol:

Suffice it to say, that slowed things down. :p

Hmm... yeah, I guess you could get into this if you build a city on 'new forest' or bloomed on a city. I'll block the bloom as I see that as a more common occurance (and its easy to fix).

I don't know if it's a bug or it's just the way civ4 works but here's my problem. I have a city in which I'm building dwarven warriors to speed up production in my remote island town. In producing city there's an obsidian gate. Right now everytime a new dwarf is built I have to manually airlift him to his destination town. Now I thought that maybe setting a rally point would work but no, units just stay in the city. They don't know how to use obsidian gate to automaticaly teleport to rally point. Now my question is this: is this a bug or not? And if it's not, can you do something about it so it will be possible to assign rally points to another town and AI would recognise obsidian gate in town and use it if it's the fastest way of reaching destination?

Machiavelli would be so proud of that Ring of Flames exploit :satan:

I guess renaming it would be the solution...

Cast the spell "machiavellian flames" :hmm:

I don't know if it's a bug or it's just the way civ4 works but here's my problem. I have a city in which I'm building dwarven warriors to speed up production in my remote island town. In producing city there's an obsidian gate. Right now everytime a new dwarf is built I have to manually airlift him to his destination town. Now I thought that maybe setting a rally point would work but no, units just stay in the city. They don't know how to use obsidian gate to automaticaly teleport to rally point. Now my question is this: is this a bug or not? And if it's not, can you do something about it so it will be possible to assign rally points to another town and AI would recognise obsidian gate in town and use it if it's the fastest way of reaching destination?

The AI doesnt use gates (airlifts). It would be nice to have but its low on the list with some other AI enhancements we want to make (I believe Chalid will be digging into these sorts of AI functions after his dragon work is finished).

Actually AI does Airlift. It uses it for Airlifting Workers as well as for defensive Airlift (lifting Defensive units that are not needed in their current city to undefended cities) as well as offensive Airlifting (lifting unit towards areas where it is palnning an attack). Unfortunteley it does not do al these thing with as much focus as a human player can do them.

I found a bug-- Playing multiplayer as the Amurites, Ashen Veil as religion. Game crashed for my position (the other player was fine) the turn I researched the Infernal Pact tech. Reloaded the autosave and switched research-- no crash.

I found a bug-- Playing multiplayer as the Amurites, Ashen Veil as religion. Game crashed for my position (the other player was fine) the turn I researched the Infernal Pact tech. Reloaded the autosave and switched research-- no crash.

Yeah there is an Ashen Veil CTD in 0.11c. It will be fixed in .12.

Elven Workers cannot build cottages on Hill /plains--is this intended? Come to think of it, I usually build mines, is this even a change?

Problem with mines: they remove the forest, so you have to re"blossom" it. Though isn't an hill the perfect place for an elven tree cottage?

Hello again. Today I've encountered a CTD. Have no idea what is causing this (it doesn't look like any crash fixed for 0.12). So I'm posting a save game from just before the crash. Just end turn and it should crash. At least it do on my computer. I hope it helps.

Is it a bug or a feature that my Scout doesn't gain experience anymore after reaching 100? Are basic units limited to 100, and will only gain more exp after upgrading?

No you wont get more than 100XP when fighting Barbarians. You have to attack other civs to get more than 100 XP.

OK ^^.

Another question: Spell extension doesn't seem to work for spring. I suppose it doesn't work for other terraforming spells either? or does it only work for "destroying" spells? While this would make sense (its much mor easy to destroy grand scale then to rebuild), maybe give an hint on that in the promotion description for spell extension?

Hope this hasn't already mentioned: Vine guardians can move if you haste them. Is this intended?

Archers can get the enchanted blade promotion if you upgrade them from warriors / bloodpuppets.

I had an undead corpse in neutral territory with slight damage; the heal option said it would take a couple of million turns to heal. I know this one's been cropping up since early in FfH1.

@kevjm:
good finds

The UNITCOMBAT should be changed on upgrad but still is not.
And the healing bug. i hope kael finds a way to disable the healing button not only if you are healthy but also if you do not heal (or heal with negative rate)

@Bastian-Bux:
Spell extension at the moment only works on "summoned" spells, (mosters and fireballs/meteors)
It will also work on targetet spells if the range limitation is in for them (is it already??)

It will not work for spells that require you to be on the same tile as the targed (Does it work for "Scorch" ? I think no.). And yes it should be mentioned in the pedia.

Archers can get the enchanted blade promotion if you upgrade them from warriors / bloodpuppets.

Interesting, but when you actually look at the archers fight they seem to use that little dagger more than the bow anyway. :rolleyes:

I agree that it should be fixed, but I wish the dagger wielding were fixed as well. End of mini-rant. :)

No you wont get more than 100XP when fighting Barbarians. You have to attack other civs to get more than 100 XP.

well i concur...
i play a standard map, custom continents-4, players 8, raging barbarians and my wariors already got 120-140 exp for just battling orc spearmen... just recently lizardmen apeared...

one more thing, maybe the promotions for basic units could get altered a bit... right now i have a warrior with all combat, march, city raider1-3 and bonus movement... right now he only gains exp from fighting barbarians who cant kill him in any way... unless there are 3 attacking him

i would recommend allowing those units to keep the exp they get, but allow for only lets say 8 promotion for basic units... due to low quality equipment
even if i get 180 exp, i should keep it, but only be able to asign promotions once upgraded to tier 2

Oh, I also noticed that there's no enchantment for cavalry weapons... or recon units, but then recon not having one is very understandable, not being 'proper' combat units. Perhaps having an enchantment spell on the summoning line, '[superlative] steed' which gives combat strength and/or an increased withdrawal chance.

@Chalid: I don't think it was to do with UNITCOMBAT, when I upgraded my bloodpuppet with the enchanted blade promotion to an archer, all the usual archer promotions became available rather than melee ones.

Thanks for the replies!

@Chalid: I don't think it was to do with UNITCOMBAT, when I upgraded my bloodpuppet with the enchanted blade promotion to an archer, all the usual archer promotions became available rather than melee ones.

Thanks for the replies!

I had misread your post and thought you had upgraded the boodpet and then enchanted the weapon (on the archer).
Ah ok i had in mind that there was a (vanilla) bug for a long time were the old UNITCOMBATS were unchanged during update. Good that that has been adressed.

The validity of Promtions is not checked for on upgrade (remember those city raider grenadiers in vanilla?), you simply keep the old ones. That is intentional. The question is is it worth cheking for those promotions you mentioned in each upgrade as the units (after the upgrade form the tier 1 units) stay in their respective unitcombat. so you will only get such effects when upgrading form the most basic units. I feel its ok that they keep their enchanted weapons that they started loving in their days as warriors/bloodpets....

I just had an interesting thing happen. I got the message saying that a distant civilization has researched philosophy, yet when I researched it fifty or so turns later, I still got a free tech. Not that I'm complaining or anything, but it seems a tad unfair.