Since RBD11 is done (Monarch OCC) I thought we could try another fast-paced game in a similar vein. Here goes an OCC game on Diety!

Civ: Egypt
Rules: OCC Standard.
Turns: Everyone plays 20 turns until 1750, when we drop to 10 turns. I'll start the ball rolling with 40 turns.

Player roster:
Zed
Shdwlord
Jaffa Tamarin
Charis
Ed Hunter

Reserve player in case of drop: Grey Fox

I'll take up to 5 players total. Spots generally reserved for RBD regulars, but if you're interested sign up and we'll sort it out at the end!

Pic of starting location:

Starting save file:

Diety? :eek: :eek: Yikes!! Well, I would be willing to give it a shot, if you still have room after the RBD regulars decide if they are going to play.

Leaping straight from Monarch to Deity, eh? Well, okay, I'm in :)

<subliminal>.. must move capital .. away from river ..</subliminal>

Excellent, been wanting to do a SG OCC and deity would be worth a shot, I'm in :P

Is it just me or does the spot directly one south look ideal, losing nothing and gaining a lot of production (*if* and only if it's still on a river).

I would have made one request if it wasn't already started (although perhaps a hex edit could do). With all my active games it's going to get REAL ugly REAL fast if I have games with two identical civs and two identical leader names. So 'Mark Antony' or 'Ramses' or 'Mistress of the Nile' for leader, or civ name change would have been a preference. Now I'll have two deity Egypt games at once. They're far enough apart in time it'll be ok, just something to keep in mind...

Woo!
Charis

I'm going to sit this one out. :) I'm all for short games, but can only take so much OCC/5CC action in a short span. (I'm really the large map kind of player, more so in general, need more stuff to micromanage, more room to explore, and play stuff like this for a change of pace -- but my pace is ready to rock at other stuff for a while now).

If you want my advice... ignore Charis ;) and move one tile to the Northeast, onto that bonus grassland. Still on the river, still on the coast, pull four hills into range and more grass, plus better shot at coal/iron/horses/saltpeter/aluminum.

Whatever you do, don't stay where you are! :lol: If you want your best shot at it, you're going to want the Colossus.


- Sirian

I'll play. Put me in Charge of the Naming New Cities Dept. :D

Yes, Sirian, I was thinking one square NW as well. You did mean NW and not NE, right? :)

I'll wait a little longer to give other people a chance to sign up before posting the roster.

Woops. Don't listen to me either! :lol: Yeah... Northwest is what I meant.

I was just judging by the picture and thought the NW grass-mine would be OFF the river. If it's on, ok... I'll buy that as best :P
Fully agree on 'stay on river' and 'hope for Colossus'

I believe we now have our five? Prepare for death or glory!!

:hammer:
Charis

Could I play?

Yea that Tile with the Bonus shield NW should be the best place to start the city at... it should be on a river.

Try and check first by rightclicking, is it a +1 Commerce tile, then it's on the river.

Ok, looks like it is:

Zed
Shdwlord
Jaffa Tamarin
Charis
Ed Hunter

Grey Fox, I'll keep you on reserve in case someone drops out.


4000 BC (0): We start on a hill overlooking a river, nice. If We move 1 square NW we get some more hills and grassland, which are always good, plus we're on a river and on the coast! Hard to beat that...

3950 BC (1): We found Thebes on the aforementioned coastal spot, and start working on an explorer. Our worker starts irrigating our wheat square, and we start researching Bronze Working for Colossus. By my count we have 5 hills and 3 bonus grasslands in range, which is are the best kinds of tiles we can get (total food+production of 4 with mines, as compared with 3 for most other terrain types) short of resource squares. The wheat will be quite handy as well.

3650 BC (7): We grow to size 2, and boost lux to 20% to keep up with happiness.

3550 BC (9): Our scouting warrior is complete and starts heading south, and we start on a military police warrior.

3450 BC (11): Our cultural borders expand, and we spot a goody hut to the north... but our warrior's already going south. Oh well, at the latest we'll get that goody hut the next time our borders expand. :)

3350 BC (13): We complete a military police warrior and start a worker. Our south-exploring warrior spots another goody hut.

3250 BC (15): Our exploring warrior pops the hut & gets barbarians! Good thing he's on a hill...

3200 BC (16): Our warrior defeats all 3 barbarians without a scratch, and becomes elite in the process! Good show. We build a worker and start a temple.

3050 BC (19): Our warrior spots a wandering barbarian and kills him, taking 2 damage. He then spots another goody hut!

3000 BC (20): We discover Bronze Working and start on the Alphabet. Another wandering barbarian shows up to challenge our wounded warrior. We find a hill to fortify on and wait for him, and we spot the camp from which he originated.

2900 BC (22): Our fortfied warrior easily defeats the attacking barbarian and even gains a hp back! A Japanese settler pair comes within our vision radius; of course they are annoyed with us and don't want to trade us anything for Masonry. We pop the goody hut and get... a settler! Well he can help us grow once we get beyond size 6.

2850 BC (23): Japan founds Satsuma right next to our settler. Thebes grows to size 4, completes a temple, and starts a spearman for military police. Our warrior moves to a mountain overlooking the barb camp, and our settler is on his way back home.

2800 BC (24): Our warrior attacks the barb camp and disperses it, losing an hp in the process. Another barbarian shows up near our city.

2750 BC (25): Our worker explores the goody hut north of Thebes and it contains... another settler!

2710 BC (26): Thebes completes a spearman, and starts the Colossus. Our spearman rushes out to attack the barbarian and kills him without taking a scratch; unfortunately he doesn't get promoted. Our exploring warrior spots another barb camp.

2630 BC (28): Japanese warriors beat us to the barb camp. Our settler spots more Minoans heading toward our capital.

2470 BC (32): Our spearman smacks a barb warrior, another is on its way.

2390 BC (34): Our exploring warrior spots some American warriors.

2230 BC (38): Thebes grows to 7. We merge in 2 settlers and grow to 11! Colossus in 7. :hammer: Of course, we're running 50% lux to keep that many people happy... :( hopefully Colossus will help with that. Japan is building the Oracle. We could probably grab that if we could get the tech from them. We really want to get in contact with more people to lower the costs on already-discovered tech.

