Welcome to the Fifth edition of the Lonely Hearts Club for Warlords. In the Lonely Hearths Club we explore strategies to cope with one of the most dreaded situations in Civ IV ( possibly the main reason for reloads after the military collapse one :p ): starting in isolation....

It had passed a long time since last Warlords LHC.... A lot of people already have BTS for quite a while, isn't it? Well, not all people.... And after some requests, I decided to make a new instalement for Warlords ( for the mac people and others that can't play or don't like BTS )

For the fifth game in Warlords the choosed leader was Brennus of the Celts:

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x257/r_rolo1/LHC%20W%20V/Brennusstats0000.jpg

Brennus has a real good combination of Traits, even for a isolated start, where early war is not exactly a priority. Charismatic, besides giving the possibility of enabling the Heroic epic only with barb XP + barracks, gives 1 :) by it self and another with Monuments and broadcast towers, making StoneHenge and Eiffel Tower very atractive wonders, and helping with the city growth. Spiritual allows you not wating time in revolutions ( if you count it, may be enough for 1/2 more techs in the late game, and that can be the diference between a lost and a won game ) and allows more flexibility in diplo.

His UU.

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x257/r_rolo1/LHC%20W%20V/Gallicwarrior0000.jpg

I'm not a great fan of Gallic warrior, but I must reckon that it has some potential in hilly areas and gives then a good anti barb potential if well used

His UB.

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x257/r_rolo1/LHC%20W%20V/Dun0000.jpg

IMHO this is the worst of the Warlords UB....

So, here is the start:

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x257/r_rolo1/LHC%20W%20V/Startingposition0000.jpg

And game settings ( Map was drawn with Fractal script ):

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x257/r_rolo1/LHC%20W%20V/settings20000.jpg

I would prefer stone instead of marble, but it is a good place to settle IMHO

About saves: We decided to implement the system that is running in BTS: same start, same map, same civs, same positions, diferent dificulties ( more people can have a fun play this way ) . Pick the level you prefer in the end of post

A small request ( not mandatory :p ) :

We ask the participants to do, if possible, a write-up with the victory save and a description of your game ( strategies, techs researched, wars,...). All the info should be in spoiler tags ( to not disturb other people's games ). If you want ( we would like to :p ) post reports at this moments of the game:

Checkpoint 1 - when we have explored the island and are aware of what resources it has. Its not so important when this is, but this is a time to discuss city sites etc. Don't look into a checkpoint 1 spoiler until you have reached this point yourself.

Checkpoint 2 - first contact - when we have met all the other AIs. At this point we can discuss our strategy to get to this point and our plans for dealing with them.

Checkpoint 3 - when we are committed to a victory condition (or at least think we are).

Checkpoint 4 - Victory (or defeat).

The last words are to wish good luck to all :goodjob: . And let the games begin!

P.S We don't have any kind of problem with defeats and reruns. Just play and enjoy ;)

EDIT 2 Changed speed to Normal because of annoying bug that makes my Warlords give 460 turns to every speed. KMad Jedi powers won again :lol: Anyway saves and settings picture were corrected....

Cool! Been waiting for this for a while! I've never had an isolated start, so this should be fun.
Heavy food and marble? Hmmm. SE and Poly on this one.

EDIT:
I've never plucked a save from the boards before, given I'm somewhat of a noob. :p
When I take the noble save, It's just a bunch of gibberush. how does this convert to a save?

Just click on the link ( like when you open a web page). It will open a window asking if you want to save or open. Save it to your harddrive and play ;)

Still not working.
Can you attach the noble save in a file? That works well for Emporer and Immortal.
Thanks!

Ok.... ;) :p

oh.... epic speed.

It's working now!

Nice start, settle in place. Goody huts give me money, sweet!
Founded Hinduism for 2nd tech; opened with Agri.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb43/hackapell_4/Picture14-6.png
Found stone too: will be wonder whoring and may even go for oracle.
Lost scouts to bears :mad: they are the number one threat to Celtica.
Map with resources:

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb43/hackapell_4/Picture15-6.png

and strategy:

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb43/hackapell_4/Picture16-6.png
Probably going to REX fast; grab parthenon and oracle; then SE until contact.

