I want to share a series of tables I create in Excel that help me to decide where to settle my military instructors. This is especially useful when I am an Imperialistic leader since I tend to warmonger early and often with those leaders and generate a lot of Great Generals.

I am going to try to attach the zipped Excel file and jpg as well.

Edit - how do I make a normal sized picture in a post?

I don't settle every GG necessarily. Sometimes a Military Academy can be useful and Medic III explorers are nice to have. When I do decide to settle a GG I use these tables to figure out the best configuration of MIs.

I have come to some logical generalizations based on the data in the tables. By no means are these rules that should always be followed, as every situation in this game is different. These are just some helpful guidelines I use. The term "Civic Boosters" refers to Theocracy and Vassalage. The guidelines are not necessarily based on the civics I am running at the moment I get the GG, but what civics I plan to be running when I produce the bulk of my army. These also don't take West Point into consideration because I like to settle them for the optimal short term configuration for the next war and then once West Point is built in the military city later in the game decide where to settle MIs as I go.

>Normal Leaders (non-Aggressive, non-Charismatic)
>>Both civic boosters
>>>1st - military city (lvl 4 mounted)
>>>2nd - either P1 (lvl 4 mounted) or military city (lvl 4 slow)
>>>3rd - wherever the 2nd one didn’t go
>>>Build lvl 4 mounted in P1 and lvl 4 slow in military city
>>>4th – P2 (lvl 4 mounted)
>>1 civic booster
>>>Look to the long term best MI placement
>>No civic boosters
>>>1st - military city (lvl 3 slow)
>>>Next 3 MIs can either
>>>>military city (lvl 4 all)
>>>>each in separate production city (lvl 3 slow)
>Charismatic Leaders
>>Both civic boosters
>>>1st - military city (lvl 4 all)
>>>2nd – either P1 (lvl 4 all) or military city (lvl 5 mounted)
>>>3rd - wherever the 2nd one didn't go
>>>Build lvl 5 mounted in military city and lvl 4 slow in P1
>>>4th – P2 (lvl 4 all)
>>1 civic booster
>>>1st - military city (lvl 4 mounted)
>>>2nd - either P1 (lvl 4 mounted) or military city (lvl 4 slow)
>>>3rd - wherever the 2nd one didn't go
>>>Build lvl 4 slow in the military city and lvl 4 mounted in P1
>>>4th – P2 (lvl 4 mounted)
>>No civic boosters
>>>1st – military city (lvl 3 slow)
>>>Build lvl 3 slow in military city and lvl 3 mounted in P1/2
>>>2nd - military city (lvl 4 mounted)
>>>3rd - either military city (lvl 4 slow) or P1 (lvl 3 slow)
>>>4th - wherever the 3rd didn't go
>>>If a 5th MI is obtained P1 (lvl 4 mounted)
>>>Build lvl 4 slow in military city and lvl 4 mounted in P1
>Aggressive Leaders
>>Both civic boosters
>>>1st - military city (lvl 4 mounted)
>>>2nd - military city (4 promos & level 4 siege and archery)
>>>3rd – P1 (lvl 4 mounted)
>>>Build lvl 4 melee/slow in military city and lvl 4 mounted in P1
>>>4th – either P1 (lvl 4 slow/4 promos) or P2 (lvl 4 mounted)
>>>If a 5th MI is obtained it would go wherever the 4th didn't
>>No civic boosters
>>>The advice for normal civs applies here as well.
>>>Put the first 4 MIs in the military city (level 4 slow/4 promos)
>Protective Leaders
>>Treat Churchill like other Charismatic leaders and Tokugawa like other Aggressive leaders. For other Protective leaders follow the advice for normal leaders, just making sure to build archery units in the military city for maximum promotions.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

The spreadsheet looked like a very cogent analysis, but I'm not a numbers person so it made my head spin. :crazyeye:

One tactic I had recommended to me lately that I rather like is settling two Great Generals in my Heroic Epic city, which gives is the equivalent of having West Point there. This allows me to build West Point in my 2nd military city (where I'll also, if I get another GG, place a military academy) while the HE city continues to produce units. It always bothered me before that I had to stop building units in the HE city for several turns in order to build WP--so I often didn't do it. This tactic also gives me the flexibility of building another National Wonder (such as the Ironworks or Red Cross) in either city.