2150 BC (40): Nothing new, end of my turn. Alphabet and Collossus in 5 turns. We're heading for the Great Library next, though we might build Oracle on the way if we can trade for the tech. We can use the Pyramids to prebuild for other wonders, though we don't want the Pyramids since they'll set off our Golden Age. No new Minoan barbs have shown up recently, it's possible the Americans wiped out their camp. Keep exploring with that warrior for new civs to contact!

Well you're off to a grand start! Very nicely done, Zed. :beer:

You know, I'm kind of a bit worried about how fast the AI can build stuff and research tech on Diety. They get an awful big production bonus, and with fast research the cascade could be a brutal thing... let's beeline for Literature (make sure to buy Alphabet/Writing/Literature if possible to speed our research up) and make *certain* we get the Great Library, rather than making side trips to grab Oracle. Once we get that we want to make sure we have shields saved up for the Hanging Gardens if possible (of course we need a Library in there too.)

Great start Zed! I wish the best of luck to you all! I will be monitering this thread the whole time.

got it

"Shadow, wake up" the servant called from just outside the door in a musical elven voice.

"What is it Tymora?" Shadow answered groggily.

"Its the Egyptian m'lord, they are without guidance. It seems that their leader was carried off by a pack of mad camels."

"Very well," Shadow sighed, quickly dressing. He glanced at Tymora as he opened the door. "Elf this time?"

"Well milord, a girl has the right to change her appearance however she wishes, doesn't she?"

Chuckling, Shadow heads to his personal library, followed by Tymora. Sitting in his favorite chair, he gazes into the crystal ball on the desk. "Aye, I see what you mean. At least the last pharoh left the Egyptians in good shape."

Chanting a few mysterious words, Shadow opens a gate into the palace of Thebes, gives Tymora some last minute instructions on running things around the castle, and steps though the gateway.

Shocked servants in Thebes stare in awe at the mysterious stranger, but quickly realize that he must lead the land at the mysteriuos absence of their previous leader. Proclaimations are sent throughout the city, Shadow Lord is now the Pharoh.

Studying the reports coming in from the warrior out exploring the land, Shadow orders the warrior to ignore the 6 American warriors around him, to fortify until healed, and continue his exploration.

2) 2070 Working with the wise ones of the land, Shadow shows them how to use letters instead of pictures to communicate. Their is great joy in the land. They hire several of the story tellers, and attempt to train them in the art of writing. 30% of the treasury is invested in their training, and they should have mastered this art in 39 turns.

5) 1950 "Joyous news Pharoh, the workers say that they have completed the Colossus" "That is great news," Shadow says smiling. "Now tell them to begin a barracks, to train our troops." "Yes milord," they answer, still stumbling over the title that Shadow still insists upon.

6) 1910 "Pharoh Shadow, we have disturbing news. The Japanese are constructing the Pyramids" "They are, ar they," ponders Shadow.

7) 1870 Shadow steps into his private chambers, once again opening a gateway. Stepping through the gateway, Shadow completely surprises the leader of the Americans. "Look Abe, the Japanese are building the pyramids, wishing to control the great wonders that are capable of being built. I was wondering, could I hire a few of your wisest men to teach my people the science of mysticism?"

"Ahh, how did you get in here," Lincoln finally mangaes to studder.

"Forget about that, how much gold would it take to hire the teachers?"

Lincolns eyes suddenly light up. "Gold? Hmmm, 50 gold."

"Done!" Shadow exclaims.

Taking the American teachers back with him, he orders them to direct the construction of the Oracle, ignoring the complaints of the stone masonry guild that they had been busy collecting materials for a barracks.

"Just use the gathered stone to complete the Colossus," shadow orders.

"As you wish milord, but it will take 18 turns"

14) 1650 "Milord, The Americans have started the Pyramids, whatever shall we do?"

Shadow Lord smiles at them. "Do you really want tall triangle buildings disturbing the tranquility of our skyline?"

"Oh no, of course not" the messangers quickly say. Then after a few quick whispers amongst themselves, they ask "Milord, what is a skyline?"

Shaking his head, Shadow retires to his bed chambers for the night.

17) 1575 "Great news Pharoh, the story tellers have mastered the arts of writing. But they have become eccentric, wishing now to call themselves authors, and going out to construct something they call great works of Literature."

"Thats wonderful," Shadow says knowingly.

"But Pharoh..." Noting an arched eyebrow from the pharoh, they stop in mid sentence.

"I said thats wonderful."

"As you say, that is wonderful," the wise ones quickly say, bowing as they back out of the room.

20) 1500 "Pharoh, our warrior has disturbing reports, the American borders have expanded, and he is trapped in their territory. Pharoh? Pharoh, where are you?"

Gazing at them through the crystal ball in his own castle, Shadow and Tymora are lost in their own thoughts

Suddenly, Tymora looks up at Shadow. "Should you have just left them like that?"

Shadow smiles. "Tymora, the signs were right, there is now another pharoh ready to lead them. His name is Jaffa. He will guide the Egyptians to their rightful glory."

...for living over the other side of the world. Guess I'll just have to join (or create) the next rbd game.

Heya, smegged. Have you gotten a copy of Civ III now? Last I remember you were itching at the seams playing Civ2 and dreaming up Civ3 variants. :)

There are openings in RBD16 still... better hurry. :)

- Sirian

**TWO** settlers from goody huts in a OCC game, to go along with the flipped-Persian city in the rbd9 5CC that would have crumbled his attack... gah!

SUPER start Zed, and good followup Shadow. A size 11 city surrounded by hills and grassland mines, ya we got decent production. (Good thing we picked to found on a river, hehe)

The GL and perhaps hanging gardens would serve us very nicely. Soon Republic or Monarchy would help a city of this size a lot too.
Glad to see a rax and some defenders soon, the AI's must think we're a pushover.

Charis

Save game, ex-otter :)

:rotfl:
:rotfl:
:rotfl:

Hmm, both Japan and America are already working on Pyramids. We'll have to see how things are looking when we get closer to having Oracle done... we do NOT want to get that if it will cost us the Great Library. I'm still worried about how fast the AIs are researching stuff.

Well, ummm. Ummm, I say again.

Inherited turn. 5 turns from Oracle, 15 from Literature. Not sure if the Pyramids will hold out long enough to be used as a GL placeholder on this schedule. I figure our best chance of getting GL is to build up cash so we can buy Lit as soon as it becomes available.

