Turn order:

Joe Harker - Played
Methos - Played
Dutchfire - Up
DaveShack - On deck
Falcon02
Hyronymus

It's a 6-way tie. The order should be those who didn't play last term in order of accepted nomination, followed by those who did play in order of nomination. That's if we pay attention to the "played last term" stuff. If we ignore that, then it's just order of acceptance.

Dutchfire
Joe Harker
DaveShack
Falcon02
Hyronymus
Methos

If non-players from last term go first:

Joe Harker
Methos
Dutchfire
DaveShack
Falcon02
Hyronymus

I wil plan my TC for the 5/6th, to let all the polls that are going on to expire

Hey Joe

Please put up the TC thread, so I can post instructions (promotions, movements, contigencies and so on).

Best regards

P

Ok i will do it on the 6th,

hmm Joe, some of the turnplayers put up a turnchat thread several days before they actually play the turnchat. If you set up a time for the TC, we can post days in advance.

I just put one up, isn't three days enough? if not i can do it on saturday or Monday.

I am all good, I am posting the main instructions today, the poll-pending I can do on the 6.

all the best

P

Well if anyone complains i can move it back a day.

It's a 6-way tie. The order should be those who didn't play last term in order of accepted nomination, followed by those who did play in order of nomination. That's if we pay attention to the "played last term" stuff. If we ignore that, then it's just order of acceptance.

Dutchfire
Joe Harker
DaveShack
Falcon02
Hyronymus
Methos

If non-players from last term go first:

Joe Harker
Methos
Dutchfire
DaveShack
Falcon02
Hyronymus

Who's up next? Was this a skip of Dutchfire from the 1st play order, a swap, or did we use the 2nd play order?

I think, just go on with Methos, as we already started on one list.

Got it....

Are we going to let the DP Pool Manager (Dutchfire) answer the question first? ;)

I am cool either way, but if you insist,you can poll it ;)

:eek:
:hide:
No, I'm happy with letting the official have his say. :D

Are we going to let the DP Pool Manager (Dutchfire) answer the question first? ;)

Considering we didn't start out this way, I wonder why were asking now. :)

Also, as Provo stated, we've already started down one of the lists. I'll wait though for official word.

Hmm, I would have sworn I saw something from Dutchfire saying "I'm on vacation, Joe should play in my place." But searching the forum doesn't show it.

Oh well, they say memory is the 2nd thing to start failing when you get :old:...

Considering we didn't start out this way, I wonder why were asking now. :)

Also, as Provo stated, we've already started down one of the lists. I'll wait though for official word.

You can always poll it? :)

I am certain that too much citizen input may grind this to a stall.
If Methos is before Dutchfire, who is coming next anyways, or the other way around does not really matter, as both agrees in a way.
Since we started on a list, we are already there.

Please put up the TC thread, so I can add unit naming ,movements and so on.

The official order, (it could have been found in the first post of this thread too btw.)
Joe Harker - Having a rest after that TC
Methos - UP!
Dutchfire - On deck
DaveShack
Falcon02
Hyronymus

Elections are currently being held.

Joe Harker
Methos
Dutchfire
DaveShack
Falcon02
Hyronymus

Looking at all of the 1st post makes it look like these were the candidates. :p

I am greatly disappointed that we had a designated player rush ahead and play a turn set with a controversial poll still open. Would it have hurt to wait a few more hours and see the results of the poll? You'll not ever get another vote from me JoeHarker.

Yes it would have, i had RL things as well going on that night and i really didn't want to wait another day because i didn't need more polls going up and further delaying the turnchat

I thought the Supreme Court gave Joe the green light. Unless they overlooked a poll I think their decision was well-considered.

Please put up the TC thread, so I can add unit naming ,movements and so on.

The Special Session (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=230695) thread is up, but I'll wait until after that session before putting up my TCIT.

Yes it would have, i had RL things as well going on that night and i really didn't want to wait another day because i didn't need more polls going up and further delaying the turnchat

Well, that's a very poor excuse for rushing ahead. Delaying one more day would not have been the end of the world. It is obvious you are more interested in playing the save (whether it be in conformance with DG rules or not) than letting the group make a decision about what moves should be made. As I said earlier you've lost my vote for good.

It's perfectly reasonable to do what Joe has done, the standard in the past has always been run the TC at the scheduled time, and if some poll creator hasn't set their poll to end before the TC starts, just use the results as are present at the time.

That's what Joe has done, it isn't the DP's job to wait for every last voter to trickle into a poll. And it had since been revealed that copying the original move would have resulted in No Change in the odds of the attack succeeding. In fact there wouldn't even be a change in the outcome, if you reload the old save and carry out the moves again you'll notice you always get the same result (regardless of what path the keshik takes to get there) because Civ's random number generator is, as all RNGs not very random, the next value it will deliver is set, and this will always result in a victory for our keshik as long as the keshik is the first battle (your poll wouldn't have changed that)

So really there is no change that has been made to the actual game. In the judiciary thread you complained about not being able to undo what has been done, nothing has physically been done to the results of the game.

