HOF Questions and Answers Thread [Archive] - Civilization Fanatics' Forums

Methos

Apr 13, 2007, 02:55 PM

As you all probably noticed there have been several questions raised lately in the forums regarding how the HoF works. Unfortunately many of these questions are either hard to locate the answers to, either in the forums or on the site, or can't be located at all. I'm working on this being the place for everyone to answer those questions. The problem is, both RL responsibilities and playing [civ4] is getting in the way. I'm hoping that many of you can help me out in expanding on the above FAQ.

Basically what I'm wanting is for those of you interested to ask/answer questions that you feel could be added to the above list. Please state your suggestions in something easy to figure out, such as:

Question: What does HoF mean?

Answer: HoF is an acronym that is used that refers to the Hall of Fame.

Disclaimer: Please note, any suggestions given does not mean that I will include them in the FAQ. If I do include them realize that they may be inserted into the FAQ worded differently than you have stated. Thank you.

Methos

Apr 30, 2007, 02:50 PM

Questions relating to the HoF Mod and the included mods have been added to the FAQ. Unfortunately I still need to complete the descriptions for the Exotic Foreign Advisor, Domestic Advisor, and MapFinder. Format has been changed to make things easier to locate. Items are now put into sections.

I have also included:

Who are the HoF Staff and how do I contact them?

Jump to top of page

KMadCandy

Apr 30, 2007, 04:39 PM

Question, since i only noticed the april 13th post when i read the new april 30th post today: How would you like to receive such suggestions?

Potential Answers: Here in this thread. Perhaps by email. Maybe in another thread created for this purpose to not clutter up this thread or your mailbox.

Disclaimer: I can't read Methos's mind, and do not know his tolerance for clutter ;)

Methos

Apr 30, 2007, 08:34 PM

How would you like to receive such suggestions?

Potential Answers: Here in this thread.

This thread is fine, unless you prefer to email or PM me. By posting in this thread it allows others to expand on the suggestions and/or questions.

Methos

May 19, 2007, 08:19 PM

The FAQ has been updated with this information in reference to MapFinder:

MapFinder
What does MapFinder do?
What do I need to use MapFinder?
How do I install MapFinder?
How do create, save, and view my Maps?
What is the Rules Builder File?
Uh, how do I read the MapFinder screen?

<Jump to the FAQ>

Methos

May 29, 2007, 02:37 PM

I just found something in my opinion very odd in the HoF-table:
I began by looking at one of my games that was worth only 6.8 Points for QM, although being on Immortal.
There are 2 games with the setting "Std Im Diplo Mara" in there.
The best finished 1544AD and mine 1560AD.
The first game gets 64 Points and because mine is the "worse", I got lousy 6.8 Points!
I don't think that is fair and till now I thought your calculation took into account, how close the games are together.
So to get more points for my game, I have to submit a very bad game or wait for someone to do so... I am disappointed about that.

Another thing we discussed some time ago, was an "unofficial" filter "warlords/vanilla". Any news on that?

QScore is derived from BaseQScore, which takes into account the average date of the best dates from each player. The fastest date receives a BaseQScore of 100 and the average date receives a 50. The problem is when a table consists of only two dates.

Take for instance a ficticious table where we have two submissions.
Player X: 1900 AD
Player Y: 1902 AD

The average between those two dates would be 1901 AD. Therefore, even though the two submissions are only 1 turn apart (two years), the BaseQScore each submission would get would be:
1900 AD = 100 points
1902 AD = 10 points

It doesn't matter if player X or Y submits a worse game, as those games wouldn't be taken into account for BaseQScore. You'd have to have another player submit a game to affect BaseQScore.

Airny

May 29, 2007, 08:00 PM

Methos

May 29, 2007, 08:35 PM

You didn't really cheer me up Methos.

I guess that 10 points are also the absolut minimum I would get.
So it wouldn't matter how good my game is. In your example, someone submitting a 2000AD game would still get 10 points, correct?

No, as the parameters used in compiling the BaseQScore would now change. Let me explain. Previously we had this:
Player X: 1900 AD
Player Y: 1902 AD

Therefore the average between the two would be 1901 AD. So player x (1900 AD) would earn 100 points and player y (1902 AD) would earn 10 points. Now let's include your 2000 AD submitted by a third player:
Player X: 1900 AD
Player Y: 1902 AD
Player Z: 2000 AD

Since we have three players with three best dates the average is no longer 1901 AD. The new average is now (1900 + 1902 + 2000)/3, or 1934. Player Y's date of 1902 is above the average date and is now probably sitting somewhere in the 90's. Since the average date is 1934 (50 points), the date that would earn 10 points would not be the 2000 AD, instead it would be 1968. This means player z with his 2000 AD date would earn less than ten points. Does that make more sense? Basically for every submission made by a player who hasn't yet submitted to that specific table the average date will change.

When there are only two submissions to a table the BaseQScore earned by both players will either be 100 or 10, no matter how close or far apart their dates are.

Thrallia

May 30, 2007, 01:18 AM

got it...so the 10 points spot is the date that is exactly as far behind the average date as the fastest date is ahead of the average?

anything farther behind the average than the fastest is ahead of the average gets less than 10 points, and anything between the average and the fastest gets between 50 and 100 points...is that correct?

Methos

May 30, 2007, 04:31 AM

got it...so the 10 points spot is the date that is exactly as far behind the average date as the fastest date is ahead of the average?

Correct.

anything farther behind the average than the fastest is ahead of the average gets less than 10 points, and anything between the average and the fastest gets between 50 and 100 points...is that correct?

Correct.

Maybe this will help...

http://www.civfanatics.net/methos/hof/staff/qscore.png

The above graph is the formula that is used in compiling BaseQScore. As you can see the fastest date would receive 100, the average date (darker line down the middle) coincides with the graph at 50 points. 10 points is the exact distance same distance as 100 points is from 50 points. The farthest point to the right is exactly twice the distance as is between 100 points and 50 points.

dutchfire

May 31, 2007, 02:05 PM

The above graph is the formula

By any chance, do you know the exact mathematical formula? Just interested :D

Methos

May 31, 2007, 02:06 PM

By any chance, do you know the exact mathematical formula? Just interested :D

Yes, I do. ;)

Dystopian

Jun 02, 2007, 10:51 AM

errors:

Warning: ftp_login() expects parameter 1 to be resource, boolean given in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/submit.php on line 196

Warning: ftp_put() expects parameter 1 to be resource, boolean given in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/submit.php on line 197

Warning: ftp_login() expects parameter 1 to be resource, boolean given in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/submit.php on line 200

Warning: ftp_site() expects parameter 1 to be resource, boolean given in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/submit.php on line 201

Warning: ftp_close() expects parameter 1 to be resource, boolean given in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/submit.php on line 204

Warning: ftp_login() expects parameter 1 to be resource, boolean given in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/submit.php on line 196

Warning: ftp_put() expects parameter 1 to be resource, boolean given in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/submit.php on line 197

Warning: ftp_login() expects parameter 1 to be resource, boolean given in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/submit.php on line 200

Warning: ftp_site() expects parameter 1 to be resource, boolean given in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/submit.php on line 201

Warning: ftp_close() expects parameter 1 to be resource, boolean given in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/submit.php on line 204

Warning: rename(./files/unchecked/dystopian1.CivWarlordsSave,./files/unchecked/7569_20105_Dystopian_AD.CivWarlordsSave) [function.rename]: No such file or directory in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/submit.php on line 321
Failed to rename from ./files/unchecked/dystopian1.CivWarlordsSave to ./files/unchecked/7569_20105_Dystopian_AD.CivWarlordsSave

Warning: rename(./files/unchecked/dystopian2.CivWarlordsSave,./files/unchecked/7569_20106_Dystopian_AD.CivWarlordsSave) [function.rename]: No such file or directory in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/submit.php on line 321
Failed to rename from ./files/unchecked/dystopian2.CivWarlordsSave to ./files/unchecked/7569_20106_Dystopian_AD.CivWarlordsSave
Thank you for submitting Dystopian BC-0275.CivWarlordsSave.
Submitted: 2007-06-02 10:47:32

You may verify that your submission was received by checking the submission list.

Denniz

Jun 02, 2007, 10:54 AM

Dianthus

Jun 02, 2007, 12:30 PM

The ftp server has been rebooted, so you should be able to submit now. Anyone care to test it? :)

Dystopian

Jun 02, 2007, 03:14 PM

Works. Thanks.

Methos

Jun 06, 2007, 10:12 AM

I've added the basic Exotic Foreign Advisor information.

dutchfire

Jun 07, 2007, 10:08 AM

Field of View Mod
This mod changes how much of the map is visible on your screen. Best use is probably if you have a monitor with high resolution...like with 1920×1200 resolution you can adjust it so you see twice as much of the map on screen as a 1024x768 monitor, while keeping the same detail on the units and tiles...
Or can zoom out all the way to take empire wide screenshots or zoom all the way in for detailed city or unit screenshots (like make one tile fill entire screen)(Description credited to Gyathaar)

Say, I've got a single player, vanilla game that was started without using the HoF mod. Would it be possible to hook up my HD-ready television to my computer (I've got the equipment to do this, but don't know how it'll work out exactly), load the HoF mod (or only the part with the Field of View mod in it) in my custom assets, change the parameter and my screens resolution to see the (standard sized) map totally while not being zoomed out too much, make a screenshot, save it and upload it on this site?

