The Cultural Department - Term 1

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/culture11.jpg

As the Department of Culture (DOC) is unique in the sense that it did not exist in the civ2 game, the goals of the Department still need to be defined. The latest draft of the constitution states that decisions about expansion and cultural city improvements are to made by this Department. It also grants this Department power to override a governors decision for the construction of a cities cultural improvements. Basically, the Department sees this authority as one being used in situations where our cultural borders are being threatened by a rival faction. The need to increase culture in a given area or city should be addressed in a timely manner to prevent cultural flips (cities or borders). There may be other motivating factors for implementing this authority, but it will not be used on the basis of a whim or some petty arguement.

The DOC will encourage, no strive for, the development and advancement of improvements and wonders that will build an enduring cultural identity. At present, the DOC goal is to seek the path that will bring our nation to greatness other civilizations will come to respect.

Listed below are improvements and wonders that the DOC will set as default endeavors. They are listed in order of importance in regard to a strong cultural stance. As these are only the default lists, decisions can and will be made that do not directly match the lists. They are posted here only to reflect game structure and scoring.

Improvements

temple
library
cathedral
university
colosseum
research lab

Wonders

Cure for Cancer
Newtons Great University
Globe Theatre
The Great Library
The Oracle
The Pyramids
Hanging Gardens
Sistine Chapel
Copernicus' Observatory
Longevity
Hoover Dam
Magellan's Great Voyage

Small Wonders

Heroic Epic
Forbidden Palace
Appollo Program
Iron Works
Wall Street

As President of the First term, I feel like I have to contribute here a little. Great work with the list of (In importance order?) cultural structures.

To get the most of our cultural buildings they should be built as early as possible. Every Cultural building will get a Cultural Bonus when they have been there for 1000 Years.

The bonus is the same as the original Culture Value (Cp per Turn).

So that would make (with the 1000 Year Bonus):

Temple = 4/turn
Library = 6/turn
Cathedrals = 6/turn
University = 8/turn
Colosseum = 4/Turn

And some important wonders(with the 1000 Year Bonus).

Great Library = 12/turn
Forbidden Palace = 4/Turn (pretty sure...)

So the Great Library is great to get, as it comes early, and for the Techs and Money boost it provides.

I think that Temples, Libraries, Cathedrals and Universities is a must in our Uncorrupted cities. Not necessarly in that order...

If we will have any corrupted cities my list of cultural improvements they must have is not that long. Temple is the only MUST-have cultural improvement for them I think. Unless they are border cities...


Wonders I consider as Must Haves (should be built in this order)

Great Library
Sistine Chapel or Sun Tzu's (Or both)
Thery of Evolution
Hoover Dam
Longevity

Keep up the Good Work

/the President

Thank you for your input, Mr. President. as your pm box is full and i can't get through to you with an email, i'll ask you here. Just for the record, what version patch are you using and where can i find your bonus information so i can catch up on my reading? Your points per turn came out a match when compared to the manual, but it calls for a different bonus. The wonders are listed by points per turn also. That's why i stated in order of importance. calculating out the points generated from a wonder that was built thousands of years before a wonder with higher points per turn is not something i had the time to do yesterday. Which is why i only listed the top 12 wonders in order of culture points per turn. If you want my personal favorites in the wonder department, i would say Oracle, Great Library, Sistine Chapel, and Cure for Cancer. oh, and i forgot, Hanging Gardens. I mainly wanted to set up a policy base for easy reference. Where any of the citizens could go and find the basic stance they could expect from the DOC. Nothing mentioned in the first two replies are written in stone. (I thought I mentioned that:) ). anyway please reply to my above question. thank you.

I just had a couple of comments on this discussion about which culture improvements are the most important. I know it is usually taken as a given to build a temple in all cities, but let me make a case for libraries. I have played in several games where I was able to secure several luxuries early (3-4). In those cases, the Temple is not so critical for happiness purposes. The library, on the other hand, produces more culture, 50% more for 33% more cost. Borders expand much faster, and if you are whipping to produce them they each take two pop anyway. Also, if we are scientific, it is just one shield and one pop! So even a totally corrupted city could crank one out quickly. The science bonus is just the icing on the cake.

Also, the 1000 year bonus is double the original culture/turn, I have tested it out. Getting Libraries done in the early BCs, when it is still 30-50 years/turn, is a big plus. It only takes 20-30 turns to get the bonus, rather than 100 turns after 250 AD.

Obviously this will depend on our situation, what civ we choose, and how many luxuries are available, I just wanted to put some ideas out there.

I usually play the Persians or the Greeks. With them the library costs less than the temple.

It's good to see the Cultural Department hard at work with preparations for developing a rich cultural heritage for our people. This warms my heart! :hammer:

The military department will do all that we can to help protect these great national treasures: our wonders, our libraries, our temples. We concur with the Culture department on the need to expand our borders by culture, on the grandeur of the Heroic Epic, and the lavishness (and utility) of the Forbidden Palace. The Great Library too will be a boon too our culture, allowing us to save budget dollars for propogation and protection.

I recognize we will not need a barracks in every city (although Sun Tzu's would be very nice!), this pales in comparison to the need for culture, and yet I'm likewise sure our president will not leave culturally significant border towns undefended.

Peace,
General Charis

“could it be that I have found my home at last, home at last.”

Yes, the game has started, and our cultural borders have already expanded from the immense culture founded in our glorious capital, Fox Nest. The birthplace of a nation, our fortress in the hills of Phoenatica, the spawning place of our future core cities, and our capital, Fox Nest will be the rock that steadies our growth. May all our citizens see the great flag atop our capitol from the mountains and forests and farmlands of Phoenatica. I will join the people in a toast, ‘Fox Nest, our home.’

First screenshot ---

In viewing this screenshot, the DOC would need to explore SE and NW from Fox Nest for possible city locations. NW being the priority. From what I can see, the only placement I could recommend is on the hill, 1 move SW of the warrior. This would create a good wonder-building or cavalry-building city once we got it irrigated and populated. Other than that the DOC sees no good spots at this time. The fish is lost and Fox Nest needs all the resources within its borders, unrestricted by other cities.

We could produce a settler naturally (if not, then waiting one turn) by working the two-food grassland tile next to the mine with our next growth (in 1). Then send it NW with no protection. I recommend against this, and agree to switch to a warrior, to explore the NW and set up for the initial protection of the next city. After this warrior is produced, then a settler (to follow the warrior’s path) should be next.

This is the official stance of the DOC, although as I have stated previously, we stand behind the president’s decision.

As a representative of The Spice Traders Guild, our merchants support the use of their goods in the construction of temples and libraries, so that we our culture can grow, and claim new resources, as well as research new techs.

Today was the second series of moves made by our president in the Civ3 Demo game. The amount of turns played was increased by demand, as stated in the constitution. The game moderator, the duck, sanctioned this. Basically the amount of moves was increased to allow the placement of the next city. In doing so, we doubled the amount of cities in Phoenatica, adding to Fox Nest a costal core city named Eyr, after our great Domestic Advisor.

