The formula for the score isn't specified. The manual just says it's a combination of factors; time, map size, population, conquered citizens, difficulty level, etc. There are bonuses if you defeat the Guardian and Anatarans. My highest score so far is about 2100. In that game, it was a huge map, impossible difficulty. I had conquered all the AIs except for one tiny planet, to keep from winning by conquest. I defeated the Guardian and won the game by winning the battle at Antaries.

The problem is that you do not gain anything from the difficulty level. The main way to gain a high score is to milk the game out to the point that you lose more points than you gain by going on.

This is about 500 turns. The next biggest thing is to not use any racial points.

You can also use some tricks, which I do not use. The main one that I recall is to grab a planet and them gift or let it be capture. The another thing I just remembered is to use planet tech to form planets from asteriods and gas one.

In conjuction with that you dump toxic planet to get better ones, but I forgot how that was done.

Anyway I think you can get in the 30K something. The highest one I ever did was this one and it was too much work to try to beat it.


Race -6 Repulsive -2 Ship Attack -2 Ground Combat

Huge universe (173 colonies)
PreWarp tech Organic Rich Antaran On
340% (24 picks left)
Start 1 system, one planet

Time 499 turns 781 pts
5385 pop 5385 pts (? not housed)
6 players elim 300 pts
tech 262 pts
154 captured 154 pts
antarans 250 pts
100 orion 100 pts
score 7155*340 24327 pts


You can drive the captured up with ease and you could start with a better univers and star system. I suspect that one race was eliminated by someone else, but I forget.

It could be I did not take down their last planet, but you can attack Antaries and the last planet on the same turn.

Anyway for what it is worth that is what I know about it and can still remember.

In conjuction with that you dump toxic planet to get better ones, but I forgot how that was done.
I think you settle it, give it to someone else, blow it up with a stellar converter to make asteroids, then turn the asteroids back into a planet and resettle it.

I was thinking that but, I never held a planet in a system I destroyed, so I was not sure if it makes asteriods or not.

Thanks. I hadn't thought of playing with a lot of negatives picks with no positive.

So the difficulty doesn't matter at all?

Not to the score. It was intended that it would but I guess they screwed up. Civ score are multiplied by the level, which makes sense.

The fewer picks you use the better your score. The max is 340 percent. You can fly pop to speed filling planets and shorten the number of turns need, but that is more work than I want to do. I will do it in the early game, but not for long.

I played a game on easy that had a huge map and 8 opponents.

I took -10 points in picks which resulted in a 300% bonus to the score. I eliminated 5 opponents, defeated the guardian and the Antarans.

The score broke down something like this.

Turns 422 = 844 points (2pts / turn?)
939 pop = ( I forget how many points this generated)
122 Conquered pop
Eliminated 5 rivals (50x5=250)
Tech +177 points
Defeated the Guardian at Orion +100 points
Defeated Anatarans +250 points.

The Base Score ended up being 2650.

2650 x300% = 7950

What difficult level do you play? I play only not possibly. My Race are telepatic +6, lower-g -5, ground-battle -3 and spy -3 = 240%
not possible, hugh, mineral rich, 8 opponents, antarn on, high tech level

Time 277 turns 1003 pts
5157 pop 5157 pts
6 players elim 300 pts
tech 242 pts
700 captured 350 pts
antarans 250 pts
100 orion 100 pts
score 7402*280 20726 pts

The groundscore are higher. In past I will play without any pics...300% and unpossible. Easy level is boring :D Are strained how many scores then.

i only want to post taht my score in mooII is 29366 ! is ther anyone else with an still hgiher score?

I don't ever pay attention to my score, Ohne Worte (seems odd to post ohne worte ;) ), but welcome to CFC.

sice the last year i tray to reach the max. score in mooII! i have a frind he trays the same, but no one of us knows where is the end:. i know 29366 is not the end, but it will be interesting to know what is the max. score that ever was reached.( sorry for my bad english!!!)

You would first need to know what the max number of star systems and planets can be in a game. Then you could come close to a possible max. Still it has to be done in about 500 turns or you lose more than you gain.

thanx for the tip taht it must be don in 500 turns, so i will try it!

