We have already a poll about which new leader you would most like to kill, but here is a bit of a flip side - which of them do you think is going to be the biggest pain in the ass - the new Monty or Isabella, so to speak?

Make your votes!

Sitting Bull! He's terrible!:mad:

I think Hammurabi is going to be quite aggressive. Not Quite as psycho as Monty but still annoying.

There is something about Pacal that screams Montezuma ...

Something tells me Boudica is going to an Isabella-like psycho, only with more dangerous traits.

Yeah, Boudica will probably be the greatest pain

Definitely Boudica. First of all, the historical Boudica was a crazy aggressive war leader, so I'm assuming they'll give her an aggressive personality. On top of that, she has good warmongering traits and a good early UU.

Boudica... she will be an insane warmonger

I'm going with Boudica, too. I'm thinking she'll be some kind of female Montezuma. I think both Hammurabi and Justinian might be good contenders as well, especially if their historical personas are anything to go by.

Pacal, I don't know... Sure, he looks like a basket case in the screenshot, but his traits don't really point in that direction. If we're comparing him to nearby leaders, I think he'll be more like Huayna Capac. He's surely going to be a strong contender for the space race, though.
...If one lets him live that long, that is :mwaha:

I don't know how anybody can answer this question other than by guessing. We don't know the parameters associated with the "personalities" of each of these leaders. Those parameters affect how likely they are to attack, pile on, trade, make demands, etc. These are the parameters that make Montezuma, Shaka and Isabella distinctive, not so much their starting techs, traits or UUs.

If he's programmed right, Darius I will be a nightmare...

Hammurabi,with his UU bowmen, I might as well throw away my favorite early Axeman rush.

And Darius I, his deadly trait combo will leave you in the dust, he'll be worst then Mansa Mansa, I remember Washington in Vanilla could keep up in tech with me even on noble :S.. and i was a Monarch player back in Vanilla.

I think I'll end up hating Darius, De Gaulle, and Sitting Bull.

I don't think I could hate Boudica.:mischief:

Let's say you don't like e.g. Boudica's Monty-esque personality, is it easy to change? I like Boudica, and would like her to have a personality that does allow me to befriend and trust her, at least to a certain extent. The only reliable thing about Monty is that he's bound to go after you sooner or later; I don't want Boudica to be the female Monty.

Sitting Bull will probably be very irritating. A sort of culturally minded Tokugawa, who pushes your cultural boundaries and defends his cities with super strong archers that make attacking almost impossible.

Pain in the ass or biggest war monger. I find Mansa, HC, Ramses II, Louis bigtime pains in my games. I pretty much know what to expect from Shake, Monty, Isabella, Tokugawa. That said I think The Dutch (Cultural/Creative) and Portugese (imperialistic/Expansive) will be pains unless it's pangea. I think Sitting Bull and the etheopian will be a problem with very pressing cultural borders. Hammurabi/Mayan may be early problems but not later because of weaker UB. Boudaci is a definite war Monger who is very likely to fall behind in tech early (weaker tech traits and UB).

I think I knew some girls during college that remind me of Boudica. Fascinating to talk to but I would trust them any further than I could throw them!

I say Willem Van Oranje, we Dutch are pretty smart you know...I think he'll be like a new Gandhi-Roosevelt-Napoleon sort of thing...(the game not real life).

Darius would be a pain if he's not a war maniac.

I don't know how anybody can answer this question other than by guessing. We don't know the parameters associated with the "personalities" of each of these leaders. Those parameters affect how likely they are to attack, pile on, trade, make demands, etc. These are the parameters that make Montezuma, Shaka and Isabella distinctive, not so much their starting techs, traits or UUs.

That's why the opening post says "which of them do you think will be", not "which of them is". :rolleyes:

Boudica will probably be psychotic.

Heh, if she is, imagine a game with her, Alexander, Isabela and Montezuma as your neighbours. :D

Also, about Boadicea, since Celts start with Mysticism, she will likely have one of the first religions. If she is anything like the other two psycho-maniacs, she is going to start some early crusade for sure.

Heh, if she is, imagine a game with her, Alexander, Isabela and Montezuma as your neighbours. :D

Also, about Boadicea, since Celts start with Mysticism, she will likely have one of the first religions. If she is anything like the other two psycho-maniacs, she is going to start some early crusade for sure.

I hope that they attack each other instead of me though, too much anti-human bias in the game.

I'd appreciate it if someone could answer my question.

To further expand on what I wrote, I'd like Boudica to be the kind of person who would like and respect you if you had a reasonably powerful army and were the same religion as her, and so she wouldn't then just attack you out of the blue. Are there any current leaders who fit this descripion?

I think the other Celtic leader falls in that catagory. Hey someone in BTS has be a war monger maniac (Isabella/Monty in vanilla Shaka/Ragnar in Warlords). Given her traits and UB gotta think she's gonna be a war maniac along with Hammurabi and maybe the Mayan. I don't know, something about tring to negotiate peace with a firey redhead who despises me.

i picked Justinian, because in real life he was actually pretty ruthless. and he conquered quite an area. the Byzantines werent that nice, you know... they still had some Roman blood running through their veins. plus he'll have the Cataphracts, which are a pretty nice UU.

but Boudicea probably would be pretty annoying too.

