Im calling this Civ3 Deluxe...because I left most of the game alone, and mearly added elements that I didnt feel were used enough through out the game(for example Hidden nationality is sorely underused, as is Stealth attack, Ships carrying missles, Lethal Land bombardment etc)...So here is a little tease...



http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/6141/ancienteratechtreeza5.jpg

http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/778/medivaleratechtreeot9.jpg

http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/8926/industrialeratechtreepj2.jpg

http://img106.imageshack.us/img106/2039/moderneratechtreeui0.jpg

http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/1237/mwnncivlisthl1.jpg



ALL UUs removed, as they arent balanced(Dromon vs f-15...War elephant vs chasquoi scout)

(Some of the) Added Units:
http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/3365/tanksandplaneszk2.th.jpg (http://img126.imageshack.us/my.php?image=tanksandplaneszk2.jpg)

http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/7527/shipsuy7.th.jpg (http://img369.imageshack.us/my.php?image=shipsuy7.jpg)


Cutter:6/10(9) mv3: Upgrade from the Privateer(Steel)

Mercenary: 2/2 Mv 2: Hidden Nationality(currency)

DaVinci Tank: 7/6 mv1: upgrades to Tank(Steam Power)

Ancient Transport: 0/2 mv3 transport 2: Upgrades to Caraval(Map Making)

Pricipes: 2/3(3) mv 1:Upgrades to Marine: Amphibious(Monarchy)

Trident: 4/3(8) mv3 :Upgrades to Destroyer: multiple Bombard. Lethal land and sea (Magnetism)

Wooden Submarine: 7/4 mv4: doenst upgrade : Steam Power

Pirate Submarine: 7/5 mv3: doesnt upgrade :Hidden Nationality: Electricity

Jeep: ARMY UNIT: lethal bombard of 8 :2 unit limit(up to 3): spawned from Ford's Factory

War elephant: 5/3:requires Elephants:upgrades from Elephant rider: all terrain as roads, no cost in Forest or Jungle: avail to all civs with Chivalry

National Guard:replaces Mech Infantry 10/18: Computers

Civil Task Force: 1/1 (and 1 shield to build) costs a popluation (Synthetic Fibers)

Civil Defender: 1/1 (and 1 shield to build) costs a popluation: upgrades to Civil Task Force (Nationalism)

War Camel: 3/4 mv3 : requires Camels: Upgrades from Camel rider(Chivalry)

Camel Rider: 2/1 mv 3: requires Camels: Animal Domestication

Mamluk: 4/4 mv 4: requires Camels: Military tradition

Combat Engineer: 4/6(6)mv1 lethal land bombard: can build Colony. Road, Rail, Fort, Airfield, outpost, radar tower, barracade.
: upgrades from Crusader

Spruance Destroyer: 10/10(7) mv 9: carries Missiles(2): Rocketry

Des Moines Cruiser: 8/15(7) mv8: carries missles(2): Rocketry

Elephant Cavalry: 6/4 mv1: all terrain as roads, ignore cost on Jungle and Forest: upgrades from War elephant: Military Tradition

Ironclad Paddle Wheel: 5/6(4) mv4: lethal land and sea bombard: spawned from the Seafaring academy

Tractor Tank: 12/6 mv1: spawned from Industrial Tank Works

Stridsfordon: 24/16 mv3: upgrades from t-62(Synthetic fibers)

ARL-44: 15/6 mv4: spawned from Desert Tank Works

Black Eagle: 26/20 mv2: upgrades from Patton(synthetic Fibers)

BTR-70: 18/16 mv5: upgrades from Panzer: Synthetic fibers

LeClerc: 24/20 mv2: spawned from Jungle Tank Works

Patton: 17/10 mv1: Military Armor

Panzer: 14/8 mv 3: military Armor

SMK: 30/25 mv3: Blitz: Spawned from Modern Tank works

T-62: 16/8 mv 2: Military Armor

HummVee :ARMY UNIT:holds 2(3): spawned from Desert Command Center

Strike Missle: 0/0 (12) : tactical missle(rocketry)

Searcher UAV:mv 2; mobile air unit...stats irrelivant...range of 10 for recon(Advanced Flight)

Halftrack: 10/5 mv2: (Automobile)

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/5002/unitlistdk1.jpg

IMPROVEMENTS/WONDERS:

Kitty Hawk(WONDER) :-Flight- creates Veteren Air units(or in otherwords it does nothing)