Save:

YAY! Something I get to play along with! Thanks, this should be fun and a good learning experience for me!

O M G .. thats quite the fatcross to be starting with. I'm looking forward to playing this one.

Looks great, but I don't think I'll have time to play. Still need to get LHC BtS chapter II (dutch?) in full throttle. Good luck to those who do.

Just because... ok I suck I admit it.

A lonely start needs to focus on developing a solid tech base, right? So CE/SE (whichever your city placement supports) and teching towards those things that will benefit your economy/research?

I mad a mistake (from the feedback I got) on a lonely start trying to find other civs instead of focusing on economy/research and from what I've read on a lot of these that's the way to go - but I just wanted to double check that.

Meeting the neighbors:

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb43/hackapell_4/Picture17-6.png
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb43/hackapell_4/Picture18-6.png
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb43/hackapell_4/Picture19-6.png
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb43/hackapell_4/Picture20-5.png
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb43/hackapell_4/Picture21-3.png
And Hannibal.
Bunch of nasty people really. I tried to convert Monty, but he founded Islam before my missionary got there. For that, he gets the axe first :trouble:
then Hannibal, then GK, then Louis for the dom win.
Fear the Biltz! :ar15:

another weird incident: the game ends at 1850 AD?

A lonely start needs to focus on developing a solid tech base, right? So CE/SE (whichever your city placement supports) and teching towards those things that will benefit your economy/research?

I mad a mistake (from the feedback I got) on a lonely start trying to find other civs instead of focusing on economy/research and from what I've read on a lot of these that's the way to go - but I just wanted to double check that.

I think that is one of the biggest myths about how to handle a isolated start: people are used to tech trade and to war and they want to do it ASAP. So they think that a Optics beeline is the best way.... My experience with the LHC threads is that leads to a poor infrastructure and poor scientific development. In all the times that the Optics path and the economical path ( currency, CoL, CS, maybe Calendar ( in this game I would postpone Calendar to the humanly possible limit, because of the extra :) that Charismatic gives with Monuments ) ) were played, the economical path leaded to a better position and to a earlier and smoother win, because ( if you're playing in your usual level ) you'll have to do a lot of catchup either way ( it is not strange to have a 10 tech handicap in first contact and nothing to trade, so don't be scared... ) and a stronger economy will handle it better.
My advice would be focus on the techs I mentioned as the economical path, and beeline Lib ( even if you're beaten to it, FR is very helpful in diplomatic terms) and to avoid founding more than a religion ( better if it is a late one, like confu, chirstianity or Tao) to try to create some hates out there ( the last thing you want is to be the only pagan in the world... believe me ). For a more extensive response, see this (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=5668238&postcount=47) post ( was a response to a poster that wanted a compreesive guide to playing with a isolated start ( that is still on deck....maybe in a month or so, when the BtS experience is bigger ) )

@Hackapell

Wierd.... Can you post a save? This was suposed to go to 2050...

r_rolo1 - thanks for the info. I tried to play along with the Lonely Roosevelt one but Monarch is... a bit beyond me. It's great that there's a Noble start on this one for me to play along with!

I think my problem with my previous (non-series) game was that I had a pre-determined VC of Conquest/Domination (whichever came first) and a ridiculously food poor/production-rich lonely island. In short, I screwed it up.

I'll play along this game with you all and keep your tips from the Roosevelt game in mind. Thanks again!

Save, and spoiler Screenshot
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb43/hackapell_4/Picture1-13.png

I've checked the Hackapell's game and it looks that I had some kind of bug that gave the game 460 turns ( normal speed ) to a Epic game. I'll subtitute the saves ASAP and try to solve the problems with the people that already played....

NO! MY WORK!!! :cry:

I can patch it, adding some turns in the WB.... but I'm having a wierd thing with the WB basis save ( is giving me 460 turns, regardless of the speed I use :confused: ). Someone that already has knowledge of the map please can WB a starting save and create a funcional Epic game? Otherwise I'll change speed to normal and pretend that nothing happened... :runs away of furious mob:

Well, on the upside I, for one, haven't researched the pitchforks and torches tech yet.