The spreadsheet looked like a very cogent analysis, but I'm not a numbers person so it made my head spin. :crazyeye:

One tactic I had recommended to me lately that I rather like is settling two Great Generals in my Heroic Epic city, which gives is the equivalent of having West Point there. This allows me to build West Point in my 2nd military city (where I'll also, if I get another GG, place a military academy) while the HE city continues to produce units. It always bothered me before that I had to stop building units in the HE city for several turns in order to build WP--so I often didn't do it. This tactic also gives me the flexibility of building another National Wonder (such as the Ironworks or Red Cross) in either city.

For me, i would use my chariot to attack a barb and earn it Medic I promotion. Then when i get my first GG, I'll attach it to to the chariot, and make it become 6 right away. This way, I don't have to go crazy trying to get my other units to earn lvl6 for West Point.

I had a look at the chart. You'll have a career ahead in accountancy BTW(!). But having 2 free promotions from protective doesn't make your unit a level 3 unit though does it?

I had a look at the chart. You'll have a career ahead in accountancy BTW(!). But having 2 free promotions from protective doesn't make your unit a level 3 unit though does it?

LOL, I am an accountant.

No, it doesn't make a unit level 3. The XP Required for promotions section lists levels next to the promotion with an asterisk. The asterisk says the levels aren't accurate for units with free promotions. Down in the protective leaders section it shows that the 1st and 2nd promotions are still level one units. The 3rd promotion is where they reach level 2.

The spreadsheet looked like a very cogent analysis, but I'm not a numbers person so it made my head spin. :crazyeye:

One tactic I had recommended to me lately that I rather like is settling two Great Generals in my Heroic Epic city, which gives is the equivalent of having West Point there. This allows me to build West Point in my 2nd military city (where I'll also, if I get another GG, place a military academy) while the HE city continues to produce units. It always bothered me before that I had to stop building units in the HE city for several turns in order to build WP--so I often didn't do it. This tactic also gives me the flexibility of building another National Wonder (such as the Ironworks or Red Cross) in either city.

This is an idea I will have to try sometimes as I run into the same problem. Usually I am at war when I reach Military Tradition and I can't afford to have my military city stop producing units to build West Point.

The spreadsheet looked like a very cogent analysis, but I'm not a numbers person so it made my head spin. :crazyeye:

One tactic I had recommended to me lately that I rather like is settling two Great Generals in my Heroic Epic city, which gives is the equivalent of having West Point there. This allows me to build West Point in my 2nd military city (where I'll also, if I get another GG, place a military academy) while the HE city continues to produce units. It always bothered me before that I had to stop building units in the HE city for several turns in order to build WP--so I often didn't do it. This tactic also gives me the flexibility of building another National Wonder (such as the Ironworks or Red Cross) in either city.

Yes this is right Sisiutil, I have been advocating this approach for a long time, in fact since the update to Warlords made Military Academies a 50% production bonus. Once you have invested so much effort into building the HE in a city it makes little sense to tie it up building an expensive wonder such as West Point. You are losing a lot of potential military production doing it that way. Plus having two cities that can produce a lot of moderately promoted units is better than one producing a few highly promoted ones, in my opinion. I often build West Point in a captured enemy capital or production city and then add the MA later. Sometimes I get to capture the MA as well :D

I guess it depends on the type of units you are producing and the promotions you want but I now like to distribute my MIs. In a city with barracks giving 3 xp and stables 2 xp I would build 2nd level mounted and not put a MI there. In another city producing catapults and trebs continuously I want to build 2nd level seige units, as they're much better than level 1, and a MI does that without switching civics. Getting 5 xp for units in several cities is a priority over getting 10xp or more in fewer cities.

