View Full Version : Turns 80-100


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Tubby Rower
May 07, 2007, 06:09 AM
Turns 1-20 (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=199569)

Turns 21-43 (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=207903)

Turns 44-60 (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=213278)

Turns 61-80 (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=216327)

Now that we've made a friend let's rape their houses and burn their women!!!

Tubby Rower
May 07, 2007, 06:11 AM
so by chance have we seen their curragh or was it claimed by Davy Jones via the Krakin?

Wotan
May 09, 2007, 02:08 AM
No signs their Curragh made it, at least not yet. There are a few dark tiles they could still be hiding in on our side of the water.
Republic in 12 turns maybe 11? FP will help but probably not more than 2-3 gold per turn? Republic will with current production and cities allow us to have an additional 15 units at a balanced economy. Our plan is to have an additional 15 above that when attacking. Building two major objects, FP and GLH is hurting our economy but we will hopefully benefit from it and have a quick ROI. Just as long as none beats us to the GLH...
5 turns to FP, 10 turns to GLH. Both projects are MMed to the last shield... ;) So if for some reason anyone else plays the turns please let me help with detailed instructions...
We are up Lit, MM and HBR on SABER.
Second Barracks on line next turn.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotou.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotov.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotow.JPG

Tubby Rower
May 09, 2007, 05:30 AM
well there are other decent wonders that we could cascade to if necessary. I doubt that we'll be beat to all of the "good" wonders

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 09, 2007, 08:37 AM
I doubt anyone is building anything currently, to be honest. Just maybe MOM in Georgetown.

Robi D
May 09, 2007, 09:08 AM
Its interesting that they have gone with a lot more coastal towns. Would there be any reason for that?

From what i recall in civ 3 coastal spots were not particularly good

Tubby Rower
May 09, 2007, 09:15 AM
no their not unless they are going completely ICS. For the most part, coastal cities allow for the most room for cities on a given island landmass.

Robi D
May 09, 2007, 09:18 AM
Ok thanks tubby, i think our layout is nicer, and better names too ;)

ThERat
May 09, 2007, 10:16 AM
if you look at their coast, they will just miss that whale. a bit unfair as they would have to waste an oasis to grab it...our coast seems a little kinder

one more thing I wanted to ask much earlier, is there any particular reason that our workers aren't ganged up together? I usually play that way to get improvements up faster

Wotan
May 09, 2007, 10:25 AM
one more thing I wanted to ask much earlier, is there any particular reason that our workers aren't ganged up together? I usually play that way to get improvements up faster
When there is a point to it they do. Near Li-Lo there are duos at work, as there is in the south. It all comes down to when we need a certain resource improved and also if there is a road in place at the time. Without a road each Worker moving into a tile cost a turn of worker actions. I prefer to avoid extra costs if possible. Using each Worker where he can do the most to help our game is the core purpose of the allocations. Not speed itself.

ThERat
May 09, 2007, 08:22 PM
Wotan, I was sure that you would be the master of optimization in this regard, was just asking. I also have to switch my mindset a little as workers simply take a turn break when they finish their improvement. That alters things quite a little

Whomp
May 09, 2007, 08:38 PM
Wotan, I was sure that you would be the master of optimization in this regard, was just asking. I also have to switch my mindset a little as workers simply take a turn break when they finish their improvement. That alters things quite a little

Isn't it if the project is done in two it's actually done or is it the IT.? :hmm:

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 09, 2007, 09:02 PM
Yeah, the worker takes the same time as usual, but the action is done an IBT sooner and you gain the improvement at the 2 turns left mark.

The thing that mixes it up is the inability to move the worker out of his square the turn he would end normally. That can be painful.

It can be used with attack units as well, though: I don't know to what full extent this works, but you can queue a move for the "turn after" and get it moved on the ibt. For instance, I remember having a spear at 2/4, 2 tiles away from a mountain during a barb uprising. I sent it on its way to the mountain and it got there in time for the barbs' IT. He died though. But the discovery was worth a spear.

BCLG100
May 09, 2007, 09:41 PM
Your not allowed to use go to's iirc in the mtdg. grahamiam had a word whilst i was tnt turnplayer last time when i left some units on go to's by accident.

Wotan
May 10, 2007, 03:27 AM
The Workers are available just as in Single player Civ. It is just that it is easier to plan tile usage with this system where the IBT development of a tile is shown "the turn before" so you will know what output a turn has after worker actions. In Single player Civ you need to "guess" what effects an additional shield or gold will have. If it is lost to corruption or not. So I prefer this system, makes it much easier to plan. But Workers can move exactly the same as when they can in Single player.

Still no signs their Curragh made it.
Republic in 11 turns maybe 10?
4 turns to FP, 9 turns to GLH. Joined a Worker to LF to generate enough food to finish it in 9 turns. Next turn 2 Workers will move an mine the last irrigated plains so the final 5 turns will produce an additional shield. This will actually put 301 shields into the GLH, what a waste of production... ;)
Third Barracks on line next turn.
Galley spotted another stretch of coastals, nothing suggest it is a coastline similar to our islands so might be a land mass that is "common lands"? One Settler onboard to claim it!
One tiler will have a town next turn, name?
There is one town on mainland still missing a "babe" name, suggestions?
Another town to be started in two turns, name?
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotox.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotoy.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotoz.JPG

ThERat
May 10, 2007, 03:37 AM
looks like their dinky didn't make it :D

hey, I didn't spot that 1 tile resting place for our galley, this is great, let's hope there is land for us to settle!

I still think we won't be able to start an invasion in 20 turns...2 raxes and nil MW's so far...not very promising, did someone do some calculations there how long it would take to assemble the armada?

Btw, since we honored the Russia Oil Czar with a city name and his team didn't actually achieve much this year, it would be time to honor the real winner in soccer this year. Or how about sponsors of soccer teams in general, shady characters like Berlusconi...

or how about some German models that made it big in this world. We could of course include some characters of the desperate housewives, since I am watching the whole season 1 on dvd these days (and enjoy that OCD character Bree van der Kamp, reminding me so much of my ex-wife)

Robi D
May 10, 2007, 04:45 AM
I noticed the coastal tiles just 3 squares NW of our galley. Looks like we are about to make some new friends :D

Or how about sponsors of soccer teams in general, shady characters like Berlusconi...

:lol: Berlusconni's.... what? there are so many things to choose from, he owns newspapers, TV stations and he was Prime Minister of Italy.

Tubby Rower
May 10, 2007, 05:39 AM
RE: names

I've updated the Naming Thread (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=200380) with our current list of city names. I propose that the settler on the island be named Maryann and the one across the sea be named Ginger since the involve settling islands via dinghy. Rename this! could be any of the names at the bottom of the last post in the thread above.

Wotan
May 11, 2007, 03:23 AM
Founded Maryann on the one tiler.
Republic in 10 turns maybe 9?
3 turns to FP, 8 turns to GLH.
Still up the same three techs on SABER.
Galley found land! Though the first few tiles to become visible are all mountains... There is a stretch of three tiles just outside of view and the easternmost looks as if it is a grassland, the other two could be hills or additional mountains. One Settler onboard to claim a site on this island!
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpa.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpb.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpc.JPG

ThERat
May 11, 2007, 03:53 AM
If this is a connector Island, we should be able to unload the settler and meet others following around the Island. Interesting setup really.

I notice how our GNP is now second already, that looks good though I am a little surprised that we are only #2 in land and pop

Tubby Rower
May 11, 2007, 05:41 AM
well if those settlers going over seas would have planted on our island, we would likely be #1 in land. GNP is always a mystery to me since we are commercial. :dunno: I would suggest that the galley come back after dropping off the settler to pick up a warrior and a worker. That way the new city (named Ginger) could start on another settler to fill in that piece of land.

Wotan
May 11, 2007, 06:10 AM
Definitely the reason we are not in the lead in territory. Sending two Settlers on a trek across our island, board a Galley and then go for a cruise cost us a considerable amount of turns we could have been using them as towns on our mainland.

Whomp
May 11, 2007, 01:24 PM
I would not be surprised that Rik put a random resource island out there. Coal, oil or uranium or lux could be a possibility. I think it was worth the trip just in case.

Tubby Rower
May 11, 2007, 01:27 PM
just so people could start thinking what to do... what should we do if there is someone already occupying the island? I think that would be considered extremely hostile to plant a city on someone else's homeland. But if it's just an "outpost" island (Gilligan's Isle) then I would argue that we definately settle it.

Robi D
May 11, 2007, 08:33 PM
It doesn't look like any part of our island and from what we have seen of sabers the team islands seem to be identical.

I did say a while back that going by the size of our island if the other 4 were the same there would have to be other land out there, maybe this is it

ThERat
May 12, 2007, 06:41 PM
Next turn we will know better about that mystery Island and I think it's perfectly fine to settle there. As suggested, bring over more stuff there as well.

Wotan
May 13, 2007, 06:06 PM
Republic in 9 turns?
2 turns to FP, 7 turns to GLH.
Still up the same three techs on SABER.
Galley found land! An Ivory and two Iron deposits plus an additional horse. I would suggest settling on the horse with the Settler that is now on the island. Pick up another in four turns and settle hill next to the GH. Ship a Worker too and start the first town on a Harbour. LF to build a harbour too after the GLH is finished.
Found an Iron province in SABER country.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpe.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpd.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpf.JPG

ThERat
May 13, 2007, 07:54 PM
hey, excellent news :goodjob:

if that's the only source of ivory, we might even have a shot at SoZ. But then, it would take navigation to get that back to our continent isn't it? GLH wouldn't help in this regard I guess.

The iron source is interesting, we need to prevent that they connect it just before our conquest there.

Vind2
May 13, 2007, 08:22 PM
Could we get a minimap pic please :)

Wotan
May 14, 2007, 12:03 AM
Could we get a minimap pic please :)

Last turn's minimap isn't enough for your needs? Everything that has changed re. visible tiles is in the two map pics posted this turn.

Wotan
May 14, 2007, 02:51 AM
if that's the only source of ivory, we might even have a shot at SoZ. But then, it would take navigation to get that back to our continent isn't it? GLH wouldn't help in this regard I guess.



AFAIK GLH do allow trade through sea tiles so it would connect the iron and the ivory. But did we not agree to allow SoZ to be built without the need for Ivory?

gmaharriet
May 14, 2007, 02:58 AM
Last turn's minimap isn't enough for your needs?

Me too, please. I'd like to see the relationship between the new iron island and where we are located on the map.

If SABER has iron, let's hope they don't have horses. That would even things out just a bit. :p

Wotan
May 14, 2007, 03:29 AM
Me too, please. I'd like to see the relationship between the new iron island and where we are located on the map.

