Will there be a version of corporations in future FFH2 releases? The corp-system seems useful for Medieval 2: Total War style guilds or something more FFH'ish like traveling mercenary groups, lesser doomsday cults, maybe even Dragon cults. If modding allows, FFH-style corporations granting unique units/buildings/Mana would be nice!

What do you think about it?

I think it's too cool not to use somehow!

Yeah, I think Kael and crew can think up some use for it. If not, I bet this community will. :)

The thought has struck us:D

if it were incorperated as guilds, it could make the guilds civic more interesting.

Guilds could be almost a direct translation of the Corp mechanic.

I've always wanted magic to have more of a day to day effect on the FFH game.

Maybe a Guild of Mages, turns mana into Hammers?

or maybe have tons of guilds for tons of things llie theives mercants sages bards mages prests naval thngies warriors and all sorts of things

I hoped to see more of the minor religions included in later releases of FFH, but I think the mod would suffer if there were more than 5-7 religions; perhaps minor religions could be implemented with the corporation mechanic?

besides AV, FoL, OO, RoK, Order, CoD.. what were the other planed religions?

I don't think that there are anymore planned, but Lugus and a Esus religion are being considered. A Mulcarn/Auric Ulvin religion might make it into Ice.

I really see guilds as a corporations (except for merchants guild, mages guld... you can have tanners guild (turns sheep,deer... into happy) etc. but even if not incorporated like this I bet team will find a good useoft it

There is also a Bhaal religion; I think most, if not all, of the twenty one angels could conceivably have a religion.

All the angels have a religion in the FfH cannon (even the one represented by Cassiel), but implementing them all would probably add complication without increasing fun.

adding many religions would mean that each individual religion gets less flavor and that makes me saaad

Well, Ill keep my fingers crossed for guilds then :goodjob:

perhaps minor religions could be implemented with the corporation mechanic?

Yeah this is a good way to implement the other religions. They wouldn't be real religions like the main 5. Maybe small cults.

My favorite way of implementing minor religions would be replacing pagan temples with civ specific ones- orcs would get temple of Bhall instead of pagan temple, which would give extra xp, calabim temple of (angel of body?) etc.

I'd like to see the Hallowers or something like that, who turn life mana into lessening the armageddon counter. Maybe 1 mana= -.5 armaggedon. A evil group could do the opposite with entropy mana. It would make intresting gameplay, trying to eliminate the enemy corporation. Perhaps there would be a unit that removed all corporations from a city, the Tax Collector? I was slightly dissapointed there were no corporations in AoI.

I don't think that there are anymore planned, but Lugus and a Esus religion are being considered. A Mulcarn/Auric Ulvin religion might make it into Ice.

I hope so. I want to see that blizzard effect again :)

I want to see The White Hand as a selectable religion. :P

I wonder if 0.24 ever going to use the same religion from age of ice, maybe the illians cause they use to work for the god of winter, and try to resurrect him.

the coorperation should be renamed as guilds and I think the guilds should be special. I wonder if they can do a special thing for the alignment, for example, good have "The Holy Order", the evil people have "The Dark Brotherhood", The Neutral should have "The Balanced Hand". I also wonder if there is a way to make one of the guild options related to only one type of Religion. The Guild purposes is to do just religion purposes, like the Runes should be able to increase the chances of gaining metals, the Leave have an increase of tree growths, The Holy Order help reduce maintance cost, Octapus Overlord should taint the sea for bonus food and gold or hammers, and finally the Ashen Veil raises the undead from the graves.

Corporations should become secret societies that you can spread to other cities (probably making the CEO equivalent invisible). They should consume resources (and create hammers) silently so you only notice if you're really paying attention. Next to giving the owning player gold they should also give him some sort of minor control over the city (kind of like spy missions perhaps? Different mission for each secret society?)

i would like to see corporations implemented as a mix of guilds, minor religion and even mercenaries.
It would be really interesting to spread a guild which gives a city free access to some mercenary units, others which is related to a minor religion and so on.
Making all "corporations" minor religions would be just doubling religion, mixing minor religions,mercenaries, merchant guilds would make gameplay more varied.

