Do you approve of the appointment of dutchfire as Elder of our second city?
Yes
No
Abstain



Section 1 – Offices
(...)
Each city will have an Elder. The Elder controls all functions of the city. If a city is founded in mid-term, the Elder will be appointed by the Chieftain. The Elder for the first city will be elected in the first term.
(...)
Section 3 – Confirmations
Any appointment may be challenged by a confirmation poll. If a confirmation poll does not already exist for an appointment, any citizen may create such a poll. This poll must be created within 48 hours of the appointment, and must ask "Do you approve of <description of appointment>", contain only Yes, No and Abstain options, be marked private, single-choice and expire in 2 days. When the poll closes, if the majority of citizens, not including abstain, voted No, the appointment is overturned. Any other result confirms the appointment.

Now for my reasons to post this poll:
Our chieftain ice2k4 has appointed dutchfire as Elder for our second city. It is as quoted above within the powers of our chieftain to do so. However, I would have liked at least a few days prior discussion on the appointment, which did not happen. Since I do not like the procedure that was used I hereby challenge this appointment with this confirmation poll.

At the same time I think dutchfire is a very good choice and vote Yes on this poll.

I voted yes. :D
I would have liked it to be announced earlier too. It had talked about it with Ice during last chat. But the question IMO is not if everything was done perfectly, it's about wether you have a problem with me being Elder or not.

Meh why not. I'll vote yes.

as long as im the elder of the third city... :)

I voted yes.

Best regards,

I think the procedure was fine, if I remember the constitution correctly this is an interim appointment and will be up as an elected office during the next round of elections, appointments are fine for temporary posts, especially with citizens given the option to challenge it with a poll like this.

Plus dutchfire is a good guy, so why slow his rise to power?

I think I announced it at a fair time. Also, Dutchfire was the runner-up in the elder election. If I thought so many people were opposed to him having the elder position, why would so many vote for him?

I think I announced it at a fair time. Also, Dutchfire was the runner-up in the elder election. If I thought so many people were opposed to him having the elder position, why would so many vote for him?

I think Ori just wants a poll to sorta verify Dutchfire is okay with the citizens... not neccisarily as an actual challenge to the appointment... anyway as I understand it, even if dutchfire's appointment is rejected (which I don't anticipate) he can still perform his functions until a decision is reached, ie for this game session.

I believe more discussion should have been required. The second city isn't even existent yet.

i agree with dutchfire being second elder but i dont agree with the WAY he has been apointed.

I think Ori just wants a poll to sorta verify Dutchfire is okay with the citizens... not neccisarily as an actual challenge to the appointment...

Thats right - I think a post with something like "I would like to appoint dutchfire as Elder" somewhere and a wait for two days would have resulted in a lot of posts containing just about this:

:agree:

and all would have been fine. Now I'd like to see this confirmed...

No.

I believe Dutchfire will do an excellent job, but we knew about this city for a while. A call for applicants would have taken a few days, and possible given a new citizen with great ideas their start in the DG.

This vote is not against Dutchfire, but against the (lack of) process.

-- Ravensfire

anyway as I understand it, even if dutchfire's appointment is rejected (which I don't anticipate) he can still perform his functions until a decision is reached, ie for this game session.
That is correct - if an appointment is challenged, the citizen does hold that office, and all rights/responsibilities, until they resign, overthrown, or their appointment overturned via a confirmation poll.

-- Ravensfire

so now can we start the thread for the third city. I'd like to nominate myself. ok, thanks nobody against it? good!

:)

This vote is not against Dutchfire, but against the (lack of) process.Lack of process? I was just following how appointments were made last demogame.

so now can we start the thread for the third city. I'd like to nominate myself. ok, thanks nobody against it? good!

:)

Actually, I think this is a very good idea! We should start a initiative discussion thread about it. I don't know the mechanics of doing such a thing. Maybe because this is the first one I'd like to introduce.
What about when we start building a settler/the elder of a city post an instruction to start building a settler/we are at war and think about keeping a city we start an "election" of the city(ies) next elder(s)? Or, maybe, get an "Elder Pool" from where the Chieftain may "summon" an elder when a city is founded? I understood Ice's move. dutchfire was the runner up on the capital's elder election, so that was the natural choice. Maybe if we turn it official, we won't have problems when it eventually (and will) occurs again.

Sorry if it's not the right place/the right way of doing this. And if it is not, someone please would care to teach me how? :mischief:

We should continue the settlement locations thread to determine where to found the next city.

The traditional process for appointing someone to a new position is for the appointing official to post a request for applications, allow some time to pass for people to apply and for commentary, and then announce the appointment.

The amount of time that wait should be, and whether it should be a required wait or a recommended one, was the biggest legal battle of Civ4DG1. Right now, legally there is no requirement for a wait. It's a matter of following tradition. If someone wants to mandate a specific waiting time, then an initiative would be necessary.