So the hint about moving back to the report from last turn was not obvious enough? ;) We have for the last few turns moved our Galley slowly northwest from our island, so I would have thought it would be pretty obvious the small ivory/iron island would be in that area? At least if you follow the turn reporting. It is not as if the island suddenly appeared out of nowhere.

I am trying to include pics of new info as well as a permanent posting of the F11 screen though I guess the value of that screen will slowly diminish as the game moves forward. Things that are not really adding to the story/progress I guess the really inquisive can find by opening a save. ;)

Post 15 in this tread has a good pic of the Galley halfway to the island and a minmap with about thesame amount of into that is in a current Minimap.

Tubby Rower
May 14, 2007, 05:20 AM
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotox.JPG
for those scroll-challenged

Tubby Rower
May 14, 2007, 05:22 AM
RE: settling location... why not move 1 NW to get the GH popped?

Tubby Rower
May 14, 2007, 05:23 AM
Also.... that sort of sucks that we have to go off-shore to get iron and SABER has it domestically. Now if they don't have gunpowder and we do, then that sort of makes it even but it would suck the other way around (isn't that blowing?)

ThERat
May 14, 2007, 06:03 AM
well, let's just eliminate Saber before they even smell saltpeter...

I think the F11 screen is not needed to be included anymore. I rather have screens of our city builds and maybe military in the future. I guess we soon get some MW's going. Also, how many galleys do we already own. This is all important for the upcoming war

gmaharriet
May 14, 2007, 06:37 AM
for those scroll-challenged

Thanks, Tubby! Sorry to be a PITA. :blush: I don't know enough to make intelligent suggestions and I know Wotan doesn't suffer fools gladly (per one of the SGOTMs), so I just wanted ask about something I wasn't clear on. I'm not very good at visualizing spatial relationships.

Wotan
May 14, 2007, 06:54 AM
RE: settling location... why not move 1 NW to get the GH popped?
we could but a few things would occur if we do this.
1. The current location is safe from Barbs appearing, the Grassland is not. Our Galley currently safeguards against Barbs appearing in the same tile the settler is but will move back to pick up another Settler/Worker/Warrior. We could delay it but that would also require the Galley to move around the southern peninsula to "safeguard" the Grassland. That is another two turns (I think).
2. Settling the Grassland would put the southernmost mountain outside of our "seen" tiles thus making it unsafe for potential Barbs appearing until we either have an expansion from culture or place a military unit on the mountain. We don't know how the island is shaped morth and west of the currently visible tiles.
3. Another settler is going there anyway and with 9 turns to go on Republic we are in no hurry to pop the GH. If we do it now the only tech we can get is Masonry. So we might even discuss a plan to wait until Republic is finished and then "start" on masonry for a chance of getting Poly if we are lucky to get a tech from the GH.

Will change from F11 to F3 info soon.

Tubby Rower
May 14, 2007, 06:59 AM
k. good reasons to ignore my suggestion. ;)

Wotan
May 14, 2007, 07:05 AM
Thanks, Tubby! Sorry to be a PITA. :blush: I don't know enough to make intelligent suggestions and I know Wotan doesn't suffer fools gladly (per one of the SGOTMs), so I just wanted ask about something I wasn't clear on. I'm not very good at visualizing spatial relationships.
I can assure you I am harmless. ;) Just don't think we should treat the team as in need of constantly having obvious things explicitely discussed. Playing Civ is something that sort of require at least some activity showing in the upper parts of a human body. :D I hope it is OK for me to continue not posting a full report of everything each turn but condense it to what is new and in need of attention?

ThERat
May 14, 2007, 07:09 AM
Wotan, looking closely at the Island, it does look as if there are no other tiles (can see the sea all around)

ThERat
May 14, 2007, 07:23 AM
I had a look at the save, things look good except for 2 minor MM issues, but they aren't important.

Well, we will get republic in 9 (or 8 if the FP does something) and the GLH around the same time.

Are we going to wait for revolting until we send our MW party over to Saber? I think we should wait and then revolt, but I don't know whether my gut feeling is right or wrong. However, we should reach a consensus here

Tubby Rower
May 14, 2007, 07:25 AM
revolting early will decrease corruption in shields and gold. I'd recommend revolting as early as possible as that'll help us build up the appropriate forces for some booti kicking

Wotan
May 14, 2007, 08:09 AM
I had a look at the save, things look good except for 2 minor MM issues, but they aren't important.

? If you have spotted anything please let us know. I did the turn late yesterday evening in case Council should decide to actually speed things up for once so might have missed something. Well, why bother to rush it, they have of course not made an effort to shorthen the turn around time when they have the save...

My vote: Revolt ASAP, when GLH is ready.

ThERat
May 14, 2007, 08:16 AM
If you have spotted anything please let us know.well, I can only see tile assignment before you did your turn.

I spotted Reese could work the BG instead of the sea tile not losing any commerce (with the warrior inside)
Rachel B was working a forest when no shield was gained, could go for the lake instead (added commerce and growth)

as I said, minor

oh, and a question, are you going to mine the irrigated plot at our GLH town?

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 14, 2007, 08:28 AM
Tubs, I wouldn't kick booti, he's funny.

Tubby Rower
May 14, 2007, 08:31 AM
did you hear him yesterday? last year his congregation made him pound sand :lol:

Wotan
May 14, 2007, 08:46 AM
well, I can only see tile assignment before you did your turn.

I spotted Reese could work the BG instead of the sea tile not losing any commerce (with the warrior inside)
Rachel B was working a forest when no shield was gained, could go for the lake instead (added commerce and growth)

as I said, minor

oh, and a question, are you going to mine the irrigated plot at our GLH town?
Thanks, will check why next time I have a look at the game. I seem to remember the RachelB thing being a case of growth and the game placing a citizen on the forest. It is not on the forest now. Reese I can't remember now.
Mining the plot, yes! Else We will not finish the GLH in 7 turns. It need to make 12 spt for the last 4 turns and will only have 6 food aggregated so placing the FP citizen on a mountain will not do the trick. Only option is to mine the plains and when that is finished reirrigate a couple of mined plains for better growth.

Kickbooti
May 14, 2007, 11:57 AM
Tubs, I wouldn't kick booti, he's funny.

Thanks for watching my back Boern. I'm keeping an eye on Tubby, I don't know what I did but...

My guard is up around Mother's Day anyway; if I make a mistake then I can get skewered by corsage pins or beat to death with hats. A very never wracking time.

Oh, and the sand is all pounded. This week the congregation is making me go interact with 30,000 Harley riders at Blessing of the Bikes. I agreed as long as my deacons promised to play the role of the Hell's Angels from the Altamont concert. I'll keep you posted. ;)

Tubby Rower
May 14, 2007, 12:01 PM
I'm keeping an eye on Tubby, I don't know what I did but... You did nothing.... I enjoyed our chats in the past. I too think that you have quite the wit about you. I'm upset that I don't have the time to spend on MSN like I did in the first game. I miss you guys :cry: Glad to hear that you haven't ticked off you patrons. :thumbsup:

Whomp
May 14, 2007, 12:20 PM
Question for everyone. If that island is empty it must be a gateway to all the other teams. Should we be sending it home or out to meet some others?

I concur with Wotan. Revolt ASAP, when GLH is ready.

Oh and leave Booti alone! ;)

Don't mod my forum, you noob !! :D - Rik

Tubby Rower
May 14, 2007, 12:22 PM
That's freaking scary. Whomp must have pics of TF with live boys or dead girls to get a mod spot :lol:

I would be up for a bit of exploration with the galley around that island.

BCLG100
May 14, 2007, 12:45 PM
:lol: thats a banning right there!

Kickbooti
May 14, 2007, 03:27 PM
Oh and leave Booti alone! ;)

I can see from his early actions that Whomp's reign will be segatious and munificent.

As a person accustomed to having friends in high places, this still is quite a thrill.

Congrats Whomp. :beer:

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 14, 2007, 05:25 PM
That's freaking scary. Whomp must have pics of TF with live boys or dead girls to get a mod spot :lol::rotfl:

Whomp might have just talked TF into ceding him the whole rig but eventually they settled on making Whomp a mod with no restrictions :assimilate:

gmaharriet
May 14, 2007, 06:00 PM
Oh and leave Booti alone! ;)

Don't mod my forum, you noob !! :D - Rik

Wow! I'm impressed!!! If that's your first official warning, it's a great one to begin with, and I concur.

Oops! We're not allowed to discuss moderator actions on the forum, are we? :blush:

Well, since it's the first time I've noticed your new status, I'll have to ask which forum(s) you're assigned to. Have you banned AK yet? J/K :lol:

Seriously, I can't think of anyone on the board better qualified. You're a solid, knowledgable player and no one can surpass your tact and diplomacy. Love ya, Whomper!!!

ThERat
May 14, 2007, 07:21 PM
didn't we have a spam thread opened which is pretty empty :crazyeye:

checking out the surroundings of this Island sounds right, but only after picking up that said worker/settler pair.

so, I guess everyone agrees to revolt immediately after GLH is in...let's hope for less than 7 turns anarchy

Wotan
May 16, 2007, 01:38 AM
First MW ready.
Republic in 8 turns?
1 turn to FP, 6 turns to GLH.
Still up the same three techs on SABER.
Ginger is now active on Ivory island.
Saber about to place a town on their iron.
Galley in the south found similar sea pattern as we have observed at teh south tip of SABERs island.
Next turn Li-Lo can start helping us churn out MWs, but first we need a Barracks.
Plan to have two Settlers on a Galley ready to cross to SABER island when we have the GLH. We will lose out on the expansion a bit but claiming the two one-tilers near them will make our war on them much easier. If we leave them alone they might soon have MM and start towns theer, towns that will remain until marines are available... With an ability to move in sea tiles we are safe from any Barb.Galleys so no need to send more than a single Galley.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotph.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpg.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpi.JPG

Robi D
May 16, 2007, 04:48 AM
Yay, we have 2 islands :)

Wotan
May 16, 2007, 04:54 AM
Hrmm, we actually have three islands... :D

Tubby Rower
May 16, 2007, 05:15 AM
what's interesting is that team Free has been tracking along with us in score. They are likely the ones that have been claiming the land lead while we were sending settlers off-shore. But now we have the land lead back. Pretty soon everyone will run out of land on their starting island and be looking to the islands that we have already claimed. Poor Saber will be kicking themselves once our galley drops off settlers on not one but two of the 1-tilers next to their main island.


RE: ginger. Should it be building a harbor? what about a worker or a settler or even a warrior? This is more of a question as opposed to a suggestion.

Wotan
May 16, 2007, 05:34 AM
Free has Kuningas on the team. We have played on the same SGOTM team in the past and have similar focus on city management.

Ginger should definitely focus on a Harbour, we want the ivory connected ASAP. An additional Settler and a Worker will be picked up in three turns and moved to settle the hill next to the GH and start improving the island with roads. When LF finish the GLH it should build a Harbour and when that is ready we should rush the harbour in Ginger. the extra lux will pay for the rushed harbour fairly quick.