Would it be going to far to make the Esus "guild" necessary for any use of espionage, and the Lugus one for counter-espionage?

If the team can rebalance corps into something useful and not some all-powerful weapon that cripples the AI, then I'm all for it. But the current implementation of corps are completely broken.

I'm sure the design team is having fun brainstorming this one. :)

I think people are right that corporations should probably be called guilds in this mod, to fit the quasi-medieval flavor of Ffh.

I don't think they should be linked with particular religions: they're supposed to act in a manner similar to religions, e.g., you get benefits by spreading them. The religions in Ffh are already pretty distinct in their effects, it seems to me.

I suppose there are several possibilities for what you could do with corporations in Ffh: have them produce a resource, a unit (maybe a unique unit?), or some other benefit as they do in BtS.

Will be interesting to see what the team comes up with.

If the team can rebalance corps into something useful and not some all-powerful weapon that cripples the AI, then I'm all for it. But the current implementation of corps are completely broken.

by just removing the maintenance (1 number for each corp in the right xml) it is possible to clear the broken side of the corp (their huge problem when inflation rise)

by just removing the maintenance (1 number for each corp in the right xml) it is possible to clear the broken side of the corp (their huge problem when inflation rise)The HQ income is also too high. Combining those two means swarming rivals with your executives is way strong. Especially if guilds/corps in FfH 2 weren't limited to the late game.

But guilds will not be just name-swapped versions of BtS guilds. Everything is open to change in our world. :)

But guilds will not be just name-swapped versions of BtS guilds. Everything is open to change in our world. :)

Do you have already an idea about how to implement them :) ?

I think it would be best if the FfH corporations weren't all of the same type. Some could be minor religions, some could be guilds, some could be secretive cults of assassins and warriors. They should be as diverse as possible and open to many different strategies.

Is there any limit to number of corporations? There are 7 in vanilla but could there be more?

Myself I would have suggested reworking the Tower of Mastery to use the Corporation mechanic.

Instead of the the minor towers being national wonders, each becomes the central hub of a Magic "School" a Univeristy of sorts that promotes the use of a certain disipline of magic, be it Necromancy, Elementalism, Divination, etc.

Each "Univeristy" would most likely generate extra beakers for each city in which it's teachings are followed. The benefits each city gets might still require some brainstorming, but I can imagine that a benefit from the School of Necromancy would be decent increased production as corpses are raised to carry out vast works of labour. This might be tempered with a slight unhealthyness increase.

Of course, some Schools of Magic would be opposed to others, but I'm not sure if it's possible to make corporations compete if they don't share a recourse (Perhaps an "invisible" resource could be used for this purpose?). Excecutives could become traveling scholars spreading the teaching of their School, the cost of spread respresenting them setting up a small area withing the city where they can train students.

Of course, completing the Tower of Mastery would still involve controlling all the lesser Towers, and so the teachings of all Magic in the world. Could lead to some intresting single target conquests.

I would also think that seeing as Mana would be used as the resources here, that each civ/race would have a better chance of founding a school of Magic that fits their ideas and values.


Of course, the big issue here would be... Could the AI handle it?

I would just like them added as a guilds. Simple as that, tanner guild takes extra sheep, deer, fur for happiness (This is too similar to Kuriotates Tailor?) Merchants guild takes many luxury resources and trades them for gold, blacksmith guild takes extra metals and trades them for industry, artist guild takes stone (marble is gone...) and metals and dyes and trades them for culture and bit of gold, farmers guild takes food resources for extra food...
There would be a big competing among these- artists and blacksmiths, food and tanners, merchants and tanners...

Two more things-
Thieves guild takes gold, but it would be interesting if they could 'smuggle' resources you need- taking, say, 3 different resources and giving one you don't have access to, or from enemy civ with thieves guild.
And mages guild same as now, but handled via guild instead of building - trades extra mana for promotions :)
Make founding corps a civ specific thing, to spice up a, say, Malakim?

Many creative options, I have full confidence team will come up with something cool.