The year is 2800 BC and our culture point total is up to 28. This is not bad compared to the number of moves. We owe all of these points to the Palace of Fox Nest. Our World Ranking is 75, and combined with the fact that our citizens are of course, the most cultured of any nation known in our world today, this is a very high score.

We have 2 warriors in the field and two in production. As we are allowed 8 military units at this time, we could basically double our army without dipping into the budget. Having lost one of our units to the barbarians in the north country, our exploration suffered a setback. Due to a unique set of circumstances, some of our leaders wish to form a small band of warriors to send up there and investigate more thoroughly. More exploration is needed in the NW and in the SE. In the NW, grassland and cattle have been found. In the SE, mainly jungle and hills have been found, but by the looks of the map, there may be a rushing river to help supply future cities.

In the Science Department, we are spending one-third of our income on knowledge of iron working. One of our warriors found a friendly tribe in the south country, who taught us the advance of ceremonial burial. This is great for the DOC as now temples may be built in our cities to lift the spirits of the people and bring them hope.

So, with the exception of the loss of our gallant warrior to barbarians, this has been a great day in Phoenatica.

Today we had a “we love the President day” celebration, as it was his birthday. Eyrei filled in for him at the helm and did very well indeed, increasing our viewable area about 400%. The land remains very hilly to the south and very mountainous to the north and farther east. We have found an inland sea to the east, a large lake to the north, and plenty of resources. 2 deposits of iron, 2 dyes, and 2 more incense. Although most of these will take time to secure, it is feasible to do so. As we are in a mountainous area, gold is everywhere. I count 8 deposits of gold, 2 of which have been secured. Cattle, wheat, game, and fish are abundant throughout the explored area, and there are 3 locations inhabited by wild horses.

We have again doubled the amount of cities for the Phoenetian Nation. Shailonegha was settled out on the northern coastline and will thrive on spice and fishing. Khatovar was settled on a hilltop, resting on a mother load of gold that will help finance a future army. A fifth city will be settled in two moves. Located north of Khatovar and East of Shailonegha, this city (already named PDX) will flourish among the local cattle and wheat farmlands fed by a river originating in the hills. It will also be fairly close to our northern neighbors, the Americans.

Yes, we have met 5 other nations. The afore-mentioned yanks to the north and the Romans, Aztecs, Babylonians, and Greeks to the south. All seem impressed with our culture, except of course the Aztecs, who are unimpressed.

A lot of trading went on during the course of the 19-move session. Heavy tech trading and selling in a wheeler-dealer day has put us technologically advanced with 164 gold in the bank. We’ve been able to keep our science rate at a low 30% with no luxuries, so we need only spend 7 of our 12 gold income, netting a fiver each turn. We spend 3 on science, send 2 as payment to another nation, and lose 2 to corruption.

Our world rating is 115, 5th of the known 6 nations. As our army is average or better, I believe the 5th place rating is due to a slight population drop due to our expansion. This should even out shortly. Our Cultural point total is now 72 in the year 1910 BC, which is about average for the known world.

We have 12 military units. 7 in the field, 3 protecting our cities, a worker, and a settler. Of the 10 army units, 9 are warriors and 1 is a spearman. In production, we have 1 warrior, 1 worker, 1 settler, and one temple.

What a glorious day for our young nation. It seems to be turning into a robust game, destined to be a race for real estate and growth – military might and gold. Stay tuned….

The DOC has read and appreciates the retraction posted by the Office of the Military. We also recognize the ability of the Military Department’s Leader to motivate and mobilize vast armies on a global scale, and to direct them in successful campaigns. We wish to express our desire to alleviate any undue inter-departmental stress that may have arisen recently. And finally, we will seek a path to better communication with the Military Department in all endeavors at the departmental level.

We must concentrate on having temples to increase our cultural influence, minister, and I dont see any indication of a wonder being started:eek: .

The loss of early wonders could be detrimental to our cause

Our recent military analysis made some strong calls for what is needed to support upcoming actions. In there is a dot map and some thoughts for priorities.

The one thing that concerns me, as I know it will the department here, is the suggestion that Wonder 'building' may not be on our agenda. Wonder 'acquisition' however, is quite a part of those plans.

The difficulty is that, well, we have such poor prospects for citiy production in our young empire. There is almost no site that has: good food (to even get beyond size 3), good production squares, *and* close enough to the capital to have good net production.
In other words... we may well need to rely on our capital for troop production rather than wonder building. With 10 shields production, the equation is simply 30 immortals or a 300 shield wonder (since the plan is to crank vet warriors and upgrade them by cash, with shields as our rate-limiting-factor). You can imagine what impact 30 vet immortals would have on the growth, power, and ultimately culture, of our civilization, compared to something like the Gardens.

With our dearth of good sites near the capital, are there any other thoughts here for building culture in the short-medium term? Or is it recognized that our day will come a little later, and use a strong early campaign to secure middle age and industrial wonders.

Hmmm... perhaps this is its own answer? "Culture" is not hurt by corruption, and if we focus on building temples quickly in ALL captured cities (good from so many points of view), we can in fact really forge ahead nicely in culture. (Didn't really recognize this as a solid plan until in the middle of writing this post) It would be more the "national" culture plan rather than the one-city approach.

General Charis

In looking at what we can do to improve the culture of our young nation in the most efficient manner possible, let us not forget that we will soon have the ability to store our knowledge in Libraries. Due to our naturally scientific nature, these are cheaper than temples, yet produce even more culture! The added benefit of increasing our learning rate is a bonus.

At this point, with science in the 30% range, it would take a city with 7-8 trade to make the library science bonus exceed the maintenance cost, (7 trade at 30% = 2 science, +50% = +1 science, making up for the 1 gold in maintenance). However, with the gold sources and other bonuses near some of our cities, that should be very feasible.

The Culture bonus, however, is even more important. By building them early, we can achieve the 1000 year bonus that much sooner, while the turns are still many years each that 1000 years goes by even quicker!

Justus II
Deputy Culture Minister

Originally posted by Justus II
In looking at what we can do to improve the culture of our young nation in the most efficient manner possible, let us not forget that we will soon have the ability to store our knowledge in Libraries. Due to our naturally scientific nature, these are cheaper than temples, yet produce even more culture! The added benefit of increasing our learning rate is a bonus.

At this point, with science in the 30% range, it would take a city with 7-8 trade to make the library science bonus exceed the maintenance cost, (7 trade at 30% = 2 science, +50% = +1 science, making up for the 1 gold in maintenance). However, with the gold sources and other bonuses near some of our cities, that should be very feasible.

The Culture bonus, however, is even more important. By building them early, we can achieve the 1000 year bonus that much sooner, while the turns are still many years each that 1000 years goes by even quicker!

Justus II
Deputy Culture Minister

The Domestic Department fully intends to construct libraries in all cities not officially recognized as military training centers as soon as possible. Rush building will be utilized, and our citizens will be made temporarily unhappy, but once they realize the glory of our cultural superiority, they will be satisfied with their sacrifice.

The year is 1400BC and the Total Cultural Value of the great lands of Phoenatica is 130. Listed below are the individual values:

Fox Nest - 114 for the Great Palace and a temple
Shailonegha - 10 for a temple
PDX - 6 for a temple
Eyr - 0
Khatovar - 0

In reading all the postings, I've come to the conclusion that you're all right. I don't know how you did it, but pretty much 100% of the citizenry is absolutely right. Which brings me to me...

Looking over my recommendations for city placement, I must say, what did they put in my drink? Even I wouldn't use the same spots, simply because I easily found new ones. But i won't bore you with that.

I will say that I am feeling highly unqualified for the position of Leader. With every step forward, it appears to be two steps back. I am thouroughly enjoying the Privilege of Cultural Minister, but maybe the position shouldn't be so vocal in matters that are seemingly outside the parameters of the Cultural Department. I would like to tone down my role in the development of our nation to be more in line with observer, responding to matters of Culture when asked by the President or Cabinet, and of course writing the Cultural Report.

This brings up our Deputy Minister of Culture, Justus II. I would encourage Justus II to try to attend some chats and become familiar with the swift moving operations of a turn session. This will also allow the nation to become more familiar with him. Welcome aboard, Justus II.

BTW, i have moved up to Khatovar and hope you all can come up and see us sometime. We'd love to have ya. Thank you and good night.

As there was a request for a screenshot with future city development marked, I’ve uploaded one here:

edit: see URL at bottom....next edit: that's only working half way
let me go find some help
I'll put this bad quickie in here till i can get the good on up and in
it's at the bottom, image002.gif


I believe securing the eastern front iron deposit is a priority. Egypt will soon be moving in to claim it and our territory [A]. After the iron, then securing the resources west of the inland sea (still to be named) [B]. One of the original suggestions early in the game, (I can’t remember who suggested it), is south of Fox Nest in the hills [C]. The newly discovered coastline will make for a good city site having fish, forest and mountain. Again in the hills [D]. The far west tip, SW of Shailonegha, a city could use the forest to build and become a strategic point. Not only would it secure the coast, but would give early detection of NW naval activity [E]. The gold deposits on the southern shores of the inland sea will help give a boost in alleviating the monetary drain we are sure soon to feel. And the city will help expand our SE border [F]. Finally, because it’s soon to be a hot spot, we should secure the dye fields as we cross the mountains to the NE [G].

This will mean 3 quick settlers from Khatovar. We will also need workers for the southern cities. Roads to cities [B] and [C] should be built out from the eastern desert tile of Fox Nest. All cities should be placed quickly to stop the advance of Egypt, Greece, and Rome. Barracks are a priority in cities [A], [B], and [C]. [D] and [E] should work on temples and get an immortal or spearman from one of the barracks. [F] and [G] are to far off to worry about at this time.

I am aware of the war effort in Phoenatica. I voted to fight. The time draws near when our men will have to leave their loved ones to face another man’s sword. The training and equipping of our men will be a sight to see. As the war draws closer, the fever will run higher. There is nothing like the advance of a heroic army to help us learn of the culture in foreign lands. Soon we will be eating of their foods, and wearing their fine woven materials, and riding their horses. Let us prepare for the Immortals.

I appreciate and enthusiastically support our Domestic Advisor's position on libraries. It is important that we move forward with our National Literacy Campaign.

I will try to attend the next chat session, it depends on how close to schedule I get home from work, unfortunately, as being Deputy Cultural Advisor does not yet pay a full-time income, I have to maintain my real job. ;)
But I am very interested in the cultural aspects of the game now, I am in the middle of trying for a culture victory in GOTM6 (my first attempt).

I am going to stay in Fox Nest for now, where I can continue to promote the construction of the Great Library.

The year is 1125BC, and Phoenatica’s Total Cultural Score is 218. Listed below are the individual culture points:

Fox Nest -----> The Great Palace – 130, temple – 28
Shailonegha-----> temple – 32
PDX -----> temple – 28
Eyr, Khatovar, Pherris, and Civinator are all at zero.

At the present time, 6 tribes are building The Pyramids, and we are one of them. Building a temple in Eyr and Civinator are also current projects.

All of the other 10 known tribes of the world are impressed with our culture and all are polite, except for two of them. The Babs, who have just declared war on us, and the yanks, who must sense our eagerness to rid the earth of them.

Yes, we have been gearing up for war since dawn, when Shaitan saw the poll results and went about instructing our main departments to make preparations. We have spent the day turning the great ship of Phoenician Destiny in that direction. And this was a good thing, as the Babs in their purposeful strut approached us and demanded our map. I am grateful that we turned them down as within the same breath, they declared war on us. Because the Babs are so far away, they don’t pose much of a threat at this time, so we can concentrate on the Northern Territory. Our army at this point in time is average compared to the rest of the world, with the exception of the Indians and the Babs, who are stronger.

Pherris and Civinator are the two new additions to Phoenatica. Military training and iron production will take place in the well-named city of Pherris and once connected to the rest of the nation, Civinator will bring dyes to our capital.

Of the eleven known tribes, Phoenatica’s World Ranking is 7th, and we can attribute this fact to our high level of culture. The small incremental steps past the other tribes to 1st place will not take much time, I’m sure.

A big thanks to Grey Fox, our President, and Eyrei, our Domestic Leader for a fine job of guiding us through these early times as we crawl through the darkness. We are doing remarkably well in the big picture and will soon become a world power.

The DOC Press Conference:

Statement - The DOC does not acknowledge the cabinet vote for the two new minister positions as the cabinet seat have not been defined well enough and posted atop the voting poll. This is an atrocity to the citizens of Phoenatica and to the polling process in general

DOC Press Conference:

Statement: The DOC acknowledges the editing of the first official Cabinet Vote. The newly listed responsibilities and privileges are in-line with the standards that should be used for future Cabinet Votes. The DOC cannot stress enough the importance of clarity and definition in all matters requiring a vote. Also noted and recorded is the extension of the Cabinet Vote through Sunday night, ending at Midnight.

On a personal note: The Cultural Minister hopes that he did not offend others in his vigorous attempt to protect the people.

I appreciate the Culture Minister's diligence on this matter. I should have been more precise, but I am at work, and am trying to keep my posts as short as possible to avoid getting caught. :cool:

Today it seemed the whole world was against us…but I was wrong. It was only six out of the other 10 known nations….. what a relief. Now we stand a chance….

The Year is 875bc
Total Cultural Value
Is 298



The individual city cultural values are listed below:

Fox Nest----------------------- The Palace – 150, temple – 48
Shailonegha------------------- temple – 52
PDX---------------------------- temple – 48
Eyr, Khatovar, Pherris, and Civanatoria are at zero.

Here is a screenshot of our seven cities:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/7cities710bc.jpg

Although the turn session took 2.5 hours to play, we only took 9 turns. Our prosperous nation is bringing in 15 gold per turn, increasing our bank to 470 gold. Our armies are average to most of the known world, yet inferior to the Babs and the Yanks, our two main concerns in this new World War. All of the other 10 nations are impressed with our culture, but only four of them are polite. These being – The Zulus, The Chinese, The Indians, and our close neighbors The Egyptians.

Our World Ranking is 249, which gives us a sixth place standing of the 11 known nations. Once again we would have to contribute this to our nation's Culture. It is keeping us aloft, just above mid-point in the pack. The Greeks, Americans, Romans, Egyptians, Iroquois, Babs, Aztecs, and Chinese all join us in a race to complete the Pyramids. We will jump this track once we complete Literature and start building the Great Library along with the Americans who have just started it in a small northern town. At the moment, India appears to be the only nation building the Oracle.

I have included two more screenshots. The first being the northern portion of the known world and the second being the southern portion.

All in all it was a very trying day as one nation after another kept joining the Babylonian cohorts in the war against us. As we scrambled to adjust, we changed our production efforts to an even more military stance, only this move was of a more defensive nature. Keep in mind we will get THE IMMORTALS in three turns (at least production/upgrading will start). At this time, we will have landed on all fours, so to speak, balanced, and ready to face the world.

the southern portion:

Some opinions posted by the DOC –

Agree with not stopping at 3 American cities in the war. Take all of them. edit: i need to slow down on the drinking.
An alliance with the Egyptians (if there is to be one) should be against the Greeks, and definitely not against the Americans.
There should be a spearman being built in Khatovar (this was discussed and decided before the game was saved) so that it can accompany the settler it builds next, unless the military promises to send an immortal with the settler.
The warrior E of PDX should be moved to the mountain next. Under the warrior to the N of PDX, one of the 3 workers should be sent south to Khatovar to build a road to Civanatoria.
The worker by Pherris should be moved 1 tile SW to build a road to connect Pherris to the main road. Then 1 tile west to connect the incense. Do not connect Shailo.
The warrior north of Eyr should go W, then NW to guard the coastal area.
We are sorry to have seen the one lone warrior in the Northern Territory perish, and hope that the other lone warrior in the E keeps healthy for the rest of his journey.

Alliance with Egypt, if any, should be against the Greeks. This situation could possibly cause a reverse domino effect, making the mil. alliances between Greece and the Romans and Aztecs have the two latter nations attack Egypt. Then the Aztec alliance with the Iroquois would trigger, that would trigger the Iroquois/Babylonian alliance, and hopefully triggering the Babylonian/American alliance. If the Babs brought the Americans into this scenario, it might avert some of their troops east to Egypt, and not towards us. This is a long shot, but it worked one way, why not the other?

The alliance should definitely not be against the yanks, as it will be easier to take cities from the yanks than from the Egyptians. Why send the Egyptians North?

I stand in full support of our President, our military, and of course our Minister of Culture during this time of national emergency. World events change so quickly, (especially when I am out of town a couple of days:eek: )
I support the decisions mentioned so far, and would pursue an alliance with egypt if at all possible. Someone mentioned in another thread that their demands are tied to the amount in our treasury. I have noticed that before, and if so it might be worth trading/buying tech, then waiting a few turns until we can upgrade some immortals (i.e. spend our treasury) and then try to ally. This may reduce the cost.

I understand the need to switch most cities over to military production for the time being, but think we must maintain our pursuit of the Great Library. If not, once someone finishes pyramids, we could be faced with a cascade of nations switching to the GL, and if we are not already far along we will not catch up.
The remaining cities should focus on military output.

Justus II, I don't think there's anything to worry about with the GL, it seems to me the majority of the people (or at least officials, since I haven't seen many people respond to this specific issue) support keeping the GL building (stockpiling in the Pyramids). We still have plans to switch to another wonder if anyone beat us to it.

Originally posted by Cyc
Some opinions posted by the DOC –

The alliance should definitely not be against the yanks, as it will be easier to take cities from the yanks than from the Egyptians. Why send the Egyptians North?

I disagree with my honorable and wise fellow cabinet member.

I think an alliance now against the Americans is preferable as they are the only country that can threaten us in reality.

If we assume that we must get an alliance with Egypt or they too will be against us (and I believe that) then we will still need several turns to mount even a basic attack force, and it will be well after twenty turns before we could credibly begin to take over all of the US.

I am beginning to fear that we are spending too much effort focusing on our upgrade path for our warriors rather than facing the reality of how this game is turning against us. This continent is too big to realize our manifest destiny any time soon. We need to focus on building an efficient large empire that will support multiple victory paths.

If the Americans are building horsemen, and they undoubtedly are, considering the horse hooked up near PDX, then we will soon be facing a mobile invasion forced from the east and slow moving but powerful legionaires from the south. I feel it is best to neutralize the American threat now, which would still leave the most efficient American cities to us.

Most important is an alliance with Egypt against someone, but second to that, I feel the Americans are preferrable. I am open to persuasion.

Let's get a warrior out to the American horse though no matter what.

Bill

In reviewing this thread, i noticed i may have been a little brief in stating my opinions. Specifically, i felt that if an alliance with egypt was struck, it should be against our foes to the SE, the Greeks. In signing this deal, we would wish them luck and immediately (if not sooner) return home to prepare to attack the yanks. i still feel the best course of action would be a clock-wise sweep across the north (starting with the General's rush for the great city of Washington) and then on into Egypt.

Welcome back, Justus II.

Cyc,

Where did you get that picture at the top of this thread? Was that an in-game screenshot, or did you create it? I like it, good theme for the Department of Culture!

The Year is 850bc
Total Culture Value – 306

Individual Culture Values Listed Below

Fox Nest –-----> The Great Palace 152, temple 50
Shailonegha –-> temple 54
PDX –-----------> temple 50
All Others – zero


Today was a short but eventful day, as the attendance of the Chat Session matched the activity of the discussion boards yesterday. Our President Grey Fox had other business to attend, our esteemed Vice-President/Domestic Leader had a rare occasion for a D&D game, I believe we never heard from the moderator, and so on down the line. The Military Office Representative showed up briefly, but the main stays for the session were our Trade Minister, our Cultural Minister, and the newly appointed Skilord covering the Domestic Department. It was decided that Skilord should take the helm, as the department he represented was highest on the list for chain of command. And an excellent job he did.


IMMORTALS! What else can I say? As our fine worker connected the iron to Pherris, which had just completed a barracks, we were ready to upgrade the 3 warriors to IMMORTALS. This was done immediately and they now await orders. Beyond all the cheering I thought I had heard trumpets in the background.


The session only lasted one complete turn, but during that turn we were able to secure a trade deal with Cleopatra. Our Trade Minister will probably explain the details of the deal in his Department thread. Basically our move was to entangle Egypt in a long-term arrangement involving money for techs. This appears to have worked and it’s to our advantage. As we are not buying peace from Babylon or any other nation, and still intend to move military forces onto American soil, we needed some kind of assurance that Egypt would not join our list of enemies. At the moment this appears to have been accomplished. Kudos to Bill, our masterful Trade Minister.

That’s pretty much it. We moved the settler in Eyr down the road towards Fox Next on its way East. We moved the worker off the iron by Pherris SW to build a road connecting the iron and Pherris to the main road. Brought our workers north of PDX to safety from an American advance. Had our warrior in the East elude a Grecian archer and not much more.

Even though we upgraded 3 warriors to IMMORTALS, our military strength weakened some as now the Yanks and the Greeks have stronger armies. Our World Ranking is 252 and we are tied for 6th place with the Americans. Fox Nest is the top city in the world (hooray!). We are second in population, and first in approval rating with a 60%.

10 nations are now building the Pyramids, two are building the Great Library, and still only one building the Oracle. Our construction of the Pyramids in Fox Nest is the sole Phoenician cultural activity. That about wraps it up for this Cultural Report.

The DOC proudly hangs this graphic representaion of our nation's Cultural Value in the department thread. This work is done by one of the many artists soon to be displayed in the Phoenatica Cultural Art Museum.

At this time, the DOC would like to offer the current President and Leaders not only honorary membership to the Museum, but seats on the Museum advisory board as well. The Museum Curator will be Cyc, our Cultural Minister. The Museum is scheduled to open soon.



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The Year is 490bc
Total Culture Value – 507
Individual Culture Points:

Fox Nest – The Great Palace 186, temple 84, The Great Library 6
Shailonegha – temple 90
PDX – temple 84
Pherris – library 48
Civanatoria, Khatovar, Eyr, Philadelphia, and New York are all at zero.

Phoenatica is the world leader in the Cultural arena, keeping us in 5th place with a World Ranking of 314. Fox Nest is still numero uno as a world-class city and as a nation we hold the number one spot in 7 world categories. The Yanks, Romans, Greeks, Chinese, and Zulus are now admirers of our Culture, and all other nations are still impressed.

Only two Great Wonders have been completed at this time – The Pyramids by the Iroquois and The Great Library by the glorious nation of Phoenatica. All of the other nations are building the Oracle, although we are not. India is currently working on The Great Lighthouse.

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Our Military forces have in deed given Abe a bloody nose, as we have captured two of his leading cities, Philadelphia and New York. Our forces are now marching on the capital.

In reviewing the maps, the DOC would suggest moving a defensive unit to the Shailonegha area, working on road construction and repair, and eventually after the enemy forces have been cleared from the Great Valley Area to the south, clearing it of jungle and developing it.

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And finally, it seems we have squandered our chances at “shoring up” our lakeside real estate with defensive fortifications. The Egyptians have moved in quickly and taken some prime spots. Because of their location, one Egyptian city borders the capital and the other threatens the extended borders of Khatovar. For this reason, the DOC strongly suggests that a library be built in Khatovar after the completion of the spearman. This will allow Khatovar to secure its outer perimeter in a timely manner. The DOC feels this is a must as earlier suggestions to secure the area were put on a back burner and now the enemy is at our front door. The DOC does not believe pop rushing is warranted in this situation. Khatovar can then return to settler/unit production after the library.

I am highly in favor of building a library right after the spearman in Khatovar. Although yes, the Egyptians have taken some prime real estate, it is incredibly close to our capital city (the highest culture producing city) and three other cities that have the ability to become culture strongholds. In the distant future we may be able to overcome the city with our high culture, since it is so far away from the Egyptian capital. I also believe that we should found a city southwest of Lisht, for that would increase our chances greatly of taking the city with culture. It is also a fairly good spot, real estate wise. It has two luxuries (forgive me, I cannot remember their names, not silk...ugh, the name escapes me, I'm sure as soon as I press Submit Reply I'll remember) and a fair amount of shielded grasslandsd to the west.

I'd also like to take this oppurtinity to introduce myself as a self-proclaimed culture monger. I have been informed that I may be a DOC representative to the chat meetings. Hope to work with you all in the future!

Cyc, I agree with ALL your suggestions.

And about those prime Egyptian cities... I think those should be first on our military list when we finish our campaign against America.

I do not see a library in Khatovar as a high priority until it builds at least one more settler. The city of Lisht will likely be raised by immortals very soon, as it will not grow for another twenty turns. We must expand our culture with more cities first.

The most efficient way to build a library in Khatovar would be to rush it after it builds a settler, and then grows to size 2 again. With a garrison and 3 luxuries, the unhappiness would not even be noticed. This way it would take about 2 turns to build the library, as opposed to 20 or so. I know many of the citizens of Phoenatica oppose pop-rushing, so a poll would certainly be posted when this issue is at the forefront. Regardless, unless there is a majority disagreement with Khatovar producing a settler next, it will stay that way. Feel free to post a poll, I will abide by its results, though I would then campaign for a prompt pop-rush.

I've just noticed we keep on talking about whipping. While I don't object to the necessity, I must say I will be VERY glad when our rushes put a dent in the treasury rather than killing part of our population, and we won't have to bring EVERY rush to poll, just the more expensive and contraversial ones.

Originally posted by Falcon02
I've just noticed we keep on talking about whipping. While I don't object to the necessity, I must say I will be VERY glad when our rushes put a dent in the treasury rather than killing part of our population, and we won't have to bring EVERY rush to poll, just the more expensive and contraversial ones.

I too, look forward to this.

Argh, what's all of this talk about razing cities??? Unless you are going to build a city right over it, there is absolutely no point in razing cities. Our culture is high enough that we should be able to suppress any uprising and flipping, so why not just inhabit the city? We could keep whatever primitive building they built and we wouldn't have to think up another name! Plus, do you REALLY want to rape and pillage that Egyptian town? I'm totally against razing any town, especially when we have the highest culture rating.

@eyrei - The DOC feels your approach to Khatovar's production is totally inappropriate.why should the city wait until it loses 2 pop for a settler, then wait till it grows again so you can kill off the population with pop rushing, again. It is such a waste. Let it build it's library naturally, gain a tile or two so that it will be able to produce units quicker and produce more gold per turn and a number of other benefits naturally associated with city growth. Your actions to stunt the growth of Khatovar have not gone unnoticed. Let the city build what it needs to help the nation grow and to develop. The DOC feels your recommendation borders on the absurd.

Originally posted by ssmith619
Argh, what's all of this talk about razing cities??? Unless you are going to build a city right over it, there is absolutely no point in razing cities. Our culture is high enough that we should be able to suppress any uprising and flipping, so why not just inhabit the city? We could keep whatever primitive building they built and we wouldn't have to think up another name! Plus, do you REALLY want to rape and pillage that Egyptian town? I'm totally against razing any town, especially when we have the highest culture rating.

The town of Lisht will be auto-razed because it is only pop 1.

@ssmith619 - your opinion about razing cities is felt by many here and is the general consensus, unless absolutely necessary (whatever that means). There IS nothing we can do about a size 1 city.

There IS nothing we can do about a size 1 city.

