This is a new club for all of us who believe culture is an essential component of any civilization. We believe that lower cultural improvements (libraries, temples) are essential for all towns and higher cultural improvements (cathedrals, universities) are essential for all cities and metropolis'. They need to be built quickly.

All interested in joining merely post 'I'd like to join' or some such. This is the place for cultural discussions. Also, don't forget the wonderful and awe-inspiring Phoenatica Cultural Museum (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=20332), whose beauty can only be increased by your membership and subsequent voting for further cultural improvements!

Check back often for other culture-related polls and news-bulletins!

Count me in.

I share your opinion and consider culture very important. A civilization without culture, much like history, is not a complete civilization.

I'm looking forward to participating in cultural discussions and promoting our group in the town of New Falcon's Haven.

Ah, the honourable Lovro, I am glad to count your name as the first on the membership list, other than my own. Have you visited the wonderous Great Library lately? They have an intriguing new exhibit on this 'engineering' that we've heard so much. Apparently rivers will no longer restrict travels :)

I view that culture is nearly the most important thing to a civilization. Without it people live in boredom and have little intellectual stimulation. Culture must increase.

Let all the peoples of this land marvel with awe at the magnificent libraries, universities, temples, cathedrals and coliseums of Phoenetica.:goodjob: :love: :king:

I'd join, but I don't believe that culture improvements should be pop-rushed unless there's a serious danger of that city culture-flipping. Otherwise there's too much of a sense of "Come children, join our civ... so we can flog you to death to build our new cathedral! MUHAHAHAHAHA!". Don't really like that :lol:

Come on, Culture Club. We need your Sistine Chapel vote on the Wonder poll.

i always build temples in my cities so i`ll join:D

I'm just posting to say announce that I've decided to remove the sentence saying that Culture Club members are pro-pop-rushing. During a long meditation at the new Sistine Chapel, I decided that anyone interested in the Culture of Phoenatica should feel comfortable posting in this thread, regardless of political belief. I don't want any culture-lovers to feel persecuted :)

Also, I definitely recommend taking a visit to the awe-inspiring Sistine Chapel. Pay no attention to that weird guy yelling 'Cowabunga' painting the roof ;)

We are working on an article on the Sistine Chapel for our new newspaper. I hope everyone will come to see the wonderous new building.

do you really want to hurt me?
do you really want to make me cry?

karma karma karma karma karma camelion
you come and go
you come and go

Originally posted by andyo
do you really want to hurt me?


kinda:hammer:

Originally posted by punkbass2000


kinda:hammer:

loving would be easy if your colors were like my dreams
red gold and green, red gold and greeeeeeen

Originally posted by punkbass2000
I'm just posting to say announce that I've decided to remove the sentence saying that Culture Club members are pro-pop-rushing. During a long meditation at the new Sistine Chapel, I decided that anyone interested in the Culture of Phoenatica should feel comfortable posting in this thread, regardless of political belief. I don't want any culture-lovers to feel persecuted :)
In that case, I'm in :D

Originally posted by Eklektikos

In that case, I'm in :D

Think I'll start hanging around here too. I'd like to join.

Sign me up too.

At the risk of appearing biased, you can count me in. I cannot quell my culture mongering instincts.:crazyeye:

Oh, I must say, I am interested in this culture bit, eh, what? As a prospective theatre major, I think it is every society's responsibility to furnish its unique cultural elements with all energies and monies necessary to keep its culture strong. Whatever services I may provide are entirely at the disposal of the Club's.

Not to stray off topic, but you bring up something I have wondered for a while. Why is there not a theatre improvement? For that matter, any culture-only improvement, such as a museum? Religious and Scientific improvements generate culture, but how about a pure culture improvement? Just some random thoughts.

Now that we can build libraries with gold I would like to join the Culture Club.:D

The Great Library is only good for culture now!

Originally posted by Justus II
Not to stray off topic, but you bring up something I have wondered for a while. Why is there not a theatre improvement? For that matter, any culture-only improvement, such as a museum? Religious and Scientific improvements generate culture, but how about a pure culture improvement? Just some random thoughts.
I guess the thinking is that the coloseum covers all real-world entertainment institutions for the individual city... plus there's still Shakespeares Theatre... I agree though - a theatre improvement would be nice. Coloseums put me too much in mind of sports arenas... our civ deserves more fulfilling forms of culture than football and arena rock bands! :lol:
Is there really any such thing as a "pure culture improvement"? Museums also tend to be research institutions to some extent... and I can't think of any other candidates for inclusion that aren't in some way connected with science, entertainment or religion.

Should the event of a poll come up on whether to build a knight or university, Culture Club, we'll need your votes for university.