I changed the speed of the saves to Normal ( only way to put this right by now ) and posted them im the initial post of the thread. Still working on Hackapell's save...

1995 victory on Noble! :woohoo: Yep - a big space victory in 1995! :D

Although to my credit - at least to some small extent - I tried this as an isolated one city challenge without the usual benefits of a OCC set up (only a few available National Wonders {no Globe Theatre, Oxford University, Ironworks, etc.} and constrained to two at that ... as it happens I went only with the National Epic).

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/56734/isolated_brennus_occ_wows.jpg

I really 'went to town' on the early game World Wonders, but clearly The Great Wall was very handy for a hassle-free run for the first half of the game. I ran it as a semi-pure (?) Specialist Economy, and tried to minimise the chops. I had only one 'Cottage', and as much as I respect the SE, getting tech's such as Satellites and Fibre Optics took ages (Oxford Uni' might have been nice here :lol:). I'm guessing that I would have been better served by putting up with fewer Specialists and running the city with even more :yuck: problems that I had and clearing a couple more Forests for Cottages.

General research path was; 'The Basics' emph Masonry > Literature > Civil Service > Liberalism > Astronomy > Rifling > Computers > Rocketry > Fibre Optics > Remaining SS Techs. Essentially went for an indirect bee-line to The Internet. Again, building Apollo and The Internet with no Factories, Power Plant, Ironworks, etc. was pretty slow - unfortunately few of my settled Great People were Engineers or Prophets.

The first two leaders I met both had the Aggressive trait, and consequently halted other production for a couple of stacks of Rifles (I really could have built cheaper Medieval troops and upgraded them when I got Rifling). Thankfully when I was invaded (three times) I was typically one Age up from the aggressors, so with the massive bank balance you get from a single-city empire, troops were easy to upgrade.

Anyway ... I'm somewhat of a OCC newb with Civ4, and never confined myself to a single city victory without the OCC 'set up'. I also played fairly quickly and perhaps carelessly (should have chopped more forests at the end for example!), so I am confident that many who may try this with the same variant would do much better. I was land-locked, and having surveyed the island initially, I then stayed within my cultural boundaries. I never met two of the tribes, although thankfully The Internet sourced plenty of their tech' for me.

The money shot;

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/56734/isolated_brennus_occ_zoom.jpg

Save at 1000AD (http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/56734/L_Cam_Brennus_AD-1000.CivWarlordsSave)

Save at 1995AD (http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/56734/L_Cam_Brennus_AD-1995.CivWarlordsSave)

Nice aproach Cam_H... it sure looks like a fun way to play the game :p

@Hackapell

I really don't have the slightess idea of how to salvage your game... at least in my warlords ( that needs a urgent reinstall, by the looks of it ). You played 361 turns with Epic handicaps and it would be unfair to change the game to normal speed just to get the turns right. My advice would be:
-Open the WB with a previous save ( a auto save 2-3 turns before this one would be the ideal, to get ri of the 99 turn left thing ) and save the game as a WB file
-Load this WB save as a scenario and choose normal speed
-Save the game as a WB file again
-Load this WB save as a scenario and choose epic speed
(P.S : Not sure if it would work... but it looks that way )
Sorry for the inconvenience :(

OMG cam i love it! wicked spiffy :) ya know, you have me thinking of trying it that way...
but naturally i'd have to make a worldbuilder save and change it into a real OCC game so that i could build multiple national wonders (but no settlers), since i'm not as good as you *giggle*
hey wait a second! i just reread the first post while downloading this. KMad Jedi Powers? whatever the heck that is, i'm not ready to share that technology just yet ;)

@ KMad,

I'm sure that you could do better :) ... I'm sure that I could do better too! It was not an entirely :smoke:-free zone!

I was happy enough with the early game - although it was painful to have a Great Prophet and not lightbulb Theology. I wanted 'some' religious tension out there, so deliberately bypassed Christianity and Islam (Buddhism went early), and could have done the same with Taoism but I wanted both Angkor Wat and Pacifism badly. The real point of getting multiple religions for me was to build Monasteries - happiness wasn't much of a factor until I got 8http://forums.civfanatics.com/images/icons/icon8.gif from not running Emancipation.

