OK, I have read some threads on here about winning culturally, so I figured I'd give it a shot. I've tried four or five times now, with no luck. Each time, I either can't generate enough culture in my three cities by 2000AD, I get run over by an AI, or I can't expand enough early on. I tried again last night and I documented my moves to 1AD, in hopes that someone would be kind enough to critique and offer some insight. I appreciate any help offered.

Settings
Difficulty: Noble
Civ: Mali (Spi, Fin, UB: Mint, UU: Skirmisher)
Map: Lakes, Large, Tropical, Low sea level
Speed/Era: Epic, Ancient
No Barbarians
Seven other AI (Alexander, Asoka, Elizabeth, Frederick, Genghis Khan, Hannibal, Stalin) - randomly generated AIs

I started off thinking I'd like to get the Pyramids as well as the Oracle. I was planning on using the Oracle to pop Metal Casting so I could build Mints everywhere. Once I finish Nationalism, I planned to switch to 100% culture and use all the gold from my cottage-spammed cities to expand. Along the way, I hoped to get the Great Library and if I'm lucky, the Sistine Chapel.

4000BC - settled in place (Timbuktu), on a lake and river. Two forested hils nearby and a flood plain. Sheep inside immediate borders. Set citizen to work flood plain. Set city to build warrior until size 2. Researching Mysticism. I'm going for Judaism, hoping to perhaps pick up Hinduism along the way.

3790BC - received Masonry from goodie hut - this helps my bid for Judaism.

3700BC - finished Mysticism, started Polytheism.

3640BC - 5 turns left on warrior, but Timbuktu hit size 2. Time to insert a settler. Second citizen working a 2f1h forest square.

3610BC - Buddhism FIDL.

3220BC - founded Hinduism in Timbuktu. Didn't convert yet. Started Monotheism.

3070BC - met Frederick.

2710BC - finished settler, sent off to site with stone. Letting warrior finish in Timbuktu.

2650 - settled 2nd city (Djenne). One turn to Judaism, so it should found in Djenne. Started a worker immediately in Djenne and citizen is working a forested hill (1f2h).

2620BC - Judaism founded in Djenne. Started researching Hunting -> Anim. Husb. so the worker can hook up the sheep when he pops.

2470BC - warrior finished in Timbuktu, fortified. Only 6 turns to size 3, so started a Monument that will get interrupted for a bit once Timb. hits size 3.

2440BC - finished Hunting. Anim. Husb. started.

2290BC - met Hannibal. Fortified my original warrior in Djenne after he worked his way back through fog. Have popped several goodie huts now, but mostly gold and a couple maps. Timbuktu has hit size 3, so inserted worker at top of queue. Citizens are working flood plain, unimproved wheat (2f1h), and unimproved sheep (3f). 15 turns to worker completion.

2080BC - Anim. Husb. finished. Started Fishing so I can work the lake tiles and boost research a bit. Horses showed up just outside Timbuktu's borders, but an expansion will cover that soon.

2020BC - met Stalin.

1990BC - Frederick adopts slavery.

1960BC - worker finished in Djenne - sent to quarry stone. Started Monument in Djenne until size 2.

1900BC - Fishing completed. Research is now at 100% and losing 2g/turn. Started researching Pottery. I feel like this is too late to start thinking about cottages, but everything I've done to this point feels necessaary as well. Will set citizen to work lake tile in two turns when worker finishes in Timbuktu.

1840BC - worker completed in Timbuktu; sent to hook up sheep. Started settler in Timbuktu.

1660BC - finished quarry; started road to hook up cities with stone. Finished Pottery. Started Priesthood.

1480BC - Priesthood finished. Quarry hooked up. Started Meditation, so I can get some missionaries out to my neighbors, not to mention the culture and science. Workers are starting to build cottages everywhere, after key resources.

1420BC - sheep hooked up, worker starts cottage spam. Revisit tile assignments in city view.

1330BC - Monument in Djenne finished. Started Oracle. 38 turns to completion, at least until the city grows. I'll need to make sure I get BW before it finishes.

1270BC - met Genghis Khan and Lizzy.

1240BC - Meditation completed. Started Bronze Working.

1150BC - met Alexander. More cottage spam from my two workers.

1120BC - settler finished in Timbuktu. Khan settled a city touching my borders, the bastard.

1000BC - Bronze Working completed; switchjed to slavery. Founded 3rd city (Kumbi Saleh) with Khan's borders touching my initial borders on two sides. City site has two elephants, pigs, and a lake. Research Archery - I need skirmishers now. City production in KS set to granary, as I expect to have to whip.

985BC - worker from Timbuktu sent to KS to improve pig. 2nd worker starts road to KS.

940BC - Archery completed. Started Writing. Research is now at 70% and gaining 1g/turn (only 2g in treasury). Khan is annoyed with me, yay.

895BC - Monument in Timbuktu finished. Queued up Skirmisher, Hindu Monastery, and a missionary. After queuing up the Skirmisher, I whip it at a cost of 2 population. This takes Timbuktu to size 2. Oracle will be complete in 15 turns in Djenne. Inserted a skirmnisher at the top of KS queue.

790BC - Writing completed. Started Agriculture to finally get wheat and corn hooked up, now that I have granaries as an option.

775BC - Open Borders to Stalin, Alex, and Hannibal, all of whom are pleased with Khan and vice-versa. Khan doesn't like me enough to do OB with me yet, but I'll change that.

745BC - met Asoka. Skirmisher finished in KS, so one less unprotected target now. I am last on the power graph.

715BC - Judaism spreads to Khan before I could get my Hindu missionary out to him, but oh well. He converts to Judaism and so do I. Khan is now cautious.

685BC - Agriculture finished. Started Code of Laws.

670BC - Oracle complete. I chose Metal Casting as my free tech, so I can build Mints everywhere, but at this point, everywhere is only three cities and I am pressed by Khan and now Frederick. Started settler in Djenne - with any luck, I'll make it to the site I have targeted with copper before Khan or Fred.

565BC - Stonehenge built far away.

520BC - Granary built in KS, started Monument to help combat Khan's borders.

475BC - Open Borders to Khan finally. Started Pyramids in Timbuktu. This is much later than I'd hoped to start them, and I'd rather be using my capital for troop/missionary production at this point, but I decided I was trying before the game started and I want to see if I can do it. I have stone, so that helps, and I have plenty of forests that I've saved for this.

415BC - started Library in KS. I've lost my pigs to Khan's borders in this town now.

385BC - settler from Djenne sent off to settle copper. Started Jewish monastery in Djenne. I need missionaries, as well as science and culture. Only 6 turns to Code of Laws, so I should have the new city settled first, to make it a potential holy city. KS would be a better choice.

355BC - founded Gao on a lake with rice and copper in immediate boundaries. Lots of jungle though and I still don't have IW. The rice is jungle-infested. Started a skirmisher in Gao.

295BC - Code of Laws completed. Founded Confucianism in KS (yay!). Sent free Confucian missionary to Timbuktu. Researching Iron Working.

235BC - Largest Civilizations of the World pop-up ... I am #1. Somehow that doesn't ease my mind LOL.

190BC - KS borders expand, giving me the pigs again.

160BC - Jewish monastery built in Djenne. Queued up three missionaries.

145BC - Iron Working finished. Start Alphabet.

130BC - Library finished in KS. Started Confucian Temple.

85BC - got Pyramids. Started barracks in Timbuktu.

70BC - built Skirmisher in Gao. Started Library.

40BC - Jewish missionary sent to Frederick's town of Frankfurt.

25BC - Khan ends OB (uh oh ...)

5BC - Judaism spreads in Frankfurt. Started walls in KS. Whipped barracks in Timbuktu and queued up Skirmishers. Insert walls in Djenne.

Well, Mansa has two advantages in going for a cultural win, as I see it. Financial can be used to power first the research slider, and later the culture slider. Spiritual provides cheap temples, which not only provide some culture themselves, they also let you build "cathedrals" (for Judaism, the Synagogue). These buildings provide a +50% culture boost, so you want one for every religion possible in your three cultural cities.

This has a couple of implications. First of all, you want to have at least nine cities so you can build nine temples, allowing you to build three cathedrals. Second, it means you want as many religions in your cities as possible. You've founded Hinduism and Judaism, but you should also try to found as many of the other religions as you can, spread them to at least 9 of your cities, and build their temples.

You might know all this already, but it's worth repeating.

OK, I stopped here. At this point, I've founded three religions and I will be spawning a GP soon, which (I think) will allow me to lightbulb Christianity. I am way down the ladder in power, but I only need enough to protect assets and buy time for diplomacy, I think. However, Khan may very well be preparing to come take me out. I don't see how I am going to come up with nine cities, although six looks reasonably attainable. I plan on going for Taoism soon, as I hope to be the first to Liberalism.

At this point, I am sort of at a loss on how to proceed, but I am sure I've made enough mistakes so far that proceeding is pretty futile. I know I'll have to make some decisions about what to neglect and what to focus on, but I am unclear as to what, exactly.