Tubby Rower
May 16, 2007, 05:41 AM
I just noticed the nice Pony stationed outside of Scarlett Johanason :goodjob:

BCLG100
May 16, 2007, 06:47 AM
looks like saber will be getting their iron hooked up in a couple of turns then..

Robi D
May 16, 2007, 07:14 AM
Hrmm, we actually have three islands... :D

The one tiler is hardly worthy of full island status, islet maybe ;)

Wotan
May 16, 2007, 07:18 AM
The one tiler is hardly worthy of full island status, islet maybe ;)
Maybe we should take this to the "save ThERat" thread? But I can't resist a reply:
In that case we only have one island and an islet and a "Continent". :lol:

Tubby Rower
May 16, 2007, 07:20 AM
Maybe we should take this to the "save ThERat" thread? meh... insanity is bound to spill over.

Robi D
May 16, 2007, 07:30 AM
Maybe we should take this to the "save ThERat" thread? But I can't resist a reply:
In that case we only have one island and an islet and a "Continent". :lol:

Touche :)

meh... insanity is bound to spill over.

I think with us its the opposite, Insanity rules with reason occasionally spilling over

Wotan
May 16, 2007, 07:31 AM
Right now the next six turns are of extreme importance for our future plans. I wish the other teams understand why we want them played rapidly. :D Or maybe better they just play them fast without understanding the urgency. ;)

Tubby Rower
May 16, 2007, 07:34 AM
not to be a dunce... but why do we need them played quickly? and what happens in 6 turns? (Republic is in 8... GLH is still a ways a way correct- 16 according to the screenie?)

BCLG100
May 16, 2007, 07:37 AM
Thats nothing, a team now in civ4 isdg has been sitting on the save for nearly a week. still nothing happening despite 2 e-mails to the admins.

Wotan
May 16, 2007, 07:45 AM
Thats nothing, a team now in civ4 isdg has been sitting on the save for nearly a week. still nothing happening despite 2 e-mails to the admins.

6 turns to go on the GLH, 70 shields missing and we make 11 next turn and then 12 for four turns until the final turn is back at 11 for a total of 70. We are playing a little cloaking game with SABER using the GLib as a cover until the very last turn.

Since we only get info on GWs under construction for the teams we have met there is still a risk someone might beat us to it. That is why I want the next few turns over and done with. So we can fully focus on building our invasion fleet and liberate SABERland.

Kickbooti
May 16, 2007, 08:12 AM
But I can't resist a reply:
In that case we only have one island and an islet and a "Continent". :lol:

Okay, Continent, Island and inContinent

ThERat
May 16, 2007, 09:11 AM
if things turn out well, we will have 2 continents, 4 isles and 1 Island...good enough?

agree on rushing the harbor if we can connect ivory to our mainland then prior to navigation (which I am still unsure) edit: after checking the save, I think ivory will be connected as there are no ocean tiles separating the Island from our continent

May suggest that we use the galley that will pick up a worker/settler to then explore round that island and maybe get more contacts up soonish. From there, we should have access to other teams for sure

Kickbooti
May 16, 2007, 10:21 AM
I agree with sending the galley exploring beyond OUR Island after it brings up some reinforcements. I'd also say that the galley to the south should go exploring that way (I'm assuming what that is doing, but it's hard to keep up; Gma is trying to kill me with the volume of reading required on her SG).

Also, where will we be rallying our invasion force? I guess we should keep most of the MW inland just out of habit so that no other future galley's would spot them. Alghough the galley's will be tougher to hide.

Would it be prudent to have a ralley point in the ocean after we get the Great Lighthouse? Ocean squares should be safe from prying eyes for awhile.

Just a thought.

BCLG100
May 16, 2007, 12:16 PM
could we not land a city on isle of saber a few turns before the invasion?

Kickbooti
May 16, 2007, 12:34 PM
could we not land a city on isle of saber a few turns before the invasion?

I think we should do that, I meant in the meantime. IF Saber gets a boat across the ocean and runs upon a city with 14 galleys and a bunch of MW they might get a wee bit suspicious.

I was just pondering operational security while we are building up.

My thought was keep most of the MW inland so they are invisible from the shore, and (maybee) put our galley stack on an ocean tile where they would be invisilbe (and I'm assuming safe with the GLH) until they are needed.

I'm just trying to be paranoid.

BCLG100
May 16, 2007, 01:13 PM
In civ3 i thought you could only see one unit within each city?

Tubby Rower
May 16, 2007, 01:13 PM
you can. it's the biggest defender in the city. So a spearman would cover anything we have until pikes

Kickbooti
May 16, 2007, 01:50 PM
That's what I get for playing CIV at the same time :blush:

BCLG100
May 16, 2007, 02:31 PM
join in mine and robi's pbem then! :)

Wotan
May 16, 2007, 04:25 PM
Ocean is not safe but sea is, with the GLH.

Galley on south coast is planning to move towards SABER to gain one turn by ship chaining. Another Galley will finish in 5 turns in time to cross the southern sea passage when we have the GLH. No need for the current Galley to sit idle until then when it can help shorten the time it takes for our Settlers to reach the islets off SABER coast.

Wotan
May 17, 2007, 04:03 AM
And our first major project is finished:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpj.JPG
GLH is 5 turns from a nice pic.
Republic in 7 turns.
SABER still missing the three techs.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpl.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpk.JPG

Tubby Rower
May 17, 2007, 09:09 AM
did improved corruption increase our shields and gold or was it about the same?

Wotan
May 17, 2007, 09:21 AM
Sure did, corruption reduced by 5 gold and we gained a couple of shields. Still not that great an effect but will definitely help us when the towns start growing. that is roughly 5% BTW.

Tubby Rower
May 17, 2007, 09:34 AM
I started to wonder about the makeup of the world... I superimposed a part of the known world into the blackness that is not known and came up with this future map....

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/52950/Image6.jpg

ThERat
May 17, 2007, 09:36 AM
I attempted to edit the minimap to fit 5 of our continent onto it, but the end result looked terrible...however, there isn't much space in any direction, so once we have GLH, we should go southwest and northwest to meet more folks...

I am trying to open the save to follow what you're doing, Wotan, so I can jump in just in case

edit: Tubby, your minimap looks so much better than what I attempted

Tubby Rower
May 17, 2007, 09:39 AM
I suspect that the resource isles are to the SE (and NW) of each continent. it might be worth it to see if we could get some access to the one to our SE as well as the ones SE of the orange continent and to the NW of the mystery continent

ThERat
May 17, 2007, 09:53 AM
I can't believe that there are many resource Islands...it's just too crammed...you know that if we move southeast, we are close to Saber land again...

I suspect that this resource Island has resources for all of us, that are missing from the home continent. Like for us, we lack iron, so there might just be saltpeter as well or coal.

btw, is the rule of the game that we can't deny access to the Isle by blocking all coastal tiles? I can foresee a war for that Island, if the resources are really crucial

Tubby Rower
May 17, 2007, 09:55 AM
Here's the entire world... resource isles are circled in green

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/52950/Image10.jpg

Tubby Rower
May 17, 2007, 10:08 AM
btw, that last version I did... I used the minimap and the final picture is a larger scale but the hieght-width ratio is the exact same scale as the mini-map.

so based off of this, we need to deny Saber their NW resource isle by settling it post haste ... imo

Tubby Rower
May 17, 2007, 10:22 AM
Looking at this a little more... I don't think that we need to explore to the SW. Try to follow me here.


Our resource isle is to the SE of Continent #1. WE should be able to continue to the NW of our resource isle and get accross to Continent #1. Then scoot to the SE of Continent #1 to meet continent #2.

That would free up the galley in the south to wait for a settler and claim the resource isle to our SE (Saber's NW).

Kickbooti
May 17, 2007, 10:29 AM
I think Tubby's proposal is reasonable.

And assuming the general accuracy of his map, I have a question.

What are we doing with Saber's land? Are we simply science farming it (that is a phrase I have heard but don't understand). Are we going to palace jump and actually try to have TWO production bases? Are we just going to raze it, get a bunch of veteran troops and then repeat the operation?

And I agree with Tubby, we really should try to go SE and see if there is a resource Island there. Cutting Saber off is a universal good. After all, they will be much happier under our reign - inside every Ottoman is a little Iriqois waiting to come out.

Tubby Rower
May 17, 2007, 10:48 AM
What are we doing with Saber's land? well their land only is the continent they started on. Once we conquer them, we'll be science farming most likely I'd imagine...

Science farming is where you farm every tile for max food. Then you make excess citizens scientists. That way you can support the increased pop from the scientists and at the same time make 3 beakers per turn for science. Adding a library and a granary enhance this effect.

Whomp
May 17, 2007, 11:00 AM
I'm not sure a library will support the cost of a corrupted science farm however sometimes a harbor or courthouse will help. The key to the science farm is the increase in unit support and the scientists that are supported by watering everything around the city.

Tubs those maps are really helpful to give a visual. Thanks.

ThERat
May 17, 2007, 11:05 AM
After all, they will be much happier under our reign - inside every Ottoman is a little Iriqois waiting to come out.:lol: :lol: :lol:

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 17, 2007, 11:11 AM
Tubs, these maps look awesome. It would also make a lot of sense, and bring a lot of props to Rik for thinking about that. It makes every continent as balanced as possible with respect with everything else.

Whomp
May 17, 2007, 11:14 AM
Tubs I think it's worthwhile starting a map room thread. It would also help detailing distances for our future conquests too.

Tubby Rower
May 17, 2007, 11:21 AM
Crazy Cartographers' Corner (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=222537) has been established

BCLG100
May 17, 2007, 01:22 PM
Basically booti if your still with civ 4- science farming is like running a specialised economy but only on crappy cities.

Kickbooti
May 17, 2007, 01:41 PM
Thanks for the explination. Now for a follow up.

Keep in mind I am emotional civ player. I care about my electronic minions and want them to be happy, healthy and wise; so cut-throat pragmatisim doesn't come naturally.

Having said that, once we take Saberland and make it a science farm, what do we do? Do we defend it? Do we milk it until other civs have the ability to invade it and rely on the tech boost it provided in the interim? I mean, once we take out Saber (which we have to do) other civs 1) won't like us 2) won't trust us 3) will be jealous of our obvious superiority and our tech farm.

Do we simply keep on rolling with invasions? Do we build a HUGE navy and spank anyone on the open seas? An idea I had in the last game was to make a large Rapid Deployment Force whoes sole purpose was to cruise the waves, look for a weakness, pop in, burn a city or two, get back on the boats and sail off in the firelight. The thought was just to keep the others off balance and hopefully destroy some infestructure and divert resources to defense.