Yeah just keep an eye out as you get to 490's as you can go a bit beyond 500, if you are getting enough pop to offset the reduction in the turn count.

An easy way to get a quick point boost (though I didn't know that difficulty didn't matter) is to use lithovore in teh early game and then use evolutionary mutation to buy cybernetic. This frees up ten points you can use as bonus points.

If you use any picks, you will not be able to get a max bonus of 340%. Why would you want Cybernetics anyway? Especially at the point where you have gotten so far down the tech tree.

If it had any value, it would be in the early game combat.

Yeah, that suggestion is if you're not capable of getting the full 340% and if you're actually using some of the picks for race development. Cybernetic sucks, but it's incompatible with lithovore, and so you 'get back' the lithovore points at the endgame (when you don't really need it either).

Cybernetic sucks, but it's incompatible with lithovore, and so you 'get back' the lithovore points at the endgame (when you don't really need it either).

I didn't know that. Thanks. That info is useful for mods since the Evo. Mut. can be moved forward in the tech. tree. I think I already moved it up closer to mid game in a mod I made last year. It's been awhile since I played, I'll have to check it out.

is it true that the difficulty didn't matter? i don't think so!

I have read that it has no effect and if you look at the scores posted, you do not see any multipler for level. You do not see any category for level.

It would be easy for you to test. Make a game on a small map, with the min race. Use editor to give techs to let you end the game quickly. Run it at two levels of you choice and see if the score is impacted.

You should be able to have both games come out nearly the same and any differences should be easy to attribute.

I ran a test, but I am not sure of the conclusions on level and score.

Test 1:
Easy small map, 2 players.
first run I gave a number of techs to ensure it could reach the other race and defeat it.

Sent two corvettes with 4 zeon missiles.
Game ends on turn 15.

Turn 15 - 185pts
Pop 10 - 10pts
elim 1 - 50pts
tech 12 points
score 257

Test 2:
Average or whatever the next level up is, small map, 2 players.
First run gave what I hope was the same techs, but could be a slight difference.

Sent two ships, end turn 19.

Turn 19 - 181
pop 9 - 9pts
elim 1 -50pts
tech 24pts
score 264

So it may be that they had different tech level or it may be there is a level bonus for techs. I reloaded form the last save and gave all techs to both test. Launched both on t15.

Test1:
Turn 15 - 185pts (2nd run T18 - 182
Pop 10 - 10pts (same
elim 1 - 50pts (same
tech 12 points (tech 33
score 257 (275

Test2:
Turn 19 - 181 (2nd run T19 same
pop 9 - 9pts (10
elim 1 -50pts (same
tech 24pts (tech 48
score 264 (289

This looks like tech score is a function of level. However I am not sure how it is determined. The tech fields do not show a breakthrough, they show Pure Research, for any level not actually researched.

So there are differences in the two game in that regard. A third test using impossible would clarify things as the breakthroughs would be similar, but if level was a factor the score should be greater than easy by a greater amount.

The 12 vs 24 and then 33 vs 48 suggest it is level per field as it went from 12 to 33. The breakthroughs between test 1 and test 2 could not be more than 1.

By my count there are 72 breakthroughs in the game. I do not know what impact Antaran techs would cause.

I would suspect there is a multipler for tech for the difficulty level, just not sure how much. I am guessing it is 1.5 for average vs easy.

wouldn't this be easier using the einstein cheat?

I don't know, never used it and am not even sure it works. Feel free to make a run.

wouldn't this be easier using the einstein cheat?

I am not sure what the point of that would be. The whole point of the HOF is to show how well you did. With online games, when someone uses a cheat it is broadcast to the other players that they cheated.

The point is to test weither there is any boost for tech score for the level. It is not intended to be a real game. That is why only 1 other races was used. To make the game end quickly and keep the variables down.

What I do not know is a) how the cheat works b) if it will make any difference to using an editor to get all the techs. IOW if both merely give you the tech, but you still need to research each breakthrough, then it does not matter, which way you test.

I personally have no interest in the score, but I am interested in how it function. So I will test the next level and settle the matter.

I ran a test on impossible.

T17 - 183
Pop - 13
Elim - 50
Tech - 150
total 396

Again did not match exactly the breakthroughs, but the tech score is much higher. A real controlled test would be need to figure out the percentages for each level. Say no research after the first breakthrough.

The three test went:
Easy 33
Avg 48
Imp 150

I think I did 4 breakthroughs on the impossible, maybe only 3. Clearly there is a bonus for the level on the techs. Nothing else changes.

vmxa: I cannot reproduce your results. I have tested version 1.31 (both Windows and DOS) and v1.40b2.
I have been doing a lot of tests to get the correct formulas for all scoring categories and no matter what I try, the score for the tech is the same regardless of difficulty level.
What version are you using and what starting options?

I use 1.31. How are you running the test? You want to use the same size map, the same race traits and the same planets, if any. I mean that if you start with no other planets in the system, do that for all test. If you have 1 large with the home planet, do that.

Give the same techs in each test and try to end at the same turn. It should not matter, if end is not exactly the same or the pop as they are seperate scores anyway. You want to be as close as you can though.

BTW if you give all techs, you still have to research each field at each level. The starting options can be any you want as long as they are the same in all test. Ideally 1 race to keep it simple and be able to end on the same turn.

You want to use the same size mapI have.
the same race traits and the same planetsI have.

Give the same techs in each testI don't "give" techs, I research them.
The starting options can be any you want as long as they are the same in all test. Ideally 1 race to keep it simple and be able to end on the same turn.That's exactly what I have done.

I suspect that the editor you are using is screwing up the tech results. Try it without the editor. If you don't want to wait for each game to finish, you can use the Alt+ cheat codes (http://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/197873-master-of-orion-ii-battle-at-antares/cheats) to speed up the process.

Well I don't know. Like I said at the start, I always thought the level had no impact on the score. The test may be invalid, but at best it only shows an impact on the tech score. A small part of the overall score.

I will be a long time getting back to this as I have gotten several new games in the last month and just got Civ5 yesterday.

If the level has no impact on even the tech scores, you should be able to play a game out with any settings and just milk it to you have researched all techs as a creative. Do that for at least two levels of difficulty and see if the tech portion is the same.

It would have to be the same, regardless of all other factors or else level does have an impact. The only thing that needs to be the same is creative. This ensures all runs have the same techs and all techs. Do not capture Orion nor use Antarans (no cpatured tech).

If the level has no impact on even the tech scores, you should be able to play a game out with any settings and just milk it to you have researched all techs as a creative. Do that for at least two levels of difficulty and see if the tech portion is the same.

It would have to be the same, regardless of all other factors or else level does have an impact. The only thing that needs to be the same is creative. This ensures all runs have the same techs and all techs. Do not capture Orion nor use Antarans (no cpatured tech). As I have said, I tested this many times, with different difficulty levels, with or without creative, and with or without Antaran tech. It seems the tech score is not affected by any game settings whatsoever.

I will publish my conclusions here soon.

Maybe I haven't done enough tests to be 100% sure of these formulas. If you know better, please correct me.
Here goes:

Turn numbers score:
Time (X turns) = [players*(80+20*galaxy_size)] - turns

players: Number of players.
NOTE: this is the number of players, not the number of opponents (I.E. yourself included).
galaxy_size: Galaxy size; small,medium,large,huge = 1,2,3,4 respectively.
turns: Number of turns played.

Maximum possible at the first turn is: 8*(80+20*4) = 1280.

Population score:
X Population = Number of colonists at the end (captured colonists included).

Eliminated score:
X Players eliminated = 50*players_Eliminated (self explanatory).

Maximum possible is: 50*7 = 350.

Captured score:
X Captured Colonists = size_modifier*captured (rounded down)

size_modifier: Galaxy size modifier; small,medium,large,huge = 2,1,(2/3), 0.5 respectively.
captured: Number of captured colonists. Captured colonists are population of another race that you have captured or mind controlled.
NOTE: It doesn't matter if you annihilate the captured pop, or give them with the system as a gift, in fact, if you conquer a planet then offer it as a gift and recapture it the next turn you get the captured score again. You can do this an infinite number of times for a theoretical infinite score (I consider this cheating and never use it).

Tech/Research score:
Technology = (3*cat) + (5*hyper_advanced1)

cat: Research categories completed up to Hyper Advanced, this includes categories obtained by getting all of their technologies via espionage/ground conquest/diplomacy etc. It doesn't matter how many technology applications there are in a category (if you are creative), all categories give 3 points to your score, regardless of difficulty or any other setting.
For example: if you are creative and you research Advanced Biology (Cloning Center, Death Spores, Soil Enrichment) you get 3 points to your score and all the 3 techs. I you are not creative, you get only 1 tech (E.G. Soil Enrichment) but still get the 3 points to your score.
NOTE1: Pre-warp starts with 2 categories researched, Average starts with 7 and Advanced with 26. There are a total of 74 categories up to Hyper Advanced.
NOTE2: Antaran technology (either from Orion or from scrapping captured Antaran ships) does not count towards your score in any way.
hyper_advanced1: This is the first Hyper Advanced (Abbrev. HA) research of each category. Only the first HA of each category counts towards your score (each gives +5).
NOTE: Even though the second HA does not give you any more score points it still counts as a refitment level as per the five-level miniaturization rules. The sixth level of HA is useless, though (AFAIK).
Maximum possible is: 3*74 + 5*8 = 262.

Orion score:
Captured Orion = You get 100 points if you defeat the Guardian.

Antaran Homeworld score:
Defeating Antaran Homeworld = You get 250 points if you defeat the Antarans.
NOTE: You can defeat the Antaran homeworld and eliminate players in the same turn thus getting maximum score from both.

Council score:
Won Council Vote = You get 100 points if you win by council vote.
NOTE: You can defeat the Antaran homeworld and win by council vote in the same turn. You can also eliminate players as long as you leave at least 3 players (you+2) which are required to incur the elections.

Score Modifier:
Total Score = score * (1+picks_left*0.1)

score: Your unmodified score, composed of all the above categories.
picks_left: Unused racial picks, which are given in custom race creation.

Maximum possible is: 10 default + 10 from penalties + 4 from the " Evolutionary Mutation" research = 340%



To conclude, here's an example of the score screen:

http://img683.imageshack.us/img683/3675/mpr1.png



*All tests were done with version 1.31

Nice job. I went back to look at my old notes and I see where I had run test on different levels and the tech score was always 262. Not sure what happen on my abbreviate test.

So I was correct the first time, when I said levle did not matter, should have looked at my files to start. I did not realize I had runs from several levels.

NOTE: Even though the second HA does not give you any more score points it still counts as a refitment level as per the five-level miniaturization rules. The sixth level of HA is useless, though (AFAIK).

Thanks for the write up. I didn't know the miniaturization of components stops at 5 levels beyond the tech the item is from. Thought the miniaturization continued with each new tech in the same category irregardless of how many levels one researched. Useful info that.

Thanks vmxa.
I wouldn't say that the difficulty level does not matter, though, maybe not for the numerical score, but I'd like to think of it this way: It matters so much that it got its own category in the hall of fame :) After all, now one can argue that any score achieved on Impossible is better than any other score that wasn't.

scratchthepitch: You're welcome. For more info you can check out:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/197873-master-of-orion-ii-battle-at-antares/faqs/16743 (section 11)
http://strategywiki.org/wiki/Master_of_Orion_II/Warship_technologies#Miniaturization

Some more thoughts I'd like to share with you:
First, some tips on how to maximize you score (This is intended for inexperienced players as veterans should know these guidelines by heart):

When you start, save the game and then use the ISEEALL cheat to make sure at least 1 player has the Subterranean racial ability. Then reload the saved game (you may consider this cheating).
Load the save in a utility, such as Sundiver's MapLeveler (http://www.spheriumnorth.com/blog-images/MapLevelerv1.0.zip), and make sure you have a decent number of planetary systems (you may consider this cheating).
For game settings use: Huge galaxy, 8 players and Antarans Attack (Advanced Tech level can help with turn numbers).
Custom create a race with 20 unused picks (300% score).
Make sure races do not get wiped out by other players.
Conquer a Subterranean race and breed them, try to have all colonies use this race for population.
Capture Orion.
Research all techs up to the fifth level of Hyper Advanced.
Get the "Evolutionary Mutation" tech by all means possible.
Terraform and Gaia-Transform every planet.
Destroy and rebuild all planets smaller than "large" and all Toxic planets.
Do not leave a single planet uncolonized. Colonize each to the max population.
Defeat the Antaran homeworld in conjunction with eliminating the last race.
Have fun :) .

If you micro-manage the hell out of the game and manage to do all the above in less than 300 turns, you may go beyond 30000 points. Note that this kind of game could take many months.

Also, I recently noticed something that I think is a bug: When you transport captured alien colonists to one of your colonies which is at full capacity the colonists don't die, they expand the max population of the planet (I've had medium planets with over 50 pop this way), however, this is very buggy and will most likely make the game crash. If you've seen this discussed anywhere, I'll be happy to get a link.

Don't know anythong about ISEEALL or Maplevel. Never going to play for max score again as it is way to tedious for even me. Mostly I get to about 6 or 8 systems and then just kill off everyone as fast as I can to end it.

Well, I often play to a 'theme' now, decided at the beginning of each game. Trying to maximize captured population (i.e., few of my own people) or to Stellar Convert as many systems as possible.

So, here is my try for max score.
MoO2 went quite buggy at end, and had to do save game every other turn abouts.. 1st bug triggered when had 63 spys attaking and other 63 defending, and few colonies producing more spies. 2nd bug type came when few planets were in some kind error mode when making more colony bases, and had to make 1 colony base at time that was like turns 390 to 430 until every star system was full of colonies.
Last bug happened after killing antareans with boarder doomstar fleet (Antarean Star Fortress captured as well.. ). High score couldn't be registered into Hall Of Fame, 31500+ ones (High score cap..).
So I had to take bit earlier saved game and finish Antarans that time to make recordable 31.3k abouts. Had subterranean (total=240%), luckily captured Evolutionary Mutation from Psilon (last race to be around..) or from Orion and got +40% (total=280%). Everything took around 30 hours game time I think, all planets were about huge/large + gaia + biospheres (=42pop each).
Ps. Screen captures have odd colours, I don't know why.
http://img600.imageshack.us/i/moo2maxscore.jpg/

Well, I often play to a 'theme' now, decided at the beginning of each game. Trying to maximize captured population (i.e., few of my own people) or to Stellar Convert as many systems as possible.

Seems like a good way to spice things up.

"MooFun"

"MoO2 went quite buggy at end, and had to do save game every other turn abouts.. 1st bug triggered when had 63 spys attaking and other 63 defending, and few colonies producing more spies. 2nd bug type came when few planets were in some kind error mode when making more colony bases, and had to make 1 colony base at time that was like turns 390 to 430 until every star system was full of colonies."

"were about huge/large + gaia + biospheres (=42pop each).
Ps. Screen captures have odd colours, I don't know why."

I have read a number of reports on the old Poly and Atari boards of strange bugs, when Corion was used.

I think the max score is 31559, but I forget where I got that number.

It requires 249 planets to get 10447 pop and all that in 517 turns. I never seen the game put up more than 173 planets.

I think the amount of star systems game puts at start might vary a bit. I've done few "get every planet possible" games, they have been around 170-185 planets. I think this map had bit more at beginning (possibly more star systems), but I added more planets with Corion. I think I had even more than 249 planets, not all were huge. And I think there was some colony cap so that I couldn't actually see few colonies at all, just popped autobuild on em while they were acceccible when new colony was set. :D My scores went messy around 31400-31500. 63spies everywhere and colony bug caused "Turn" button go yellow/orange and nothing happened (game crashed), one time it caused system go unstabile too and had to boot it.

Well for sure Corion can cause the game to crash, so it is too irritating to use it. I tried to set up some test with it in the past and then could not get past some action later. Some times it was a combat, some times it was just trying to build something on a planet.

I always thought the cap for spies was 63, so I never make more than 60-61. It does not seem to matter anyway as nothing is a lock to stop a thieft. I have had many games where I had 60-61spies on defense and waiting to get the last tech, before going to Anties.

They had 1 planet with 1 pop and I sit on them and still they get in steals. Even if I am creative and have all the spy techs.

In any event reporting your high score, while using an editor is a bit cheeky. Oh and just remembered a map I made for a friend to play years ago with Corion. I put pop on a couple of planets for the game and that game eventually crashed as well. This was just a few pop, maybe 4 or 5. I tried to give him two extra systems.

Hi, 63 works fine for me, usually doesn't even crash when repeatbuilding more, they get lost tho..

Did yesterday impossible game with UniTol race (huge, 8pl, prewarp, average, all on.. my 1st win on that setup.. took around 350 turns) had around 50 spies at end of game with 50% agent bonus, and still 1 enemy stealed particle beam from me, spying is bit tricky yea..

High score was just a test, thats why I don't want to fill my score table by trying get absolute maximum, some 100pts more..

Now I am trying a race with just "clear" button used on options, impossible seems bit too difficult at beginning so trying 1st hard to train a bit. Maybe going later to try feudal government race too.

Some time ago completed civ1 on king mode (earth, max enemies and stuff) around AD 1950, I feel it was much "harder".. Actully the combats were crazy, I don't know what hacks that game do use, but veteran battleships did get used to lose when attacking settlers made me "bit" confused. :P
At end I did bit testing .. It seemed to need around 10 veteran (made with barracks on) armor 10-5-3 to kill 1 enemy rifleman/mech inf 2-5-1, 6-6-3 in their town, 1 town did often have 2-5 units. For that kind siegecrafting would of needed 50tank grps to keep 1 battle last less thatn 100 years. ;P So compared to that MoO2 actual combat is awfully easy.

Or almost.. My 1st impossible win was on creative researcher race (Almost 100% psilon race), I had just 1 solar system with 5 planets, Xantus (75%) and Matrix (pool, but giving spy bonuses..) leaders.
At turn 410 I had 4 tech in physics, rest 1 and 9 doomstars. Still got that saved game.
It took quite a time to 1st finish that scenario. At some point all enemies was against me and bit after 1 enemy did gain galactic leader.. Then enermous doomstar&etc fleets (I counted best time around 100 ship fleets I think, they were in like 6 lines. At that point I think I had 30 doomstar with all 5techs; 1 stellar converter 1 bomb, 10 AF disrupters and rest AF, HV Disrupters (50 or so) + Structural Analyzer, Reinforced Hull, Heavy Armor, Battle Pods, Hyper-X Capacitors, Inertial Nullifier, Shield Capacitor and High Energy Focus. Stellar was must for preventing enemy recolonizing conquered areas, I found disrupters with those mods most efficient whipeing out their fleets.

All defending doomers had to be ultraelite or enemy did get 1st turn ( No idea what causes that, but was only way to do defending without losing 50% of defender doomers to get that 1st turn..) And their enormous fleets was coming like every turn, so there wasn't really such option to lose my ships. :D

My defending or attacking fleets did usually kill their whole doomstarfleets(with X-armor and X-shield and 2-3 stellars each, but tbh, their boarder ships were even more annoying..) in 1 turn All that fighting took around to turn 600, fights were "long" like 1 or 2 turns always, but lots of clicking.. But before that win I thought impossible really was impossible :D, now ive succeed that scenario in like turn 450, Demoliths and Unitols around turns 350.

One of the options is to let initive determine who goes first. IIRC that was in the last patch. Anyway using that, the fleet with the best ship init, will be first.

I cannot even recall Civ2 at this point, so Civ1 is long forgotten. I have almost forgotten Civ4 as I did not play that much of it. C3C I can speak to or even Civ5.

Spying

In MOO2, the spying is an AI cheat routine. The percentages help some, but if one of the cheat codes, which is the MOO2 AI, determines you need to get hit by a spy tech theft, they get the tech. A clue early on that spying is mainly a cheat is when you build your first or second spies, these get killed almost immediately, then next turn, an AI steals a tech.

As for spy numbers, you can have 63 at home and on each of the existing alien empires. If you don't want your spies creating "incidents", set them to "hide". I usually fill up the defensive spy quota, but I don't always use spies offensively. When I do I usually fill up 2-3 63 spy quotas on the alien empires. But that's usually late game. I tend to forget to transfer those spies when an empire is about to go under, with the result I lose them.

Initiative

I think ship computer level and ship speed are the main factors that determine this. What I noticed when using this was that a battle turn could switch back and forth between player and AI ships quite a few times before the turn is finished. It can be rather confusing and if you specialize your ships for specific roles, to come into play at specific times in the battle, it can be rather daunting to design those ships so they will be able to fight when you planned them to fight. Because of that, I've not done much playing with initiative turned on. I probably should, though.

I made 6010 points on impossible huge. Unification Creative Telepathic.

A fun race for sure.

Yeah, that suggestion is if you're not capable of getting the full 340% and if you're actually using some of the picks for race development. Cybernetic sucks, but it's incompatible with lithovore, and so you 'get back' the lithovore points at the endgame (when you don't really need it either).

My recent kick with Creative race builds has just placed me in a game where I am thinking of trying to play for a personal high score. There is a silicoid master race in this map, with Lith Tol Subterranean, that I can spread everywhere. There are also Elerians with whom I could do repeated invasions to farm up the score.

I have a little question about the trick described above, since my own race is Dict Lith Cre.

I am concerned that there will be sudden problems with food supplies when I switch to cybernetic, since my home race is Lithovore. Most of the problem will take care of itself because these awesome Coids will be unaffected. But I was wondering if it is possible at all to steal or capture any food technology when you are lithovore, or even after you have switched away from lithovore. Food replicators would be ideal.

I tried the evolutionary mutation in a small test with ALT menlo (instant tech progress), and when I switched to cybernetic, food technologies did NOT appear in the research tree (makes sense, because this was not an intentionally-designed possibility).

I guess the problem will have to be solved with inefficient farmers and good old fashioned freighter fleets, but like I say, is it possible to steal food techs when you are lith?

I have no idea. It sure would be nice to be able to! You should still have massively-awesome food potential, since you'll have slave races by then.

What's this about 'repeated invasions'? How do you get that to work ideally?

I have no idea. It sure would be nice to be able to! You should still have massively-awesome food potential, since you'll have slave races by then.

What's this about 'repeated invasions'? How do you get that to work ideally?

Fortunately it looks like any race can research weather controller. I guess they didn't want to let lithovores skip that tech level for free, the forbidden alternative at that level being another food application, subterranean farms.

Regarding capture, according to this thread, which celebrated its sixth birthday recently :bday: —

You can also use some tricks, which I do not use. The main one that I recall is to grab a planet and them gift or let it be capture. The another thing I just remembered is to use planet tech to form planets from asteriods and gas one.

In conjuction with that you dump toxic planet to get better ones, but I forgot how that was done.

In this game I am repulsive though so it may get to be tedious to keep the elerians strong enough to mind control my worlds. This score maxing thing was something I just thought of on a whim when I saw how strong the coids were in my galaxy. This is impossible diff though and I believe the highest possible scores would only be achievable on Easy, where you have a good shot at winning with an utterly disadvantaged, +340% score race.

I do not know for sure, but I think you might be able to create large planets out of any existing smaller world, including toxic ones, by gifting it to an enemy and using a stellar converter on it. Doesn't that turn the planet into an asteroid field? lol.

Does gifting then conquering really improve your score? How is that not insane?

Captured score:
X Captured Colonists = size_modifier*captured (rounded down)
size_modifier: Galaxy size modifier; small, medium, large, huge = 2,1,(2/3), 0.5 respectively.
captured: Number of captured colonists. Captured colonists are population of another race that you have captured or mind controlled.
NOTE: It doesn't matter if you annihilate the captured pop, or give them with the system as a gift, in fact, if you conquer a planet then offer it as a gift and recapture it the next turn you get the captured score again. You can do this an infinite number of times for a theoretical infinite score (I consider this cheating and never use it).

So, slave pop would count? Gah, that's nuts!