Phase Two comes to phase of planning - One of the task is to put new nations.

So what new nations would you like to see the first? Have in mind that creating new nation with new units is very slow process, so choose the most important. What unique units you suggest for this nations?

How many nations can be in the game? 18 or 24?

For scenario makers, it would be nice to have all the slots filled, we can always change the art and other WBS options, but having to repeat leaderheads and such is not preferable.

Add Austria, Romania, Czechoslovakia, Belgium, Denmark....

Thanks for asking.

In mod it could be 100+ (probably this number of leaders and units would make cpu failure, not mentioning about smoke from graphic card ;D)

About scenarios i'm not sure if in warlords is possible to have 24 (in single scenario) - but it's very easy to increase the number - just one line in sdk. - there's modcomp that increase the number to 50 nations per map.

In Warlords you can have an infinite amount of civs on one map. You just have to modify the DLL file. One civ I'd like to see that really put up a fight is Greece. Germany and Italy lost quite a few troops to Metaxas.

but it's very easy to increase the number

Well, this needs to be playable, so 18 should be enough, on average size maps hopefully.

Can you share with us some of the gameplay changes in the next patch? Any modcomps included? What are some of the features?

I think it would be more fun, to see the scandinavians and the benelux and the balkans be aparted..

so germany can invade poland without being in war with all other neutral countries.. same is for benelux and so on..

Yup i think so too - increasing the number of nations more than 18 would be insane in some scenarios.

For the changes in next patch - i and the rest of team mostly focused on removing bugs (in first place critical and annoying) and balancing. More new things will appear in patch 1.2b

The modcomps included in patch are modified Dale's Range Bomardment (very modified, but it seems that AI well knows how to use it) and Modified Missile Dale's Mod (hovewer it needs a little bit fixing with short range missiles with A-Bomb Warheads, but it's 100 times better than it was).

And what units you propose for this nations? :)

My preferred new nations in mod 1939:

-> the scandinavian countries should be three independent nations Norway, Sweden and Finland

When the scenario starts Finland should fight against Russia (perhaps you can stop the war in the end of 1940 - by scripting)

-> it should exist the Benelux country with Belgium, the Netherlands and perhaps Denmark

Hungary and Romania should be two new nations which are included in the Axis Power

Bulgaria as a new country should be friendly with the Axis

Yugoslavia acts as a neutral nation

Spain and Turkey should become independent countries


Norway
Sweden
Finland
Benelux
Hungary
Romania
Bulgaria
Yugoslavia
Spain
Turkey

10 new nations, that`s enough!!!

thx for reading

ok I forgot Scandinavia is too small for three new nations,

so it should become one nation Scandinavia

Benelux you mean Nederlands and Belgium ?

My preferred new nations in mod 1939:

-> the scandinavian countries should be three independent nations Norway, Sweden and Finland

When the scenario starts Finland should fight against Russia (perhaps you can stop the war in the end of 1940 - by scripting)


thx for reading

The first war Winter War was November 30, 1939 - March 13, 1940
and the second one Continuation War June 25, 1941 - September 19, 1944 with new supplies from Germany. And then the Lapland War against Germany September, 1944 - April, 1945.

Maybe one ski infantry unite would be good to have or just Jäkkäri

I know but fighting until March 1940 is a too short period (only 7 rounds) of war

I know but fighting until March 1940 is a too short period (only 7 rounds) of war

Not if you change the calendar to weeks or months in the scenario.

Not if you change the calendar to weeks or months in the scenario.

I noticed that changing months to weeks (for example in 1939 scenario) better fitts tech tree and production

yes that`s better but what do you think about simulating this war???

I like this idea i think also there's good idea to make the Winter War Scenario and than Barbarossa Scenario (also with Finland Included as seperate country).

I rather won't use scripting - scripting is good for single scenario mods and they really complicate making scenarios for person that don't know python. On the other hand - it's mod for changing history not replaying - so i don't see it's necessary that the war starts automaticly in....... and ends in.........

My preferred new nations in mod 1939:

-> the scandinavian countries should be three independent nations Norway, Sweden and Finland

When the scenario starts Finland should fight against Russia (perhaps you can stop the war in the end of 1940 - by scripting)

-> it should exist the Benelux country with Belgium, the Netherlands and perhaps Denmark

Hungary and Romania should be two new nations which are included in the Axis Power

Bulgaria as a new country should be friendly with the Axis

Yugoslavia acts as a neutral nation

Spain and Turkey should become independent countries


Norway
Sweden
Finland
Benelux
Hungary
Romania
Bulgaria
Yugoslavia
Spain
Turkey

10 new nations, that`s enough!!!

thx for reading



I agree with this one. First we need Turkey, Spain, Hungary-Romania, Greece and Finland. Then you need Yugoslavia, Batic Alliance, Belgium-Nederlands, Norway-Denmark, and Sweden. Not to forget about Bulgaria.

yes greece is important tto

Hey guys again, remember me? :)

Well anyway i love your mod now that i can play it ;) I really enjoy playing 1939 scenario.

http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/8312/finwarmy3.gif (http://imageshack.us)

BUT you seriously need to add Finland in the 1939 scenario, you dont even need to modify map much, only put Finland in and these four cities: Helsinki(capital), Viipuri(city where was lots of fighting and only city which Russia conquert from Finland, later on in continuation war Finland tooked it back but losed it again in the end of war, so historially it's really important) and last city Turku(old capital and got lots of people), Oulu (it should be right on north border of the map if you dont change it)

http://www.sodatkuvina.cjb.net/images/Jatkosota/Rintama/4108Fagern%E4sVastaanottaaOhimarssin.jpg

And im not saying this just because im finnish. Here's few points why you need to add Finland in to this mod:

-Finland was famous about our amazing defending against massively bigger country (USSR)

-Germany provided Finland with guns and supply's and for that Finland let Germans use Lappi(north finland)-Norway road to move forces to vacation and stuff.

-There were quite many germans in Finland fighting in continuation war with our side against communist's.

-Finland WAS part of world war 2 so it should be in.

-So Finland was Germany's allie like Italy was earlier.

http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/6687/hitlermannerheimgi6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

-It's not much of work for you, but it will put a lot historical depth in mod and hell a lot fun.

-A lot more i cant get on my mind now :D

Also about how many civs? - I would say 14-16 so it will still work in my comp :P currently 1939 scenario works perfectly on my computer but if you put in 24 civs im sure i cant even play it. So please max 16 :) Most perfect number would be 15 [Germany,USA,France,USSR,Poland,Finland,Italy,Great Britain,Greece,Norway,Turkey,Spain,neutrals(sweden example), +2 more]


Okey and here's my few months ago posted post but i modfied it a bit, please read it.