Anyway, what do we do...once we have the science farm...which I now understand...thanks again.

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 17, 2007, 02:49 PM
Rapid deployment force would be good at this stage. Later on, cavalries will intercept too quickly.

My idea of multiplayer warfare is to get to the bottom of things if at all possible, turn into beaker farms and send defenders. Keep a mobile assault force ready to intervene, but keep it on the main, since it's where we want it most if they attack. Once we have an extra island, chances are the others will be ready to greet us. It won't help us outproducing their military so we'll be a bit weaker to them.

What we gain is economic power. We'll have to use that to outresearch them and try to get unit advantage - to cavalries or tanks if we want to be able to kill anyone, to infantries if we want to defend ourselves and win by space.

Wotan
May 17, 2007, 03:15 PM
This is the layout I have been suspecting. The Curragh northeast of SABER will move NE and hopefully find the team there after GLH. There is a Galley finishing in three turns in (Hughes?) ready to cross to the SE when the GLH is built. The second Settler from now in Hef's (7 turns) will board and hopefully claim an island. I have intentionally left a Warrior to accompany him.

Science farming SABER seems like the most appropriate use of it. If we do get the GLH we will have a window of relative security reaching until Astronomy so we better be real aggressive until then.

ThERat
May 17, 2007, 08:34 PM
If we do get the GLH we will have a window of relative security reaching until Astronomy so we better be real aggressive until then.Absolutely agreed, what might happen though, is that others will gang up against us, if we succeed to take over Saber land...

Robi D
May 18, 2007, 12:45 AM
Looking at Tubby's wonderful composite map has given me an idea. We need to confirm it so we need to get a galley going south east from the south western point of our continent. If the map is correct its a second sea passage to Saber which would be a big bonus in attacking them.

Why? Because Saber can see our connection to them via the north east passage so they will more than likely have more troops in that area because of that and because its closer to there core. What they wont expect is an attack from their north, which according to the map we could do just as easily.

If we attack from the obvious direction first with around 1/3 of our forces they will no doubt get all their defenders heading there, leaving them completely exposed down the eastern flank to the remaining 2/3 of our attackers coming down from the north. Call it Robi's carrot and stick tactic;)

Wotan
May 18, 2007, 04:42 AM
Like your idea Robi, it is also shorter for us to reinforce though we end up farther from their core. But combining the two shoudl be interesting. With luck we should soon have iron connected and can add a few Swordmen to the force for basic protection. Not a big fan of defensive action, Civ is just too "attack" friendly so they are just there for some minimal protection.

Robi D
May 18, 2007, 04:46 AM
We would only really need swordsmen in Sabers south east as they will have units within striking range of the landing force. Our Northern force should be just MW's so where in the open spaces we can make full use of their speed.

Robi D
May 18, 2007, 05:23 AM
To illustrate the suggestion a little better here's tubby's map with the attack

http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/9264/image10apk3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Our 1st Army would land in Sabers SE, maybe take a city but mainly draw all of Sabers forces there.

The 2nd Army would land in the far north a few turns later and going flying down the south coast. They could split into 3 groups of 4 to cover a wider area.

With these numbers we would need;
9 galleys, 2 swords and 16 MWs. A total of 27 units

Don't know if that's possible on our schedule, Wotan or one of the other MMers to work out but we can scale down if required, for example
1st army: 1 sword, 3 MWs, 2 galleys
2nd army: 10 MWs, 5 galleys (MWs split into 2 squads of 5)
For a total of 21 units.

Finally another thing to consider is which cities to keep. Ideally it would be close to all of them but the more we keep, but that will make the war longer too which is not so ideal.
I'm thinking maybe keep just the core 5 or 6 and raze the rest, as a quick war is better in the long run, and we can always rebuild.

Also if this discussion is going to get more involved maybe we should start a General's Quarters thread to keep this one clean for Wotan to display his MMing mastery;)

Tubby Rower
May 18, 2007, 05:26 AM
if they are doing like us and going all out ICS in the north then we should have a ton of cities by the time that they could get anyone up there to defend it.

Another option is just hitting another continent without even knowing who is there. now that would be a surprise!! "oh btw, our teams have met and you now have 15 MW in your backfield." :lol:

Tubby Rower
May 18, 2007, 05:34 AM
Robi's Rowdy Riding Roughnecks (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=222648) is now the Saber killing planning thread. get out of here you war-mongers :p

Kickbooti
May 18, 2007, 08:30 AM
Great idea Rob. And nice maps, Tubs. With the MMers Crystal ball and the Warmongers Spleen victory is surely ours!

Robi D
May 18, 2007, 10:05 AM
Another option is just hitting another continent without even knowing who is there. now that would be a surprise!! "oh btw, our teams have met and you now have 15 MW in your backfield." :lol:

This would certainly simplify the diplomatic process.

We could have a Generic greeting letter


Greetings (insert name),

We are glad to finally meet you after all this time.
After a preliminary inspection of your lands you have been deemed worthy of becoming a minor province of our evergrowing glorious empire.
To make sure this transition happens as seemlessly, smoothly and swiftly as possible we have dispatched several officals, beaurocrats and diplomats for the implemention process (they are the guys riding horses with feathers in their hair). Just sit back and relax and they will take care of everything

So congratulation Team (insert name) on become our newest minor province and welcome to the BABE family

Tubby Rower
May 18, 2007, 10:07 AM
superb :thumbsup:

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 18, 2007, 03:01 PM
I definitely and whole-heartedly support the love at first sight approach to war. No questions asked, no diplomatic complications, just MW's.

Wotan
May 18, 2007, 04:07 PM
Oh Robi, you are a born diplomat! :D

I like it, gunboat diplomacy is my favourite too.

EDIT: Without looking at the save I think we will average about 1 MW per turn in three turn time or so. Need to get Li-Lo online first, the barracks is just started.

Robi D
May 18, 2007, 11:51 PM
Well thanks for the kind words :)

I did have a thought occur to me. If we "intergrated" Saber quickly would the other three team become worried about us and start pumping out more military.

I think there is a good chance that they wont for 3 reasons

- 4 teams had the Ottomans as 1st choice, so its fair to assume most would be happy not to have to deal with the Sipani later on
- Having terrorised the 1st MTDG most would also be happy so see the back of Chamnix
- Finally most would think that we would be kept busy consolidating our new province

So in my mind continuing the miltary action against someone right away would be a surprise rather than expected. A victory would give us 3 out of 5 continents which brings us in touching distance of winning the game.

gmaharriet
May 19, 2007, 03:05 AM
- Finally most would think that we would be kept busy consolidating our new province

Considering that KISS was conquered last game while busy consolidating new territory, wouldn't that lead the other teams to consider our homeland ripe for invasion as underdefended?

Wotan
May 19, 2007, 04:02 AM
The passages to be crossed without the benefit of a GLH will be costly. The only team I am sure would plan for such a venture is Kuningas team and I am also a bit worried they too might be in the process of building the GLH. The suspense that is building will definitely make the next 5 turns extremely exciting. Will we have it or not?

Wotan
May 19, 2007, 04:41 AM
GLH in 4 turns, Republic in 6.
I have made a rough estimate on the numbe of MW/Sword and Galleys available to us in 20 turns. We should be able to have at least 22 ground units and 11 Galleys.
SABER is still behind Lit, MM and HBR. They are also lagging in territory and pop.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpm.JPG
Their lands:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpp.JPG
Our lands and the F11:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpo.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpn.JPG

Robi D
May 19, 2007, 05:14 AM
Considering that KISS was conquered last game while busy consolidating new territory, wouldn't that lead the other teams to consider our homeland ripe for invasion as underdefended?

That is my point, the last thing free, gong or the council would be expecting is a dozen or so MW's turning up on their backdoor :D

The passages to be crossed without the benefit of a GLH will be costly. The only team I am sure would plan for such a venture is Kuningas team and I am also a bit worried they too might be in the process of building the GLH. The suspense that is building will definitely make the next 5 turns extremely exciting. Will we have it or not?

We need to keep some forces at home in case anyone attempts it. However the bonus is the possible directions are limited. As far as the GLH hopefully we beat anyone to it. My fingers are crossed

ThERat
May 19, 2007, 05:26 AM
I am quite confident that we get the GLH. However, I don't think we will have that many units in 20 turns simply because we are going to revolt in 6, aren't we?

Wotan
May 19, 2007, 08:34 AM
I am quite confident that we get the GLH. However, I don't think we will have that many units in 20 turns simply because we are going to revolt in 6, aren't we?
You are absolutely correct. In 20 turns + anarchy... :D

Robi D
May 19, 2007, 09:05 AM
Revolting babes, now there's an oxymoron :lol:

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 19, 2007, 09:46 AM
Feminism ... fortunately we'll only have that for one streak of turns.

Wotan
May 19, 2007, 04:31 PM
What is annoying is the almost dimwit approach to this game as shown by Council, they seldom manage to play a turn in less than 24 hrs and are still way behind all other teams. I sure would want to find them ASAP and move them up to be our first target. ;) Not sure it is the smartest move but would probably be the most satisfying.

Tubby Rower
May 19, 2007, 04:46 PM
the Council is the one you want to destroy last since they will be the easiest to defeat. As long as you can put up with the delays for voting if they should mine or irrigate that hill in despotism :lol:

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 19, 2007, 07:01 PM
Good point on Council last IMO, though it is admittedly the one team that stands out, delay-wise.

Kickbooti
May 19, 2007, 08:04 PM
So if we are going to seriously consider taking a third continent with Robi's diplomiatic option, we need to KEEP building military units to fill our empty galleys. THAT would take care of home defense in the short-term. Anyone risking it would run into our ammassing invasion force part 2.

Wotan
May 19, 2007, 11:32 PM
Remember when we begin attacking we will enter our GA so production will increase considerably for a period. That and the fact our forte is during the early stages of the game with our UU makes it just obvious we continue to churn out military until we have conquered the world. The question is if we eventually start adding a few Libraries to our most productive locations and go all the way to Navigation for lux connections? We might also end up with other teams setting up one tiler towns that require Amphibs? But hopefully everyone will concede when they are down to the one tilers?

Wotan
May 21, 2007, 12:24 AM
GLH in 3 turns, Republic in 5.
SABER still down MM, Lit and HBR.
We have an average military now, 12 Warriors, 2 MWs, 2 Galleys and a Curragh.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpq.JPG

ThERat
May 21, 2007, 12:48 AM
what's up with them that they don't want to trade and yet get no techs :crazyeye:

3 more turns to waterloo

Kickbooti
May 21, 2007, 01:25 AM
Three more turns to GLH... I'm so excited I could :vomit:

Robi D
May 21, 2007, 02:06 AM
the Council is the one you want to destroy last since they will be the easiest to defeat. As long as you can put up with the delays for voting if they should mine or irrigate that hill in despotism :lol:

Not to mention donsig is on the team :)


Remember when we begin attacking we will enter our GA so production will increase considerably for a period. That and the fact our forte is during the early stages of the game with our UU makes it just obvious we continue to churn out military until we have conquered the world. The question is if we eventually start adding a few Libraries to our most productive locations and go all the way to Navigation for lux connections? We might also end up with other teams setting up one tiler towns that require Amphibs? But hopefully everyone will concede when they are down to the one tilers?