I know this is highly unrealistic, but perhaps they could represent planar trading. Merchants from other planes might want stone (only availble in Erebus) for a resource that does not spawn on the map. It would be intresting, but maybe it would be to powerful, being the only one with a resource. Just an idea...

Well, the Lanun are the only ones with pearls.
I think that's a good idea, for a guild, though not all of them need be like that.

I think it should be possible to add two levels of the corporation system, and as such both guilds (for turning resources into food/production/commerce) and cults (for providing specific exp or upgrades and/or effecting the city ie happines/health) could be possibilities.

I'm sure this will get some serious attention once the initial conversion is done.

One way I'd like to see the corperations implimented would be in a lesser role than they play in a late era game of the stock bts.

The way I see the FFHII most games boil down to Good Vs Evil + afew fence sitters, with the reglions taking center stage in just about every game, and as the reglions are a major factor throughout the games I've played there really isn't much use for the corperations as they were intended by the all powerful creators of Civ4.

What I would like to see is instead of the corperations replacing the reglions to work with the religions and the players, be they AI or Human, to aid them in there victories,

BUT not through suppling the player with an exbotinate amount of moolah, but with perhaps a set bonuses like a "free promontion" for units in this city, mages exp rate doubled here, or perhaps the plain ol' "this this and this get this" type of bonus, with no finacial gain to the city housing the corperation and/or the city housing the corperations Hq, the bonuses would simply be Militaristic and/or Sciencific

Perhaps make them pot luck too, so the players don't actually choose which corperations to found =P]

.........and errr......sorry if this is unreadable to most, haven't slept in awhile ^.^;;

EDIT: (Second thought that would probably be a major ***** to code the AI for that heh)

Instead of the the minor towers being national wonders, each becomes the central hub of a Magic "School" a Univeristy of sorts that promotes the use of a certain disipline of magic, be it Necromancy, Elementalism, Divination, etc.

I really like this idea. The more fantasy that can be worked into the fantasy mod, the better. And with magic already tied into the resource system, it makes perfect sense. Give each school of magic a couple of unique spells that are unlocked by having the corp. in your civ., and it's golden.

I really like this idea. The more fantasy that can be worked into the fantasy mod, the better. And with magic already tied into the resource system, it makes perfect sense. Give each school of magic a couple of unique spells that are unlocked by having the corp. in your civ., and it's golden.

Actually, I would like alittle less magic, and a little more mundane. Guilds should be less magic. Magic I think is more religous, with the priests, so something should remain untouched by it. Maybe there could be a mage guild, but I would prefer actual companies or merchants. While it could be linked with mana, I would prefer to be more unique. I think an ethanol like corporation should be made for reagents, which are very important, like oil, in the late game. Perhaps converting a certain kind of mana (nature?) into reagents. Just a suggestion.

<Insert name>'s alchemical gardens => Turns nature mana, and some food resources to reagens.

I think it would be best if the FfH corporations weren't all of the same type. Some could be minor religions, some could be guilds, some could be secretive cults of assassins and warriors. They should be as diverse as possible and open to many different strategies.

I don't really think that would work. It would confuse lots of stupid people. By that reasoning, religions could be mixed as well, which is just illogical. Finally, adding cults would take away from the uniqueness of the current religions.

If you could separate them into separate screens than having Religions, Cults, and Guilds would work nicely (CotD would obviously become a cult instead of a religion). Having Guilds and Cults intermixed on the same screen would just be wrong. I would prefer a separate cult screen, but they could probably just be arranged in two separate rows at the top and bottom of the same screen.