WW2 Finland



http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/1636/endum0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)



Leader: Carl Gustaf Emil Mannerheim (Organized and Protective maybe)

http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/4659/mannerheimtl0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)



Civics: These are hard to say but, probably: Fascism,Nationalization,Freedom of speech, Cooperation or something and defensive

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/4466/civicshj7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


Unique bulding: Sauna (+2 happiness +1 growth) (Women use to gave birth in sauna)

http://img239.imageshack.us/img239/6449/saunapc7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Major cities: Helsinki,Turku,Oulu,Viipuri(now a day belongs to Russia but was Finland during this time) and more depending on map size

Ideas:

Here are Finland's land losses on wars: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7a/Finnish_areas_ceded_in_1940.png/300px-Finnish_areas_ceded_in_1940.png

- 20% from infantry of USSR (example if USSR has 20 on start we have 4) It should be the way that USSR wouldnt smash Finland by sending small part of troops, but if they decided to really get Finland they would do it quite easy with 50% of their troops.

- Finland should have units like: 1-3 snipers on start in east border and 2-4 Tank hunters. (One finnish famous sniper told the public that he had killed 120 Soviets in war by the way )

- Finland should have only 2-4 light tanks at start. We had really few tanks on start of WW2, later on by help of Germany we had quite many tanks.

- On east border 2 antiaircraft cannons and in Capital 1.

- Later on Germany provided Finland with guns and equipments. To fight against USSR. Finland and Sweden should be friendly, or if Sweden isnt in then other civ in their spot) USSR and Finland should be in war at start and Germany and Finland pleased. Because we would have never joined or allied with communist. So USSR should kind of be furious or if the scenario starts before 1939 then annoyed of Finland.

- Finland tile in map should be snow but that's not hard to you to change on map. and USSR should be snow too, it would make A LOT sence since Germans failed to conquer Russia partly because of the cold weather, germans (had summer clothes and equipments)

- MAYBE: New tech on techtree Skiing. Finland would have it on start (national sport here), [would add 1 movement to infantry on snow, if its possible to make it like that]:

http://www.heritageaspen.org/images/soldier.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/73/Finn_ski_troops.jpg


Intresting links (CHECK THESE OUT!!)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_war

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuation_War



List what troops would Finland have:



-Regular with rifle (strenght 16, movement 1, cost 120, only difference whitesnow uniform) You could also make Ski troops, they would act like infantry II as the regular would be infantry I

http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/1986/talvisoqi5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

-Machine gun (strenght 18, movement 1, cost 140, 50% vs gunpowdr units, would be like normal except white uniform)

http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/5039/winterwarym3.gif (http://imageshack.us)

-Sniper (strenght 15, Movement 1, cost 200, 100% vs infantry, white uniform)

-Gloster Gladiator fighter (UK sold 30 to finland, and South-Africa gave 29 to Finland for free) (strenght 12, movement 6, cost 120)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gloster_Gladiator

Model:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showth...=1#post3820589

-Tankhunter with molotov cocktail and rifle (strenght 14, movement 1, cost 140, 100% vs. tanks, white uniform)

-Bristel Blenheim (strenght 15-20, movement 6, cost 140)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bristol_Blenheim

-Morande-Saulnier M.S. 406 (strenght 15-18, movement 6, cost 130)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morane-Saulnier_M.S.406

-Brewster F2A "Buffalo" (strenght 18,movement 7, cost 150)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brewster_Buffalo

-Messerschmitt Bf 109 (used in Finland 3/1943) (you have allready)

-Regular with Suomi-M-31 SMG(Jäger/machine gunner) (strenght 22, movement 1, cost 160) (like germany's SS, but white uniform and different weapon)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suomi_M-31_SMG

-T-26 Tank (USSR and Finland both used these in winterwar)
(you have the model allready)

http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/8956/finland2ay0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

-Panzer IV (Finland bought 15 of these from Nazi-Germany during world war, thought had no time to use them in continutionwar. Thought i quess model would be allready done. And playing this mod maybe Finland-USSR war isnt over in 1944. Would be available in 1944)

-Sturmgeschütz III (StuG III) (Would be available in 1944. In 1944 the Finnish Army received 59 StuG III from Germany and used them against the Soviet Union. These destroyed at least 87 enemy tanks for a loss of only 8 StuG's)
(You have model of this allready)

-British Vickers E (Finland - used 33 tanks since 1938. They were armed initially with 37 mm Bofors anti-tank gun. They were used in the Winter War with the USSR) (you got this allready)

-Mines and bunkers and the other improvements

-Truck/s (movement 4, cost 120, for moving infantry) I think you have good enough truck in mod so just use the same.

-Submarines and warships(you can use same submarine as germany, and maybe some other ship [destroyer maybe?] )

-Tankhunter with Bazooka (Strenght 15, movement 1, cost 180, 1 first strike, 100% vs tanks. (Germany sell those to finland, white snow-uniform) Germany should have these too!!

http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/5940/4407taliihantalagc8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

-Artillery (the current model: early artillery would work fine)

-Anti-aircraft



PS: You dont need to put all those planes in, only 2-3

And also there are gold in northed finland(Lappi) So put gold there.

Also small information about jägers background, early on Jägers were group of finnish soldiers who were trained on germany and went to partipicate(hard word :D ) world war I. Jägers fighted with Whites on Finland's civil war in 1918(1917 Finland independed) [other side was Red communist's] So they were kind of elite infantry. Now a days basic infantry of Finland's army is called Jäger.

I made this image to easy thinks up with relationships with other civs

http://img128.imageshack.us/img128/6418/suomipa2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


And as for flag, use this one:
http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/6065/finlandflagpb4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

wow :)
thanks it would help a lot with adding Finland :)
and of course i remember you :)

btw if i remeber well you've thought about translating mod to Finnish. Is it actual?

Yeah i asked if i could do it, but i think it would just ruin athmosphere, it sounds cooler in english really :) I updated the big post with few photos and infomation. :P Im bored.

This could also help things up:



Winter war



the Soviet Union attacked Finland on November 30, 1939, three months after the start of World War II. Because the attack was judged completely illegal, the Soviet Union was expelled from the Leagueof Nations on December 14. Soviet leader Josef Stalin had expected to conquer the whole country by the end of 1939, but Finnish resistance frustrated the Soviet forces, who outnumbered the Finns 4:1 in men, 100:1 in tanks and 30:1 in aircraft[3]. Finland held out until March 1940, when a peace treaty was signed ceding about 10% of Finland's territory and 20% of its industrial capacity to the Soviet Union.





Continuation war


War of Continuation, lasting from June 25, 1941, until September 19, 1944, was one of the two wars fought between Finland and the Soviet Union during World War II. Continuation War comes from its relation to the Finnish-Soviet Winter War (1939–1940), as it is seen as a Stalin's attempt to continue his conquest of Finland which was aborted by the end of the Winter War or Finnish revanchist attempt to rectify the result of the Winter War.

Because Finland belonged to the Anti-Comintern Pact and signed other agreements with Germany, Italy and Japan, the Allies characterized Finland as one of the Axis Powers, although the term used in Finland is "co-belligerence with Germany".