Originally posted by Justus II
Not to stray off topic, but you bring up something I have wondered for a while. Why is there not a theatre improvement? For that matter, any culture-only improvement, such as a museum? Religious and Scientific improvements generate culture, but how about a pure culture improvement? Just some random thoughts.

Not off-topic at all, Justus :). It's about culture, so it passes my criteria.

Also, I recall somebody around here (or possibly at Apolyton) talking about a culture only building that they had modded. It was a shrine, I think. IIRC, it only cost 20 shields, and produced 2-3 culture and had no tech requirement, but it also cost 2-3 gpt, so in the beginning it could be built quickly to expand borders but would need to be sold off because of its high maintenance. Apparently the AI was able to adapt quite well to this new building, too.

Someone already mentioned this, but here's a link to a discussion about a university in Fox's Nest (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=286881&t=183#post286881). Let all of Phoenatica know of your support for a wonderous, new university, to replace the antiquated (but still culturally significant:)) Great Library, the first of its kind.

Here's the accompanying poll (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=22675).

The Phoenatica Cultural Museum (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=289651#post289651) has new exhibits of our great nation's amazing new scientific achievements. Apparently there is a new form of government, with even more citizen input than our current government :eek:

A new Cultural assault against the lands to the south has begun! CAP is already being implemented in Justinian and Macao, and soon a new city shall be built.

Discuss!

Also, don't forget to vote for your Culture Club leader, punkbass2000, as Cultural Minister. If you were running for office he'd vote for you!

This thread has been bumped for the benefit of the newbie who is looking for citizen clubs.

Very good PunkBass, but this is being neglected, is it not.

Originally posted by curufinwe
Very good PunkBass, but this is being neglected, is it not.

Unfortunately so, as until you the last five posts were mine.

Well PB, you could start a discussion on the new hangings in the Phoenatica National Cultural Art Museum. (Maybe the word Cultural should come out of that name, it looks too long.) Beyond the next addition to the "Great Wonders" exhibit, I believe my favorite Civ3 scientific advance pictures will be put up for display. Can't wait.

Sounds exciting.

Does Shakespeares Theater really give 8 culture. I though that everything could only give 6, well we'd better find that out quickly as to not have to high of hopes. So will any check a game where that has been built (anywhere, just use spies) with a version 1.21 and check. Thank you.

It is 8 I can promise you that, first it is in the civliopedia that is 8 and I have built it in 1-3 tournoment game and it is 8

I wish to join as well!

Yes, Shakespeare's is eight.

I had been wondering, what do you Culture Club Members (ar anyone really) think about colisseums? To me, they are pretty much the least useful culture building. In a few cities they could conceivably be more useful than universitites, but I believe this to be rare. Is there a way they could be changed with ruining game balance?

All of You have the Bless of the ONE. Go on, and make our people a temple of the ligth and the wisdom.

Colliseums I will only build when that is the only thing left, and have no need for gold or untis (rarely ever will I be able to build one then) and the culture they give for their cost is terrible.

In this GOTM, colliseums were in every way inferior to cathedrals. More shields needed, less culture, less happy faces, same upkeep. Not sure if this has something to do with the Iroquois being religious. The only good thing is that colliseums can be built slightly earlier and if you still need the extra happiness after cathedrals, then build colliseums.

Yes, it has to do with being religious. Cathedrals and Temples are half price for the Iroquois (and all religious civs), but colisseums are not. I belive that w/o religious, temples are 60 shields, colisseums are 120, and cathedrals are 160. Temples and colisseums provide 2 cpt, and cathedrals 3, IIRC. Temples cost 1 gpt, colisseums and cathdrals 2. Temples make one unhappy citizen content, colisseums and cathedrals 3. In terms of cost, a colisseum is essentially two temples, except culture is halved and one extra unhappy citizen is made content. Perhaps if a shrine improvement (as I outlined about tem posts up) were implemented, having a shrine and colisseum would be almost identical to having three temples. When I look at the numbers like this, colisseum doesn't seem so bad compared to temple. I wonder why temples are considered invaluable while colisseums get the short end of the stick. Unless, of course, you're religious, in which case it makes sense.

Also, what makes them more diminutive for us is the fact that they produce 2 happy faces Punkbass, and our Cathedrals make 6 because of the SIstene Chapel. Upkeep is the same, so if you had to choose between 10 colliseums or 10 cathedrals we'd have to do some math.
10 Coll. 10. Cath.
Sheild cost: 1200 1600
Culture: 20 30
Happiness: 20 60
Upkeep: 20 20
Then only way that Colliseums win is cost to build, and in everything else they lose more and more as each Cath is built.

With non-religious civs, I find colliseums also have a niche position in the game. It doesn't happen often that we need exactly 2 happy faces or want to spend exactly 120 shields instead of going back to temple or leaping to cathedrals.

To add to this, let's look at it more in depth at varying amounts of each.
1Coll. 1Cath
SHeild Cost: 120 160
Upkeep: 2 2
Culture: 2 3
Happiness: 2 6
Now we ask ourselves how much is culture worth. Well let's do averages at non-religous non-scientific structures. Adding together gets you, 60 for temple, 80 for library (140) 120 for colliseum (260) 160 for Cathedral (420) 200 for University (pretty sure, correct me if I'm wrong) (620) and how much for Research Labs? WE'll leave those out for now and factor them in later. 620 sheilds divided by how much culture? 2(temple) 2 (4) (Colliseum) 3 (7) (Library) 3 (10) (Cathedral) 4 (University) so a grand total of 14. now 620 divided by 14= about 45 sheilds for 1 culture. Now Colliseums produce 1 for 60 sheilds (so 15 above average) and Cathedrals produce 1 for 53 sheilds (so 7 better than colliseum) so we've a comparitive advantage for Cathedral's there. Now let's figure out happiness. 1 for 60, 2 for 120 and 3 for 160. 6 for 340, average of 56 shields for 1 happiness. Colliseums cost 60 for 1 happiness, and Cathedrals cost 53 for 1 (exact same for culture.) So another comparitive advantage for Cathedrals. But our Cathedrals produce double the happiness, so a total of 340 shields, divided by 9 happiness, gets you average of about 37 or 38 per 1 happiness. Now Colliseums are 22 above average (not good) and Cathedrals are about 26, or 12 below it, so a huge comparitive advantage.

Oh yes I forgot upkeep to figure out. 2 for each, so 1 upkeep produces 1 culture in Colliseums, and 1.5 in Cathedrals (comparitive advantage soaring) and for happiness ditto (huge comparitive advantage) So we can see that in almost everything Cathedrals have a comparitive advantage, if not an absolute one, so they are by far superiour to colliseums.

the founder or the leader of this citizen-group should register the group in the citizen-group registry (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23800)!

The Phoenatica Music Academy (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23936) is a great place to hear the new songs about our nation. Glad to see somebody is finally putting the Music Theory to good use ;). Some of the better will be played in JS Bach's Theatre itself!

I'm new here to the demo game, civfanatics and civ itself(Iwas missing out on something, eh!)!:D

I would like to join you culture club. Culture is very important, and must not be ignored.

I anyazes the situation and make the apporedite destion (forgive my spelling).

Thanks!!!! :goodjob: :cool: :) :D :) :cool: :goodjob:

Punkbass:The Phoenatica Music Academy is a great place to hear the new songs about our nation. Glad to see somebody is finally putting the Music Theory to good use . Some of the better will be played in JS Bach's Theatre itself!

Calling all punk rockers! Invade and take over Bach's Theatre! :flamedevi

We who respect decent music, generally classical shall notallow this, for it is tantamount to blasphemy to change what one person dedicated his life to to something he'd be agaisnt.

I don't think such a thing as... punk rock... has been invented. :confused:

of course! this tendency was already there all the time!

Punk rock is indefinable, IMO.

I will join this great and worthy group!

Culture is the main thing a civilization should strive for. We should strive to make all other peoples admire our cultural beauty, not our swords! An army should be for defense, not for killing. All people have the right to live! And the right to live in a cultural society. Such should be the great Phoenatica!

Originally posted by Zur


Calling all punk rockers! Invade and take over Bach's Theatre! :flamedevi

YES! JS Bach's shall reverberate to the sound of punk rock and avant-guarde jazz insanity! :D

avant-garde jazz? :confused:

once we develop "regicide" we can safely play The Sex Pistols

Old school :)

Originally posted by punkbass2000
avant-garde jazz? :confused:
Yep. You heard me :p Rockers don't have a monopoly on ear-bleeding noise you know! :D

There are some amazing new scientific advancements to be seen in the Phoenatica Cultural Museum (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=20332).

There are new advances to be found in Phoenatica Cultural Museum (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=330972#post330972). Business will never be structured the same way again, I hear.

I'm in

I will join.

Our military has built us up to this great position in the world. But it is now time for our glorious culture to take over. We can use this culture to cement our place in history. We should use the majority of our funds to build up this culture, along with scientific research and fostering trade, and less on our military.

As a member of the Phoenatica Pacifists League, I fell it right to join this worthy group.

BTW, I think we deverse Bach's music in his cathedral.

Im joining because culture is the greatest thing to win over our rivals

Does this citizen group still exist? Since im comiling all the citizen group for the tourism association i need to know weather to add it or omit it from the records.

thx
Phoenatica Tourism Assoc.