Cults might be like unadoptible religions that probably cause more harm than good except in their holy cities (They should also have the same negative penalties as non state religions from civics, and be wiped out by inquisitions). It might be nice if they spread faster than real religions, but sometimes died out on their own. Some cults could also have some synergy with some religions and huge problems with others, possibly based on alignment. I'm reminded of how the Civilopedia says that the Lugus and Sirona religions are tolerated by the Order, but their priests are required to give assistance as healers, exc. Perhaps their current priests could get fewer spell spheres, but also get the spheres of the more synergistic cults. For example, Confessors might start only with Law (and probably fire, unless both a Bhall and Brigit cult are added) magic but have access to Spirit, Life, and Sun sphere if built in cities with the Sirona, Sucellus, and Lugus cults. Esus and Mammon cults might let evil/neutral disciples have access to shadow and mind magic. Would it be too much to give each civ a cult for its representative elements, and make that civ immune to its negative effects? It might be best to let anyone found the cults, but make it much easier for them. Since several wonders are related to certain gods, it might make sense for these to require the cult (or to found the cult if that is a better mechanic) It might also be appropriate to make cults have unique units, or to make current units like Monks or Shadows dependent on certain cults. Since the cults are not government sanctioned, it might be nice if their units were not buildible (except perhaps by the founder or the civ that represents that cults element), but would sometimes randomly join your cause.

Guilds would be much more like the Cooperations in BtS. They would probably have purely economic, non-religious effects. Guilds would be improved by the Guild civic. I'm undecided as to whether tieing the current Mage Guild and Theves Guild buildings to actual Guilds is a good idea. If so, perhaps the Mage guild should be founded at the start of the game by the Amurites when they are present, and whoever gets Knowledge of the Ether first otherwise. If they do decide that each civ should start with a cult, then perhaps some less magically inclined civs (like Khazad and maybe Hippus) could start with a guild instead.

Cults might be like unadoptible religions that probably cause more harm than good except in their holy cities (They should also have the same negative penalties as non state religions from civics, and be wiped out by inquisitions). It might be nice if they spread faster than real religions, but sometimes died out on their own.If this were the case, it would be easier to do using religion mechanics than corporations.

I all for having quite different types represented under guilds, mercantile guildds, secret societies, noble houses, military orders, maybe even minor races. We can just call the screen "Organizations" or something, and make sure the benefits/drawbacks are clearly explained (when they get finalized, of course.)

I dont know about cults. You allready have the religions and, above that, between those there is allready Cult of the Dragon.

I feel more for the guild system, but im not sure.

My thought on cults was that they would give access to unique units, maybe with some cost: increased maintenance, unhappiness, loss of culture, random events, whatever. It just seems like it would be a great mechanic to introduce some units with a very unique flavor.

How about the idea of sacrifice? Sacrificing animals, other food resources, or metals to a god for access to a god's preferred mana type?

What do you mean by sacrificing animals? Does this mean sheep resources, or capturexd lions and wolves?

I haven't had my copy of BtS very long, and so far, have only used it for ffh2 ;) but my understanding is that corporations allow you to trade one or more resources for other resources and/or happiness, etc. So, cows, sheep, corn, rice, horses, etc.

The only resource I can see gained by animal capturing is silk (spiders).

Would be amusing if capturing Adepts or other magic users would create a slave magic user, and if you could use something like 3 of them to create a building that would provide a random mana source. Sort of like using two Great People for golden age.

Adepts/magic users would need to be captured by Inquisitors, of course.

I would like to see every civ have a cultural "corporation" type of thing; for instance food...lets say the Calabim have a special recipe that can be a delicacy in another civ. 'Meatbag Pasta', 'Pizza', 'Your Mom'...you know, things from that particular culture that can be marketable. Of course you'd need the proper ingredients before using so-n-so corp or...hmm...not, seeing that the only resource needed for Calabim food is people, just use the other civs peeps as food. It'll decrease their pop. cap. and yields a few gold a turn. ;)

Although seeing there's only five corps. and you may need actual resources to found such corps. Mayhaps unrealistic for game use, heh

I would like to see every civ have a cultural "corporation" type of thing; for instance food...lets say the Calabim have a special recipe that can be a delicacy in another civ. 'Meatbag Pasta', 'Pizza', 'Your Mom'...you know, things from that particular culture that can be marketable. Of course you'd need the proper ingredients before using so-n-so corp or...hmm...not, seeing that the only resource needed for Calabim food is people, just use the other civs peeps as food. It'll decrease their pop. cap. and yields a few gold a turn. ;)

Civilized Calabim Chefs
Requires- Cow or Sheep (the side)
Gives- 1:culture:, 1:yuck:9 (decreases Pop cap)