I'd appreciate it if someone could answer my question.

To further expand on what I wrote, I'd like Boudica to be the kind of person who would like and respect you if you had a reasonably powerful army and were the same religion as her, and so she wouldn't then just attack you out of the blue. Are there any current leaders who fit this descripion?

The leaders' personalities are completely customizable through editing of the XMLs. There's a lot of parameters to take into account, though, but it's quite easy to just copy and paste the personality of another leader you might like.

Check out \Assets\XML\Civilizations\CIV4LeaderHeadInfos.xml for a better idea. Be sure to copy it to \CustomAssets\XML\Civilizations\ before you start fiddling around with it. That will save you the trouble of a reinstall if you mess something up.

To further expand on what I wrote, I'd like Boudica to be the kind of person who would like and respect you if you had a reasonably powerful army and were the same religion as her, and so she wouldn't then just attack you out of the blue. Are there any current leaders who fit this descripion?

I haven't played her that much (bad or good luck on my games), but isn't that Isabella's description? Specially if you consider the bold part...

Isabella is not bright and will attack if you have an enormous army to her handful of warrioir units This had happened to me).

I hope that they attack each other instead of me though, too much anti-human bias in the game.

I agree. Everytime I play, all the other civs have a love fest with each other. Not that they all hate, me, but despite half of them sharing my religion, they are still so chummy with the others. So there are never any wars other than with me. I'd like to see two civs beat the crap out of each other for once.

If you voted Joao II...I'M GOING TO KILL YOU!!!:spank: :evil: :mwaha: :nya: :ar15: :whipped: :sniper:

Hammurabi. Now how do you axerush them if they do end up being your neighbour?

Thanks to all who answered. I'll wait until I play the game to decide what (if anything) to do about Boudica's personallity. I basically just don't want her to be another Monty. If she is a neighbour of mine, I don't want to feel that war is inevitable.

I don't know how they will make the AI for De Gaulle as suitably annoying to represent the real leader.

I think Boudica will be like Isabella in that she'll be a faithful ally and a fierce opponent, but what makes her your 'friend' will be different from religion. (If you double cross her once I expect her to be more fiercely against you than anyone else in the game).

I don't know how they will make the AI for De Gaulle as suitably annoying to represent the real leader.

How could they program De Gaulle to be more trouble for his allies than his opponents?

How could they program De Gaulle to be more trouble for his allies than his opponents?
I don't know. It's too bad you can't have personalized diplomacy between leaders. I wish I could ask Churchill

"What do you think of De Gaul?"

"Unfortunately my bishops wont let me burn him."

I'm shocked that Boudica is winning like that. I mean, she'll be crazy aggressive I'm sure, but even with the Better AI, I don't think the AI will be smart enough with choosing promotions to really make good use out of it.

I'm going with Gilgamesh because I see Creative/Protective as the worst trait combination for your neighbor to start with. I am going to hate starting next to him.

Hammurabi. Now how do you axerush them if they do end up being your neighbour?

Yeah he's going to be an annoying neighbor until catapults.

If you have Boudica in the game, you might as well prepare for war.

I think Boudicca will be the worst. I don't think she'll prove to be a massive threat economically, but I feel she may be of a similar mould to Monty, a crazy back stabbing . .. .. .. .. ., possibly even worse.

I think Darius is in second place for me. His trait combo could well see him being an insane techer. Just imagine having both gim and Mansa in the same game with you.

Why is Charlemagne so low on the rankings? Think about it:

- cares a lot about religion (Holy)
- solid UU
- keen on empire (Empire)

I'd put Justinian as a runner up to him.

Something tells me Boudica is going to an Isabella-like psycho, only with more dangerous traits.

I agree. People should ignore her cleavage and keep an eye on her troop movements. I said *troop* movements.

I agree. Everytime I play, all the other civs have a love fest with each other. Not that they all hate, me, but despite half of them sharing my religion, they are still so chummy with the others. So there are never any wars other than with me. I'd like to see two civs beat the crap out of each other for once.

Didn't the game designers said something about the leaders in BtS behaving towards each other more the way they do to the human player than they do now?

I'd appreciate it if someone could answer my question.

To further expand on what I wrote, I'd like Boudica to be the kind of person who would like and respect you if you had a reasonably powerful army and were the same religion as her, and so she wouldn't then just attack you out of the blue. Are there any current leaders who fit this descripion?

Bismarck is pretty nice, but he doesn't give a rat's ass about religion...:goodjob:

My problem is with Charlemagne he's got Imperialistic and Protective so he gets cities quick and keeps them especially in the medieval ages with those landsknechts of his. :cringe:

I put De Gaulle.

I can just see it now. I'm his neighbor and he's #1 in the power graph. But with good planning and luck, I destroy his civ in 2 turns. He has a couple of cities scattered about the world but nothing to be worried about. I launch an invation against another neighbor and the next thing I know the entire world's gunning for me. Not only do they take back his lands, but they give it back to him for free and take all of my cities.

