I am new to the mod. It seems that religions had some major changes. Like spread chance, holy city dissappear and stuff by reading changelog. well, lets just say that I have no idea how religions work now. Anybody can enlight me on it?

And it would be nice if anybody can post an upto date list of speard chance for each religion.

I'd recommend starting here: http://www.civ4.houmie.com/The%207%20Religions.htm

Most of the answers can be found on this site.

According to houmie's internet site, holy cities shift to a new civilization if you don't use the religion as your state religion. What happens when less than 7 civilizations are left in the world and all 7 religions have been researched? What happens to the extra religions?

Well, I saw the Holy Cities of religions nobody adopted just migrate indefinitely.

Well, I saw the Holy Cities of religions nobody adopted just migrate indefinitely.

So if the world is reduced to 6 or less civilizations, some religions will effectively die?

So if the world is reduced to 6 or less civilizations, some religions will effectively die?

yes and no - it depend on adopted civic - with free religion, holy city do not disappear

yes and no - it depend on adopted civic - with free religion, holy city do not disappear

Ok, thank you.

So with free religion, you can get more shrine income from 2 cities, right? And if you switch to another religious civic, then your holy city will start moving again in 75 turns.

Would it be possible to switch to stay in another religious civic for 74 turns, then switch to free religion for 1 turn and then stay in the first religious civic again for 74 turns while maintaining 2 holy cities?
Just checking how this system really works and finding loopholes. I also don't even know if it is interesting to have 2 religions and holy cities in a civic other than free religion. I haven't carefully checked the new civic bonusses yet. And of course regular switching between civics is only interesting when you are spiritual and don't have a revolution period.

Another question. Does the AI realize that founding a second holy city is kind of pointless? I do believe that I read something along those lines in one of the updates of the BetterAI mod which is incorporated in your mod (AI's who already have a religion don't try too hard to get another one). But that was not explicitely created for this mod and it's revamped holy city system. But maybe it still works very well, I don't know.

It's kind of a weird system of religion at first glance. I don't know how often in a typical game a holy city will move. If it doesn't happen often, then it is ok. If it happens often, then it gets a bit weird (if you think of the game as representing real life at some level). I have to get a bit of a feeling for the system before I start playing this mod.

It looks like a very interesting mod by the way. But it is a bit too deep to be able to judge it without playing it. It seems to have many layers of detail and a lot of things already sound great at first glance. I must say an excellent job. :goodjob:

Thanks for the quick answers by the way.

Ok, thank you.

So with free religion, you can get more shrine income from 2 cities, right? And if you switch to another religious civic, then your holy city will start moving again in 75 turns.

Would it be possible to switch to stay in another religious civic for 74 turns, then switch to free religion for 1 turn and then stay in the first religious civic again for 74 turns while maintaining 2 holy cities?
Hmm, interesting point - never tested this, maybe you found a cheat :)
must check a code, but i think that this not help - there is counter, how long holy city exist (in your civ) and if it is more than 75 turns and it is not your state religion (or free religion), then disappear - but as i said, must chceck a code

Another question. Does the AI realize that founding a second holy city is kind of pointless? I do believe that I read something along those lines in one of the updates of the BetterAI mod which is incorporated in your mod (AI's who already have a religion don't try too hard to get another one). But that was not explicitely created for this mod and it's revamped holy city system. But maybe it still works very well, I don't know.
also we have implemented favorite religion, so if you have adopted favorite religion, you don't focus to new religion...

It's kind of a weird system of religion at first glance. I don't know how often in a typical game a holy city will move. If it doesn't happen often, then it is ok. If it happens often, then it gets a bit weird (if you think of the game as representing real life at some level). I have to get a bit of a feeling for the system before I start playing this mod.
this system was started about 1 year ago for TR for vanilla civ, got some modification. we have some other ideas how to improve religion, but not on top of our list, so for now, this sytem will stay as is

It looks like a very interesting mod by the way. But it is a bit too deep to be able to judge it without playing it. It seems to have many layers of detail and a lot of things already sound great at first glance. I must say an excellent job. :goodjob:

Thanks for the quick answers by the way.
thank you :)

Thank you for the quick response again.

I do tend to find loopholes and cheats and imbalances, however I dislike abusing them. So if I come up with some other strange loopholes that you've never thought about, then please don't be angry. I just want to perfect the mod. I just posted a lenghty post (new thread) about windmills. I wonder what you think about that post. I hope that the strange cheat that I theoretically thought up here will not be a cheat and that the 75 turn timer will just continue on where it left off.

Good to hear about that favourite religion system. That will be interesting, it will give some nice flavour to the civilizations.

And by the way, I'm not saying that your religion system is bad or something. Just something that I will have to get used to. I like the various different bonusses of the religions very much, but it is very hard to see the impact without playing the mod. That is something that I will do now. Let's have some fun. :D

No, you don't get double income - in fact, you get none. At free religion, you have no state religion. And in order for a Great Shrine to yield income, it has to be the one of your state religion. So no loophole here, as you can't have more than one state religion.

No, you don't get double income - in fact, you get none. At free religion, you have no state religion. And in order for a Great Shrine to yield income, it has to be the one of your state religion. So no loophole here, as you can't have more than one state religion.

Ah, this was also changed from the normal vanilla game. Good work, no loopholes then.

I thought the movement of the holy cities of religions was introduced to stop you from getting the shrine income from 2 religions, but that wasn't possible in the first place.

Honestly, I haven't seen the "movement of the holy city" in real world. Jerusalem is still holy city for Christians, Mekka is always a holy city for Muslims, and so on. You can destroy religion in that city, but still it will be a holy city for followers of that religion.

However, do we expect such realism from programmers?.. The only thing that I don't like in TR, is a perverted logic in some areas. I think that the whole religion in TR is totally screwed up. Yes, it makes gameplay more difficult but it makes no sense in real world, so instead of "Total Realism" it may be called "Total Redesign", as it is not near to realism.

An example is Russia. Home of 3 religions (Christianity, Buddhism and Islam). No problems with that in modern times ("free religion"), no problems in the past ("organized religion"). Having three religions in CIV4 Russia with TR makes more troubles than in real life.

IMHO, of course.

Not a very good example - as most multi-religion countries in the past had lots of trouble due to it. And Russia is still predominantely christian (and has been that way since Vladimir the Saint), with other religions as minorities. Spain can be a better example - it suffered very much due to the inter-religion strife.

And, speaking in Civ 4 terms, current "Holy City" of Christianity is Rome (the centre of religion, raking money from pilgrimages). It is in-game logic that is sometimes flawed, and we're striving to correct it somehow.

I'm sorry, I didn't notice the INI files in TR. Seems like most things can be corrected in it.

Regarding Russia - there never been wars in Russia caused by religion - they all were political or wars for resources. Unlike the crusades, initiated by countries with one religion.

You're right, Russia is mostly Christian, but it is because most of Russians are Christian. Kalmyk are mostly Buddhist. There are more Russians than Kalmyk so Russia is mostly Christian. But the land of Kalmyk (which is only 4 times smaller than Italy) is Buddhist. The land of Caucasus is Islamic. If there are wars between religions, I haven't noticed.

I took Russia as an example, because there are not many countries in the world with such territory (none, actually) and so many religions spread. And the point was - while there is a state religion, others flow and smell like roses instead of producing revolts and wars.

Russia has always been quite tolerant to other religions in a manner not very characteristic of Europe - they've even managed to get into religion wars between christians themselves! :D

The happiness maluses of having multiple religions are offset by ability of constructing multiple temples/monasteries and getting their boni - so generally having several religions can be good or bad in TR depending on how you treat them. I, personally, always strive to get several religions to my cities as it means more culture and research.