There were also small SS-volunteers batallion from Finland. The battalion was made up of 1200 Finnish volunteers who had signed to fight against Soviet Union for two years. The unit lost 255 men killed in action, 686 wounded and 14 missing during its service.The battalion was praised by many Waffen-SS commanders, even Himmler, for its combat performance. Himmler said "Where a Finnish SS-man stood, enemy was always defeated." On top of this, the unit did not commit any war crimes

The United Kingdom declared war on Finland on December 6, 1941, but did not participate actively in the Continuation War. Nazi Germany took part by providing critical material support and military cooperation to the Finnish side. USA did not fight or declare war against either party, but it did provide massive multi-level assistance to the Soviet Union. That help was officially meant for the Soviet war efforts against Germany.

War ended in September 19, 1944.

The formal conclusion for the Continuation War was ratified by the Paris peace treaty of 1947.



"Nobody respects a country with a poor army, but everybody respects a country with a good army. I raise my toast to the Finnish Army."

J. Stalin
1948




And i made this picture to easy things out

http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/9456/warsfk4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Some of the numbers are probably wrong, but you get the picture.^^



Scripts should be like this if you can: (im excepting months change to weeks) Trading means any trading, from open borders to gold.

http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/8457/scriptsgt4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)



And i would rather have Finland just in 1939 scenario not own winterwar scenario, but that's just me :)
And for the space issue-- Take little bit ground from estonia, not mutch but little bit and make the sea little bit smaller but still useable and extend the land of finland little bit. Here's my idea: (It also has the cities i think should be in, at least helsinki, turku, vyaborg/viipuri (historially important) and oulu, tampere would be nice too. they could be small towns like helsinki 2 population, turku 2,oulu 1, viipuri 2, tampere 2 and if you also put vaasa in then 1 . Red spots are cities, red thing going all over finland is cultural borders, or how they should be at least, they are little bit larger than finland in this map, Finland had more territories back then, but we lost them to Soviets.


http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/2822/karttaoq3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


How do you like map by the way :P made in paint

Here are also all the recources in finland up to end of map. You should make some small lakes on middle part of finland near tampere, we have many thousand lakes in here :P

http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/5781/luonnonvaratwk3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

really great!!!

I agree with you makke!

Finland rules

Turkey and Spain are the biggest neutrals in the Europe map. One side persuading one of these would change the course of war drastically. They must be included.

here's my contribution:

Turkey (1939)
Leader: Ismet Inonu (defensive, organized, favors Free Religion)
Civics: Universal Suffrage, Nationhood, Emancipation, State Property, Free Religion
UU: Infantry (just lower the cost), or Suvari (Cavalry plus 1 first strike, starts with Blitz)
UB: Bazaar (Market, can turn 1 more citizen to merchant, +10% culture) or use the good old Ottoman Hamam.
Cities with wonders: Ankara (Palace, National Epic), Istanbul (Hagia Sophia, West Point, Red Cross), Izmir (Temple of Artemis was here), Konya (Hermitage), Canakkale (Heroic Epic), Zonguldak (Iron Works)

Agree^^ It would make scenario intresting if spain would join nazis ect.

Ok this screenshots conveans me much - Japan (i started to work on it) and Finland will appear in patch 1.2b - I have couple other in mind (Spain, Turkey, Australia, Canada) but i won't promiss that they'll be addedin 1.2b - it make take more time :) ok so what more propositions :)

Nice information about Finland. I definitely like to see Yugoslavia in the next patch as it occupies most of the Balkans.

Ok this screenshots conveans me much - Japan (i started to work on it) and Finland will appear in patch 1.2b - I have couple other in mind (Spain, Turkey, Australia, Canada) but i won't promiss that they'll be addedin 1.2b - it make take more time :) ok so what more propositions :)

From current scenarios i like 1939 scenario most. Spain and Turkey would be big + on that scenario :) What will be in patch 1.1b??

yup ans Spain and Turkey makes me rember of this great scenario in Civ2 :)

In patch
- mostly fixes of annoying, critical bugs and other minor bugs posted for the last month (the full list i'll publish with patch)
- changed Dale's Range bombardment Mod and Missiles Mod implemented
- few new graphics and animated missiles and few air units
- completly rebalanced buildings and wonders - now it's made much more logicly and historicly, and it's balanced better.
- Atom bomb test site and hydrogen bomb test sites are now projects - and need much effort to construct nuclear weapons
- newest versions of scenarios.
- starting of reediting some sounds and textures, and models to keep the memory requirements down and run game faster

I wrote something about 1939 scenario remember it's just my opinion :) :

the USSR is brilliantly made in 1939 scenario! It's great that in beginning they are quite **** and get -43 (or something) wealth per round, but once the workers have done their jobs it's best civilization in scenario! I played with France on noble, i conquert italian cities in africa and had big advantage. USSR was really small in scores at first but by the end of scenario they were leading other nations by 500-scores! That's really cool in fun way and historially accurete way.

Also i think USA is nicely done, since they only have 2 cities but still they affect a lot when they declare war, mostly because of their warships.

But i seriously think France is little bit too strong, well they are under attack by italy and Nazi-Germany.. but i played with France, i lost 2 cities(lyons and other one north from lyons) but i kept everything else from France(mostly because of my foreign legions send from north-africa via transport ships) I also conquert 2 cities from Italy in North-Africa. And i trained workers there and then i got massive advantage with oil,copper,iron and other stuff. It's really fun and it gives purpose to conquer Africa yes, but i think France has too many troops there. They should have ½ less troops there. Italian cities in Africa had no chance against my troops there(well im fairly good player but still) Also Germany should have little bit more desert troops in Africa than they have now.

UK is also little bit too strong at start. Reduce their strenght little bit. Since Germany was only scenario which knew about war before it happend so they had time to prepare on war. They should be much better militarilly than others at start. Poland is also little bit too strong, not much but still i think they should be reduced little bit.

This is my 1 to 10 review of accurate strenght from all current nations.

Germany

Number 10

-They are as strong as they should be in means of game, but still they're not too good which is nice thing

United Kingdom

Number 8

-They are little bit too strong at start, UK kind of had "golden age" in ww2 but they were not nearly as massive at start as they were in end of war

USSR

Number 10

-I love the fact that they suck little bit on start since their territories are not improved, but once improvements have been done they are best country.

Poland

Number 9

-They are little bit too strong but that dosent have too much effect but still their strenght should be reduced little.

France

Number 7

-They are too strong. In France they are nicely accurate. Only thing bothering me is their stenght in Africa. Reduce the Africa troops little bit and it's perfect IMO.

Italy

Number 9

-They are pretty close accurate, they should maybe have little bit more strenght, not much by any means but still.

Neutrals

-Well they are neutrals so i can't compare to anything.



I hope you agree that little criticism is for good. :) Over all amazing work so far.

Also i just remembered that U.N sucks! Germany had to change their civics and it messed whole idea of the big bad nazi threat. :P Is it possible to remove U.N completely from mod? It sucks ass..

