If the result of this poll: Our New Great Leader (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=22151)

indicates that we are to build a wonder, which wonder should we rush with our new leader?

Options available to us now:
- Sistine Chapel
- Forbidden Palace

Option available next turn:
- Leo's Workshop

2 techs away (if you wish for these, vote "other" and post your vote):
- JS Bach's
- Copernicus' Observatory

This vote will be nullified if the leader vote is for making a new army. Also, maybe you'd also like to write where the wonder is to be built.

There is competition for the Sistine Chapel. I don't know when the other civs started it so I don't know if we will be able to build it or not. Leo's Workshop should arrive next turn when the new books on "Invention" arrive at our Great Library.

If, by the time our leader is in position, the wonder we voted for is not available, the next most popular option by this poll will be chosen.

the forbidden palace is crucial in reducing corruption across our large empire. I suggest that.

I'm for rushing Leo's workshop and build the Forbidden Palace by convensional means. I don't want to miss out on cheaper Upgrades.

The Sistine Chapel will be very important since we get happiness on the Cathedrals, and we'll be building a lot of those.

The reason I support Leo's workshop so much is simple. It will allow us to always stay up to date in technology, and possibly stay one step ahead of our enemies, making them think twice before attacking and pay if they decide to.

Our mass of Pikemen could eventually be turned to Mech. Inf. at half the price. After all those upgrades the savings will be IMMENSE, and we may be able to afford to rush other cultural improvements, if need be.

You already get 3 Smilies from the Cathedral, with the Sistine you get 6.

Just wanted to point that out.

And I don't think we will be able to build so many cathedrals anyway.

I vote for Sistine Chapel. We do have a leader, I believe, and with culture, we can entice people to join via trade or city flipping.

We should build it in a FP spot just in case another nation finishes it before our leader arrives.

As I was the first Cultural Minister, I will vote for the Sistine Chapel. It was one of the top Cultural Wonders and I believe we will need it to keep our people happy. I also think we will be building a fair amount of cathedrals.

PDX is a great site for the Forbidden Palace, as chiefpaco pointed out, PDX can build the FP fairly quickly and it's only four tiles from Grey Fox's proposed site. I think that the location of the FP should be discussed in the same thread as where the Great Palace will be relocated too. But that's just me. PDX would be an appropriate spot with the GP being relocated in th newly aquired Egyptian territory.

As far as location of the Sistine Chapel...I like Khatovar. It will grow to be a world class city.

Happiness will not likely be a problem in our empire. We already control 4 luxuries. With a marketplace, and maybe even trading, we will have plenty of happiness to go around. Actually, I don't even think we will need many temples. We are not religious & cathedrals are expensive buildings to make.

Nothing will affect our empire more than a well-placed Forbidden Palace, especially considering our Palace location is far from ideal.

Leo's will save us quite a bit of money too.

I vote for Sistine. Excellent culture generator, and if built quickly, it will double. I just don't think Leo's is wonder it used to be (Civ2 players know what I mean).

Originally posted by punkbass2000
I just don't think Leo's is wonder it used to be (Civ2 players know what I mean).

I know what you mean, but I still think Leo's is very useful, not AS useful, but still important.

there all useful in their own way. In my opinion these are 3 of the most important wonders to build (Leo's, FP, Sistine Chapel, too bad we missed Sun Tzu) Each have very distinct parts.

1)Leo's is good for the military department and MAYBE the foreign department
2)FP is good for trade, domestic, and culture
3) Sistine chapel is good for the domestic, and culture


Punkbass---I know what you mean, it seemed like the person who build Leo's in CivII would almost always be the most powerful.

I vote for Sistine Chapel for three reasons:
Culture, Culture, Culture!

Oh, I mean, actually culture is one reason, not only is it a great culture producer of it's own, but also makes cathedrals more effective, meaning we will build more of them, and they are great for culture.