Also note that moderately promoted troops attacking at lower odds generate more GG points (at greater risk). So there is sort of a self perpetuating aspect to the strategy of a massive army of moderately promoted troops being built with the help of Military Academies, and these troops generating more GG. The key to managing the horrible war weariness in the late game this can lead to is building Jails and running Police State (for +25% more military production :lol: ).

Cyrus is great for this...
I´m now almost in the times of grenadiers (1400AD)

My capital is Heroic Epic city with 4 generals...It can produce maceman with 13exp in 1 turn...this is with Vassalage, but without West point...13xp with charismatic means level 5 units :D...

At the moment I have 9 macemen (level 6, strenght 2 and city raider 3)waiting to be upgraded to grens...

Rest of generals (atleast one more coming from warring and one from Fasicm) I will settle in my Naval production city wich have Military academy and now one general attached...Military academy was captured, so I have got 5 generals so far...

The spreadsheet looked like a very cogent analysis, but I'm not a numbers person so it made my head spin. :crazyeye:

One tactic I had recommended to me lately that I rather like is settling two Great Generals in my Heroic Epic city, which gives is the equivalent of having West Point there. This allows me to build West Point in my 2nd military city (where I'll also, if I get another GG, place a military academy) while the HE city continues to produce units. It always bothered me before that I had to stop building units in the HE city for several turns in order to build WP--so I often didn't do it. This tactic also gives me the flexibility of building another National Wonder (such as the Ironworks or Red Cross) in either city.

Sissy, you are so smart. I'm going to try this next time.

One thing that I would be weary of, however is putting my GG into an explorer, since explorers are inelegable for woodsmanIII and thus cannot become the ultimate medics with MedicIII and woodsmanIII. If you manage to get both your unit will heal allied troops a whopping 40hp/turn (that is 45 in enemy territory!)

One thing that I would be weary of, however is putting my GG into an explorer, since explorers are inelegable for woodsmanIII and thus cannot become the ultimate medics with MedicIII and woodsmanIII. If you manage to get both your unit will heal allied troops a whopping 40hp/turn (that is 45 in enemy territory!)

I almost never get woodsman III :(. It's too hard to get the medic high enough level unless of course I'm aztec or Boudica.

Edit - how do I make a normal sized picture in a post?
The posters use another service to host the pictures and put into the post just the link. I use photobucket and it gives already the forum tags you need for it.

Yes this is right Sisiutil, I have been advocating this approach for a long time, in fact since the update to Warlords made Military Academies a 50% production bonus. Once you have invested so much effort into building the HE in a city it makes little sense to tie it up building an expensive wonder such as West Point. You are losing a lot of potential military production doing it that way. Plus having two cities that can produce a lot of moderately promoted units is better than one producing a few highly promoted ones, in my opinion. I often build West Point in a captured enemy capital or production city and then add the MA later. Sometimes I get to capture the MA as well :D

I guess it depends on the type of units you are producing and the promotions you want but I now like to distribute my MIs. In a city with barracks giving 3 xp and stables 2 xp I would build 2nd level mounted and not put a MI there. In another city producing catapults and trebs continuously I want to build 2nd level seige units, as they're much better than level 1, and a MI does that without switching civics. Getting 5 xp for units in several cities is a priority over getting 10xp or more in fewer cities.


Every time this topic comes up on the forum, I get a clearer picture of the answer...

The situation in which you'd want to have WP and HE in the same city is when you're aiming for a massive invasion using highly promoted modern units such as Marines or Tanks (which upgrade to Modern Armor). This is because you can combine the +4 XP of WP with the +2 of an MI to get 11 XP for a non-Charismatic leader, or 13 XP with a Charismatic leader using extra help from the Pentagon. The MA and MI are both placed in the same city, along with HE, and WP, to get a city with +150% production multipliers for military units, and +6 bonus XP. This will be even more effective with the 3.17 patch, which makes siege units less effective and marines more effective for intercontinental invasions.

However, if you want to focus on renaissance-age wars, then I can see the merits of your approach of separating WP and HE into different cities...



Also note that moderately promoted troops attacking at lower odds generate more GG points (at greater risk). So there is sort of a self perpetuating aspect to the strategy of a massive army of moderately promoted troops being built with the help of Military Academies, and these troops generating more GG. The key to managing the horrible war weariness in the late game this can lead to is building Jails and running Police State (for +25% more military production :lol: ).

I agree with this, but its significance decreases when you go into modern warfare. For modern wars, you would like to begin with stronger units. Again, this is made more significant with the 3.17 patch.

I used to be a big fan of the Uberunit military city. Now I tend to spread my GG's around a bit. I would prefer to have 2 cities producing 5xp lvl3 units @ a steady pace during non-wartime while running peaceful civics

I used to be a big fan of the Uberunit military city. Now I tend to spread my GG's around a bit. I would prefer to have 2 cities producing 5xp lvl3 units @ a steady pace during non-wartime while running peaceful civics
I'm becoming a fan of this approach myself. The problem with uberunits, I find, is that you tend to become a little over-protective of them and it's very upsetting when one dies. I'd rather have a plethora of half-decent units.

This approach is very valuable with a non-Spiritual leader, as it lessens the need to switch into the XP-granting civics to get promoted units.

It can also be valuable to attach a GG to a unit with a lot of experience that is NOT destined to become a medic. The GG will allow you to upgrade that unit for free and it will keep all of its experience points (instead of being dropped back to 10). I find that when I am playing an Imperialistic leader and have a big mid game war that pumps out 6+ GG, I often settle two in each of two military production cities (four generals total) and attach the other two to units. One unit is generally a scout or spearman to make a medic and the other is a maceman with a lot of experience points. Adding the GG gives him more exp, and when the time comes he makes a really nice Rifleman or Infantry unit with CR3 and Combat VI.

When going for a Cultural Victory is is important to have one of the destined to be Legendary cities be a military unit producer. When you have the Sistine Chapel, your GGs produce 2 Culture each. This stacks really fast when you settle 4 or more and have several Cathedrial equavelent buildings to amplify your culture (i.e. 4 GG produce 8 raw culture. 4 Cathedrials and Hermitage add +300% which would be 16 culture per turn just from the GG).

Hi

uber unit cities can be fun though. I once played a game where whole point was getting a uber unit city with toku of america,

I managed to get a city with 4 gg's, wp, redcross, got help from pentagaon and theo and vas.Not only was it making level 5 units but it was making level five navy seals that had combat 1, city gar 1, drill 1, medic 1, march, and amphib built in BEFORE they even used any of their promotions. Most got drill 2-4, and then combat 2 so it gave em like 4-8 first stirkes or something like that. Some got combat 2 and then woody 1-3 so they could help heal their buddies faster and then some got combat 2, drill2 and 3 and then pinch. (I wanted to get one with ALL the drill promos and up to woody 3 JUST so I could see a unit with 10 first strikes but never did get one like that :( ) I

t was a PAAAAAAIIIN getting toku to that point though but super fun once I FINALLY did. it was like they REALLY were elite special forces hehe.

Usually though I dont put all my GG's in one place like that. First one goes on a spear medic. I like spears for medics since they can go down woody line. And its not hard to get spears promoted if you go to war early enough. Usally that early in game once you make your first spear you can catch a barb warrior, or unfortified enemy warrior, or a weakly promoted chariot or even say when you suicied an axe to sofen up a archer in walled city or 40% holy city or something if that suicide drops archer low enuff then it can be safe for spear medic to finish him off. That usually enough to get em to at least 6 exp. by time first GG pops. The I attach GG to lvl 6 spear which makes him 26 exp. which is nice cuz first now you got your lvl 6 unit needed for wp. And 2nd thats enough promotions to get him medic 2 then medic three and have one promo left over.

To make sure he gets to woody threeo for uber medic though I dont make last promo woody 1. If you do it can be PAIN getting last two promotions especially if non char leader BUT if you make that last promo tactics then he will get dbl exp for every win. And usually round this time cats are being added to stacks or soon will be so I just make sure to use him to pick off one of the wounded left in a city after cats soften defenders to point where ANYBODY gets 99.9% chance to win and eventually he usually get to woody 3.

2nd gg goes in city where I plan to build HE. Usually niceest production city I have thats not my capitol and is on coast, that way naval units can get benefit too. If I get thrid gg then that one will go there too.

Wp gets built in another coastal city if I can. Redcoss if possible one of those two citys and if not try to get in a coastal city too. Just because I LOVE medic transports. Not only so they will help heal their warship escorts if needed but mainly because Units in ships dont count as moving if they are loaded on a ship EVEN if the ship they loaded on moves. So the units attack a city get back on board and heal while moving to next city :) (at least I HOPE they still do. One of listed 3.17 changes is "units no longer get fortify bonus on ships" I just hope that not another way of saying "units wont heal while loaded on ships now" it would be VERY sucky if it does)

Medic privateers are handy too so they can heal up faster after sinking caravals and stuff (which is a NICE way to get freebie peace time GG points but also privateers that heal faster =privateers that live longer and kill more stuff which not only = more freebie peacetime gg points but also = highly promoted privateers that become VERY tuff destroyers later on :) )

but most times they obsoleted by time redcross comes online but sometimes IF I have HUGE tech lead on some backward AI who has lots of coast cities I will put off combustion for a bit so my coastal cities have time to make shipyards so they can at least make combat 1 privateers one turn away from medic.

Another fun use for GG's is sticking one to a privateer and just watch his levels go up after giving him tactics and letting him kill ships and get exp even in peacetime it's not really all THAT practical but it LOTS of fun hehe.

Kaytie

When going for a Cultural Victory is is important to have one of the destined to be Legendary cities be a military unit producer. When you have the Sistine Chapel, your GGs produce 2 Culture each. This stacks really fast when you settle 4 or more and have several Cathedrial equavelent buildings to amplify your culture (i.e. 4 GG produce 8 raw culture. 4 Cathedrials and Hermitage add +300% which would be 16 culture per turn just from the GG).

OK but the city shouldnt be making units. Whatever hammers it has should be going towards the production of culture or towards city improvements that give it more hammers, so it can make more culture faster.

OK but the city shouldnt be making units. Whatever hammers it has should be going towards the production of culture or towards city improvements that give it more hammers, so it can make more culture faster.

Why not? If you don't have any Culture building to produce, there is no reason not to use the production hog to pound out some units...especially if that city can make them in 1-2 turns. I often find that there are several times in a Cultural game where my production center runs out of stuff to build. Early in the tech tree I have that city pound out melee units or horse archers to premtively attack (read defense) one of the AI civs. Mid to late game I will pound out defensive units to beef up my power rating to deter AI players from DOW me in my moment of Cultural triumph. The extra culture produced by the GG (with SC) is just icing on the cake.

Monty can get a medic III/woody III quite easily, of course. But any aggressive or charismatic leader can, too, if you're willing to use 2 GGs.

Get a spear to 7 XP (agg) or 8 XP (char). Attach a GG. Place it in a tile with exactly one other unit, and attach a GG to that second unit -- 10 XP to each. I like to use a 7 XP chariot for the second unit, so it can become a medic III as well. I like having one super-duper medic who travels with the stack, plus one 2-move medic for a second stack, defensive duty, or just insurance.

As for settling GG's: I initially spread them around to get lots of 5 XP units without civics. Eventually, though, I want to get at least one good production city up to 9 or 11 XPs. This will mostly produce seige units, since it's become so much harder for them to earn XPs in combat. It's great to have a significant fraction of your cannons/artillery roll off the line at CR III, or just 1 XP short of it.

Why not? If you don't have any Culture building to produce, there is no reason not to use the production hog to pound out some units...especially if that city can make them in 1-2 turns. I often find that there are several times in a Cultural game where my production center runs out of stuff to build. Early in the tech tree I have that city pound out melee units or horse archers to premtively attack (read defense) one of the AI civs. Mid to late game I will pound out defensive units to beef up my power rating to deter AI players from DOW me in my moment of Cultural triumph. The extra culture produced by the GG (with SC) is just icing on the cake.
I think the problem would be the opposite: the city has cultural builds available, but is needed to churn out units instead. When I play for a cultural win, which admittedly isn't often, my military cities are not my legendary cities. Your main threat when playing for a cultural win is that you look like a tasty artsy-fartsy treat to the AI, so you need to keep churning out units from cities that aren't busy building culture.

Recon units can't get medic 3 or woodsman 3.

Recon units can't get medic 3 or woodsman 3.

I'm almost 100% positive scouts can get medic III. They can't get woodsman III unless something has changed though.

there sure is alot of focus given to making a medic. in my experience medic 2 is easy to get to without trying and one can throw it on any unit so as not to be nit picky about a minor promotion.
Where is the fun in making a military instructor? A great general
attachment gives your promotions and an uber unit with Leadership that one can crash into the enemy and either win or die. Worrying about units dieing is not on me list of concerns- however having a Great General lead a successful attack or defense can add excitement- as oppossed to a non involving, non dramatic, non risk taking, non adventerous military instructor. Unless he is like that military instructor in Star War Troopers that gets to actually fight.

Why not? If you don't have any Culture building to produce, there is no reason not to use the production hog to pound out some units...especially if that city can make them in 1-2 turns. I often find that there are several times in a Cultural game where my production center runs out of stuff to build.

I dont follow the build nine cities, crank culture to 100% and pray method of cultural victories.

My last cultural win was with the HRE. Izzy and Rome were right next to me and they had no iron. So, I killed them both. Monty was to my north with an empire equal to mine. Fortunately I was able to use him as an attack dog for a while, but eventually he turned on me and we fought 4 wars total.

I chose Rome, Madrid and Vienna to be my legendary sites. I had 12 to 15 cities total. With all those cities, there's no way I needed to use my culture cites to defend myself. They simply built culture and buidlings that improve hammers and ran artist specialists. Even through the wars. But, to answer the question, building culture lets you finish faster.

First one goes on a spear medic. I like spears for medics since they can go down woody line. And its not hard to get spears promoted if you go to war early enough. Usally that early in game once you make your first spear you can catch a barb warrior, or unfortified enemy warrior, or a weakly promoted chariot or even say when you suicied an axe to sofen up a archer in walled city or 40% holy city or something if that suicide drops archer low enuff then it can be safe for spear medic to finish him off. That usually enough to get em to at least 6 exp. by time first GG pops. The I attach GG to lvl 6 spear which makes him 26 exp. which is nice cuz first now you got your lvl 6 unit needed for wp. And 2nd thats enough promotions to get him medic 2 then medic three and have one promo left over.



I did something along the lines of this to get a spear medic, but i found it always got selected in stack defense pre-engineering.

I usually use my first general on one unit to get it to level six for West Point. The next I usually put in a good port city with decent production. Usually West Point goes there with my Heroic Epic. This way I can produce a ton of land/naval units with a lot of experiece (Vassalage and Theocracy needed). I then spread my other specialist generals around. This way I can get units with three or more promotions easily. Usually no more than four because of massive experience requirments.

Recon units can't get medic 3 or woodsman 3.

They can get medic 3. I use explorers for all my M.A.S.H. Units. If I have an early scout survive until 6 exp. (one fight then a hut for exp or animals for 5exp and one lucky fight vs a barb warrior) i stash him until I get a GG. If it comes down to a scout defending then your stack is gone altready

I did something along the lines of this to get a spear medic, but i found it always got selected in stack defense pre-engineering.

I wind up slapping the GG on any old thing - spears are often the target!

Make more than 1-3 spears. Having 4-5 on hand means one can be the GG medic without problems. The GG stays at combat I, all medic promos after that. Other spears get C II from the get go (I often have access to 2 promos for several spears by the time a GG pops).

A combat II spear is always selected over a c I medic III spear.

The easiest way to protect a GG is to just give an axe or something combat I then medic it, rest get shock. Never upgrade the old unit and it's almost never an issue (an axe, spear, etc will never be chosen first in the middle ages or later!).

I haven't had a medic die without the stack being wiped out in a while.