I vote for the flag with 12 silver stars, that sounds cool. I like the Fascism symbol, but maybe an eagle with 2 swords crossed behind it would be better. Just my opinion. ;)

As for civs, I'd like to see the Spaniards, the Carthaginians, and the Vikings, Norse, whatever....maybe some Confederates ? :cool:

Anyways, keep up the good work. I'm not real editor literate, but I'd be glad to help with some civilopedia entries if you could use an extra hand.


Happy 4/20 everyone! :D :D

Ah - patching isn't supposed to be painless, I guess - Not to fear though, with a bit of work well get everything back to normal in no time, hopefully
//Release manager makes mental note to cancel Christmas for all Firaxis employees//

Anyway, about balancing:
Originally Posted by Kal-El
Which brings up a question, do people think there is too much time spent in despotism to start the game? I think it is historically accurate that you don’t get the higher forms of govt. til sometime between 500 BC and 1 AD, but it is fun?
I think it's a good premise, but I would like to hear some opinions from people who've played to 1700 - 1800 AD or further. If this doesn't seriously cripple gameplay in the later ages, it definitely gets a big :goodjob: from me.
That brings up another question, do people want more citizens? Here are my thoughts, open for discussion:
Oh yes, definitely, though I share RobO's concerns about the AI not being able to handle it - Let's test it though.
1) Improvement and Unit Costs – are they too low? How much more should they be?
There are a lot of Productivity Increasing improvements available, so It might be a good idea to increase the costs of some of the later Units/Improvements/Wonders - but which ones and how much - I haven't got a clue yet :crazyeye:
Additional Resource – Besides the resources I listed above, what other resources would you like to see in the mod? Jeez... are there any more types of resources in the world :D ..

oh yeah, Hemp would.....oh, nevermind

About Additional Civs

All your suggestions are good - I'd Personally like to add Etruscans and Hittites to the list, but names are really (somewhat) unimportant - my main concern is: Is it possible to come up with civ's that are significantly different from the ones already in the game?

Of course the Danes are a must in any selfrespecting Civ3 mod - I suggest the Couch Potato as a Unique Unit, and The Little Mermaid as Leader :rolleyes:

I agree on the point of Jeanne D'arc - I never understood what she was doing as leader (yes yes, she's mighty pretty and all, but still..) - and If you decide to change to Charlemagne, then I guess Franks would be more correct. Other alternatives would be Louis XIV or good old Napoleon.
Ottomans – the Empire not the furniture

LOL
but on the serious side, I'd love to see them in the mod

I think that covers all 4 of your topics..... (ok, I'm indifferent about the Federal Republic :p )
Originally posted by RobO And another idea: In order to use the HP ability systematically without overusing it, you could consider adding an extra HP at each shift in era. Thus, all units researched in the third era gets 2 extra HP. Just a thought.
Not a bad idea for a general rule - unless of course this could bring us to a situation where Elite Spearmen can kick Regular Tanks' butt on an everyday basis.

....Oh and Kal-El - Thanks for the wonderful recital of Finland - Now who want's to do Eric The Half-A-Bee for tomorrow? ;)

(...and will that be the full hour argument or just the five minutes?)

As afar as the HP go, I think I have it pretty well figured out. I was working on it last night while I was in class :p

the basic idea is that there is a gradual addition of hp through the ages. so that middle ancient units may have a +1 while late ancient and early middle will have a +2. More powerful early middle may have a +3 while some middle middle will have +3 or +4 with late middle having +4, early industrial could have +4 or +5, etc. Modern armor ends up with +8 and the Mobile Infantry jump to +10. Warrior's obviously get no bonus.

thanks, i was having a hard time figuering out how the whole +HP thing works.

Instead of Vikings should they be called Scandinavians, or just Danish? I don't like using the term Vikings for a Civ, or am I just being unedumacted here?

I think they should be commercial/expansionist the Viking Raider can be their unique unit. Who is great historical leader? I will have to do some research, or maybe somebody could do the research for me. Maybe somebody who lives in that neck of the woods. ;)

Of course now we will need leaderhead animatins for each of the new civs. :rolleyes: I prefer that over static images, don't you?

Kal-el,

Quote:

3) Additional Resource – Besides the resources I listed above, what other resources would you like to see in the mod?

_______________________________________________-


Since we can have a lot of Resources now, why don’t you make it that you actually need resources to build things. That way trade in resources will become vital.
i.e. Lumber - for all wood ships. Not just tireme.
Stone - Pyramids, Palace, Aqueducts .......

get my idea? Let the resources become absolutely critical for success.

Kal-el,

I know you have your tech tree worked out, but the patch replaces the science advisor (SciAdv) screens and the techboxes screens. They added a smaller techbox for the ancient age, probably for the others as well, but this will mess up your SciAdv screens if someone installs the patch over your mod. Also I am not sure how the program will handle the old techboxes.pcx it may not like it too much. I was thinking of redoing the techboxes file for this new version. What do you think?

I am told, however, that as a scenario the lines look fine. So maybe you could try it that way.

Originally posted by Kal-el
that is most disheartening. :(

Nightstorm,

it looks like you are not playing v.0.2. You industrial science is missing the city planning tech and your entertainers are still attached to the Drama tech. Not that that should effect the advisor screen.

Actually, it looks that way with v0.1 and v0.2. And, some boxes are even missing (like fussion for example - pics and writing is there but there is no physical tech box).

Originally posted by Elucidus
I know you have your tech tree worked out, but the patch replaces the science advisor (SciAdv) screens and the techboxes screens. They added a smaller techbox for the ancient age, probably for the others as well, but this will mess up your SciAdv screens if someone installs the patch over your mod. Also I am not sure how the program will handle the old techboxes.pcx it may not like it too much. I was thinking of redoing the techboxes file for this new version. What do you think?

Me thinks this is something to work on. I believe they will need completely re-rendered, as I have re-installed your files and they still look the same.

Originally posted by Elucidus
I am told, however, that as a scenario the lines look fine. So maybe you could try it that way.

Um, Negative...as a scenario it still looks the same.

God, I am beginning to hate Firaxis and their piece of crap v1.21f patch!!! :sniper: :mad:

Hi All :)

Been playing 0.2 of the mod with the 1.21f

I dont know if this is a result of the patch or not, but the land mine & the airbase wont move out of the citys they have been built in, allthough the movment indicate shows that they should be able to move. ( did not try the sea mine).

Also tried to build the arc de triomphe, but the game crashes at the piont where the says it is completed.

:(

Originally posted by Kal-el
Instead of Vikings should they be called Scandinavians, or just Danish? I don't like using the term Vikings for a Civ, or am I just being unedumacted here?

I think they should be commercial/expansionist the Viking Raider can be their unique unit. Who is great historical leader? I will have to do some research, or maybe somebody could do the research for me. Maybe somebody who lives in that neck of the woods. ;)


I think Vikings is best - it is well known and as "accurate" as many others.

I think commercial/militaristic would fit better, though commercial/expansionist also has merits.

The unique unit definitely should be an oceangoing longship, historically available from around 800AD or perhaps a bit later, so that should be somewhere around the middle of the second age.

As for leadership - I'm not completely sure, but IIRC King Knut conquered England and Ireland, so he might be a good choice. Perhaps Isak knows more about Viking hsitory :)

I'd really like to try out this mod...

However, after downloading everything, reading the installation document, I still have no clue where anything goes...

I'm doing the best I can, but installation should be made *MUCH* easier.

Even if they need to be in separate files for distribution because of the size, how about at least making it so the files can be easily extracted?

An add-on to my last message - Zips inside of Zips? Do away with that...

make life easier on us out here...

make life easier on us out here...

That will happen once version 0.3 (or whatever it will be called) is released

In the meantime check out this page (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=19742&perpage=20&pagenumber=10)
and scroll down to the "Quick Installation" heading

Following that procedure should fix most problems, but not all....after all we're still beta-testing :)

About the zips in zips - what files are those? - I can't remember coming across any of those, but then I have a hard time even trying to remember what I did 3 minutes ago :crazyeye:

Originally posted by Kal-el
Instead of Vikings should they be called Scandinavians, or just Danish? I don't like using the term Vikings for a Civ, or am I just being unedumacted here?

I think they should be commercial/expansionist the Viking Raider can be their unique unit. Who is great historical leader? I will have to do some research, or maybe somebody could do the research for me. Maybe somebody who lives in that neck of the woods. ;)

Of course now we will need leaderhead animatins for each of the new civs. :rolleyes: I prefer that over static images, don't you?

Leiv Erickson (not sure if spelling is correct) could be either the leader or a Great Leader

Yes - I prefer animated leaderheads too

Originally posted by Isak
About the zips in zips - what files are those? - I can't remember coming across any of those, but then I have a hard time even trying to remember what I did 3 minutes ago :crazyeye:

In file #1, you have Unit Pediaicons.zip and Buildings.zip

It took 3 ethernet cards, 3 flat cables, 2 fans, 3 12-packs of mountain dew code red, and 5 days, but I finally got my computer working again. I also (while formatting several times) redid a few CGI scripts on my web site. The last thing I want to look at right now is another bloody text file, so the civilopedia may be delayed.

Kal-el: If you plan on adding anything else to the mod, PLEASE send me the civilopedia entries as you add them. It makes it much easier than if you send them in one large sum, and it would be better for my morale.

I just got the Add/Delete hacked version of the 1.21f editor, and I am playing around with it. This patch added alot of features but it seems that 16+ civs will still not 100% work. :(

Note for additional civs: Before adding civs, make sure you have a UU for it, the animations for the unit, and the leader head files. It takes less time to round those up and then add the civ rather than add the civ, not find the required files, and then remove the civ. :p (Been there, done that) You can find some leaderheads on my web site (if it is still running stable)

On resources: The more the merrier. I plan on adding AT LEAST 15 in my mod :D

Also, seeing as I havent been in here for 5 days, I am lost as to what files I need to get your mod working. Does the release manager have a list of files that must be installed in order to get the game to work? (Not everyone who has just found out about the mod want to go through all 14-15 pages of posts to gather all the files. A web site would be handy . . .)

I think that is all I have for now. I will start on the civilopedia entries again once I recover from my computer problems (I seem to have them mostly under control).

GIDustin

About the Vikings:

Civilization Name: Originally posted by Kal-El Instead of Vikings should they be called Scandinavians, or just Danish? I don't like using the term Vikings for a Civ, or am I just being unedumacted here? Nope, that's actually very educated - the term Vikings was never used by the ..uhm.. Vikings themselves or by any of their enemies - still it is the popular term, so I guess no harm done using it - personally I prefer Normans or just Scandinavians.

Great Leader:
King Knud (Aka. Canute, Knut, Cnut) the Great is often picked for the fact that he reigned over England, Norway and Denmark for 19 years. Alternatives could be Harald Bluetooth (the first King in Scandinavia) or Svein Forkbeard (the King who actually conquered England so that Knud could rule over it) - but again
Knud/Canute is the best known of the Scandinavian kings so....

Leif Eriksson/Leif The Lucky - the guy who found America (though, of course certain native americans were not too surprised with this discovery :rolleyes: ) is perhaps more suitable as a Leader Unit. (though it wasn't a bad suggestion Pesoloco)

Whatever you do, don't make Kaupang the Capital (like in Civ2) - the credit for that should really go to the Swedish city Birka.

ok im new to this all an ive downloaded the 3 files for all the new stuff... what i do now to make it work? ah hell wot i g2 do to make thses work, are there any extra file needed after the very 1st 3 on pg 1 of this thread? :die!: :ar15::finger: :rocket2: :ripper: :rocket:

I am done with the building and large wonder entries in the civilopedia. These are the ones that were listed but had no entry. If someone could make a few and PM them to me, I would be very happy. Please dont post here as this thread is large enough already.

I should have another list (small wonders and units) shortly.

Buildings:
----------
Academy
Theater
Shrine
Drugstore
District Courthouse
Newspaper
Radio Station
Television Tower
Movie Palace
Computer Network
Slave Market
Forge
Town Clock
Textile Mill
Fishery
Steel Mill
Civil Liberties
Performing Arts Center
WWW Effect
Genetic Tailoring


Large Wonders:
--------
East India Company
Chichen Itza
Global E-Bank
Big Ben
Edison's Workshop

GIDustin

I also need pedia entries for these:


Small Wonders:
-------------
Holy City
Governor's Mansion
National Monument
Cable Network
National Electricity Grid
National Health Care
National Sports League
Atomic Weapons Testing

GI... could you tell me plz:confused: :)

I have been gone for 5 days - You know more than me

Talk to Isak. He is the guy who knows what files you need and where to put em

slozenger:

Just scroll a bit further up the page - I already answered this question a few posts ago :D

Kal-El:

Could I persuade you to update the first post of the thread to point to my Quick Installation instructions ? ;)

Originally posted by Isak
Kal-El:

Could I persuade you to update the first post of the thread to point to my Quick Installation instructions ? ;)

Isak,

How about a web site for the Mod...so many other mods have them, why not us? :D

Anyway, I am a web designer, and it would take me all of 5 minutes to design a web site. Matter of fact, I already have half of it finished. I can also update the first file to remove the two .zip files from within the file. Heck, I can even put all the .zip files into an install file instead and just have a temporary beta install until Kal-el finishes the mod and you put together the final package. All this would just be a temporary thing until you and Kal-el have everthing finalized. Something a little easier for people new to the mod, everything in one place.

If you need any help, i know CGI :D

As you guys are play-testing the game, I need to know if there are any buildings in the tech trees or in the civilopedia that do not have pictures associated with them. That would indicate either 1) no file for the picture or 2) the pediaicons.txt file is pointing to the wrong files. Let me know so that I can get the files created if they are missing.

So far, I know I am missing the following building files and I'm in the process of creating them:

- Great Buddha
- World News Network
- National Health Care
- Basilica

Any others, let me know please.

Nightstorm and GIDustin: Since both of you have now pestered me for the website - well okay, I give in, lets get the web-site up and running.

And, Nightstorm - you were the one I was going to bug into making it anywayz, so it's only nice to see you volunteer before I get a chance to beg and grovel :D

I already got a zip-file with all the files in it - I've been spending the last few days checking through all the unit folders and some of the civilopedia icons and I think this is as updated as can be (though I haven't finished testing yet)

My only problem is....serverspace - the file is 14 MB using best RAR compression :(

I might be able to find something, but not until next week at best - do any of you have that kind of space/bandwidth available?

Originally posted by Isak
Kal-El:

Could I persuade you to update the first post of the thread to point to my Quick Installation instructions ? ;)

So shall it be written, so shall it be done.

Originally posted by Nightstorm
How about a web site for the Mod...so many other mods have them, why not us?


I think this is a great idea :D

About Resources:
Stone will be added

Resources will be required for some buildings. i.e. iron for the Forge and Steel Mill, Marble for Temples and Courthouses, Stone for City Walls, etc., etc., etc.
Timber will be required for all ancient ships 9didn't I say that before?)

Isak, thanks for the info on Knud/Knut/Cnut/Canute. Hard to find a decent picture of this guy.

Originally posted by Isak
And, Nightstorm - you were the one I was going to bug into making it anywayz, so it's only nice to see you volunteer before I get a chance to beg and grovel :D

My only problem is....serverspace - the file is 14 MB using best RAR compression :(

do any of you have that kind of space/bandwidth available?

1) Will go ahead and finish it. :D

2) My server is limited to 10 megs. Besides, they still don't have FTP working. And Geocities is only 15 megs. So I'm not quite sure were to go.

You asked:Which brings up a question, do people think there is too much time spent in despotism to start the game? I think it is historically accurate that you don’t get the higher forms of govt. til sometime between 500 BC and 1 AD, but it is fun?
Historically you could put monarchy back to about 1000BC or 1500BC. Egypt had a very sophisticated form of Monarchy that long ago.

Besides the resources I listed above, what other resources would you like to see in the mod?
Chocolate please;) maybe clay? needed to build granary or possibly cats? reduces illness by killing off the rats.
Federal Republic Icon What do people think about changing the symbol for federal republic from the eagle that it is now, to the EU's flag of 12 gold stars on the blue background? I would probably change the stars from gold to silver. This symbol closely mirrors the original flag of the US which had 13 white stars on a blue field, and would thereby be representative of the two largest federal systems in the world? (at least I think they are the two largest)
The EU is more a confederacy then a federal republic. Each country has its own military and some retain their own monetary system. But the flag sounds cool.
I love this mod. Took me forever to get it working properly but so much fun.

I have a 160GB Hard drive with a 15K cable ISP. I could host the file for you but it will only be available when my comp is on (which is pretty much 24/7)

However, due to my computer problems, I can put it on my web server (same internet speed but only 2 GB free space, which is still plenty). That computer only goes off when it gets a BSOD or some other error.

Just thought I would run that past ya. There are no good free ISPs that give that much space/bandwidth . . .

GIDustin

use these new tech boxes. they will realign the techs.

I will work on the arrows in the ancient age because now some are two short. but this is a quick fix

here's what the ancient age will look like until I can fix the arrows

Installed 1.21, edited in my own favourite changes (which are mostly covered by DyP), fired up the game and looked at the tech screen when I got to pick the first advance to research. My immediate reaction was: Where have all the techs gone :confused: The screen is almost empty!

So, I'm going to install DyP :D and edit in a few temporary changes (like the reduced entertainer bonus).

A couple of comments:

It seems to me that clockworks come too early in the tech tree. When was Big Ben built, and when were clocks invented / used? I don't know. In fact, clocks were the deciding factor in navigating oceans reliably, not the compass. The clock allowed you to determine longitude, and this didn't happen until sometime into the 1700's IIRC, i.e. in the industrial age. I also question the ability of the clock to increase production before the introduction of factories. It definitely makes a difference when you need to coordinate large labour forces.

I would like to delay map trading somewhat - it destroys part of the exploration aspect of the game. Just a personal preference, and not an important point.

I look forward to that website, but have two requests. If you make a self-extracting exe, then please make it optional. I don't like to install those, I have no control of what they do and can't check before I do so how to uninstall them. And secondly, please split the download or make a split download available.

Hey, I think someone else might have mentioned this, but building the Arc de Triomphe makes the game crash. I;m still running with version 1.17. A city's production window will come up and I give new build orders, I hear the jangly wonder music, and then the game crashes. The Arc finishes that turn. Isak, if you'd like the save, let me know.

Originally posted by GIDustin
I have a 160GB Hard drive with a 15K cable ISP. I could host the file for you but it will only be available when my comp is on (which is pretty much 24/7)

I can do you (and the community) one better 1M/512 ADSL and sufficient space for the web, with ftp access.

Isak could you Or maybe NightStorm take the initiative if needed.

Regards Bernskov

Originally posted by bernskov


I can do you (and the community) one better 1M/512 ADSL and sufficient space for the web, with ftp access.

Isak could you Or maybe NightStorm take the initiative if needed.

Regards Bernskov

I will be putting the web site together. Just PM me with your email address and we can start coordinating getting everything up and running there.

Originally posted by NightStorm


I will be putting the web site together. Just PM me with your email address and we can start coordinating getting everything up and running there.

I've done just that.
The site should be at http://civ3.bernskov.com but it maybe not respond just yet as the DNS entry has to 'spread'

NightStorm have been given the needed info on maintaining the site so the pressure is on him (to make a tiny shrubbery with a little path between - nice to see other python fans)

Regards Bernskov

Great, thanks for all the offers. Looks like we can get the website up and running soon then. :goodjob:

I suggest (if Bernskov and GIDustin agree to it) that we host the Zip files on both their servers - since they are both private servers (i assume) it might be a good idea to have a backup server.

Due to somewhat popular demand (and RobO's continued begging :D ) I've decided to give modem users an alternate download option, with files split into 1.4 mb .rar files (this would be 9 files), so maybe one (I suggest GIDustin) could host the 9*1.4mb install set, and the other (Bernskov) could host the 14mb zip file. Tell me what you think?

I don't like going on hogging all of GIDustin and Bernskov's bandwidth forever. I work for an ISP, and as far as I can remember, somewhere in my contract it says that I can get a certain amount of serverspace for free, I just need to figure out where to order this, and how much time it'll take before I actually get it.

GIDustin and Bernskov, PM or Email me if you're still interested.

As for the self-extracting exe's and the like, I personally don't think this would be worth the effort for now - Once we get to version 1.0, I'm hoping that we have an exe-installer which copies files to a subdirectory in the scenarios folder, and then using a bat file, we can backup all files before installing the mod, and use another bat file to uninstall it again, so that we never have to manually copy files (unless we're dying to, of course).

Originally posted by EmprorCoopinius
Hey, I think someone else might have mentioned this, but building the Arc de Triomphe makes the game crash. I;m still running with version 1.17. A city's production window will come up and I give new build orders, I hear the jangly wonder music, and then the game crashes. The Arc finishes that turn. Isak, if you'd like the save, let me know.

sounds to me like the wonder splash is missing in PediaIcons.txt

Originally posted by Isak
I suggest (if Bernskov and GIDustin agree to it) that we host the Zip files on both their servers - since they are both private servers (i assume) it might be a good idea to have a backup server.


Backup is allways good. I can also provide a Mirror

..an alternate download option, with files split into


I'm indifferent. Why not both have both set of options and a link to each other, so that if I am 'slow to dl from' you could try GIDustins copy vai a link from my page (That is really up to NightStorms layout idea)

As for the self-extracting exe's and the like, I personally don't think this would be worth the effort for now

Agreed. Just maintain a step by step guide like the one you posted earlier in this thread.


reagrds Bernskov

Yep, pesoloco appears to have hit the spot. :goodjob:

Pediaicons refers to the file "Arc de Triomphe.pcx" but the file is called Arcdetriomphe.pcx"

Go to the Art\Wonder Splashes\ folder and rename the arcdetriomphe.pcx to:

Arc de Triomphe.pcx

Hopefully that fixes it, please report whether it does or not, as I have absolutely no time to test right now :(

Originally posted by Isak
I suggest (if Bernskov and GIDustin agree to it) that we host the Zip files on both their servers - since they are both private servers (i assume) it might be a good idea to have a backup server.

Due to somewhat popular demand (and RobO's continued begging :D ) I've decided to give modem users an alternate download option, with files split into 1.4 mb .rar files (this would be 9 files), so maybe one (I suggest GIDustin) could host the 9*1.4mb install set, and the other (Bernskov) could host the 14mb zip file. Tell me what you think?


As for who hosts what, it really it up to those guys. However, I do agree with backups as well. If they both want to host all the files, I can work with that and just have seperate "mirror" links in there.

If there is anything anyone would like to see on the site, besides just the downloads...like for instance what was added, changed, etc...just let me know through PM or email (if you already have my email) cause as has been said, this thread is already big enough. :D

Dear Kal-El!
Your mod is superb, an I like to play it. But sometimes (especially when i build Colonist), game crasheswith following message:

" CIVILIZATION3 caused an invalid page fault in
module CIVILIZATION3.EXE at 015f:00555ab0.
Registers:
EAX=00877504 CS=015f EIP=00555ab0 EFLGS=00010212
EBX=00877290 SS=0167 ESP=00adedcc EBP=00877504
ECX=00000000 DS=0167 ESI=00878de0 FS=3c07
EDX=0000006d ES=0167 EDI=00877890 GS=0000
Bytes at CS:EIP:
8b 41 08 56 85 c0 74 09 b8 18 00 00 00 5e c2 18
Stack dump:
00537d57 00877504 0000015f 0000006d 00000000 00000000 00000000 00877890 00877290 00000000 00877800 00000000 0056234e 00877890 00877290 0087780c "

Can it be fixed somehow?

Originally posted by Mark132
Dear Kal-El!
Your mod is superb, an I like to play it. But sometimes (especially when i build Colonist), game crasheswith following message:

" CIVILIZATION3 caused an invalid page fault in
module CIVILIZATION3.EXE at 015f:00555ab0.
Registers:
EAX=00877504 CS=015f EIP=00555ab0 EFLGS=00010212
EBX=00877290 SS=0167 ESP=00adedcc EBP=00877504
ECX=00000000 DS=0167 ESI=00878de0 FS=3c07
EDX=0000006d ES=0167 EDI=00877890 GS=0000
Bytes at CS:EIP:
8b 41 08 56 85 c0 74 09 b8 18 00 00 00 5e c2 18
Stack dump:
00537d57 00877504 0000015f 0000006d 00000000 00000000 00000000 00877890 00877290 00000000 00877800 00000000 0056234e 00877890 00877290 0087780c "

Can it be fixed somehow?

What Operating system are you using, how much ram do you have and what kind of video card are you using?

Ugh, I'm sorry for my ignorance. OK, there is Win98, 512 MB RAM and Pixelview X-Player Pro (GeForce 2 GTS) with 64 MB RAM DDR. But on Win2K and XP was the same - I mean game crash.
It is also independent from game patch - 1.16,1.17 or 1.21f - always the same. Thank you for so fast responce :)

Mark132,

What else are you doing besides building colonist when the game crashes?

Hey Kal-el, you wanted a new version of your mill...well, here ya go!!! :D :goodjob:

Isak

Thanks for the help with the Arc...it works fine now. Have another question......my Partisan folder is empty, no ini or flcs or anything. Any idea where I can get these files? Thanks.

Originally posted by EmprorCoopinius
Thanks for the help with the Arc...it works fine now. Have another question......my Partisan folder is empty, no ini or flcs or anything. Any idea where I can get these files? Thanks.

Copy the Sniper files into that folder and rename the .ini file to partisan.ini

game locks up after building any of the new wonders
alright i build one the new wonders (sphinx/stonehenge/ect.) and after it says the wonder has been finished and i see the image of the built wonder (splash screen image i think) and i close the image to continue playing the game 'locks up', everything is frozen. needless to this is very irritating. oh and one minor thing, are any of the added units/buildings/wonders supposed to have images or descriptions in the .pedia because all i see is alot purple.


__________________
sors immanis et inanis

awesome mod kal-el! there is one thing I disagree with, however.

Irrigation should be available from the start, since irrigation is dated back before the ancient egyptians (nile river valley...). Or, make it available with one of the starting techs. Crop rotation is waaaaay too late historically and gameplay-wise.

Keep up the good work Kal-el, NightStorm, Isak, GIDustin.......

Kal-el,
I added some new resources to try out the "Require resources to build Buildings and Units. And it works great. It just seems that 6x6 is still the limit on resources. (Well, at least that is 6 more than last time.) What is Resources_Shadows used for?

I think it will be a good idea to make the spearman, that you can build from Bronze working to require Copper. But then you need to add another unit to Iron Working that has the same stats as the spearman, but requires Iron (Strategic Metals). To even out the game. Else some Civ’s will never have a strong defense in the beginning.
- Just a thought

GIDustin,
Would you be so Kind and start on the Ancient era entries first and then post them once completed??

NightStorm,
Could you also Please first complete the Ancient era first?
Great fork getting the Web site up so fast!

Isak,
Keep up the good Release Managing.

Originally posted by Victorvanwavere
Keep up the good work Kal-el, NightStorm, Isak, GIDustin.......

NightStorm,
Could you also Please first complete the Ancient era first?
Great fork getting the Web site up so fast!

What is it about the ancient era that I need to complete?

Odd, I don't have any sniper folder in my units directory. I just copied the secret agent files and renamed that ini...will that be ok?

Just a quick msg to tell you that there is a copy/paste edition of the installguide from this forum avaiable on http://civ3.bernskov.com/install.guide.htm

I hope that all the files are there as well...

Hi all

Has anybody had problems with moving the landmine, seamine & the airbase since installing the 1.21 mod :confused:

Does anybody have the solloution to being able to get them out of the citys they are built in

Ex,

Don’t think of it so much as irrigation, but as improved farming techniques. I understand irrigation was around since the time of Egyptian Empires, and probably before that. The purpose of moving irrigation to the middle ages was to represent the dramatic increase in farming productivity that came along with the agricultural revolution. This was do in part to crop rotation, but also to better tools for tilling the fields.

nzrock,

the land and naval mines should be able to paradrop out of a city. the problem with this is that you have to have an airport. they should also be loadable into transports. I still haven't looked at 1.21f so I don't know if that has changed anything.

Victorvanwavere,

I agree with you about needing an additional defensive type unit.

Note: strategic metals will be returned to iron - it was only renamed to represent both iron and copper.

bernskov,

thanks for the webspace. :D

Nightstorm,

Looks beautiful :goodjob:

GIDustin,

I will take a look at the Units_32 issue.

All,

I will be putting together the resources tonight.

Here is the fixed Ancient era advisor screen. make sure you download the new techboxes I posted above. I will update the first post later.

thanks for all the support. :)

Originally posted by EmprorCoopinius
Odd, I don't have any sniper folder in my units directory. I just copied the secret agent files and renamed that ini...will that be ok?

Nope...won't work...goto the very first page of this thread...about half-way down, Kal-el has posted the unit downloads...get the sniper files from there and then copy them over...they aren't the same as the secret agent files...

NightStorm,

I still have a lot of buildings that are not showing in the city build list. (I think you are the one working on this). I was hoping you would finish the buildings small and large by era and post it as you complete them.

Originally posted by Victorvanwavere
NightStorm,

I still have a lot of buildings that are not showing in the city build list. (I think you are the one working on this). I was hoping you would finish the buildings small and large by era and post it as you complete them.

The build queue images are in no way related to the civilopedia images that I did. Yes, they are the same general images however they are not the same files. The files you are speaking of are the buildings-large.pcx and buildings-small.pcx files. These files have to be done in order of their respective entries in the .bic file.

Therefore, if say for instance the order is temple, port, shrine then the images would have to be in the exact same order in the file. I suppose it could be done by era, however it would be a whole lot more difficult because I would have a lot of skipped spaces, and that would lead to possible errors. I would rather be able to pull up the editor and look at the list one entry at a time while I'm doing the graphic for the same entry. Sorry, but it is only a minor inconvenience that does not affect game play.

I am working diligently and will have them done before the final version of the mod is released. :D

I recommend that all players of the DYP use these graphics by Icedan for the irrigation. They look more like farmland rather then the irrigation that comes with the game.

icedan,

if you would like me to remove this file from the post just let me know.

Well, it appears that Firaxis' idea of unlimited resources is 36. Anymore than that and you run into the same invisible barrier that thre used to be with 24. And we are still limited to 8 luxury resources.

So here are the 36 resources:
Strategic: 14
Horses
Iron
Saltpeter
Coal
Oil
Rubber
Aluminum
Urnium
Timber
Flax
Copper
Marble
Stone
Elephant

Luxury: 8
Furs
Spices
Coffee
Silks
Wine
Tobacco
Gems
Incense

Bonus: 14
Game
Seal
Cattle
Sheep
Wheat
Corn
Fruit
Tropical Fruit
Fish
Whales
Pearls
Oasis
Silver
Gold

Here is a pic of the new resources. I will post the file once all the details are worked out in the bic. http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/resources.gif

I have finished adding in the HP scale and am currently working on the resources. They should be done by tomorrow night. In the mean time here is the new federal republic icon
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/federalrepublic_large.gif

forgot to attach the files

Food/Growth: I started out yesterday in a grassland area. I try to locate my starting city at a river or fresh water source, but decided to try this one out. After a while I discovered that the city could not grow beyond size 2 because of the production limits imposed by despotism. None of the techs gave me a bonus food resource. I considered restarting, but decided to stick with it to see where it would go. I actually got a tribe from a hut, but plopped it in a similar location before I discovered this growth limitation. I then found the Zulus by a flood plain, and took their city. This city produced one extra food and was able to produce settlers, albeit very slowly. There was a wheat square on the flood plain, oustide the radius of the former Zulu city, producing 6 food, but other than that nothing useful within a reasonable distance. There was an oasis, but that gave only 2 food. This growth limitation severely limits my options, as I cannot effectively finish any wonders and I cannot expand.
There are several ways I can deal with this, other than conquering my neighbours. I can "cheat" by producing a serf/worker, starting a settler at city size 2 and adding the serf to the city just before the settler is done. And I can go for a government that lifts the production restriction.

The implication here is that you need a bonus food resource or flood plains to be able to expand, or access to an improved government (which will take time), or you can go on a conquering spree.

I'm not sure this is a major problem, though it will stop an AI civ from expanding in a number of cases. Balancing growth and food production is very difficult.

The Brave costs the same as a spearman and is better (2/2/1 instead of 1/2/1). Why should I ever build spearmen if I can build the Brave unit :confused: I think something needs to change here - why not make the Brave 2/1/1 ?

Serfs/Workers at start are in many cases out of a job because several civs start with neither The Wheel (Commercial) nor Mining (Industrious) and Irrigation comes much later.

Mining can in a way be considered as an advanced technique, just as Irrigation is (btw, why not rename Irrigation to Farming?). It is noteworthy that you can access strategic resources like Iron without having to mine them. I like to think of "Mining" as a kind of industrial exploitation that is probably available from late middle ages. So, I propose that the mining tech be (re)moved (and Industrious civs be given Masonry), and that "Mining" (preferably with another name) be moved into the middle age. It would also be appropriate to change the mine graphics to something representing a workshop.

Startup: If the mining change is used, or perhaps even if it isn't, then I think the starting Serf should be replaced with a warrior. The Serf will only be useful if you have roadbuilding, and it would also serve to slow expansion down even more.

These two last changes will affect gameplay drastically. They might not make the game more fun - but then again they might do just that :) - that remains to be tested. I think it would be interesting, and will try it out.

Let me get some opinions on these ideas.

To start, I want to say this is a terrific mod. The author is a genius and has come up with some great ideas to make Civ3 a more enjoyable game to play. :goodjob:

I've upgraded with the v1.21f patch, downloaded all the files, and installed the mod using Isak's quick installation instructions.

I've run into a couple a problems after attempting to play a few games and here they are:

Mining - Just isn't happening. The first time I played I chose Zululand and had to research mining. But after gaining it, the option wasn't available for the workers. I tried another civ and had the same problem. Without being able to mine and increase shield production, the game was going nowhere fast. I did look at the .bic file in the editor and couldn't find anything odd or a reason to explain why a worker didn't have the option to mine.

Text descriptions - None of the new units, advancements, or improvement have descriptions in the civilopedia within the game. This is very frustrating as I have no idea what the Obelisk does for a city, let alone any other improvements or advancements or units. Along with this, the pictures or icons for what's been added to this mod do not show up in the civilopedia within the game.

If there is someway to fix these problems, then this mod would be sweet to play, but until these issues can be resolved, then I'll have to be patient and wait. :(

Thanks,

Shultster :smoke:

Originally posted by shultster
Mining - Just isn't happening. The first time I played I chose Zululand and had to research mining. But after gaining it, the option wasn't available for the workers. I tried another civ and had the same problem. Without being able to mine and increase shield production, the game was going nowhere fast. I did look at the .bic file in the editor and couldn't find anything odd or a reason to explain why a worker didn't have the option to mine.
Did you try to mine forests?
Mining doesn't work on grasslands anymore.
If that's not the problem, you've gotten one of Kal-el's bugs.
Originally posted by shultster
Text descriptions - None of the new units, advancements, or improvement have descriptions in the civilopedia within the game. This is very frustrating as I have no idea what the Obelisk does for a city, let alone any other improvements or advancements or units. Along with this, the pictures or icons for what's been added to this mod do not show up in the civilopedia within the game.

Sadly, the civilopedia entries haven't been added yet, but if you use the readme, print it or alt-tab between it and the game, you will get the basic idea.

Kal-el:


My game is allowing me many more than that. What have you tried? Are you still using the the default resources.pcx? Here is a screenshot of mine. Notice the size:

GIDustin

Originally posted by shultster
Along with this, the pictures or icons for what's been added to this mod do not show up in the civilopedia within the game.

Have you downloaded the civilopedia buildings files that were added about halfway through this thread? Once those are downloaded and installed, you will be able to see these.

Also, you won't see anything in the build queue until I finish those images, just so you know. ;)

Originally posted by shultster
To start, I want to say this is a terrific mod. The author is a genius and has come up with some great ideas to make Civ3 a more enjoyable game to play.

Well, thank you. I think Genius might be going a bit too far (stop it, false modesty is so unbecoming ;))

But seriously folks, I think Comen is probably right about the mining issue.

Originally posted by RobO
Food/Growth:
The implication here is that you need a bonus food resource or flood plains to be able to expand, or access to an improved government (which will take time), or you can go on a conquering spree.

I'm not sure this is a major problem, though it will stop an AI civ from expanding in a number of cases. Balancing growth and food production is very difficult.

This, IMO, is the hardest part of the game to reconcile. Trying to balance growth before and after the discovery of higher forms of govt.

I think the current system most accurately reflects the development of civilizations, and puts a premium on choosing where you are going to place those early cities. Much like in the early years of civilizations, only those nations that had the good fortune to be in a fertile location early were able to blossom. Indus River Valley, Nile River Valley, Tigris and Euphrates, Yangtze, etc.

Originally posted by RobO
The Brave costs the same as a spearman and is better (2/2/1 instead of 1/2/1). Why should I ever build spearmen if I can build the Brave unit :confused: I think something needs to change here - why not make the Brave 2/1/1 ?

Good point, you have to remember that the brave was first developed before the advent of the HP system. The brave should probably be 2/1/1 with +2 hp or he could be 2/2/1 with +1 HP but costs more than the spearman. Militaristic civs then have the choice, they can put a little more time and effort into producing a Brave or they can go the cheap route and build the spearman.

Originally posted by RobO
Serfs/Workers at start are in many cases out of a job because several civs start with neither The Wheel (Commercial) nor Mining (Industrious) and Irrigation comes much later.

Yeah, that is a problem. One option is to just add them to your initial city. And build a worker later.

Originally posted by RobO
Mining can in a way be considered as an advanced technique, just as Irrigation is. … It is noteworthy that you can access strategic resources like Iron without having to mine them. I like to think of "Mining" as a kind of industrial exploitation that is probably available from late middle ages. So, I propose that the mining tech be (re)moved (and Industrious civs be given Masonry), and that "Mining" (preferably with another name) be moved into the middle age. It would also be appropriate to change the mine graphics to something representing a workshop.

I don’t think I will remove the mining tech itself as I like it as a prereq for bronze and then iron working, plus it allows copper and iron to become visible on the map even if you can’t make any units with them yet. But I do like the idea of removing the mining ability to the industrial era, available with steam power to represent the improved drilling tools and techniques available after the invention of the steam engine. I am reminded of the story of John Henry the Steel driving man.

A concern would be that workers would really have nothing to do now and you wouldn’t be able to log forests. So, in order to keep some utility for the worker units I don’t think I will do this. If only we could add worker jobs.

Originally posted by RobO btw, why not rename Irrigation to Farming?

Very Good Point. This will help clear up some of the confusion we have been seeing as to just why it is not available until after crop rotation.

Originally posted by RobO
Startup: … Serf should be replaced with a warrior. The Serf will only be useful if you have roadbuilding, and it would also serve to slow expansion down even more.

I really like the serf unit. I think the serf is more valuable than you give him credit for. The industrious civ basically gets the laborer two eras ahead of anybody else.

just a note to anyone who may read GIDustin's post just above and wonder why tehn does the DyP not have more resources. I have talked with GIDustin and he now agrees that only 36 resources will show up on the map.

Hey Kal-el, how about a little rework on the resources.pcx file. Few of the icons look more realistic this way (I think :D )

Also, do we need jade as a resource, since you have jade exchange as a building?? :confused:

I think you've got clams in your coal. :D

When it comes down to it, people are going to change the reource icons to match their preference. I like the oil and I would like to see the Uranium a litle bit more vibrant (easily fixed). But I don't think you see too many bearskin rugs lying about the woods nor do you see naturally occuring bottles of wine. I know, I know, you don't see aluminum cans or rubber tires growing in the wild either, but when possible I prefer to use the raw resources. Sometimes it would be too difficult to figure out what the raw resource is, e.g. incense and rubber. Why do people like the metal bars?

Since when do I have the Jade Exchange as a building?

Jade Exchange was in the .zip file you sent me of the buildings that needed worked on. It isn't in the .bic file though. Was just wondering. This is what was sent to me by you in the .zip file.

hmmm, very interesting. don't remember every seeing that before. :D well, no matter, it is not in the bic, sorry for the confusion.:p

by the way, I will edit the resource image to use the uranium (after some editing) and oil that you posted.

are people interested in an artillary unit between catapults and cannons?

I am thinking wither trebuchet or bombard.

Thoughts, preferences?

Originally posted by Kal-el
are people interested in an artillary unit between catapults and cannons?

I am thinking wither trebuchet or bombard.

Thoughts, preferences?

If I had to choose, I think the trebuchet would be most appropriate. It would be a good bombardment unit to put between the catapult and the cannon, make it available with Engineering or maybe Chivalry or Feudalism.

Hi, I haven't read the whole thread (only first and last pages) and don't have any previous mod-experience but I've played with this mod, and these are my comments on it:

General:
- AI has trouble with new food/citizen-ratio. Sometimes they whip too much and need entertainers with size 1 cities (even capital/last city), which are then abandoned because of food-shortage. This way they are completely suicidal in times of war. It would be better if a city could get 3 food on center tile (if it is grassland/plains/hills/other nutrient stuff), so that it always can remain size 1, and has better chance of growing size 3 (for settlers).

It would be nice if somehow AI would know to avoid building desert and tundra-towns, as they will almost never grow past size 2.

Units:
- Brave is a bit too powerful so early in the game (esp. compared to spearman). And has ability to airdrop??
- Ranger, Brave, Crusader need own pix to help distinguish them.
- Horseman is the same (only mounted and not wheeled) and more expensive than chariot
- Convoy and Motorized Transport are useless (are they?)
- Battle animation for ships is not in the right direction
- AI likes to build archers/longbowmen as primary attacking units. Dunno if this is because lack of resources for swordsmen or if it's a fault.

Improvements/Wonders
- Pyramids are too expensive now that they only deliver obelisks. I'd say halve them 20/200
- Theater is a bit expensive.. 60 should be 6 ;)

So far played until ca 1750, got to knights/crusaders/explosives (which I usually also do), so I guess most rates are ok. AI has trouble keeping up though :p

Forgot to mention I find it a great mod. Would be nice if most things can get really integrated (like pix, civ-entries, AI-gameplay)

In response to Kal-el's response:

Food/Growth: I know this is difficult to balance out - I have tried it myself and gave up. I guess the current setup will work, but I'll have to try it out some more. It focuses the early game on access to food, as that is the limiting factor for growth, but that may be entirely reasonable.

Serfs/Workers at start: I think you misunderstood me, and I also was not aware of the difference between the two. I was talking about having a starting worker that has nothing to do because you can neither mine, irrigate nor build roads. I tried using a starting warrior instead yesterday, and reverted to the worker because it is more interesting to play that way. It does imply that you will want to research mining or roadbuilding asap, though.

Mining: I'm trying it out now, having made it available with Explosives. I gave Masonry to the Industrious civs but I suppose it could just as well be mining. I usually don't have a lot of time to play, so this is unfortunately not a fast process. I have found so far that I'm so busy producing food that production is severely limited. I expect that is the same for all the other civs. I played England, and my worker has been plenty busy making roads. Perhaps that industrious serf is too efficient at start?

While playing I noticed a few other things

The Ranger is must too fast for my comfort. I like to explore and dislike having everything exposed in the blink of an eye ;) . After some experimentation I gave him a movement of 3 and removed the "terrain as roads" ability. In fact, I would personally probably prefer to revert to the Scout and make the Scout exclusive to the expansionist civs, but I can always mod the mod myself :D . I do think however that you should consider the 3 movement points instead of letting him zip along on invisible roads.

Road movement: In the process of working with the Ranger I temporarily set the road movement rate to 2. I had the feleing that it slowed down everything too much, so went for the solution described above instead. It is however an interesting thought, but quite radical. It would mean that most of the land units with 2+ movement points should have their movement points increased, and would allow for a greater degree of differentiation between units. Its not a change to be done lightly, however. What do y'all think about this wild and crazy idea? Nuts?

Resource pics: I don't recognize the Marble pic - I think this one and the Stone should show an angular 3D block that is white/shiny (for marble) and sand-colored (for stone). Have you ever played Pharaoh? The blocks of stone in that game are exactly what I would like to have. It should be easy to draw with some nice shadows for someone with the proper skills. Or the Marble could be some slabs/tiles that are stacked and slightly shifted. Anyway, please change the stone even if you keep the marble.

Thanks all for your informative replies.

Mining - Yes, the problem I've been having with mining must have been because you can no longer mine on grasslands or plains. This will definitely make the game go much slower since it will take so much longer to build units or improvments. As a note, when my workers were set to automatic mode, they would always chop down the forests. If that is the norm and you can only mine in a forest, then you would never be able to mine. I naturally assume you can mine in the hills and mountains however.

Text descriptions - Having to switch back and forth between the readme file and the game, or print it out is terrible annoying. But I suppose if I were to look on the bright side, once I've learned about all the new entries for this mod, then I won't need to constantly refer to the readme file.

Sorry about this but I couldn't figure out how to add a quote while posting a reply but it was something like this:

Have you downloaded the civilopedia buildings files that were added about halfway through this thread? Once those are downloaded and installed, you will be able to see these.

Also, you won't see anything in the build queue until I finish those images, just so you know.

I will look for this file so I can download and install it.

I really don't mean to criticize this terrific mod pack, but I feel like it's necessary to read each and every post so I don't miss a single file that I'm supposed to download. Maybe I missed it somewhere, but is there a way this can be avoided? I understand someone was building a homepage for Double Your Pleasure. I'll have to go back through previous posts and see if I can find it.

Again, Kal-el, great mod pack and my salute to you and the others for the time and effort that's been put into this. :goodjob:

Shultster

Okie dokie....I went back through the pages of posts and found:

http://civ3.bernskov.com/install.guide.htm

I was able to download the 3, not 2, but 3 (and certainly not 4) additional building graphics. Just as a note, there were duplicates between the files and they were different sizes so I just chose to overwrite the older file. Sorry I didn't write down which ones were duplicated so I could add them to this post.

If I may make a suggestion to simplify the downloading process for this mod. Instead of posting new files to this thread, upload them to the previously mentioned web site. This would save everyone a great deal of time especially since this thread has so many posts and replies now.

Again...thanks and terrific work :goodjob:

Shultster

Hello All

Sorry, I've been away for a while, but I'm now back in release managing business.

Just to clarify:

There will be a new release within the next couple of days. This release will make all currently finished files available in a one-file download (1 file....not 2, not 0) and in a split up set, to help the poor modem users a bit :D

About the Reference - I'm compiling a complete reference for all buildings, units, terrain, wonders etc. etc - with a bit of luck, I'll have it finished by the end of the week. (Note: I'm usually pessimistic when handing out release dates - so don't be surprised if it gets finished sooner)

And shultster: Thanks for the confidence, and keep up the good beta-testing :goodjob:

When Isak has the 1 (one) file ready it will be avaiable on http://civ3.bernskov.com
There will be a better todo list where Kal-EL will post which elements is being worked on and so on. (Maybe finished tonight)
If any of you have ideas that needed to be on that web please tell me so it will give you a central place of info for this great Mod.
Please be advices that the current install guide will be rewritten when Isak has done the Release Manager bit :-)

reagrds
Bernskov (ub@bernskov.com)

After some testing, I think I have an idea about that bug I mentioned a few days ago.

It seems like the improvements with both coastal flag and near water flag had some problems with geting along with the harbor, which only has a coastal flag.

The point is that sometimes when I built the harbor first, I couldn't build the others afterwards, but not always.

If I built the port or the shipyard first, I can always build the harbor just fine.

The point is, it is only to remove the near water flag on coastal installations.

BTW, why is district courthouse flagged as near water?

First I would like to announce that today is my last day of classes ever for Law School!!! [dance] Yahooo!!! [party] This is of course bad news for the rest of you as I will now be focusing on exams and the bar :( (yikes, that's no fun.)

On to other (more important) matters

Originally posted by Plux
General:
It would be better if a city could get 3 food on center tile (if it is grassland/plains/hills/other nutrient stuff), so that it always can remain size 1, and has better chance of growing size 3 (for settlers).
talk to Firaxis about this. The 2 food on the center tile is hardcoded into the game.

Originally posted by Plux
It would be nice if somehow AI would know to avoid building desert and tundra-towns, as they will almost never grow past size 2.
that would be nice. Tundra towns should never get past size 1 and should generally starve.

Originally posted by Plux
Units:
- Brave is a bit too powerful so early in the game (esp. compared to spearman). And has ability to airdrop??
In the soon to be released v.0.3 the Brave will cost 3 compared to the spearman 2.

Originally posted by Plux
- Ranger, Brave, Crusader need own pix to help distinguish them.
People are working on the Brave and the Crusader

Originally posted by Plux
- Horseman is the same (only mounted and not wheeled) and more expensive than chariot
Not being wheeled can be a serious advantage, it all depends on your surrounding terrain.

Originally posted by Plux
- Battle animation for ships is not in the right direction
Which one

Originally posted by Plux
Improvements/Wonders
- Pyramids are too expensive now that they only deliver obelisks. I'd say halve them 20/200
Only the obelisk? Having free obelisk’s in all your cities is a huge boost to your starting culture, to be able to jump to the next sphere of influence within ten turns of founding the city is a tremendous advantage. If anything the obelisk itself may need to be more expensive.

Thanks for your comments, I am glad you like the mod so far. It will only get better from here.

Wow, the web site looks great B. Guess I will abandon my design and go with yours! Good Job! :goodjob:

Comen,

The District Court is flagged as must be near water simply to limit the number of district courthouses you have. There should be fewer district Courthouses than city courthouses.

Another goal of the Mod is to have your coastal and river cities develop more than your interior cities. This is more representative of how cities actually grow. Just look around, all the major cities throughout most of the worlds History were either costal cities or had access to the coast via a major river. I was just trying to emulate that phenomenon in the mod.

Originally posted by RobO
In response to Kal-el's response:

Food/Growth:…It focuses the early game on access to food, as that is the limiting factor for growth, but that may be entirely reasonable.
That is definitely one of the deciding factors in the design choice.
Serfs/Workers at start: … It does imply that you will want to research mining or roadbuilding asap, though.
Again, I wanted to make these first tier techs very valuable to make choosing starting civs more interesting. Do you want to be able to build roads right from the start or would you rather have some other advantage over your neighbors?
While playing I noticed a few other things

The Ranger is must too fast for my comfort. I like to explore and dislike having everything exposed in the blink of an eye ;) . After some experimentation I gave him a movement of 3 and removed the "terrain as roads" ability. In fact, I would personally probably prefer to revert to the Scout and make the Scout exclusive to the expansionist civs, but I can always mod the mod myself :D . I do think however that you should consider the 3 movement points instead of letting him zip along on invisible roads.
The problem is that if you give him three MPs there is never a time when he becomes obsolete. As it stands now with his road “treat all as roads” there is little incentive to build him after you have roads and the scout can move 6 over those. As you know it’s all a matter of balance. What if the ranger had no defensive value and the scout had 1?

Road movement: In the process of working with the Ranger I temporarily set the road movement rate to 2. I had the feleing that it slowed down everything too much, so went for the solution described above instead. It is however an interesting thought, but quite radical. It would mean that most of the land units with 2+ movement points should have their movement points increased, and would allow for a greater degree of differentiation between units. Its not a change to be done lightly, however. What do y'all think about this wild and crazy idea? Nuts?
This was actually discussed by Kryten in the Alexander the Great Mod that he is doing the animations for. I think it is a good idea, but it would require some serious fleshing out. If we eventually went this way I think it would really clear up your ranger issue.

Resource pics: I don't recognize the Marble pic - I think this one and the Stone should show an angular 3D block that is white/shiny (for marble) and sand-colored (for stone). Have you ever played Pharaoh? The blocks of stone in that game are exactly what I would like to have. It should be easy to draw with some nice shadows for someone with the proper skills. Or the Marble could be some slabs/tiles that are stacked and slightly shifted. Anyway, please change the stone even if you keep the marble.
Put together a stone image and let me see what you are talking about. The marble image is marble columns and slabs.

Fantastic Comen, I think you've solved the harbor bug.

Nightstorm, since you were unable to produce the bug previously (thereby thwarting my otherwise brilliant theory :cry: ) could you perhaps try it again, but this time start by building the harbor and a port or shipyard afterwards - anyone else willing to try, please go ahead, I really desperately want to remove this bug from the mod :scan:

Kal-El:
Big Congratulations: If I'm ever about to get into any kind of legal trouble, I'll give you a call first :D

And don't worry about the mod either - there's plenty of helping hands around here - all you need to do is come back once the mod is finished, and put your name on the box :rolleyes:

So many questions and comments to respond to I forgot what I meant to post.

Regarding the improvement costs:
What do people think of just using a basic multiplier for each era. i.e. x1.5 for middle ages, x2 for Industrial, x2.5 for Modern.? Too much? Too little? Would it be better at x1.25, x1.5 and x2? Or maybe x1.25, x1.75, x2.25?


Please comment.

Kal-el,

I think this was covered some time ago, but why not give "The Tribe" a movement of 2? This will five you a little more freedom to place that first vital city.


Also,
Is there a good tutorial thread on adding new tech, including Tech boxes and pics?

About the Tribe moving 2: Originally I was going to give it the treat all terrain as roads ability, but was brought to my senses by somebody on the board, credit to you, I am not going to read through and figure out who it was, you know who you are. Move 2 is not a bad idea, but remember, Tribe units are what you get from goody huts so you don't want to make them too useful.

As with most things I am open to suggestions and if other people feel similarly, let me know and it can be changed.

About the tutorial: well now that you mention it, I did put together a little tutorial on the subject. Read it here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=20136)

One of the biggest things left on the to do list is converting the map linked below to be compatible with all the new resources.

Someone, please take on this fun and exciting project. All it requires is a serious understanding of geography, aided by a good atlas, and patience and time.

contact a team member if you would like to volunteer.

Kal-el:
Your signature is more than 5 lines long. Expect a message from the signature police in the near future :p

Originally posted by Kal-el
Which one

This was on the subject of wrong boat battle animation. I attacked enemy galleys with both triremes and longships. Both took on their opponent head-on in stead of side-by-side. Just a graphical glitch...


Only the obelisk? Having free obelisk’s in all your cities is a huge boost to your starting culture, to be able to jump to the next sphere of influence within ten turns of founding the city is a tremendous advantage. If anything the obelisk itself may need to be more expensive.
I was just comparing Pyramids with Stonehenge which gives free granaries in every city. Granaries are most costly than obelisks, so I thought Stonehenge should be more expensive than Pyramids too. Or indeed obelisks should be more expensive (but I think their cost is ok)


talk to Firaxis about this. The 2 food on the center tile is hardcoded into the game.
I just mentioned this because in my game the AI didn't know how to deal with the new food/citizen-ratio. Several times I saw cities that once were size 4/5 disappear without being attacked and civs that thus destroyed themselves.

I don't know if others experienced the same, but IMHO it really hurts gameplay, and that's a pity..

PS: Am I correct that your mod changes the whole Civ-install, and that I can't just switch to normal by replacing the civ3mod.bic-file?? I'm a n00b on modding so I hope you can shed some light on this, and tell me what the best way is to switch between (graphic) mods.

The mod i am working on now has an "install.bat" and "uninstall.bat" where you can install the game, play awhile, then uninstall and install someone elses, play that, then re-install mine and have everything still work (This will take an extra sum of HD space so it will be optional upon install)

This could be implemented in this mod as well . . .

GIDustin

GID,

That would be very cool. can you talk to Isak about that?

thanks,

Plux, regarding the ship attack animation: are you playing v0.2? that was supposed to have been fixed. if you are and are still having problems check the unit in the bic and make sure that the rotate to attack is flagged.

originally posted by plux
I just mentioned this because in my game the AI didn't know how to deal with the new food/citizen-ratio. Several times I saw cities that once were size 4/5 disappear without being attacked and civs that thus destroyed themselves.

has anybody else seen this? if so that's really not good.

Yes, I've noticed this too. Sorry I didn't mention it before. When I downloaded the mod pack files, they were v0.2 as far as I know.

Shultster

Kal-el,

I really like the idea of little food in the beginning.
But I do think the computer does really have a hard time with this.
I tried to correct this by starting with 2 Settlers, this helps some of the computers. They now have double the chance to get a viable city. Yet, I am almost sure that during war times some citys dissapear. Also when I looking at the replay.

I dont know how you are going to address this. I like the consept and would hate to see to much change to the food worked out. I am not feeling sorry for the computers, they cheat enough, but to make this a mod to stand the test of time, some thing small will have to be tweaked.

In the new patch, there is a new "Unit Ability" named "Rotate to attack". Try altering this (if it is on, turn it off, if it is off, turn it on)

Tell me what you find out

Well, I just gave the updated bic file to the release manager.

I am going to test a few things with this, so let me know what you think. Like I need to tell you guys that. :)

First in regards to the food issue: I am removing the tile penalty from despotism. I just played a game where the AI started on a flood plain and couldn't grow past size 1. very bad for him, not so fun for me. Hopefully this will help with the food problem. You still won't be able to Farm and if you don't have some grassland, flood plains or food resource around you will still struggle to grow.

Second: I am going to try out the RobO/Kryten roads multiplier and see how this goes. Again, looking for serious feedback on this.

Other things:
Added: New Resources
Added: Implemented new HP system
Edit: Golden Age Extended to 30 turns
Edit: Maximum research time is now 50 turns
Edit: Fixed Tech Boxes to be compatible with patch v1.21f
Edit: Fixed Ancient Science Advisor Screen to be compatible with patch v1.21f
Edit: Irrigation changed to Farm
Edit: Longship renamed Longboat
Edit: Caravan renamed Merchant
Edit: Convoy renamed Caravan

Kal-el:

First: I changed my golden age to 50 turns, but I guess that is a personal preference :p

Second, I know that in order to add civs that can be played, you have to rename the "gonna be replaced" civ's files to something else. Well, I did, and I was going to send all the "Ga*.*" (New Ghandi files) along with my mod (as well as all the other civs) and then thought about creating a .bat that just renames the installer's Ghandi files to my Ga*.* format.

My mod went from 107MB to 56MB. If you have added civs, or plan on adding civs, I highly suggest this.

As for the installer.bat file I was talking about somewhere in a previous post, I just successfully made one for my mod (install and UnInstall) so making one for yours shouldn't be a problem.

Also, thanks again for your help in my tech advisor screens.

GIDustin

P.S. If my "Second, ..." above made no sense, I can re-explain it when I am less tired. :sleep:

GIDustin: Yup, I definitely have planned on making a .bat installer/uninstaller available for this mod, just haven't gotten around to writing it yet.

If you feel like doing it just drop me a line when I v.0.3 has been released (hopefully in a few hours!!!! :eek: )

Isak,

The buildings-small.pcx and buildings-large.pcx files should be finished in a few days. Can't finish them today cause I'm going to take a test for a new police dispatcher job. I'll get them to ya for release v0.4

Kal-el wrote:
Put together a stone image and let me see what you are talking about. The marble image is marble columns and slabs.

A reasonable request :) And I did recognize the marble image, but it did take some time.

I have made some feeble attempts at stone and marble using my limited graphics skills and enclosed them in a pcx file. Have a look at them. I haven't tried them out in the game yet - it will be much easier to test them once I get v0.3 than starting to add resources myself. I would probably do some irreversible damage :cry: (just kidding, I could probably make it work if I spent enough time).

Note the smileys on the luxury resources - they come from SkankyBurns: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=15022
I like to use them and plan to add them to the mod as an alternate resource file. I'll send it to Isak when I get it done. I don't plan to add the strategic resource letters.

I'm in a regent game in the middle-ages right now, and I have a few opinions about this.

About the building costs: Right now I have 4 cities completing a wonder each in very good time, better than I did without DyP.
So the cost might be raised a little.

But I the ordinary buildings are something else I think.
All of them have less than half the improvements possible, and it is not so easy to choose which ones to build because of this.
Atleast it becomes important to make choices that way.
So maybe the wonder costs should be raised a bit more than the oter buildings?

But atleast you will have to raise the tech rates.
I increased the minimum turns to research to 6 turns, and now I go trought the tech three researching everything at 6 turns with a low tech rate, so I have a lot of money and luxuries, and am going to the industrial ages much earlier than what would be realistic.

If I didn't have the minimum 6 turns, I believe I would be there around year 1000, and that is with only a few libraries.

IMO, you should atleast increase the middleages tech-rates with 50%, and more in the later ages.


That's my opinions atleast

Originally posted by Comen
But I the ordinary buildings are something else I think.
All of them have less than half the improvements possible, and it is not so easy to choose which ones to build because of this.
Atleast it becomes important to make choices that way.
This is by design, you shouldn't be able to build everything in every city until much later in the game. Initially you have to choose what you want your city to be "famous" for. Is this an industrial center of your empire? Is this city known for its Trade? Or do scientists flock to your academies and universities?

So maybe the wonder costs should be raised a bit more than the oter buildings?
I think all the buildings will probably be raised at the same rate to account for the increased production levels.

But at least you will have to raise the tech rates.
I increased the minimum turns to research to 6 turns, and now I go trought the tech three researching everything at 6 turns with a low tech rate, so I have a lot of money and luxuries, and am going to the industrial ages much earlier than what would be realistic.

IMO, you should atleast increase the middleages tech-rates with 50%, and more in the later ages.

Science Costs will probably also be raised at the same rate as the building costs, unless people feel other wise. Go here to vote (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21114)

Regarding the improvement costs:
I put a poll on the main creation forum, go here to vote (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21113)

Here are the options:
A: x1.25, x1.5, x2
B: x1.5 , x2 , x2.5
C: x1.25, x1.75, x2.25
D: Other

Somehow the file fell out of my previous post. This should be it:

Somehow the file fell out of my previous post - perhaps because I'm usually using Opera. This should be it:

Edit: Sorry for the double post, and I have no idea where the file went. Kal-el, if you send me your email at robert.olesen@get2net.dk then I'll send you the file.

The Mod is really coming together now, but there are still a few more things on the list that need to be crossed off before it can be called complete. Some of these things are being taken care of by members of the team, others need direct input from you the user.

----------------------------------------
Things being worked on now:
----------------------------------------
-Nightstorm is working on the buildings
-GIDustin is working on the civilopedia entries
-JimmyH is putting together some unit animations
-We are still waiting on a few other animators to finish projects they previewed months ago

-----------------------------------------------
Things that need to be worked on:
-----------------------------------------------
1) Improvement and Unit Costs – are they too low? How much more should they be? See poll.
2) Tech Costs – same Question. See poll.
3) The map nees to be updated
4) The new civs need to be discussed and put together
-Spanish
-Scandinavians
-Celts
-Incans
-Mayans
-Carthaginians
-Nubians
-Koreans
-Mongols
-Ottomans

------------------------------------------------------------
Things that I would like to see done eventually
------------------------------------------------------------
Reorder the Buildings Alphabetically by Type (Improvement, Wonder, Small Wonder)
Reorder the Units Alphabetically by type (Special, Offensive, defensive, air, naval)

Originally posted by Kal-el
----------------------------------------
Things being worked on now:
----------------------------------------
-Nightstorm is working on the buildings

Pretty much finished, just need to finish the buildings-small.pcx and buildings-large.pcx files so that the buildings show up in the building queue.

4) The new civs need to be discussed and put together
-Spanish
-Vikings
-Celts
-Incans
-Mayans
-Carthaginians
-Nubians
-Koreans
-Mongols
-Ottomans

My vote, add all of them :cool: . Well, add in the ones that were deleted from Civ2. :D

------------------------------------------------------------
Things that I would like to see done eventually
------------------------------------------------------------
Reorder the Buildings Alphabetically by Type (Improvement, Wonder, Small Wonder)
Reorder the Units Alphabetically by type (Special, Offensive, defensive, air, naval)

I could possible do this, however it would take awhile. Whomever does this will probably have to create a completely new .bic file, as this would probably be the easiest route.

This is getting absurd :crazyeye:

One last try.

OK, do y'all know why people from Århus in Denmark have vipers on the inside of the windscreen?

Oh sh.. I just realized this joke is auditive, not textual. Anyway, just imagine the effects of the spluttering sound they make when driving :lol:

Sorry Isak :( , but I had to do something to offset this waste of space.

Something else I would like to see is modifications to the build queue along the lines of Il Mafioso's Civ Usability Pack (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8079)
This would require editing of the units_32 file and the buildings_large file

Edit: Fixed some missing foot soldier flags on units
Edit: Fixed some missing rotate to attack flags on units
Edit: Fixed some missing ranged attack animations on units
Edit: Removed must be near water flag from port and shipyard
Edit: Tribe now treats all terrain as roads.

Still to come in v.0.4
Change tech costs
Change Building and Wonder Costs

Originally posted by Kal-el
Something else I would like to see is modifications to the build queue along the lines of Il Mafioso's Civ Usability Pack (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8079)
This would require editing of the units_32 file and the buildings_large file

Geesh! One project finished, have to start another one. That one is only 1/2 done and he gives me another to do!!! :D

Email me a list of the stats to include for each and I'll get on it while I'm finishing the buildings_small.pcx file.

Originally posted by Kal-el
Something else I would like to see is modifications to the build queue along the lines of Il Mafioso's Civ Usability Pack (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8079)
This would require editing of the units_32 file and the buildings_large file

I personally prefer Silvagems Helpful Build List: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=18376

I just sent the version of the civilopedia that I am working on to Isak. It only has buildings/wonders in it and they may be named wrong (I have never seen the bic), so some may not appear.

Also, I installed Il Mafioso's wonder splashes with the info box because I think it is very helpful, and I succesfully added that box to all the wonders in my mod, so if the idea surfaces, I can add those boxes to any wonders we may add. I already have Il Mafioso's permission.

I have leaderhead animations (some are still animations) for many leaders on my web site including Carlos of Aragon from Spain, hannibal, and ghenghis khan which are civs that were on the list above.

Earlier, I posted names of the buildings and wonders that still need civilopedia entries ( I am a programmer, not a historian ) and I cannot add those to the pedia until i get the entries.

I plan on doing the units next, and resources when i get a list of the ones added.

GIDustin

Nightstorm,

I think Isac is putting together some excel files similar to those crated by Nerowould. These will be helpful to you I am sure.

thanks, for taking on yet another task. :D

Originally posted by RobO
I personally prefer Silvagems Helpful Build List: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showt...&threadid=18376
Any of those types of modifications would be great. Silvagem based his work off of both Il Mafioso's and Nemo's work.
Originally posted by Silvagem
HELPFUL BUILD LIST - GRAPHICS PACK
For Buildings I included the following info given by each Building or Wonder:
1. Culture Points generated (original ones, before the Millennium doubling)
Color used: Blue
2. Maintenance cost
Color used: Golden
3. Pollution Points generated
Color used: Red
4. Happy Faces generated (just for that city)
Color used: Green

For Units I included the following info:
1. Number of possible upgrades
Color used: Green
2. Number of "carryable" units
Color used: Blue


CREDITS:
This Graphics’ Pack is heavily based on the works done by Il Mafioso with the "Civ 3 Usability Pack" and Nemo with "Nemo's Graphic Build Queue". I just tried to improve on their efforts and make things a bit tidier.

So, *most* of the credits should go to them, for having the splendid idea of doing these two original graphics packs and sharing their efforts with the world, which I've been using.

You can find their original work in these threads:
Il Mafioso ("Civ 3 Usability Pack"):
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8079

Nemo ("Nemo's Graphic Build Queue"):
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9675


I hope to make your Civ 3 experience even better! :)

Originally posted by Il Mafioso
Try this modpack! I guarantee you you (money back on a free modpack... hummmm) you will find Civ so much more enjoyable. This doesn't alter rules or anything like that... all the great things described below are achieved thru modifications of 2 graphic files....

Here's an excerpt from the documentation, you'll need to look at the attached image to follow the description. When you download the zip (which I'll post next) you'll get the full documentation, including the easy to follow installation instructions.

Hope you'll like it!

###POINT A: How do I pick which unit to build based also on upgradeability?

Look at figure 2, specifically at the Longbowman, the Musketman and the Caravel. Notice that the Longbowman has a ZERO next to it? Guess what.. zero upgrade steps from Longbowan. For Musketman it's 3... Rifleman, Infantry, Mechanized Infantry. For the Caravel it's 2... galleon then transport.

POINT B: How do I know how much maintenance gold improvements require?

Look again at Figure 2, specifically the Palace and the barracks. Notice the brown (dark gold in my eyes <grin>) lines in the upper right hand corner of each one's icon? Count them! Two lines for Palace, one for Barracks (also one for Granary below) the lines correspond to the maintenance cost in gold. If you look at the palace, you may also notice a vertical blue line in the upper left hand corner... but don't get ahead of me here... that's point D!

Point C: How do I know which units carry other units, and how many they carry?

Look at the Caravel in Figure 2, notice that under the "2" that indicates 2 more upgrades there are 3 little lines? Guess how many units a caravel can carry. Now look at the catapult... count the little lines... right, ZERO, what did you expect?

Point D: How do I know how much culture an improvement or wonder generates?

Remember that lone blue line in the upper left hand corner of the Palace? Look at the Sistine chapel in Figure 1.... 6 blue lines... mmmm copernicus has 4 blue lines.... mmmm ring a bell?

Point E: How do I know if a wonder I may think of building expires?

Look at figure 1. Specifically, the Lighthouse... notice the 2 blue lines? Well you already know what those mean, right? Ok look to the right? See that RED "O"? Let's see... OOOOO...bsolete! That tells you a wonder may eventually become obsolete due to a discovery.

:jump:

Hiya ive got the three main files of 1st page of this thread but as ive red through it uve made loads ov changes an added xtra files. could you re issue them again on one massage asawell as diections how to deal with the new files. Keep up the good work guys from waht ive read this mods gona rock!

Go to the DyP website (check Kal-els signature for link)

Originally posted by GIDustin
Go to the DyP website (check Kal-els signature for link)

Or check my signature for the link! :D

Originally posted by GIDustin
Also, I installed Il Mafioso's wonder splashes with the info box because I think it is very helpful, and I succesfully added that box to all the wonders in my mod, so if the idea surfaces, I can add those boxes to any wonders we may add. I already have Il Mafioso's permission.

Personally, I love this look. I think we should go with this look for all the wonder splashes. Anyone else?

Originally posted by RobO
I personally prefer Silvagems Helpful Build List: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showt...&threadid=18376

After looking at both versions, I tend to agree. Since Kal-el said either of these types of additions would work and since we have permission, I'm gonna go with this one. :D

[dance] Kal-El's Double Your Pleasure Mod version 0.3 Beta OUT NOW! [dance]


Get it at The Double Your Pleasure Website (http://civ3.bernskov.com)

It is available as a 1 (that's One) file download or a 10*1.4mb download. All in .rar format.

To open .rar archives, use WinRar (http://www.rarlab.com/) or WinAce (http://www.winace.com/)

Have fun :D

//Release Manager Signing Out//

Originally posted by GIDustin
Also, I installed Il Mafioso's wonder splashes with the info box because I think it is very helpful, and I succesfully added that box to all the wonders in my mod, so if the idea surfaces, I can add those boxes to any wonders we may add. I already have Il Mafioso's permission.


This is definitley something I would like to see. I completely forgot about it but this should be on the to do list. I have the overlay as well so whoever decides that this is something they would like to do, just give a hollar and I will send it over.

what do i open the .rar file with? right now it's one of those unrecognized files, and i have no clue what to do with it. this mod looks great and i would really appreciate some help
thanks

Originally posted by
what do i open the .rar file with? right now it's one of those unrecognized files, and i have no clue what to do with it. this mod looks great and i would really appreciate some help
thanks

WinZip should recognize and open it. Try to open it from within WinZip. Download it from the WinZip Website (http://www.winzip.com) if you don't already have it...it is free.

If that doesn't work you can use WinAce. You can get it at downloads.com (http://download.com.com/3000-2250-7878388.html?tag=lst-0-1)

Has anyone else taken a look at Snoopy's new city graphics? I know many of us use his terrain ones, the new cities are sweet. Maybe we could get Snoop's permission to use them in the mod as well.

Last time I checked, snoopy only had two of the 5 done, but it looks like he is finished now.

I just d-loaded them, and they look sweet. :goodjob: I am definately using these in combo with his Extra green terrain.

GIDustin

Small problem here.

Coffee beans are showing up instead of game, rolls of silk instead of fish and so on. It looks very interesting but not, I think, quite what you had in mind.
How do I fix this? Just go into CivEdit and change the pictures for the resource?

Originally posted by cricket
Small problem here.

Coffee beans are showing up instead of game, rolls of silk instead of fish and so on. It looks very interesting but not, I think, quite what you had in mind.
How do I fix this? Just go into CivEdit and change the pictures for the resource?

Most likely cause would be if .bix file has the wrong icon number assigned to each resource.

UPDATE: I just checked this in the v0.3 .bic file and that isn't the problem. Are you using the correct version?

I am not sure, should I be using the bic file DyPv3 as a mod or should I use it to replace the "Civ3mod":confused:

You should be able to play it as a scenario, but the install overwrites a lot of the basic files so you should really replace the basic civ3mod.bic file.

Is it just me or is ther way too much food now? It looks like I may have to rework the terrain yet again.

Food: Well, I'm not surprised there's to much food at start if you really did lift the production restriction from Despotism. I'll check it out when I get the download done. I think that may have to be changed back.

Install: Next time, can I have zip file(s), please? I'm hoping that Winzip can handle it, but even so it doesn't provide me with the handling options that a zip file does. So I will be converting it to a zip file anyway. I bought winzip a good while ago (been using it every day for quite a while) and have no intention of buying WinAce as well.

Edit: Winzip 8.1 cannot open the file (assuming I got it down OK - I'm pretty sure it did, but my PC had some hiccups towards the end of the download). So, I'll download a 30 day trial of WinAce, install it, uncompress the DyP file and uninstall WinAce again. Hey guys, it's supposed to be easy to get this mod to work :(

Btw bernskov - Getright didn't recognize the download so I had to give it the url manually. I'm using Opera, that's probably part of the reason - but I have found that downloads work in some places and not in others. For example, this forum (and Apolyton) are really :mad: in this respect. It has probably got something to do with the way you coded the download. Just thought you might want to know.

RobO:

Look's like you made a bad investment - in fact WinZip can't handle very much, and what it does handle, it doesn't handle very well :p
Sorry but WinZip is not very high on my personal list of favourite software, and I'm definitely not going to buy a license for it. I tried to use the Demo version to create a multiple disk set, but it wouldn't allow me to do so unless I actually inserted floppy disks and created the files on floppys :eek: What kind of stupid interface is that? That's why I decided to stay with my favourite compression utility: WinRar - it simply can't be beat.

But, ok I'll check out a couple of shareware zip-handlers later today and maybe replace the .rar's with zip's - in the mean time why don't y'all check out www.download.com - if you search for "zip" and "rar" you'll find plenty of Freeware utilities that handle most archive types

[Inside note] Bernskov: Good thing we didn't decide to use ARJ, huh?[/Inside Note]

Look's like you made a bad investment - in fact WinZip can't handle very much, and what it does handle, it doesn't handle very well :p

This may be true, but I have been quite satisfied with it and it has a nice UI. I'll check out the freeware stuff. Anyway, that's off topic.

OK, I had my rant :D - and thank you for being patient with me.
Here's a more balanced version: The web page and coherent download is a great help. It would however be even better of the download was (also) in zip format.

I played just a little bit and had no obvious food imbalances. I'm pretty sure it will surface eventually, though. I also wonder if Despotism doesn't become too powerful without the food restriction.

I noticed a few things:

The barbarian colour has changed! All of them has, in fact. Is my install screwed up?

The hurry penalty is 40 in both cases. Shouldn't it be 20?

Entertainers still provide 2 happy people. Should it be 1?

Iron comes with Bronze Working. Shouldn't this be Iron Working? The change log says Mining.

Pearls are available at start. The change log says it should be Boat Building.

Fish are available with Farming. The change log says Pottery. None of them make a lot of sense to me. How about Boat Building?

Tundra can have Seal. I hope we don't get too many landlocked seals :)

RobO:

Ok, sorry about putting WinZip down. Of course I understand that WinZip is the proggie most people are familiar with, and in my quest to be a good Release Manager, I will figure something out and upload a zip file set as well (if Bernskov allows it ;) ) Hopefully, good ol'e Dos-based PKZip will be able to do the trick.

In the meantime, check out UltimateZip (available at Download.com) - I've only looked at it for a few hours, but I'm already impressed. Two words sum up the how good it is : German Engineering :goodjob: - and it's freeware too!

About food, I haven't seen any real imbalances yet, but I'v also only managed to play until around 700 BC, so I don't know what happens when I get Irrigation (farming).

Originally posted by RobO
Tundra can have Seal. I hope we don't get too many landlocked seals LOL - Maybe we should be able to build a Greenpeace or World Wildlife Foundation wonder to take care of that problem ;)

Just added a split up Zip fileset to the downloads at our website -
Check out the Install Guide (http://civ3.bernskov.com/installguide.asp)

Hope this helps all you WinZip addicts :cool:

Originally posted by Isak
Just added a split up Zip fileset to the downloads at our website -
Check out the Install Guide (http://civ3.bernskov.com/installguide.asp)

Hope this helps all you WinZip addicts :cool:

How about a 1 complete file .zip download for all us WinZip addicts with cable! :lol:

Heh, heh :D

Way ahead of you Nightstorm.... It's already there ;)

:D

Originally posted by RobO
I played just a little bit and had no obvious food imbalances. I'm pretty sure it will surface eventually, though. I also wonder if Despotism doesn't become too powerful without the food restriction.

[Quote]I played just a little bit and had no obvious food imbalances. I'm pretty sure it will surface eventually, though. I also wonder if Despotism doesn't become too powerful without the food restriction.
Maybe imbalanced is too strong of a word, but there is way more food out there now and that's not really what I was aiming for. My solution to this would be to Change as Follows:
Plains: was 2/2/1 now 2/1/0 worked 1/1/1
Grass: was 3/0/1 now 2/0/1 worked 2/0/1
Coast: was 3/0/1 now 2/0/2
Sea : was 2/1/1 now 1/1/1

I think that should fix things. So froma food standpoint its still better to build on grassland because you will eventually be able to Farm it.

I noticed a few things:
Of course you did. ;)

The barbarian colour has changed! All of them has, in fact. Is my install screwed up? Nope, I changed the colors around, I was aiming at more traditional colors. Actually I should probably switch the French (dark blue) and the Americans (white). I have the French using the blue because that was the color of the Republican Army under Napolean, but I suppose the White of the Kings would be more appropriate.

The hurry penalty is 40 in both cases. Shouldn't it be 20? Didn't touch it.

Entertainers still provide 2 happy people. Should it be 1? I said I was going to change it and I forgot. Should be 1. Sorry.

Iron comes with Bronze Working. Shouldn't this be Iron Working? The change log says Mining. Should be Mining with the rest of the base metals.

Pearls are available at start. The change log says it should be Boat Building. Typo in the Changelog.

Fish are available with Farming. The change log says Pottery. None of them make a lot of sense to me. How about Boat Building? Its Farming because you can build your first boats with Farming.

Tundra can have Seal. I hope we don't get too many landlocked seals :) Poor little guys.:cry:

That's it for now.

Hello, I wonder if any of u can help. I just downloaded v0.3 and installed it as per instructed, but when i go to play it the 'new game' button dosent do anything and i tried to start it as a scenario but a msg box came up saying
"Invalid scenario version
version 3.08 is no longer
compatable"
I am using the new patch 1.21f. Thanx

hey Kal-El,
I started working on the naval mine unit that you wanted
(see link in signature)

The Hurry penalty was changed back to 20/20 in 1.21f
I suppose the mod is still based on 1.17f, so there could be more changes in 1.21 that have to be edited in manually. I'll look it up if I get the chance, but can't make any promises right now.

I suppose copper is required by other units than spearmen and/or some buildings and that's why it doesn't come with bronze working. Same with Iron.

Why not make pearls appear with farming then? After all, you do need boats to harvest them.

Originally posted by Richard IV
when i go to play it the 'new game' button dosent do anything I've only seen this happen when there is no Civ3mod.bic file in the \Civilization III\ folder - are you sure you extracted to the right path ?

If all else fails, try uninstalling Civ3 (remember to back up any files you want to keep), reinstall Civ3, then apply patch 1.21 and install the DyP mod again.

If that fails .... I guess I won't be sleeping tonight after all... :cry:

Originally posted by Kal-el
You should be able to play it as a scenario, but the install overwrites a lot of the basic files so you should really replace the basic civ3mod.bic file.
:goodjob: did the replace and it works fine now.
Thank you!

Originally posted by RobO
The Hurry penalty was changed back to 20/20 in 1.21f
I suppose the mod is still based on 1.17f, so there could be more changes in 1.21 that have to be edited in manually.
Yeah it is, and I didn't even think to go through and check for discrepancies. Duh!

I suppose copper is required by other units than spearmen and/or some buildings and that's why it doesn't come with bronze working. Same with Iron.
Actually right now Copper is not required for Spearmen but it is required for Triremes (for the ram), Caravels, Galleons and Brigs (for their cannons). I made the metals available with mining so that you could see ahead of time where you would like to build your cities to get at that precious ore.

Why not make pearls appear with farming then? After all, you do need boats to harvest them.
This was my initial thinking, but I was talked out of it. Of course I could be talked back into it. :D

-------------------------------------------
Pesoloco,

Saw it, Love it!

Civilopedia entries may need to be checked. Some of them are EXTREMELY long, and the game does not seem to be putting a scroll bar in the description part, thereby causing a portion of the description to not be visible (extends below the bottom of the civilopedia box.)

I've only seen this happen when there is no Civ3mod.bic file in the \Civilization III\ folder - are you sure you extracted to the right path ?

The civ3mod.bic is in the right place... so i will now try uninstalling.

And finally (drumroll please)...after a long wait, the buildings-large.pcx and buildings-small.pcx files have been completed. They have been posted to the web site with the other file downloads. Also in this file are all of the buildings for DYP.

Extract buildings-large.pcx and buildings-small.pcx files to C:\Program Files\Infogrames Interactive\Civilization III\Art\City Screen\

Extract all the rest of the files to C:\Program Files\Infogrames Interactive\Civilization III\Art\Civilopedia\Icons\buildings\

Isak, I tried to email it to you buy your ISP wouldn't accept it. Can you get it off the web site and break it up for the non-broadband, modem bound people. :)

Enjoy Everyone! :D

[NOTE] Remember, this is only the first version of the buildings. The stats will be added to the buildings and units in a subsequent version, prior to the final release.

Great Job Nightstorm!!

Thanks a million.

So you say some of the entries are long? ;)

There may have been a few that I got carried away with. :D But certain topics I felt merrited longer discussions. e.g. slavery, emancipation, civil rights. I think the SpecOps one is probably too long too. I haven't actually downloaded the mod from the site yet so I haven't seen the pedia entries. I am sure there are more than the ones I just mentioned. :sheep: :) = sheepish grin :D

I could use some more input on the improvement and tech costs.

Regarding the improvement costs:
I put a poll on the main creation forum, go here to vote (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21113)

Here are the options:
A: x1.25, x1.5, x2
B: x1.5 , x2 , x2.5
C: x1.25, x1.75, x2.25
D: Other

Science Costs will probably also be raised at the same rate as the building costs, unless people feel other wise. Go here to vote (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21114)

Here are the options:
A: Fine as is
B: Same as Buildings
C: Other

right now I only have 2 votes in the buildings poll and 3 in the science poll

B is leading the way in both

Relax, Kal-el :sleep:

We need to get a chance to play the thing before we can vote :)

ok, sorry :blush:

I just thought people might have an opinion based on previous versions of the mod.

I will try to be patient :crazyeye: Its just that I am trying to get the finished version out as soon as I can. I don't mean to rush you guys.

Somebody stop me from thinking about this mod!!! Please!!!

Kal-el,

Ever think about re-doing the music. Just need to find someone who has figured out how the music files are broken up. I have several classical mp3's that would fit beautifully with this mod.

If playability and enjoyment are related to length of thread this mod should kick ass. You know its too bad I have an exam in 30 minutes...grad school is really impinging on my gameplay. Anyway, we download your mod and appreciate the time you spend on them.

cheers

Kal-el,

Some Questions on DyP3,

I might be missing the bigger picture, but it seems like the required resources (Strategic Resources) are a little inconsistent.

* Riflemen need nothing but musketeer needs both saltpeter and iron.
* Some tanks need 2 resources others none.
* Ancient era ships need flax that only becomes available with crop rotation.

Was just wondering if this was by design?

Originally posted by Victorvanwavere
Kal-el,

Some Questions on DyP3,

I might be missing the bigger picture, but it seems like the required resources (Strategic Resources) are a little inconsistent.

* Riflemen need nothing but musketeer needs both saltpeter and iron.
* Some tanks need 2 resources others none.
* Ancient era ships need flax that only becomes available with crop rotation.

Was just wondering if this was by design?

Good point on the flax, that was a last minute adjustment, and was not initially going to be required for the early ships. Now I remember why. :)

The Riflemen don't require the same resources as the musketmen and arquebusiers because by that time in the game the resources are supposedly more plentiful. This is Firaxian logic and I am goin g along with it. This is the same reason that later ships do not require timber. It's not that the frigate is made out of some new polymer, but that the lumber industry has advanced to a stage where the resource has become less "strategic"

I will have to look at the tanks, which ones are you talkig about inparticular?

I have played a bit and found so far that food seems perhaps a bit abundant (except when you can't access any resources), research costs are too low and production costs seem OK. I had too much money, though. One reason is that I cannot set research higher than 60%, another is that the amount of commerce has been increased.

The following tables show the F/S/C provided by resources and terrain. I have also listed the appearance and disapperance numbers for resources and the F/S/C values for terrain from 1.21f

Btw, timber is missing from the resource list in readme v0.3

.................F S C App Dis
Strategic:
Horses.........- 0 0 1 160 0
Iron...........- 0 2 0 160 800
Saltpeter......- 0 0 2 120 800
Coal...........- 0 3 1 120 400
Oil............- 0 2 2 120 200
Rubber.........- 0 1 2 120 0
Aluminum.......- 0 2 1 120 400
Uranium........- 0 3 3 100 100
Timber.........- 0 1 1 the rest are 0 0
Flax...........- 1 1 1
Copper.........- 0 1 1
Marble.........- 0 1 1
Stone..........- 0 1 0
Elephants......- 2 0 2
Luxury:
Furs...........- 1 1 1
Gems...........- 0 1 4
Silks..........- 0 0 3
Spices.........- 1 0 2
Tobacco........- 0 0 3
Wine...........- 1 0 2
Coffee.........- 1 1 2
Incense........- 0 0 2
Bonus:
Game...........- 1 1 0 App and Dis cannot be set for bonus res.
Seal...........- 1 0 1
Cattle.........- 2 1 0
Sheep..........- 1 1 1
Wheat..........- 3 0 0
Corn...........- 3 0 0
Fruit..........- 2 0 0
Tropical Fruit.- 2 0 1
Fish...........- 2 0 1
Whales.........- 1 1 2
Pearls.........- 1 0 3
Oasis..........- 3 0 0
Silver.........- 0 1 3
Gold...........- 0 0 4

.............. F S C - Workd..21: F S C . Workd
Desert.......- 0 1 1 - 1 1 1......0 1 0 - 1 1 1
Plains.......- 2 1 0 - 1 1 1......1 1 0 - 1 1 1
Grassland....- 2 0 1 - 2 0 1......2 0 0 - 1 1 1
Tundra.......- 0 0 0 - 0 2 1......1 0 0 - 0 1 1
Flood Plain..- 4 0 0 - 2 0 1......3 0 0 - 1 0 1
Hills........- 1 2 1 - 1 2 1......1 1 0 - 0 2 1
Mountains....- 0 3 1 - 0 2 1......0 1 0 - 0 2 1
Forest.......- 1 1 1 - 0 1 1......1 2 0 - 0 0 1
Jungle.......- 2 1 0 - 0 2 1......1 0 0 - 0 0 1
Coast........- 2 0 2 - 0 0 0......1 0 2 - 0 0 0
Sea..........- 1 1 1 - 0 0 0......1 0 1 - 0 0 0
Ocean........- 0 0 0 - 0 0 0......0 0 0 - 0 0 0

This leads me to the following conclusions:

The appearence value should be set for all strategic resources. I did find them somewhat rare, and this should solve it. The editor help is somewhat obscure: It states that a value of 160 provides 2 resources per player in an 8 player game. I would go with 160 for all of them, as I gather they aren't supposed to be rare. The use of the disappearance value is a matter of preference. Set it to 0 if you want them to stay where they are (they don't disapper, they relocate).

I think there are too many resources that produce food. I think that Flax, Spices, Coffee and Pearls should be reduced to 0 food, while Elephants, Fruit and Tropical Fruit should be reduced to 1. Horses should on the other hand go up to 1 food, they are just as edible as elephants :D .

Copper is 0/1/1 while Iron is 0/2/0. Why the difference? There are more of these comparisons, but that may be nitpicking. Along similar lines, why do Gems provide one shield? Also, silver provides a shield but gold does not.

More importantly, the commerce values of terrain has been increased a lot and should be reduced again. This will also reduce the tech discovery rate and may offset some of the planned tech cost increase. At the very least Desert and Mountains should have 0 Commerce and preferably Hills as well. Grassland and Forests would probably be unbalanced without the commerce value. Forests could however be compensated by giving them 2 shields when mined.

The rest of the extra income would hopefully be consumed by extra upkeep - though probably not. These suggestions ought to help, though.

OK, here's a constructive minimal suggestion. My suggested values are listed to the right:

................ F S C -> F S C
Horses.........- 0 0 1 -> 1 0 1
Flax...........- 1 1 1 -> 0 1 1
Elephants......- 2 0 2 -> 1 0 2
Spices.........- 1 0 2 -> 0 0 2
Coffee.........- 1 1 2 -> 0 1 2
Tropical Fruit.- 2 0 1 -> 1 0 1
Pearls.........- 1 0 3 -> 0 0 3

................ F S C - Workd -> F S C - Workd
Desert.........- 0 1 1 - 1 1 1 -> 0 1 0 - 0 1 1 Why allow irrigation?
Hills..........- 1 2 1 - 1 2 1 -> 1 2 0 - 1 2 1
Mountains......- 0 3 1 - 0 2 1 -> 0 3 0 - 0 2 1
Forest.........- 1 1 1 - 0 1 1 -> 1 1 0 - 0 2 1
Jungle.........- 2 1 0 - 0 2 1 -> Not sure - it's actually better than Forest

I played a game last night and redid the resources, yet again.

I have adjusted the appearnace ratios and lowerd the commerce value for many of the terrains and the food value from grasslands and coasts.

here is a basic list of changes
Edit: Changed Plains to produce 2/1/0 (was 2/2/1) 1/1/1 with improvement
Edit: Changed Grassland to produce 2/0/1 (was 3/0/1) 2/0/1 with improvement
Edit: Changed Coast to produce 2/0/2 (was 3/0/1)
Edit: Entertainers only make one citizen happy (was 2 people)
Edit: Iron now becomes available with mining (as it was supposed to have been in v.0.3)
Edit: Pearls now available with Farming
Edit: Fixed Appearance/Disappearance rate for Resources
Edit: Fixed some issues with Units and Required Resources
Edit: Fixed some upgrade issues

you can get the 0.3.1 patch on the website

RobO,

these changes were done before I looked at you post, so check these out and then we'll discuss if there needs to be further changes. I would really like to get this part done and out of the way.

There's not much left to do for the mod. So once we get these little details out of the way, all that will be left is getting the civilopedia finished.

Originally posted by Kal-el
There's not much left to do for the mod. So once we get these little details out of the way, all that will be left is getting the civilopedia finished.

Don't you mean shortened!! :lol: :D :cool: :rolleyes:

RobO,

I think you have a good point about reducing the output of the tiles, but I think you are mistaken about the bonus resources.

If the tiles are reduced then you definitely need the food bonuses or else your cities will starve. Try it. Without farming you need the food bonuses. So rather than less we may need more, probably not though.

I wish the AI was smarter about choosing where to build its cities. If it were this would be an easy thing to fix.

Nightstorm,

None of that lip from you. get back to work :cringe::whipped:

Originally posted by Kal-el
Nightstorm,

None of that lip from you. get back to work :cringe::whipped:

I'm on vacation for a few days!! :p

I haven't gotten to play the mod since v0.1, so I figure I've earned it!! :crazyeye:

you have in deed :goodjob:

Shouldn't you be studying?! :eek: :confused: :D

finishing up a project at work ;)

last day here, so trying not to leave any loose ends for the next law clerk to deal with.

I still can not built ports in citys built on the second island. I can build one on my home island but not on any others.

Needless to say this really affects my trade

:cry:

I have tried both building and not building harbors and I checked to see that coastal installation was checked and build near water is not. Same with shipyards. I simply cannot build on the second island.

I am using the V3.1 patch.

Originally posted by cricket
I still can not built ports in citys built on the second island. I can build one on my home island but not on any others.

Needless to say this really affects my trade

:cry:

I have tried both building and not building harbors and I checked to see that coastal installation was checked and build near water is not. Same with shipyards. I simply cannot build on the second island.

I am using the V3.1 patch.

I will have to look into this. I plan on devoting a few hours tomorrow to playing around with the mod. I'll have to see if I can duplicate this.

Are you using the newest firaxis game patch (1.21f) that is out there or are you using 1.17?

i had similar problems on my mod. The problem was that it considered every spot of water as fresh water, and not coastal. This is a really weird bug. Check the square(s) of water you are near and see if it is fresh or salt

GIDustin

Buildings
I downloaded the buildings zip file from the web site and installed them as directed by Nightstorm.

Firstly, I seem to have a Civilopedia/Buildings directory in my installation. It has a lot of _small.pcx and _large.pcx files. This directory is not mentioned by Nightstorm - is it supposed to be there and what is it supposed to contain?

Secondly, I have some problems with the city screen. The queue seems OK - I think - it could probably do with a quality check - but the city screen itself does not always show the right pic of what I'm building. The Obelisk pic is blank. There's more but I don't remember it right now. Sorry for notbeing more specific, but a check is definitely needed.

luxury resources
These show up in the city screen on a dark background (dark blue I think). luxuryicons_small.pcx seems OK to me - does anybody else notice this?

Kal-el,

I looked at your updated bic file and will check it out, probably later today. I like the fact that we were very close on the terrain values. The (dis)apperance values for the resources will be interesting to try out as well. I still think that living off coffee, spices, pearls and flax is somewhat odd, but I'll try it out - hopefully without getting a stomach ache :) And I also still think that horses should be edible.

Please note that these modifications change the premise for your vote. Is there a way to pick up the current results and reset the vote to be based on 0.31? Commerce will decrease, resulting in a slower tech discovery. And strategic resources will be more abundant, which in particular increases the number of shields.

I made a resource file with :) on luxuries. It's compatible with the one Kal-el released with 0.31.

This time I put the file at C: - no blanks in the pathname. And it worked :goodjob:

Originally posted by RobO
Buildings
I downloaded the buildings zip file from the web site and installed them as directed by Nightstorm.

Firstly, I seem to have a Civilopedia/Buildings directory in my installation. It has a lot of _small.pcx and _large.pcx files. This directory is not mentioned by Nightstorm - is it supposed to be there and what is it supposed to contain?

All of the building files that I did are supposed to be in the Civilization III\Art\Civilopedia\Icons\buildings directory.

Secondly, I have some problems with the city screen. The queue seems OK - I think - it could probably do with a quality check - but the city screen itself does not always show the right pic of what I'm building. The Obelisk pic is blank. There's more but I don't remember it right now. Sorry for notbeing more specific, but a check is definitely needed.

:lol: I know. Those are the files I've been working on this version. They are now finished and will be available for the next version. So, no real problem here. :P

All of the building files that I did are supposed to be in the Civilization III\Art\Civilopedia\Icons\buildings directory.

I know, and they are, but do you know what the Civiliopedir\buildings directory should contain? I wonder if I have made it by mistake somehow and can delete it.

Originally posted by NightStorm


I will have to look into this. I plan on devoting a few hours tomorrow to playing around with the mod. I'll have to see if I can duplicate this.

Are you using the newest firaxis game patch (1.21f) that is out there or are you using 1.17?

I am using the new patch. I can build more then one port on the first piece of land I am on but not on the second.

I am playing a tiny world island map if that helps.

Thanks,
Cricket

Originally posted by RobO
All of the building files that I did are supposed to be in the Civilization III\Art\Civilopedia\Icons\buildings directory.

I know, and they are, but do you know what the Civiliopedir\buildings directory should contain? I wonder if I have made it by mistake somehow and can delete it.

That is from one of the original "Kal-el" version .zip files and not an "Isak" version. Doesn't belong there and can be deleted. ;)

WOW! I just spent the last three hours playing v0.3.1, and let me tell you, FOOD UNDER DESPOTISM SUCKS!!! :mad: :cry:

I spent three hours after getting a bad starting spot (but deciding to try to make it work) trying to get my city past 2. Didn't work. I even tried conquering other cities so I could do something but all my archers and warrior died!!!

Think that maybe the starting spot could be work 1 more food so that you can get beyond size 2 and be able to start another city?? Ideas?? (or am I missing something :confused: )

Hi Nightstorm,

Been there, done that :D

You basically need either a bonus food resource or access to flood plains to get going. If you start out badly, you can either restart, use your worker to get a settler going, hope to get a Tribe from a hut or walk your starting Tribe around a bit (he does have road bonus).

So, Farming and Domestication becomes quite important techs early on.

Hello boys and girls

I've just released a new update, v.0.3.2 at the Double Your Pleasure site (http://civ3.bernskov.com)

If you've already downloaded Nightstorm's buildings.zip and Kal-El's (unsolicited ;) ) update v.0.3.1, you won't be getting much with this - basically it just gathers those two files and adds an updated pediaicons.txt and a couple of fixed icons. - Oh, and I removed the original Firaxis Improvements from the buildings.zip as well, as I gather that most of you already have those (if you bought Civ3, you should have :D )

If you wan't to play DyP the 'real' way, you should reinstall Civ3, install DyP v.0.3 and then apply update v.0.3.2. Try it - it's a way of life......

:scan: Anyone: Please send me a savegame with the harbor bug - I'm totally unable to reproduce this, so I haven't got a clue what the problem could be......:scan:

Originally posted by Isak
Hello boys and girls

I've just released a new update, v.0.3.2 at the Double Your Pleasure site (http://civ3.bernskov.com)

Oh, and I removed the original Firaxis Improvements from the buildings.zip as well, as I gather that most of you already have those (if you bought Civ3, you should have :D )

Did you look carefully at the stock buildings before you deleted them? I redid some of the Firaxis buildings, such as solar plant, nuke plant and several others.

I think so, but to be honest I only checked the timestamps - all those with new dates, were kept - all those that had the original dates were discarded.

Can you check it yourself to see if I've missed any or picked the wrong ones?
These are the ones I kept your versions of
- Great Cathedral (J.S Bach)
- Nukeplant (Only the large image was updated though)
- Sistine Chapel
- Solar Plant
- TempleMea and TempleRom

There were duplicates of certain images like Performing Arts Center and Great Lighthouse - and I'm not sure if i've picked the ones you wanted to go in, so let me know and i'll correct it (but I refuse to patch an update though :p )

(and I thought you were on holiday.....:confused: )

Originally posted by Isak
(and I thought you were on holiday.....:confused: )

Kind of hard to be on holiday when you people won't leave me alone long enough to breath... :cringe: :whipped:

:p

:eek:
New Pediaicons.txt file is messed up.

Need to look at entries for the following:

Guttenberg bible
Human Genome Project
World News Network
National Health Care
National Monument
National Sports League
War Memorial
National Gallery

May be others, but these are the ones that are now messed up in the civilopedia (after the 3.2 patch)

I found one discrepancy in 0.3.2

The changelog says that plains should be 2/1/0 while the bic file has it as 2/1/1. I'm pretty sure that the bic file should be changed.

Also, I have found that I generate too much money (IMO) using these settings. Does this match your experiences?

The above plains change helps a little, but not enough. Desert also produces 1 commerce, which IMO should be reduced to 0. Other than that, there are two ways to deal with it:

1. Reduce income, primarily by reducing the commerce provided by the resources.

2. Increase expenditure. The most likely candidate is unit upkeep. Each unit could cost 2 (which might work but possibly requires that the increased commerce production of the terrain is reintroduced). Or the number of supported units under despotism could be reduced ( e.g. 3/3/3) - the same might have to apply to Monarchy.

Let me have some opinions, please. I prefer the increased unit cost if it can be made to work, as it would provide more play options (military campaigns will be more expensive) and provide more options to differentiate between governments.

I also looked a bit at governments and found that Democracy - as the only government - has high war weariness. I'm pretty sure that this should be changed to low.

New Pediaicons.txt file is messed up.

Grrrrrrrr......

It's because the BLDG_ codes in the Bic don't correspond to the ones in the Pediaicons.txt - I sent Kal-El an updated bic with the changed names, after I fixed the Civilopedia, but obviously he decided not to use it - the PRTO_Spy entry is also missing again....:mad:

Oh, never mind I will update the pediaicons.txt in a few hours, and deduct the cost from his wages :rolleyes:

Hi, guys. First wanted to say that I think the mod is superb, and has made Civ3 my first game of choice once more. Bear in mind that I'm not Civ-modding fluent, so my question may be unbelievably dumb.

After a clean install of Civ3, 1.21f patch, and DyP 0.3, the game runs fine, except that the new building pictures and descriptions are not visible in the city screen or the civlopedia. New unit pictures do seem to appear (at least, horse archer and crusader do), but I forgot to check descriptions in the civlopedia. Is there something damn obvious I'm doing wrong, or does the mod not include those functions? (I ask because I read a post about some of the descriptions being "too long", which didn't square with what I have.)

I'll try a fresh install and add the 0.32 patch to the mix, in case that fixes it. It's a fantastic mod in any case, but alt-tabbing out to check what things do is very inconvenient, and I can't help but think that I must have done something obvious wrong.

Be seeing you,

Saxman

Saxman:

You're not doing anything wrong, the descriptions for the civilopedia are not finished yet - I'm hard at work trying to get them finished within the next couple of days. Most of the Icons should show up after you install v.0.3.2, though (as noted above) a few still have some problems - but it is the intention that they should all be included in the 'Final' version of the mod (whenever that is released) - In the mean time, just keep on checking this thread, and the webpage, and eventually everything will be fixed.

Thanks for joining the crowd - hope you enjoy your stay ;)

[Edit: Didn't see your sig at first - just have to say it's nice to see a Zappa quote around here :goodjob: ]

hey guys good job on the mod.
is there any way you can change the resource icons ? make them more noticeable by putting a letter on top of the icon in which it stands for : iron = i .
the reason why i mention it because TIMBER resembles a small mountain, its hard to see sometimes.

Deleted - See Next Post

Originally posted by pjm
hey guys good job on the mod.
is there any way you can change the resource icons ? make them more noticeable by putting a letter on top of the icon in which it stands for : iron = i .
the reason why i mention it because TIMBER resembles a small mountain, its hard to see sometimes.

You can do anything you wish to the resources. For example, I change some of the actual icons (my replacements are highlighted for effect - see attached image [DON'T DO THIS IN THE ACTUAL FILE].) BTW Kal-el, don't start! I know you don't see alot of wine sitting on the ground or alot of bear skin rugs in the forest but I like the images! :D I especially like my marble image. *hint hint* :rolleyes:

All you need is a graphics program that can read .pcx files, such as Paint Shop Pro, which is what I used to create all the buildings. Open up the file Civilization\Art\resources.pcx. Everything is laid out very self-explanatory like in the file. Just remember, the background color MUST be the very last palette entry and the border color MUST be the next to the last. In other words, don't mess with or use the background or border colors. :D

Enjoy!

wow ! a really good job on the mod .
a suggestions on the mod . to many resources at once , im at 800 bc right know and i have everything at my disposal.
meaning :iron,copper,timber,sheep,stone,insense,horse,gold and mable. all in my little area . i think that needs to tweak so one civ doesnt get all those resources in one little area.

Originally posted by pjm
wow ! a really good job on the mod .
a suggestions on the mod . to many resources at once , im at 800 bc right know and i have everything at my disposal.
meaning :iron,copper,timber,sheep,stone,insense,horse,gold and mable. all in my little area . i think that needs to tweak so one civ doesnt get all those resources in one little area.

That is deliberate. The reasoning behind that is so that you can plan the placement of your cities better. Historically, cities were only built near resources, be it food, minerals, etc. Even though you can see the resources, you can't do anything with them until you learn certain techs (even if it does say "You have completed a road yada yada yada etc. etc. etc.")

In a normal game, you would build your city and then they would appear, so you would still have the same resources. Kal-el just opted to show them early so you can plan your kingdom better. Hope this explains it. If I'm wrong, I'm sure Kal-el will correct me. Of course, I may have to retaliate if he does. :whipped: :D

Am I the only one playing this mod? Or perhaps I'm the only one who thinks there's too much money available during the ancient age? After all, we do want people to have an incentive to buy marketplaces, banks etc. It would also be good if you couldn't just set your science rate at 60% at start and then ignore it until you changed government.

I did some experiments, and they are hereby freely available for Kal-el to use. I experimented with the number of supported units during despotism (same for all city sizes) and the support cost per unit.

Setting the number of supported units to 2 (it was 4) and the cost to 2 forces me to reduce the science rate at times, which is good. It might be problematic right at start, where 5 units (1 worker, 3 warrior/brave/scout/ranger, 1 settler) will cost 6 gold, which is just about what the capital wil produce. There seems to be a bug in 1.21 - when I reduced the science to 0 or 10% it threw it back up to 40% each turn :rolleyes: - but once you get a few cities going, you're basically OK. I'm not sure how this would work if you staged a war, though. It would certainly put a premium on occupying, not razing, cities, as they will save you a lot of money by supporting units. I also fear that the AI has trouble handling this.

3 supported units at a cost of 2 will solve the startup problem, but once you have a few cities you won't have any serious support costs.

Keeping the cost at 1 you might reduce the number of supported units to 1. 2 is comfortable, 1 is more of a challenge. I did not have to reduce my science rate from 60% in any of those cases, though.

Kal-el, you will have to decide which way to go (if any). Opinions are ofc. still welcome if anybody other than me really are playing this (what a shame to miss out on such a great mod :lol: )

Originally posted by pjm
hey guys good job on the mod.
is there any way you can change the resource icons ? make them more noticeable by putting a letter on top of the icon in which it stands for : iron = i .
the reason why i mention it because TIMBER resembles a small mountain, its hard to see sometimes.

Hi pjm.

I added some :) on the luxuries (should be on the previous page) but decided against adding info on the strategic resources. I don't need them, but I would have chosen a shield if I had done so. Feel free to do it yourself, though.

Btw, I actually think the "original" marble looks great on the map. I tried modifying the stone, but failed to make a better graphic.

Originally posted by RobO
Btw, I actually think the "original" marble looks great on the map. I tried modifying the stone, but failed to make a better graphic.

Looks good either way, personal preference I guess. Was showing edits to get point across. :D

I just played an entire game no crashes and the mod looks great. Good work guys. A few things that have probably been mentioned but I dont want to read 22 pages. I am making way too much money early on. Definately need to at least double all costs...production and science in the Industrial and Modern ages. Wondering why unit support costs for the democracies have been lowered to 1. I think you should allow fixed wing aircraft to destroy naval units and the helicopter gunship to destroy land units. Maybe make all treaded vehicles (tanks apcs and mech infantry) wheeled and unable to airlift so that they can only be transported by the air carrier and by sea. Also the AI seems to have difficulty using the penguin and mines. I dont know if this was just peculiar to my game or if others have noticed it. Anyway, excellent mod. One last thing, regarding the merchant, caravan and Freight...good idea but I think that they should not require any strategic resources too build. I am not sure but I believe that if for example you dont have any oil, you would not be able to build freight but would then have the option of building caravans which only require horses. This would allow for rushing wonders very cheaply in the later ages. I might be wrong as I changed it in my game but I think thats how it would work.

Thanks, Isak, and not just for the information. It is an excellent mod, and I'll just print out the new civlopedia info so that I have it handy when I play. The reason for my confusion may be that I checked in the .txt files, and found what looked like full descriptions of the new units and buildings, so I assumed they weren't showing up because of an error. In any event, good to be straightened out.

If I had any comments, I'd like to say that I got smacked around by the Zulus early because I mistook their Braves for Scouts - my fault, probably, but other lurkers may be having the same problem. There is a lot of money around in the early stages, I agree, although the AI seems to spend it far more than me. But it's a fantastic mod, and my bungling shouldn't be construed as criticism. Full speed ahead, and thanks for the entertainment.

Be seeing you,

Saxman

Hello everybody,

Sorry I have been busy with life.

Nightstorm,

I am glad you like my alternative marble image. :D You don’t know how long I spent looking for that. It was very difficult to find a decent image of a marble column.

RobO,

originally emailed by RobO
I tried your revised settings and still had too much money. I entered the 2nd era around 100BC, which should be around 500AD historically AFAIK. I will try the following changes:

Desert from 0/1/1 - 1/1/1 to 0/1/0 - 0/1/1
Plains from 2/1/1 - 1/1/1 to 2/1/0 - 1/1/1
Sea from 1/1/1 - 0/0/0 to 1/0/1 - 0/0/0
Timber from 0/1/1 to 0/2/0
Gems from 0/1/4 to 0/1/3
Tobacco from 0/0/3 to 0/0/2

I like the changes you are making here, except for the timber and maybe instead of Gems dropping in value it should be Gold and Silver to 0/1/3 and 0/1/2 respectively they were originally 0/0/4 and 0/1/3. What do you think. I think this will accomplish what we are trying to do and keep Gems more valuable than Gold.

The money issue is definitley a major concern. Please keep thining about this issue.

originally emailed by RobO
I tried those changes, and it didn't make a lot of difference. I still have a lot of money. It might be related to the lack of upkeep for Despotism, I'm not sure what the original setting was for that.

Those are the original upkeep costs for despotism. But I like your idea about raising the costs to 2. you’re right it does provide for greater flexibility in the various govts. Which is one of the main goals of the mod, creating options and forcing players to make choices.

originally posted by Isak
It's because the BLDG_ codes in the Bic don't correspond to the ones in the Pediaicons.txt - I sent Kal-El an updated bic with the changed names, after I fixed the Civilopedia, but obviously he decided not to use it.

I had already made a lot of changes to my bic and didn’t realize that you had made those specific changes. I will accept a temporary cut in pay.

originally posted by Nightstorm
WOW! I just spent the last three hours playing v0.3.1, and let me tell you, FOOD UNDER DESPOTISM SUCKS!!!

Like RobO said, you need a bonus tile or a flood plain. Move your tribe around to try and find a decent location for your starting city. Most nations started out as nomadic wanderers until they migrated into areas that could support large settlements.

By the way, your explanation of why the resources are visible earlier is wonderful. Here is a little more on the subject. The way the original game is set up you discover a tech that allows you to build something, either a unit or an improvement, and then the resource appears that same turn. The way DYP is set up you discover a tech and a new resource appears, but all you can do with that resource is get the tile bonus, but you know where it is, and now your researchers will try and figure out what they can do with this new resource, leading to the discovery of a new tech that now allows you to produce units or buildings using this already discovered resource.

If you discover mining and there is no iron within reach you may think twice about going after the iron working tech, why not expend you energy researching something else until you find a source of iron that you can make use of. I always hated researching iron working and then finding out that I still couldn’t make swordsmen because all the iron on my continent was already controlled by my neighbor.

An additional side effect of this is that you now must be more selective in which civ to play. Do you want to be an industrious civ that starts out with mining so you can see where all those ores are? Or do you want to be the expansionist civ who starts out with farming so you can see where all the crops are?

Its all about making choices.

Kal-el spake:
The money issue is definitley a major concern. Please keep thining about this issue.
...
But I like your idea about raising the costs to 2. you’re right it does provide for greater flexibility in the various govts. Which is one of the main goals of the mod, creating options and forcing players to make choices.

OK, I'll work on the premise that cost/unit is 2, at least for Despotism and probably also for other governments. It helps to narrow the playing field a bit. I would really like to get this one nailed down.

Kal-el uttered:
An additional side effect of this is that you now must be more selective in which civ to play. Do you want to be an industrious civ that starts out with mining so you can see where all those ores are? Or do you want to be the expansionist civ who starts out with farming so you can see where all the crops are?

I have found that the Chinese really kick ass :hammer: at start. Being Military and Industriuos, with a good starting position (e.g. jungle with timber) they can churn out braves and overwhelm the neighbours rather quickly.

The downside is that if the unlucky enemy happens to produce a settler just before you strike, then his city will be size 1. You can take it but it will starve the next turn because the second citizen will resist and the city itself only makes two food. I have seen that happen twice :sad:

Originally posted by RobO
Am I the only one playing this mod? Or perhaps I'm the only one who thinks there's too much money available during the ancient age? After all, we do want people to have an incentive to buy marketplaces, banks etc. It would also be good if you couldn't just set your science rate at 60% at start and then ignore it until you changed government.



I just finished a game where I also had the unfortune of 60% science rate showstopper.
Somehow later in the game I was able to raise this to 90% and still have a whopping 1200 income

Does anybody know why 60% is set at start and not later.

I think the science cap is used to differentiate between governments (as it was in Civ2 IIRC).

Here are most of the government settings from the 0.3.2 bic file:

Government.Cost/unit..Supp.T/C/M..Trade..Draft..MP..WarWear..Prod..Science.Work.. Maint..Corrupt
Despotism......1......4./.4./..4....No.....2.....2....No.....Forc.....60%....2. ....Y....4.Rampant
Monarchy.......1......2./.4./..8....No.....2.....3....No.....Paid.....70%....2. ....Y....3.Problematic
Communist......1......3./.6./.10....No.....3.....4....No.....Forc.....80%....2. ....Y....Communal
Republic.......1......3./.5./..7...Yes.....1.....0...Low.....Paid.....60%....2. ....Y....4.Rampant
Democracy......1......2./.4./..6...Yes.....1.....0...High....Paid.....80%....3. ....Y....3.Problematic
Theocracy.....Free..................No.....3.....4 ....No.....Forc.....50%....1.....N....1.Minimal
Federal.Rep....1......1./.3./..5...Yes.....1.....0...Low.....Paid....100%....4. ....Y....2.Nuisance
Social.Democ...1......1./.2./..4...Yes.....1.....0...Low.....Paid....100%....3. ....N....2.Nuisance
Fascist........1......3./.6./.10....No.....3.....0....No.....Paid.....90%....2. ....N....1.Minimal


The table should be selexplanatory and hopefully enlightening. It seems to me there are three obvious errors:

Democracy has high war weariness (should be low)
Theocracy has a tile penalty (should be removed)
Social Democracy has no maintenance (it should have)

I'm working on the money issue. Suggestions are welcome.

Gentlemen:

I have read with great interest (and excitement) your postings concerning Kal-El's excellent mod. Unfortunately, I encounter the same problem Richard IV described 4/25 when installing: my New and Saved Game buttons don't work on the start screen, and I receive an error message reagrding "Scenario Version 3.08" files being invalid. I am running Civ 3 with the 1.21f patch, but I have also tried reverting to 1.17f, and I still get the same results. (I have a Falcon NW P4 on an Asus P4T-E with an Intel 815 chipset & 512 MB RAM.) I have copied the civ3mod.bic file created by the mod into my civ 3 per Richard's subsequent posting, but still no luck. However, I have not yet downloaded the dyp 03.1 files - I only tried things this weekend with the initial .03. If anyone could advise me how to correct this, I would greatly appreciate it. And thanks Kal-El, Nightstorm, RobO et al for your very helpful postings here!

Originally posted by Def Lep
Gentlemen:

I have read with great interest (and excitement) your postings concerning Kal-El's excellent mod. Unfortunately, I encounter the same problem Richard IV described 4/25 when installing: my New and Saved Game buttons don't work on the start screen, and I receive an error message reagrding "Scenario Version 3.08" files being invalid. I am running Civ 3 with the 1.21f patch, but I have also tried reverting to 1.17f, and I still get the same results. (I have a Falcon NW P4 on an Asus P4T-E with an Intel 815 chipset & 512 MB RAM.) I have copied the civ3mod.bic file created by the mod into my civ 3 per Richard's subsequent posting, but still no luck. However, I have not yet downloaded the dyp 03.1 files - I only tried things this weekend with the initial .03. If anyone could advise me how to correct this, I would greatly appreciate it. And thanks Kal-El, Nightstorm, RobO et al for your very helpful postings here!

1) Completely uninstall Civ3
2) Completely reinstall Civ3
3) Upgrade to patch 1.21f
4) Download and install DYP Mod v3.0
5) Download and install DYP Mod v3.0 to 3.2 patch

This should do you. I recommend downloading the .exe versions to correct your problem. Isak has done a great job putting the .exe together so that all the correct files go in the correct places. Try this, hope it helps.

Originally posted by RobO
I think the science cap is used to differentiate between governments (as it was in Civ2 IIRC). It is indeed.


It seems to me there are three obvious errors: A very Bold statement.

Democracy has high war weariness (should be low)
The earliest, and most well known, democracy was the Greek City State of Athens. Athens was known for her navy and her dominance of Mediterranean trade. War is not good for trade.

Theocracy has a tile penalty (should be removed)
Possibly, but I wanted there to be a significant penalty for switching to a govt that gave you free units, minimal corruption (the only one) and had no maintenance.

Social Democracy has no maintenance (it should have)
This is what distinguishes it from Federal Republic, I suppose it could be removed and then switch the corruption to communal.

Originally posted by Ganjaman
I think you should allow fixed wing aircraft to destroy naval units and the helicopter gunship to destroy land units. Maybe make all treaded vehicles (tanks apcs and mech infantry) wheeled and unable to airlift so that they can only be transported by the air carrier and by sea.
I am concerned with allowing fixed wing aircraft the ability to sink naval vessels. I am afraid this will severly limit the effectivness of an already ineffective aspect of the game.

I like the idea about the Gunship though, it only makes sense.

One last thing, regarding the merchant, caravan and Freight...good idea but I think that they should not require any strategic resources too build. I am not sure but I believe that if for example you dont have any oil, you would not be able to build freight but would then have the option of building caravans which only require horses. This would allow for rushing wonders very cheaply in the later ages. I might be wrong as I changed it in my game but I think thats how it would work.

This is a really excellent point. I hadn't thought about this possibility and you are right, this could allow for very cheap caravans in the later stages of the game. This will be fixed to prevent such occurances. Thanks. :goodjob:

I think the governments seem pretty well set up: theocracy with the tile penalty, democracy with high weariness. Makes sense. I am going to try social democracy with communal instead of no maintenence to see how it works out. Is there any way to alter the bic file without having to start a new game for the modifications to take effect. Right now I have to start over everytime i tweak something and it makes testing things in the later stages very time consuming. Anyway I started a game on emperor with 16 nations. I set the upkeep for despotism at 2 and halved the support rate for monarchy to try and slow down advancing in the ancient era. I multiplied science and costs at a rate of 1.5 for middle 2.0 for industrial and 2.5 for modern. I also reduced the commerce for some tiles as Kal El mentioned in an earlier post. I am about half way through the middle ages and the unit costs seem okay. Science is still jacked way up though as is income. A lot of the nations have 1000 plus gold and got to the middle ages by 800 BC. Maybe because I am playing with so many tribes. I am going to cut it down to eight and try it again. It really is a shame because there are cool new units in the ancient and early middle ages but it goes by so quick that one does not get a chance to really use them.

It seems to me there are three obvious errors:
A very Bold statement.
Yes, but not entirely without merit :)
I'm glad you did these things deliberately, though. You obviously think things through.
Democracy has high war weariness (should be low)
The earliest, and most well known, democracy was the Greek City State of Athens. Athens was known for her navy and her dominance of Mediterranean trade. War is not good for trade.
OK, but IMO it makes it a very difficult government to play. Point taken.

Theocracy has a tile penalty (should be removed)
Possibly, but I wanted there to be a significant penalty for switching to a govt that gave you free units, minimal corruption (the only one) and had no maintenance.

I see, but starvation is unfortunately an excessive and crippling penalty, and' I'm pretty sure this will be the outcome. It can be tested ofc.

Social Democracy has no maintenance (it should have)
This is what distinguishes it from Federal Republic, I suppose it could be removed and then switch the corruption to communal.
It does make them different, but a social democracy definitely should have maintenance in my experience. I live in one :cry: and it's definitely not full of corruption either. Perhaps the name should be replaced?

Originally posted by RobO

Yes, but not entirely without merit :)
I'm glad you did these things deliberately, though. You obviously think things through.

OK, but IMO it makes it a very difficult government to play. Point taken.
yeah, this is one that most players probably won't use, but I think there are a couple of civs that have this as a preference so its a way of handicapping the AI, if it needs it.

I see, but starvation is unfortunately an excessive and crippling penalty, and' I'm pretty sure this will be the outcome. It can be tested ofc.
as far as starvation goes, just look at the theocracies in the world today, Iran and Afghanistan. Maybe not starving but definitley not thriving. Besides, by the time you can move into a Theocracy you should be able to farm, or at least you soon will and with farms most of your main city tiles should be producing at least 3 food, as long as you built on grassland or plains with a bonus tile. with farming plains will produce 3, grassland 4, floodplains and obscene 6, plus if you have any food bonus tiles, elephants for example :) you could survive even with the minus 1 penalty. you just won't thrive.

It does make them different, but a social democracy definitely should have maintenance in my experience. I live in one :cry: and it's definitely not full of corruption either. Perhaps the name should be replaced?
As far as social democracy and communal corruption. in this case don't think of it so much as corruption but simply as spreading your tax dollars around to the more "needy" and less well to do. The Social Democracy is a welfare state, not that I need to tell you, and the main goal is to make everybody suffer at the same rate. (can you tell I am not a big socialist).

I agree the lack of maintenance was a mistake, and the communal corruption is a better alternative to distinguish between the capitalist federal republic and the socialist social republic.

Originally posted by cricket
I still can not built ports in citys built on the second island. I can build one on my home island but not on any others.

Needless to say this really affects my trade

:cry:

I have tried both building and not building harbors and I checked to see that coastal installation was checked and build near water is not. Same with shipyards. I simply cannot build on the second island.



I am new to this, but could it be that ports require timber (like shipyards?) I am trying out a variant where ports don't require timber, but shipyards still do.:confused: I hope it works, because I like scenarios with a lot of water.

I like your mod so much I registered at this site just so I could report my experiences. I am very green on scenario/mod design, more of a play tester than a designer. Here are my observations.:mwaha:

1) I already posted about the problems with building ports. If I am seeing this right, ports won't build sometimes because of lack of timber. I think this skews the game too much away from trade. It is a Catch22 for isolated island civs.

2) I've noticed that too many civs fail to get past one city at the beginning. This happens for two reasons: Either the civ is surround by mountains and jungle and is wiped out before it can build a long enough road to get a settler out, or it can't grow its first city past '2' because there isn't enough food.:nono:

3) I tend to like a relaxed pace with time to explore the strategy and tactics of each era. I set the minimum time to research new tech higher to slow the game down. This tends to exacerbate the problem with too much money in the early years.

4) Also, a minor note: The sailing Ship of the Line, though not built by the young United States, was the major battleship of its day during the War of the American Revolution and the Napoleanic Wars. If anyone is tinkering with units I would urge adding the Ship of the Line as the ultimate saling warship with frigates downgraded a bit to the role of sailing "destroyers." :grad:

You are doing a great job. This is not meant as criticism. I appreciate the time being put into making Civ3 an enjoyable game.:love:

Great mod, but have found one major "bug", you can't build FIGHTERS.

I have in the build cue list airports, airbases, bombers, but no fighters.

Once I discovered Adv Flight, there were helos and paratroopers, but still no fighters.

Great work though guys!

Originally posted by Skotty702
Great mod, but have found one major "bug", you can't build FIGHTERS.

I have in the build cue list airports, airbases, bombers, but no fighters.

Once I discovered Adv Flight, there were helos and paratroopers, but still no fighters.

Great work though guys!

Don't mind the newbie! I checked the BIC and there were no countries set for availibility for fighters. I pretty sure I didn't change anything with the BIC so you might want to check the DL file.

Kal-el:

I may not be able to check this thread too often for awhile so if there is anything you would like me to do, email me at asklfhdnnsdnfsldfsk@gidustin.net (actually, anything @ gidustin.net comes to my box, so . . .)

I just released V4.0 of my own mod. I was soo happy when I was able to get 120MB worth of file changes into a 29 MB installer :p

Well, TTYL

GIDustin

Originally posted by guidebookdave



I am new to this, but could it be that ports require timber (like shipyards?) I am trying out a variant where ports don't require timber, but shipyards still do.:confused: I hope it works, because I like scenarios with a lot of water.
By George I think you have figured it out[dance]
I will play a game tomorrow to check but it looks like that might have been the key.
Cricket:jump:

Kal-el,

I wasn't thinking straight when I commented about starvation and Theocracy. You're probably right. If I ever get this far in a game :( I'll try it to see how it works.

As far as Social Democracy goes, I'm not a socialist either ;) - but using communal corruption has the side effect of affecting production, not just taxation. Too bad there isn't any way to just increase taxes for a government.

Skotty702:
You're absolutely right about the fighters - bug will be fixed in the next release.

Kal-el: I think Guidebookdave is right about the timber requirements causing the Shipyard/Port trouble. I think we'll have to remove the resource req from the Port as it is flagged as allowing water trade. Won't be much trade if there's only timber on one continent, I guess (before airports anyway)

By the way, good thinking , Guidebookdave. :goodjob:

These bugs will be fixed in the next release - stay tuned for it, It will be out within 4-6 hours (if all goes well) and will include Effect descriptions for all Improvements and Wonders.....[and there was much rejoice]

Isak,

Will it fix the pediaicons.txt file?? :D

Nightstorm:
You had to ask, didn't you? :rolleyes:

Yes it will fix the civilopedia icons - again.

Say, what are _you_ doing anyway - we still need civilopedia icons for the resources, unique animations for units that don't have them, etc. etc. etc....:borg: :whipped:

Originally posted by Isak
Nightstorm:
You had to ask, didn't you? :rolleyes:

Yes it will fix the civilopedia icons - again.

Say, what are _you_ doing anyway - we still need civilopedia icons for the resources, unique animations for units that don't have them, etc. etc. etc....:borg: :whipped:

Which icons ya need...I used to have some around here somewhere till I was told to uninstall and reinstall to get the full effect of the mod. :)

As for animations, well I suck at that... :(

Which icons ya need... I don't have any civilopedia icons for any of the new resources :( I used to have some around here somewhere till I was told to uninstall and reinstall to get the full effect of the mod. Actually the best way to get full effect is - Start in Dos, type format c:......:nuke: As for animations, well I suck at that... You don't know that until you try.... I tried - I suck ;)

Originally shreeked by Isak
You don't know that until you try.... I tried - I suck ;)

Like I said, with animations, I suck! :cool:

DAMN I'M GOOD!! :D

Here ya go Isak. Icons for the following new resources:

- Coffee
- Copper
- Corn
- Fruit
- Marble
- Oasis
- Pearls
- Timber
- Tobacco
- Tropical Fruit
- Wool

As with all my stuff, these are preliminary (mostly cause I got them from other places :D ). But, I will be updating some and will repost those that I missed. Guess this means that you will have to update the pediaicons.txt file... AGAIN! :lol:

DAMN I'M GOOD!! And fast...:goodjob: Guess this means that you will have to update the pediaicons.txt file... AGAIN! Yeah, but I know my way around it now - anyway, I think I'll just postpone the patch for another 4-6 hours (who believes in scheduled release dates anyway ;) )

I think/hope I'm approaching a workable solution to the money issue, but it would help to have some data to test it on. I don't have the time to play all that much, and have difficulty getting past the first age. I noticed that some people seem to have progressed to(wards) the end, and they might just have some savefiles lying around.

I need the following data:

- Version of DyP (if available)
- Name of Civ
- Date
- Government type
- Number of cities (of size up to 7 / 8 to 15 / over 15 )
- Total number of units
- Total maintenance cost of improvements
- Total cost of corruption
- Total income (without any deduction for expenditures)

The data are available from the city screen (F1) and the military screen (F3).

If you feel lazy, you could also send me the savegame.

Don't post it here, send it to robert.olesen@get2net.dk

:) Thanks :)

Off Topic !

Originally posted by NightStorm
"What walks on four legs in the morning, two legs in the evening and three legs at night?


Ok, I know the quest of the sphinx - baby/adult/grand pa - :D

:confused: But what the :scan: is your quest is :confused:

Sounds like me after a heavy night... :crazyeye:

Request education....


KeeP CooL & FooL,

Maverick

Originally posted by MavMcLeod
Ok, I know the quest of the sphinx - baby/adult/grand pa - :D

:lol: was just wondering how long it would take someone...the answer is in the civilopedia under quest of the sphinx...also, the answer is from typical college history course... :D

i think i found a a slow down on money received.

i tweaked the depostism gov. by putting a check on standard tile penalty. it seems to slow the game down abit .
in the game that im playing i had to go into my advisors to change science & happiness several times.

can someone check this out to see if this works or it just me playing really bad
thanks

i also changed the unit cost in depostism from 1to 2

It is now official:

Version 0.33 has been released

Get it while you can at The Double Your Pleasure Web-site (http://civ3.bernskov.com) (Accept no Substitute!)

It's available in Full EXE (http://civ3.bernskov.com/dyp.files/dyp_v033_full.exe), Full Zip (http://civ3.bernskov.com/dyp.files/dyp_v033_full.zip) or Full Split-up Zip versions (the latter only available by visiting the website)

It's also available as a 375 kb Update (http://civ3.bernskov.com/dyp.files/Update_dyp_032to033.zip) for those running version 0.32.

:jesus:

And now the list of changes:
------------------------------------
Added: Civilopedia Icons for almost all resources
Fixed: Removed timber as requirement for Port (the most likely cause for the "Harbor bug")
Fixed: Missing nationality flags for Fighter unit
Edit: Gunship can now kill ground units
Edit: Social Democracy now requires maintenance but has communal corruption.
Edit: Terrain changes:
--------------------Before (Natural-Worked) NOW
---Desert.......- 0 1 1 - 1 1 1......0 1 0 - 1 1 1
---Grassland..- 2 0 1 - 2 0 1......2 0 0 - 1 1 1
---Tundra.......- 0 0 0 - 0 2 1......0 0 0 - 0 1 1
---Hills............- 1 2 0 - 1 2 1......1 2 1 - 1 2 1
---Mountains..- 0 3 0 - 0 2 1......0 3 1 - 0 2 1
---Forest........- 1 2 0 - 0 1 1......1 1 1 - 0 1 1
---Jungle........- 2 1 0 - 0 2 1......1 0 0 - 0 0 1
Edit: Resource changes:
---Timber from 0/1/1 to 0/1/0
---Tobacco from 0/0/3 to 0/0/2
---Silver from 0/1/3 to 0/1/2
---Gold from 0/0/4 to 0/1/3
Fixed: Added missing PRTO_Spy entry
Fixed: Civilopedia: Effects pages added for buildings (Improvements and wonders)
(Re)Fixed: Civilopedia Icons for certain Improvements, wonders, units and resources. (Grrrrr....)

//Release Manager Singing Out//
ho-ho-ho, tee-hee-hee, Cyril Connolly

Hello.

Again Kal-El, Isak, and everyone else involved thank you.
You have produced a beutiful baby Mod, and it's maturing into quite the game.

There are several thing I won't spend time on, for they have been discussed @ great length in the last 22 pages.

Food- I assume v3.2 will be better.
$$$$- I assume this is addressed.
Warrior- Clear forest ability? After all they do have an axe.
Swordsman- Clear jungle ability? After all they have a sword.

Historicly military legions spent much of their time building infastructure. Maybe ad build road to military units ability.

I definately like the added resources, can you add more please?

I got to mobile warfare w/ no errors- props to the file maint team.

The Civilopedia is a must, prioritze the work. Wonder's, and city improvement's effects first. It's a pain to keep referring to the edit program to find the effect of improvements or wonders.
Forget the descriptions for now.

I couldn't get the caravans to work. What do you do to hurry?

I didn't get any mines to work, how do you deploy them?

How does the airfield work? I couldn't deploy it.

I think I like the Idea of moving the ability to mine to the middle or industrial ages, but the tiles would have to be adjusted again.

I couldn't build temples or cathedrals, why?

I couldn't build fighters.

The road mvment rate @ 2 is cool. It opens a new level of gameplay.

We need more units. There should be infantry w/ additional movement points avail earlier.
A few suggestions: A lightly armored swordsman, a horse drawn cannon, recon sniper, some type of infantry w/ high att, low def, 2 mv points, more, More, MORE!!

I think that's most of it for now.....

Really good Mod, really good dedication by mod spokesman, all in all the best yet.

Keep up the good work, I'm gunna dwnload the new versions now. Can't wait.

Originally posted by pjm
i think i found a a slow down on money received.

i tweaked the depostism gov. by putting a check on standard tile penalty. it seems to slow the game down abit .
in the game that im playing i had to go into my advisors to change science & happiness several times.

can someone check this out to see if this works or it just me playing really bad
thanks

i also changed the unit cost in depostism from 1to 2

I'm working extensively on this right now - it does take a bit of time, though.

The standard tile penalty was lifted for despotism because (IIRC) it didn't allow enough food for growth. Also, the AI would have problems if it started drafting extensively - causing cities to melt away. It's hidden somewhere in the mass of pages preceeding this one.

The standard tile penalty should only affect flood plains and (from 4 to 2 food) and mountains (from 3 to 2 shields). I'm not entirely sure about bonus resources. The first is unfortunate, as flood plains historically provide a good starting point for a civ.

Drop me an email at robert.olesen@get2net.dk if you wouldn't mind testing my tweaks.

Originally posted by Isak
Version 0.33 has been released
------------------------------------
--------------------Before (Natural-Worked) NOW
---Hills............- 1 2 0 - 1 2 1......1 2 1 - 1 2 1
---Mountains..- 0 3 0 - 0 2 1......0 3 1 - 0 2 1
---Forest........- 1 2 0 - 0 1 1......1 1 1 - 0 1 1
[/B]

This is a miscommunication between team members. The only tiles with commerce bonus should be Grassland at 2/0/1, Coast at 2/0/2 and Sea at 1/1/1. Lessening the number of tiles that offer commerce bonus should help with the too much money issue.

the terrain table should read:
---Desert - 0 1 0 - 1 1 1
---Plains - 2 1 0 - 1 1 1
---Grassland - 2 0 1 - 2 0 1
---Tundra - 0 0 0 - 0 1 1
---Floodplain - 4 0 0 - 2 1 1
---Hills - 1 2 0 - 1 2 1
---Mountains - 0 3 0 - 0 2 1
---Forest - 1 2 0 - 0 1 1
---Jungle - 1 1 0 - 0 1 1
---Coast - 2 0 2 - 0 0 0
---Sea - 1 1 1 - 0 0 0
---Ocean - 0 0 0 - 0 0 0

Sorry for the confusion.

Originally posted by Kal-El
This is a miscommunication between team members. The only tiles with commerce bonus should be Grassland at 2/0/1, Coast at 2/0/2 and Sea at 1/1/1. Looks like I wen't and misread the changes when adjusting the bic and since Kal-El had already applied some of the changes in a bic he sent me, I managed to reset them to their old values..... I'll deduct it from my own wages this time.:blush:

This means that a new patch is not far away - I'll be waiting for further instructions from our fearless leader, but it should be out within the next 24 hours - after that It might be a good idea to stop changing the bic for a while - just to let people actually get to the industrial or modern ages (which would help RobO's great initiative too) . What do you all think?

Anyway, IMHO it would be nice if we tried to stick with the tile settings as they are (after the next patch is applied of course). The effect of changes to tiles are relatively easy to calculate for the Ancient era, but it is a lot harder to predict the effects for the Industrial and Modern eras, especially with all the new buildings and wonders that affect the city's production and commerce. E.g. adjusting natural trade for hills from 1 to 0 could result in a decrease of around 20-40 commerce for a single Modern era city. The effect on the entire empire would be even more profound.

So if there seems to be to much money or too high production levels in later eras, maybe we should start adjusting the Shield costs, tech costs, etc.... Just a thought.

Originally posted by Civalaholic
Hello. Hi Civalaholic - good to have you back again :) I definately like the added resources, can you add more please? I think Kal-El has crammed in all the resources that the program can handle under the current Patch 1.21f - Im also quite sure that once the "Unlimited resources" that the Firaxis team promised are actually unlimited, he's got another load of resources waiting in line to join in on the fun. I got to mobile warfare w/ no errors- props to the file maint team.
What??? Our bug-spotter Numero Uno is bug-free.... You'd better pull yourself together or I'll deduct it from your paycheck. ;)
The Civilopedia is a must, prioritze the work. Wonder's, and city improvement's effects first. It's a pain to keep referring to the edit program to find the effect of improvements or wonders.
Forget the descriptions for now. Agree with you on the descriptions - they are good, but not too necessary while beta-testing. Improvements and Wonders are in Patch 0.33 (as you may already have noticed) I couldn't get the caravans to work. What do you do to hurry? I think you should disband them in the city building a wonder - not sure though, as I haven't built any caravans yet :( I didn't get any mines to work, how do you deploy them? I think there was a bug in 0.3 - they were not flagged as foot soldiers and thus couldn't be loaded onto transports. How does the airfield work? I couldn't deploy it. I'd like to hear the answer for this myself - never built this either. I think I like the Idea of moving the ability to mine to the middle or industrial ages, but the tiles would have to be adjusted again. Oh nooo! No more tile adjustments :D I couldn't build temples or cathedrals, why? You need Incense to build Temples, and you need Temples to build Cathedrals I couldn't build fighters. Should be fixed in v.033
The road mvment rate @ 2 is cool. It opens a new level of gameplay. I totally agree - if only Railroads could be slowed down too (they can't, can they?) Really good Mod, really good dedication by mod spokesman, all in all the best yet. Yep, three cheers for our fearless leader :goodjob:

Originally posted by Isak
This means that a new patch is not far away - I'll be waiting for further instructions from our fearless leader, but it should be out within the next 24 hours - after that It might be a good idea to stop changing the bic for a while - just to let people actually get to the industrial or modern ages (which would help RobO's great initiative too) . What do you all think?

Hold your horses - a suggested slution to the money problem is on the way to the release manager as well as our fearless leader. This is an excellent opportunity to get a lot of voluntary beta testers :lol:

I just hope it passes the scrutiny of Kal-el :scan:

And yes, it would be great to get this thing stabilized a bit.

Caravans ought to work as leaders - put them in a city and there should be a "Hurry" button at the bottom center of the screen (with the other buttons). There's a keyboard shortcut as well. I haven't used them myself, though.

And no, you can't slow down railroads. Too bad. Adding another type of worker job would have done the trick, but that can't be done either.

Originally posted by RobO
Caravans ought to work as leaders - put them in a city and there should be a "Hurry" button at the bottom center of the screen (with the other buttons). There's a keyboard shortcut as well. I haven't used them myself, though.

This is correct. I've done this twice now in two seperate games and it works!! :)

Originally posted by RobO
Caravans ought to work as leaders - put them in a city and there should be a "Hurry" button at the bottom center of the screen Oh - pardon my ignorance :blush: Maybe I should find the time to actually play the mod one of these days....

Nightstorm: In addition to what I already ordered, I would like to see some Civilopedia Icons for:
- Flax
- Sheep
- Silver
- Stone
- Seal

No need to rush it though - I'm going out to the kitchen to make a cup of coffee, and I won't be needing the icons until I get back to my seat again.....;)

Oh boy, I love this smiley :whipped:

Greetings to all!
Am I only one who sees, then Colonist CAN"T found new cities?
Or maybe I am doing something wrong? I build a Colonist, send him to suitable place, then press "B" and.... NOTHING HAPPENS :(
I am sad, because there is no Settlers - only Colonists - and I can't estalish new cities. Help me, please. I am using 1.21f patch and DYP v. 033. Thank you all from advance.

The Colonist is a Settler upgrade that comes with Navigation. I have never played far enough to activate it :sad:
It is entirely possible that it does not have the proper ability set in the editor. That should be easy to check, but I can't do it right now.

Dear Robert!
Painfully, in editor all seems to be OK, the "Build City Option" IS checked. That's why I submit my post :(

Well then, I suppose this might be a job for the selfappointed bug squasher (you did appoint yourself, didn't you?) who is currently busy brewing coffee and preparing a patch for the latest patch (shades of Firaxis here :) )

There is ofc. the standard procedure:

1. Uninstall.
2. Clean out the Art directory
3. Reinstall.
4. Patch to 1.21f
5. Install DyP 0.33

It worked for me once :) , but you probably already tried that :(

Originally posted by RobO
Well then, I suppose this might be a job for the selfappointed bug squasher Ok, I'll look into it a.s.a.p. (Darn! Where did I put that fresh batch of DDT) Originally posted by RobO
(you did appoint yourself, didn't you?) As I have been producing most of the bugs lately, it only seems fair. Originally posted by RobO
(shades of Firaxis here ) I'm doing my best to impress them - hoping to land me a job in their QA department :rolleyes:

:scan: Anyway, Mark132, could you send me a savegame or two? That would really make things a lot easier. My email address is on the DyP website.

Hi all,

I don't know if this issue has been addressed somewhere at page 25-n (n=1 to 24), but there seem's to be a connection of the two words "colonist" and "colony". ;)

Could it be that colonists where able to found colonies like Barcelona (greek), Boston (the 'dark' empire) or any country in black africa? :confused:

So IMHO colonists should not only be able to found new cities but also colonies!
I don't know if anyone would use them to do that 'cause they're more 'expensive' than workes, but they should be able to do so.

Those were my 2 €-Cents.

KeeP CooL & FooL,

Maverick

the thing is that colonies in the game are not the same thing as colonies in real life. You don't actually gain any territory by placing a colony and your colonies can be easily lost if another civ places a city too close to it or a rival civs cultural border expands to envelop it, this doesn't even cause an international incident!!

I wish you could set up puppet colonies, it would really add depth to the game, but you can't. :(