Seafaring Academy(Sm WONDER) :-Ironclads- Creates Veteren Ships, +2 ship move, Spawns Ironclad Paddle Wheel

Amusement Park: (WONDER)-the corporation- Reduces corruption, and war weariness. 2 happy faces in the city, 1 happt in all cities

Cafe(Improvement) :-Democracy- Requires Democracy Govt- adds 2 shields to production, checked as power plant(replacement flag)

Ford's Factory(WONDER) : -Automobile- must have Iron/Rubber in city radius. Adds 3 production, halves upgrade cost, and increases Leader appearance rate...Puts a Factory in every city...Also Spawns Jeeps

Big Ben(WONDER) : -Replaceable Parts- increases city defences, double vs Barbs, Stealth barrier

Rosetta Stone(WONDER) :-Education- +50% research, double city research

Hubble Telescope(WONDER) : Requires Apollo program...+50% research, double city research, stealth attack barrier

Desert Command Center(Improvement) : Requires 2 Desert Tank Works...Spawns Hummvee

Jungle Tank Works(Improvement)-Synthetic Fibers-: Requires Jungle(RES) within city radius. Spawns LeClerc tank

Desert Tank Works(Improvement)-Military Armor-: Requires Desert(RES) within city radius. Spawns ARL-44

Industrial Tank Works(Improvement) requires Ford's Factory...Spawns Tractor Tank

Modern Tank Works(Improvement)-Synthetic Fibers- requires the Iron Works...Spawns SMK tank

Movie Theatre(Improvement)-Electronics- 50% tax increase, 2 happy people in the city

Berlin Wall(WONDER)-Fascism- requires Fascism, and a victorious Army. Doubles City defences, and increases Leader appearance rate...also puts a wall in every city

Communist Manifeto(WONDER)-Communism- requires Communism. Reduces corruption, and Propaganda. Also increases the chance of a leader appearing.

Green Peace(WONDER)-recycling-reduces pollution and puts a recycling center in every city

HollyWood(WONDER) requires 5 movie theatres. reduces War weariness, and earns 5% on the treasury...Also doubles the happiness of Movie theatres

Senate(Improvement) -The Republic- Requires the Republic govt. +1 production, +1 happy people...resistance to Propaganda, and reduces corruption

Olympic Games(Sm WONDER) -Nationalism- reduces War weariness in all cities

Jade Carver(Improvement) Requires Jade within City radius. +2 shields, +1 happy face

Lumber Mill(Improvement) Requires Timber withing city radius. +3 shields

Shopping Center(Improvement) -Capitolism- requires 5 marketplaces +50% tax output

Mall(Sm Wonder) -The coorporation- must have 5 shopping centers to build...50% tax output, treasury earns 5%, +1 trade in any trade producing square



Added RESOURCES:

Ivory changed to Elephants

Timber - S - 0/1/0

Pigs - B - 2/1/0

Jade - L - 0/0/3

Cocoa - B - 0/2/0

Coffee - L - 0/2/0

Camels - s - 1/0/1

Jungle - S - 0/0/0

Desert - S - 0/0/0



ADDED/Altered TECHS:

Broze Working changed to Mining

Iron Working changed to Smelting

Horseback riding changed to Animal Domestication

Map Making changed to Cartography

Automobile requires Combustion

Capitolism requires Economics and Democracy

Motorized Transportation changed to Military Armor

{edit} culturally specific unit lines being added...

Looking good. However, you may want to look closely at the HN Land units- the AI has a tendancy to build nothing BUT them, potentially crippiling it.

I found how to avoid this...Note that the Mercenary is 2/2 2mv...HN(and cannot capture)....because it is low attack and defence(to make up for HN) the AI build some, but tends to stick with higher att/def units(War elephant is their favorite if they have elephants...then camels) The AI builds Trident and cutters, and a few pirate subs...they still love the Destroyer...

in the MANY tests, I kept adjusting the HNs so they were useful, but not over powerful...the AI builds few or none...and they end up being "a useful annoyance" when you use them against the AI...since the AI goes crazy trying to kill them, and they are kinda weak...

Without the ability to capture, what AI Stratgagy did you give them? (As it seems you must have given them one for them to build/use the unit).

explore...the AI knows enough to pillage with the weaker unit...like I said, over glorified scout...

The concept is that a Mercenary can fight for you, but not claim land in your name...and is not as powerful as your trained warriors...

Another concept that I think is completely original in this MOD, is the Civil Defender...0/2 immobile, with population cost of 1, costs 1 shield...the concept is later in the game(after Muskets) the defensive unit is SO expensive to build, that your city is in disorder a LONG time, and can risk being culturally reverted, thus losing all units in the city...so in concept, you promote a citizen of the city, to calm his own people...a Civil Defender...in action, it reduces population(easier to be happy with less people) and creates a military unit (increases happiness)...BUT they arent very strong, so if you rely on them, you will prolly lose the city...Also after synthetic fibers, they upgrade to Civil Task Force...0/4 immobile, cost a population...1 shield

I posted here yesterday and now it's gone! :ack:
I like most of your ideas, but IMO the game is much better with UUs than without.

Well I may very well add more UUs...I just dont like the original ones...some of them are aweful, while others are awesome...like the Dromon, or War elephant...as opposed to the F-15 or chasquoi scout...

plus I changed almost all the civs to better looking LHs...so I will need suggestions for UUs...here is my current civ list:

Etruscans
Phoenicia
Prussia
Tibet(shaolin Monk?)
Javanese
India(to be changed)
Aztec(to be changed)
Iroquois(to be changed)
Xiong-Nu
Norway
Ireland
Bulgaria
Seljuks
Netherlands(to be changed)
Byzantine(original civ that stays)
Mercosur
Egypt(original Civ that stays)
Babylon(to be Israel)
Russia(original Civ that Stays)
America(original Civ that stays)
Carolingians
Persia(to be changed)
Mali
England(to be changed)
Spain(to be changed)
Khazars
Kushan
Korea(to be changed possibly)
Haiti
Phillipines
Amazonicos

All the civs are chosen by LH...I use the ones I like the best...and replace the closest civ that matches...

Etruscans- some sort of boat or utah's sea peoples unit.
Phoenicia- carthaginian foot soldeir unit
Prussia- a musketman or cavalryman
Tibet- chainmail armoured swordsman
Javanese- indonesian tribesman unit
India- swordsman or elephant
Aztec- jaguar or eagle warrior
Iroquois- "long house guardian"
Xiong-Nu- horseman
Norway- a viking unit?
Ireland- a celtic chariot, a fianna or an IRB infantryman
Bulgaria- an ottoman sort of unit
Seljuks- an arabic swordsman pr spearman of crusading era
Netherlands- scalemail knight
Byzantine- a swordsman/spearman unit
Mercosur- an infanrty unit
Egypt- f16 or ancient egyptian spearman/lanceman
Babylon- assyrian horse archer
Russia- cossack, hun horseman, or an infantryman
America- Abrams or continental soldier (1700's)
Carolingians- axe-thrower
Persia- mounted spearman/lancer
Mali- touareg or tribesman
England- redcoat or roundhead
Spain- conquistador (mounted or unmounted)
Khazars- chainmailed soldier (mounted or unmounted)
Kushan- chariot unit
Korea- hwarang
Haiti- colonian rebel (french cavalier)
Phillipines- SWAG SEAL, scout ranger or tribesman
Amazonicos- tribesman

--------

notes:
iroqois is sometimes concidered derogatory. they call themselves the Haudenosaunee.
byzantine warrior: http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/strategikon/t-warr.gif
dutch warrior: http://www.animatile.com/Delft/Images/DutchWarrior.JPG
xiongnu: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Mayi
iroquois: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iroquois
i chose the long house guardian because some of the groups were chosen to guard the "long house"
bugaria was under ottoman controll for 500 years
tibet: http://www.metmuseum.org/special/se_event.asp?OccurrenceId=%7BDD23FA42-2DC3-4DBD-82CB-CB529C69DC56%7D
mercosur: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazilian_Army
egypt: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_of_Egypt
egypt also: http://storeforknowledge.com/Ancient-Egypt-Egyptian-Warrior-with-Lance-P6624C253.aspx
persia: http://www.soldiers-russia.com/kolobob/images/ar03n_f.jpg
khazar: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars#Army
philippines: http://www.martialartsunlimited.com/images/Kali_Filipino_Warrior_2.jpg

Holy Crap Quinzy...thanks for the quick and detailed response...processing info now...

thanks. i got a bit lost for the more tribal civs, but i'm sure better suggestions will be put forward. if you want any more info on the reasoning for the UU's, just ask.

Well, Im not making any Boat or Plane UUs...I feel they are unbalanced in general...So Im making all UUs land based...(I may make seperate "regional" flavor boat and/or plane lines...graphics but no stat changes)

Some of them are obvious (Mercosur, Norway, Haudenosaunee(changing to a different tribe I think)...) but some I didnt get, like: why an armored Tibetan? when the Shaolin monk is available?...

a few you gave UUS for wont exsist in the final version...England(may combine America and England), Spain, Korea(Vietnam), Netherlands, Babylon(to Israel), Persia, India(to Siam I think), Aztec...

Also, I have removed chariots from the game, as I was planning to add them as "Horsemen" UUs...for certain civs...my reasoning for this is: some Civs NEVER had chariots(Native Americans, Java, Tibet, Vietnam)

because tibet is muslim and buddhist. i'm not sure if shaolin is even tibetan.. i must check that.. and i linked you my tibetan reasoning- the weapons and armour they found!

and you may pick whatever ones you want from that list, or none at all if you want :) they're only suggestions.

I see...my mistake

just checked, and not once in wikipedia does it mention tibet on shaolin.

Shaolin stuff is Zen Buddhism not Lamaist Buddhism.

And you should put Romania/Dacia instead of Bulgaria, we were not conquered by the ottomans, we were only vasals. :mischief:

And ...
May i puweeeese steal an idea from you ? :please:
The Hidden Nationality sub...

By all means...steal away...want the stats I use?...its still invisible etc...

As far as Romiania, do you have a good LH?...like I said, I didnt pick civs by anything but which LHs I liked best

By all means...steal away...want the stats I use?...its still invisible etc...
I'll probably use the same stats that you added. I didn't think too much about.
I just liked the idea that there is a way to use Stealth and get over the annoying so-called "Sub Bug". :)
As far as Romiania, do you have a good LH?...like I said, I didnt pick civs by anything but which LHs I liked best
Er... i'm not quite sure. I don't know leaderheads in general for any civ ... I do recall a Vlad Tepes of some sort.
I hope mirc might know more ...

These are pics I found, and I would like opinions please...and possible units to fill these pics


Xiongnu units?? http://fun.china.com/zh_cn/subject/juzhao/10002228/20011207/images/10166161_32120.jpg

Khazar unit?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/b6/Khazar_1.gif/200px-Khazar_1.gif

Kushan Unit?
http://www.kushan.org/pictures/archer.jpg
or
http://www.dbaol.com/images/faces/838_face.jpg

Seljuk Unit?
http://www.allempires.com/empires/seljuk/seljuk_warriors_enh.jpg

Bulgaria Unit?
http://www.bnr.bg/NR/rdonlyres/ECD107AF-E528-4C5D-9DE5-00050EAF43CA/0/batallion.jpg

Ireland Unit?
http://library.thinkquest.org/C005417/images/cucspear.jpg
or
http://www.timelessmyths.com/celtic/gallery/cuchulain.jpg

Bulgaria- an ottoman sort of unit


Bulgaria is not an ottoman counry!

I think balkans units will be better!


Happy 2300 post, Spacer!

but it WAS under ottoman control for 500 years.

xiongnu: maybe http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=173198
Kushan: maybe: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=2896113 or stock keshik
Kushan 2: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=56408
Seljuk: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=62275
Bulgaria: parachuiste http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=54319
Ireland: a bit bulkier than cucullain but http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49914
Ireland 2: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=91034

First post updated...Beta Release will be this weekend...when Thanksgiving is over...

Like I said on page 1, looking good!

here is a basic summary...this will be included as the Read Me for the MOD...this is the last "preview" update...the MOD is ready for release tomorrow (maybe tonight if I get motivated)

ten chars...

The Mod is being uploaded as I type this, so I thought Id put up some more previews, on the front page of course...of version 2.0...with almost complete Ancient and Medival era , Culture specific unit lines...

I no longer have a working Civ disc, so I have to ask for a volunteer to play it and give me error reports and such...

I just wanted to say that I love the idea of the civil defender unit and how you have used the game mechanism to do it. It's a really great idea. I never liked losing a stack with a culture flip. At least way you are not losing real fighting units. Well done. I look forward to trying it out.

If anyone is looking for the most updated version of this, it is the MWNN link in my siggy

@William: I also never liked losing the stack of good units to culture conversion...I also never liked having to wait 40 turns to build a simple defender...with the Civil defender, as long as the city has more than 1 person in it, you can crank out the happiness providing military units you need. Without losing valuable units to your military campaign

I have (immobile) units like that in my Greek scenario :)

Immobile...cost 1 shield and a population 0/1 no abilities

Mine has one attack and x defense, and has the ability to bombard (offset by using the "Charm" flag). This is so the AI builds it as an Artillery unit.

neat idea...did you make it cost a population as well?...

Can I ask, who is the leader for Ireland?

Michael Collins...

Ah. Umm, Michel Collins wasn't ever the leader of Ireland. He was the Minister for Finance.

neat idea...did you make it cost a population as well?...

Of course. One population and one shield.

I have had this debate in private with someone else, and Im not getting into it again...all I will say is I selected the LHs for the reasons I chose to select them for(Che was never the leader of the Mercosur either...nor was the Dali Lama ever technically the "ruler" of Tibet)...

This MOD is NOT an attempt at historical accuracy...leave that to the SOE guys and all the creators who are studied enough to strive for that degree of accuracy...Im making this more in the flavor of Civ...with units that never existed, under leaders that never ruled, over countries that (in many cases) may have never been more than a single island(Phillipines, Java, Rapa-Nui)...

I wasn't trying to make a stab at the mod whatsoever, I was just saying that he was the Minister for Finance, in case you did not know that. I'm not saying that you should change it, as it is your mod and you're obviously free to do what you want with it! :)

sorry if that sounded crass...I didnt mean it to be...

I did not know Collins was the Minister of Finance, but thats not why I chose him anyway :)...

I'm guessing it was because he was a guerrilla and espionage mastermind then? :D And created what we now have as modern intelligence? :lol:

Mine has one attack and x defense, and has the ability to bombard (offset by using the "Charm" flag). This is so the AI builds it as an Artillery unit.

what do you mean by offset by.....have you determined what the charm flag does?

Well his involvement in certain famous events in the 1900s was a big part of it...and the fact that the LH EXISTS...

also, he has always been a hero of mine (And not for his "Guerilla" involvements)..also the fact that he was a revolutionary, and after that, worked within the political system...if Im not mistaken he was voted a seat in the British House of Commons(Even if he never sat there)...and was at one point the "President of the Irish Republic" by law...

He was Chairman of the Provisional Government :) Dev was the President :D

I said "By Law"...he was the President of the IRB (I believe) which made him the "Legal" presidentof the Irish Republic...

I also believe this is where "perspective" comes in...if this subject turns to a debate over the history of the England/Ireland struggle I will have the thread closed...Nothing personla Quinzy, but I have seen this debate get UGLY

Don't worry mate, I'm not going to get into it. In fact, I agree. In him being the Commander-In-Chief, he held the same military power as the President.

Good to hear that your concerns were Historical, not political :)

Oh of course. I'm not one of those violent nationalist types! :) I'm just a history freak :D
As I said, I was only informing for fear that you didn't know, as opposed to infringing on your mod! :)

Not at all...I am aware that there are persons who would argue that Michael was NEVER a ruler of Ireland...and they might be right depending on their take on history...however, I dont share that view...I feel that of the available LHs, and possible LHs, this is the most appropriate one for my MOD...the same reasoning is behind Ngawang Gyatso as the leader of Tibet, even tho he isnt/never was...King David as the leader of a "Nation" that didnt exist 1000 years ago(maybe in spirit)...and Che Guevara as the Leader of the Mercosur(Even tho he was technically leader of no nation EVER)...

I admit, that my political views are lightly expressed in this MOD(Tho some civs were included so I could beat on them), but only in the selection of LHs(And removal of most countries)...But the MOD is balanced and fair...any CIV i felt should be penalized for "bad behavior" has been removed...Others were removed to allow better diversification(America for one)...I hope that the Civs represented in this MOD arent in anyway offensive...

I completely understand your angle in this mod and I think it's a nice and unique one, and not in the least ways offencive!

thanks for that...and that too :)

what do you mean by offset by.....have you determined what the charm flag does?

From mine and others tests, I can only deem that it nerfs the bombardment :)

Bulgaria turk country? :D That is funny! If you want to make more realistic this country and your mod I will help you with pleasure ( = .

Greetings,

VVS

Oxus, not only are you bumping an old thread, but in this case you make suggestions to a dead civer. :(

Sorry, Civinator! I can't understand what you want to say O.o .

Hi Oxus, welcome to the community :)

Civinator means that the user Spacer One has died some time ago. This mod is not being worked upon as a result.

Hi Oxus, welcome to the community :)

Civinator means that the user Spacer One has died some time ago. This mod is not being worked upon as a result.

Correct. Spacer One (the person) is deceased.

I almost thought this was a new thread there for a second... :sad: