Discuss and kill here

Let's start with getting the Nutters in on our mission. An SS with us is still their best option, especially now when were likely to be the weaker one standing when MIA falls. It's very frustrating for me not being able to do IM chats at the moment. Diplomacy couldn't be more fun than right now. I urge everyone who can to really make solid friends with Homer.

We need some pictures... I'll try and get some up later. :)

Here's the current status.
http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/7997/miavy5.jpg

should i just copy paste my idea/post over?

sure (10chars)

Is it possible to get the Capitol moved by MIA? They will likely go for S'ton asap. Can we prepare for it to jump to a desired location? I know it has to do with population and units...

Isnt it better to abandon it than to let it be taken by M.I.A.?

i figure you've seen my ideas anyways so im not gonna spam.... ;)

You can't abandon your capital. And yes I would assume that it is the likely target for next turn's blood bath

OK started from the west and worked my way east

Apefish- the can's south of that move one south and get him to bombard the road leading into wilde side-means they cant attack there for awhile.

dresden-gift to the nutters, could make MIA declare war on them and means that they'll be involved either way but it means that we could safely move our workers out perhaps.

elfing whomper room, im undecided what to do about this, eventually it'd get lost but if you bombard enough roads in and around it then MIA will be worried about whats inside it and so be forced to send some units up against it.

move the units on the coast into polecat, crackhead and nincompoopcity.

2 in each and the 3rd in polecat

rush cavs in polecat, crackhead, gilfrach, stoogeville, ignoramus, notfullshilling, SKTWD, Jesterton and the rax in devils soul, rush pikes in nincon, apefish, switch to pike in dionysthis, frozen lake-pike, pike in paradise hotel.

On battle isle-all them cities which are building wealth-switch to workers as we will have a chronic shortage of them soon.

We need to try and save as many of the workers we have wandering around as possible.

knucklhead cav should go and take out CV chaos cav

the cavs in elfing whomper room we can use as scouts to see what is about and whether we can save dresden at all- im not going to explore but whoever plays the turn can take screenies and see.

get them galleys out scouting to see if MIA are planning on launching a sea attack on battle isle and dump them cannons in frozen lake if possible-that for me seems to be our last stand city on green isle and therfore we should try and get it to size 12 for max defence benefeits (Add workers etc)

anywhoo we can get nationalism in 8 turns with 70 defecit so thats not going to happen.

Also there will be some INCREDIBLE WW so something needs to be done about that it may be worth after the rushing just switching to monarchy to tone it down a little.

Well there just my thoughts- i imagine someone who is better at c3c will come on and point out the flaws but :shrug:

We should change some builds for horses since they disconnected our saltpeter. That could actually be a benefit with Leo's. We will have saltpeter the turn after and speed will be key in whacking their incursions and disrupting their rail line.

FYI::: Once we get enough of a plan organized to play the upcoming turn, we should go ahead and play. The longer we take here, the more that MIA will realize that they not only caught us with our pants down, but also with the farmer's daughter.

might get over confident then though....

Simpleton can be attacked next turn, just in case no one has seen that.

Simpleton Attack
http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a358/Box180295/MTDG/SimpletonAttack.jpg

MIA needs to rail to the Blue Dot, then build a city on the Blue Dot. And maybe rail to the mined grassland NW of the city. From there, Pink Line is 1 MP, Yellow Line is the 2nd MP and attack on the 3rd MP.

Do we a count of MIA workers / slaves ?

Simpleton is far enough away from other cities that MIA cannot leapfrog from one city to the next. Not without building a city on the way. But if they can do that, then they see this plan also.

I see now, but did not earlier, that the Cav stack near Blue Dot could attack Simpleton next turn also. At least, I think it can. I am only using Whomp's screenshot, not the game, so GIGO.

Don't like to add bad news, but this needed to be reported.

Where the University build is shown, there is a mine, which means 2 turns. :D :)

This felling reminds me of when Donuts attack us back in TNT. I seem to bring war where ever i go :(

Has MIA had it's GA yet?

Has MIA had it's GA yet?
They have. It was wonder activated when they got Newtons.