Well we COULD wait for it to grow THEN capture it, but that really makes NO sense what so ever, which means "There IS nothing we can do about a size 1 city."

But on the productive end of things....

I don't feel that Eyrei is making an ABSURD suggestion.

-We need a library in Khatovar.
-Getting it up quickly could help us with our current endevours. (defending from our enemies and taking their land, along with getting a good start.)

Taking these things into concideration I feel that Rushing, while it may not be the best thing to do, at least deserves to be brought up for discussion. Some times the whip is called for, but we must decide that the benifits will outweigh the penalties if we do it.

Cyc: I am trying to keep a good sense of humor about this, but your constant attempts to provoke me and damage my reputation with baseless accusations and attacks on my character are unacceptable. I strongly suggest that the DOC at least attempt to maintain a professional relationship with the Domestic Department for the good of the empire.

As Falcon said, on a more productive note, the DOC's recommendation has been taken into consideration and rejected based on the fact that settler production is far more important than defending our cultural borders from cities that will not even exist much longer. Again, feel free to post a poll on the subject, and I will abide by its results.

They are not baseless accusations eyrei. you have been watched very closely since the begining of the game.

As, at this point in the game, 6 of the AI are on the verge of monarchy or the republic, we are sure to get one of these through the Great Library very soon. At which time we can pay for the rushing of our improvements as opposed to wasting our citizens. If we were to start the library now and not pop rush, we could wait until the cost of paying for it was acceptable to the Domestic Department. This would keep the city of Khatovar from continually being knock down to a size one town and having a slow growth period back up. It would also allow Khatovar to produce any units, improvements, and income on a larger scale. It's a win-win situation.

Originally posted by Cyc
They are not baseless accusations eyrei. you have been watched very closely since the begining of the game.

As, at this point in the game, 6 of the AI are on the verge of monarchy or the republic, we are sure to get one of these through the Great Library very soon. At which time we can pay for the rushing of our improvements as opposed to wasting our citizens. If we were to start the library now and not pop rush, we could wait until the cost of paying for it was acceptable to the Domestic Department. This would keep the city of Khatovar from continually being knock down to a size one town and having a slow growth period back up. It would also allow Khatovar to produce any units, improvements, and income on a larger scale. It's a win-win situation.

It is not a good idea to switch governments during a war such as this. It will be probably about 40 turns at least before we switch governments, and we will not have surplus gold for a while after that. As far as being knocked down to size one all the time, it will continue until we have build all the settlers we need. The only way we can afford to build a library there is to rush it, because otherwise, our expansion will completely halt. While this war is going on, almost all of our cities will be producing units to fight, while one or two will be producing settlers. The time it would take to build a library in Khatovar without rushing it is unacceptable.

I still find your position as cultural minister strange, as you attempt to attack me as willing to pop-rush, yet you ignore the fact that our civilization would be almost completely without culture if we hadn't used pop-rushing. Your position was created so that cultural concerns would not be forgotten by the other departments. It was not created to complain every time a cultural improvement is rushed.

Why don't we drop this? It benefits noone. If you do not like my policies feel free to voice your opinion, and run against me in the next election. Have you noticed that noone has jumped on your bandwagon to criticize and threaten me? The issue you take so personally has seemingly been resolved to most peoples' satisfaction, as noone else has posted about it in days. Let it drop, please.

This is not a popularity contest, eyrei. This is becoming like a political party, and I would not have it be like that, for I would gladly rush to the side of Cyc. No one is critisizing you, they are critisizing your position on this one issue. Don't take everything so personally, for this is a democracy and if you have a bad idea no one will spare you their feelings, at least someone will object and others will gladly rush to their side. As for both of you, you must take this less personally. Our empire is large, and although not the most techonologically advaced, Lincoln's empire is within our grasp. Something is going right, and it's safe to bet that Cyc is doing a good job balancing culture and whatever else, and you eyrei, you are doing a good job in the Domestic Department since our citizens are happy and our cashbox is growing. I suggest we put aside our disputes, and warn you eyrei, many people would gladly jump to the aid of Cyc. I hope you to in the future can resolve your differences without being so bitter, and I must remind you, you each have your own point of views and neither of you will budge, so why not just bring it up tomorrow during the chat session (Cyc, I'll be sure to appose it in your absence, if that is the Culture Department's feeling) and let everyone else decide?

Since both of you have such differing opinions, post a poll about the library issue and let the people decide. That's the whole point of the game. You both have arguements for your choices, so spell them out in the poll and let the vote stand. :king:

If you guys can't end this before it gets worse, I will. I will not let this get to personal attacks against anyone from anyone.

That's OK, Duke. I'm tired of debating the point. I wasn't going to say anything more about it as I have too much to do. The only reason i took it this far is I felt I had to in a patriot sense, i suppose. Couldn't give it up without a fight. Besides, Eyrei has too much power for one individual.
ssmith619 thank you for your support. Totally blew me away. It's hard to find support these days. Hopefully i will be able to return the favor.

grow up children.

Eyrei has too much power for one individual.

is criticzizing his policies going to help this? If you want to change the constitution call for a change to it, don't criticzize an able official.

just so i won't seem too biased:

I still find your position as cultural minister strange, as you attempt to attack me as willing to pop-rush, yet you ignore the fact that our civilization would be almost completely without culture if we hadn't used pop-rushing. Your position was created so that cultural concerns would not be forgotten by the other departments. It was not created to complain every time a cultural improvement is rushed.

you can't really tell him how to run things in his department.

SKILORD: I agree with your point about changing the constitution but there is also the question of overstepping constitutional authority. You were elected governor yet because of discussion regarding geographically based provinces what you actually govern was cast in doubt. While this doubt lingered eyrei was content to act as governor for all our cities. I think this is the type of thing Cyc is trying to point out and so have I.

Our domestic leader has taken his job to heart and should be commended for his work but he should also be more aware of the limit of his authority. And I will add before this all rekindles that I think eyrei has been more aware of these limits since the recent constitutional debate.:)

Originally posted by donsig
SKILORD: I agree with your point about changing the constitution but there is also the question of overstepping constitutional authority. You were elected governor yet because of discussion regarding geographically based provinces what you actually govern was cast in doubt. While this doubt lingered eyrei was content to act as governor for all our cities. I think this is the type of thing Cyc is trying to point out and so have I.

Our domestic leader has taken his job to heart and should be commended for his work but he should also be more aware of the limit of his authority. And I will add before this all rekindles that I think eyrei has been more aware of these limits since the recent constitutional debate.:)

I also think part of the problem is that I am VP and domestic leader, two of the more powerful positions at first glance. However, VP is a nearly powerless position, and this is why The Duck of Flanders appointed a cabinet member to it. I actually did not even want the job, but it made sense for me to start out with it, as it did not affect the COC, because the domestic advisor is right after the VP.

As far as my continuing to govern after Skilord's election, I do not think that is fair. With all of the things going on, I did not realize that I should be passing part of my authority to the new governor. As soon as this was brought to my attention, I immediately supported Skilord governing the 6th-10th cities until we could decide on geographical borders.

I have apologized on a couple of occasions for the rushing of the library in Pherris without following the due process of the constitution (even though pop-rushing is not addressed in the constitution, which also makes me consider this an unfair accusation), and I apologize again. It will not happen again that pop-rushing is used without a popular vote well in advance. I believe my reasons for doing so were good, and that it was the right decision to use pop-rushing in this instance.

I am not power hungry, cruel, or conniving as some would lead you to believe. Please look at the facts, or lack thereof when considering this situation. I do not pretend that I was in the right throughout this entire situation, but I do believe I was libeled and victimized by demagoguery.

Finally, sssmith619, I am concerned that someone would immediately take to threatening on their first day as a member of this game. This sort of behavior is particularly unproductive when one knows little of the situation. Please refrain in the future from threatening me and we will get along well. As most members of this game will attest, I do not mind people disagreeing with my policies, and do take a close look at their concerns. When they begin to be insulting, it makes things very difficult, and a lot less fun for all of us. You seem interested in the game, and I believe you will make an excellent citizen, whether we agree on things or not.

This is the last I intend to say on this subject, and I hope we can all get over this. Government scandals tend to become old news quickly in real life, so hopefully the same will happen here so that we can get back to the business of running our country.

Peace.

alright, lol, think i've learned to shut up and not speak unless spoken to :-X

Please welcome ssmith619 to the Department of Cuture. He has been assigned the Chat Room Representative position. He will have authority to relay the wishes of the DOC to the President or player in Chat Room Session.

Sorry I couldn't attend today's chat. I was unavoidably delayed. I didn't even have a chance to get to a computer to post a notice. This is the first chat I have missed completely, and feel really bad about it. My apologies especially to ssmith619.

Although as Cultural Minister I was unable to attend the last Chat, I have read the reports and have studied the maps. I must congratulate our military for their taking of the American capital as well as ridding us of their new infestations. We have achieved a Leader, which The DOC believes should be used to hurry the creation of the Hanging Gardens. The elimination of the Americans and an advance against the Egyptians is also supported. Peace with the other nations may be advisable if cost efficient, although this Department would like to see the Egyptians suffer the same fate as the Americans. In reading the Presidents speech, I was moved. I believe if we stand behind Grey Fox whole-heartedly, in the short-term he will move us toward our manifest destiny.

Many thanks to our Historian Daaraa, for the wonderful record-keeping reports. These reports save me from a lot of research and typing, as all seem accurate. Basically, the only thing left for me to report is the individual Culture Values.

Fox Nest – The Great Palace 194, temple 98, The Great Library 30
Shailonegha – temple 106
PDX – temple 98
Pherris – library 60
Civanatoria – library 21

The DOC would like to take this opportunity to apologize to our esteemed Domestic Leader, Eyrei. We did not mean to criticize your work, as we do appreciate all of your contributions to our nations Culture. Please overlook our past blunders and join us as our nation moves forward into a new era.

CENSUS OFFICE
The Census Office wants to remember all Citizens to re-register in the new official registry http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=20720 !!!

CHAT OFFICE
The Chat Office wants to remember the Department Leaders to announce their chat-representatives in the thread http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=20797 until 1 hour before the chat. They will NOT be voiced if not nominated in the thread!

Well, here I am again, apologizing for missing another chat session. Since we moved the start time a little later in the day, Mondays and Thursdays have been too tight for me to be there. Lately I’ve been thinking that we should spend weekdays discussing the directives we want to put in place, the paths we want to follow and the wonders we want to build, and then play two turn chats on the weekend. Maybe Saturday around 1700 GMT (noon EST) and Sunday 2100 GMT (4pm EST). That would pretty much give everyone a chance to attend at least one chat, plus give us all week to discuss issues and complete polls. Just an idea.

So as nothing happened last night, there is nothing new to report, game-wise. We’re still running our polls (don’t forget to vote), and still debating some key issues. I would like to say that the DOC feels the Hanging Gardens should be hurried with the Leader in PDX, making our citizens happier and our Culture value higher. Also switching governments to Monarchy is looked upon favorably. With this done we’re ready to ramp up and go to war. As our plans for making peace keep changing, it’s hard to make a call on which way to go, but with the Gardens and Monarchy the pressure would be lessened IMHO. In viewing the maps, I would think the Forbidden Palace would be better placed in the Athens/Sparta area or even in Phebes. Of course that means we would have to wait a little longer, but placement is better than speed. I understand Eyrei would like to get libraries in our remaining cities and would like to get this done with pop rushing. It all makes perfect sense from an accounting point of view, and Eyrei is gaining support from my Deputy Minister, Justus II and our new Chat Representative ssmith619. Therefore I believe it is time for me to step down and maybe take a literacy class from our new national program. I fully support each of my staff, if they choose to run for Cultural Minister. I would be very glad if the two of them filled the two open slots. I will nominate both of them tomorrow if they don’t self-declare.

So that about wraps it up. I will probably get three more Cultural Reports to do and then I’ll semi-retire as Curator of the Phoenatica Cultural Art Museum. It has been an honor to serve the nation of Phoenatica. It has also been my pleasure to work with my colleagues here in Fox Nest.

Thank you again,

Cyc
Cultural Minister

Originally posted by Cyc
Lately I’ve been thinking that we should spend weekdays discussing the directives we want to put in place, the paths we want to follow and the wonders we want to build, and then play two turn chats on the weekend. Maybe Saturday around 1700 GMT (noon EST) and Sunday 2100 GMT (4pm EST). That would pretty much give everyone a chance to attend at least one chat, plus give us all week to discuss issues and complete polls. Just an idea.



With a little tweaking this could be a very good idea. Maybe if we extended the sessions to a standard 15 turns to be played on Saturday and Sunday, and then added a Wednesday 1 turn session, where actions that have already been decided upon could be carried out so that further actions can be explored (for example, making peace with one civ to see how that affects a peace treaty with another).

Therefore I believe it is time for me to step down and maybe take a literacy class from our new national program. I fully support each of my staff, if they choose to run for Cultural Minister. I would be very glad if the two of them filled the two open slots. I will nominate both of them tomorrow if they don’t self-declare.

I am honestly saddened by your desire to step down. While we have had many disagreements, I think these have given us all a better understanding of how best to run this game. On issues such as pop-rushing, you do not stand alone. While your view is not necessarily held by the majority, a good number of citizens believe as you do on this issue. Maybe you should run for one of the Cabinet members 'at large' (as Shaitan calls them) in the next election. It would require much less time and effort than a normal cabinet position, and your experience in the government would be helpful. In fact, if you do truly desire to pass on your post, and are willing to take one of these seats on the cabinet, I will nominate you myself.

Therefore I believe it is time for me to step down and maybe take a literacy class from our new national program. I fully support each of my staff, if they choose to run for Cultural Minister. I would be very glad if the two of them filled the two open slots. I will nominate both of them tomorrow if they don’t self-declare.


I am both honored and humbled by Cyc's vote of confidence. I joined this game without any experience in the original, and volunteered for Deputy Culture Minister, because I wanted to learn what it was all about. Cyc has always been gracious enough to keep me informed, and I have learned much about this concept, and truly enjoyed myself. I also have gotten more involved in the culture aspect of the game between this and GOTM6.

I would be interested in running for the position of Culture Minister, with the acknowledgement that I am not able to attend the chat sessions on a regular basis. Depending on what schedule is finalized, I will certainly attend as many as possible, but unless the salary of the Culture Minister is substantially more than that of the Deputy, I will have to maintain my present job during the daytime! ;)

I hope that my Campaign was taken in the spirit intended, an opportunity for citizens to unite and support an agenda that benefits both science and culture. We have organizations which support our war effort, and I support our Manifest Destiny as well, I want to be sure that other aspects of our development are not neglected. I know the pop-rushing discussion is more controversial, and it is not specifically a part of the Literacy Campaign agenda. As I tried to state, that is more of a personal recommendation, based on our near-term situation, not necessarily a long-term policy. It was also never intended to be taken as dissension within the Culture Ministry, I certainly support Cyc and the great job he as done establishing precendents for a truly new department.

Cyc, I also hope you will continue to stay involved in the government, and look forward to working with you in promoting the Phoenatica Cultural Museum!

Well, I am shocked at Cyc's decision to not run for another term at Culture Minister, but I am also honored that he encouraged me to run in the next elections. I realize that I'll be running against Justus II, someone with a lot more experience, but I hope to at least become the Deputy Culture Minister, and I'm beginning to think that that would be better. Well, I'll run anyway and take what I can get. I'd like to congratulation Cyc on his great term and must say that the museum was a great idea. Although I do not support population rushing, I don't think it will matter anymore considering it is likely that we will switch to Monarchy soon (something that I think will come just in time, for we were forced to like under Despotism for way too long). Well, good luck Justus II and congratulations Cyc!

Shall we post a poll about change turn chat times to the weekends that cyc suggested?
It would be good for me then I finally be able to to make it to the turn chats.

All department heads please vote on the VP Position Band-Aide Measure. (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21178)

Just for the record, forum downtime is part of the Phoenatica Cultural scene. We were christened on our very first day as a nation with downtime. Hopefully, these small setbacks will be few and far between, but they do give us time to relax and enjoy some time off.

Some thoughts from the DOC:
The DOC agrees with Eyrei’s suggestion of a short Wednesday turn chat addition to my turn chat schedule change suggestion (stated above). Also crabapple’s poll suggestion is a good one and should probably be started soon.
The DOC disagrees with SirPleb’s proposal for Egypt brought forward by Falcon02 in the Military Dept. thread. I can address this later, but basically it will just allow the weaker Egyptians to fall away to a stronger civ, making it tougher for us in the long run. If the powers that be do accept this proposal the DOC advises an ROP with Egypt.
The DOC is glad to see that we are moving forward on the Governor/Province issue. We do not believe there should be a final poll running on the options, as a little more time is needed for more discussion and border options, as well as defining the standards used in declaring a Province.
Sorry to hear about all the nominees for the election who will not be accepting. There is still plenty of time to self-declare, so if you feel you can help the next administration through the Middle Ages in ANY way, please do so.
Civanator, I would have nominated you (and I’m glad you self-declared), but with your long absence, I have no idea how you stand on the issues. Please update.
As far as the war goes, the DOC would like to advance our borders south and east (not necessarily in that order) as much as possible before we stop to rest. We realize that we do not have as many troops as we would like, but with our decent sized bank, maybe we could cast some foot-high golden immortal statues and throw them at our enemies. You never know, it could work…
That’s basically it for now. We hope to see the completion of the Heroic Epic soon. Maybe someone could write of the battles in the Northern Campaign (hint hint). The notion of libraries in all of our cities, especially a library and temple in Eyr and Khatovar, two of our oldest cities, is extremely welcomed by the DOC. Keep the faith and don’t forget to vote.

Cyc
Cultural Minister

Oh, that I were in Greece watching some play whose writers have pointed a bony finger at our government. That’s one part of the Grecian Cultural Scene I admire the most. They weren’t afraid to use their arts to poke fun at or dramatically analyze/criticize the government elite. Some comedy (and I have seen some good groundwork for that here) can be just as inspiring or moving as a tragedy. I would imagine many a law or preference were changed or solidified after a rousing standing ovation or a deathly silent murmuring. But enough about the finer things in life…

It has been too short of a month. The hammering out of ideas, the pondering of hard choices, the listening and the shouting. These times will be remembered well. How one afternoon I plucked an apple from the tree of theDuckofFlanders, taking a position in this government no one seemed to want. From that moment until now, it has been a grand journey filled with perspective and learning, insight and vision. I have learned a lot from my honorable colleagues, witnessing their careful steps on the path of destiny. I will take my brief tenure as the first Cultural Minister as a lesson to guide me in my future endeavors.

I can only hope that I have solidified the backing of our government’s elite. That I have brought about an awareness of issues that might have passed us by. That I have helped others key on the wording of our constitution in its refinement and restructuring. I doubt that I will realize these hopes, but at least there is a small light at the end of the tunnel.

As we move forward in this New Age, let us not forget the trials of the last. Let us be aware of the new sights and sounds of modern technology, but not forget to develop the arts that mirror our society. Build the wonders that will bring pleasure to our people and draw new populations to our fold. Let us become an empire that other nations come to respect and admire.

In leaving the Department of Culture, I wish to thank the Phoenatica citizenry for allowing me this opportunity. I will now strive to repay you from the private sector.

Cyc
Cultural Minister

Another glorious day in the history of Phoenatica. Donsig and I stood shoulder to shoulder with the President as he directed Falcon02 in the commanding of our military forces. As we won many front line battles and recaptured our lands, news of Abe Lincoln’s demise reached us. The President bowed his head in recognition of the men we lost. We are now moving up our front lines and fortifying as new plans are drawn up.

With the Heroic Epic finished in Fox Nest, we are ready to continue our quest of Manifest Destiny, no matter what phase or direction we may presently be in.

Again as Daaraa has drawn up superb historical charts, the only real stats left for me to report to you are the individual Cultural points. At this point, I may suggest to Justus II that in your term as Cultural Minister, our list of cities may grow quite lengthy and individual stats may become tedious. This listing may not be required in the future, although I’m sure you’ll want to make reference to it in regards to one or two cities when you need to stress a point in your Cultural Reports.

Fox Nest – Palace 256, temple 222, library 69, Great Library 216, ...................Heroic Epic 28
Washington – library 90
Shailonegha – temple 230
PDX – temple 222
Pherris – library 156
Civanatoria – library 156

Congratulations again Justus II in your victory. I wish to congratulate all of the winners in the elections today. Hopefully the days ahead will be filled with the same glory as the past. The polls are still open. Don’t forget to vote!

Cultural Department Term 2 Thread (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21637)