@ RR

Well, I admit a 'variant within a variant' isn't really the point of this exercise, but it's a new approach for me - albeit Brennus is hardly the leader you want for the type of game that I played. Thanks again for setting it up!

finally had time to finish this one, was busy this week-end.

Launched on 1922 on Immortal difficulty. Here's a few highlights.



http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d101/Shamshaw/Civ4ScreenShot0000.jpg

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d101/Shamshaw/cap0000.jpg

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d101/Shamshaw/war0000.jpg

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d101/Shamshaw/220001.jpg

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d101/Shamshaw/20000.jpg

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d101/Shamshaw/vic0000.jpg



I attached the saved game right before launch if any1 wants to check it out.

OK seriously, how in the heck do you people get where you can build the Eiffel Tower in 1645?

OK seriously, how in the heck do you people get where you can build the Eiffel Tower in 1645?

Well, I think on higher difficulties like I pointed out on the last LH threat, the AI techs much faster, and you end up trading more tech, so you end up with a much overall higher tech level. Here, I discovered Radio before researching chemisty so in a way I "beelined" to radio, but its not uncommon at all to be in the modern era in the 1600s on Immortal/Diety. In another screenshot posted on these forums not long ago, it was of someone researching Assembely Line in 1240 while playing on Diety (snaaty, I think). This is cause the AI trades more tech, and player ends up trading more tech with the AI since they have worthwhile techs to trade. Much unlike when player is the most advanced, and the AI has nothing to trade.

In this game particular too - I ended up building 7 Adacamies, 5 of them on costal cities, that ended up generating tons of commerce once I got free-market and corporation. I also ended up getting 2 great merchants and some preists which I settled in my capital in the BC era which allowed me to run a 100% science for most of the game (and Spiral Minerat in the middle ages).

Some people like using thier Great People to Lightbulb techs, but this is something I virtually never do (in fact I can't remember having done this cept when I was a noob, but if I knew it meant getting liberalism, or a tech that gives a free GreatPerson I would maybe, but you don't know exactly when the ai gets techs unless you save/reload, so...), I settle all my Great Merchants, Engineers, Prophets, and build academies with my scientists, and virtually always I have pyramids with early representation which gives all my settled GP that extra +3 Sci before modifier, and with 5-10 settled GP before the middle ages + academy, you tech fast.

Ah, ok that makes sense. I was thinking here I am on Noble researching that stuff MUCH later so I must suck (not that I don't, mind, just not for that reason) - but really it sounds like it'd actually be tougher to advance to those techs that early on Noble than on the higher levels.

Thanks!

AnaNg, believe me, tech pace is Noble is very slow and normally it is not because of the ( lack of ) skills of the player. I'm playing a educational SG, the Many leaders Game 2, Noble level, and I'm feeling that the tech pace is very slow, exacly because no AI has techs to trade with me and I'm wasting a lot time researching all the necessary techs. I'm used to launch near 1900 in monarch, but in that SG I'm in 1930 and still lacking some key techs to the SS ( even with multiple Golden Ages ). Why? The last useful tech trade I did was for Feudalism....

About this LHC: I'm not sure that I'll have time to play this until this saturday ( when I'm going to launch the LHC BtS III, most likely with Zara Yacob ). If that happens , maybe I'll skip this one :(

Round 4...
ended in loss.
I have come to the conculsion that all Finacial civs, no matter how nice, must be killed on sight. I saw that Hannibal was running away with the tech and had the Apollo project by 1800's :eek: I tried to stop him with my massive, semiout-dated army (70 troops at it's height, with 40 cannon)and took three of his cities and destroyed his whole expeditionary force, but he demanded his cities for peace. As my economy was shattering, with the rampart unhappiness, and even though hannibal had to deal with everyone expect monty and shaka, it was absolutly hopeless.
I'm not having a good day; I'm batting 0 for 3 at this point in terms of civ 4 games. :(
Time to take Hatty and her war chariots out for a spin...:evil: