View Full Version : Double Your Pleasure


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Nder
Jan 10, 2003, 02:27 PM
still love this mod.

Kal-el
Jan 10, 2003, 02:30 PM
When considering which new civs to implement we looked not only on their historical impact but also, and just as important in our decision if not more so, their geographic location.

Now, I know you don't all play on earth maps, but I do, so my own playing tendancies affected the decision quite heavily. In my opinion, there are already too many European Civs in the game, in fact in order to get a decent game played I have to eliminate some of my options right from the start and only play with four or five civs in Europe onmy 180x180 map. If we were to add in more civs to Europe they wouldn't come into play when I got arround to playing the game.

That being said, these are hopefully just the first additional civs to be included in the mod. I would like to eventually add in many more civs less dependant on geographic location for their inclusion. However, I am not sure if the editor will allow us to include more than 31 civs as options. I know it won't allow us to play with more than 31, but am unclear whether there is a prohibition on adding more than 31 civs to the game. That needs to be tested and determined. If it is possible you can all look forward to additional civs being included in future versions of the mod.

reedtwostep
Jan 10, 2003, 08:18 PM
first off,

these new civs you are adding to the next version, will they be for both reg civ3 and ptw or just ptw? those of us who havent dished out the extra $30 for ptw would still love to have the extra civs if its possible, (a more realistic world map with more encompassing civs like the ones you suggested would be awesome for better game play)

second,

about those maps... i realize that with dyp you can only play dyp maps... at least, thats been my experience. (its kind of a bummer, expecially when you see all the other cool mods out there, but, even that being said, this is the best most comprehensive mod ive ever seen, good work again) so i guess my point is: since dyp maps are all we get, is there a 140x140 map in the works? likewise, will you be using the current 180x180 map for the new versions?

lastly,

ive seen some pretty *sweet* unit mods out there check this thread (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=40728) can we use these with dyp? im too scared to try it and then have to redownload all that wonderful stuff i had to do for the original installation.

keep up the great work, cant wait to see what comes next

:goodjob:

ChaoticWanderer
Jan 10, 2003, 09:42 PM
me myself thinking of centeral asian figures would conhsider the hittites first they were war oriented but they where major palyer through out centeral asia and middle east. they were at times loctaed from the black sea to india to egypt maybe harder to gfind hittite city names but im sure i could come up with something

and you want true hitory importence for asian races go for the indus civilization is now considered to maybe be the first civilized nation ever

Kal-el
Jan 11, 2003, 12:08 PM
Originally posted by reedtwostep
first off,

these new civs you are adding to the next version, will they be for both reg civ3 and ptw or just ptw? those of us who havent dished out the extra $30 for ptw would still love to have the extra civs if its possible, (a more realistic world map with more encompassing civs like the ones you suggested would be awesome for better game play)The new civs will be available in the both versions and we will try and incorporatet he PtW civs into the vanilla version, though we can not use the PtW Graphics.
second,

about those maps... i realize that with dyp you can only play dyp maps... at least, thats been my experience. (its kind of a bummer, expecially when you see all the other cool mods out there, but, even that being said, this is the best most comprehensive mod ive ever seen, good work again) so i guess my point is: since dyp maps are all we get, is there a 140x140 map in the works? likewise, will you be using the current 180x180 map for the new versions?I intend on making a DyP version of my 140x140 map, just haven't gotten around to it yet. Real Life keeps getting in the way. You can of course use any other map available by simply randomizing the resources using the editor. This will replace any resources already on the map and will include all the DyP resources.
lastly,

ive seen some pretty *sweet* unit mods out there check this thread (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=40728) can we use these with dyp? im too scared to try it and then have to redownload all that wonderful stuff i had to do for the original installation.As I said in that thread, I love the look that Kryten and Steph are creating but am reluctant to implement it until all the units for DyP have undergone the conversion. Even then I think I will have it as an add-on and not the default visual.
keep up the great work, cant wait to see what comes next

:goodjob:
As I always say, "We aim to please." :)

pesoloco
Jan 11, 2003, 03:55 PM
Originally posted by Kal-el

As I said in that thread, I love the look that Kryten and Steph are creating but am reluctant to implement it until all the units for DyP have undergone the conversion. Even then I think I will have it as an add-on and not the default visual.

As I always say, "We aim to please." :)

If you want to use those units in this mod, you can just copy the existing graphics over top of the units in this mod.

pesoloco
Jan 11, 2003, 04:05 PM
Originally posted by Kal-el

As I said in that thread, I love the look that Kryten and Steph are creating but am reluctant to implement it until all the units for DyP have undergone the conversion. Even then I think I will have it as an add-on and not the default visual.

As I always say, "We aim to please." :)

If you want to use those units in this mod, you can just copy the existing graphics over top of the units in this mod.

Kal-el
Jan 12, 2003, 03:25 PM
The 140x140 Earth Map with DyP resources is now available.
Get it here. (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=704894#post704894)

ChaoticWanderer
Jan 12, 2003, 11:33 PM
Some thpughts on resources

first.
i think game should be increased to 2 food. their are alot of northern races that have and antive races built around hunting

also think game and fur should be spread over all terroans except desert

also think that a resorce called potatoes adding a food area for mountains tudra and Hills should be includded f possible
potatoes are a very important crop for many countries today and in the american past grows in some harsh terriabs like russia where little crops would grow and places ike idaho and sweet potatoes in the andes with high mountains.

gold should be spread to tundra and fllod plains to show mining styles in north canada and california ot name a few. also jewels fro flood plains since alot of jewels are also orginally river finds

also another desert food cource should be added. since the huge blocks of oasis sometimes found in small deserts is weird but huge dry words will have large deserts with nothing in them. maybe something like date palms or my favorite a domestication of goats. since many desert tribes raise and herd goats for food

these all came to pass being stuck in a couple of games recently in testing where i was 1st surounded by deserts and second aourounded in a forest in the center of a huge ice zone.

in the desert on their where a few oasis but then huge uusable tracts of desert that made building or moving impossible

while in the tundra and forests all good land north was taken way before i got there, but in the tundra all i had was huge bocks of game all over. but they werent enough to help me press or grow

just some thoughts on how to spread out the resources and make bad starts a little nore managable

Dragonlord
Jan 13, 2003, 07:03 AM
Originally posted by delmar
I am about to finish my first game with the DyP mod. Regent level, huge map, 16 civs (or what is the max?). The diversity is quite amazing on every front. And the changes in the naval unit movements are especially cool. Modern ships (well, I am at the Galleon) bring a huge boost to sea travel, you can really feel the difference between pre-Magentism and post-Magentism ships.

However, I think it is fair to say that the AI doesn't like this mod (yes, I know I should try higher difficulty levels :) ).

I've been playing a game of DyP on Deity level as the Chinese and have to say: the AI is handling this mod very well indeed! I've managed to come up from the underdog position through some clever diplomacy (allying myself with the VERY strong Arabs) and helped eliminate another strong contender, the Iroquois. Having conquered some of their best cities I can definitely say the AI DOES build those production improvements!
In fact, the Arabs are so strong, they've been ahead of me in techs all the way and are building Wonders left and right.. I'm trying for a domination victory by taking on the slightly less formidable Aztecs while I'm allied to the Arabs.. I'm taking his cities while the Arabs bomb his coasts with his 30 or 40 (!) Battleships..
:D

Anyway, I've said it before and I'll say it again:
THIS MOD IS THE GREATEST!!! :goodjob:

Esteban
Jan 13, 2003, 02:44 PM
An easy question that must've been already answered, but finding the answer through 113 pages of replies would be too hard a task for me :)

Anyway, how do you play the mod on an earth map ?

Kal-el
Jan 13, 2003, 03:00 PM
You can download either a 180x180 or a 140x140 earth map in the map section.

Skullbones
Jan 14, 2003, 01:04 AM
I'm using your mod with vanilla civ and when I used a bombard to fire at a city I got a strange message. It was one of those gray pop ups that usually say "such and such improvement destroyed". This one went completely across the screen and had a bunch of garbage characters and some text mixed in. If you are already aware of this, sorry to post it again.

Isak
Jan 14, 2003, 09:32 AM
@Skullbones: We haven't had that reported yet - are you using v.0.91 of the mod and Civ3 version 1.29f ? And did you install the mod after installing the patch?

Skullbones
Jan 14, 2003, 10:53 AM
Isak: No, i have v.90, yes and yes. I made a scenerio to try and recreate it with a stack of bombards against a city but I haven't seen it again. The text looked like something the foreign or trade advisor would say. :confused: I guess it was probably just a strange fluke.

Esteban
Jan 14, 2003, 11:00 AM
Best...mod...ever!!!

Isak
Jan 15, 2003, 03:22 PM
@Skullbones: I hope it was a fluke, but if you see it again, please send me the autosaves or a screenshot with the text. TIA.

@Esteban: I don't want to argue with that :D

ChaoticWanderer
Jan 15, 2003, 11:53 PM
the last 6 tests i did i got one decnt start.

this was a plains start but with not resources near by so though i grew nicely i had no iron copper or other building bcks to build power with

some thoughts not nearly enough iorn or copper on world map

in last 6 games NONE of my races were anywhere near a source of either.

which makes it hard to take from a race with iron troops

also my last 5 starts are.

Desert, tundra forest, small island, shared small island, plains, desert with little plains and flood plains

and even starting in hilly landscapes near mountains i havent gotten iron.

also finding it hard to find insense

maybe its jsut bad luck but i found a total of three iron on one content of a very alrge size. and all of them were near capitals. immpossible to get back when fighting iron troops and a large distence away.

being stuck on an island wiith no resources at the start and no near lands is very hard to come back from.

well jsut grumpy at all my immpossible starts lately

Jaceanders
Jan 18, 2003, 01:14 PM
:crazyeye: :eek: WOW. I haven't dl the mod because I wanted to read about all the updates and ideas on the thread before I installed it. I've been reading the thread on and off since the beginning of December a few pages every day while at work. I get to page 106 and OFL declares a new thread. I almost started a riot but thought better of it. Oh well, on to the new thread. 114 pages is a lot of reading material I think. You guys are wonderful imho and I can think of a few people Firaxis should contact to improve the game more.

Jace

ps. Whatever happened to Nightshade?

Kal-el
Jan 18, 2003, 01:18 PM
Not sure where he went. We have lost a few people along the way. Usually civilopedia editors. :( We get a lot of volunteers to work on it, but then they just disappear.

Isak
Jan 18, 2003, 03:09 PM
If it's nightstorm you mean, I think he got busy at work for a while, and then probably moved on to modding something else, but who knows.

It's a shame - I really miss pulling out the Whip on him.... not to mention cancelling his christmas.


Jason, where are youuuuuu? :whipped:


;)

agustindc
Jan 21, 2003, 05:15 PM
I've tried to go to the DyP site, but it seems offline. Perhaps it's just me...

Hope this problem is fixed soon!

Isak
Jan 22, 2003, 03:18 AM
I thought it was our webmaster Bernskov who was moving the site, but he has just informed that the entire section of the ISP's net is down at the moment. Sorry - I hope they fix it soon.

tmarcl
Jan 22, 2003, 05:13 PM
This may have been mentioned already, but when a barbarian enters a city, the game is crashing. I have PTW, and have downloaded the most recent patch as well as the most recent DYP.

Marc

Isak
Jan 23, 2003, 02:31 PM
@tmarcl: Please send me a savegame from just before this happens (using an autosave if necessary). I've had a few people report it before, but none of them have been able to reproduce the bug, and neither have I, so I still have no idea what's going on :confused:

BadAndy
Jan 23, 2003, 09:48 PM
O_o
backup....i m supposed to back up my files!!!
>_<

oh well

bshirt
Jan 24, 2003, 12:14 PM
This mod kicks ass & takes names.

Kal-el
Jan 24, 2003, 12:18 PM
:D Thanks.

tmarcl
Jan 24, 2003, 02:16 PM
Originally posted by Isak
@tmarcl: Please send me a savegame from just before this happens (using an autosave if necessary). I've had a few people report it before, but none of them have been able to reproduce the bug, and neither have I, so I still have no idea what's going on :confused:

I'm afraid I need to join the club on that one. I just tried reproducing it myself, and couldn't. I don't usually autosave, so I can't send you that. I will play another game, and make sure to autosave. With my luck, it'll work perfectly, now.

Just out of curiosity, have any of the others who reported crashes modified the scenario/player properties? In the game I played, I did, and in the test, I used the defaults. It's possible that this may be connected, though I doubt it.

Marc

tmarcl
Jan 27, 2003, 06:41 AM
Hey Isak,

Where's the graphics patch on the site? I downloaded the patch, but I'm still missing Summer Palace, at least.

Marc

bige2002
Jan 27, 2003, 05:46 PM
I was aimlessly looking through the scenerios on PTW and saw this. This is the geatest thing to happen to Civ III. Ever. I would offer my help, but my skills in the area are nonexistent. This mod rocks.

Isak
Jan 28, 2003, 04:07 AM
@tmarcl: The graphics patch is currently called 'Full Version 1.04x' - if you've already downloaded and installed that, make sure you installed it to the Scenarios directory, and also make sure you use the BIX file called 'Double Your Pleasure with GFX' when starting the game.

@bige2002: Thanks :) You can always help us by testing the mod - I think that's the kind of help we currently need most. If you haven't already, go to the DyP site and get the latest version of the mod, which will also make the Graphics a bit more interesting than what was included in the official PtW patch.

Dragonlord
Jan 30, 2003, 01:58 AM
@Isak: Re playtesting

After reading your last comment I just thought I'd give you some feedback:

I've been playing DYP extensively and am now up to Tank Warfare on Deity level, on PTW with the 1.04x patch. Everything works just fine, with just a few minor niggles:

- The graphics for the Fishery are missing
- The hidden units (e.g. Spy) are worse than useless: the AI alwasy seems to know where mine are and will even cross my territory to get at them. OTOH, the AI only builds them to defend it's cities, it seems like, and it's a pain in the a** attacking invisible units where you don't even see the hit points!
- Just like in vanilla Civ, the AI never uses most of the special units, like adventurers and such, not to speak of artillery. This is the usual Civ beef, though, nothing to do with your mod.
- The sometimes voiced complaints that the AI can't use all those extra city improvements correctly are unfounded, IMO. On Deity, at least, they build them just fine and have built some real powerhouses!

Keep up the good work!

EzInKy
Jan 30, 2003, 11:00 AM
I just started using DYP on PTW also. Very impressive! The Steam Frigate is a beautiful unit, and being on an island I built scads of them, lol.

As far as the spy, I found the AI tended to use them as "artillary" in their cities. When I used it to pillage, even my allies would go after them.

Besides the Fishery graphics missing, so was the Echelon. I built it, but had no idea what it did until I downloaded the spreadsheet because their was no Civilipedia entry.

Overall, this is a fantastic mod...please keep improving it!

bige2002
Jan 30, 2003, 05:55 PM
I'm getting the update right now. I'll report any bugs or problems I see. Also, thanks again for the mod!

kingjoshi
Feb 01, 2003, 08:36 PM
It's been so many months since I've been here that the posts have doubled!

I congratulate you guys on having released version 1. Isak and Kal-El, you've guys been working hard on this for such a long time. Is RobO still working on this? I wish i had time to play this game or even help out on this great mod. I can't imagine how many changes and improvements have been done since I last played. Congrats again.

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 01, 2003, 08:43 PM
Please, I have two questions.

1 - I try to enter DYP's site WWW.CIV3.BERNSKOV.COM, but IE says it can't find the site. Is there something wrong with the site?

2 - Is there any other site I can download the patch?

Kal-el
Feb 01, 2003, 09:21 PM
Hey, Kingjoshi!

RobO is still an integral part of the team.

Hakeem-RJ,

the site is civ3.bernskov.com, but it is currently down while we move to a new server. We hope to be back up and running soon.

Isak
Feb 02, 2003, 06:06 AM
The site should be up again, and it's even on a faster connection now :eek: A million cheers for our web-wizard Bernskov :goodjob:

but note that you should not type WWW in front of the adress - that won't work :) it's only http://civ3.bernskov.com

And welcome back Kingjoshi - good to see you again. Don't be such a stranger :D

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 02, 2003, 07:52 PM
Kal-el, thanks for the information... I was kind of desperate, trying to enter the site. But I'll wait. I am kinda new here, although I play civ since the first one...

Isak, thanks, and as soon as I posted the message, I noticed that I put the WWW, but I know it's just http://civ3.bernskov.com.
Anyway, thanks everyone!

Hakeem-RJ
Rio de Janeiro - BR

Chris1111
Feb 04, 2003, 06:40 PM
Dont know if this was fixed somewhere but I get this error when trying to load the mod. :(

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 04, 2003, 08:03 PM
A few things to say: Lots of images have that pink color on it. Plan on doing something?
Lots of buildings, such as Temple of Zeus and Taj Mahal have the same drawing. Could you do the Temple of Zeus a little more greekish?
Some wonders like Civil Rights have really weird icons.
Couldn't there be an option to choose if you want or not the percentual limit to be spent on science, like 60% on Chiefdom?
Some icons on the science advisor are really odd, there are faces out of the little square. And about the advisors, the button MORE under the guy's face is below it should be.

I was playing China, and I started with Warrior Code and Mining...
Ok, but the thing is that I put my first city in a city with lots of grassland around, but my city doesn't grow bigger than 2! What do I do? Irrigation is so far away... :-( sorry to ask, it's because I don't know all the little things of the mod!

Well, sorry to bother with these little things.
Anyway, Double Your Pleasure has really doubled my pleasure playing the game, is by far the best mod.

Thanks.
Hakeem-RJ (Sorry for my bad english!)

kingjoshi
Feb 05, 2003, 05:56 AM
I haven't played the mod in half a year and I'm sure it's changed, but here goes me trying to help anyhow.

Originally posted by Hakeem-RJ
Couldn't there be an option to choose if you want or not the percentual limit to be spent on science, like 60% on Chiefdom?

Could this still be because certain government types are given limitations? I remember the limit at cheifdom being 60% for science, tax, or lux so if you set it to something higher than 60%, each turn, the computer would set the max back down to 60%.


I was playing China, and I started with Warrior Code and Mining...
Ok, but the thing is that I put my first city in a city with lots of grassland around, but my city doesn't grow bigger than 2! What do I do? Irrigation is so far away... :-( sorry to ask, it's because I don't know all the little things of the mod!


When I used to play, I made sure I had cities near water and built harbors. I used them just to increase population. Also, it's advisable to use Kal-el's maps because they used to have tons of resources that made growth dependant upon resources. The rules of the game have changed and your style of play needs to change to adapt.


Well, sorry to bother with these little things.
Anyway, Double Your Pleasure has really doubled my pleasure playing the game, is by far the best mod.

Thanks.
Hakeem-RJ (Sorry for my bad english!)

Always feel free to ask questions. There used to be a lot more people during the summer. I guess people went back to school and work, just like me.

Cheers,
Kiran

Kal-el
Feb 05, 2003, 01:37 PM
actually most of the discussion now takes place over on the CDG forums.

Isak
Feb 05, 2003, 02:37 PM
@chris1111:

Make sure you have installed the mod to the correct directory and that you have all necessary patches.

If you can tell me which DyP version number you are using (and whether you have PtW or not), I will be able to give you some more directions :)

@Kingjoshi:

No one is allowed back to real life, once they've tried DyP

:satan: :D

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 05, 2003, 07:33 PM
Plan on doing something new to DYP? Adding or changing stuff?
Is there anyway I can help you guys out? I have some (little) programming experience.
Hakeem-RJ

Kal-el
Feb 05, 2003, 07:39 PM
we are currently in the process of another major update. new civs, more flavor units, a new small wonder, and a few other changes.

What kind of work can you do?

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 06, 2003, 08:09 PM
i'm finishing programming science college this end of year, and have worked with virtually all of the programs, are you guys programming something? what do you need most? if it's graphical i have two friends from college that would like to help.

what news civs are you gonna include?

Kal-el
Feb 06, 2003, 09:09 PM
well, we're not programming anything unless you can crack the editor. As for graphics, we can always use graphic artists. We need units, leaderheads, and I wouldn't mind having a few of the city improvements updated.

New Civs:
Ethiopia
Inca
Polynesia
Mali
Siam
Sioux
Tibet

Check out the DyP Forums (http://www.cdgroup.org/forums/tbs/civ3/viewtopic.php?t=1218)

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 08, 2003, 09:27 AM
well theses civs sound good, the incas should be in any game.

maybe if you give me some details i might pass it to them.
they would be glad to help.

RobO
Feb 08, 2003, 11:55 AM
Originally posted by kingjoshi
It's been so many months since I've been here that the posts have doubled!
That's even without counting all the stuff going on at CDG.
I congratulate you guys on having released version 1. Isak and Kal-El, you've guys been working hard on this for such a long time. Is RobO still working on this?
Sure am. I have just been ignoring this thread for quite a while. Time to go back to monitoring it, I guess.
But we're only at version 1 for the PtW version. The other one will reach a beta 1.0 soon. I hope :)
I wish i had time to play this game or even help out on this great mod. I can't imagine how many changes and improvements have been done since I last played.
Neither can I. Kal-el is extremely creative, as I'm sure you know. And I also throw in an idea once in a while. Isak is conspicuously silent in the discussions - but he does a pretty good job editing in all the changes :D

Good to hear from you again.

Isak
Feb 08, 2003, 01:55 PM
Originally posted by RobO
Isak is conspicuously silent in the discussions - but he does a pretty good job editing in all the changes :D

I'm usually flooded with emails and also supposed to do some 'manual labor' (I was going to say: Actual Labor, but the boys might get a bit grumpy if I use that expression :D ) on the mod, and by the time I actually get around to read Kal-El and RobO's discussions, they've usually changed their minds already, and it's too late for me to make suggestions. Doing it any other way would require me to get on top of their discussions, and that just isn't humanly possible. I'm usually always 5-10 emails behind those two. :)

I usually don't see changes until the time when I have to implement them. But don't worry, I'll yell then, if I disagree ;)

Kal-el
Feb 08, 2003, 02:11 PM
Originally posted by Hakeem-RJ
maybe if you give me some details i might pass it to them.
they would be glad to help.
What kind of help are you volunteering them for?

If we are talking unit animations have them look at this:
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/Inquisitor1.gif
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/Inquisitor_Poses.gif
These are drawings for the Inquistor flavor unit that will be seen in the next version of the mod.

If we are talking about Leaderheads, here are the ones we still need.
Mongkut of Siam
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/brynner52.jpghttp://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/Yul.jpg

Songsten Gampo of Tibet
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/songsten.jpg http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/songtsen_gampo.gif

and

Kamehameha I of Hawaii
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/kamehameha_and_his_queen.jpghttp://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/kamehameha.jpg http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/KAMEHA.jpg

Rais
Feb 09, 2003, 05:10 AM
Wow Kal-El your mod kicks ass!! I've played a few games and a few of them i got through the entire game including the modern age... I was wondering about a few things in this game though... I don't know if these questions were asked in previous posts but I have managed to find some of these bugs:

Echelon Great wonder doesn't do anything

Many of the Great wonders that say you need a certain building in it dont actually need the building there to build it, such as...

Supreme Court(i believe this is the name)
also many others can't name them off my head ... i'm sure a few of them are like that though! maybe even circus maximus

Also, i was wondering the camel resource was supposed to do anything at this point because it seems as if its just there...

Also, the low graphics version appears to have more resources in general.... such as..

Natives
Copper

some others possibly, also the building requirements were different in these...

I'm not sure what you are planning, but the graphics rich version is great! It's just missing the content of some of the non graphics version.

Thanks for all the time you put into it, I hope this helps you if it helps at all.

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 09, 2003, 06:34 AM
wow these images look good!
well ok, i'll meet both tuesday and will show these images to see what they can do.

Kal-el
Feb 09, 2003, 10:27 AM
Rais,

Welcome to the DyP!

Echelon gives Police Stations in all cities.

Some wonders require a certain number of improvements to be built. Once that number has been reached the wonder can be built in any city, even one without the prerequisite improvement. Odd, I know, but that is how the game was programmed.

Camels will be used in the next installment of the Mod.

Natives and Copper have been removed as resources.

Check out the DyP forums by following the link in my signature. There you can sign up to be a DyP tester, then you can get access to the latest and greatest version of the mod before it is released to the general public.