Science tax reduced to zero. I turn our entertainer into a scientist, just so as to have him do something useful.

1400BC (turn 4). We built the Oracle. Still no sign of Lit on the trade screens. Start on Pyramids as placeholder.

1225BC (turn 11). Japan has finished the Pyramids. Oh, ack. I use our stored up cash to buy Pottery from Japan (WM+19g), and Mapmaking from USA (WM+140g), and switch us to Great Lighthouse, again as placeholder. Start science again -- Lit comes in 12 turns, one turn ahead of Lighthouse (after I move a citizen from a hill to the coast).

1200BC France has completed the Great Library. ACK! :( :( Probably cascade from the Pyramids.

Don't think there's anything I could have done about that, seeing as this is 2 turns ahead of us getting Lit on the original schedule, and our local Civs still don't have it :(

I turn off our science budget again. We're still building Lighthouse, but Hanging Gardens would be better. The only way we're going to get that is by buying techs.

1175BC Indians finish Great Wall. Cascade again, I guess.

At end of my turn, I bought Warrior Code (40g) and Polytheism (8gpt) from Japan. Both Japan and USA have Monarchy, but want an arm and a leg and a first-born son (to get them to offer a deal at all, you have to go and set our luxury tax down to zero before talking to them), so we could get Hanging Gardens, but I haven't committed us to it. If not, we get Great Lighthouse in two turns.

Save game (ex-otter) up a couple of posts :)

PS: our wandering warrior was pushed out twice by Lincoln, and is now fortified in no-man's-land between Japan and America.

I've been watching this game too. Nice challenge! Good Luck!

I played a few turns myself (Gee, the computer is a *LOT* nicer to me on Diety than in Civ2 (a little **TOO** nice! :crazyeyes ). One contact, and everyone declared war in 2. Here, it's demanding world maps at the most), and I must say, that's one bueatiful continent! :) (I won't spoil the rest for you, though).

Again, good luck! I'll have to try this sort of challenge soon. (on an easier level, of course!).

1000 BC (0) - Charis Antony took the reigns of power, after making a
play (as it were) with Cleopatra. He was a bit of a control freak,
and liked to manage just one city, but manage it well. He brought
together his advisors...

What to do about the wonder? Extra ship movement to places we can't
settle? 4 vs 2 culture and three happy faces. A partial-GA set-off with
the industrious gardens. I'm thinking the latter if at all possible.

Spearman and a warrior??? Let's hope they don't SNEEZE at us!

No embassies?? No wonder they're not happy. Hrmmm, can we afford
the knowledge?

Abe wants world map, 71 gold, 10 gpt. Even 81 won't close the deal
on Toku, so Abe it is.

Gasp, that's tight finances. We then reset slider off zero, to 20%,
put one citizen as entertainer, and have 10 gpt in treasury and -1 gpt
deficit. Gardens due in 2 turns with food deficit of one.
I just wish Japan was the trademaker, since Abe is polite, Toku is
annoyed, and the annoyed one is on our doorstep.

I realize we have the Oracle, a relig wonder. The gardens **will** set off
our Golden Age, so we take one turn out to revolt and have Monarchy going.

975 BC (1) - Japan founds Bizen to the North and compresses our border slightly.
Lincoln's politeness sure didn't last long, he's annoyed again :P
Being relig, we knew the anarchy was one round. Good thing - we were JUST
able to not starve and have deficit equal to whole treasury :P Coming out
now, we're at 0 treasury but +4 surplus.

925 BC (3) - Now we're rocking!! 29 shields per turn. Great Lighthouse due
in just 9! Treasury 8, surplus +20/turn, zero science because I think it
will be too tight to lighthouse. The Gardens let us get away with 10% lux.

875 BC (5) - Bombay completes Great Lighthouse. oops!! Just 7 turns short,
bummer. Now what can we hock for tech?! :P Nothing. Excellent, no shields
lost by switching to harbor :rolleyes:

Japan greets us as polite, and "What can unworthy Japan do?" Huh?
America is up to cautious from annoyed? Uh, ok, that's good. (What did I do?)

800 BC (8) - Americans start SunTzu while we start barracks?
We top off literature from Japan for 20 gold and 1 gpt. (He was annoyed
again, how fickle) Establish embassy with Washington- SunTzu in 42.

775 BC (9) - Buy contact with French and give her some gpt for Math.
Other known civs (well, not fully known to us) are Indians, Persians,
English and Romans.

750 BC (10) - Japan is building Sistine (and Sun), French Sun Tzu, and
Sistine. Bought contact with English. The more civs we know the cheaper
ALL techs are to research and to buy, very nice...

A spear is due in 1, so we can have a smidge better defense and can disband
that warrior scout who will soon be trapped in enemy territory.

The citizens are working for maximum cash right now, the last two items
we've actually been overproducing shields for. After a spearman (or two)
a library is almost surely next.

This is rough... can't get anything to build, our GA production will soon
go to waste after the library is done. Our economy is in the tank until the
gpt deals run out. Then again, if we WERE rich, they would just extort us
mercilessly! On the plus side, we've got some very good culture generators
that will kick in nicely when 1000 years old.

Techs? Currency for marketplace is a key. Iron Working shouldn't be neglected
in case we DO have iron, it's a shield bonus on a hill as well as ability
to make swordsmen and later pikes.

Good luck,
Charis

730 BC: Thebes builds spearman, starts on library
690 BD: Nada
670 BC: Zilch
650 BC: Library finished Spearman Started
630 BC: Japs demand 4 gold. What choice do we have..?
610 BC: Sistine Chapel started on by Engrish
590 BC: Japs start leo's We have no money, and are getting more money at a stead rate of 0 gpt, and thats with 0% sci!
570 BC: Aha! My superior Pecuniary skills prevail! We can get +1 a turn and have science at the small cost of... Starvation?
550 BC: No! Thebe is growing! In merely 19 turns! POOT!
530 BC: ??? How come all of asudden we are getting +19 a turn? aha! Our deal has finally terminated. Phew! We get currency for 21 gold and 6 gpt. With 10% science philoshophy will be ours in 11 turns.


There. Gwaaaargh!

Got it.

Ok, the good news and the bad news...