Remember we only need 66% pop and land for domination, so one tiler hold out are not an issue in that respect.
Beating 2 team will get us 50% and we will be pushing 60% as we build new cities on them.

Wotan
May 21, 2007, 02:12 AM
Remember we only need 66% pop and land for domination, so one tiler hold out are not an issue in that respect.
Beating 2 team will get us 50% and we will be pushing 60% as we build new cities on them.

:lol: Here I was thinking total and absolute destruction of all opposition was the only outcome possible in the MTDG. All VCs active... Thanks for making me understand it!

Robi D
May 21, 2007, 06:39 AM
:lol: Here I was thinking total and absolute destruction of all opposition was the only outcome possible in the MTDG. All VCs active... Thanks for making me understand it!

Well we could always engineer it to stay under 66% to inflict complete and utter destruction;)

but then again we shouldn't get too cocky either and have it come back to bite us.

ThERat
May 21, 2007, 07:23 PM
btw, maybe I wasn't quite sure what the strategy would be in 4 turns. Are we going to send galleys in all direction to make more conatcts or are we going to fight Saber and then surprise another team with war declaration with another armada?

BCLG100
May 21, 2007, 07:33 PM
I dont think we especially *need* to find anyone else right now-we should imo focus entirely on the war.

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 21, 2007, 08:01 PM
I do believe we have to scout overseas for a third civ to jump on sneakily. GLH plus an old contact is too much of a giveaway. They'll expect and prepare for it in time.

Tubby Rower
May 21, 2007, 08:05 PM
well the thing is that we know where the other civs are... just not who is where. So I dont' think that scouting is important as it'll just lower the costs that they have for techs.

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 21, 2007, 08:40 PM
To a mathematician, there is a mile wide gap between having a reasonable, plausible, clear cut guess about things and having facts ;)

Wotan
May 22, 2007, 12:15 AM
well the thing is that we know where the other civs are... just not who is where. So I dont' think that scouting is important as it'll just lower the costs that they have for techs.
Do we intend to research the whole AA tech tree on our own? Getting to know more teams would suggest there are ways of lowering our cost to get to MA too. Even if we want to slow the tech pace for max use of our UU. Difficult balance I guess. ;) Our long term tech goals might be Navigation for full lux access? But OTOH that would help others be able to reach us.

Hrm? The Curragh north of SABER might venture north and seek out the team there? The team that would be to our SW too. Or the Galley dropping off Settler/Worker on ivory island could continue to discover who is NW of it? We have a couple of turns to decide. I do not see anything bad in searching for the other teams but there is also an upside with holding off on it.

Tubby Rower
May 22, 2007, 06:58 AM
I was just looking at the save and I have to wonder.... why does saber have at least 2 sources of iron on their continent while we have zero. If they didn't have horses, I could almost understand it, but Rik depriving one team of a vital resource isn't cool. If the iron went away on our continent and just happened to re-appear on their continent, that's one thing, but it sucks pretty bad that we are disadvantaged by not having iron.

Is this something that should be brought up to the admins? (bringing it up in the main forum would advertise our weakness) I don't mean to be sour grapes, but if it was unintentional I would have assumed that Rik would have mentioned something since he surfs these forums.

Whomp
May 22, 2007, 07:38 AM
My guess is that the resources are not balanced but fair. This tells me that Saber may not have horses possibly?

Tubby Rower
May 22, 2007, 07:40 AM
but they do have horses under the City of WoundHealer...since they have at least 1 lux, the only thing that could be different is that there is only 1 lux on their continent... but I'd never trade iron for a lux.

Wotan
May 22, 2007, 08:20 AM
2 turns to GLH, 4 turns to revolt.
SABER still down the same techs.
Another Galley finished this turn.
Gong have built the first GW:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpr.JPG
SABER lands: (Do we want to continue with the Curragh aroud it or should we move towards the NE and travel across to the next team? (the team to our SW).
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotps.JPG

Tubby Rower
May 22, 2007, 08:32 AM
I'd go back and head to the NE. We know what the other part of the continent looks like. except for where the cities are. I wouldn't advocate taking a galley on a friend finding mission but curraghs are ok for that in my opinion.

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 22, 2007, 08:40 AM
I definitely would skip and jump NE to the team to our SW. As far as ressources go, n one has said a thing about saltpeter and coal eh? These are just as important, in the long run. Have faith in Rik !

ThERat
May 22, 2007, 09:07 AM
yes, definitely go and find more contacts...if we continue to sail around, we might only run into barbs

Wotan
May 22, 2007, 10:23 AM
Besides our Galley with one-tiler claiming Settlers will close the loop. We just about get a glance if the first one-tiler from the current position of the Curragh.

Just continue crossing your fingers for the next two turns...

Tubby Rower
May 22, 2007, 10:34 AM
I posted a thread about the pyramids in the main forum to get the jump on them. btw, are we gonna come up with a press announcement for the GLH?

Robi D
May 23, 2007, 03:00 AM
Pyramids is an odd choice, oh well that one team we don't have to worry about building the GLH

Wotan
May 23, 2007, 03:31 AM
Agree on the waste of shields building the Pyramids. Cannot understand why they built it? Never built it on an archipelago map and this must be thought of as such a map???

Well, report this time is an absolute nonevent.
Everyone holding their breath and crossing fingers for the next turn to arrive... Will we have the GLH or stumble on the final step???????
Republic in 3 turns.
Next turn the two Settler load for a journey into "SABER territory". Settler to ivory island will be ready to found a location on the same turn we get Republic!!! Perfect, we can start on Masony and have a shot at getting Myst/Poly as our free tech in case the GH is good to us. Don't remember if we have Myst already.
Shall we take the next Settler from Hef's and send him to claim the Resource island to our SE? We will not be able to connect any lux there but just by grabbing it we deny it to others.

Wotan
May 25, 2007, 12:20 AM
First things first:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpt.JPG
How many teams will be in tears now? :D
Republic in 2 turns.
2 Settlers now heading towards the SABER one-tilers.
Another Settler will be ready in Hef's next turn. Do we
A. Send it to continue filling our own island and settle in the NW?
B. Send it to the Resource island NW of SABER?
C. Send it towards the one-tilers near our SW neighbour?
We have a Warrior on one of the Galleys in the South, he could go to either B or C to help control the second one-tiler there until we have a Settler to send.
Galley with second Settler and Worker to Ivory island will offload Worker next turn to start connecting resources.
Misha Barton is 8 turns from completing a Galley however the size of the town and the production of food suggest we might change this to a Settler instead? Opinion?
Average military with 12 Warriors, 5 Galleys, 4 MWs and a Curragh.
SABER down the same 3 techs.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpu.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpv.JPG

ThERat
May 25, 2007, 01:15 AM
most excellent :dance:

It's beautiful when an elaborate plan just turns out well. Do we have any message for the general board to boast a little about the GLH. :D

As for the options, I'd go for option A. Don't overstrech as we will fight and might have some problems defending those resource Islands as they can be reached with galleys

Tubby Rower
May 25, 2007, 05:30 AM
maybe Booti can come up with a quippy way to put that we were so interested in the liquified grains that Gong has that we built a lighthouse to guide our way I'm no good at words so I'll let the masters handle it ;)

Robi D
May 25, 2007, 06:00 AM
Good news:goodjob:

Now we can proceed to with phase 2;)

Wotan
May 25, 2007, 06:47 AM
As for the options, I'd go for option A. Don't overstrech as we will fight and might have some problems defending those resource Islands as they can be reached with galleys
OK about the resourse island and since we cannot connect them until navigation they are of dubious value. But one thing is if there is a GH on it as it was on our own. Should we use a Settler to "safely" pop it or just move onto it with a Warrior?

BTW, what about option C? The one-tilers are safe but for culture and we could possibly grab them from others than SABER?

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 25, 2007, 06:57 AM
I think doing C to some extent has some good potential. I definitely would try to locate a 1-tiler and base our operations from there.

Tubby Rower
May 25, 2007, 06:59 AM
I would settle the resource island to Saber's NW. Mainly because that could be useful for lux & resources to Saber's lands once we secure them. IIRC there is no sea-way to Saber without ocean (is that correct?). If not then the ex-Saber continent will have to have all resources and luxes connected internal so that it can produce more than archers, settlers, and workers

if the setup for "their" resource isle is the same as ours, then it should have a sea-route to it and therefore adds resources/lux to the ex-Saber continent's portfolio.

edit: vote is for B/C

Robi D
May 25, 2007, 07:54 AM
There should be a resource island to our SE, we should definately look to grab that but otherwise i don't think we should spread ourselves too much, afterall we will be needing to fill up Sabers continent really soon ;)

Wotan
May 25, 2007, 08:09 AM
There should be a resource island to our SE, we should definately look to grab that but otherwise i don't think we should spread ourselves too much, afterall we will be needing to fill up Sabers continent really soon ;)
And that resource island is the one close to SABER so we can use it to boost happiness on SABER island later.

Tubby Rower
May 25, 2007, 08:14 AM
I would hold off on filling our island as any new cities will be almost totally corrupt. I wouldn't expect anyone to risk a settler/military/galley to try to claim land on anyone's land unless they were looking to immediately invade.

That being said, is there a plan to set a city on Saber's continent before/as we offload the troops.

Kickbooti
May 25, 2007, 08:21 AM
most excellent :dance:

It's beautiful when an elaborate plan just turns out well. Do we have any message for the general board to boast a little about the GLH. :D



At 9:21 EDT the article is halfway done, give me about another hour...

Wotan
May 25, 2007, 08:22 AM
That being said, is there a plan to set a city on Saber's continent before/as we offload the troops.
Noticed Rik is dropping in the have a look at our happy faces. hello Rik, fun map idea!!! I wonder when the other teams realise the importance of the GLH if they have not already done so???

Yes there is a plan forming. I actually have been considering suggesting a full assault in their "soft underbelly" even if it is not that soft but I am sure we will never have to fear Gallipoli2.
Looking at the map I would suggest using the passage to the SE (middle sea tile of the three visible in this pic and outside of their view)from SABER as a staging point. It is 4 tiles due south from the mountain next to their "LF" equivalent and within another turns distance from their capital. We would swiftly take out two of their major locations and be at their centre.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotps.JPG

Wotan
May 25, 2007, 08:23 AM
At 9:21 EDT the article is halfway done, give me about another hour...
Should we wait until someone else comments on it or be preemptive?

Kickbooti
May 25, 2007, 08:24 AM
OK about the resourse island and since we cannot connect them until navigation they are of dubious value. But one thing is if there is a GH on it as it was on our own. Should we use a Settler to "safely" pop it or just move onto it with a Warrior?

BTW, what about option C? The one-tilers are safe but for culture and we could possibly grab them from others than SABER?

I'm with Tubby, B or C. I would opt for B first, settling hte one tilers on another neighbor leads to diplomatic engagement. If we are going to roll over another victim, that diplo may be premature.

Kickbooti
May 25, 2007, 08:27 AM
Should we wait until someone else comments on it or be preemptive?

I will post it to our team thread first for editing and determination what the best use would be. It feels good to have the KISS-like creative juices flowing.

Whomp
May 25, 2007, 09:47 AM
Yipee!! We have light!

I'm inclined to use option B. Wouldn't a island city give us a staging area just in case?

Wotan
May 25, 2007, 10:12 AM
This game has been very kind to us so far. We have finished the two major projects we set out to build. Now we will just have to see how far into our enemies territories our MWs will carry us. I guess we build MWs and a few Swordsmen from now on. And enough Galleys to carry our land units to their destinations. Any other types of buildings but Barracks are basically out of bounds if we pursue a rapid military campaign. We absolutely want to finish this game before getting too far into the MA.

Shall we just research the inexpensive techs after republic and then close down research? We have not discussed research after Republic. Masonry should be a four turner and all but currency/Construction should be fairly inexpensive. But do we need them? can we run a lightning campaign and get to domination before too many MA units are beginning to appear?

Tubby Rower
May 25, 2007, 10:16 AM
I wouldn't cut off research... cut back, maybe, but definately not turn off comepletely. Once we take over Saber, I would expect that others will turn a disdainful eye towards us.

I think that we need to maybe find another team and trade with them before word gets out that we are kicking little tail and just taking initials cuz we don't have time to take names

BCLG100
May 25, 2007, 10:41 AM
I just didnt understand your last paragraph there tubs :)

Tubby Rower
May 25, 2007, 10:52 AM
um. sorry?

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 25, 2007, 11:01 AM
I don't think we'll have time for that either, Tubs :)

BCLG100
May 25, 2007, 02:10 PM
um. sorry?

well wanna paraphrase it so i can understand?

Whomp
May 25, 2007, 02:13 PM
"Kick "buttocks" and take some names" I believe comes from the military. Meaning either you kill them or take their names (POW's). The point is in a blitz action to do things with alacrity since we want to catch them with their drawers around their ankles, so to speak.

Tubby Rower
May 25, 2007, 02:48 PM
I'm sorry... yes like Whomp said... but if your in a hurry you can't be bothered with writing the whole name down so you just take initials since it's fewer letters to write.

Kickbooti
May 25, 2007, 03:53 PM
Here ya go. Sorry for the Delay. I will put it here and trust someone more refined to post it in a public forum if that is desirable.

Editorial comments welcome...

GREAT WONDER UPDATE
Thanks to his single-minded devotion and tireless effort Emperor Killyouall is the most famous, well compensated and unhappy man in all the Kingdom of BABE.

The Emperor is a quiet, reclusive man, seldom seen or heard from who purchased his beachfront property in Larry Flint’s Resort (LFR) as a retreat from noise, crowds and germs. In a twist of irony, that was also the reason the adjoining property was bought by the Thong/Sunscreen/Brazier/Pillow Fight Research Institute.

The coastal location on the sunny coast of LFR was viewed as a perfect product testing site for the Research Institutes’ sun screens, tanning lotions and moisturizing oils; important components in the Institute’s recently created Tan-line Nullification Agency (TNA). This Agency was crated with a Governmental grant issued by Babe-Magnet-in-Chief Wotan. In his State of the Babes address he promised to marshal all the resources of the kingdom to eradicate tan-lines, “This most disturbing of blights on the body politic cannot be allowed to continue.” With this edict from Hefner’s Palace money soon became available and so began TNA, along with Emperor’s troubles.

While the presence of scores of research scientists/fitness models next door to his own isolated retreat destroyed the privacy he values, the Emperor decided to make the best of his changing situation and introduce himself to the neighbors. An eight foot high security fence and several large dogs reinforced the fact that the Institute was even more committed to isolated privacy than the Emperor.

As a founding resident of LFR the Emperor (a title given due to his constant referral to himself with the plural of majesty) was upset about the disruption TNA would cause to the quiet lifestyle local residents were accustomed to. “We were not amused. We attempted to be neighborly, offering to clean the cabana, borrowing sugar and such. But we were rebuffed in a manner most unseemly. Despite our desire for solitude we were resigned to friendly, personal contact; but their abominable fence and security guards have prevented that. As a result, we no longer trust them, and as a public service have determined to keep an eye on them.”

And keep an eye he did. So committed was Emperor to was his lonely vigil that he mounted a life guard chair in his back yard so he could gaze over the security fence. This began an escalation of elevation.

Dr. Bambi, the chief medical researcher at TNA tells a different story. “I understand how people can be nervous having a government research facility next door. But that Emperor was a disruption. We are doing important work for the government and he was constantly skulking in the bushes and disturbing the researchers. One time Drs. Amber and Trixi were studying how many rubs it took before tanning lotion was completely absorbed without that icky residue. He came running up getting sand on Dr. Trixi and making Dr. Amber loose count. After throwing him out we had to start the project all over again. We thought the fence and dogs would be the end of him but he got that blasted chair, so we had to erect a bigger fence.”

This tête-à-tête continued until the Emperor, driven by his neighbor watch began construction of a huge, stone platform from which he could observe the goings on in the TNA compound.

“At that point we were resigned,” says Dr. Bambi. “That Emperor whatever seemed convinced that we were up to no good, so we just determined to prove him wrong and moved most of our research projects to the beachfront so that he could see we had nothing to hide. While he never trusted enough to give up his observation, he stopped trying to climb the fence. We could live with that and he seemed contented.”

This détente continued for some time until fate once again conspired to ruin the Emperor’s solitary vigil.

The 84 ft. Imperial Yacht Compensation was cruising off LFR’s coast and nearly run aground except for the coincidental intervention of Emperor Killyouall.

“We were at our post and noticed this monstrous ship sailing back and forth in front of the compound’s beach. We assumed they were lost, but after their ninth circuit in front of the TNA compound, each progressively nearer, we began to think they had other purposes. We trained our binoculars on the vessel getting closer and closer to the shore, and a rocky outcrop in front of our frontage that was becoming visible with the retreating tide. We noticed a crewmember jump, stare at us, spy the rocks and quickly race to the wheel house and steer out to sea. We were glad they left.”

But they were not gone for long. Unknown to the Emperor, Babe-Magnet-in-Chief Wotan was on the yacht ‘checking on the Agency’s beachfront work.’ In the midst of their inspection the crew was distracted and but for the flashes coming from the Emperor’s binoculars they would have surly run aground.

Wotan immediately saw the wonderful utility of the Emperor’s tower, plus it could keep ships from hitting those rocks. He immediately came ashore, insisted that Emperor allow him to inspect the re-named “Great Height House” and be brought up to speed on his vigil.

So marvelous was this edifice that scores of officials are regularly there, the flashes from various reflective surfaces and the fires from the exceptionally large grill they regularly stoke for their nightly steak fry shining like a beacon for miles around.

Not only has this decreased the number of accidents in LFR’s shipping lanes, but the increased exposure has resulted in increased public funding and interest in the Institute’s work, especially the Tan-line Nullification Agency. As of this article’s publication TNA was planning on capitalizing on their new found fame with a series of speaking tours and a full color calendar.

As for Emperor Killyouall he is a victim of his own success. The solitude he once sought is a thing of the past. Now he spends his days as one of any number of patriotic watchmen, or forlornly sulking in his house. “We miss our solitude, we miss the diversion from our stone spire. When I moved to Lary Flint’s Resort who could have imagined I would be surrounded by panting, leering men crowding our tower. All those men, that plural is completely unacceptable to us.”



Pictured below.

Dr. Bambi and Emperor Killyouall

Whomp
May 25, 2007, 04:01 PM
Ahhhh The Great Height House!!! Awesome Boots! I vote for a public posting.

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 25, 2007, 04:10 PM
I'm not sure I get the “We were not amused. We attempted to be neighborly, offering to clean the cabana, borrowing sugar and such. But we were rebuffed in a manner most unseemly. Despite our desire for solitude we were resigned to friendly, personal contact; but their abominable fence and security guards has prevented that. As a result, we no longer trust them, and as a public service had determined to keep an eye on them.” part.

For the sake of precision: there's a loose 'lose' on the next paragraph. Also, 'détente' takes an accent. There's also a surly 'surely', but this one is ok by me ;)

While I am making an effort to be editorial and grumpy, that's all I can rant about; the text is awesome :thumbsup: :hatsoff:
X-post: yes to public posting, obviously.

gmaharriet
May 25, 2007, 04:25 PM
Booti, How would our island function without your creative genius? That was wonderful!!! :D

Emp. Killyouall
May 25, 2007, 04:34 PM
Ok... that was pretty funny. I assume my name was the only reason you used me, as I am pretty much a lurker here. :goodjob: :king:

Kickbooti
May 25, 2007, 04:37 PM
Sorry I didn't check first Emperor, but your name and your silence did combine in my head to create an eccentric peeping tom type.

All in good fun though. I don't know you well enough to be intentionally cruel...

And thanks for the kind words, and the forum for my insanity. Imagine what it would be like if I COULDN'T get this stuff out of my head every once in awhile?

Emp. Killyouall
May 25, 2007, 04:42 PM
I don't mind at all... I don't even have C3C, and in the original game I got a grand total of 1 chieftan win before going to cIV. I'm flattered and rolling on the floor laughing :)

Tubby Rower
May 25, 2007, 07:48 PM
Ok I edited the surly to surely and the loose to loose , but the détente already had the accent.

I'm posting it here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=224032)

Kickbooti
May 25, 2007, 10:13 PM
Thanks Tubs. I hate detail stuff

Wotan
May 26, 2007, 05:58 AM
Annoying, I accidently hit return and had to save before having taken screen shots. So no pics this turn, sorry.
We have republic and I set research to Masonry in case we get a tech from the GH. Republic should have been two turns to go but I hoped for an extra beaker from a growth and it payed off! We probably just made it above the required number remaining.
Two SABER Curraghs still alive. One on the final coastal before the last crossing to our NE so he need to be lucky for one more turn... The same goes for the Curragh we spotted last turn in an ocean tile, he made it across to a Coastal tile. If the Curragh near us was the same Curragh we spotted starting his passage 10 turns ago or so maybe they were waiting for their GLH to finish? Haha!
Worker on the ivory.

ThERat
May 26, 2007, 06:27 AM
did you revolt right away?

Wotan
May 26, 2007, 06:34 AM
did you revolt right away?
No, in C3C the opportunity to have a second attempt that is present in PTW is removed plus we had a Settler just about to finish in Hef's. But I am not sure I did it at all... :blush: The accidental "return" maybe not only stopped the pics... I sure hope I did, I just can't remember and if i did I am sure I would have looked at the number of turns of anarchy and I have no recollection of it... :mad: :mad: :mad: (verbal flogging in action ATM, if you were here you would blush...):lol:

Robi D
May 26, 2007, 06:41 AM
You could always go back into the save. As long as you don't do anything different with unit movements it fine

Wotan
May 26, 2007, 06:46 AM
I have tried that but the save is not allowing me to open it. So no idea if we are in anarchy or not. I do hope I did it before exiting, just no immediate recollection of it. The rather abrupt ending resulted in me not being able to do the "final" double check of everything I normally do.

Rik Meleet
May 26, 2007, 08:06 AM
CA2 on the "exit-save" might tell you what you need to know. Not sure though, but worthy of a shot ?

Wotan
May 26, 2007, 08:13 AM
Thanks Rik! Yes the save we ship off is possible to open in CA2. Good to know. We are not in anarchy, I repeat we are not in anarchy. However we had planned to go to anarchy next turn when Republic was thought to finish so we have not lost any time. :D Poor defense I know... :blush:
EDIT: Found another bit of info in CA2, SABER just went into anarchy! They must have gone straight for Monarchy...

Robi D
May 26, 2007, 08:30 AM
Interesting move. Apart from military upkeep is there be any advantage to Monarchy? Does the map make any difference?

Wotan
May 26, 2007, 08:44 AM
Maybe the map is favouring Monarchy a bit. Republic needs plenty of towns to allow running a large army. With the rather restriced availability of land maybe Monarchy is better? We had a discussion but chose Republic for the higher yield from commerce. I am sure we will be able to make it work if we are able to quickly dispose of SABER.

A thought. SABER's Curragh NE of us might stay in the coastal tile as a scout to keep tabs on our movement should we send a fleet their way. In multiplayer games I guess there is a way for us to trick them into thinking we too place a scout there. By placing a Galley next to theirCurragh and ship chain our army one Galley at the time they will not know it is not the same Galley sitting idly but a continuous stream of Galleys with 2 MWs each. If so we need to plan for when to start moving the stream of galleys.

BCLG100
May 26, 2007, 08:55 AM
Dutch just asked me for a chat, i really dont have time right now but if someone can get on msn in an hour or two i can forward his e-mail.

another virtue of this being the multi team demogame wotan is that we can simply ask them what they are doing and presurise them into moving it :)

Robi D
May 26, 2007, 09:03 AM
I wouldn't say anything to them about it. As wotan pointed out they wont be able to tell with a ship chain. Also it wont show them the boats coming down from there north. If anything it gives them a false sense of security which i'm happy for them to have

Whomp
May 26, 2007, 09:10 AM
I'm available for a bit today. It's too cool to be on the lake. :(

I sent Dutch a pm yesterday so that's what may have initiated his desire to talk. Can I tell them we have republic to see if they're in monarchy? I'm wondering if they lowered the price to republic by finishing just before us.

Robi D
May 26, 2007, 09:14 AM
If i'm still awake i'm happy to join you. I don't see a problem with telling them we have republic since it will be able to see it soon anyway

Wotan
May 26, 2007, 09:20 AM
That must be it! They are not in anarchy to go to monarchy but have finished Republic just prior to us. Ha! I just got confused and remembered them wanting philo from us some time ago. Not sure why i thought they could not have finished it by now?

Robi D
May 26, 2007, 09:27 AM
Because they had those 3 tech missing on us maybe. They would have had to make some hefty trading if thats the case

BCLG100
May 26, 2007, 11:40 AM
How would they have got republic without CoL btw?

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 26, 2007, 12:00 PM
Well if they actually are revolting to monarchy, this is textbook warmongering. They'll get a nasty pileup against them in the middle ages.

Wotan
May 26, 2007, 12:07 PM
They are down HBR, MM and Lit.
EDIT: We actually pulled off both major projects I guess, philo free tech and GLH.

Whomp
May 26, 2007, 12:12 PM
Here's my conversation so far with Dutch and their offer for tech trading. They researched republic.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=5483466&postcount=98

Wotan
May 26, 2007, 12:54 PM
I would actually ask we do NOT trade anything to them. We want to have as much use for our MWs as possible so the slower the tech race is the better for us. Keep talking but no deals please... ;)

Whomp
May 26, 2007, 01:00 PM
I would actually ask we do NOT trade anything to them. We want to have as much use for our MWs as possible so the slower the tech race is the better for us. Keep talking but no deals please... ;)
I'm with you Wotan. I'm just trying to keep them off guard. I'd say the plan is to keep countering with delays, concerns, ideas and mostly misinformation. IE our "other trading partner" may not allow us to trade "x" tech. :p

Wotan
May 26, 2007, 01:25 PM
I'm with you Wotan. I'm just trying to keep them off guard. I'd say the plan is to keep countering with delays, concerns, ideas and mostly misinformation. IE our "other trading partner" may not allow us to trade "x" tech. :p

Good! Just keep talking then... :lol:

BCLG100
May 26, 2007, 02:19 PM
those of us that cant play civ are good at that :)

Wotan
May 26, 2007, 02:28 PM
I like playing this demo game, it sure add a dimension to Civ I have not experienced in earlier games, even Succession games lack certain components I have now found really add to the experience.

BCLG100
May 26, 2007, 04:05 PM
thats cool, weren't you earlier not liking it due to the pace or some reason? how come the change of heart?

Wotan
May 26, 2007, 04:30 PM
thats cool, weren't you earlier not liking it due to the pace or some reason? how come the change of heart?
What I had a problem understanding was the "lagging" some teams sort of went into. Talking about doing things in their own time etc. It is as bad as someone showing up late to a meeting and oblivious to the fact others are already there and on hold until you arrive. In a multiuser game situation there is no such thing as your own time. I had a problem with the attitude of Xyzy when telling me he or his team played their turn in their own time. What "own" time? It definitely showed a lack of respect for the other teams.
Maybe I am a bit too influenced by RL but I do react when ppl show no respect for their coworkers time. If one person is 5 mins late to a meeting with 10 others it is almost an hour lost.

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 26, 2007, 04:55 PM
So that's roughly a hundred civving play days per extention request, here. But they're just trying to mess with you, Wotan. They'll learn soon enough that it wasn't wise ;)

ThERat
May 26, 2007, 08:29 PM
I understand your impatience, Wotan. I dread those people late for meetings etc. Actually though, I think more time is wasted due to inefficient meetings. Countless manhours if you ask me.

As for trading, I agree not to trade with them. Generally, we should try and keep the tech race slow as it will only benefit our GLH advantage.

Let's get them to be republicans, WW will hit their roof once we attack and take cities. I hope delaying our revolt would maybe give us less anarchy turns...maybe we're just lucky

Wotan
May 27, 2007, 02:26 AM
I understand your impatience, Wotan. I dread those people late for meetings etc. Actually though, I think more time is wasted due to inefficient meetings. Countless manhours if you ask me.
Fully agree with you on this, inefficient meetings are a greater waste of resources, but with one important caveat. Showing up to meetings at the correct time is every individuals responsibility. The problem with endless and often pointless discussions all in the glorious traditions of Parkinson's principles are down to the Chair to regulate. Cutting filibusters from orating and parking issues with little or no progress is all down to the Chair. But I do think every individual attending a meeting should strive to be to the point and focused so as not to steal time...

Wotan
May 28, 2007, 08:52 AM
Yippey! 7 turns of anarchy!!! Hope we had recieved 8 turns had I managed to revolt last turn... LF will go into unrest for a turn to avoid it losing a citizen during the anarchy.
Settler now landed on the second site on Ivory island. Galley will meet another team in two turns.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpx.JPG
I have swapped in another galley to sit next to the SABER Galley. Until all Galleys/MWs have moved into position there will be a Galley sitting next to the Curragh.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpy.JPG
Settler and Warrior in Galleys moving to claim the resource island SE of us.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpw.JPG
We are now strong in comparison to SABER: 12 Warriors, 6 Galleys, 5 MWs and a Curragh.
The Curragh is about to make the final crossing to meet or SW neighbour.

gmaharriet
May 28, 2007, 12:25 PM
Settler and Warrior in Galleys moving to claim the resource island SE of us.
It will be interesting to see if there's a goody hut on that isle as well. If so, there will be two potential opportunities for our settlers to pop something nice.

This game is at Emperor level, right? What are the odds of getting a tech? I always hate getting a map of an area already explored.

Wotan
May 28, 2007, 01:25 PM
This game is at Emperor level, right? What are the odds of getting a tech? I always hate getting a map of an area already explored.
With Barbs(65%) and City(5%) (at least) out of the equation getting a tech is 10% on Emperor so I would guess roughly 10/30. With Settler being produced in Hef's that option should also be out (not sure how the game deals with teh change to Workers instead of Settlers) for a grand total of 40% (10/25). The three remaining 5% options are gold, warrior and map.

BTW, no GH in the same tile there is one on our resourse isalnd.

gmaharriet
May 28, 2007, 02:39 PM
BTW, no GH in the same tile there is one on our resourse isalnd.

Yes, I noticed that but maybe in another area. It would be interesting if a different resource were placed on each "resource island" and settling all of them were necessary to have everything for the game. I guess we'll know more in the next turn or two.

Could Rik be so devious? :mischief:

Whomp
May 28, 2007, 02:47 PM
Reading into the mind of "the Meleet"....devious? Psh...of course he'd do that. He's seeing an opportunity for massive battles for islands. I sense he wants war or serious diplo sacrifices to be a big part of this game.

Wotan
May 28, 2007, 04:41 PM
It seems fairly obvious we beat Council by two turns building the GLH! They have now finished SoZ in "the Admiralty", they also talk about it being on the shore in their "paper". So it sure looks as if SoZ was not their initial goal. :D

Kickbooti
May 28, 2007, 04:52 PM
It seems fairly obvious we beat Council by two turns building the GLH! They have now finished SoZ in "the Admiralty", they also talk about it being on the shore in their "paper". So it sure looks as if SoZ was not their initial goal. :D

Let me add my own :D :D :D :D :D

Whomp
May 28, 2007, 04:57 PM
I'll see your :D :D :D :D :D and raise it with a http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y239/phranc/4.gif

This is great news. I think we're going to find this wonder was a really big deal.

ThERat
May 28, 2007, 06:15 PM
On this map, GLH is absolutely the killer..now let's make use of that. It seems that second resource Island is not occupied as well...

Wotan
May 29, 2007, 02:27 AM
One of our most informative turns yet. We now have full info on who is where on the map.
But first, when settling the GH grabbing location on ivory island this happened:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotpz.JPG
Then I started moving our scouting ships and met with a GONG Curragh, they are our neighbour in the West (NW and SW crossings):
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotqb.JPG
They are up Polytheism and they are currently in monarchy! But the most important fact is they are way behind in most areas.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotqa.JPG
We landed a Settler/Warrior combo on the new resource island, next to another GH! When we settle next turn we will have a shot at Poly as our free tech! If we have traded for poly from GONG before settling we have a chance at Monarchy if that is interesting. Else I guess we are good with getting a shot at Poly?
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotqc.JPG
Then a Curragh spotted a new border on the other side of SABER, we have found Council. Full map for the benefit of the "spatially challenged". ;)
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotqd.JPG
Adding another map for ease of understanding the discussion that follows:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotqe.JPG
So the following distribution is in place:
We have SABER in an easterly direction and GONG in a westerly direction.
SABER's neighbours are Council and BABE.
GONG's neighbours are FREE and BABE.
FREE's neighbours are Council and GONG.
Council's neighbours are FREE and SABER.
I think this is good news, FREE is by far the strongest adversary and they will hopefully go after Council first so our meeting point will be Council/SABER border.
EDIT: We don't have confirmation GONG is our actual western neighbour, it could be a Curragh that has made it across three stretches of water and FREE actually being the one immediately to our west. Though it is most likely my first analysis is the correct one.

ThERat
May 29, 2007, 03:22 AM
most excellent getting another free tech...I'd say do not trade before popping the hut, we don't need monarchy...

this map is mind boggling really :crazyeye: I think later on this will be a real headache.

As for all those resource Islands, we need some good defenders there. If we can, we should tyr and get a rax there to build pikes for good defense later on. I could imagine nice wars about those Islands.

Who is preapring the welcome mail for Gong? How did they end up so bad in techs?

Are we still going for a full scale invasion in about 20-30 turns?

Robi D
May 29, 2007, 04:45 AM
Reading into the mind of "the Meleet"....devious? Psh...of course he'd do that. He's seeing an opportunity for massive battles for islands. I sense he wants war or serious diplo sacrifices to be a big part of this game.

Well it good we have already decided on the former otherwise we would be in a dilemma now:D

It seems fairly obvious we beat Council by two turns building the GLH! They have now finished SoZ in "the Admiralty", they also talk about it being on the shore in their "paper". So it sure looks as if SoZ was not their initial goal. :D

:lol:
Although i wouldn't put it past them to have been building SoZ in the first place. They have donsig on the team after all;)

Wotan
May 29, 2007, 04:49 AM
:lol:
Although i wouldn't put it past them to have been building SoZ in the first place. They have donsig on the team after all;)

That is not very nice, is it? :lol: But pretty hilarious... :crazyeye:

Robi D
May 29, 2007, 04:50 AM
Ahh... seeing the island to our SE has brought a smile to my face. It confirms tubbys map which means our MW's will be going that way really soon causing Saber much grief. Especially after they see our inital attack in the south and think they have us covered:D

Tubby Rower
May 29, 2007, 05:24 AM
About defending the resource isles....

all we need are units on all of the tiles for each island. Since no one could attack from ships. We could have all warriors there or all spears. Nothing too expensive.

ThERat
May 29, 2007, 05:34 AM
all we need are units on all of the tiles for each island. Since no one could attack from ships. We could have all warriors there or all spears. Nothing too expensive.isn't that a prohibited tactic?

ThERat
May 29, 2007, 05:39 AM
Wotan, I checked the save and actually got masonry down to 2 turns by simply employing 2 more scientists in places where growth will only cause unhappiness...maybe you can get it to 1 turn next round by doing that?

Tubby Rower
May 29, 2007, 05:51 AM
isn't that a prohibited tactic?

nope. Just checked the Ruleset (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=196005)

Wotan
May 29, 2007, 06:32 AM
Wotan, I checked the save and actually got masonry down to 2 turns by simply employing 2 more scientists in places where growth will only cause unhappiness...maybe you can get it to 1 turn next round by doing that?

I think those were the locations I fixed after taking the screenshots. Extreme southern location is now running a scientist at 0 growth and another location about to grow was put on hold with a scientist. So the submitted save also has masonry in 2. Sorry about the screenshots but I was wary after the debacle a couple of turns ago so took the screenshots before MMing the position.
BTW, as you might have observed LF was in unrest, this was intentional so it does not shrink to size 7 during the anarchy period. It will be back in line next turn and lose a single food each turn for 6 turns but produce 3 beakers. It will be at 1 food remaining in the box by allowing it to go into unrest for a turn.
I have also landed a Warrior on our second one-tiler as a safeguard against any evildoers sending a Settler to claim it.

ThERat
May 29, 2007, 06:40 AM
I think those were the locations I fixed after taking the screenshots. Extreme southern location is now running a scientist at 0 growth and another location about to grow was put on hold with a scientist. So the submitted save also has masonry in 2.:goodjob:

Wotan, as for the unrest, it was clear to me why and if I were the one doing the turn, I would put in on alternate unrest as to preserve more food. There is no penalty doing that

Wotan
May 29, 2007, 06:46 AM
I also wanted to check what cost maths will carry when we get Masonry maybe the additional beakers from LF makes a difference. Besides paying 1 food per turn for 3 beakers is an OK deal I think, though my first thought was to let it be in unrest more just as you discuss.

Kickbooti
May 29, 2007, 09:02 AM
That is not very nice, is it? :lol: But pretty hilarious... :crazyeye:

And very probably true...

Wotan
May 29, 2007, 09:08 AM
And very probably true...

I am sure I missed out of some pretty good laughs in the previous MTDG. :crazyeye: Donsig seems to have earned quite a reputation from odd choices in the past, though he seems to have learned a lesson from the choices made last game. He made a comment about the monument built last game when at first there were some funny remarks the GONG Pyramids was the MoM.

Whomp
May 29, 2007, 11:04 AM
:dance: These turns are starting to get real interesting! Did we meet Council this turn or next?

I started a new diplo thread with Gong. :mischief:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=5494733#post5494733

Wotan
May 29, 2007, 02:44 PM
:dance: These turns are starting to get real interesting! Did we meet Council this turn or next?

No, we just spotted their border.

Robi D
May 30, 2007, 02:52 AM
:dance: These turns are starting to get real interesting! Did we meet Council this turn or next?

I started a new diplo thread with Gong. :mischief:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=5494733#post5494733

Its a real shame we didn't meet The Council with 10 galleys full of MW's:(
Now that would have been funny.

Kickbooti
May 30, 2007, 08:11 AM
Its a real shame we didn't meet The Council with 10 galleys full of MW's:(
Now that would have been funny.

Since we have confirmed the layout of the map maybe we should stop exploring so that we don't initiate any further diplomatic contacts. We've met Gong, let's avoid the other two until Saber is gone.

Whomp
May 30, 2007, 08:23 AM
Since we have confirmed the layout of the map maybe we should stop exploring so that we don't initiate any further diplomatic contacts. We've met Gong, let's avoid the other two until Saber is gone.We're going to need a friend and by meeting them everyone we have better potential for 2 or 3 fers. I think we should meet everyone since it would be difficult to mount an attack before galleons. I think our diplomats can handle it. :mischief:

Kickbooti
May 30, 2007, 08:41 AM
We're going to need a friend and by meeting them everyone we have better potential for 2 or 3 fers. I think we should meet everyone since it would be difficult to mount an attack before galleons. I think our diplomats can handle it. :mischief:

I will defer to the Diplomat Extrodionaire. Not only is Whomp a smooth talker, but he is also an Administrator - a nice thing in diplomatic situations...

"Dear Council, please show me the respect of surrenduring to the Babes or you might find your forum locked and your pet's head stored in your linens."

Beorn-eL-Feared
May 30, 2007, 03:03 PM
I completely agree, in principle, with the meeting them all arguments. 'In principle' since I'm not the one dealing with diplo :D

Robi D
May 31, 2007, 06:54 AM
We're going to need a friend and by meeting them everyone we have better potential for 2 or 3 fers. I think we should meet everyone since it would be difficult to mount an attack before galleons. I think our diplomats can handle it. :mischief:

Not if we kill everyone and i don't see why we have to wait for galleons either. Chains of galleys will do just nicely. Aside from that if we wait for galleons then we lose the one advantage we have over everyone right now.

Whomp
May 31, 2007, 08:31 AM
Not if we kill everyone and i don't see why we have to wait for galleons either. Chains of galleys will do just nicely. Aside from that if we wait for galleons then we lose the one advantage we have over everyone right now.Indeed. What I would like to see is two teams gone (scientifics preferably) so we're not encountering a research 3 on 1. We have a big advantage right now and we should be prepared to use it.

One thing we should be aware of is teams will more likely abandon cities rather than let us walk in. We'll need a 2nd tier city ready for settler production.

Tubby Rower
May 31, 2007, 08:52 AM
Once we're in republic we should have a couple of cities with enough production capacity that we could have a couple of settler pumps up and jsut have a continual ferry over to other lands

Robi D
Jun 01, 2007, 03:01 AM
Indeed. What I would like to see is two teams gone (scientifics preferably) so we're not encountering a research 3 on 1. We have a big advantage right now and we should be prepared to use it.

One thing we should be aware of is teams will more likely abandon cities rather than let us walk in. We'll need a 2nd tier city ready for settler production.

Okay i'm with you now. For a second there i thought you had turned all peacenik on me and i was going to have to set my religious fanatics on you:lol:

We definately need to have settlers ready to replace any abandoned cities.

Our other advantage before galleons is that even if someone attempts a suicide attack on us they are limited to 3 areas to arrive from so we can always keep some defenders in those spots just in case

Wotan
Jun 01, 2007, 03:14 AM
Our settler on SABER resource island got this when founding LJ:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotqf.JPG
And the island looks like this now:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotqj.JPG
We have confirmed GONG as our Western neighbour, their Curragh sunk though...
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotqh.JPG
Then we proceeded to meet with Council:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotqg.JPG
And a little pic:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotqi.JPG
They are in MA! But still in Despotism??? Huge culture lead though:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/28942/wotqk.JPG
Tech: We will have Masonry next turn. Only 3 beakers left to fill after meeting with Council. Maths should be a fast affair even if in anarchy, we can generate 30+ bpt so probably 5 turns, 4 in anarchy and the first in Republic.
On another issue: There are three resource islands left with a GH each (probably). Only Council have MM so far and probably FREE. Should we gamble on sending Settlers to try to pop those that might remain in play?

EDIT: We are strong compared to everyone else.