Sisiutil, your posts have been very helpful in getting me to this point. Everything you just posted are things I was keeping in mind when trying this and part of the reason I chose Mansa Musa. The health penalty from Mints might turn out to be problematic, but at Noble level, I think I can get away with that.

Thanks all for any help.

OK, I have read some threads on here about winning culturally, so I figured I'd give it a shot. I've tried four or five times now, with no luck. Each time, I either can't generate enough culture in my three cities by 2000AD, I get run over by an AI, or I can't expand enough early on. I tried again last night and I documented my moves to 1AD, in hopes that someone would be kind enough to critique and offer some insight. I appreciate any help offered.




I've played about 25/30 Civ IV games now and won maybe 7/8. I've been pretty much going for the cultural win myself. I've found that most of the time (in your capital) when you first settle, if you work a tile with one or more commerce then most of the time you can get two religions if you go Mysticism - Polytheism - Monotheism with your first three science choices. Although this works for getting the first couple of religions, it doesn't set you up for an initially strong position (with three early cities), and I’ve lost more often than not with that strategy.

IMO, a better early cultural win strategy is to research BW right off (sacrifice the early three religions to the AI: Buddhism, Hinduism, and Judaism). Get your first three cities up & running ASAP with two workers chopping trees right off (I've done worker, worker, settler, settler) with my first four builds in my first city and it's worked very well for me in two out of the last three games (one game I got hosed because one of my settlers got nailed by a stinking bear on the way to a city site).

Anyway, with three cities up very early and with two workers, I've been able to get 2 of the 4 early wonders (Stonehenge, Pyramids, Oracle, and Parthenon). I think Stonehenge and Parthenon work best (Parthenon is great for generating GP points with a Philosophical leader .. I've been playing Elizabeth).

Usually I've been able to get three of the four later religions (usually Confucianism, Islam, and either Tau or Christian). Having an early city with a lot of farms & being able to "whip" buildings up quickly really helps to get your first three cities going strongly early.

Anyway, those are just a few things that I've noticed after 25/30 games.

I'll back up Sisutil a bit. It's too early in your game to talk about the "push" for the win, but you need to be seriously thinking about the setup.

You should probably know what your 3 culture cities are by now. They need plenty of food and also hammers. Yes, you're financial, but cottages are not so important for those 3.

Be sure and spread your wonder builds between those 3. Also, any Great Artists you get might be good to join whichever of those 3 cities you feel is the weaker in regard to getting culture and to building later wonders.

Beyond that, your focus should be on getting techs that give access to culture buildings, with getting more religions, and with keeping your military up so you don't get invaded.

Wodan

Another great advantage of the spiritual trait: you can temporarily adopt slavery to rush buildings and then switch bach to caste for your artist farm. If you have conquered some cities (and welcomed more religions in your empire) you can switch to organized religion to build missionaries asap and spread the faith in all your cities, and use the production bonus to get wonders and other culture related buildings, then get back to pacifism to max aout the GP generation....

I recently got my first cultural win (Prince/Standard/Continents). I played as Gandhi and played a diplomacy-based game. I rapidly expanded to 6 cities but didn't go further than that all game. I founded hinduism & confucianism and managed to get two more religions through my borders by maintaining good relations. Much of the game was devoted simply to building temples and other culture buildings & wonders in my three cities. I had a production city churning out units for defense to prevent my neighbours from attacking and I held off adopting my religion for the same reason.

Alex did attack me once, but I had a few spears and whipped a few more and he did little more than pillage a few improvements (annoying, but fixable). I bought peace for about 70 gold and then beefed up my power.

I screwed quite a bit up (Great People, particulary), but won the culture victory around 1920.

There is a lot of detailed advice in other posts, but my tips are:

1. As always, specialise your cities. My capital was a science city as well as a culture city. My military production city focussed on doing its job (barracks, heroic, forge & temples). My other culture cities were focussed on religion & culture.

2. Check the city screen regularly and consider what needs to be built where (and where you are going to settle your early artists). Generally, build Versaille in your 3rd cuture city as it really boosts things - I made the mistake of building it in the wrong city and overshot the mark.

3. Keep your miltary strong and work to build up positive modifiers through trade. Don't give the enemy an excuse to attack you.

4. Don't forget your culture slider. At some point, when you've got your major culture buildings up, you're going to want to drop science rate for culture. This is scary as you will see the enemy moving ahead of you, but you can still keep up a respectable pace. I used my super scientist capital along with a Great Artist farm and used Representation and some trading.

OK, so there's nothing I've done in the first 4000 years that is just wrong? That's good, I think .....

Thanks for the replies! :)