Glad you are enjoying the mod. :)

Hakeem-RJ,

Cool, have them look at this concept art for some future era units as well.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/Chessmen.gifhttp://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/Raven.jpghttp://www.civfanatics.net/uploads2/42_Red_Arrow.jpg
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/MarkVII.jpg

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads3/Scout_Armour.gif

Kal-el
Feb 09, 2003, 10:33 AM
I have been dying to see those guys made!

griffon65
Feb 11, 2003, 03:54 AM
Nice mod! Ive playing play for a few days now and no crashes. This is the best civ mod ive found so far.

I do have one problem though. I just reasearched engineering and still cant build mine/engineer I tried pressing the "M" key and the icon for mines isnt even there. Can someone help me out?

Isak
Feb 11, 2003, 08:41 AM
Hi Griffon, we're glad you like it :)

I'm unfortunately not home at the moment, but if you can tell me which version you're using, I'll check what's wrong when I get back home tonight.

kingjoshi
Feb 11, 2003, 04:10 PM
That's cool artwork. not only are you a knowledged historian but also an artist! and you even hold a good job on the side :)

I checked out the other site but was intimidated by the thousands of posts.

I remember that rarely did we go through modern tech and stuff, with more people playing or the newer versions, is that more common now? I rarely go to use the cool units at the end with this mod.

Kal-el
Feb 11, 2003, 06:00 PM
I finally got to play the mod and was able to advance into the modern age. There are some adjustments that will have to be made in regards to the tank and apc advancements in order to give the tank a bit longer shelf life. Other than that it seems to be playing out well. :) But still we don't hear too much about the later stages of the mod. :(

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 11, 2003, 10:06 PM
well i showed him (one of them) and they asked me to see the game, they will come here next thursday or friday to see the game ok?

lots of wonders don't show on the city, and the improvements are changed. my barrack has the image of a factory!

Kal-el
Feb 11, 2003, 10:11 PM
ok by me. was he interested in helping? does he play Civ3?

The city screen is messed up and to get it to look right would be a lot of work that right now nobody is willing to do. We can only get the first 65 improvements in the bic to show up in the city screen and the mod has closer to 180 with more on the drawing board so we all kind of figured the bang just wasn't there for the buck.

Rais
Feb 11, 2003, 10:27 PM
heya kal el,

Thanks a lot that sounds great i just registered in cd forums but i dont know where to get recent maps that would be cool for sure. Your maps rock! I just have the one off of your site which is 1.04.
O yeah... that one didnt have any description for echelon if it helps =). Definitely a great map though! It would be really interesting if it was possible to add worker actions but i doubt thats possible :( would definitely be cool though. Keep up the good work!!! Know that your efforts aren't going to waste. I'm sure many people play your map!

Morbius
Feb 12, 2003, 04:29 AM
ive been playing dyp several months ago, and ive also tried to contribute a bit; now im back and im wondering whether only the PTW dyp is being improved anymore because of the higher version number.

do i have to get PTW to be able to play the newest and best dyp?

sorry if this has been asked already, ive tried to find the answer but either im too blind or it isnt there.

regards: Morbius

RobO
Feb 12, 2003, 06:29 AM
Hi again, Morbius :D

Good question.

Our plans are to keep the two versions in line as much as possible, but the PtW version will naturally have more functionality than the regular one. And there will veentually be more PtW variants, as you can play with the turn setup.

The different numbers simply reflect the fact that the one going out with PtW ought to have a 1.0 version ot larger. We didn't feel the regular version warranted such high praise at the time ;-)

We are currently working on 1.0 beta and 1.10x beta, to be released simultaneously with matching functionality. You can get the betas by signing up as a DyP tester on the CDG forums.

Morbius
Feb 12, 2003, 07:11 AM
thx for the swift reply, RobO.
i think i will get this PTW thingy, then.
id rather not sign up as official dyp tester, tho, since my time is rather limited ATM, and only signing up to get the version earlier without being able to really test it for you , seems wrong to me :)

regards: Morbius

RobO
Feb 12, 2003, 12:31 PM
That would not be wrong at all, but you do run the risk of using a version that needs to be updated, forcing you to restart a game.

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 12, 2003, 02:55 PM
i see :)

well he has never played, and was interested, but he'll have to come here to see it!

ok? :)

Kal-el
Feb 12, 2003, 03:10 PM
sounds good to me. :)

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 12, 2003, 04:14 PM
actually i got another question. may be stupid...
is there anyway i can put more than 512 cities in the game?

Kal-el
Feb 12, 2003, 04:42 PM
there is a max number of cities, I am not exactly sure how many that is, but 512 sounds right.

Micaelis Rex
Feb 14, 2003, 07:44 PM
Woohoo, post 2323! Now THAT is a milestone, much more significant than #2000! :goodjob:

:beer: :band: :beer:

Procifica
Feb 14, 2003, 08:37 PM
there are 512 cities max in 1.29f

RobO
Feb 15, 2003, 12:50 AM
Originally posted by Mike23
[B]Woohoo, post 2323! Now THAT is a milestone, much more significant than #2000!
Definitely not!
Post 2000 on page 100 (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?postid=502427#post502427) :goodjob: :beer: :band: :beer:

is obviously a much more significant achievement than post 2323 on page 117.

Micaelis Rex
Feb 15, 2003, 10:26 AM
I beg to differ, 23 is the best # in the world, and thus 2323 is the best post (until we get to 232323) :goodjob:

Kal-el
Feb 15, 2003, 10:30 AM
Mike23, I take it you are a Michael Jordan fan. :D

RobO
Feb 15, 2003, 01:34 PM
I have no clue how Michael Jordan fits in here, But I do now see the connection to Mike23 and post 2323. Congratulations on making that personal goal! But it's still not anywhere near as important an achievement as post 2000 on page 100 :D

Yoda Power
Feb 15, 2003, 01:39 PM
no offence, but that "2000 vs 2323" discussion you have is kinda dumb:crazyeye:

Micaelis Rex
Feb 15, 2003, 03:34 PM
No offence taken, its just a bit of fun! :D (Hehe, I'm rhyming :D)

:lol: Ironically, Mike23 isn't even derived from Jordan (whose # is 23), my name is Mike, and favorite athlete wears #23 (not Jordan). This thread is historic, so lets enjoy it! (no, not the rhyming again :D)

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 15, 2003, 07:05 PM
kal-el. he has just seen the game. seemed to like it although didn't understand that much. he took my cd with him to install in his pc to start to understand how the game animations work, ok?
:)
FLAMENGO!!

Kal-el
Feb 15, 2003, 09:03 PM
ok, tell him to take a look at the flicster program (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10208). He should also look into the SBB utility (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=42092). Both of those programs are vital in converting standard animations to Civ3 units.

Unregister
Feb 20, 2003, 05:24 PM
I must tell you Kal-el that i love this mod and it is by far my favorite mod.

Unregister
Feb 20, 2003, 05:25 PM
I must tell you Kal-el that i love this mod and it is by far my favorite mod.

Kal-el
Feb 20, 2003, 05:36 PM
thanks. :)

Balrog
Feb 21, 2003, 10:50 AM
Yup, decent mod! :goodjob:

Only problem is that I prefer the medieval/fantasy genre, I never play with the 'normal' Civ3 settings. :rolleyes:

Isak
Feb 21, 2003, 10:53 AM
Originally posted by Balrog
Yup, decent mod! :goodjob:

Only problem is that I prefer the medieval/fantasy genre, I never play with the 'normal' Civ3 settings. :rolleyes:

So, in other words that post was really just an advertisement, right? :rolleyes:

RobO
Feb 21, 2003, 01:49 PM
It obviously was. Mostly. Relax, Isak, this is not a competition to get the most followers. No point, we'd win if it was :D

And I can see that you have just returned the favour :cool: ;)

Isak
Feb 21, 2003, 01:56 PM
Hehe - I was only kidding, but it was just one of those 'I just can't resist' situations ;)

And I actually do think the mod looks cool, and probably wouldn't have noticed it for another month if it hadn't been posted here, so honest thanks Balrog :goodjob:

RobO
Feb 21, 2003, 02:19 PM
I agree. Downloading as we speak to check it out. Though it appears from the discussions to need some tweaking. And one big file would have been much easier.

But now I'm advertising that mod even more. Time to get back on topic ;)

Balrog
Feb 22, 2003, 06:17 AM
No. I had to reply. [I downloaded DyP] The mod is really good!
:p

Kal-el
Feb 22, 2003, 08:41 AM
Originally posted by RobO
I agree. Downloading as we speak to check it out. Though it appears from the discussions to need some tweaking. ...;)
As if we should talk ... DyP could still do with some tweaking too, IMO.

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 22, 2003, 10:52 AM
Hi!
Well Marcelo (my friend) is asking if you could give some hints about what to put behind the leaderhead, through the times, ancient, medieval, ind, and modern.
He said it is the easiest part to do, so he will start from that.

Kal-el
Feb 22, 2003, 07:01 PM
which leaderhead is he planning on doing?

fuerza
Feb 22, 2003, 08:42 PM
Is there a way to use the DyP mod, or any mod for that matter, on the Mac version???

I'm new to mods but would really like to try some of these.

Thanks,
Fuerza

Kal-el
Feb 22, 2003, 11:05 PM
I don't think so. Sorry. :(

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 23, 2003, 07:29 AM
hi! i think he is planning on doing the bald guy, i think siam!
not so sure! any recommendations?

Kal-el
Feb 23, 2003, 12:55 PM
I would love to see King Mongkut of Siam.

For Ancient he could have a Jungle Hut type background.

For Medieval he could have a Palace Background as in the pictures.

For Industrial he could have a similar background but with more industrial type props. i.e. a globe or world map in the background.

For the Modern age I guess an office with the Skyline of Bangkok in the background.

Hakeem-RJ
Feb 24, 2003, 08:45 PM
hi! ok, i will tell him tomorrow! and will ask him for a pic


i was playing and i got the encyclopedia, which gives me any tech known by 2 other civs right? but problem there, cause the arabs and greeks had naval tactics, and i didn't! why?

B.Archer
Feb 24, 2003, 09:57 PM
New to this Mod.

Great job DyP team, hadn't played Civ for months you gave me a reason to pick it up again.

Quick question and apologies if this has been asked already...

I'm play PTW 1.14f and loaded DyP 1.04 and appears that when ever I capture a rival civs city the entire civ gets whiped out and every one of their cities turns to rubble....

Now this would be a great tech in say MOO3 but here I have to believe I goobered somthing up.

Any thoughts would be great.

Regards

Isak
Feb 25, 2003, 06:53 AM
Hi B. Archer

Glad you like the mod :)

It sounds to me like you're playing it with the 'Regicide' option set. Try starting a new game and make sure when you get to the rules selection screen in the setup, that you deselect this option (unless of course you're starting to like it :) )

cedwin
Feb 25, 2003, 07:20 AM
I want to congratulate you on the fine work you've done on DyP! As a longtime Civ player, I'm impressed with the effort involved not only in the development of this mod, but also in the integration of play balancing, art work, user input, and Civ tradition that is evident in the game play with this mod. What you've provided for free Firaxis would have to charge us for in at least three expansions.

I have a few questions that hopefully somebody with more DyP experience could help me with:

1) With all the added technologies in the game, has anybody considered the need to modify the time spans from the default DyP currently uses. In my initial games, I've found (quite naturally) that even with my highly research-oriented Civs, my progress is slow relative to the game clock because I have that many more required technologies to pursue before entering another era. What has other's experience been?

2) It's obvious that one beginning strategy that one must adopt in DyP is to rush build "Clans" even more than the Settler builds in previous Civs, until Dynasticism kicks in. What other beginning strategies have DyP players adopted to deal with some of the other early strategy differences required in the mod-such as lack of early mining and irrigation, key Wonder changes (like Pyramid), the increase in food requirement etc.

Thanks for your help!

Kal-el
Feb 25, 2003, 10:15 AM
I am currently working on an Extended version of DyP for the PtW version (the only version with which that is possible) It will have approximately 40 more techs but will also have 460 more turns. :D

pdescobar
Feb 25, 2003, 10:49 AM
Originally posted by fuerza
Is there a way to use the DyP mod, or any mod for that matter, on the Mac version???...
Originally posted by Kal-el
I don't think so. Sorry. :(

Really? That surprises me. I myself have the PC version but since a mod is made up of platform-independent files (graphics, sounds, text, and bic/bix) it ought to be possible.

Fuerza, does the mac version use .pcx and .flc graphics and .wav sounds? If you aren't sure, take a look in your PTW folder. One of the subfolders should be Art and one of the folders inside that should be Units. If the units folder has a units_32.pcx file and the subfolders have files of type something.wav and something.flc, I'd guess that mods in general should work. The only potential problems at that point would be the Scenario Search Path and the distribution method. Since DyP is distributed as a zip file, a mac should be able to extract it ok, and since I thought I saw a mac version of the editor announced recently, the former could be taken care of too. Can anyone else who uses a mac confirm that they have succeeded or failed in using mods?

Kal-el
Feb 25, 2003, 12:20 PM
I was thinking the bic file for the mod might not be usable by a mac, but I could be wrong.

pdescobar
Feb 25, 2003, 02:15 PM
Originally posted by Kal-el
I was thinking the bic file for the mod might not be usable by a mac, but I could be wrong.

Well, I just noticed there's a Mac forum here ;) and I was able to dl and open a mod posted there as a BIC (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=45634) on my PC so I'm pretty confident it'd work the other way. Based upon a quick scan of some of the posts, the main reason there hasn't been much testing and such on Macs is the lack of an editor until recently. So, fuerza, go ahead and download DyP and give it a try. If you have problems, either someone here or in the Mac forum can probably set it right.

Kal-el
Feb 25, 2003, 04:25 PM
I look forward to hearing whether that works for you or not. :)

RobO
Feb 26, 2003, 01:57 AM
Originally posted by cedwin
1) With all the added technologies in the game, has anybody considered the need to modify the time spans from the default DyP currently uses. In my initial games, I've found (quite naturally) that even with my highly research-oriented Civs, my progress is slow relative to the game clock because I have that many more required technologies to pursue before entering another era. What has other's experience been?
Other than the massive change Kal-el mentioned, I'll probably "hack" a variant of the PtW version with a longer timespan, once we get the next version done. It will have to have adjusted build and tech costs, however.
As to the research pace, this varies a good deal btw. different players. You can find some comments on this issue here (http://66.111.46.203/forums/tbs/civ3/viewtopic.php?t=1944&sid=d15b707f900beb28cc0f738cf58c443c)

2) It's obvious that one beginning strategy that one must adopt in DyP is to rush build "Clans" even more than the Settler builds in previous Civs, until Dynasticism kicks in. What other beginning strategies have DyP players adopted to deal with some of the other early strategy differences required in the mod-such as lack of early mining and irrigation, key Wonder changes (like Pyramid), the increase in food requirement etc.
Check this forum (http://66.111.46.203/forums/tbs/civ3/viewforum.php?f=44&sid=d15b707f900beb28cc0f738cf58c443c) - it has tome tips. There could be more, though.

Thanks for your help!
You're welcome :D

päällikkö
Feb 26, 2003, 08:14 AM
You definitely need more time to be able to research everything. For my last game on monarch level I adjusted the time scale as follows. I was ahead of game time in the middleages, but it turned out to be quite right in modern times. It should be possible to launch a starship between 2000 and 2050 AD.

1) 40 x 40 years
2) 56 x 25 years
3) 57 x 20 years
4) 74 x 15 years
5) 100 x 10 years
6) 125 x 4 years
7) 75 x 2 years
[8) 150 x 1 years]

That makes a total of 677 turns until 2050 AD. (These numbers seem somewhat odd, but that way most of the changes in turn length are at decent dates) By the way, the total number of turns should be entered in the lower left corner of the Scenario properties table and one should turn "time limit" on. That is because there seems to be a bug with the time limit:

Even with "time limit" turned off I lost the game after 540 turns(in 1913) due to a "Mandatory End of Game". I was only second in victory points, although I was miles ahead tech-wise and could have crushed anyone with my tanks. (The AIs fell behind in research when they were fighting a great war or two in the middle ages, and they did not recover from that afterwards.)

A minor BUG I encountered: The ironclads do not have the "All Terrain as Roads"-flag checked. Makes them pretty useless compared to steam frigates.

@Kal-el and his crew: Great mod!

RobO
Feb 26, 2003, 08:59 AM
Thanks, päällikkö, I'm sure the beta testers will find that bug report useful.

The Ironclad does not have ATAR on purpose (we want to limit it's movement), but you are right that it does not compare well with the steam frigate when you look at the other values.

Donegeal
Feb 27, 2003, 01:24 PM
Possible bug:

I modded DyP so that the no one could build settler units and leader could build cities. However, my problem did not come from my mods. Let me explain the situation:

I am isolated on an island with the Zulu (I am China). We both have one city and do not have contact with anyone other than each other. My city grows to size 8 (I have an inland lake on my border) and I am working a gold tile, a silk tile and an Iron tile on a tiny map. All the rest of the tiles worked have a road. I am playing on Warlord level. I have built the Colossus. Both governments types are Despotism. My Sci slider is set to 60% (the higest allowable for this government) and neither of us have discovered Lit. Shaka only has a size 7 city and only two fur tiles to give extra commerce.

I cannot compete with him in the research department. We had had two wars already and each time he gives me 2 techs and money for peace. He is continually a head of me in the tech department. I have at least 9 more units of commerce per turn than him (more like 12 or 13 with the gold, silk and inland lake). Why can't I keep up? Does the AI get a research bonus at this level? I don't believe they do. This is where my suposed bug comes in. I think that the AI is not limited by the slider restrictions based on government types. Has this come up before?

Donegeal
Feb 27, 2003, 01:26 PM
Oops... Double post.

Kal-el
Feb 27, 2003, 02:34 PM
that is interesting, I don't think anybody has ever tried anything like that.

Make sure you set the leaders AI to Settler and Leader, otherwise the AI won't know what to do with them.

Donegeal
Feb 27, 2003, 03:05 PM
Yeah... the leader building a city deal is another issue. I marked the settler strat for a leader (so it has leader and settler marked). Funny thing is is that the AI still doesn't know how to use them. And thank god for that, cause the AI was able to build them. This problem though is all mine and I will fix it (sometime). However, back to the AI Slider restriction bug. is there just something I'm doing wrong?

Isak
Feb 27, 2003, 03:46 PM
Some people seem to think that the AI can trade with other AI's even before they have had first contact. Not sure though - I'll try to test if the AI is limited by the Rate Cap, but I think it's going to be a bit tough to test really. :confused:

lz14
Feb 27, 2003, 09:07 PM
The tech tree and wonder list is really top class. Dyp is more qualified to the name 'civilization'. The oringinal game was more like a 'western civ'. Although most late wonders are still Europe/US, but I guess that's just history.
Adding Marxism before communism is right!
And I hope you guys can strengthen the modern age tech tree a bit more, it looks quite slim right now.

dguichar
Feb 28, 2003, 03:54 PM
I was playing a game as the Carthaginians against the Babylonians, Koreans and Indians. I built the Great Library and guest what...

I got "Natural Curiosity", because both Babylonians and Koreans were scientific. So it's like i'm now half scientific, i got their unique specialist. If i were able to get an extra advance by era, then i'll be fully scientifc. Obviously, that's not possible... unless i demand it as a tribute.

Keep civilized

David

Kal-el
Feb 28, 2003, 04:21 PM
yeah, that's what happens, but it doesn't really give you an advantage, because by the time you build the GL you should have researched philosophy or should be close to doing so, and at that point you get your own advanced specialists that give the same bonus as the Scientific Wisemen.

pdescobar
Mar 01, 2003, 07:01 PM
I decided to try out DyP 1.04 (GFX) under PTW 1.14f but it has thus far been a frustrating experience. The main problems I have stem from the state of the documentation, particularly the Civilopedia. I rely on the civilopedia alot to look things up, and with the amount of changes and additions in this mod, I'd normally spend as much time in there as in the game itself, initially. But looking things up there has been a confusing and frustrating experience.

Two examples,
-When looking up what techs to go for, I see a new wonder called Chichen Itza, check that out to see it requires Natives as a resource, and then find that Natives don't exist.
-I start out near jungle, notice my tribe can't settle there, check the terrain entries and see nothing about what is and isn't settleable.

Am I correct in assuming, then, that the civilopedia is still very much a work in progress?

Additionally, I am confused by inconsistencies such as the scenario description, which calls itself "Double Your Pleasure with GFX - v. 1.03x" (even though it was installed from "Full_DyP_PtW_1.04x.zip"). It then tells me to "See the DypReadme.txt in the Double Your Pleasure folder for more info. " and lists "Double Your Pleasure" in the search path, but I only have a DyP Folder, so I become worried that I'm missing things...

So, at this point, I have abandoned the civilopedia for anything but the auto-generated portions and am beginning to not trust the other docs either, but I'm going ahead and start up a game as the Ottomans. I settle my first city and move my worker to a plains square to find out that he can't do a darned thing with it. I'm industrious, and Sid tells me I know mining, and the Readme says "Mining Available with Mining" but after looking here, there, and everywhere I find out that I won't be building mines until the middle ages and Engineering.

In summary, this mod looks great. It has all this cool new stuff that I'm dying to see in action, but the documentation is screwing with me so badly that simply sitting here banging my head against the desk is starting to look like far more fun...

Any advice or suggestions? Is there a Tutorial Game or an Idiot's Guide to DyP buried deep within the 2400 posts of this thread? Or should I just forget about having fun and go back to cataloguing leaderheads? :)

RobO
Mar 02, 2003, 01:01 AM
Originally posted by pdescobar
Am I correct in assuming, then, that the civilopedia is still very much a work in progress?
Yes, you are. We have had some bad luck in getting people to work on thsi cinsistently, but there's hope now that it will finally be done.
Additionally, I am confused by inconsistencies such as the scenario description, which calls itself "Double Your Pleasure with GFX - v. 1.03x" (even though it was installed from "Full_DyP_PtW_1.04x.zip"). It then tells me to "See the DypReadme.txt in the Double Your Pleasure folder for more info. " and lists "Double Your Pleasure" in the search path, but I only have a DyP Folder, so I become worried that I'm missing things...
Oops. That's for Isak to deal with ;)
In summary, this mod looks great. It has all this cool new stuff that I'm dying to see in action, but the documentation is screwing with me so badly that simply sitting here banging my head against the desk is starting to look like far more fun...

Any advice or suggestions? Is there a Tutorial Game or an Idiot's Guide to DyP buried deep within the 2400 posts of this thread? Or should I just forget about having fun and go back to cataloguing leaderheads? :)
Don't Give Up :)
You'll get the hang of it soon enough.
Also, check this forum (http://66.111.46.203/forums/tbs/civ3/viewforum.php?f=44&sid=d15b707f900beb28cc0f738cf58c443c) - it has tome tips. There could be more, though.

Kal-el
Mar 02, 2003, 06:19 PM
once we get a stable mod in place I think we can expect to see more strategy type documentation become available.

bshirt
Mar 02, 2003, 06:32 PM
That would be great....

Still though, there ain't nothing like the DYP mod!

pdescobar
Mar 02, 2003, 07:28 PM
Originally posted by RobO
Don't Give Up :)
You'll get the hang of it soon enough.
Also, check this forum (http://66.111.46.203/forums/tbs/civ3/viewforum.php?f=44&sid=d15b707f900beb28cc0f738cf58c443c) - it has tome tips. There could be more, though.

Thanks. I've started a new game since I had gone a good while in the first game with a none-growing size 2 capital before I realized they could build clans which only cost 1 pop point. I'm determined to plod through this time, with or without documentation :) I'm on a break right now because I'm unable to sell off my granaries (right clicking on them results in an invalid page fault and necessitates reboot) but I'm 99% sure that's Firaxis punishing me for upgrading to 1.21 ;)

BTW, regarding the post by Donegal: If you have reached the point in the game where embassies are available, simply investigate an AI city and you will be able to see his allocation percentages for tax/research/luxuries

pdescobar
Mar 02, 2003, 08:43 PM
Originally posted by pdescobar (Yes, me! I'm talking to myself!)
I'm on a break right now because I'm unable to sell off my granaries (right clicking on them results in an invalid page fault and necessitates reboot) but I'm 99% sure that's Firaxis punishing me for upgrading to 1.21 ;)

This is why I left that 1% :) I now believe that the problem is not (at least primarily ;)) the patch's fault. Rather, the problem is that the civilopedia.txt lacks a "Maintenance" Game concept (there's a GCON_Maintenance12 and GCON_Maintenance36 -- or similar -- but no GCON_Maintenance) Because this is gone, when you right-click on a building requiring maintenance, the game crashes. Adding a GCON_Maintenance makes it happy again and the right-click displays a menu and allows me to sell off my granaries like a good little program.

I would guess that this applies to any of the right-click menu options which launch a civilopedia in that there must be a GCON for culture, happy faces, etc (I don't recall them all offhand.) And I wouldn't be surprised if a missing building entry caused a crash if you right-click that specific building, but that's all speculation. The only thing I know for sure is that the lack of a generic GCON_Maintenance in the civilopedia playing dyp-1.04x-with-gfx under PTW 1.21f will cause an invalid page fault if you right-click on a granary, barracks, or palace. And the fix is to edit the dyp civilopedia.txt and add one.

Kal-el
Mar 02, 2003, 08:55 PM
Thanks for the tip. :)

Gelvan
Mar 03, 2003, 06:04 AM
Firstly I have to thank you for this mod, it’s so wonderful, that many choices, that many units..! Plain and simple: you are great!

Here are some things I’ve noticed and changed (V0.91r):

140x140 map with DyP-Resources:
1. There were no Elephants. Added some in India and South Africa.
2. No Silk. Added some in China and West India.
3. No Incense. Added some in Israel (2), Tibet, Kashmir and Saudi Arabia.

I’m not sure if I did something wrong, but on my map they appeared not. I suppose it's a problem with the DyP-Bic- file not with the map file. Maybe you've put these ressources on fields where they can't appear in the DyP-bic.

4. Added Horses to the Camarque (near Marseilles). This Region is famous for them.
5. England became 1 Plains more in the south west.
6. Italy became 2-3 Plains more in the south, makes it look like a “boot”.

Furthermore I’ve added plenty of Barbarians in Asia, Africa and South America. Even though, it doesn’t prevent the AI from expanding there. Maybe changing most of northern Russia to a forest could help (remember civ 1 world map?). An other idea is to create strong barbarian defenders (Longbowman) to make it harder to push them away.

I replaced the American Civ with Spain.


Regarding Bombardement in Ancient Times

First I have to say, that this is mostly a question of how you see Archers. In my humble opinion, in Civilization, they are a supporting defense unit. Thanks to the game mechanics, they give a huge advantage for a defender, therefore, their stats shouldn’t be to high. Thus said, my suggestions of course only are an opinion.

Archer 0/1/1 (1/1/1) Cost 10 –1 HP
Bowman 2/2/1 (2/1/1) Cost 20 +/- 0 HP
Longbowman 2/3/1 (3/1/1) Cost 50 +/- 0 HP
Crossbowman 3/2/1 (3/1/1) Cost 40 +/- 0 HP
Arquebusier 3/6/1 (4/1/1) Cost 60 +/- 0 HP

Horse Archer 3/1/2 (1/1/1) Cost 40 +/- 0 HP
War Chariot 3/1/2 (2/1/1) Cost 30 +/- 0 HP
Chariot Archer 2/1/2 (1/1/1) Cost 30 –1 HP
Elephant Archer 3/2/2 (3/1/1) Cost 60 +2 HP

Even though the above could be discussed, I think 2/4/1 (6/1/1) for the Longbowman is too good. They should be significantly weaker than a Pikeman, and they shouldn’t be stronger in Bombardment than the Saltpeter Units. Furthermore I thought the crossbowman to be rather useless.

Camels! Knights and Crusaders

I made a Camel Rider unit (available with Stirrup), which is available to the Egypt, Persian and Babylonian instead of a knight. I made the Camel Rider cheaper, faster and gave it therefore only 2 defense. The Indian have their War Elephants, Chinese their Rider.
I’ve made the Crusader available only to the European, therefore the Eastern Knight unit (available with Chivalry) would be it’s equivalent for China, India, Persia, Egypt and Babylon.
Stats for both are the same – or different, that’s up to you.

Ressources

I’ve read, that it is not possible to add more than a given number of different ressources, and of course DyP shall be played not only on Earth but also on random maps, so I suppose it’s not possible to add more ressources (like papyrus, bronze, etc.).
But maybe you could make an “Earth only” version where it’s possible to seed them manually, and therefore have more of them.

One other suggestion: I’ve read you had to remove the slave ressources due to that problem of an upper limit, because of the random seed. Well, why not just use Camels for the Pyramids, Dye for Leonardo’s Workshop and Sistine Chapel, Incense for Religious, Spices for Indian Wonders of the World. Olive Oil for Bazars etc. – I played it with these changes, and it made trading quite interesting.

Units

In Zulus 800+ units32.pcx there is a section “DyP-Units”, where I found more pics than there were in Version 0.91 – well, maybe I just made something wrong. However using Zulu’s file makes it much easier to mod. I’d suggest to use this file for version 1.0 – one more MB doesn’t count that much. ;) And it really helps to add new units.

Civilopedia

Well... :)

Conclusion

This mod is very good. The Units are thorougly balanced and the only unit I’ve never built was the Troubadour (sounds) and the Crossbowman (Longbowman is better?) Every other unit was needed to defend against the AI, which had no problems with the changes (or at least it doesn’t seem as if it had). That’s truely an astoundish peace of work you’ve made there, needless to say, that all the new graphics for the civilopedia, the units, etc. were breath-taking as well. :goodjob:


Accelerated Startup

I like to play on Earth, and I hate when French gets killed 3450BC. Therefore I made a.. let’s call it scenario, where everyone has 3 cities from the beginning, or two cities and one tribe. Clan and Shaman ain’t available from the beginning but together with Caste System (which now needs "9" science rows). and they cost 3 pop’s. This worked really good, everyone was still alive in 1040 AD, England and Japan were quite strong. The only “problem” was China and Egypt. Egypt because they conquered Africa and were leading. China because they did the same with Asia, before they emerged Egypt and shortly had Africa as well. Aside of that, Europe looks quite shattered and the rest of the world is up to colonization.

Isak
Mar 05, 2003, 10:02 AM
Patch 1.05x has been released - it only has minor changes:

Fixed: Compatibility issues with Firaxis Patch 1.21f
Removed: Merchant and Freight units

Thanks to pdescobar for figuring out the cause of the right-click error before I even got a chance to see the bug in action
:goodjob:

And thanks Gelvan for a lot of good suggestions - I'm sure when Kal-El gets some more time on his hands he will review especially the Map suggestions - he is a bit busy right now, though, so please have patience with him :)

About Zulu's units, I have already cleaned up the units_32.pcx for the regular release (that file will go into the 1.00 version which is soon to come), and for the PtW version, I'll do the same, though for PtW the incentive to have just one file doesn't really make as much sense, but it makes it easier for me to control in the future, so what the hey! :D

Also we now seem to have no fewer than 4 (yes, Four) people working on the Sillyvopedia, and none of them are me, so I have high hopes for the next version of the Sillyvopedia.

If you get a scenarion worked out to your own liking, why not post it on our forum and let some of the testers there try it out and help you test it - we will definitely be looking for DyP scenarios and maps once version 1.00 (regular) and 1.10x (PtW) have been released.

CivAgamemnon
Mar 05, 2003, 04:38 PM
Speaking of the Sillyopedia, please report any bugs you find here (http://www.cdgroup.org/forums/tbs/civ3/viewtopic.php?t=1348). That helps us so much. I expect to have a better sillyopedia update within a month (one of our members is on a 3 week vacation and I'm traveling extensively Wed-Sun).

gorilladf
Mar 06, 2003, 02:01 PM
Ummm...holy S&!T! :D

I was an avid player when civ3 1st came out. I followed the LWC mod closely. Sadly it took too long and remained unfinished. I never lost interest in civ3 (Who could?) But it has been a LONG time.

ANywho I came back, only to find LWC dropped. Browsed around and found this......NICE!!! Can't wait to try it. But maybe I should?

How far away (estimate, I know) is v1.0?

Is this mod a scenario, or changes civ3 right off the bat?

This is exactly what I was looking for!

Isak
Mar 06, 2003, 02:53 PM
Hi Gorilladf

I loved the LWC mod too originally (and for Call To Power where it was also being developed - don't remember if it was CTP 1 or 2 though).

This is a full scale mod, which will change your Civ3 install (I'm assuming you don't have PtW), but it's worth a try IMHO :D

If you join the Beta Testers in our forum, you'll be playing v. 1.0 this weekend, unless I trip over a large bus and get hit by a comet at the same time :)

CivGeneral
Mar 06, 2003, 08:58 PM
Nice work on the DyP mod pack :). After playing this Mod pack gave me an insperation to make my own Mod pack using what I have gathered from the C&C forums :).

Hakeem-RJ
Mar 06, 2003, 09:59 PM
Hi there! sorry to stop posting the past few days, it was carnival here in brazil and i traveled with my gf!
my friend said that the siam guy is almost finished, just wanted to ask if 10 mb is too big!

also i got a question, about the game. has anyone ever had 40 minutes beetwen turns???? i got it today, and wasn't nice... i guess huge map with 24 civs shouldn't be an option...
40 minutes man!

well thanks!

RobO
Mar 06, 2003, 11:41 PM
Originally posted by Isak
This is a full scale mod, which will change your Civ3 install (I'm assuming you don't have PtW), but it's worth a try IMHO :D

Worth a try???
IYHO???
This is the best thing to happen to Civ3 since .... since .... ever :cool:
Don't miss out on it. :goodjob:

If you join the Beta Testers in our forum, you'll be playing v. 1.0 this weekend, unless I trip over a large bus and get hit by a comet at the same time :) [/B]
You do have a tendency to predict "in or just after the next weekend". Have you noticed that? But I gather this one might have a higher probability than usual :)

Isak
Mar 07, 2003, 08:10 AM
Originally posted by RobO
Worth a try???
IYHO???
This is the best thing to happen to Civ3 since .... since .... ever :cool:
Don't miss out on it. :goodjob:

Well, you know that my 'clan' does have humility running through our veins. In fact, it's only because I've lived 'abroad' for a few years that I could call the mod 'worth a try'. A few years ago, I would have said 'It's not too shabby, all things considered' and that would have been the best compliment in my vocabulary ;)

You do have a tendency to predict "in or just after the next weekend". Have you noticed that? But I gather this one might have a higher probability than usual :) Yes, In fact It's been ready to go for days now, I'm just holding on to it, to increase my own sense of feeling important :D

@Hakeem-RJ:

10 mb is fine - in fact I think most of the leaderheads made average 15-20 mb, so your friend is actually on the lower end of the scale, MB-wise. But in any case, we'll make the leaderheads an optional addon, to save the poor dial-up modem users from going crazy ;) I'm really looking forward to seeing your friend's work.

RobO
Mar 07, 2003, 10:12 AM
Originally posted by Isak
Well, you know that my 'clan' does have humility running through our veins. In fact, it's only because I've lived 'abroad' for a few years that I could call the mod 'worth a try'. A few years ago, I would have said 'It's not too shabby, all things considered' and that would have been the best compliment in my vocabulary ;)
I see. I come from the same clan myself (actually a somwehat more strict sect from the west), but I must have forgotten my roots. I probably lived too long abroad. Apologies.

Yes, In fact It's been ready to go for days now, I'm just holding on to it, to increase my own sense of feeling important :D

OK, Please let it loose now, then :)
I'm sure it can take care of itself.

gorilladf
Mar 07, 2003, 10:44 AM
OH I'll definetly use this mod. But I'll wait a little until after the testing. I'm a sysadmin, therefore I am allergic to beta.

Ok, well maybe I'll setup a 'test' civ3 DyP machine :D

Yup, no PTW. I like Civ3 as SP only.

How does this mod work with other mods like:
less yellow
Those cool new Multi figure units
I imagine unit libraries like Zues's would overwrite what you have done.

SO I should load this mod without others?

There didn't seem to be a FAQ on the DyP website. I read the readme, and some of the forums. I hate looking like a noob ;)

RobO
Mar 07, 2003, 02:47 PM
Originally posted by gorilladf
Ok, well maybe I'll setup a 'test' civ3 DyP machine :D

Yup, no PTW. I like Civ3 as SP only.

No problem. We'll be releasing both versions simultaneously.

How does this mod work with other mods like:
less yellow
Those cool new Multi figure units
I imagine unit libraries like Zues's would overwrite what you have done.

Terrain mods are not a problem. And I guess you can exchange some unit graphics easily enough if you can figure out what to overwrite where.

SO I should load this mod without others?

Not sure what you mean. With regular Civ3 DyP wil take over the install. You can't use that one with other mods. But you can install Civ3, patch, copy the install, then install Dyp in one of them. That will allow you to switch by renaming the two Civ3 install directories.

There didn't seem to be a FAQ on the DyP website. I read the readme, and some of the forums. I hate looking like a noob ;)
Sorry. Not enough time :(
I have a reference to a DyP strategy forum at CDG a few posts or pages back.
At least the civilopedia is progressing now.

Grey Fox
Mar 08, 2003, 03:38 PM
Ok, I've finally taken the time to test your mod Kal-El.

And the so far the strangest thing of them all... the workers can't do anything but scout in the early game... ;) So i scouted for 15 turns or so, returned home, and added the worker to the city.

And the settler could move one tile before settling...

Well, I'll see if this mod is fun, or just TOO much :p

Isak
Mar 08, 2003, 04:29 PM
Hehe - now where have you been all this time Grey Fox?

Your workers can't initially do a whole lot, unless you start off with The Wheel, in which case they can build roads.

You then need to get Crop Rotation, before you can start Irrigating (which we call 'Farming').

And you'll need Engineering before you can start Mining (which is called Engineering). Note that you can't Mine grassland, but you can mine Forests (think of Lumber Mills) in this mod.

About the settler, it's only the initial 'Tribe' unit, which represents your starting clan that moves that fast. It treats all terrain as roads, and in DyP that means it moves 2 tiles (not 3) ignoring terrain. Any settler units (initially called Clans if you're not a religious Civ, and Shaman if you are a religious civ) will move 'normally'.

So, to quote Yoda Power's sig (and some Sci-Fi movie) "you must un-learn what you have learned". :)

I guess it's been too long since the DyP Strategy Thread (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23380) has been advertised here, so there it goes again ;)

Grey Fox
Mar 08, 2003, 04:51 PM
Yup, I noticed those things.

And no, I havn't missed DyP. It's just that I didn't want to try it out... it just seemed to be TOO much. Something that will make it harder to balance. And I can bet that it's probably not as well balanced as Civ3 is, and you probably agree. :)

But it seems like a whole lot of fun, and I actually downgraded from Deity to Regent now just to try the mod out :crazyeye:

It's a little easy for me on Regent, but I gotta learn the mod before I start playing it for real :D

One thing that is really cool is the Cap on research. I NEVER knew that was possible to do in the editor, although I have never really fooled around with the Government settings in it.

I sortof missed the first message when playing with the Industrious civ I'm playing now (america) but I know they start with Serf's is that the only thing they get?

Anyways, I noticed their where some graphics missing, the Pigs for example. Do you mind if I would make the graphics for it?

Grey Fox
Mar 08, 2003, 05:09 PM
The game crashed when I tried to look at the Bombard Civilopedia entry.

Kal-el
Mar 08, 2003, 05:13 PM
there are graphics for the pigs, make sure you are playing with the right version of the mod. "Double you Pleasure with GFX" is the proper scenario to play if you want all the graphics.

Grey Fox
Mar 08, 2003, 05:26 PM
Uhm... but I downloaded the mod from your site, and the patch, and that said "load Double your Pleasure.bix"...

CivCube
Mar 08, 2003, 05:34 PM
Dang it, I downloaded the graphics patch from http://civ3.bernskov.com/. However, I try to open the new scenario, and ICON_BDLG_Palace_Garden is not there. Can I write this in the Civilopedia text myself, or is it a picture thing? :confused:

Grey Fox
Mar 08, 2003, 05:37 PM
Can't find the "...with GFX" version.

Grey Fox
Mar 08, 2003, 06:00 PM
ok, I found my problem. I installed in my old Civilization folder... a folder which I can't remove.

Rais
Mar 09, 2003, 03:38 AM
heya kal-el i was just wondering how i become a tester for certain again is it through this form or the cd ones? because i registered for both of them....

anyhow i found a few bugs that might help u out...
on multiplayer:

canoes cannot be captured

spies and secret agents cause cant be attacked... and since your opponent cant see them, when they move their troops they cant and "your unit has been attacked" message appears repeatedly

also sometimes when switching techs in MP u can search it in 2 turns even though it would be unreasonable at the time... even lowering ure research to 10% will still allow the researcher to research the tech to 2 turns... especially for early techs such as....
domestication, weaving, urbanization, caste system, dynasticism, boat building....

hopefully this information helps!!!

Thanks a lot for your incredible mod and keep up the great work...
I'm sure that everyone playing your mod appreciates your work as i do!

RobO
Mar 09, 2003, 03:49 AM
Thanks for the bug reports. Which version were you using? That 2 turn thing sounds unusual, though.

Don't advertise other sites in your posts. The forum rules forbid you from doing so, but you can post the link in your sig.

RobO
Mar 09, 2003, 06:26 AM
Originally posted by RobO
Thanks for the bug reports. Which version were you using? That 2 turn thing sounds unusual, though.
Edited by ???
Don't advertise other sites in your posts. The forum rules forbid you from doing so, but you can post the link in your sig.
I wasn't advertising. I was passing on information.

So, I cannot "advertise" in the post, but I can advertise in my sig?

Boy, you got my temper going :mad:
I'll refrain from commenting further, or from the looks of this I might well get banned.

Who are you, btw?

hbdragon88
Mar 09, 2003, 10:14 AM
It says "Last edited by chieftess" so it was chieftess that edited out the link in your post - whatever that was.

I'm interested in starting the DyP mod but I'm not sure how to get started. On the site I viewed pages of information (except for units and improvements) and the tech tree layout. :eek: That's a lot of techs.

I've just finished two chieftain games where I researched (and traded) heavily, and all I got was near the end of the industrial/start of the modern ages. They were standard sized maps, 8 rivals. From the looks of the tech tree, there are at least twice the techs there...how would I manage to advance through the whole tree?

Also would there be more of a bigger lag with all the new techs/improvements/wonders/units? I'm trying to play gotm17 but the lag is killing me at 25 sec in the BC era.

RobO
Mar 09, 2003, 10:29 AM
Originally posted by hbdragon88
It says "Last edited by chieftess" so it was chieftess that edited out the link in your post - whatever that was.
It sure does. I missed that.
It was still unwarranted and insulting, though.
I'm interested in starting the DyP mod but I'm not sure how to get started. On the site I viewed pages of information (except for units and improvements) and the tech tree layout. :eek: That's a lot of techs.

I've just finished two chieftain games where I researched (and traded) heavily, and all I got was near the end of the industrial/start of the modern ages. They were standard sized maps, 8 rivals. From the looks of the tech tree, there are at least twice the techs there...how would I manage to advance through the whole tree?
Well, I really don't know how far the censorship reaches here, but this post a couple of pages back (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?postid=803325#post803325) contains a reference to a forum with some info you might find helpful. Now, if I can't post that then CFC is in deep **** (sorry, couldn't resist ;) ).
Also would there be more of a bigger lag with all the new techs/improvements/wonders/units? I'm trying to play gotm17 but the lag is killing me at 25 sec in the BC era.
I don't think so. The lag is AFAIK related to the number of civs, units and cities in your game

hbdragon88
Mar 09, 2003, 10:37 AM
So, either there's a double standard or chieftess doesn't monitor this thread as much as she does with the whole of the forum (after all, there are a lot of boards to mod)

Kal-el posted a link to the DyP forums - was that your link?

pdescobar
Mar 09, 2003, 10:47 AM
The mods sometimes get a little happy with the "advertising" thing. See this discussion in Site Feedback: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=46116 ; after reading over that thread and the forum rules (http://forums.civfanatics.com/forumRules.shtml) -- you may want to PM Chieftess and discuss that edit.

And, to stay on topic ;) I've been moving along quite nicely with game #2 and this mod is really starting to grow on me. I made my standard map modification (deleted huge because my comp can't handle it and replaced it with crowded -- large map with all 24 civs) and it seems to work as well as in the standard game. I'm compiling a list of bugs/observations that I'll post at some point, although I'd like to see if they are relevant to the new version first. I suppose I have to go register at CDG and sign up as a tester to do that though...

RobO
Mar 09, 2003, 10:49 AM
The link in the post mentioned above is to a DyP forum. The one that was censored is to a thread in one of the DyP forums, explaining how to sign up as a tester.

RobO
Mar 09, 2003, 11:54 AM
Originally posted by pdescobar
[B]The mods sometimes get a little happy with the "advertising" thing. See this discussion in Site Feedback: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=46116 ; after reading over that thread and the forum rules (http://forums.civfanatics.com/forumRules.shtml) -- you may want to PM Chieftess and discuss that edit.
Thanks, I did.

Now I just need to calm down.

Rais
Mar 10, 2003, 12:42 AM
I was using v1.04 dyp when i noticed those bugs that i said earlier... and that 2 turn bug thing i am pretty confident there is a problem with it as i got it 2 times today when there were resynch messages!! Thanks for your time o ya can you tell me where i can registesr as a dyp tester too! thank you!

RobO
Mar 10, 2003, 02:15 AM
Originally posted by Rais
o ya can you tell me where i can registesr as a dyp tester too! thank you!
That's the part Chieftess deleted. I just sent you a PM with the info.

Isak
Mar 10, 2003, 02:38 AM
And incidentally, if you register as a tester now, you'll be able to get your hands on the brand spanking new beta-versions of 1.10x (for PtW) or 1.00r (for regular Civ3).

I'm starting to sound like a used car salesman, right? :rolleyes:

RobO
Mar 10, 2003, 02:43 AM
Originally posted by Isak
I'm starting to sound like a used car salesman, right? :rolleyes:
Not quite. You didn't mention all the benefits, nor the neglible cost ;)

Isak
Mar 10, 2003, 03:12 AM
Originally posted by RobO

Not quite. You didn't mention all the benefits, nor the neglible cost ;)

Oh, phew - you're right. I'm glad that I'm not quite doing sales talk yet. Was starting to get a bit worried :)

Rais
Mar 10, 2003, 06:43 PM
O ya i was just wondering where you can get the new versions of DyP once you are a tester :-D it would be great if someone could direct me id love to test it out... o ya i was also wondering if the new mods work on v1.14f or just v1.21f
sorry to be so much of a bother!

but thanks for helping me out quite a bit especially robo :)

CivAgamemnon
Mar 10, 2003, 06:56 PM
just go to the testing thread at cdgroup. instructions will be there.

dguichar
Mar 11, 2003, 09:29 AM
...to the mod developers.

Somebody stated a few pages gave a couple of suggestions about range units and camel riders.

Since i got the mod i hardly come back to normal rules of civ3. So i've detected a lack of scientific wonders in ancient times(as far as i know the only one is the great library) and an abundance of them in industrial ages.

Maybe it's beacuse the science was not so common in the dawn of times and the genius of invention came up with the industrialization.

But even so, i would love to see at least one more ancient scientific wonder. I don't know if it could be found, but as i love scientific civilizations... well, they are very outmatched by religious civs.

Think of Egyptians, building pyramids gets it's golden age. Iroquois and Arabs gets so with the colossus. And that's really easy to do so. Chinese with it's great wall, though no religious, get a huge advantage.

I'm mostly peaceful, that's why i play scientific. I even sometimes don't even build military units early on. So only as the greek i've been able to get a military golden age.

Any chances on thinking on more ancient scientific wonders?

Keep civilized (and doubling your pleasure)

David

Yoda Power
Mar 11, 2003, 09:35 AM
you could make the Hanging Gardens scientific, that way Babylon would get its GA by building that.

Grey Fox
Mar 11, 2003, 09:52 AM
I really like this mod. But why does the Monastary give 50% science output?

For me a monastary sounds Religious. And Religion has almost always stood in the way for science.

Yoda Power
Mar 11, 2003, 09:58 AM
Originally posted by Grey Fox
I really like this mod. But why does the Monastary give 50% science output?

For me a monastary sounds Religious. And Religion has almost always stood in the way for science.

in the medieval age a monastary was the only place science were kept alive

RobO
Mar 11, 2003, 10:03 AM
Originally posted by Grey Fox
I really like this mod. But why does the Monastary give 50% science output?

For me a monastary sounds Religious. And Religion has almost always stood in the way for science.
Well, Kal-el made that decision but it makes a lot of sense to me. In the middle ages, monasteries were centers of science, not just religuous in nature. They had schools - probably close to a monopoly on that.

Kal-el
Mar 11, 2003, 04:08 PM
yep, that's why they give science. :)

Roluce
Mar 12, 2003, 07:52 AM
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Grey Fox
I really like this mod. But why does the Monastary give 50% science output?

For me a monastary sounds Religious. And Religion has almost always stood in the way for science.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What?!? Better check your history. According to everything I've understood, religion has brought about some of the greatest scientific advancements in history. Now if you mean that religion and science sometimes don't get along, then I could understand your thought. Nevertheless, religion and religious people have clearly been innovative developers of science, education, and philosophy. Just wanted you to rethink that objection.

Grey Fox
Mar 12, 2003, 07:58 AM
@Roluce: Earth is not round it's flat...

Roluce
Mar 12, 2003, 08:34 AM
Grey Fox,
Obviously, you don't understand the history of the flat/round issue. And sure, anyone can produce examples of religious based ignorance. Just as anyone could produce example of ignorance in any group. But I'm not interested in debating any particular issue of religion vs. science, I'm just saying that your statement about religion is generally false when considering the actual history of it's relationship to science. Over the course of recorded history, religion and religious people have played major roles in the development of the "tech" tree, to deny this is essentially to re-write history. Just because some have a "modern" bias against religion, and just because religion and science have a "love/hate" relationship, does not mean that religion hasn't greatly influenced our world of thought in positive ways. In fact, there are certain periods of history where religious people were the only ones keeping science alive. True, religion can also breed ignorance and narrow minded believism that negates or discourages real scientific analysis, but in the grand scheme of history it has produced major accomplishments and advances. To me, objecting to an historical connection between religion and science advancement is uneducated, obviously ignorant of historical truth, and perhaps biased.

Yes, the earth is round - and it was religious men and religious thought that inspired the challenge to the popular opinion of the day. Check it out.

Gelvan
Mar 12, 2003, 10:47 AM
Peace brothers :)

I'd say 'a' Religion most often considers science as a danger to the absolute power the Religion provides to the people who are lucky to be in the upper ranks of this Religion. It's simple: the more the people know, the less it's nescessary to believe in a Religion (Rennaissance proves this opinion). In the world of Civ this is already reflected by Theocracy Governments, where your maximum science output is capped.

BUT - it is of course also true, regarding history, that a monastery, often ruled by wise, relaxed people, stored scientific books, made alchemistic progress and therefore - seen from an "upper view" - contributes a form of science to the civilization it's connected with.

In other words: both of you are right, from a given point of view. ;)

Roluce
Mar 12, 2003, 11:28 AM
Gelvan, you are looking at things primarily from a "power" point of view. I agree that religious power corrupts, for that matter all power corrupts. History is replete with examples of religious and political idealogies that repressed scientific information (or any thought that would weaken their position) in order to solidify and maintain their position of power over the masses. As you have said, it "considers science a danger to the absolute power." Hence Theocracy. This is rightly stated in terms of political power, however, that does not preclude the idea that religious ideas and inspiration have contributed massively to scientific, cultural, philisophical, and political ideas thoughout history. Nor does it mean that religious "powers" necessarily reflect the influence or outcome of their religion. Many times the ideas seeded from religion have birthed huge gains (my opinion) in civilization advancement - far exceeding their leaders attempts of control. Examine the Reformation, the religious seeds of Democracy, freedom, the Emancipation, the religious roots for medical research, Education, Higher Education, just to name a few. In fact, it is almost impossible to seperate many advances without "religious" influence. Just the idea that religion and science are opposing forces is quite an incredible leap. Powermongers have tried to control both science and religion. I was merely responding to the stated idea that religion necessarily leads to scientific repression. Such a thought would be extremely modern and untrue to history.

Faith (religion) does not necessarily preclude science anymore than science necessarily precludes faith (religion).

Grey Fox
Mar 12, 2003, 11:36 AM
Some religious people still have no faith in science, and shuns the evolution theory. And tries to ban it from being thought in school etc...

But you are correct. Religion has not always stood in the way of science, and I guess you are correct about the monastery thing.

Roluce
Mar 12, 2003, 12:39 PM
Grey Fox,
And you are correct as well. Some religious people are quite critical of science or at least any science that doesn't support their belief. And on the other side, some people are overly sceptical of religion, believing that science has somehow answered all the questions or at least disproven religious teaching. In truth, both have been proven wrong on many occassions. And in truth, neither can claim undeniable evidence. While I don't know all there is to know about the evolution theory, I am quite sure that science has not ruled out the plausibility or even the great statistical probability that existence is dependent upon some higher creative power. And on the other hand, I have not seen undeniable proof on the religious side either. In some ways, the more we know about the world (science), the more questions we have. Religion attempts to answer those questions, but sometimes in the most illogical way. But existence is itself a great mystery, one that demands our attention and exploration. To some, neither science or religion has adequetely proven much of anything, while others find great purpose, inspiration, and resolution in what science or religion have said. As one searcher to another, there are greater questions than I have answers. Recognizing the value and limitations of science and religion is a healthy way to remain alert to the possible answers, or at least to help us keep both ears open.

Hope I didn't seem overbearing or rude, butting into the conversation about monastaries like I did. If so, I apologize.

Roluce
Mar 12, 2003, 01:01 PM
Oh, and back to the point of why I was reading the thread in the first place - Could I get info on how to get the current beta?

Isak
Mar 12, 2003, 01:27 PM
Thanks for getting back on topic, Roluce ;)

And we are a bit reluctant to post that info right now, as none of us want to get moderated again, so please go back a page or two, or go to our website and look for our forums for now. Sorry about that inconvenience. I'm awaiting response on what we can and cannot do, and hope to get that soon.

Donegeal
Mar 14, 2003, 06:53 AM
The discussion of a DyP demo game at Apolyton is tending to drift to other areas. If some of you DyP officals would post more about the game, we might be more inclined to go for it. Please do this. I really want to see what a DyP Demo game could look like.

RobO
Mar 14, 2003, 01:12 PM
Donegal, I did a search at Aployton but couldn't come up with anything looking like a DyP demo. Please drop me a link via email or PM.

dguichar
Mar 14, 2003, 06:15 PM
Originally posted by Yoda Power
you could make the Hanging Gardens scientific, that way Babylon would get its GA by building that.

It'll be nice, but i'd like to be sure that those gardens were really scientific. It surely may, if there are any mathematics principles in that building.

Weren't any other scientific wonders in ancient times?
I always thought that Aztec pyramids were observatories...
What about the Acrópolis? It was a stairs like city upon a hill... there should be some science involved.

I'm not going for giving every civ an specific wonder that gives it it's golden age. Just the ones that really existed...

Keep civilized (and doubling your pleasure)

David

Chuma
Mar 14, 2003, 08:54 PM
After seeing this mod pack included with PTW I decided to download the full version and have a game.

I have PTW 1.21F installed.

For some reason some of the buildings aren't displaying properly. In the attached picture you can see it says the Colosuss is the granary and the pyramid is the forge.

Has anyone else had the same problem?

Thanks.

pdescobar
Mar 14, 2003, 10:42 PM
Quoting a post by RobO elsewhere,
The overhead city view is messed up because we have rearranged the order of improvements and wonders in DyP. Unfortunately, the order of improvements in the city view is hardcoded, so the only way to change this (barring a bug fix) is to remake the graphics going into the city view.

We do not have the time for nor the interest in such an endeavour - our efforts are best spent elsewhere.

Isak
Mar 15, 2003, 12:28 AM
And in addition to that, even if we did go about changing the graphics, we would only be able to do so for the first 65 improvements, so that's 80% of the regular buildings and none of the Small and Great Wonders. :(

Grey Fox
Mar 15, 2003, 03:48 PM
I don't know if this is the right place to report bugs, but I can build the Forge in every city without even having iron.

Isak
Mar 15, 2003, 03:59 PM
Yep, that looks like a bug alright, but in fact the Iron requirement was removed in order to entice the AI to build some of the early production boosters.

It's quite possible the civilopedia isn't up to date on that change though - fortunately that is no longer my dept. :D

But thanks for reporting it, and please continue to report whereever you see fit - we hang around here too, as you see :)

Grey Fox
Mar 15, 2003, 04:04 PM
Ah, good thing it's not a bug. It would feel like an exploit to build them if that was not the design. ;)

Now I can build them with a conscience. :p

pdescobar
Mar 16, 2003, 01:58 PM
It's a good thing they don't require iron cause then civ3 would get even angrier when I tried to look at the iron civilopedia screen ;) Anyhow, I think all questions should be posted here as well as "other places." How else would this thread reach 3k posts or 100k views? :D Alright, that's enough silliness from me for now...

Kal-el
Mar 17, 2003, 01:23 AM
well, if we add up all the posts on this thread and at that other place we have nearer to 5000 posts. :)

Warlock
Mar 21, 2003, 03:11 AM
I can't build build the garrison and the military academy despite I’ve already researched leadership. Is that a bug? I’m playing standard CIV3 (1.29 patched) with DyP v 0.91. Pls help.
Keep up with excellent work!!!

Tomas

RobO
Mar 21, 2003, 06:57 AM
Originally posted by Warlock
I can't build build the garrison and the military academy despite I’ve already researched leadership. Is that a bug? I’m playing standard CIV3 (1.29 patched) with DyP v 0.91. Pls help.
Miltary Academy requires a victorious army.
Im pretty sure that Garrison is only available in the PtW version, but I can't find the proper spreadsheet here. All indications point to that, tough.
Keep up with excellent work!!!

Will do :D :crazyeye: :scan: :lol:

HiroHito
Mar 21, 2003, 12:04 PM
Kal El I know that my post will be lost somewhere, but I have to say that I LOVE YOUR WORK, THANKS A LOT !!

:love:

Kal-el
Mar 27, 2003, 06:59 PM
HiroHito,

glad you like the mod, and welcome to DyP!

:D

PantheraTigris2
Mar 27, 2003, 08:34 PM
Kal-El, I have been playing your mod for the better part of a year now, and I can't imagine myself ever going back to retail Civ3/PTW - without the DyP mod.

The "fun factor" really is at least double, in comparison.
Just wanted you guys to know that all the small, little changes that most people don't even notice I appreciate very much. All the time while playing, I ask myself "hmm, I wonder why they made this the way it is...", and eventually I get it, and say "Wow, that's genius!"

You've turned Civ3 into a game that is much more dynamic, and realistic, not to mention fun! And with all the time I'm getting out of your mod, I must say thank you very much.


Going back to regular Civ3/PTW... Bah!! What a joke that would be...

Warlord 101
Mar 28, 2003, 09:54 AM
DyP was the first Mod I played. I love it as much as Fantasy Empires!

The only queries I have is that Buildings/Wonders don't all appear in City View, but that's not really a Major Problem. Hell, its almost not even a problem.
Also, in Standard Civ 3 games I'm researching Gun Powder around the correct Historical Time. However, I'm nowhere near that when I play this. But it does ensure a fun and long game. I have to congradtulate you on this greatly.

Kal-el
Mar 28, 2003, 12:24 PM
Music to my ears. :D

Bamspeedy
Mar 30, 2003, 07:05 PM
It's been a very long time since I've visited here, so sorry if this has already been covered, but...

I installed 1.05 and I'm having trouble with the smiley heads. With the celts I get a content citizen who looks like a scientist. Well, I didn't want the default graphics anyways so I installed the 'mood badges' (to easier see who was happy/content, etc). That doesn't work. I can copy and paste the file into the art/smallheads folder manually, but then in the city view I see nothing (no citizen).

How can I get around this? Is there a way so that the DyP scenario doesn't try looking for all those new citizens that were added to the popheads.pcx file (all those citizens that were added down by the taxmen/scientists, which I don't want, the default citizens are fine by me)?

pdescobar
Mar 30, 2003, 07:52 PM
The problem is that the program looks for European heads by the absolute number of icon it is in the file (e.g. icon #20) instead of simply looking at the relative number based on the column (e.g. column #2, icon #1). So European heads are all messed up and there's really nothing that can be done about it :( I believe in the next proposed test version, all the extra DyP citizens will be removed (some converted into city "improvements") so one of the smiley head mods for the standard game will work fine.

Bamspeedy
Mar 30, 2003, 08:29 PM
Ah, thank you pdescobar! I didn't realize there was new degrees of scientists/taxmen, etc. I was wondering why all these new heads were there for :wallbash: . I'll just delete those then.

Edit: Just tried it and it works fine now!

Silverblade
Mar 31, 2003, 07:29 AM
Does anyone know if there exist other maps to DyP besides that huge world map?

Kal-el
Mar 31, 2003, 11:35 AM
there is also a large earth map. :)

Yoda Power
Mar 31, 2003, 12:11 PM
Kal-el+other DYP team members, do you remember the scenario i showed you? I might be able to finish it soon, might.:)

Kal-el
Mar 31, 2003, 01:45 PM
cool

pap1723
Apr 02, 2003, 03:06 AM
Hi, don't know if I am supposed to post "bugs" here, but using the newest version for PTW I was able to build the Tribe, Barbarian Raider, and Barbarian Rider from the start of the game.

They didn't really unbalance things, but every civ was able to build them, and it only took 1 turn so I thought it might have been a bug.

Pap

Isak
Apr 02, 2003, 03:52 AM
Using 1.05x ?? The Tribe isn't marked as being available to any civ, and the Barbarians are marked to only be available to the Barbarian Civ, so that should not be possible at all.

Were you using any special settings or a Map, or have you changed anything in the BIX?

pdescobar
Apr 03, 2003, 03:43 AM
To: Kal-el, Isak, & RobO

Not sure if you guys monitor the General Discussion forum, but I stumbled upon a thread about DyP (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49223) there asking what people's thoughts are on it and whether they play DyP or standard rules.

Kal-el
Apr 03, 2003, 10:17 AM
Thanks for the thread. I rarely venture outside of the C&C forums so this was nice to see.

RobO
Apr 03, 2003, 12:34 PM
Thanks, pdescobar, that was an encouraging read :D

Kal-el
Apr 03, 2003, 05:40 PM
Originally posted by Hakeem-RJ
Hi there! sorry to stop posting the past few days, it was carnival here in brazil and i traveled with my gf!
my friend said that the siam guy is almost finished, just wanted to ask if 10 mb is too big!

also i got a question, about the game. has anyone ever had 40 minutes beetwen turns???? i got it today, and wasn't nice... i guess huge map with 24 civs shouldn't be an option...
40 minutes man!

well thanks!

Whats the latest word, Hakeem? I am eagerly anticipating a preview.

Bamspeedy
Apr 04, 2003, 05:19 AM
Great job on fixing the problem with civs avoiding Weaving. Adding more resources to that tech sure worked wonders. The AI get that tech very quickly from what I've seen so far. Adding multiple resources must have a cumulating effect for the AI to decide whether or not to go for a tech.

Yecos
Apr 05, 2003, 02:56 PM
First of all, thank you very much for all your work Kal-El.:love:
I have a simple question does your mod works with EU english v1.14f

Thanks for the reply

Keep up the good work for the sake of our beloved community :D

Isak
Apr 05, 2003, 03:45 PM
If you install the mod version 1.04x, i can 100% guarantee it will work.

You may try patching it to 1.05x too, but I can't 100% guarantee that this will work. Having tested it for some time now, it seems 95% certain that it does however.

Yecos
Apr 06, 2003, 08:32 AM
Isak, Thank you very much.

I gonna try this mod right now:D

RobO
Apr 06, 2003, 02:51 PM
This thread has survived for a year today. :bday:

:band:
:beer: [party] :beer:

I wonder if that isn't one of the most persistent threads around at CFC.

Ville
Apr 07, 2003, 06:54 AM
Originally posted by RobO
This thread has survived for a year today. :bday:

:band:
:beer: [party] :beer:

I wonder if that isn't one of the most persistent threads around at CFC.

Happy Birthday DYP[party] :bday:

It is the most persistent thread here:lol:
And also the BEST mod here:goodjob:

Yoda Power
Apr 07, 2003, 11:29 AM
:bday:

FANTA
Apr 07, 2003, 12:28 PM
:bday: [party] :beer: [dance]

Ben E Gas
Apr 08, 2003, 03:31 PM
sorry for asking as I'm sure it is listed somewhere:

Where can I find the latest version of double your pleasure mod? will it work with PTW 1.21?

and, what exactly does it add to the game?

Kal-el
Apr 08, 2003, 03:40 PM
Originally posted by Ben E Gas
sorry for asking as I'm sure it is listed somewhere:

Where can I find the latest version of double your pleasure mod?
Not a problem you can get the altest release of the mod from the DyP Website (http://civ3.bernskov.com).

will it work with PTW 1.21?Yes, of course. :)

and, what exactly does it add to the game?:lol: A lot! tons of new units, tons of new techs, tons of new wonders and improvements, seven new civs, and seven (soon to be eight) new governments, 20 new resources, and double your pleasure each time you play or your money back.

Mavooo
Apr 08, 2003, 08:27 PM
I have the scenario installed on the game already, must have come with patch, bcause I have never downloaded a mod before.

My question is, do I need to still download the 28mb file if I already have the scenario?

If not which one do I need to get the gfx fixed.
I played that scenario today but all the artwork was missing.

I have 56k :( and 28 mb is a nice little file to download.

Isak
Apr 09, 2003, 01:41 AM
The version that comes with the official Firaxis patches, is unfortunately missing all the graphics, so you'll need to download one of the 28 mb files. If you're running PtW 1.21f (i.e. if you have the US version of the game) you should also download the patch from 1.04x to 1.05x.

I wish we could have included all the graphics in the official patches, but Firaxis weren't too keen on releasing 40 mb patches for PtW, I'm afraid :D

Emperor C
Apr 09, 2003, 09:51 AM
don't know if u mention this, but why does the tech screen on your website look different than mine? I've downloaded the 1.05 patch and have v1.21 PTW, but still have extra techs like advanced composites. Also, what in the world does the Echelon do?

Kal-el
Apr 09, 2003, 10:54 AM
the website needs updating, we just haven't gotten around to it. never fear, you have the latest version.

Echelon gives Police Stations in all cities.

Emperor C
Apr 09, 2003, 03:16 PM
thanks for your help Kal-El. By the way, very good mod, i enjoy it alot.

Ben E Gas
Apr 09, 2003, 04:01 PM
Will this double your pleasure mod cause problems when I try to finish an on going 'play by email game' i'm involved in?

also,

Will this mod work with the Powerbar utility created by SPiderzord?

thanks,
Ben E. Gas

hbdragon88
Apr 09, 2003, 04:33 PM
When I first saw this, this is what popped up in my mind:

"Double your pleasure, double your fun, it's the statement of the great mint and double mint gum. Double sentiment, your mentamint, double your moment of fun. Double your delightmint, with the right mint, for forever it's the only way!

"Double your pleasure, double your fun, with the state mint of the great mint of double mint gum."

I still think that :crazyeye:

Kal-el
Apr 09, 2003, 05:53 PM
that was the inspiration for the name! :)

Kal-el
Apr 10, 2003, 09:18 PM
http://home.mindspring.com/~dikjensen/_uimages/DyPTitleBlue.gif

What do you guys think?

Kal-el
Apr 10, 2003, 09:19 PM
let's get some more 5 star votes for the mod :D:D:D

Ben E Gas
Apr 10, 2003, 09:21 PM
*****

I'm downloading it tomorrow!!

:band:

Ben E Gas
Apr 11, 2003, 07:57 AM
I've downloaded from your website the 28MB file, but I'm having trouble downloading the PTW patch1.05(300kb). any reason this is happening? it gets to about 34% and then stalls.


thanks for your help,
Ben E Gas

p.s. will the regular 28MB file work with PTW 1.21 or do I need the 1.05 patch?

also, I can't even get onto your DyP website right now, is it being worked on? thanks again.

Ben E Gas
Apr 11, 2003, 09:40 AM
nevermind. your website is back up and I downloaded 1.04(28MB) and patch 1.05(320KB)

thanks. I can't wait to try this later.

Will it ruin my current PTW game that I'm involved in? will it ruin my current PBEM game I'm involved in.

keep up the good work,
Ben E. Gas

Yoda Power
Apr 11, 2003, 09:46 AM
Originally posted by Ben E Gas
Will it ruin my current PTW game that I'm involved in? will it ruin my current PBEM game I'm involved in.

not if you install it correctly

Ben E Gas
Apr 11, 2003, 08:26 PM
you're right. It did not effect my current games. I didn't realize how the mods work. I thought it was going to work like the Hi_Res mod worked for civ2. That modified civ2 permanently.


It works with Powerbar 3.5 also.

primat
Apr 11, 2003, 08:29 PM
Originally posted by Kal-el

...
tons of new units, tons of new techs, tons of new wonders and improvements, seven new civs, and seven (soon to be eight) new governments, 20 new resources, and double your pleasure each time you play or your money back.

There are seven new civs!?!?!? How do I access them? Even when I edit the bix file I can't see any new civs! I'm using PTW 1.21 and DYP 1.05 with GFX.

Btw, great mod! And thanks to everyone who put effort into producing it!

pdescobar
Apr 11, 2003, 09:03 PM
The new civs are in the version currently in testing (1.0r/1.10x). One of the Big Three (;)) would be able to tell you if there's a target release date for it. If you would like to become a tester, one of them or myself can PM you the link as the test group is part of a forum on CDG.

RobO
Apr 12, 2003, 12:18 AM
I suppose I'm one of the big ones ;) and I can tell you that there is no projected release date. Every time we try that it gets shifted. The best I can come up with is "As Soon As Possible", which in effect means nothing at all.

Isak
Apr 12, 2003, 01:01 AM
[Doom 3 Developer Voice]
"We'll release it when it's ready"
[/Doom 3 Developer Voice]

;)


Sorry - that's the best we can give at the moment, like RobO said. But we're working on it every day, so please don't quit on us yet :)

Micaelis Rex
Apr 12, 2003, 11:52 AM
Yes, don't make them give you a date, last time they said it was 3-4 days away, and it got released 38 days later. ;)

Isak
Apr 12, 2003, 12:38 PM
Originally posted by Mike23
Yes, don't make them give you a date, last time they said it was 3-4 days away, and it got released 38 days later. ;)

What - i must have misplaced the '-' It was supposed to have been 34 days, so it was only four days off..... ;)




And if you believe that, maybe you want to buy one of my Iraqi oil wells too.....

Harrier
Apr 12, 2003, 05:50 PM
Blame the testers. We keep on giving them ideas, etc. to make the game better, or so we think.

You can join us if you want to! But we want to here your comments on how the mod plays. :)

Kal-el
Apr 12, 2003, 06:32 PM
yeah, blame the testers, thats it! why didn't we think of that excuse before!?!?!

pdescobar
Apr 12, 2003, 06:33 PM
Those darned testers! Hey.... wait a minute....

Harrier
Apr 12, 2003, 07:24 PM
Originally posted by Kal-el
yeah, blame the testers, thats it! why didn't we think of that excuse before!?!?!

OFL, I take it that is the royal we, or being American maybe not.

(We as in I) for those who do not understand England.:crazyeye: :crazyeye: :)

Kal-el
Apr 12, 2003, 07:55 PM
sometimes I like to include Isak and RobO. :D

Emperor C
Apr 13, 2003, 09:52 AM
u probably mentioned this before, but the mobile infantry file seems to be missing. I was looking forward to see what they could do against the greeks but if i build one, the game crashes. just wondering if it's a flaw with mine or it isn't finished yet.

Harrier
Apr 13, 2003, 10:00 AM
Originally posted by Emperor C
u probably mentioned this before, but the mobile infantry file seems to be missing. I was looking forward to see what they could do against the greeks but if i build one, the game crashes. just wondering if it's a flaw with mine or it isn't finished yet.

I have the standard civ3 version and I can build Mobile Infantry.

Don't know about PTW.

It helps if you include version numbers in your post so we can give you a specific rather than general reply. :)

Emperor C
Apr 13, 2003, 10:34 AM
sorry, it's ptw version 1.21 and dyp version 1.05

Emperor C
Apr 13, 2003, 12:25 PM
i believe that's the current version. u said that the standard civ 3 doesn't have that problem right.

pdescobar
Apr 13, 2003, 03:27 PM
Emperor C, is there any error message when you build the mobile infantry?

Isak
Apr 13, 2003, 03:45 PM
Check in the Scenarios\DYP folder and see if there is a Power Armor folder there. It's been in since 1.01x, so if it appears to be missing, I think something went wrong with your installation.

But as Pdescobar said, the error message should give us more info on what goes wrong, so please post it, if you get any, and we will look into it :)