Thanks in advance!

Edit: I think the fact that Locked Modified Assets is checked would make this impossible, wouldn't it?

Denniz

Jun 07, 2007, 11:24 AM

Say, I've got a single player, vanilla game that was started without using the HoF mod. Would it be possible to hook up my HD-ready television to my computer (I've got the equipment to do this, but don't know how it'll work out exactly), load the HoF mod (or only the part with the Field of View mod in it) in my custom assets, change the parameter and my screens resolution to see the (standard sized) map totally while not being zoomed out too much, make a screenshot, save it and upload it on this site?

Thanks in advance!

Edit: I think the fact that Locked Modified Assets is checked would make this impossible, wouldn't it?Yeah, you have to start a game with the HOF Mod in order to use the mod. Also, the Field of View mod is a SDK-Python hybrid. There is no way to take just a part of it without begging Gathyaar for the C++ code snippet.

All the HOF Mod does is provide a function to dynamically modify the field of view value in memory and save your setting in the HOF's ini file to set it whenever you start or reload a game.

If you wanted to duplicate the effect you could copy the correct XML file to custom assets and modify the field of view value. You would have to exit/restart to tweak the value until it is what you want, but it would work.

Although, the LMA would probably prevent you from using the different custom assets for your current save.

Quintillus

Jun 07, 2007, 10:21 PM

Question: In the Rules/FAQ section of the CivIV HOF, the "Map Settings" section states that:

Each map may only be played through once. Each map must be submitted from the turn after your first victory condition. The following are the legal maptypes:...

What exactly does this mean, and where does it apply? Does it mean each individual map can only be played once? You obviously couldn't get the League of Nations award only playing each map type once.

Methos

Jun 07, 2007, 10:51 PM

What exactly does this mean, and where does it apply? Does it mean each individual map can only be played once? You obviously couldn't get the League of Nations award only playing each map type once.

Not each map type, but each individual map. In other words, when you create a game you can't play that game out and than later reload the 4000 BC save and play it again. You must submit your first attempt at that specific map.

Quintillus

Jun 09, 2007, 01:36 AM

OK, thanks. That makes sense. Time to download the HOF Mod and start working towards victory!

Harbourboy

Jun 13, 2007, 04:07 PM

Any chance that the Gauntlet results table could include the name of the Leader used? It is always interesting to know who managed to get good results WITHOUT using Huayna Capac.

superslug

Jun 13, 2007, 05:10 PM

Any chance that the Gauntlet results table could include the name of the Leader used? It is always interesting to know who managed to get good results WITHOUT using Huayna Capac.
Just click on the game info link. The Civilization played and all AI civs are on the first tab...

Dracandross

Jun 18, 2007, 02:58 AM

Just click on the game info link. The Civilization played and all AI civs are on the first tab...

Well that means a lot of clicking if you want to check them all. As gauntlet table have only name/score/date shown now theres plenty of room for some extra info on the primary table.

ATopic22

Jul 11, 2007, 03:27 PM

I'm new to HOF and I was just wondering what the latest mod i can download is and when it's too late to submit it

ParadigmShifter

Jul 11, 2007, 03:31 PM

You can get the mod from the HOF site (links at top of page). You only have a time limit for Gauntlets btw, and it expires when the notice is posted in the Gauntlet thread.

ATopic22

Jul 11, 2007, 04:00 PM

and when will the new scores be listed

ParadigmShifter

Jul 11, 2007, 04:24 PM

Updates are once a month I think (see dates of HOF update threads). The gauntlet dates are always in the first post of a gauntlet but they overrun a bit sometimes.

Dianthus

Jul 11, 2007, 04:43 PM

Good answering ParadigmShifter!

We actually try to update the Civ4 HOF twice a month. We have dates we aim for, but I'm not sure we should tell you what they are in case you expect us to stick to them :mischief:.

dutchfire

Jul 12, 2007, 06:06 AM

When hovering over the picture of Napoleon in the opponents section (say, for this game (http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/game_info.php?entryID=8168)), it says Napolean (bolding mine).

I know it's a very minor issue, but if you're going to do something about the site anyway, you might want to correct this too :D

IglooDude

Jul 13, 2007, 09:21 AM

dutchfire

Jul 13, 2007, 09:29 AM

Methos

Jul 13, 2007, 10:05 AM

In the HOF, there are blanks in a few of the squares - for example, in Diety there are blanks in the Time victories on Large and Huge maps. Does this mean that anyone actually winning a Time victory (assuming they're running the HOF mod and so on) on a Large Diety map will get into the HOF?

As was already stated, yes. Unfortunately there are still blanks in the tables, though many players are aiming for them to earn the 100 BaseQScore. Hopefully soon we can fill those spots up, so that QScore will average itself out.

Tatran

Jul 15, 2007, 08:41 AM

I've a problem.

Message : "this game isn't valid for HOF use"
But the settings are correct. No matter what kind of start I use
not one is accepted. Any ideas?

Denniz

Jul 15, 2007, 08:53 AM

I've a problem.

Message : "this game isn't valid for HOF use"
But the settings are correct. No matter what kind of start I use
not one is accepted. Any ideas?First thing you should do is go to your Victory screen and look at the Setting tab. That will show more specifically what the problem is.

If it says your assets are different, then will probably need to uninstall and re-install both vanilla and warlords. Make sure you delete anything left behind after the uninstall.

Tatran

Jul 15, 2007, 09:56 AM

Only Warlords re-installing wasn't enough, but it works now.

Thx.

IglooDude

Jul 16, 2007, 07:07 AM

As was already stated, yes. Unfortunately there are still blanks in the tables, though many players are aiming for them to earn the 100 BaseQScore. Hopefully soon we can fill those spots up, so that QScore will average itself out.

Great, thanks. I just submitted a Noble/Normalspeed/Huge/Domination game.

Next question - is it always the final score that determines the best game, or for conquest/domination/space is it the number of turns taken, or some combination?

Edit: and one more question, hopefully not a dorky one - if one has to leave domination wins enabled, how does one win a conquest game, particularly on the larger maps?

dutchfire

Jul 16, 2007, 07:25 AM

Great, thanks. I just submitted a Noble/Normalspeed/Huge/Domination game.

Next question - is it always the final score that determines the best game, or for conquest/domination/space is it the number of turns taken, or some combination?

Edit: and one more question, hopefully not a dorky one - if one has to leave domination wins enabled, how does one win a conquest game, particularly on the larger maps?

1) The fastest win is always best for the normal victory conditions, with score as a tiebreaker. For the score condition, the highest score wins. So to sum it up, you (almost) always need to aim for the fastest win.

2) Avoiding Domination :D Keep your territory under the limit while killing (or vassalizing!!!) everyone. You'll have to raze a lot of cities.

Methos

Jul 16, 2007, 07:48 AM

Next question - is it always the final score that determines the best game, or for conquest/domination/space is it the number of turns taken, or some combination?

Fastest date is the deciding factor in every table except the Score table. As was already mentioned, score is only used to break ties for fastest win dates. The score table is a bit odd, as every game submitted (whether conquest, culture, etc) also is placed on the score table. For instance your [Igloodude] game. After the update if you check the "General" tab on your game, it'll show your ranking on the domination table and your ranking on the score table.

Edit: and one more question, hopefully not a dorky one - if one has to leave domination wins enabled, how does one win a conquest game, particularly on the larger maps?

I would suggest checking out Civ4Alerts (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=213555#Civ4Alerts) which is included in the HOF Mod. The domination warning is very good.

Tatran

Jul 17, 2007, 10:19 AM

Are Fantasy Realm maps not allowed ? (and maybe more map types)

Methos

Jul 17, 2007, 10:30 AM

Are Fantasy Realm maps not allowed ? (and maybe more map types)

They are not allowed. For a list of whether a map is, or isn't allowed, I suggest checking the HOF Rules (http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/rules.php) page. You'll find it almost half way down listed as "Map Settings".

drepsed

Jul 27, 2007, 05:43 PM

Denniz

Jul 27, 2007, 05:47 PM

OK, I usually just play warlords, but decided to try vanilla again. Thus I needed the new mod. I loaded it and started the game. Now I get a message that says:

The assets are different from a standard install. Contact the HOF staff.

Any help? Sorry if this is discussed elsewhere and I missed it...The assets warning means something has been changed in the assets. All I can suggest is unistall, delete anything left, and reinstall/repatch.

drepsed

Jul 27, 2007, 05:53 PM

The assets warning means something has been changed in the assets. All I can suggest is unistall, delete anything left, and reinstall/repatch.

great...and Warlords was working wonderfully...we're sure it is not the new patch before I go through all that trouble?

Denniz

Jul 27, 2007, 06:03 PM

great...and Warlords was working wonderfully...we're sure it is not the new patch before I go through all that trouble?Sorry, I have no way of knowing. If there is a problem with the STEAM patch they need to fix it. If you do the reinstall and make sure you clean up any thing left behind and it doesn't solve the problem then we'll have a better idea.

BTW, are you using Vista? I have been hearing about security setup issues. You might note Bebe post in the HOF Mod Support/Suggestions thread. I don't have any details yet.

drepsed

Jul 27, 2007, 06:42 PM

Sorry, I have no way of knowing. If there is a problem with the STEAM patch they need to fix it. If you do the reinstall and make sure you clean up any thing left behind and it doesn't solve the problem then we'll have a better idea.

BTW, are you using Vista? I have been hearing about security setup issues. You might note Bebe post in the HOF Mod Support/Suggestions thread. I don't have any details yet.

No, no vista...XP...and the reinstall did not work either. :-(

Denniz

Jul 27, 2007, 06:51 PM

No, no vista...XP...and the reinstall did not work either. :-(Something is different. There is no easy way to tell what though. Let's try this:

open a command prompt window and go to your Civ4 install folder.
enter the following command: dir /s assets > assetsfiles.txt
send the assetsfiles.txt file to hof.civfanatics@gmail.com

ATopic22

Jul 27, 2007, 07:00 PM

are you guys going to get hof for bts anytime soon

Denniz

Jul 27, 2007, 07:03 PM

are you guys going to get hof for bts anytime soonyes :mischief:

ATopic22

Jul 27, 2007, 07:08 PM

yes :mischief:

could you tell us a date to expect and can you tell me if the option of choosing any religion will be allowed. I would love it if you guys would let us use the option of being able to choose any religion.

Denniz

Jul 27, 2007, 07:13 PM

could you tell us a date to expect and can you tell me if the option of choosing any religion will be allowed. I would love it if you guys would let us use the option of being able to choose any religion.Sorry, no date. We are thinking choosing religion should be player's option. It is not like there is any difference functionally, is there?

Also, the BTS HOF Mod to signal the beginning of a Beta period for BTS submissions. There is a lot work out with regards to BTS and the HOF.

ATopic22

Jul 27, 2007, 07:44 PM

Sorry, no date. We are thinking choosing religion should be player's option. It is not like there is any difference functionally, is there?

Also, the BTS HOF Mod to signal the beginning of a Beta period for BTS submissions. There is a lot work out with regards to BTS and the HOF.

of course there isnt anything different. thats why i would have been very mad if you didnt let us use it.:lol:

ori

Jul 27, 2007, 08:30 PM

It is not like there is any difference functionally, is there?

Actually there is :smug: Some of the quests can only be triggered if you have a certain state religion... Not that it would be gamebreaking. On the other hand this would only be a concern if you decide to allow random events...

Denniz

Jul 27, 2007, 08:35 PM

Actually there is :smug: Some of the quests can only be triggered if you have a certain state religion... Not that it would be gamebreaking. On the other hand this would only be a concern if you decide to allow random events...And so the debate begins... :mischief: That's why we are going to start out with a BTS Beta. It will give us time to upgrade the HOF Site for BTS and settle what should be legal or not. ;)

ATopic22

Jul 27, 2007, 11:29 PM

And so the debate begins... :mischief: That's why we are going to start out with a BTS Beta. It will give us time to upgrade the HOF Site for BTS and settle what should be legal or not. ;)

i say we should be able to do it because it doesnt make much of a difference and many players are tired of seeing hinduism and budhism, the dominant religions. this will give it more flavour and make games more interesting.

Thrallia

Jul 28, 2007, 03:31 AM

ATopic22

Jul 28, 2007, 12:37 PM

The only big option you shouldnt allow because its gamebreaking is the unrestricted leader option.

azzaman333

Jul 28, 2007, 12:47 PM

Sorry, no date. We are thinking choosing religion should be player's option. It is not like there is any difference functionally, is there?

Also, the BTS HOF Mod to signal the beginning of a Beta period for BTS submissions. There is a lot work out with regards to BTS and the HOF.

Will the beta period for BTS begin at the same time the HOF mod for BTS is released or will there be a period where BTS games can be submitted for beta before the HOF mod is released?

Methos

Jul 28, 2007, 12:49 PM

Will the beta period for BTS begin at the same time the HOF mod for BTS is released or will there be a period where BTS games can be submitted for beta before the HOF mod is released?

The two should go hand in hand. No since in releasing one without the other.

Denniz

Jul 28, 2007, 02:22 PM

I say allow random events :D

None of the events I've gotten so far are anywhere near gamebreaking...misclicking during an invasion has made more of a difference in one of my games than any quests ever did.

The only big option you shouldnt allow because its gamebreaking is the unrestricted leader option.

I have started a thread (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=234335)to discuss BTS Game Options. Please make any comments you care to over there.

superslug

Jul 28, 2007, 03:32 PM

The two should go hand in hand. No since in releasing one without the other.
Well, it might take us a day or so to update the HOF for BTS submissions even after the mod is released.

doriengard

Aug 03, 2007, 11:04 AM

Sorry if this looks like hijacking of the thread, but I have some semi-noob questions.

Can someone please list the details of how to use the MapFinder?

Also, this one is causing folks to restart multiple times? How are you restarting without going back to the main screen and reselecting all the options including opponents, speed, map type, your civ, etc. Do you create a start file somehow?

Thanks

Methos

Aug 03, 2007, 02:59 PM

Can someone please list the details of how to use the MapFinder?

I'd suggest looking at the first post in the Questions/Answers (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=213555) thread.

How are you restarting without going back to the main screen and reselecting all the options including opponents, speed, map type, your civ, etc. Do you create a start file somehow?

If you regenerate the map prior to settling and during the 4000 BC turn, it'll regenerate a new map with the exact settings you used from the Custom Game option.

ori

Aug 03, 2007, 03:06 PM

If you regenerate the map prior to settling and during the 4000 BC turn, it'll regenerate a new map with the exact settings you used from the Custom Game option.
:confused: why prior to settling - it regenerates just fine after settling as well... All it needs to be is 4000BC (actually the start turn). Unless of course it has become illegal for the HOF recently :rolleyes:

Methos

Aug 03, 2007, 03:10 PM

:confused: why prior to settling - it regenerates just fine after settling as well... All it needs to be is 4000BC (actually the start turn).

Really? I didn't realize this. Thanks! :)

ori

Aug 04, 2007, 05:18 AM

Really? I didn't realize this. Thanks! :)
Yes - the only annoying thing is that if you do that the replay will tell you that you founded your capital in 4000BC and then again in 4000BC and then again...:crazyeye:

Misotu

Aug 04, 2007, 08:18 PM

Yeah ... I was really worried the first time I saw that. I thought I'd done something incredibly stupid :crazyeye:

HolyHandGrenade

Aug 09, 2007, 08:35 AM

Yes - the only annoying thing is that if you do that the replay will tell you that you founded your capital in 4000BC and then again in 4000BC and then again...:crazyeye:

... and before starting map-finder you should create one permanent save, so each time map finder cannot regenerate, you load the permanent save and start map finder again ;)

IglooDude

Aug 17, 2007, 10:54 AM

Is the 3.02 HOF mod still legal for submissions? I'm reading above about the 3.03 patch/mod but I'm in the middle of a 3.02 game.

Methos

Aug 17, 2007, 11:20 AM

Is the 3.02 HOF mod still legal for submissions? I'm reading above about the 3.03 patch/mod but I'm in the middle of a 3.02 game.

Yes, it is. We generally continue to accept previous versions of the HOF mod until a full month has passed since the newest version was released. In other words, we'll continue to accept 3.02.001 until around the middle of September.

Thrallia

Aug 19, 2007, 12:44 AM

does 3.03 even do anything worthwhile? I haven't seen any information onw hat it or 3.02 changed/fixed in the game.

Denniz

Aug 19, 2007, 05:32 AM

does 3.03 even do anything worthwhile? I haven't seen any information onw hat it or 3.02 changed/fixed in the game.
I think mainly they fixed some of the install/patch problems that have been driving us all crazy. Plus the Gyathaar fixed several crash bugs for the 3.03.001 HOF Mod that goes with it.

IVIaster

Aug 20, 2007, 04:54 AM

HolyHandGrenade

Aug 20, 2007, 08:16 AM

Denniz

Aug 20, 2007, 12:32 PM

I am not trying activly to get on the Hof, but I would be intrested in watching some sort of replay of what other people have played. I downloaded some of these files(?) but it said "The file you have selected is protected to ensure that the assest in your mod folder have not been changed"

You always have to view the files with the exact hof-mod version this file was created with. So you have to check the appropriate gauntlet first for the version number, download that hof-mod version, install it, and try it again.

The save file should ask to load the HOF Mod version it requires. If you get the "protected" message that means your install Civ4 or HOF Mod doesn't match. Which is usually cause by install mods in the install folders assets (ie. Program Files\...\Assets) sub-folder instead of in My Documents\My games\...\CustomAssets.

Also, for a Vanilla Save file, the download changes it so it asks for the current Vanilla HOF Mod version. That doesn't work for the other versions, though.

de Mott

Aug 21, 2007, 06:12 PM

RL has taken its toll on me lately. I still have two pre-BTS, 2.08.004 HoF Mod games going that I play if time permits. Given the time I have on my hands and that one of the maps is huge in size, I suspect that it may still take over a week for me to finish. I hope that won't pose a problem for a HoF entry.

Thrallia

Aug 21, 2007, 06:32 PM

the only vanilla mods being accepted right now are 1.61.011 and 1.74.001, while for warlords 2.08.004 and 2.13.001 are the only ones being accepted...I believe 2.08.004 will not be eligible anymore at this coming update, although I could be wrong and it will be the following update that will disallow them.

Denniz

Aug 21, 2007, 06:34 PM

RL has taken its toll on me lately. I still have two pre-BTS, 2.04(?) HoF Mod games going that I play if time permits. Given the time I have on my hands and that one of the maps is huge in size, I suspect that it may still take over a week for me to finish. I hope that won't pose a problem for a HoF entry.While the old versions are technically obsolete after the next update, we're flexible. If you started playing before then noone is going to say anything. Good luck with that huge map. ;)

Almond

Sep 02, 2007, 01:53 AM

Harbourboy

Sep 02, 2007, 02:18 AM

Not each map type, just each specific map. The number of maps you can submit is practically infinite (although in theory there must be a limit, it's juts higher than anybody could possibly ever reach).

Denniz

Sep 02, 2007, 06:14 AM

One of the HOF rules says that each map type may only be submitted once. Does this mean that all parameters of the quattromasters rank must be fulfilled with no more than one game of each map type? It seems like it, but I want to be clear.
Harbourboy has right it right. :goodjob:

The idea is to only play each new game only once without reloading/replaying any portion. (Is is okay to save at the end of a play session as long as you continue from that save.)

Welcome to the Hall of Fame. [party] :band:

Almond

Sep 02, 2007, 09:55 PM

Is a "session" the same thing as a turn?

Methos

Sep 02, 2007, 10:35 PM

Is a "session" the same thing as a turn?

No. A session is when you sit down and play for x amount of time. If you sit down and start a new game and don't stop playing until it's finished, that's one session.

Almond

Sep 02, 2007, 11:56 PM

Methos

Sep 03, 2007, 12:15 AM

I just submitted a game for approval, and then I found the "check initial save" page where you check your initial save. When I did this it told me that the map had already been used -> http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/2311/civivmapalreadyusedwx9.jpg

Just to clarify, are you saying you submitted a game and than after submitting it, you tested the starting save for the game you just submitted? If I'm understanding you correctly, than it definitely will fail. Once you submit a game, whether we've checked it or not, it's part of the database and therefore part of the checks on if that map has been used. So basically you were checking the starting save against the very game you submitted.

If I'm in fact wrong in how I interperted your post, than please say so, so that we can work with the issue.

Almond

Sep 03, 2007, 12:17 AM

You read me correctly. I submitted the game, then checked the initial save file (I had just found that feature).

Does that mean that the game will not be accepted?

Methos

Sep 03, 2007, 12:21 AM

You read me correctly. I submitted the game, then checked the initial save file (I had just found that feature).

Does that mean that the game will not be accepted?

No, that particular reason would not cause the game to be rejected. You could check that very start file a hundred times and it wouldn't change anything. All it's there fore is so that players can test their starting save to make sure it falls within the rules prior to spending large amounts of time on their game.

In all honesty, I don't believe that feature is even needed anymore since the HOF Mod now informs you if the game is valid.

Almond

Sep 03, 2007, 12:25 AM

Thanks for the reply. I noticed the HOF warning once, and it is indeed handy. However, would it know if you've submitted that map already? How would it know? Does the HOF mod consult the database that you mentioned before a game starts?

Methos

Sep 03, 2007, 12:34 AM

Does the HOF mod consult the database that you mentioned before a game starts?

No, it does not. To know that you would have to check the save, or just submit and wait for an email from us stating you've already used that map. :D

Almond

Sep 05, 2007, 10:40 PM

Two questions:

1. If I retry a strategy for which I already have a valid HOF entry, can the new try replace the old one if there's a higher score?

2. Can one game fulfill multiple HOF requirements? For example, if I win a conquest on a dual map with Hayuana Capac, does that one game fulfill the Quattromasters requirements for the dual map portion of the map quest requirement, the conquest victory of the machiavelli requirement, AND the League of Nations requirment for Inca?

Methos

Sep 05, 2007, 10:45 PM

1. If I retry a strategy for which I already have a valid HOF entry, can the new try replace the old one if there's a higher score?

Yes, so long as its done with a different map. You cannot play a map twice, even if you are trying a different strategy. You can make as many attempts as you want (with a new map) for any specific table and/or gauntlet. The submission with the fastest date will be used for consideration of placement on the tables.

2. Can one game fulfill multiple HOF requirements? For example, if I win a conquest on a dual map with Hayuana Capac, does that one game fulfill the Quattromasters requirements for the dual map portion of the map quest requirement, the conquest victory of the machiavelli requirement, AND the League of Nations requirment for Inca?

Yes, each game can fulfill multiple requirements.

Almond

Sep 05, 2007, 11:55 PM

Why is date used instead of Q score?

Methos

Sep 06, 2007, 12:09 AM

Why is date used instead of Q score?

One, HOF is designed around the fastest date to achieve a victory. Two, QScore is compiled based off of the date.

Conquistador 63

Sep 12, 2007, 08:52 AM

HOF noob question:
Is it OK to play a session, save it, and later open it, give it a look (no moves, etc.) and quit without saving to resume playing later? I know it is fine in GOTM but have read elsewhere (can't remember where) it could not be acceptable in HOF games.

I ask because I have 2 ongoing games for Gminor27 (BC years) and would like to compare my stats/status in them to choose the better one to keep playing.

azzaman333

Sep 12, 2007, 11:58 AM

I'd just play out both and see which comes up with a better date. A lot can happen between BC and Space.

However, I'm 95% sure that is legal, provided no moves are made as they would potentially give an advantage by knowing what the effect of X action is.

Conquistador 63

Sep 12, 2007, 12:57 PM

Yes I thought so, until I read this post from a previous GMajor thread.

Gray Cardinal played small settler for HOF and finished his game before 800BC.
But there was marathon speed. Unfortunately his game was declined because of GC open one intermediate save more than one time. We did so as we played last SGOTM and there were no problems. But for HOF game this action is prohibited :( So you can not see one of the best game in the HOF table.

bshumbera

Sep 12, 2007, 01:31 PM

Couldn't you just open it and resave it under a different name, and then play from the resave?

Methos

Sep 12, 2007, 02:49 PM

Couldn't you just open it and resave it under a different name, and then play from the resave?

This is probably the safest course of action. Looking at the save is fine, so long as you make no moves or any unchangeable actions, but sometimes its just safer to save it just in case.

Almond

Sep 14, 2007, 05:45 PM

In quattromasters, what is the difference between a score victory and a time victory?

Denniz

Sep 14, 2007, 08:22 PM

In quattromasters, what is the difference between a score victory and a time victory?Score can be any victory condition.

Almond

Sep 14, 2007, 09:08 PM

Score can be any victory condition.

So it's like a freebee? Our highest score is counted for score as well as the other victory condition that it fulfills?

Denniz

Sep 15, 2007, 05:42 AM

So it's like a freebee? Our highest score is counted for score as well as the other victory condition that it fulfills?Basically, although, the highest scores don't always come from the best dates. Maybe for Conquest or Domination.

Conquistador 63

Oct 19, 2007, 12:39 PM

Is it ok to play a map/game until some point, then decide to trash it, reload the starting save and regenerate a map, just to avoid configuring the custom game parameters from the main menus?

It seemed pretty obvious to me this isn't a problem. But having done it once in a continents map I found it funny that I had the same 3 out of 8 predefined AI's in the starting landmass in both runs. I assume this event was just random luck, but I thought I should ask here just in case.

Methos

Oct 19, 2007, 01:00 PM

Is it ok to play a map/game until some point, then decide to trash it, reload the starting save and regenerate a map, just to avoid configuring the custom game parameters from the main menus?

Yes it's okay and is something that many of us do. To be honest, I usually create one save that I either regenerate from, or use for MapFinder purposes. Just make sure you never play that one save more than once.

HangingChadDad

Oct 28, 2007, 08:31 AM

First thing you should do is go to your Victory screen and look at the Setting tab. That will show more specifically what the problem is.

If it says your assets are different, then will probably need to uninstall and re-install both vanilla and warlords. Make sure you delete anything left behind after the uninstall.

Well thanks to this thread (I kept looking for "Victory Conditions" on the HOF website, not in my game.. duh) I finally found that my problem was with modified assets. You suggest above that this requires re-install of the game to correct.. This seems completely rediculous on first thought. I did an absolutely standard install, no mods etc other than the patch 1.74 and the HOF mod 1.74.001. How did my asets get configured WRONG to start with.. and why would I expect the condition to change when I re-install?

ori

Oct 28, 2007, 09:31 AM

azzaman333

Oct 28, 2007, 09:37 AM

Replacing the new CvGameCore.dlls with the old ones seems to have no side effects in BtS and allows Warlords and Vanilla to be compatible.

HangingChadDad

Oct 28, 2007, 11:05 AM

Do you have Beyond the Sword installed?

No.. Its a plain vanilla install with no expansion packs .. sorry.,.. thought that was clear from the above, but since i don't have the expansions, I really don't know.. :)

Denniz

Oct 29, 2007, 05:52 AM

Well thanks to this thread (I kept looking for "Victory Conditions" on the HOF website, not in my game.. duh) I finally found that my problem was with modified assets. You suggest above that this requires re-install of the game to correct.. This seems completely rediculous on first thought. I did an absolutely standard install, no mods etc other than the patch 1.74 and the HOF mod 1.74.001. How did my asets get configured WRONG to start with.. and why would I expect the condition to change when I re-install?Since we don't know the details of your installation, all we can do is give you general advice that has worked for people in the past.

Deleting anything left behind between uninstall and reinstall is the key as that makes sure anything that might be causing a problem is cleaned.

HangingChadDad

Oct 29, 2007, 01:00 PM

Denniz

Oct 29, 2007, 05:15 PM

Well, ignorance forces superstitious solutions. Let me rephrase the question. What sets the "asset modification" flags? I find no mention of it in anything but HOF. Does some version of Civ4 have a .ini entry or an initialization flag for this asset status? Can someone tell me what it even is?.. that is what ingame result occurs based on the 2 states of the assets? Is it an element of the multiplayer games? ThanksCiv4 uses a CRC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyclic_redundancy_check) algorithm to create a checksum match the contents of the assets folder in the Civ4 Install directory will values in the save file. This is the basis of the their "Protected Assets" checks. It is controlled by the "Lock Modified Assets" Game Option, which is a required setting for the HOF for that reason. The HOF Mod's Assets folder is also checked. (I assume that Civ4 does that automatically too.)

If you change a file, add a file or delete a file, then it won't match the expected values we capture when we create the HOF Mod.

The only known/outstanding issues that I am aware of that can get you that error message:

Gold edition
STEAM purchased
BTS patch 3.13

Since you have said you have a regular version of Vanilla Civ4, we know those are not involved. That leaves a install/patch problem or something changed in your assets. The only other thing I can think of is not installing/running Civ4 with Admin rights.

HangingChadDad

Oct 30, 2007, 10:01 AM

ori

Oct 30, 2007, 10:05 AM

Ok, I took the advice. Used Control Panel (I have Win XP Pro sp2) and uninstalled Civ4. Then deleted all folders remaining in the install directory including the install folder itself. I installed direct from the plain vanilla Civ4 2CD install set... used the "get updates" from the "advanced" heading and dl'd/ installed patch 1.74.. then installed the 1.74.001 patch from the civfanatics Civ4 plain vanilla HOF section. When I start the game, then used advanced to "add mod" for 1.74.001 and restart and "create new" game and get to the 1st move I still get the "locked assets" error warning that the game is not valid for HOF.. Now what?

BTW both this time and the last I cannot get the modified shortcut with mods=\HOF-1.74-001 added to the target technique to work for starting the game with the mod added.. only way I can get it to start with the mod is to either do the double start thing or modify the .ini file. I don't believe the modified shortcut target method works unless I am completely missing the syntax somehow.. I followed the directions to the letter and triple checked it to keep trying to get it to work.
This sounds like you are using "Play Now" for the new game, unfortunately this is not possible since you need to check the "Lock Modified Assets" Option which you can only do if you start a "Custom Game".
Edit the shortcut needs to read:
mod= Mods\HOF-1.74.001
the space between = and the Mods is necessary.

Denniz

Oct 30, 2007, 10:23 AM

Ok, I took the advice. Used Control Panel (I have Win XP Pro sp2) and uninstalled Civ4. Then deleted all folders remaining in the install directory including the install folder itself. I installed direct from the plain vanilla Civ4 2CD install set... used the "get updates" from the "advanced" heading and dl'd/ installed patch 1.74.. then installed the 1.74.001 patch from the civfanatics Civ4 plain vanilla HOF section. When I start the game, then used advanced to "add mod" for 1.74.001 and restart and "create new" game and get to the 1st move I still get the "locked assets" error warning that the game is not valid for HOF.. Now what?

BTW both this time and the last I cannot get the modified shortcut with mods=\HOF-1.74-001 added to the target technique to work for starting the game with the mod added.. only way I can get it to start with the mod is to either do the double start thing or modify the .ini file. I don't believe the modified shortcut target method works unless I am completely missing the syntax somehow.. I followed the directions to the letter and triple checked it to keep trying to get it to work.

This sounds like you are using "Play Now" for the new game, unfortunately this is not possible since you need to check the "Lock Modified Assets" Option which you can only do if you start a "Custom Game".
Edit the shortcut needs to read:
mod= Mods\HOF-1.74.001
the space between = and the Mods is necessary.
Yeah, a message about "locked assets" is different than the "assets different". If you are getting both messages than checking "Locked Modified Assets" in the Custom Game screen should clear it. LMA is required for the CRCs to be generated.

HangingChadDad

Oct 30, 2007, 12:55 PM

Hmm.. it seems that the "custom game" requirement is not clear on the pages defining the HOF.. I thought I read it fairly thoroughly but never caught that. If it is I apologize.. so much for re-installing the game and all that ...

The instructions on this page here (http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/mod.php) don't have the space.. perhaps that should have someone edit it.

Thanks for the help

Methos

Oct 30, 2007, 01:38 PM

Hmm.. it seems that the "custom game" requirement is not clear on the pages defining the HOF..

The instructions on this page here (http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/mod.php) don't have the space.. perhaps that should have someone edit it.

Sorry about that. I've edited the page, so I hope its more clear now.

HangingChadDad

Oct 30, 2007, 02:00 PM

Well I'm back again.. Gosh this seems rediculously complicated.. and I've actually WORKED AT IT!! .. Now I'm doing all the "right" things.. custom game, check "locked assets", fresh install (never even played a game) with 1.74 and HOF.. and now I get the "assets are different" message.. this is .. ummmm.. annoying would be polite..

Sorry about that. I've edited the page, so I hope its more clear now.

I did notice you have added "start a custom game" .. thanks ..maybe that wil help the next guy.. :)

Also this quote is still incorrect IMHO further down the page

"Also, rather than changing the ini file, you can make a copy of the Civ4 shortcut and add mods=\HOF-x.xx.xxx at the end of the Target field." on the page I linked in my last message.
^^^ space required to work
ie "Also, rather than changing the ini file, you can make a copy of the Civ4 shortcut and add mods= \HOF-x.xx.xxx at the end of the Target field." is correct.

It might be added for the benefit of those not familiar with modifying targets that the info should be outside the "'s in the target.. perhaps I'm just being too elementary.. :)

Methos

Oct 30, 2007, 02:05 PM

Denniz

Oct 30, 2007, 05:26 PM

Well I'm back again.. Gosh this seems rediculously complicated.. and I've actually WORKED AT IT!! .. Now I'm doing all the "right" things.. custom game, check "locked assets", fresh install (never even played a game) with 1.74 and HOF.. and now I get the "assets are different" message.. this is .. ummmm.. annoying would be polite...:hmm: Please e-mail a save file to hof.civfanatics@gmail.com. Maybe we can figure out what's what from the save file. :crazyeye:

A screen print of the Victory Screen, Setting tab might also be helpful.

On thing you can try in the meantime. Go to your "My Documents\My Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Patch" folder. You should find Patch_174.exe there. Run it again in case the in-game patching didn't finish properly. I have only heard of that being a problem with BTS but you never know...

HangingChadDad

Oct 30, 2007, 05:34 PM

First start up a new game without using the HOF Mod. Than exit out of the game and start up a game using the HOF Mod. There's a glitch when the first game started after installation where a certain file is empty. A new non-mod game needs to be started to fill the file. I thought the glitch was fixed, but I could be thinking of the 3.13 version.

Well I did that and played a few dozen moves, then exited and re-tried the HOF mod.. still says I have assets different from a standard install.. Any other ideas?

edit: I did re-run the 1.74 patch.. it didn't make any difference. Still the same result for a new "custom game" with HOF mod. I sent the screen and game to Denniz, so maybe he will find something.

Denniz

Oct 30, 2007, 05:37 PM

Well I did that and played a few dozen moves, then exited and re-tried the HOF mod.. still says I have assets different from a standard install.. Any other ideas?Start a new game and send the save to the e-mail above. I look at it.

HangingChadDad

Oct 31, 2007, 02:06 PM

:hmm: Please e-mail a save file to hof.civfanatic@gmail.com.

This email address gave a fatal error and failed delivery. "addressee unknown"

I did attempt to contact u via an upload and private mail on this forum

Methos

Oct 31, 2007, 02:12 PM

This email address gave a fatal error and failed delivery. "addressee unknown"

I did attempt to contact u via an upload and private mail on this forum

I'll email you now using the above account, tell me if it works.

Edit: Sent

Denniz

Oct 31, 2007, 02:44 PM

This email address gave a fatal error and failed delivery. "addressee unknown"

I did attempt to contact u via an upload and private mail on this forumI left of the "s" in civfanatics. :blush:

Methos

Oct 31, 2007, 02:46 PM

I left of the "s" in civfanatics. :blush:

Hehe, I didn't notice it either....:sad:

HangingChadDad

Nov 01, 2007, 10:03 AM

OK.. thanks to the steady work of Methos and Denniz, we found the problem that I was having with the "ASSET CONDITIONS" problem. I am posting AGAIN to let some of you know what the problem was, and how to avoid it for yourself. I can't believe that I am the only person that this happened to, but here is what seems to have happened.

1. I installed the game from the CD's
2. I linked to the "CHECK FOR UPGRADE" on the "ADVANCED" menu and the patch ran and installed on my game.
3. I put the HOF patches in
4. Started the game in "Custom Game" mode

Then there was nothing but trouble with my game and having the assets work properly in HOF mode. The problem was that even though I ran the patch (and even at Methos' request RE-RAN it from the PATCH folder in my game where it re-ran the "install" for the patch" the GAME WAS NEVER PROPERLY PATCHED. The version was STILL version 1.61 as installed from the CD.

"What can I do??", you ask! Well the solution turns out to be very simple, even though I haven't the slightest idea WHY the problem occurred. In that same ADVANCED menu, the top menu item is "ABOUT THIS GAME". If you run that it is not the normal list of people and programmers and etc. Instead it SHOWS THE VERSION YOU ARE RUNNING!! :)

For this reason I suggest each person doing this.

1. Install the game from the CD's
2. Link to the "CHECK FOR UPGRADE" on the "ADVANCED" menu and run the latest patch install.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
3!! CHECK YOUR VERSION via the "ADVANCED", and "ABOUT THIS GAME" to verify that the version is the level required for the HOF installation. (later this also will show if you have the HOF mod installed)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
4. DL and install the HOF patch from Civfanatics
5a Modify your Desktop Icon to properly link in the HOF
OR
5b Modify your .ini file to set it for the HOF mod
OR
5c Start the game and go to advanced and select the HOF mod .. this will require the game to restart

NOTE: I find the modified desktop icon 5a. to be the best by far as you can just click the way you want to run Civ right from the start with one click and there is no fooling around with restarts PLUS you can easily run HOF mod OR plain vanilla with equal ease .. :) But that's just my opinion.

6. Start your new HOF game in "Custom Game" mode with the HOF mod linked

If you do all these things, your way to HOF games should be easy and simple..

Thanks to Methos and Denniz for all their patience and help!!

Methos

Nov 02, 2007, 12:45 AM

Also this quote is still incorrect IMHO further down the page

"Also, rather than changing the ini file, you can make a copy of the Civ4 shortcut and add mods=\HOF-x.xx.xxx at the end of the Target field." on the page I linked in my last message.
^^^ space required to work
ie "Also, rather than changing the ini file, you can make a copy of the Civ4 shortcut and add mods= \HOF-x.xx.xxx at the end of the Target field." is correct.

Fixed. Thanks for the PM, since I missed the statement in the post.

It might be added for the benefit of those not familiar with modifying targets that the info should be outside the "'s in the target.. perhaps I'm just being too elementary.. :)

Your not, as at the moment, I'm not for sure what your saying. :blush:

ori

Nov 02, 2007, 05:49 AM

Your not, as at the moment, I'm not for sure what your saying. :blush:
I *think* its the following:
the shortcut when created looks like this:

"C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4"
If you add the mod target like this:

"C:\Programme\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Civilization4.exe mod= Mods\HOF-1.74.001"
it won't work, if you add it like this:

"C:\Programme\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Civilization4.exe" mod= Mods\HOF-1.74.001
it works - notice that the path to the exe file is within " and " while the mod flag is set outside the ""

Methos

Nov 02, 2007, 08:03 AM

Thanks! Added this as an example:

"C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Civilization4.exe" mod= Mods\HOF-1.74.001

Thaliana

Nov 04, 2007, 05:23 PM

Denniz

Nov 05, 2007, 05:52 AM

I'm trying to figure out exactly why my first HOF submission was rejected for reloading and replaying--I had read through the rules beforehand and had not reloaded. Looking through the posted rules again, it appears that I followed them to the letter.

Hence, the questions:

1) Are there restrictions on save file names? Must we use the default?
2) Is each save required to have a unique name? That is, is saving over old intermediate saves not allowed? :confused:

Thanks!There are no restrictions or requirements on naming or how you manage your saves. Just remember to save before you exit and continue playing from that save the next time you play and you can't go wrong.

Also, if you have questions about an exlcusion, please reply via e-mail, as we prefer not to discuss exclusions publicly. Not that I can promise much more detail than already provided.

Sorry, for the circumstances, but welcome to the Hall of Fame. [party] :band:

HolyHandGrenade

Nov 28, 2007, 12:49 AM

Infantry#14

Nov 28, 2007, 03:05 AM

HolyHandGrenade

Nov 28, 2007, 04:31 AM

HolyHandGrenade: the last time I check the Incans are Industrious and Fiancial in warlords and BTS and Aggressive and Industrious in vanilla, not spirtual, although their starting tech does include mysticism.

sorry - I only got from my memory the Mysticism fact and assumed Spiritual - you are right. But my suggestion is to just forbid Inca as the player civ instead of dictate Inca as opponent.

Denniz

Nov 28, 2007, 05:57 AM

I really wonder why Inca must always be an opponent in the last gauntlets. If the human player has too much advantages playing Inca why not excluding it from the Civ choice. Instead of "any" it can say "not Inca" and at "Opponents" it can again be any. With Inca as spiritual you have no choice to target all early religions. Comments?Gosha190 asked about this in one of the Gauntlet threads:
"Opponents: Must include Inca"! again... Why? If you don't want to see kechua rush at the beginning it is possible to use next setting: "Civ: Any, except HC".

As it seems to me, permanent including HC as opponent is an unwarranted game setting.

Currently, our Gauntlet setup and scorer doesn't have the option to list civs you can't play. This one more thing on our to do list.As I said, it is on our To-Do list.

HolyHandGrenade

Nov 28, 2007, 06:17 AM

Gosha190 asked about this in one of the Gauntlet threads:
As I said, it is on our To-Do list.

Thx for the answer and sorry for the wrong thread :D

BLubmuz

Nov 28, 2007, 07:10 AM

Just to say i agree with Gosha and HHG about Inca (just forbidden, not as opponent).
I prolly posted something time ago, but i never thought it was a problem of the games submissions engine.

Nice to know you're working on it.

Denniz

Nov 28, 2007, 07:09 PM

Thx for the answer and sorry for the wrong thread :DThis thread is okay. I pasted that post from one of the gauntlet thread. I figure we will have to answer that question in all the stickied threads before we done. :mischief:

Thrallia

Nov 28, 2007, 08:31 PM

the HOF site still says it is administered by superslug...not that I'm trying to get rid of him or anything...but shouldn't it say Denniz or Methos now since superslug is taking a break?

Infantry#14

Nov 29, 2007, 06:41 PM

Does anyone know the relatively agressive level of the AI in Warlords and BTS and their judgement (yes or no) of going to war at pleased/friendly attitudes?

shyuhe

Nov 30, 2007, 11:42 AM

Their used to be an old spreadsheet that listed these numbers. I base my evaluation on the BtS numbers - I don't think the leader settings have changed between vanilla/warlords and BtS. You can find the numbers for BtS on the BtS thread (it's the sticky for the info sheet).

Electryon

Dec 02, 2007, 01:46 PM

Hi all,

This ahs probably been asked and answered, I just can't find it. Do games submitted to the HOF need something different or special to be counted towards Quattromaster? I just submitted my first game to the HOF and it shows up as accepted but not on my Quattromaster tab.

Thanks for any help

Electryon

Conquistador 63

Dec 02, 2007, 02:49 PM

You need to wait for the HOF update which happens usually every other week.

Denniz

Dec 02, 2007, 03:24 PM

Updates are on the 10th and 25th.

ChrisShaffer

Dec 08, 2007, 06:25 AM

It would be nice if the Hall of Fame FAQ explained the Quattromaster.

Also, the FAQ has a lot of stuff about the Warlords beta - surely that's complete by now? See http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/rules.php?show=faq

pholtz

Dec 17, 2007, 03:07 AM

MapFinder is a program that allows you to set a game up using your desired settings (map type, size, speed, civ, opponents, etc.) and generating maps based off of a ruleset you have created to locate and save maps with a specific amount of certain features (terrain types, resources, commerce, food, etc.)

As a new player to the HOF and having just finished figuring out, in part the Map Finder, may I suggest the above is not enough for new users of the finder. I would like to suggest something like the following:

------------------------------------
When you start a game of Civilization, sometimes the initial position isn't all it could be. For example, you could be in Tundra or have no river. Many players will go ahead and play from these positions as the randomness of the start is one attraction, and if the position isn't very good its just another obstacle to overcome. Hoever when playing at the very high difficulty levels or playing for an entry on the HOF table, a good start is sometimes mandatory. Players used to had to do the following.

1. start a game
2. notice that there is no river (or whatever terrain feather they decide is necessary)
3. quit the game
4. reset up the custom game and restart
5. loop through 1 - 4 until satisfied

The Map Finder is a way to automate this procedure. It does not give you any additional information but allows you to continously generate random maps over and over, until the terrain in the visible area of the start (the 20 or so squares normally visible) meet your criteria.

For example, you could specify you want a fish, 3 hills (for production), 2 other food resources, and a river. That sounds like a pretty good start. Once Map Finder is installed correctly you could set up your game, start it, look over your initial position and if not satisfied, run Map Finder to continue generating starting positions until one matches your criteria. You could even have it save that starting position then continue searching for more until you had 10 or more good positions that you could look over, before you made one move.

To repeat, Map Finder does not give you any additional information, it just automates the "look at the starting position and restart if desired" process.
--------------------------

Much longer I know, and I'm sure it could use some editing, but something like this is needed for the beginner.

BLubmuz

Dec 17, 2007, 09:35 AM

WaxonWaxov

Dec 17, 2007, 09:54 PM

Where does one get the map finder thingy?

Methos

Dec 17, 2007, 10:03 PM

Where does one get the map finder thingy?

I'm at work and they block the hof site, so I can't get you the direct link. Here's the link to the hof site (http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/). Once there, click on the 'Mod' tab and when the page loads, you'll see two tabs at the top. One of them will be 'Map Finder'. Click that tab and you'll see links similar to the ones on the mod page.

I hope that helps (and wish work wouldn't block the site :mad: ).

Denniz

Dec 18, 2007, 06:29 AM

A thread good as any other one to ask:
news about Superslug?
in his last post he mentioned the Thanksgiving time for his return...

Not that you guys are not doing fine, just to know if say him goodbye or see you later.We have waited saying anything about that to let Thunderfall make an announcement. He said sometime this week.

You should remind him if he doesn't post anything by this weekend. :mischief:

ruff_hi

Dec 18, 2007, 10:39 AM

I am planning to start a game that will take ages to play. What is the rule about submitting a game with a HOF mod version that has been superseded?

If I start the game with 3.13.001 but it takes me 12 months to complete and the HOF mod has moved on to 3.13.004 - will the game be accepted? (I know that I cannot move my game up to the latest version).

Denniz

Dec 18, 2007, 10:52 AM

ruff_hi

Dec 18, 2007, 09:36 PM

I've just started a rainforest, cylindrical game in BtS and I'm getting a HOF warning. According to the HOF rules, this combination is allows. Is this an issue with the HOF 3.13.001 mod?

Not only that, but on checking F6 (science), I have knowledge of Wheel, Agriculture, Mysticism and Mining (playing as Ghandi / India).

Methos

Dec 18, 2007, 10:52 PM

Not only that, but on checking F6 (science), I have knowledge of Wheel, Agriculture, Mysticism and Mining (playing as Ghandi / India).

What difficulty level are you playing? The easier levels grant you more techs at the start.

I'm at work right now, so I can't look into the error your getting.

Infantry#14

Dec 18, 2007, 11:25 PM

how to set vanilla, warlord, bts hof as the main mod, so that I dont have to load mod from main screen every time?

Methos

Dec 19, 2007, 12:10 AM

how to set vanilla, warlord, bts hof as the main mod, so that I dont have to load mod from main screen every time?

From the HOF site: (http://hof.civfanatics.net/civ4/mod.php#how_to_use)

If you want to have the mod start automatically when starting Civ4 (so avoiding steps 2..6 above) you can make the following change in the CivilizationIV.ini file:

Before:

; Specify a Mod folder (Mods\Mesopotamia), '0' for none
Mod = 0

After:

; Specify a Mod folder (Mods\Mesopotamia), '0' for none
Mod = Mods\HOF-x.xx.xxx

Also, rather than changing the ini file, you can make a copy of the Civ4 shortcut and add
mods= \HOF-x.xx.xxx at the end of the Target field.

"C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Civilization4.exe" mod= Mods\HOF-1.74.001

Infantry#14

Dec 19, 2007, 03:29 AM

thanks Methos, now I can transform the usual loading time into playing time :cool:

Denniz

Dec 19, 2007, 03:44 AM

I've just started a rainforest, cylindrical game in BtS and I'm getting a HOF warning. According to the HOF rules, this combination is allows. Is this an issue with the HOF 3.13.001 mod?On the BTS Beta tab is shows that only flat is allow with Rainforest. Where are you seeing that it is allowed?

ori

Dec 19, 2007, 05:36 AM

On the BTS Beta tab is shows that only flat is allow with Rainforest. Where are you seeing that it is allowed?

look at the settings tab :mischief:

edit: oh and that one mandates no random events - you might want to change that :)
Edit2: like those christmas smilies :) ;) :( :D :p :rolleyes: :eek: :lol: :mad: :mischief: :confused: :xmas: :cool:
Edit3: and the version info on the settings tab is outdated as well
Edit4: and while I am at it: the version info in the BtS beta tab is outdated and you might want to change the following in the disallowed tab:

Leader repeating

The human player may not play a leader already included as an AI. Civilizations may be repeated, but not leaders.
to something like

Leader repeating

No Leader can be assigned to any player if it is already assigned to another. Civilizations may be repeated, but not leaders.
I am pretty sure that me playing as Julius against 16 Gandhi AIs is disallowed...

ruff_hi

Dec 19, 2007, 05:50 AM

What difficulty level are you playing? The easier levels grant you more techs at the start.ahh - that explains it ... I'm playing on an easier level.

On the BTS Beta tab is shows that only flat is allow with Rainforest. Where are you seeing that it is allowed?There is a BtS tab? I was looking at the regular tab that includes things like 'no random events' and thought it was the one and only tab.

Denniz

Dec 19, 2007, 08:17 AM

The BTS Beta Tab has the correct rules. We'll fix the rest.

BLubmuz

Dec 19, 2007, 08:19 AM

Can i ask why the "Fantasy realm" map is banned from the HoF?

It's so fun, pity not use it.

Methos

Dec 19, 2007, 02:00 PM

As a new player to the HOF and having just finished figuring out, in part the Map Finder, may I suggest the above is not enough for new users of the finder. I would like to suggest something like the following:

------------------------------------
When you start a game of Civilization, sometimes the initial position isn't all it could be. For example, you could be in Tundra or have no river. Many players will go ahead and play from these positions as the randomness of the start is one attraction, and if the position isn't very good its just another obstacle to overcome. Hoever when playing at the very high difficulty levels or playing for an entry on the HOF table, a good start is sometimes mandatory. Players used to had to do the following.

1. start a game
2. notice that there is no river (or whatever terrain feather they decide is necessary)
3. quit the game
4. reset up the custom game and restart
5. loop through 1 - 4 until satisfied

The Map Finder is a way to automate this procedure. It does not give you any additional information but allows you to continously generate random maps over and over, until the terrain in the visible area of the start (the 20 or so squares normally visible) meet your criteria.

For example, you could specify you want a fish, 3 hills (for production), 2 other food resources, and a river. That sounds like a pretty good start. Once Map Finder is installed correctly you could set up your game, start it, look over your initial position and if not satisfied, run Map Finder to continue generating starting positions until one matches your criteria. You could even have it save that starting position then continue searching for more until you had 10 or more good positions that you could look over, before you made one move.

To repeat, Map Finder does not give you any additional information, it just automates the "look at the starting position and restart if desired" process.
--------------------------

Much longer I know, and I'm sure it could use some editing, but something like this is needed for the beginner.

Thanks for the help and don't think this was ignored. We are working at getting things updated.

Denniz

Dec 19, 2007, 04:01 PM

Can i ask why the "Fantasy realm" map is banned from the HoF?

It's so fun, pity not use it.I don't remember but I am sure it was for a good reason. :) I don't think we need to re-open the discussion. ;)

pholtz

Dec 20, 2007, 03:18 AM

Thanks for the help and don't think this was ignored. We are working at getting things updated.

Thanks for the response. Part of the reason for my suggestions are the following order of my understanding of Map Finder.

1. No idea
2. Wow, what a way to cheat
3. Ok, so how do I cheat using this thing
4. Oh, I guess it isn't really cheating
5. Ah, I guess it could be useful
6. Still got a few things to figure out

Methos

Dec 20, 2007, 11:19 AM

look at the settings tab :mischief:
edit: oh and that one mandates no random events - you might want to change that :)
Edit3: and the version info on the settings tab is outdated as well
Edit4: and while I am at it: the version info in the BtS beta tab is outdated and you might want to change the following in the disallowed tab:

All fixed.

Edit2: like those christmas smilies :) ;) :( :D :p :rolleyes: :eek: :lol: :mad: :mischief: :confused: :xmas: :cool:

:confused:

I am pretty sure that me playing as Julius against 16 Gandhi AIs is disallowed...

Swapped.

ori

Dec 20, 2007, 11:57 AM

:confused:

It should have read "I like those Christmas smilies" :xmas: - I just noticed them for the first time this year during that post :cool:

CivAgamemnon

Jan 08, 2008, 03:51 AM

I noticed on the HoF tables you have "Space Colony" and "Space Race" conditions. I know about the Space Race, but is "Space Colony" a victory condition in BtS I've not run across yet?

Ozbenno

Jan 08, 2008, 05:31 AM

Denniz

Jan 08, 2008, 06:03 AM

I noticed on the HoF tables you have "Space Colony" and "Space Race" conditions. I know about the Space Race, but is "Space Colony" a victory condition in BtS I've not run across yet?

Its just a recognition that space victories are different in BtS, so Space Colony is just a space victory in BtS, at least I think that's what it is.

Yes. BTS Space Race victories are now called "Space Colony". This reflects the fact that you don't win until your ship arrives at AC and lands it's colony. It is different enough to warrant a separate "Official" table like with Religious.

It is part of getting ready for Quattromasters. Originially it seems redundant to add the victory condition since we could see the BTS Space Race victorys using the drop downs. But for quattromasters it was going to be too much to work out, so a change was in order.

CivAgamemnon

Jan 08, 2008, 08:11 AM

Okay, thank you for your answers, Ozbenno and Denniz! :) Makes sense. :)

Infantry#14

Jan 09, 2008, 11:44 PM

so far I cant log on to the site to submit games, is the server down?

Edit: this is the stuff displayed on the site after I tried to log in:

Warning: mysql_connect() [function.mysql-connect]: Can't connect to local MySQL server through socket '/var/lib/mysql/mysql.sock' (111) in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/user_login.php on line 35

Warning: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/user_login.php:35) in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/user_login.php on line 102

Warning: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/user_login.php:35) in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/user_login.php on line 103

Warning: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/user_login.php:35) in /home/hofciv/public_html/civ4/include/bars.php on line 23

CivAgamemnon

Jan 10, 2008, 12:04 AM

Site's working normally for me, including the login.

Methos

Jan 10, 2008, 12:09 AM

The server has been down for a while today, but just recently came back online. Due to this we are extending the deadlines of the gauntlets. I have posted this message in each of the gauntlet threads:

Due to CFC's server being down today, we are extending the deadline of the gauntlets to twenty fours from the time of this post. That would be at 12:00 AM Central Time US (0600 GMT).

jesusin

Jan 12, 2008, 01:18 AM

Denniz

Jan 12, 2008, 05:12 AM

I don't fully understand the Qscores. Why should a #1 small map game score less than a #1 huge map game? There are games where the bigger the map, the easier the victory. Anyway, my real question is not this one.

Imagine someone has a poor GMinor Qscore and wants to improve it. Imagine the minor of that month is a OCC conquest. Conquest in OCC is suboptimal, so his game, even if he gets to make the #1 position in the Gauntlet, will have a very low Qscore when compared to normal HOF games with the same settings. So, shouldn't he play that Gauntlet?
Then he tries and wins the Gauntlet and is #1 at it. There will be no reward at all in terms of Qscore? Is that the way we want it to work?Gauntlets are compared to the other games in the same gauntlet. If you look at the game_info you can see there is a Gauntlet Qscore that is used for the QM.

I don't remember all of the discussion around the different modifiers (difficulty, barb and size) but I think that the theory is that the great the size the more effort required. I can understand that there might be conditions were what you say is true.

The question is can you define a table could be used to identify which combination are more difficult. It has got to be something universal that most players would agree with.

We are in the process of upgrading the QM to include BTS. We also have some new things we want to introduce so it is a good time to revisit this. But, we have to move quickly, as in the next couple of weeks.

jesusin

Jan 12, 2008, 06:14 AM

The question is can you define a table could be used to identify which combination are more difficult. It has got to be something universal that most players would agree with.

Thanks for the opportunity. I don't have the needed experience. I would just suggest decreasing the map size relevance, for example Large and Huge 0.9, Std and Small 0.8, Tiny and Duel 0.7. Maybe someone else can make a better suggestion.

Gauntlets are compared to the other games in the same gauntlet. If you look at the game_info you can see there is a Gauntlet Qscore that is used for the QM.

Ok. Let me change the example then. Someone who has won (#1) a Deity-Huge Gmajor doesn't have a reason to win another Gmajor in Prince-Std.
What about adding 3 points per Gminor won and 5 points per Gmajor to the formula?
I would like to hear from the top Quattromasters on this.

pholtz

Jan 12, 2008, 11:53 AM

This is from someone who is still pretty new to HOF, and only a Prince/Monarch player so take it with a grain of salt:

I think the current system is pretty good. I've gotten my first Deity games posted only because they were much easier on the Duel Map. I don't think I deserve any more than a .5. Also adding points per game won would unfairly weight the numbers in favor of long time players. Someone new wouldn't be able to catch up.

The only thing I might change is the Barbarian penalty. I play too many games without Barbarians because I'm going for the quickest date and the presence of Barbarians would just slow me down. If it was .1 and .2 for normal/raging it might make me think more about playing with them on.

Methos

Jan 13, 2008, 10:25 PM

Imagine someone has a poor GMinor Qscore and wants to improve it. Imagine the minor of that month is a OCC conquest. Conquest in OCC is suboptimal, so his game, even if he gets to make the #1 position in the Gauntlet, will have a very low Qscore when compared to normal HOF games with the same settings. So, shouldn't he play that Gauntlet?
Then he tries and wins the Gauntlet and is #1 at it. There will be no reward at all in terms of Qscore? Is that the way we want it to work?

Gauntlets are compared to the other games in the same gauntlet. If you look at the game_info you can see there is a Gauntlet Qscore that is used for the QM.

As Denniz stated, gauntlet's earn their own QScore (GauntletQScore), which isn't affected by non-gauntlet games. So the player who got #1 in your OCC conquest example would indeed benefit from the gauntlet. Remember also that once the gauntlet has closed, your GauntletQScore can never be changed. Therefore that #1 ranking will always be #1.

Ok. Let me change the example then. Someone who has won (#1) a Deity-Huge Gmajor doesn't have a reason to win another Gmajor in Prince-Std.

Your Quattromaster score for the gauntlet event is based off of your two best scores for both the Major and the Minor. So it would be good to have at least one other high scoring Major. Expanding on your example, if the player had two #1 huge deity games, than yes, any future majors wouldn't help his score (unless they could possibly earn a higher GauntletQScore).

The only thing I might change is the Barbarian penalty. I play too many games without Barbarians because I'm going for the quickest date and the presence of Barbarians would just slow me down. If it was .1 and .2 for normal/raging it might make me think more about playing with them on.

As some have stated before, on higher difficulty levels and crowded maps, barbs are rarely seen. Therefore clicking 'Raging Barbs' doesn't really do anything (except increase your QScore).

m4gill4

Jan 17, 2008, 10:58 PM

Methos

Jan 17, 2008, 11:18 PM

Hi, I'm thinking of trying my first HOF game to submit. Before I do so, I have a few questions, if anyone can answer them it would be helpful. I'm very new at this and tried searching these questions, but the search results list was very long and intimidating, so I'll try here....

Welcome to the HOF!!! :band:

#1. I see that it is required to submit 2 saves; one starting save, and one the turn after victory. As for the starting save, is the 4000bc autosave sufficient?

Yes, the 4000 bc save is mandatory. If you start in an era other than ancient, than the initial turn you begin in is the save that we need. Basically as soon as the game starts up, that is the turn that we need.

#2. Is there any rule against regenerating map on the first turn? For this event I am playing above my skill level and hope to find a starting position that is favorable. Is this against the rules? If not, is it in any way taboo?

You are allowed to regenerate. In fact the HOF mod even helps you out. Under the options screen on the HOF3 tab you can check the Alt-G regen box that allows you to just press Alt-G and it automatically regenerates for you. Saves a little time. We also have MapFinder that was created by HOF admin Denniz. It's an excellent program that helps you locate those perfect starts.

#3. Let me see that I understand correctly: I can play any game that meets the criteria for HOF using HOF mod, and then can submit it? Now, if I play a g-minor or major game, does it count towards my HOF score?

Games played for either the minor or major are submitted just like any other. Our checker examines the submission and if it meets the criteria of the major/minor the game is automatically submitted. Technically someone who isn't intentionally playing for the minor/major could accidently submit a game if they just happen to have played a game that fits the criteria.

Thanks! I've been eying this whole HOF thing for awhile but was intimidated by all the strange words like "quattromaster", but now I'm just going to dive in and hope I figure it out.

Peace

I'm glad you chose to start participating. We're looking forward to seeing your games up on the board!