BTW Vind...it's not your fault. ;)

means its mine.... :p ;)

we dont actually have anything solid to do yet (unless your all actually planning on doing what i advise) and we have got an extension so we should maybe get on with deciding what to do now :D

Cheer up you lot, christ anyone would think you was dead already.

No point in bringing troops back to defend the island however there is a whole lot of point in putting them all in boats and moving either to the battle isle or down south and hit the remaining MIA cities.

also gift those cities closest to MIA to the nutters and make sure they dont have a RoP with MIA-this will give us valuable time to build up some form of rearguard while the rest of the units are brought over to the battle isle.

Shove as many workers on the boats also.

nutters and MIA will eventually have to go to war and we'll be left with a small highly fortified area on the battle isle ready to attack either of the nutters/KISS.

Also do we have much gold? rush a load of units-then switch to monarchy and pop rush a load more units, get the nutters to step on it with nationalism so we can draft.

You cant go abandoning cities because they leave the roads there and for 3 move cavs it isnt going to make such a huge difference unless the culture is good.

Anywhoo there just my ideas thus far and i havnt looked at the save yet.

OK started from the west and worked my way east

Apefish- the can's south of that move one south and get him to bombard the road leading into wilde side-means they cant attack there for awhile.

dresden-gift to the nutters, could make MIA declare war on them and means that they'll be involved either way but it means that we could safely move our workers out perhaps.

elfing whomper room, im undecided what to do about this, eventually it'd get lost but if you bombard enough roads in and around it then MIA will be worried about whats inside it and so be forced to send some units up against it.

move the units on the coast into polecat, crackhead and nincompoopcity.

2 in each and the 3rd in polecat

rush cavs in polecat, crackhead, gilfrach, stoogeville, ignoramus, notfullshilling, SKTWD, Jesterton and the rax in devils soul, rush pikes in nincon, apefish, switch to pike in dionysthis, frozen lake-pike, pike in paradise hotel.

On battle isle-all them cities which are building wealth-switch to workers as we will have a chronic shortage of them soon.

We need to try and save as many of the workers we have wandering around as possible.

knucklhead cav should go and take out CV chaos cav

the cavs in elfing whomper room we can use as scouts to see what is about and whether we can save dresden at all- im not going to explore but whoever plays the turn can take screenies and see.

get them galleys out scouting to see if MIA are planning on launching a sea attack on battle isle and dump them cannons in frozen lake if possible-that for me seems to be our last stand city on green isle and therfore we should try and get it to size 12 for max defence benefeits (Add workers etc)

anywhoo we can get nationalism in 8 turns with 70 defecit so thats not going to happen.

Also there will be some INCREDIBLE WW so something needs to be done about that it may be worth after the rushing just switching to monarchy to tone it down a little.

Well there just my thoughts- i imagine someone who is better at c3c will come on and point out the flaws but :shrug:
Tubby's Check

MIA
cavs lost: 10
MI lost: 6 check

6 1/4 cavs
4 2/4 cavs check
7 3/4 cavs
2 3/5 cav
11 4/4 cavs (a few of these attacked an undefended city and therefore can't attack again)
____
30 left

1 5/5 knight


2 4/4 MI check
1 3/4 MI check
1 2/4 MI check

KISS
Cavs lost: 11 check
Muskets: 6
MI: 4 check
LB: 2 check
pikeman: 1
cannnons: 5
workers: 5
settlers: 1

9 cities lost. <- one of which is Dunderhead which is 3-4 tiles from our capital
Simon has our best, most concrete plan of action so far. I put it here to make it easy to see and foucs on. And Tubby has the body count.

The shock is over, the dead are dead and we the living have to put things right.

We have work to do. We can panic later.

So....
What is our city count and how is it divided?
What is our military composition and where are they located?
Where are our workers and what are they doing?
What cities can we/will we gift to the Nutters?

We need to know what we have while we attempt to figure other things out.

Can we mount a localized counterattack anywhere without losing the attacking units to MIA next turn?

Can we disrupt their lines of attack? Barricades? Fortress?

It looks like MIA has 11 good order Cavs right now and 7 more that are lightly wounded. Where are these located? On rails or roads?

If we defend strongly enough these 11 Cavs may be the only attackers next turn. If these 11 take enough losses, the wounded will not be used. On the other hand, if these 11 walk all over us, the wounded will be thrown at us also.

Has anyone looked at the map and plotted the course of the attacks? It doesn't seem that they wanted Leonardo's Workshop greatly or they would have made a bee line for it. But this is just a guess on my part. If the Workshop is the Grand Prize, I would have done everything possible to plan to get it on the first turn of the war. And maybe they did. I don't know the map well enough to be able to say.

We appear to have been a target of opportunity, from some of the other posts. Under what circumstances would we attack an AI with 40 Cavs?

We need to play with their minds. Make them think that we are a bunch of crybabies and ready to quit, while we continue to sharpen our knives.

EDIT:
Khan: Surely I have made my meaning plain. I mean to avenge myself upon you, Admiral. I deprived your ship of power, and when I swing around I mean to deprive you of your life.

Kirk: I see your point. Stand by to receive our transmission.
[sotto voce]
Kirk: Mr. Sulu, lock phasers on target.

[Kirk remotely commands Reliant's shields to drop]
Joachim: Our shields are lowering.
Khan: Raise them.
Joachim: [pounds fists on console] I can't.

Kirk: Fire!

I don't think they'll send out their precious cavs without cover. If they do that's where we pick them off. They should have a more difficult time manuevering now. They're still riding in the darkness.

I'd love to get a few units behind their thrust down the middle. Is there any way we can get there without being suicidal? Their workers are as dangerous as anything right now.

A couple of questions -

Do we want to keep EWR? - I don't know if we can make a successful retreat out of there so we might want to keep it. Or maybe we gift it to Donuts and catapult our units back to Simpleton (or will that not happen immediately?)

We might want to open the save. Make one or two recon moves out of EWR and see if we have rails headed north.

Then save it there and report back. We need some intel on their troop movements.

How many defenders can we get to our many front line cities? If we can't defend them, I think we need to consider gifting them to Donuts. I would think we would want to get at least five defenders in each location.

I'm not sure we have that many units to move to the front. The rails I saw were between our 2 ex cities. I think we should see if there's any way to capture the railing workers. I'd think it will give them something to think about.

This turn we have quite literally nothing to do other than the units in elfingblahblah and a few old fashioned units on the west coast.

oh and that cav.

Has anyone looked at the map and plotted the course of the attacks? It doesn't seem that they wanted Leonardo's Workshop greatly or they would have made a bee line for it. But this is just a guess on my part. If the Workshop is the Grand Prize, I would have done everything possible to plan to get it on the first turn of the war. And maybe they did. I don't know the map well enough to be able to say. Why stretch for it when they really don't need it. They've been saving up cash and then massively upgraded their knights last turn. They really don't have a need for Leo's since they have a ton of cavs and already knocked out most of our forces. D'nut isn't going to be much of a problem for them either to be honest.

:( if only i could of showed you something i wanted too (though it didnt indicate an attack was coming)(at least to me it didnt)

:( if only i could of showed you something i wanted too (though it didnt indicate an attack was coming)(at least to me it didnt)
Don't feel bad, Simon. You're playing by the rules the game admins asked of you, just as you defended your civ to the best of your ability when all looked pretty bleak. I think I can speak for everyone that you have our respect for being honorable, and it's among the reasons you're so welcome on our team. We appreciate your help where it's allowed for you to give it...when it's forbidden, we understand your frustration. I'm glad you're here with us. :)

thanks when were standing on the ruins of Athens then i can show you :)

Why stretch for it when they really don't need it. They've been saving up cash and then massively upgraded their knights last turn. They really don't have a need for Leo's since they have a ton of cavs and already knocked out most of our forces. D'nut isn't going to be much of a problem for them either to be honest.

They're still riding in the darkness.
I keep forgetting that MIA cannot see our land. Which means I hit the panic button earlier. Sorry.

The good news is that MIA doesn't know where Simpleton is and won't know until next turn and only if a scouting Calvary finds it.

How can we the darkness to our advantage? Can we divert the attack by leaving gaps-to-nowhere/gaps-to-Nutter-towns in our lines?

I could guess that MIA investigated most of our cities before the attack.

I could guess that MIA investigated most of our cities before the attack.Only if they can see them.

They sailed over the top of the continent when taking a look at our second invasion force. IIRC.

MIA has all of our land visible since they've been about scouting way back in AA. What they don't see is our units 'cept for the usual 8 tile sight around their units.
Seriously, someone has to play the save tonight. Gather the Idiots online and chat your way through it. I think no-one blames anyone for not being able to turn the tables on this turn. Agree on main strategy and do your best.
My vote goes to asking MIA what they want for peace, hook up Nutters on the extension deal, retreating to save as many units as possible. As long as we can keep the area around frozen lake I'll be happy. We need that for future landing. A chance go for the worker stack would be ok too. To me it looks like we should adapt the "burned ground tactic" and pillage our way back to a position where we have a fair chance of holding.

I would like to send a suicide cav towards where they've railed if we can. I really think they'd think twice about sending workers in uncovered.

I can't play the save tonight. Elvis night at the White Sox game. :mischief:

I'd offer to play but its friday so i think most of you can work out what my state of mind will be shortly...


edit-are we gifting the nutters any cities?

Is there anyone else who can play? I'm a little leary about this turn as if I make a mistake, it could mean curtains for us.

I can play right now but i think it'd be better if one of you original KISS'ers did it :) tell scout to get his ass back.

I can play it tomorrow morning with some people but that's the earliest.

wouldnt worry about it-i asked for quite a few extensions and the turns had been progresssing quite fast recently.

Can we just destroy Leonardos' Workshop only? I've never tried to destroy a wonder, but we can sell improvements.

If we raze Simpleton, a huge chunk of KISS land becomes no-mans-land and the MIA Cavs will have their road movement back.

If we gift cities to the Nutters, do they start all over with initial nine-tiles or do the Nutters get the cultural boundaries of the cities? If it is only the nine tiles, then we do not want to gift any front line cities to the Nutters, since that will leave gaps of unclaimed land for the MIA Cavs to use. Gifting second line cities might be better. We would lose the front line cities but we put a brief stop to the Light Green onslaught.

culture doesn't transfer. so yes it's just the 9 tiles. If we get them back we'll retain our current kulture.

Gifting cities to tele units is against the rurles i think.

I have to say I am really disappointd with the Grumpies. I sent out the Grumpy sign to all of them and it doesn't appear we have any response.

I will play it tomorrow afternoon, unless there is another brave soul who would like to do it.

I have to say I am really disappointd with the Grumpies. I sent out the Grumpy sign to all of them and it doesn't appear we have any response.
Could be the first week of school and readjusting to the old schedule.

I will play it tomorrow afternoon, unless there is another brave soul who would like to do it.
Not as a joke, but do you have any idea of what you will do?

I will play it tomorrow afternoon, unless there is another brave soul who would like to do it.
You (or whoever takes it) will have the full support of the rest of us I think. Nobody's expecting miracles and this will be a terribly difficult turn. We'll all be with you in spirit. :ninja:

Bugs I have a lot more confidence in your decision making than my own. The only thing I'd like to check is whether we can cut off their workers from railing north.

I think we'll need to abandon Effing Whomping Rower at some point but I'd leave a defensive unit in there to force them to move that direction.

They wouldn't know if we only moved our offencive units away unless they see them.

Sorry I didn't play it. In hindsight, I don't think it wouldn't have mattered if my dog played it.

What is the chance we can get enough defenders together on Battle Island to hold on for a while?

To you.

Battle Log:

It takes 5 cannons to redline the 4/4 musket by Effing Whomping Rower.

3/5 knight (after cannon hits) vs. ¼ musket -> 3/5 knight, musket dead, 2 cannons captured.



It takes 2 cannons to redline the 3/3 MDI.

3/5 cavalry vs. 1/3 MDI -> 3/5 cavalry, MDI dead.


So not letting our units return safely i guess....

So not letting our units return safely i guess....
Yeah, we told them where to stick their peace idea.