.......is The Most Retarded Thing Ive Ever Seen In My Entire Life

...is a very good idea. Unlike vanilla Civ, FfH has multiple early ways to deal with happiness problems. Pop rushing is just one of them.

Should we just declare this thread closed, or do people really want to discuss making slavery an open civic and giving the OO another special one?

close it! hfhgfh

http://kael.civfanatics.net/images/dogballfy6.jpg

http://kael.civfanatics.net/images/dogballfy6.jpg

Gahaha! I have to say I agree with you...

...is a very good idea. Unlike vanilla Civ, FfH has multiple early ways to deal with happiness problems. Pop rushing is just one of them.

More like the most powerful means of early game production. Slavery is especially vital for getting out settlers and workers quickly. Why spend 6+ turns building a unit that inhibits the growth of your city, when you can build it for one turn, whip it for 2 pop and then get a 1-2 turn militray unit with the overflow? Not to mention the fact that you get the new city / additional worker turns that much earlier, and that early game cities grow back pop very fast. A player using slavery to whip settlers and workers out can develop MUCH faster than a player without. Granted, it isn't hard to be the one to found OO, I like to play direct IP with my friend, and quite frankly i feel cheap using slavery when the option isn't even available to him.

Making this specific to the founder of a specific religion changes the game way too much IMO. Slavery is a powerful civic capable of making/breaking your game, especially on high food/low prod(hill) starts

Making this specific to the founder of a specific religion changes the game way too much IMO. Slavery is a powerful civic capable of making/breaking your game, especially on high food/low prod(hill) starts

I had yet to hear people say OO is way too powerful compared to the other religions. And if it were, the other religions could simply be boosted on some other area.

Though it would be nice if the FfH team took over the Warlords fix of the whipping bug.

Haha, Kael is one of the most well-mannered people I encountered on the Internet, so this pic really tells something about Fye ;) Slavery comes later than bronze working in vanilla, and I played many games, yet I dont think that slavery is overpowered. Besides there are things called backstory. Could Order keep slaves? And in the end, Ashen Veil can use pop rushing as well (Sacrifice the weak)

Most people think Runes of Kilmorph is more powerful than Octopus Overlords so I don't think OO is overpowered even with slavery.

I have no problem with Fye's opinion. Slavery is powerful, but I don't know that it is any more powerful than the Runes money making abilities or the Fellowships free treants. I just think that picture is so funny that I just had to use it.

Sorry about the OP it wasn't worded in the most respectful manner. >_> bit frusterated when i posted. The mod is great overall but like i said even though this may seem small to some of you, it's a very drastic change for people who know how to abuse slavery properly.

Slavery is as much as powerfull as FoL´s supercitys, or Runes´ super economy. Each religion has its own bonuses, and its own penalties. Overall I think they are pretty much balanced. Oh and don´t forget that the Ashen Veil can use whipping too, with Sacrifice the Weak.

The thing about slavery though is the earlier you get it the more powerful it's going to be. When you leverage your production with slavery in the early game you can rapidly speed the expansion phase of the game. The sooner you get your economy set up early in the game, the faster you're going to grow, and I believe giving this sort of advantage to only one of the civs in a particular game is imbalancing.

I don't mind religion specific bonuses, it adds more character to the game. However slavery is a very important game mechanic that can drastically alter a civilization's means to expand early, or quickly produce an assault/defence force. It is in my opinion a tool that should be available to either everyone or no one at all.

Anyway, i was more posting this for my own selfish venting purposes. I doubt I'm going to change anyones mind. I'll just have to accept the fact I need to adopt OO every single game. Hurray

or Ashen Veil........... and i dont think its asking too much that you adopt an evil religion if you want to sacrifice people to rush building things, its quite evil afterall.

Her problem is that the AV comes too late.

she has a good point about early expansion though. THe other religions give their large bonuses later.

I mean I'm all for the evil civs being allowed to do pop-rushing with just a default labor civic. As long as we give good civs an equally valid option for early expansion.

Why not give the Good civs a bonus with the cottage line then or something? A bonus, but a different one.

Maybe, but then you have maintenance costs kicking in. With Runes for example, that is easier to hold on. So you may expand faster, but need more ways to get money for the maintenance costs, while Runes alredy give that money or FoL don´t need to expand so much because of the super-citys generated (Ancient Forests) for example.

The mod is great overall but like i said even though this may seem small to some of you, it's a very drastic change for people who know how to abuse slavery properly.


In other words the problem lies not with the mod, but your inability to adapt to the need for varying strategies depending on circumstances. ;p

The thing about slavery though is the earlier you get it the more powerful it's going to be. When you leverage your production with slavery in the early game you can rapidly speed the expansion phase of the game. The sooner you get your economy set up early in the game, the faster you're going to grow, and I believe giving this sort of advantage to only one of the civs in a particular game is imbalancing.

I don't mind religion specific bonuses, it adds more character to the game. However slavery is a very important game mechanic that can drastically alter a civilization's means to expand early, or quickly produce an assault/defence force. It is in my opinion a tool that should be available to either everyone or no one at all.

Anyway, i was more posting this for my own selfish venting purposes. I doubt I'm going to change anyones mind. I'll just have to accept the fact I need to adopt OO every single game. Hurray

Then get online and kick everyone's arses to convince them that slavery is overpowered! ;)

What do you pick up before founding OO and researching Mind Stapling? It just seems like a lot of research to do before the expansion phase ends. I guess it depends on the number of opponents and the map settings.

It worked for me with rangers. It wasn't so long ago that they were strength 7...