Now it's true you can't undo the act of Joe playing the TC before the poll closed, but is that really such a big deal? I'd say we got lucky on this one we saw what can happen when a DP uses incomplete poll results, but there was no effect on the actual game, this gives us an opportunity to change the laws about playing the save with incomplete polls before any actual damage is done. I will bring an initiative to fix this problem and I hope that you'll pop over to the citizens forum to give some input on the particulars Donsig.

That's what Joe has done, it isn't the DP's job to wait for every last voter to trickle into a poll. And it had since been revealed that copying the original move would have resulted in No Change in the odds of the attack succeeding.

I think my original poll was up in time to end before the scheduled game play session. I made it a two day poll despite my personal objection to such short polls. It was DaveShack's blatant attempt to undermine that poll that resulted in a counter-poll that was to end after the scheduled session started. Is a citizen supposed to just give up when someone else makes a dirty move like the one DaveShack did?

Now, finally, I ask you, if Joe Harker's original move would not have altered the odds of the attack then why wasn't it just used as that would have satisfied all parties? Does no one with authority in this game have any common sense?

See response in the judiciary thread. Joe's move did not happen, from the DG perspective. Of course we all know what was done and the different information it revealed, but we are supposed to disregard it, not use it as a cause to overturn an existing valid decision. We do not use information obtained from illegal moves, ever.

And trolling is a bad idea.

Please be friends and go on. :)

The Special Session (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=230695) thread is up, but I'll wait until after that session before putting up my TCIT.

:)
You should put up your TCIT up on Thursday if you're going to play on Friday.

I have posted my TCIT for Saturday @10:00 AM CST (@1700 GMT) (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=230999).

RL has caused me to push it back until Saturday. I could have done it on Friday like I intended, but something came up so I would have really had to squeeze this in, which is not something I want to do.

It will be online.

See response in the judiciary thread. Joe's move did not happen, from the DG perspective. Of course we all know what was done and the different information it revealed, but we are supposed to disregard it, not use it as a cause to overturn an existing valid decision. We do not use information obtained from illegal moves, ever.

And trolling is a bad idea.

You unilateraly decided it was an illegal move and should have been disregarded. It is my position that the move was made by the current designated player and should have been considered to be legal. The whole thrust of my polls was to have the democracy game citizens make the decision as to whether the move should have been considered legal or illegal. As for using information obtained from illegal moves, IIRC you argued strenously that the move did not give us any new information so why do you bring that up now? You know as well as I do that this was not about information it was about what we should consider to be reloading.

And don't make snide remarks about trolling to try to stifle my discussion about this topic. If I'm breaking forum rules then do what you have to, otherwise leave out the accusations.

I've posted my log in this post (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=5680149&postcount=15) and here is where you can read the chat log (http://www.civfanatics.net/methos/games/dg2/1370ad_turnlog.php).

Joe Harker - Played
Methos - Played
Dutchfire - Up, Will play Friday
DaveShack - On deck
Falcon02
Hyronymus

Joe Harker - Played
Methos - Played
Dutchfire - Played
DaveShack - Up
Falcon02 - On Deck, but I fear you won't be able to have a go this
Hyronymus - time around, that does mean you'll be first next term :)

Tentative schedule: Tuesday 7/24, 10PM PDT (0500 GMT Wednesday)

Yay, I'll be the first next term (if I get elected). That does mean I need a dual install once I get my (eager) hands on BtS.

Yay, I'll be the first next term (if I get elected). That does mean I need a dual install once I get my (eager) hands on BtS.

I believe it's already been covered, but here are the instructions:

I've been digging this up forever. Here it is again, slightly edited for the current times:
Originally Posted by DaviddesJ
Dual install is pretty easy.

1. Copy "Sid Meier's Civilization IV" in Program Files/Firaxis Games, to "Sid Meier's Civilization IV v1.61".

2. Rename "Sid Meier's Civilization IV" in My Documents/My Games, to "Sid Meier's Civilization IV v1.61".

3. Install the BTS.

4. Run from one directory or the other to get the version you want. You'll also be able to install mods separately for the two versions, save games will be separate for the two versions, etc. The new version will have a clean install with no mods, which is probably what you want (since many old mods won't work).

I know about that topic but it still "stinks".

Joe Harker - Played
Methos - Played
Dutchfire - Played
DaveShack - Played
Falcon02 - Up
Hyronymus - Next term?

Falcon02 should be Up, right?

Falcon02 should be Up, right?

Corrected :blush:

I'm thinking of doing the session either Sunday evening or Monday afternoon (local time, -4 GMT).