But on the other hand I'm not in this game, as has been pointed out in tons of threads.

I'd appreciate it if someone could answer my question.

To further expand on what I wrote, I'd like Boudica to be the kind of person who would like and respect you if you had a reasonably powerful army and were the same religion as her, and so she wouldn't then just attack you out of the blue. Are there any current leaders who fit this descripion?

Brennus and Mehmed.

Blake pulled a bunch of personality parameters for all the Warlords leaders a while back to see who is the biggest bastard (the answer may surprise you. It's not Montezuma or Shaka or Alexander or Genghis.). Anywho, it turns out that Brennus and Mehmed respect their friends (they will never pick a fight with anyone they are pleased or friendly towards), but are thoroughly vicious towards everyone else.

Thanks, Monkeyfinger. I managed to track down the post:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=5042215#post5042215

Every leader with the protective trait... :p

I can't believe no one has mentioned Gilgamesh yet (well, except Sjaramei somehow...).
He may not have the ultimate warmonger traits like Boudica or the ultimate economy traits like Darius, and his UB looks rather weak but Protectice/Creative is great for early landgrab and if the improverd AI will pull an Axeman-rush from time to time Gilgamesh will be the greatest threat in the early game.
And there is something terrifying about the leaderhead...

I can't believe no one has mentioned Gilgamesh yet (well, except Sjaramei somehow...).
He may not have the ultimate warmonger traits like Boudica or the ultimate economy traits like Darius, and his UB looks rather weak but Protectice/Creative is great for early landgrab and if the improverd AI will pull an Axeman-rush from time to time Gilgamesh will be the greatest threat in the early game.
And there is something terrifying about the leaderhead...

Well IF the gunpowder units do get the drill promotion now Gilgamesh would look pretty sweet. In the beginning you will have the cultural advantage which will let you spread your cities and with the protective trait you won't need much army to defend it. Later on the gunpowder units will get the Drill promotion and be capable of carrying an assault, because after the first promotion you will be able to chose between Formation,Shock and Pinch(if I'm not mistaken).

I'ts not only the traits, it's the Vulture.

I think Justinian and his civ will be the hardest.

I think Justinian and his civ will be the hardest.

yeah, but he looks like some diseased/weakling, so...

I can't believe no one has mentioned Gilgamesh yet (well, except Sjaramei somehow...).
He may not have the ultimate warmonger traits like Boudica or the ultimate economy traits like Darius, and his UB looks rather weak but Protectice/Creative is great for early landgrab and if the improverd AI will pull an Axeman-rush from time to time Gilgamesh will be the greatest threat in the early game.
And there is something terrifying about the leaderhead...

I imagined him to be old and fat but he's like young, fit and looks like a WARRIOR! :eek:

I imagined him to be old and fat but he's like young, fit and looks like a WARRIOR! :eek:

You expected a legendary king with description as Konan himself to look old and fat?

Before voting this poll, I encourage everyone to read the description that Fraxis gave Zara Yaqob. Don't let that Eddie Murphy smile fool you folks, this guy is going to be a smiling, diehard, psychopath with all the religious zeal of Isabella and the bloodlust of Monty. I reckon sharing his religion will be the only way to slow his paranoia... beware!!

I definitely agree that the religious types tend to bring about the most nuisances. Zara Yaqob, Justinian, and Charlemagne could all potentially be worse than Isabella.

I definitely agree that the religious types tend to bring about the most nuisances. Zara Yaqob, Justinian, and Charlemagne could all potentially be worse than Isabella.

I guess, but Justinian looks like a §¶•?ª....:lol:

Zara Yaqob for sure. Read his bio. Religious nut probably...best to convert to Jesus now before he tries to kick our butts :o

I voted Sitting Bull. Anyone who gets in the way of my civ's manifest destiny is a pain in the butt :evil: :D.

I think a lot will depend on a person's playing style... if you're an aggressive player: Sitting Bull because he'll be a tough nut to crack in the early game probably. If you're a builder: Boudica because she'll be attacking you every chance she gets until you stomp her out once and for all.

I agree. Everytime I play, all the other civs have a love fest with each other. Not that they all hate, me, but despite half of them sharing my religion, they are still so chummy with the others. So there are never any wars other than with me. I'd like to see two civs beat the crap out of each other for once.

I think that you will see more AI v. AI wars. I have been playing w/blakes Better AI for a while now and there tends to be more AI wars. Since frixas is encorporating the Better AI into BTS it should be awesome.

MY experiences with the better AI have been great. Even for an unfinished product. The game is much more interesting when others are fighting on a regular basis.

Hmm...I've seen AIs completely destroy each other, and become massive. Then again, I almost always play with Aggressive AI on. I've been drug into a world war started by AI nutjobs (Isabella, obviously).

I'm voting for Boudica simply because she has two warmonger traits, arguably the best warmonger trait combo, and the AI is supposedly better at coordinating military operations and acts more like a dastardly human.