The good news is, we now have contact with all other civs, and we are in the Middle Ages. Probably we ought to have done this sooner -- getting contact first and tech later. Tech prices have dropped from absurd to theoretically possible for us to afford... at least for the moment. They will jump back up again soon as we start to get into the more expensive techs. Unfortunately, our income isn't going to go up any before Banking (well maybe a bit if we go to Republic.) We also have Iron on our lands. I pillaged it for the moment to ensure it doesn't run dry before we get to Factories/Rails, but we could see if anyone needs it and try to sell it for a bit more cash.

The bad news is, we officially suck. :) I had to go on WEALTH for a number of turns simply because we hadn't researched any city improvements to build, and we couldn't afford any more military since all our gold was going to other civs! Several turns later some of those gpt deals ended so I brokered some more to get us contact with other civs and enough tech to build a colliseum. Once that was done I prebuilt a courthouse for a couple turns to gather a bit of cash to soften the gpt cost of Monotheism for a cathedral.

Now we're back to building a courthouse placeholder and having most of our income going out on gpt deals, so we can't go too much further in that direction. We might be able to swing buying our way to Education for University, and if we wait long enough for some of our deals to expire we can then go for Banking.
The really bad news is we're going to totally miss out on the Middle Ages wonders. There is NO WAY we can afford enough cash to buy the necessary tech in time, and there is NO WAY we can compete with the AI civs on production rate now, PLUS the cascade is in full swing. So, looks like culture victory is out -- the AIs will have a space victory before we even get close. That leaves Diplo victory as the only possible escape valve. I'm not sure if we can possibly pull that off but I guess we'll see.


On another note, really what killed us was building the Oracle. I tried again from just after my first turn and skipped the Oracle, and beelined for Literature as fast as I could. I wound up getting it a few turns before finishing my Pyramids placeholder, swapped to Great Library, and life was rosy from then on. Next up was Hanging Gardens (triggering Golden Age), then a galley for exploring and Great Lighthouse. I was first to make contact with the other civs so I was able to get maps & contact for not too expensive a cost, and got caught up on early Middle Ages tech. Built a Cathedral before my Golden Age expired and then managed to snag Sistine out of the AI cascade (I thought I'd have to settle for Bach for sure, but the AIs built Sun Tzu and Leo instead of Sistine first.)

Right now I've paused that game to let this one get ahead. Time-wise, it's roughly where we are now (actually 90bc, so a couple turns ahead.)

Zed
Shdwlord <<<< Up
Jaffa << On Deck
Charis
Ed Hunter

got it

Inherited: set city production for max commerce. bought theology, republic, engineering, and a worker from america for 16 gold and 10 gpt. went into anarchy. Hired an entertainer to keep from going into disorder.

1) 130 Became a republic. Switched to max production.
English complete the Sistine Chapel. Romans switch to Bach's.

2) 110 Feudalism/Education purchased from french for 6 gold & 6 gpt. Switched to building a university.
Japan has finished Leo's and started Smith's. French are building Bach's and Smith's. The Indian's have finished Copernicus's Observatory, started Bach's and Smith's. Persians have started Bach's and Smith's. English are building Bach's and Smith's.

3) 90 Purchased Banking from India for 5 gpt. Switched to bank in Thebes.

4) 70 Paris has finished Bach's. India, Persia, English switched to Smiths. English start Magellan's.

5) 50 Japanese are building Smith's. American's are building Smith's.

6) 30

7) 10 Invention, Astronomy, and Printing Press purchased from France for WM, 4 gold, and 9 gpt.
America and France have signed a peace treaty. Japan has finished Smith's. French switch to Magellan's.

8) 10 AD

9) 30 Japan demands our entire treasury, 2 gold. we give it to him. Indians begin Shakespeare's.

10) 50 some per turn deals must have ended as our gold jumps up from 1 gpt to 15 gpt.

Well, we're sort of in a hole. Good news, nobody is attacking us, and we've almost bought our way into the industrial age (only need Theory of Gravity).

Bad news, we're broke and have no defence.

Japan destroyed America, which saved us some cash (had I known, I'd have bought a lot more techs from Lincoln :) ).

For diplo victory, we have to build the United Nations ourselves. There's no way we'll get into the vote otherwise.

Charis up.

250 AD (0) - Ugh!! Two saltpeter visible onscreen, and none in our land.
Gollllleee are we thin on defense. The strategic box is empty, and no luxuries,
weeee!! Ugh!! Look at Japan, our nearest neighbor, on the histograph!
Finances? We're flat broke too. After this catpult is finished we'll have
0 surplus. We're SO far behind in tech, after Theory is finished, may as
well set slider to zero for next half-dozen or so techs. It costs 1/2 as much
to buy as to research, and we're not getting there first to sell anyway.

260 AD (1) - Since corruption is 2 commerce, I build a courthouse. Not much
else to do.

270 AD (2) - Japan and Persia sign an MPP (ouch) and India wants to talk to us.
Gandhi offers us Music Theory for 1 gold. Are we THAT pitiful?! Out of sheer
politeness we accept.

300 AD (5) - That courthouse cut one shield waste too, good. Switch to Wealth
and set citizens for maximum revenue rather than shields.. (gasp)
Hmm, if we're going to do that, set an entertainer up and reduce lux % to zero.

310 AD (6) - Gonna hook up the iron, upgrade to pike, disconnect :P

330 AD (8) - Top off Theory of Grav, we're now in the Industrial Age :hammer:
Even spending real cash it's 40 turns to Steam Power. With **zero** to build
we're going max revenue, one entertainer and one scientist, 31 surplus.

350 AD (10) - Pikeman cuts the iron, warrior upgraded to Swordsman. Head back
to town next turn while workers re-do the mine.

Democracy can be bought for around 150ish gold when we accumulate that. Soon
some deals should end I hope and our surplus will get bigger.

Zed << On Deck
Shdwlord
Jaffa
Charis
Ed Hunter <<< up

Good luck,
Charis

Ed! Where are you, Ed??? You're up!

If we don't hear from you tonight, we'll skip to... I guess that would be me. :)

Looking at our situation, we're wasting a ton of potential shields to get a few more gold, but I guess that's what we need right now. Nevertheless I veto the scientist and tax collector and just run 10% lux and expect to buy tech; in fact we're making money slightly faster that way! We're not even using our river tiles, and they're worth 4 gold same as the coast -- we could be getting some extra shields here with no loss of income, so we might as well.