Thx for posting this ideas - hmm many ppl talks that Germany is to strong and conquer with germany to easily, and playing with ussr is insane cause theire economy sucks - hovewer kodzi tried to make it historicly accurate and make russian economy in troubles, and germany enough strong to start the war. :) and i like that idea that playing different countries you need to focus on different problems, strategies :)

I removed LON the ability to mess up diplomacy and civic - as we know it LON was good in chatting not solving problems and keepinng peace on earth - weak Joseph Avenol was the best example how LON also week could be.

Hovever I left diplomatic vicotry - i left United Nations as wonder that could be build with discovering color television (i didn't knew where to put it so suggested by firaxis mass media i've put this there) - it takes some time to reach that tech

I think Germany should be strong. It's still not too easy with Germany at least if you play with noble. League of nations = LON? I don't like diplomatic victory ether. But maybe that's just me :)

Edit: You should use this in background music when talking to Finland's leader C.G.E. Mannerheim. It's famous Finnish anthem it's played in march's and stuff.
http://download.yousendit.com/D83F3BF144592673

I made this skin to ease your job, if you like it let me know so i will upload it.

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/616/ounaa4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

It's really simple re-skin. It's based on this pic here and other pic i found(i lost url)

http://www.mannerheim-line.com/pictures/fire-ice17.JPG

I upgraded skin little bit :)

hmm i think he's to white, but send me this or better upload on cfc :)

hmm i think he's to white, but send me this or better upload on cfc :)

I'll change uniform colour little bit i'll update link here soon. :)


Edit: The uniform was supposed to be as much snow colour as possible, but i darkener it little bit, but it shouldnt be grey ether. Feel free to modify it if you want. :) But if you do try keeping the uniform still white, not grey. I decided to give him mustache so he wouldnt look too mutch like Waffen SS looks from face in mod. All the changes i did: Modified: skin color(it was too dark for finnish), uniform,helmet,shoes,hand(gloves),small face details, and other stuff. It's nothing too fancy or anything. It's simple re-skin for infantry.

Here:

http://download.yousendit.com/8EFD649A342FE345

Thank you :)
I'll put on him a litle bit dirt and shadows but he looks good now. Thx :)

I'm also working on Panzer IV re-skin with Finnish flag on side, but im not sure if it becomes good enough for mod :P (Im n00b on skinning)

This is really difficult. Nice job Makke in giving all that info on Finland by the way. I am only interested in a European theater situation as I think the World Wide Mode is impossible to create in anyway that is particularly interesting to play or have any historical feel.

So for the Europeans I try to think of it from the German perspective as to what countries helped or hindered their situation. Since for Allies the production and manpower of UK, then USSR, and later USA was so massive that other allies contributes can easily be abstracted for the purposes of game play. Please don't get mad at me if you are a fan of other allies this is purely a game play issue - in the real war every contribution certainly counted.

So if we look at this from a Sep. 1939 start it seems the Benelux must be seperate - since it is unreasonable for Germans to attack it and get enemies all over the place as it is now. Obiously the odds are going to get wiped out quickly but they are still needed to force the Germans into a difficult but not crazy choice.

If you take my suggestion of having commodities such as Coal I and Coal II and Steel I and Steel II, and most importantly Oil I, II, III, and IV then several other countries can be introduced that would make things for realistic.

For example Germany could have Steel I but not Steel II and Steel II would be pocessed in USA, UK (representing off map colonial/ally contributions), USSR, and Norway and maybe Sweden. This would give Germany a reason to attack Norway similar to the actual reasons of the war along with Naval advantages. So if that is the case possibly a Norway/Denmark combo nation and a seperate Sweden.

In terms of Oil I would give Germany and Italy Oil I and all other majors. Oil II would be in USA, UK (representing off map and or middle east), USSR, and most importantly Romania - giving Germany a strong need to ally with Romania or take the middle east for that commodity. Oil III would be in deep middle east on the map (maybe modern Saudi arabia, and/or Iraq, and/or Iran) forcing Germany to conquer a lot to get them. Oil III would also be in a couple locations in USSR giving Germany strong reason to take key areas of USSR. USA would also have Oil III. Finally Oil IV would only be for USA maybe to give special building or some other nice bonus to represent the massive production advantages they developed. This could easily start as undeveloped at the start of the scenario to represent ramp up times or require research to develop.

My suggestion was to have these level not exclude building certain unit - i.e. if you only had oil I you could build most unit but you would need higher oil levels to build certain building such as a tank factory to represent the ability to suport such large oil burning forces. Same would go with Steel and Coal.

So Romania strikes as key to have in this situation.

Finland was an important ally of German and a real pain for the USSR so I would include them.

Sweden is interesting question. For game purposes it might be good to add a new religion maybe called True Nuetral that might include Sweden, Switzerland, maybe even Portugal, and Ireland - anywhere that would cost Germany a lot diplomatically to attack - so if Germany wanted Sweden thay would suffer the penalty of having to deal with a heavily defended Switzerland as well as support from other areas such as Portugal to simulate the problems of the time of attacking Sweden. So I would suggest no seperate Sweden but this special True Nuetral nation. I appologize to all my relatives in Sweden :) What ever Sweden's status some strong defense should be in place that does not easily convert to strong offence.

This reminds me that something like a Fort unit (like machine gun but much more powerful) should be created to similate defense in Maginot line, Switzerland, Sweden, and elsewhere. Maybe this could be done by having it be a very late tech but having the unit exist in several locals at the start of the game like Kodzi did with the Inf IV in Switzerland on the 39 Scenario.

Hungary might be included as part of Romania (maybe Bulgaria too) simply to keep number of Nations down.

Spain is a good on to have but must be set up in such a way that it will take some serious effeort to get into the war other than outride attack by someone else.

Greece would be a nice Seperate because it was so difficult as would be Yugoslavia.

Turkey also was a key neutral and could be seperate or possibly included in that True Nuetral group I suggested although this would have to be watched for play balance so that it didnot actually become more desireable for Germany to attack Sweden etc.

These would be my suggestion for best countries to add to game play and historical feel.

I of course want to add lots of countries and I do have a pretty powerful Core2 Duo with 2GB Ram and top notch Graphics card ( I got it as partial payment for a networking job I subcontracted with local computer company) - but since I previously had medium level machine and most folks still have such machines I would suggest trying to restrict nations to absolutly most necessary ones.

Ok this screenshots conveans me much - Japan (i started to work on it) and Finland will appear in patch 1.2b - I have couple other in mind (Spain, Turkey, Australia, Canada) but i won't promiss that they'll be addedin 1.2b - it make take more time :) ok so what more propositions :)

Just a suggestion by a Noob, but if you are going to put in Japan, you should make sure to give them the best Navy. The Imperial Navy was no doubt the best Navy at the beginning of the War. No doubt an advanced fleet. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_Japanese_Navy#World_War_II)

Bonzootoo i loved the oil I, oil II and so on- idea. There should be best Oil III(or IV) in Africa, that would give Italy and Germany reason to conquer Africa. And that would make game a lot more interesting. And yes i think Norway/Denmark combo is good idea, but i think Sweden should just belong to neutrals, since Sweden didnt have anything to do with war and they don't really have anything too intresting that Norway dosen't have. Here's pic from all the countries i think there should be and how they should be in start of the 1939 scenario (some countries are little big different than they were at the time example USSR has Estonia and ect.) :

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/9549/omgkonguv8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


Overall 15: Germany,France,Poland,UK,USSR,Finland,Italy, Romania&Hungary,Norway&Denmark,USA,Japan, Creece,Turkey,Spain,Neutrals. This would be perfect number IMO.

Edit: I forgot to add UK's, France's and Italy's territories in Africa into the map. North Ireland belongs to UK too.. I kind of rushed making the map so it has some small mistakes :P

Also if it is possible i think that Neutrals must be un-playable for Human players. It would be stupid if you would play with neutral countries and they are so disconnected from each others that it wouldnt make sence.

Also if it is possible i think that Neutrals must be un-playable for Human players. It would be stupid if you would play with neutral countries and they are so disconnected from each others that it wouldnt make sence.

No way... I love playing neutrals in ww2 scenarios and watch the show while I build-up. Then I join the war at the opportune moment.

Well, at least someone likes that :P I just dosent like the idea but that's just me :) It should stay as playable as long as anyone wants then.

Today when i played with USA in 1939 scenario i noticed that i was wrong earlier, Italy is too strong, and Poland is too weak, this time when i played, Poland was destroyed in few rounds, omg. But i still think Germany shouldnt be changed in strenght, Poland just should be given more troops. I've now played with all civs, except Neutrals and Poland. Next i'll play with Poland :)

Italy is much too strong, but Poland isn't too weak- in real life Poland have lost after the first month...

Yeah but in game it's stupid if they don't stand a chance. They need to be little bit stronger in my opinion. But it still should be quite easy to conquer Poland with Nazi's but not that easy as it is in game now.

Ah, you meant those neutrals... I was talking about big ones like Turkey, Spain, or Sweden. For some reason I coudn't see the map before - crappy connection I guess.

The bunch of disconnected unplayable mini neutrals should be simulated as Barbarian cities in my opinion. If you roll them into a "neutrals" civ, when Germany blitzes Netherlands and Belgium, the other neutrals would declare war, which is unrealistic. You can also include the baltic states as neutrals too.

And Sweden is too strong to ignore, and Norway+Denmark is not. So Sweden could be in, and Norway+Denmark can be out. I also don't see the point of discarding the baltic states.

Bulgaria was in the war, shouldn't be neutral. I think Bulgaria should be grouped with Hungary and Romania as the "Axis satellites on Danube" or something like that.

You also need Yugoslavia, which is huge.

This gives 15:
Germany, France, Poland, UK, USSR, Finland, Italy, Danube (Slovakia+Hungary+Romania+Bulgaria), Sweden, USA, Japan, Yugoslavia, Greece, Turkey, Spain, Barbarians (Ireland, Norway, Denmark, Iceland, Switzerland, Baltics, Portugal).

If 18 is ok, then Danube can be divided into Slovakia+Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria; and Norway+Denmark+Iceland can be a civ.

I somehow managed to forget Bulgary was in ww2 :P

I disagree about Norway+Denmark, i think it's good idea to have them together and as their own civ. But i agree with Danube idea(Slovakia,Hungary,Romania,Bulgaria). I don't see point with "Barbarians", atleast you can negotiate with Neutrals. Neutrals is better idea IMO. Sweden should be in Neutrals, just to keep number of civs low. Atleast i rather have Spain,Turkey or Greece instead of Sweden(thought maybe 1 more civ dosent slow too much, so include Sweden if you want :) )

In my opinion: Germany,France,Poland,UK,USSR,Finland,Italy,
Norway&Denmark,USA,Japan,Greece,Turkey,Spain,Neutrals(Swe den Included),Danube(good idea knigh+)


18civs start to be too much.. atleast for my comp :D(i have **** computer, currently 1939 scenario works perfectly :) )

Edit: Now that im starting to think, maybe there should be 2 neutral sides. And they should be split by geographical positions. Like "northern and eastern neutrals"(sweden,estonia,lithuania ect.) and "other neutrals"(Switzerland,Netherlands,Belgium,Portugal ect.) Then when you want to conquer i.e. Netherlands you dont get to war with Sweden. It would make sence :D But im still in for the idea of Not being able to play with "Neutrals", but if anyone wants to be able to play with them that should be left being possible.

Edit2: So: Germany,France,Poland,UK,USSR,Finland,Italy,
Norway&Denmark,USA,Japan,Greece,Turkey,Spain,Neutrals1,Ne utrals2,Danube(good idea knigh+)

Edit: Now that im starting to think, maybe there should be 2 neutral sides. And they should be split by geographical positions. Like "northern and eastern neutrals"(sweden,estonia,lithuania ect.) and "other neutrals"(Switzerland,Netherlands,Belgium,Portugal ect.) Then when you want to conquer i.e. Netherlands you dont get to war with Sweden. It would make sence :D But im still in for the idea of Not being able to play with "Neutrals", but if anyone wants to be able to play with them that should be left being possible.

Well, then you still have Portugal and Switzerland fighting Germany because of Netherlands, and Sweden fighting USSR because of Baltics.

Netherlands, Belgium, and the Baltics were in WW2 from very early, so why are they even in the neutrals?

How about this: Give control of Netherlands&Belgium to France (historically Germany took out all three of these countries in one operation anyway); Give Lithuania and Latvia to Poland; Give Estonia to Finland (This way all the baltics are controlled by countries USSR aims to invade. Estonia to Finland due to relative similarity from ethnic/linguistic angles I suppose). Then you have the rest of the neutrals (Switzerland, Portugal, Ireland, Sweden - if not separate) being composed of the small countries that were neutral in WW2.

edit: I still say Yugoslavia - unless you intend to merge it with Greece and label it...I don't know what.

It kind of brakes the idea if Estonia will be given to Finland, since USSR got Estonia but not Finland. Maybe Estonia should just be part of USSR from the start. But anyway your idea might be more logical than mine. =)

Edit: Still Neutrals1,Neutrals2 is more logical than just one Neutrals. :P

It kind of brakes the idea if Estonia will be given to Finland, since USSR got Estonia but not Finland. Maybe Estonia should just be part of USSR from the start. But anyway your idea might be more logical than mine. =)

all 3 Baltics to Poland then

Edit: Still Neutrals1,Neutrals2 is more logical than just one Neutrals. :P

The more the merrier (and slower?)
The small neutrals aren't even worth interacting, they are there for completeness. I think it would be easier on the computers to have them as totally defensive barbarians

Yeah but in game it's stupid if they don't stand a chance. They need to be little bit stronger in my opinion. But it still should be quite easy to conquer Poland with Nazi's but not that easy as it is in game now.

If you're playing as a Nazi- weak Poland is OK. If you're playing as a Poland- you have to be a hero to not be eaten- and it's OK too...

Also if it is possible i think that Neutrals must be un-playable for Human players. It would be stupid if you would play with neutral countries and they are so disconnected from each others that it wouldnt make sence.


Makke, thanks for the comments. Although I agree that it is very unhistorical to play the neutrals since they can do all sorts of things with a human player that would not be possible reality. Since each of these little nations could not afford to risk a major city etc. But I think it is fine if a player wants to play them for the fun. Maybe a mention in the intro that playing will often lead to unlikely real world results.

The more the merrier (and slower?)
The small neutrals aren't even worth interacting, they are there for completeness. I think it would be easier on the computers to have them as totally defensive barbarians

Maybe we should just have small neutrals(Estonia,lithuania,Switzerland ect.) as Barbarians then.

But still what are we going to do with bigger neutrals(i.e. Sweden) are they going to be barabarians too(that would be stupid imo) or are they going to appear in the mod as their own civ?

I think Netherlands and Belgium shouldn't be given to France. Since they are like small shield to France and i loved when i played with France that Germany had only one spot in the map where they could go to my territories without having to fight their way in (or they would have to go round throught Italy. So maybe they will be Barbarians too?

Maybe Sweden should have their own spot in the mod afterall, they would be big neutrals like Spain,Turkey,Greece who all have their own spot.

Yugoslavia should be their own country maybe too

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/f/f5/LocationYugoslavia.png/200px-LocationYugoslavia.png

http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/europe/fm_yugoslavia_rel96.jpg

Ireland should probably just belong to UK IMO.

So list would be:

Germany, France, Poland, UK, USSR, Finland, Italy, Danube (Slovakia+Hungary+Romania+Bulgaria), Sweden, Norway+Denmark, USA, Japan, Yugoslavia, Greece, Turkey, Spain, Barbarians (Iceland(if it's in map), Switzerland, Baltics, Portugal,Belgium,Netherlands)

Overall 16civs + barbarians




Okey so overall we decided in this page that(?):

-Small neutralcountries(i.e. Switzerland,Estonia,Lithuania,Latvia ect.) should appear as totally defending Barbarian states
-Sweden should also have their own spot in the mod
-Poland is weak enough and their strenght shouldn't be changed
-Italy is little bit too strong
-Danube country would be good idea(Slovakia,Hungary,Bulgary,Romania good idea by Knigh+)
-Oil I,Oil II, Oil III, Oil IV and Steel I, Steel II and Coal I, Coal II is good idea
-There would be 16civs in map + barbarians: Germany, France, Poland, UK, USSR, Finland, Italy, Danube (Slovakia+Hungary+Romania+Bulgaria), Sweden, Norway+Denmark, USA, Japan, Yugoslavia, Greece, Turkey, Spain, Barbarians (Iceland(if it's in map), Switzerland, Baltics, Portugal,Belgium,Netherlands)



But however it's mod maker's choice :) Afterall they are the ones who decide what's best for the mod and do all the hard work :P

Edit: Is Japan going to appear in 1939 scenario-map? And where? Like USA but in down left corner?

Yep, actually if you check my first post you'll see that my first list included Sweden as a separate civ.

One detail: Iceland belongs to Denmark at the beginning of WW2. So it belongs to the Norway+Denmark group.

I have a question (having never played this scenario, as I don't actually have a civ4 - or time for it): Isn't this a European map? what is Japan doing in the list?

:D Funny you don't own even own civIV and you're helping in a mod :P Yeah it's Europe map but it has small part of northern Africa on it and USA put in left corner of map. Well asioasioasio said that Japan will be in 1.2b so i just respected that on my list, there isnt Iceland on the map currently, but if they include it then it should belong to Norway+Denamark group :) There's a pic of scenarios in main post which is in modpacks forum.

Yup i would switch Japan to Benelux.

The minus of using barbarians foe example for Switzerland is that - they are in war with everyone and they are first to be conquered - so it doesn't work well for all the neutrals (switzerland is best example). - i would keep ireland, switzerland, portugal, and maybe sweeden too as neutrals - and one country

i very like the Danube idea.

I would like to see this way
Germany,France,Poland,UK,USSR,Finland,Italy,
Norway&Denmark,USA, Yugoslawia ,Greece,Turkey,Spain,Neutr als(Sweden Included),Danube, Benelux

Maybe merging Greece (1 city is not much for independent country in civ4) and Yugoslavia - they were attacke in quite the same time (yugoslawia was attacked by germany just after greece fighted bravely against italians)
about Poland - they should have chance to survive when britain and france would strike on the west - phony war was one of the biggest mistake of the west allies (hitler doesn't had strong forces on the west). Also stalin wouldn't eneter poland in 17.09.1939 - so phony war and attack of the soviets bring further defence hopeless. So poland should be able to repeal attack if the france and britain would gain victories on west front

@ Makke
about Panzer IV - wait with repainting - too many uu will slow down game much - so i leave unique repainting for phase 3 (from repainted units i have just IS-2 Pl , T34/85 Pl and Curtiss P40 - it was used from the beginning - i stopped further repainting - probably i would reedit some models to get team collor)

Greece (1 city is not much for independent country in civ4)

How did that happen?.. Your map didn't look that small in here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=210422). I thought you had Athens and Thessaloniki, and I was going to suggest adding Iraklion (which I will anyway).

Yep, consider adding Iraklion on Crete, as Greeks continued to resist from there for a couple of months after they had lost the mainland.

Can someone post a screenshot of Turkey in the beginning. I can then indicate exactly which tile had resources, railroads, etc. If you care for such accuracy that is.

Greece should have like 3-4 cities atleast, if they're in as their own country.

About Sweden, well they are quite big country.. so i dont know. It could be cool if they would be in as their own country, but i dont mind if they are in Neutrals ether. :)


About Finland i changed my mind about some things:


Civics should be: Fascism,Nationalization,Mobilization(instead of free speech),Cooperation,Defensive

Also Finland should have like 4 cities(Helsinki,Turku,Viipuri[vyborg now],Oulu).

And there should be like population of 5 in helsinki, 4 in turku, 4 in Viipuri and 3 in Oulu. :)




BTW: I hope the patch 1.1b comes soon :P

You left out one of the capitals you have Helsinki and Turku but you don´t have Vaasa there

Capital = Pääkaupunki :D (finnish)

I think that if there's Oulu(it's bigger than Vaasa) there's no room for another. And Oulu is more northern than Vaasa so if you think it from gamaplay side it's smarter to add Oulu :) But if there will be more room(take my idea from earlier; "take ground from estonia..") Then Vaasa or Tampere should be 5th city or if we get enough room and stuff then all 6 cities: Helsinki,Turku,Oulu,Viipuri,Vaasa,Tampere. :)

Also there should be some kind of way to move infantry trought northern Finland to norway(would be historially accurate) If there's enough room on map after some fixing that "road" should be added =)

Great job -- I look forward to trying this!

Regarding Switzerland, why not do what was done in the old Avalon Hill boardgame: just make Switzerland impassable mountains? Then you don't have to worry about how to stop the AI from invading it.

Other things I remember from that game, some mentioned above: Spain and Turkey were the key neutrals in terms of size/economy/military. Lumping Latvia/Lithuania/Estonia together makes sense, adding them to Poland does not make sense as their fates were somewhat separate. Lumping Norway with Denmark and/or Sweden isn't historically or strategically accurate. Same for combining anyone with Finland, they had their own unique situation. Lumping Hungary/Rumania/Bulgaria together DOES make a certain amount of sense, I think they all effectively joined the axis as one, they are small, border each other, etc. Greece and Yugoslavia are separate/important. Belgium/Netherlands/Luxemborg because of their size/border makes sense to combine them into one civ.

Depending upon when the scenario starts, Germany absorbed Austria and Czechoslovakia so they need not be separate states. Italy was able to put troops in Albania so that could also be part of Italy to reduce the number of civs.

England was dependent upon its overseas colonies for trade, which is what the uboat menace disrupted, so that would be an important dynamic to include, even if it requires making a 'British colony' civ somewhere to allow the trade and give targets for the uboats.

My list for the '39 scen:

1. Spain
2. Norway
3. Sweden
4. Finland
5. Denmark (probably as part of Norway)
6. Benelux
7. Baltic States
8. Bulgaria
9. Romania as German vassal
10. Hungaryas German vassal
11. Greece
12. Egypt as British vassal
13. Turkey
14. Iraque as British vassal
15. Yugoslawia
16. Lybia as Italian vassal
17. Tunesia as French vassal
18. Algeria as French vassal
19. Arabia
20. Palastine as Arabian vassal or French Vassal to represent the free French.
21. Malta as British vassal
22. Cyprus as British vassal

The Vassal states could also be just cities of the major civ...

As I'm planning to create scens on Trip's huge Europe map and my own, still unfinished, map, these civs would perfectly fit.

@knigh+ i'll post a screenshot of Turkey tomorrow - lately i was to busy to make it :)

@ VeteranLurker Thx for ideas - ok so i would start to keep Greece and Turkey as sepearate countries (i rethink this once again and i agree it's not good idea)

@Hardner I'm glad you'll work on scenario :) more scenarios = more fun :)
I think tha this vassals should be part of countries - i don't see possibility of making Iraq or Malta or Cyprus in near future
Maybe making Hungary Romania and Bulgaria as a one country won't be bad - they joined axis in quite the same time.

But also you can make it as JungleIII made it - just double existing leaderheads before they will be added.

BTW i want to recreate the scenario wich is for vanilla - this in North Africa :)

you might find this usefull.... i can find more for pacific theatre if you want.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/112285/Second_world_war_europe_animation_small.gif

here (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a4/US_landings.jpg) is pacific theatre landings and dates, its not animated, sorry

you can get more WW2 Facts here than you'll know what to do with (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II)

Also I would go ahead and make it possible to do 36 or 50 players... Just make most of the scenario's with less than that.... That way its available but not required. Why not open up the possiblities?

Here are some new civs that I believe should be included:

Europe:
Netherlands
Hungary
Romania
Bulgaria
Finland
Albania
Ireland
Portugal
Spain
Sweden
Turkey
Norway
Yugoslavia
Croatia
Denmark
Sweden

Africa:
Free Egypt???
Liberia

Asia
Tannu Tuva
Japan
Thailand
Iraq
Afghanistan
Republic of China
Oman
Saudi Arabia
Mongolia
Iran
Lebanon

North America:
Canada
Cuba
Mexico
Nicaragua

South America:
Argentina
Brazil
Chile
Colombia
Peru
Venezula

Australia & Oceania:
Australia
New Zealand

That is it really

Too many countries imo. Max 15 so the game is still playable : ) IMO.

I'll let asioX3 speak for all the ones we are inlcuding, but I'll say that some of those you mentioned are already in phase 2 (unreleased as of now), but all of them wont be used for every scenario. Maybe make 1 or 2 scenario's which will have more civs on a global scale, and other scenario's which focus on a smaller area with less civs (i.e. europe, pacific) :)

Too many countries imo. Max 15 so the game is still playable : ) IMO.

I know but just so different scenarios can be made on certain places during the war.

I'll rise limit of playable in scenarios to 36 (tough it would be insane to play such a scenario - it'll slow down much)

@ aman2192 - in the list you proposed there's more nation than both warlords and vanilla have :)

We have now two major problems with adding new nations (the list isn't closed) but i cans say we would go in quantity. And the mayor problems seems in aspect of quality:
- Leaderheads - missing a lot of new LH - and i'm rather poor in reskining and changing LH (I hope FireHazard would find solution how to create completly new LH - that could be useful)
- Lack of models for units (i'm only person that works on models right now :() it takes much time (luckly it gives a lot of fun too)

What do you think of making fake models of LH and units? (firaxis made it - check firaxis' scenarios) So the name would be correct, but the model would be for example of sherman for M3 Grant (of course reskinned in other color - for example desert colors). Some fake models appear even now but they minority. For Hindenburg i would use for example Bismarck.
Adding so much new nations asap would make the mayority of new units and LH with fakes models. So would you like to wait 2-4 months more and have correct models or split WW2 Mod Phase Two into two releases?

why not use a picture insted of lh for now and add real lh later

I need to discus 2D/3D LH with scenario producers what they think about.

Meanwhile i got totally crazy and made a lot of flags - 126 (still in production buttons and finishing teamflags):)
You can easily use other flag in scenario so you can exchange flags (depends what you need for scenario )

And here it's list (all are historical - if somethings wrong with flags of accuracy (for example i notieced that for canada we have been using to modern flag) or one of the flag is missing - let me know)

http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/9616/flags1scryg1.th.jpg (http://img262.imageshack.us/my.php?image=flags1scryg1.jpg)

http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/6386/flags2scrtq2.th.jpg (http://img112.imageshack.us/my.php?image=flags2scrtq2.jpg)

http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/2517/flags3scrxm5.th.jpg (http://img112.imageshack.us/my.php?image=flags3scrxm5.jpg)

I'll publish soon the list of countries that going to the mod - phase two

about pictures vs. leatherheads...

Why don't you leave that for later and make the mod - phase 2, version 0.9 and put it out. While your fans here playtest and see if there is any major problem, you can do the leatherheads. Then LHs and final touches can go into version 1.

about pictures vs. leatherheads...

Why don't you leave that for later and make the mod - phase 2, version 0.9 and put it out. While your fans here playtest and see if there is any major problem, you can do the leatherheads. Then LHs and final touches can go into version 1.

well... if it comes down to that we might. It really up to Asio, but everything else isn't quite ready yet anyhow. :p

EDIT: Very nice flags asio!!!

With my muvee maker i could start working on an .bik movies for anything you might want a movie for.

Yeah very very nice flags = ) I currently have problem's with my PC so i have to re-install windows and empty hard-drive.. So i can't really play anything atm.. It sucks but i hope in 2weeks im able to play again : )

OK i would suggest this new countries

This will appear in phase two:
People's Republic of China
Spanish Republic
Australia
Canada
Commonwealth Of India
Japan
Hungary (or Danube Alliance)
Spanish Nationalists
Finland
Republic Of China
Yugoslavia
Kingdom of Greece
Kingdom of Netherlands (or Benelux Alliance)
Kingdom of Norway
Republic of Turkey
Iran (Persia)
Kingdom of Saudi Arabia
Mexico
Brazil (Latin Alligned Nations)
Portugal

This might appear in phase two
Vichy France
Bulgaria
Romania
Slovakia
Czechoslovakia
Prebaltica
Kingdom Of Danmark
Kingdom Of Sweden

I hope it's great news - cause the number of nations will exceed the number of units that are placed @ warlords

We finally found sollution with Leaderheads - but more info about it soon :)

I thought this thing was on a European map. On even a huge world map many of these nations will end up with 1-2 cities.

If you have a world map, I suggest having all British commonwealth as one civ. That will open up space to separate, for example, Argentina+Chile from rest of SA, because they had better relations with Axis compared to the rest of SA.

It's great news but I think that with so many nations Phase Two will be much slower.

It would depend on scenarios - more nations - more new scenarious could appear :) If scenariow ould have for example five countries it won't slow down game much

About South American Countries / Commonwealth - i make it this way mostly for needs of the 1933 scenario :)

I thought this thing was on a European map. On even a huge world map many of these nations will end up with 1-2 cities.

If you have a world map, I suggest having all British commonwealth as one civ. That will open up space to separate, for example, Argentina+Chile from rest of SA, because they had better relations with Axis compared to the rest of SA.

Most of the scenario's are on a European map. We are planning to add at least 1 more scenario for sure, maybe up to 3 more.

And yes, some nations might be very small and should be (in my opinion) non-playable, but I think it is important that they are represented in the mod, because some of them did play a vital role in WW2. :)

Most of the scenario's will have about the same requirements (slightly higher) than normal warlords, but let it be known, do not even attempt to play the huge map without at least 2GB RAM and 2.8 Ghz processor.

How about replace the gunship with this Sikorsky H-5 (built 1944-1951)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sikorsky_S-51

or maybe Focke Achgelis Fa 223
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focke_Achgelis_Fa_223

I would like to play this mod as Abyssinia and destroy "mighty" Italian Empire :D

Thx for suggestions for the gunship - yes we want to replace this unit - the lack of model for now, but they are on the list.

About abissynia - i thought about it but for now there's no scenario for it - so it's more than probable that they won't appear in next update.

In couple days i'll show almost closed (almost in case for not planned civilization) list of nations that'll appear in phase two.

Abyssinia vs Italy scenario? :rolleyes: That would be great!

Yup it might be fun :)
If someone would like to make it :rolleyes: i would make Abbisynia for mod

Is japan going to be made in depth units and all?

Yup it will have all units unique :) like oother mayor countries - own air units tanks etc

All nations that will appear in next version of mod.

ARGENTINA
AUSTRALIA
BELGIUM
BRAZIL
BULGARIA
CANADA
CHINA_COMMUNIST
CHINA_NATIONALIST
CZECHOSLOVAKIA
DENMARK
EGYPT
ESTONIA
FINLAND
FRANCE
FRANCE_VICHY
GREAT_BRITAIN
GREECE
HOLLAND
HUNGARY
INDIA
IRAQ
ITALY
JAPAN
LEAGUE_OF_NATIONS
LATVIA
LITHUANIA
MEXICO
NORWAY
PERSIA
POLAND
PORTUGAL
REICH
ROMANIA
SAUDI_ARABIA
SLOVAKIA
SOUTH_AFRICA
SOVIET_UNION
SPANISH_NATIONALIST
SPANISH_REPUBLIC
SWEDEN
THAILAND
TURKEY
UNITED_STATES_OF_AMERICA
YUGOSLAVIA

It gives 44 nations - more than Civ4 with all expansions has :).

USA, France, Australia and Germany would have 2 leaders instead 1.

It gives 44 nations - more than Civ4 with all expansions has .

And there is Poland too :P Personally I think that most scenarios have to have small number of nations because of loading times but still that many nations in one mod is wonderful!

:) Yeah - luckly most of moders puts poland to theire mods :)

I agree - some nations would appear only in certain scenarios - i don't see the point to put lithuania estonia and latvia into world scenario even on extra huge map - it would be also performance insane.

But making scenario focusing on certain parts of world - for sure new countries would be useful

Have you ever considered making WW2 1939 modular? so for example if your loading up one of the europe scenario's it would only load up the nations and graphics that are necessary. Not sure if that method would work easily but if it did, it would probably cut load times in half, and also lower the strain on memory very much.

Great work :)

Have you ever considered making WW2 1939 modular? so for example if your loading up one of the europe scenario's it would only load up the nations and graphics that are necessary. Not sure if that method would work easily but if it did, it would probably cut load times in half, and also lower the strain on memory very much.

Great work :)

Yup
BTS work like that :)
And thx for .xml-ing - it's much easier now to add just couple other ocuntries :)

All nations that will appear in next version of mod.

ARGENTINA
AUSTRALIA
BELGIUM
BRAZIL
BULGARIA
CANADA
CHINA_COMMUNIST
CHINA_NATIONALIST
CZECHOSLOVAKIA
DENMARK
EGYPT
ESTONIA
FINLAND
FRANCE
FRANCE_VICHY
GREAT_BRITAIN
GREECE
HOLLAND
HUNGARY
INDIA
IRAQ
ITALY
JAPAN
LEAGUE_OF_NATIONS
LATVIA
LITHUANIA
MEXICO
NORWAY
PERSIA
POLAND
PORTUGAL
REICH
ROMANIA
SAUDI_ARABIA
SLOVAKIA
SOUTH_AFRICA
SOVIET_UNION
SPANISH_NATIONALIST
SPANISH_REPUBLIC
SWEDEN
THAILAND
TURKEY
UNITED_STATES_OF_AMERICA
YUGOSLAVIA

It gives 44 nations - more than Civ4 with all expansions has :).

USA, France, Australia and Germany would have 2 leaders instead 1.

Didn't Britain controll india in world war 2

Didn't Britain controll india in world war 2

Yup that's true - but i think it's good to make india - they already appear in scenarios - making them vassals in scenario is good idea.

Yup that's true - but i think it's good to make india - they already appear in scenarios - making them vassals in scenario is good idea.

India should be a vassal only in biggest scenarios- the less civs means faster game. BTW: in BTS India can be released as a vassal, or not?

Yup it could be released as vassal in scenarios :)
and i agree - it should depend on scenario size :)