Second, we can use the leader to build it before our rivals. That is the main reason I don't like to use it for the FP, we can build that on our own at any time, I hate to use a once-in-a-millenium leader for that. Especially in this situation. There are games where we need an FP on another continent, and building it ourselves would take forever, but here I think we could build it in PDX or Philadelphia in a decent amount of time. (Philly would take some prep work, pay for a courthouse, boost the population, etc, but it could be done). Sistine cannot be built on our own without the leader, period.

Third, although I generally try to get Leo's most games when I can, in this case it is not as critical. The unit we have the most of, Immortals, do not upgrade. Without Sun Tzu, upgrading is a time consuming process, moving units to barracks and back. Since we control one end of the continent, many of our rear cities will not need to upgrade from pikemen for quite some time. Also, worst case we could always try to build it ourselves, although most likely once the other civs miss out on Sistine, they will cascade to Leos anyway.

Finally, it produces a lot of CULTURE!

I voted for Leos. I think we should build the FP regularly.

We are already the #1 culture. You can't get much better than "in awe" The ones who are still just impressed would have switched to in aweif the revolution had not have happened preventing more culture points accumulated.

I think halfing the cost of upgrades will help our treasury as it is not in all that great a shape especially when we have to start researching on our own.

If we don't make Leo's for some reason, I think JS Cathedral would be good.

Slightly off topic : When we know how many turns we will be from Music Theory, should we start a "palace" in say PDX to give us a jump on the wonder or is that "illegal" ? I can't recall how many turns it would take to get the palace built but if it is a lot maybe we shoudl start the minute we start going after education.

What's all this talk of moving the palace?

I voted for the forbidden palace and we should build it in Egypt! If the American cities are already producing more than one good shield we should put the palace somewhere else.

Our domestic leader wants to limit what a city can build according to what it can afford. Let's give our outlying cities a chance to bring themselves out of poverty by giving them a second capital nearby.

Leo's is not critical if we are a strong nation. We will be able to upgrade our border forces first and then our interior forces later. The Forbidden Palace will also significantly increace our surplus allowing us to afford the upgrades we need.

As for the Sistine Chapel, well, we don't even have any cathedrals now, do we? And if our outlying cities can't afford the upkeep on them then we will have to justify their cost in order to get them built...

The Sistine Chapel and Leo's Workshop are two wonders whose effects cannot be reproduced. I vote for the Sistine Chapel.

The Forbidden Palace will almost double our production and enable us to effectively build and support troops against Chinese agression. It will also give us double the number of candidate cities to prebuild for other wonders.

I'm in favour of Leo's Workshop for the reasons put forward by its other supporters. FP can wait to be built conventionally, since we don't have to compete for it. Everyone will see the benefit of the workshop when it comes to upgrading defensive units and especially artillery (damn expensive stuff).

Looks like Leo's gonna lose :(

well, I could live with the FP, but I don't see the reasoning for the Sistine chapel. We're #1 Culturally and we've got good happyness. However, we're starting to slip Militarily, and we have the most Pikemen rather than Immortals. It's a figure of about 28 to 16 (exact numbers are in the first post of the Military Dept thread.)

But, Alas, what the people's choice is the government's choice, so I must comply if it is still on top when it's time to rush and if it's still availible.

This is great! Looks like the Sistine Chapel is the winner and only one location was suggested. I like this.

Originally posted by Cyc
This is great! Looks like the Sistine Chapel is the winner and only one location was suggested. I like this.

:cool: :D

While I have voted otherwise, I can see now why Sistine is a fair choice, because of the ease it will be to keep cities in WLT President's day. This will be a nice benefit, & maybe the most important. In the long run, I hope that it becomes the most advantageous construction.

Regardless of this poll's results, I still think we have major empire centrality issues. The FP should be a top priority so that new areas may be developed. I think plans of its construction should be considered immediately.

Eyrei speechless....now THAT worries me... :D

Originally posted by Cyc
Eyrei speechless....now THAT worries me... :D

It's just that the Sistine Chapel is my favorite wonder. Ahh. A dream come true.