At the beginning of my turn I notice we have almost no workers with which to build rails, so I skim some off the top while I build up the gold to purchase Steam Power. I don't like giving away gpt deals (you generally pay more and are less flexible with future spending) so we'll avoid that for now. Getting bullied for 20 or 30 gold here and there is not going to make enough of a dent in our income to matter. :p While I'm waiting I work on rearranging some of our tile improvements for flexibility once we have rails. Once I've got the gold built up I purchase Steam Power from France, then turn around and trade it to England for their territory map, Democracy, and Military Tradition. I hold off on revolting so we can build up gold to get coal -- a couple turns later I purchase coal from Persia, start the workers on Rails, and revolt to Democracy.

The rest of the turn was building up gold again while working on the railroad. I've got our rail net nearly complete in just 8 turns with the extra workers and the Democracy boost. For grins I built an Ironclad to guard our harbour. :) Then at the end of my turn I had accumulated enough gold for Industrialization, so I bought that from France and then traded it plus some minor gpt to England for Nationalism. I swap all our city workers to max shields and we can get a Factory in 6 turns.

Looking forward, it seems like ToE is within the realm of possibility if we can afford the tech, providing we get our factory and coal plant built in time. If we can pull it off it would be an enormous help, as denying Hoover to the AI and pulling in major gpt from selling the tech would be huge; it might even give us enough cash to bribe our way to a diplo win. The AIs are all building suffrage but hopefully it will be done before SciMethod is discovered (or after we build ToE...) It would be nice if England were wiped out -- they're down to 1 city and can't research anything, but they're preventing us from getting last-civ prices for tech. I think we've pretty much got everything useful we can get out of them, except their world map. Maybe we can persuade someone to do the dirty deed? :sniper:


Zed
Shdwlord <<< up
Jaffa << On Deck
Charis
Ed Hunter

Shdwlord? It's been 24 hrs, where are you?

Jaffa, you're on deck, so be ready to take over if Shdwlord is AWOL...

Sorry, my son has been sick all weekend, he is only 16 months. Kathie works 12 hour shifts on the weekends, so I have been watching him pretty much by myself, and he isn't sleeping more than 2 hours at a time. Go ahead and skip me this time, and sorry about the delay :(

No problem, RL comes first, of course! Sorry to hear your little one is sick. Ours had a fever this weekend as well, but it seems to have been the 24-hr variety, so it's not so bad. She got really sick a few weeks ago though...

Built factory, built coal plant.

Established our first embassy! In Kyoto, which upgraded Mr T from annoyed to cautious.

Trained one of our pikemen in the use of the rifle, to enhance AI deterrence factor.

Traded our iron+15gpt to the French for Medicine and Electricity (I don't see us needing iron in the next 20 turns). Bought Sanitation for 200g-odd from Japan.

Started on hospital. We could afford to buy SciMeth and go for ToE, but I don't rate highly our chances of getting it. One or more of the AIs must be close to finishing Suffrage by now, and ToE will almost certainly vanish in cascade.

Zed
Shdwlord
Jaffa
Charis <<< up
Ed Hunter << On Deck

650 AD (0) - Why are the workers sleeping OUTSIDE the city??? Don't invite
AI aggression - you know how they love to eat unguarded workers :P (Is it a slave trade thing?)
(Hmmm, that's one depressing histograph, eh? :P ) Everyone is on Suffrage
and Xman is on ToE already. No chance there. More wait and see it seems.

660 AD (1) - You got your wish, the "rampaging Roman forces have destroyed
the English!" We also get to see a Roman 'Army' rummaging about Syracuse.
Hmmm we could complete Suffrage in just 11 turns? Hmmmmmm...
Persia just now completed it. Romans cascade to ToE. We lose our coal.
Have essentially nothing to build, go wealth and high food and look to grow.
Everyone else starts or switches to ToE.

680 AD (3) - I add three workers back to the city, to get us larger and with
higher revenue quicker. Can pop 'em back out later if needed.

Let's see what techs are we missing:
Useless and optional: Chivalry, Econ, Nav, Free Arts, Communism
Optional, perhaps useful: Espionage
Needed: Replacement parts, Sci Method, Corporation.

Gandhi offers parts for 200 gold and 22 gpt. That'll work.

We have no rubber. Is this any surprise?

690 AD (4) - Japan declared war on the Persians.
I notice, tis cheaper to rebuild rifles and artillery from scratch than
pay to upgrade.

720 AD (7) - India joins Persia in the fight vs Japan!

Realize we may well want Espionage, both for steal tech or sabotage reasons,
as well as to have Intelligence agency to use as a (short) prebuild for a wonder.

730 AD (8) - We buy espio for just 100 gold from Rome. Then establish an
Embassy there.

750 AD (10) - Now France wants a piece of Japan, and declare :hammer:
Sci Method cost has dropped to about 100 gold and 9 gpt. We buy from
our close neighbor and (cough) friend, Japan. Likewise the Corporation
for 6 gold and 11 gpt, but this time from France.

Ed Hunter - are ya there? UP (Zed on Deck)

There ya go...
Charis

Hopefully Ed can show up this time, though I haven't seen any posts of his around recently.

Note to Grey Fox: if Ed is a no-show again this turn, do you want to jump in and take his spot? Inquiring minds want to know!

Oh Ye of Little Faith :( . I have the game, and the post will be up shortly.

I missed a turn? :eek: Truly sorry. I have been checking the forums, but I forgot how fast a 10 turn per player game can go :(

760 AD: Delhi completes TOE. Some other people start hoover. Thebes builds a rifleman, starts on artillery
770 AD: ARtillery finished, we start on Intelligence agency
780 AD: Not much
790 AD: Ditto
800 AD: The Same
810 AD: Nothing :)
820 AD: We complete intelligence agency in Thebes. For lack of a better choice, we start on wealth.
830 AD: Xerxes extorts 23 gold from us :(. India and Japan sign peace treaty
840 AD: India and Rome sign MPP. I get away with giving India 2 gold tribute
850 AD: N0-thing

Heh, Ed, it's 20 turns per player until 1750 ad, or the game ends, whichever comes first. :)

Got it.

Well, looks like we are too far behind the 8-ball to come back now...

India and Rome are in the Modern age. We are still several techs away from the same, though so are Japan, Persia, and France. I don't see how we're going to be able to afford to buy tech fast enough to catch up, and still have enough cash left over to butter enough civs up to gracious with RoPs and cash gifts so they'll vote for us. Not to mention we no longer have the Intelligence Agency to use for prebuilding purposes.

We have one, slim, chance: France is currently under assault from Persia. If we save up our cash and, just as France is about to be wiped out, we give them gpt deals for all their tech, then those deals will be cancelled when France bites it, and we can use our stored up cash to get out of the industrial age and maybe get Fission (assuming it's available.) Of course, Persia's going to take a number of turns to wipe France out, so we'll have to hope that the AIs don't research Fission and start the UN anytime soon.

If that doesn't work, it's the Space Race, and I don't have any illusions about a OCC civ winning that on Deity. We probably will have the dubious honor of being the first succession game on the board to actually lose. :)

There was already a loss -
Higher lever game, where the AI turned,
and the game was given up on.

LK, what do you mean, higher lever (level?) game, where the AI turned? I don't understand your terminology. What's higher level than Deity? How can the AI "turn"?

Originally posted by lkendter
There was already a loss -
Higher lever game, where the AI turned,
and the game was given up on.

Well, if you gave up, you didn't actually lose, so we can still be the first to do that :)

got it

Inherited: Purchased economics from france for 60 gold.

1) 1060 We went from +88 gpt to +95 gpt. Trade India our world map for free artistry. France only has 4 cities left.
We caught Ghandi trying to plant a spy.

2) 1070 Our ironclad continues exploring.

3) 1080 The persians have captured Lyons.

4) 1090 The Persians have captured Rheims.

5) 1100 Purchased combustion from france for 19 gpt.
Persians capture paris.

6) 1110 Purchased Atomic theory and mass production from france for 39 gpt. Purchase electronics for 22 gpt. Purchase Radio for 18 gpt + 97 gold. We now have a 0 gpt income. Research on motorized transportation begun.
France has been destroyed. Too bad they didn't have flight or motorized transportation to purchase before their demise.

7) 1120 I purchase wines from japan for 30 gold. Wow, thats only 1.5 gpt. They are now polite with us. Dyes and silks cost us 25 gold each. Luxuries lowered to 10%. Incense, spices, and ivory purchased from rome for 150 gold. Luxury rate set to 0.

8) 1130 Iron clad continues exploration.

9) 1140 Iron clad continues exploration.
Romans begin the United Nation.

10) 1150 Well, I don't see any choice now. Flight and motorized transportation purchased from india for 45 gpt.

India has the best price for fission, our entire treasury (1043) + 30 gpt. Rome and Japan want 41 gpt. Persia doesn't have fission yet. The only placeholder we have is an airport, it takes 2 turns to build. I set Thebes to an airport in case the next leader wants to see if persia can somehow acquire fission in the next turn and drop the price for us.

From the thread
Originally posted by gonzo_for_civ
Sorry guys, the blitzkreig came out of nowhere! The germans declared war in 1784 with units already in our territory. I was busy upgrading our defenses but after 1788 I had to throw in the towel. Russia had just declared war on us and taken 5 cities as well. We lost about 20 cities in one turn and after 1788 we only had 3 cities left, even our capital was sacked. I was forced to throw in the towel. It is sad to admit it but we were beaten, there was NO hope at all for a recovery especially on Monarch level.

Sorry guys, it was out of my hands.:( :cry:

P.S. Maybe we should take 1 step back to regent. :(

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=213583#post213583

Ah, so you meant higher level as in higher level than you normally play, and turned as in turned on you, i.e. sneak attacked you. Gotcha.

Where is Rome building UN? If it's a relatively unimproved city we might have a chance!

0) 1150AD We buy the Roman territory map for 100g, and have a look at Cumae. Size 7. We should be able to beat them...

Japanese and Indians start on UN (in Kyoto and Madras, respectively).

1) 1160AD Oh well. Buy Fission from Gandhi for 1007g+32gpt. Start on UN (12 turns).

2) 1170AD Our gpt goes negative :eek: Ummmmm, oops? How did that happen? Oh, right. We lost gpt from Wealth.

We lose our barracks to support our spending :( I sell off our granary for next turn.

A worker digs a mine which puts us in food shortage, but gets UN one turn earlier.

3) 1180AD We sell off our last remaining pikeman, and sell a worker to Gandhi (20g).

4) 1190AD Japan declares war on India.

10) 1250AD Persia demands our treasury as tribute. We give in, which upgrades him from annoyed to cautious. We lose an artillery unit.

11) 1255AD We build UN this turn. Okay, who will be our opponent? Either Japan or Rome, I guess.

Give our WM to everyone, and a worker each to Japan and Rome (strangely, the workers don't appear in the list for donating to India and Persia. Why not?)

We build the UN.

Both Japan and Rome get into the vote. Erf. I forgot that could happen.

How long is it between chances for a UN vote? 10 turns, so our the next shot will be in 1305?

As things stand, we could probably get Gandhi on our side by allying with him against Japan (on the turn the vote's going to happen, and hope that Japan doesn't wipe us out immediately).

What to do about Xerxes, I'm not sure. Don't really have anything to donate to him, except cash.

Zed
Shdwlord
Jaffa
Charis <<< up
Ed Hunter << On Deck

Hrm! Things are getting interesting! Bold move Jaffa, I like it!!
:hammer:

UN Votes are every ten turns, so I'll see one at end of my turn.
That vote didn't look too encouraging though. I've got not one but *TWO* diplo wins as the final player this week, LOTR1 and Babylonian Utopia, so now I'll try for three :P

Got it.

Charis

Another Brilliant Jaffa Deity Turn! :hammer: :cooool:

Charis the Diplomat: you also got the last turn in RBD7.

Woohoo, we lucked out! Talk about pulling a rabbit out. Good thing the Romans didn't start building the UN in Rome. :)

Well, things are looking *much* better now. Now we just need to wait for these gpt deals to expire and build up some cash for RoPs, lux purchases, and gifts for the next vote. BTW, we may not want to do anything too drastic to get that last vote just yet, like declaring war, as we still should have a goodly amount of time before any of the AIs can put a space victory together, so we can take a couple kicks at this particular can if necessary.

Charis Antony stepped up to the plate, for the times required the
touch of a diplomat.

1260 AD (0) - Times are Rough. That's with a capital 'R'. Our treasury
stands at 1 gold coin, and our income is 1 gold from a tax collector!
We've sold our barracks and even our granary, and (sniff) sold some workers
into slavery. Thebes is running a food deficit and needs to pop out a worker
just to have someone change a tile back to irrigation.

Still... getting the UN was a major coup! That's like getting the Olympic
Committee to choose Fargo... for the SUMMER olympics! Now... how on earth
can we go about winning the election? Simple, if we live that long. We
need friends. How do you make friends in this sad, dog-eat-dog world?
You scratch their backs. We don't need true friends, life-long friends,
friends that will be there for you when no one else is. The people our
our great nation do, but (sniff) it's lonely at the top.

I switch to wealth for one turn, to get out of this insane budget crunch,
before coming back to the worker.

What's the plan? Cut science, cut everything not essential, and start
being friendly. At present it's a three person race, with us, Rome and Japan
voting for ourselves. Gandhi and (gasp) Xerces will decide the victor.
That is... unless one of the other two falls behind and goes <25%. Japan
will not, with about 33% of score and power. Rome seems just above 25 and is
dropping. Perhaps they will will get knocked out of contention. If they do,
their vote will mean something, and if it's against Japan, so much better.

The world has no alliances. And no wars except one, Japan vs India. We make
the rounds. Japan is polite, but we have nothing to offer (I suspect this will
become a theme) other than an ally vs India (no way). India likewise, and
would accept an alliance vs Japan (not yet Gandhi, but we'll consider it)
Persia is cautious and seeks no alliances. Our hope there is that they get
into a war (a decent bet with Xerces!) Rome is polite, and owns a large
chunk of the land mass. I doubt they'll get booted off the ballot.
What expires soon? Wine, dyes and silks from Japan in 5 turns, and we'll have
nothing to pay for a continuation. (Ouch) In 9 turns we'll get back 87 gpt
in payments to Gandhi. In 5 turns, Incense, Spices and Ivory from Rome will
expire. Let me get that straight... in 5 turns we lose ***six*** luxuries
and have no chance to buy? I smell rioting :eek:

1265 AD (1) - Rome and Japan sign a military alliance against India!!
And Mahatma voted for Caesar last time too...

Well that's great news!! That'll let us put Gandhi in our pocket! Now
how can we get Persia? We'll want to find out before 1305, or delay it.

This turn we'll rebulid the granary.

1270 AD (2) - Madras complete SETI, Persia starts... Manhattan :eek:
So does Rome.

1275 AD (3) - Japan starts Manhattan too. Er...

Persia FINISHES Manhattan! (Cascade from SETI I guess)
For us, back to wealth.

1280 AD (4) - Pollution on our iron square. Lovely.

1285 AD (5) - I get the type of message you usually get during a sneak
attack. "You lost your supply of xxx." Six times. :eek:
Just deals expiring, but... I look nervously at the city screen.
Hmm... no disaster? It will take a turn to kick in...

1290 AD (6) - The unhappiness kicks in now. All white and blue.
It would take 20% lux at -27 gpt to keep 'em happy. It's deal or revolt.
Japan is annoyed and Rome is cautious. It's the deal expiration.
Well we're just not trying to make those two clowns happy. They can deal
with the anger. Gandhi otoh... we buy his furs for his asking price, a
mere 22 gold. (Gosh it's cheap when you only have one city!)
Still... we do need luxuries. We'll take one each for plain cash, from
Japan (who can sneeze and take us out)

1295 AD (7) - Zero gold, +3 surplus now, and had to give up an artillery.
That's with three lux imports, 0% lux and 3 entertainers, running Wealth! 8-\
Do you get the feeling something has got to give?

1300 AD (8) - Persia and India have entered an Alliance vs Japan!!!!!!

Woo!! This is like... a script! And just before the vote! :hammer:
I don't think it will be 1305 per se, but from my other diplo game this
week, it should show up after my tenth turn. So just a few more.

On the down side, we lost our furs. (Japan harbor hit or something?)

AAAAAAAAAAACCCCCCCCCCCCCKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK???????? ???!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

India is at War with us???? WTH?!? WHY?! No declaration, we just "lost
our supply" ? Was that intentional? Did they choose to declare on us
because our big gpt deal we owed them just expired?? ACK! ACK!
If they even waited ONE MORE TURN to do this, I would be right now in
an alliance vs Japan with BOTH Persia and India, and we win the UN vote
for sure! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGHHHHH HHHHHH!!!!!

Sorry. I'll try to calm down. I just don't get it. They didn't declare
war. We didn't declare war. They were polite and would have accepted
an alliance. Now we're "in a state of war" ??

Well that's jolly. Now it's #1 and #2 vs #3 and #4. If #4 ever accepts our
envoy, we ally with 3 and 4 vs 1, on the turn before the next election,
and win. As it stands now, Gandhi will abstain, and Toko and Caesar will
vote for themselves. We could get Persia's vote, but it's not enough.

Ok, until then... let's improve relations with Persia, maintain with Japan
and Rome, and hope Gandhi comes to his senses and seeks peace with us asap,
then lets us help him out. Alas, I think there is a minimum #turns we're stuck
at war before he'll even meet our envoys.

Japan has no luxuries to trade to us. Odd. We get spices from Rome for 2 gpt.
He'll sell oil to us for gold+gpt btw, if we need that. We'll take incense
for one more gpt. Better butter up Persia. We trade some gpt for Rubber and
he moves to polite. Good deal. We'll make a barracks to upgrade our rifles.

1305 AD (9) - AAAAAAAAAAAAAAACCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCKKKKKKKKKKKKKK???? ?????!!!!!!!!!!!

Xerces the polite has joined forces with Gandhi the capricious to...

... form a military alliance versus us!!!! :confused:

Barracks is done, and rubber is gone.

: towel gets thrown in :

Passing off a turn early. Vote will come at end of 1310 I think, don't bother
holding elections. Sheesh. I still don't get it. :cry:

That's just a sick ending. Literally one HALF turn away from victory. If we
talk to Gandhi instead of being "entered into war without declaration",
we had it. Hats off to players this game -- you guys did very well, and Jaffa,
you had the winning maneuver. This is the saddest most incomprehensible ending I've yet seen. :mad:

Charis

Well, hold on, Charis, don't throw in the towel just yet. We're not being attacked yet, are we? We still have the next vote in another 10 turns... if we can make peace before then and before the AIs get around to wiping us out (they *are* on another continent and have bigger fish to fry) we still have a shot at it.

A phony war for a bit won't really hurt us so long as it doesn't become a real war and so long as we can get out of it in time to butter the AIs up again and have a vote before space race becomes a factor. If we have enough artillery, even a half-hearted attempt at a real war may not hurt us. OTOH, you're right in that we don't want to hold a vote just now; everyone would vote for Ceasar.

Let's see how this plays out, hmm? Ed, you're up!

: picks up the towel :

Nod... that post was while the events were fresh in my mind. Still... can't... fathom...

But yes, if we can ride out the war and get nice again we'll have a chance. Can only hope they'll end the war without tribute, cuz we'll need whatever little we have to butter them up.

It's not over :D

Charis

Phony war, maybe, but one transport with a couple of tanks and we're history :eek:

And yeah, that was a bizarre and sucky turn of events on your round, Charis.

Oh well, let's play it out and see what happens :)

One transport and a couple of tanks we could survive. Assuming the transport makes it past the Jap navy & airforce, it could end its turn within a couple squares of our territory. If so, we shell the heck out of it and its escort with arty and they hopefully withdraw for repairs (and that's a long way to go for repairs.) Failing that, we still have arty to take the tanks down a few pegs before they attack our infantry (we *do* have a couple, and could build more if we buy some rubber) which gets a +100% defensive bonus from being in a metropolis. We also have a number of riflemen to throw away, and with that defense bonus it's not impossible for them to take out an attacking tank that fails its withdraw roll.

If they come at us in a serious way, yes we're toast, but it would take more than one transport to really scare me. We can reinforce much more easily than they. What could really hurt, though, is they could pillage all our terrain improvements, and we don't have much in the way of offensive units (no oil for tanks, etc.) to prevent them from doing so, nor much in the way of workers to replace them.
I could wish we had some fighters and bombers to scout for enemy naval vessels and bomb them before they get close enough to land, but you know what they say about wishes...

Hallooo, Ed, it's your turn, and your 24 hrs "got it" post time have expired twice over... Don't make us skip you again!

I'll check back this evening and get it if no response.

Ok, got it.

1305 (0): Hmm, why is Thebes starving??? Ah, too many entertainers -- well screw that! I bump lux up to 10% and send them all to the fields. We only have 4 artillery left, I guess we had to sell some. I start building some more as they are essential to fighting off an invasion. I send our lone worker out to irrigate, we need some more workers in case pollution happens, so I buy back a couple from Japan (at ridiculously inflated prices I might add, please don't give workers away again, they aren't worth much to the AI and we need them!) I use one to grow to size 21 so we can get a free scientist for some 40-turn research. Fortunately all our gpt deals seem to have ended as we now are getting about 55 gpt income.

1310 (1): Our Ironclad gets bombed down to 1 hp, but it can still scout, which is all it was doing anyway. Woot! A new source of uranium is discovered, meaning we can build Nuclear Submarines -- an actual navy will do a *much* better job of protecting us, especially one the AI can't see to target. Gentlemen, we can rebuild our navy, we have the technology... better, stronger, faster!

1315 (2): We get a chance to hold a vote. No thanks, we don't like the excited expression on Ceaser's face when the UN's in session these days.

1315-1345 (3-8): Not much happens. We build nuke subs, India and Persia won't talk to us.

1350-1355 (9-10): India offers a Peace treaty for 140 gold. We accept! Oh, Persia's willing to talk? Wonderful! We buy peace from them too, for 70 gold. To keep them both happy we buy RoPs from them, not too expensive, as well as Furs and Rubber from India for cheap prices. Japan's gone from polite to annoyed, so we buy Silks from him for 60 gold, and that cheers him up. Well, the world's a happy place again, and we've got some good resources going, all for only 400 gold or so. Now that we're at peace I put us back on wealth to get cash for deal-making.

1360 (11): Next vote's coming up shortly (like in 2 turns) and we've got 200 gold left. Gifts of 100 gold to each of Persia and India make them *very* happy -- sheesh, that's less than 1 turn income for these guys, what's up with that!? I'll take it though... :)

End of turn 1365 (12):

Our final score was 4338! Woot, for a game that seemed hopeless at times, we sure came through when it counted.

Awesome finish, people!

Da na na na, na,

HEY!!!

Da na na na!

[party] :hammer: :goodjob:

Awwww-RIGHT!! Well we had the right line-up anyway,
the two voters in peace with us and at war with other two.

Phew... after I calmed down after my last turn, I realized that exactly what you described was not far fetched at all. I just didn't know how long they would take to come to their senses, or if we would survive til then.

Excellent finish, and to all... congrats on the first Deity OCC SG victory! That's a mighty fine score too.

:D
Charis

PS Did I say... :hammer:

You know, given the pace of AI tech advancement in Deity, I'm not sure it's possible to win a Deity OCC in any way *other* than diplomatically. Culture victory is probably out due to Space Race being done before then... the culture victory isn't sped up much by the faster tech researching, but everything else sure is. So, in the end, losing out on the culture race didn't hurt us much other than making it hard for us to scrounge up enough cash to keep up with the AIs for tech, even at last civ prices.

For the curious, my solo version of this game finished around 1300 AD with a diplo victory as well. About the only major difference is I had more money in the bank when it was over (and stuff that comes with money, like maps of the world, etc) though I still had a bit of a struggle at the end of the industrial era trying to get the cash to move into the modern era. Japan researched Fission first and started the UN in Kyoto; I beat them to it by 1 turn and only because I had been prebuilding the Intelligence Agency. :eek:

:hammer::hammer::hammer:

:hammer::hammer::hammer:

Next time there's a deity RBD game, I'm jumping in. Too much fun.

Beautiful game, more of these and the RBD crew will be remembered far and wide.

Jester

Way to go! :goodjob:

Us observers bow to the OCC Deities in awe. :)

What's the next project? A Deity OCC with Diplomacy turned off? A Deity OCC with some weedy variant rules thrown in? :) I know, how about one where every time we advance an era we have to go conquer one of the AI cities, move our capital, and give away the old city? :rolleyes: