Dynamic civ names are in!

With them, the following controversies are solved:


- English / British:
Kingdom of England and British Empire will be two of the possible names (depending on the era and the empire size).


- Maya / Mayan:
I've appplied this general rule as compromise: Maya for refering to the people, the culture and the civilization; Mayan as adjective for any other term


- American Empire? From now on it will be called the United States of America!


- You miss civs like the Frankish or the Britons? Now they'll rename to their respective civs after a few turns (the first time they switch government)



Plus, as you rename cities, you'll be able to spead around Viceroyalties as Spain or Satrapies as Persia, as you vassalise!



Do you want all this?
Then it's your turn!

The following files contain english and italian names for all the civs

http://rhye.civfanatics.net/civ4/files/DCN05D.zip Updated on Nov 22nd

Translators: please use &#XXX; combinations instead of accented letters if you can (it's easy to tell what a letter corresponds to, from the Windows characters map).
And make a good use of the gender and plural tags when needed, as you can see in some examples in there.

All you have to do is say "I will start the X language", and then upload or send to me what you have done.
I'll take care of merging the changes and updating this post.

Current progress:

ENGLISH....100%
GERMAN......54%
FRENCH.....100%
ITALIAN.....100%
SPANISH....100%

notes on German localization:
Unfortunately German is a very ugly language and requires 3 versions of the same name, as in these 2 examples:

<German>
<Text>Amerikanisch:amerikanischen:amerikanische</Text>
<Gender>Neuter:Neuter:Neuter</Gender>
<Plural>0:0:0</Plural>
</German>

<German>
<Text>Türkisches Reich:Türkische Reich:Türkischen Reich</Text>
<Gender>Neuter:Neuter:Neuter</Gender>
<Plural>0:0:0</Plural>
</German>

I'll later post the names table for a quick look
Now up to you....

Great stuff. Will give a hand when I have time.

Wow, this looks great! I can help out with the French, German and Spanish translations, but they're all second languages for me so I'd need a native speaker to double-check my work.

Rhye is a God, isn't he?

Some Problems:

- huge workload, so I don't want to start and then see that somebody else already has done it... I'd fancy a bit more organization! Suggestion: Everyone posts in here (your first post, rhye?) which files he has done already for which language and wether he would like somebody else to take a second glance at it.

- Could you elaborate a bit more on the exact settings? Why do only Islamic special names exist? (What's the difference between Islamic Turkish Empire and Sultanate of Turkey? Satrapy of Ionia please, not Macedon btw.) And not Christian, Jewish or Hindu special names. Same thing with the Vassals, you don't expect China to take vassals, don't you (the last option is the generic one, right?).

mfG m

Wow, this looks great! I can help out with the French, German and Spanish translations, but they're all second languages for me so I'd need a native speaker to double-check my work.


I am a native speaker of English and French. I'm fairly decent in Italian as well, despite not speaking it on a daily basis. I would love to help with translations.

English and italian names for CIVs?

I can't understand italian but I better learn about it.

Rhye,

I have some small problems:
1)the Franks.
The Franks were split up into 2 people, the Salian Franks (= Salted or sea Franks,living in Belgium and the Netherlands) and Ripuarian Franks (= river Franks, living around the Rhine)
2)Frisians are not the same as the Dutch. The Frisian language is more related to (old) Engilsh than to Dutch (a Frankian language). The frisians are a minority in the netherlands only living in the northern provice of Friesland.

Maybe changing Frankian people (France) to Gaullic people. (France comes from east Francia, and Germany was west Francia, West Francia got split up much faster than east Francia and the became just Francia and evolved to France. The Frankian language became Dutch and German and not French)

Germanic people is fine (Franks are a germanic people)

The Dutch could be the Batavian people. During the French Revolution the netherlands were conquerd by France and were transformed to the Batavian Republic (during Napoleontic times, Kingdom Holland). The Batavians were a celtic people living in the netherlands during Roman times. The Dutch themselfs use this name sometimes, the have a beer called Batavia, some importent ship, and it was the name of the colonial capital of Indonesia

So can we use this yet?

EDIT: update deleted, get the new files directly


EDIT: for the organisation, it's up to you.
I'm not obliging anyone to do anything in particular, so each of you should just post here "I'll do the following files .... for the following language" and then do them and post them here

I'll promise I'll do a few but these weeks are probably the worst choice regarding my workload (just started a new job)... Regarding your changes, may I ask why both the Persian names for a Vassal Greece and Turkey are (or were) "Satrapy of Macedon", Especially the latter doesn't seem to make sense, at least for me?

m

mistake. See the post above for the last updates

edit: actually I seem to have forgotten to finish the whole Turkish file, which is half greek. I've updated the archive

Update:

TXT_KEY_DN_ENG07 = British Union
TXT_KEY_DN_AME07 = American Bund

Great idea. I'm looking forward to it. Three comments:

TXT_KEY_DN_ENG17 = Soviet England
TXT_KEY_DN_FRA17 = Soviet France
etc.

Are those the names civs get when vassalised by Russia? If so, I don't think the names are appropriate (unless Russia happens to be running State Property when vassalisation occurs). Russia is not the same as the USSR. Something like "England vassal of Russia" would be better, I think.

TXT_KEY_DN_ENG20 = Vassal state of England
TXT_KEY_DN_FRA20 = Vassal State of France
etc.

I guess that those are the default names of vassal civs. It sounds confusing, imho. Literally, a “vassal state of England” is one of England’s vassals. Perhaps, something like “Vassal England” or “England, vassal of X” might sound less confusing?

TXT_KEY_DN_ROM07 = New Roman Empire

What is that? Is that supposed to be the name of a re-spawning Roman Empire? In that case, why not just call it “Italy”?

P.S. Rhye, I’ve been listening to the polycast interview. Good stuff. Except that the correct pronunciation of “(Beyond the) sword” is /'sord/ ; the W is mute here. :)

Can't wait. I like the idea of having different names when they're vassals of certain other civs.

One question, why "United Kingdom of Great Britain" and not "United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland"? (as it is now I don't see how it's different to "Kingdom of Great Britain").

-> names for vassals of Germany or Russia are active only in industrial or modern; otherwise, default.

-> yeah Vassal State of X doesn't sound right, but what else? The alternatives aren't so great.

-> New Roman Empire is the term adopted during fascism to label Italy + Albania + its African colonies

-> I apologise for my awful English

-> United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland is unnecessarily long and I have no control of Ireland being controlled by Britain or not (the name is civic and number of cities based)

"<Adjective form of Master> <Short name of Vassal>", such as "Russian England", might be smoother on the tongue than England Vassal of Russia.

that approach would work in english but not in other languages:

Egitto Greco
Spagna Greca

genders vary and it would be very complicated to keep track of all of them for each language


Do you like "Minor Civilization of X"?

Hmm... maybe "England of Russia". It's a little strange in English, but short is good.

I'd rather stick to England, Vassal of Russia

English Dominion of Russia? Or perhaps Russian Dominion of England?

yeah Vassal State of X doesn't sound right, but what else? The alternatives aren't so great.

How about those alternative generic descriptions (that do not specify who the master is):


Vassal English State
Vassal England
Vassalised England
England, vassal state


and, in Italian:

Stato vassallo inglese
Inghilterra vassalla
Inghilterra vassallizata (ugly)
Inghilterra, stato vassallo

alright, I've uploaded a new version which contains a solution to the problem of vassal state (Protectorate and Colony) and one additional slot for vassals of China, Japan and Khmer (Tributary X State, which won't hopefully cause new controviersies).

It's really up to you now.

All you have to do is say "I will start the X language", and then upload or send to me what you have done.
I'll take care of merging the changes

Maybe it's only Soviet England etc if Russia has State Property civic?

Maybe it's only Soviet England etc if Russia has State Property civic?

English Soviet Socialist Republic

Too complicated- I vote Vassal England or something else indicate subservience.

there's no room for voting, as the table is complete. They just have to be localised

Based on the translations you have recieved so far, do you have any ballpark estimates as to when this while be included, Rhye?

I haven't received any.

Rhye, you still need only french, german and spanish translators? or any language of the civs in the game?

Come on, somebody here must speak French and German.

french, german and spanish

I've done French and Spanish for Italy and Egypt. Not sure how to upload it though (.xml is prohibited on the uploads) to make sure I'm not doing it incorrectly though.

I have said I'll do some and I promise I will, it just is the possibly worst time at the moment as I really have no time to do anything ... Maybe next week...

m

I've done French and Spanish for Italy and Egypt. Not sure how to upload it though (.xml is prohibited on the uploads) to make sure I'm not doing it incorrectly though.

compress them into a single zip

Ah, alright.

This is just to check I haven't screwed up:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/129959/Dynamic_Civ_Names_French_Spanish_Italy_Rome.zip

it was excellent.
I've updated the first post.

I've beginning to translate in french (not that i'm particularly interested in that new dynamic civ name thing, it's just to help and give my contribution to Rhye's work) can somebody give my the code for é,è,ë,ê, etc... ???
'cause I don't find any examples in the uploaded files.

Also some names seems weird even in english (for example : french mandate of Arabia, a mandate is not a kind of state, maybe "french protectorate..." would be better?)
For Arabia (the first I've translated) I noticed the name "Caliphate of Hidschaz", Hidschaz is the german for the Hejaz region (or Hedjaz).

and just a little advice for the people who translate in french, the translations are good but in french the adjectives never took a capital letter.

well I feel like some stuffs must be discussed:

what's a Reichkommissariat of Spain?
why using something long and strange as "Tributary Spanish state" when we could use the more understandable "Vassal Spanish state"?
why a "Department of Spain"? a department is a subdivision way more smaller than an entire country (Britain or Normandy are made of several departments), "French dominion of Spain" sounds less cool but it's more accurate
"Caliphate of Spain" why not "Caliphate of Al Andalus" which is correct and more let say "poetic"?
Why a "Spanish State", what kind of government is it supposed to represent?


And my bad about "mandate" it fits in english as a kind of protectorate, which doesn't in french so I translate it by protectorat.

Also some names seems weird even in english (for example : french mandate of Arabia, a mandate is not a kind of state, maybe "french protectorate..." would be better?)

Yes it is, the League of Nations even had a whole Mandates Committee.

Reichskommissariat of Spain is presumably the German vassal.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_State

Caliphate of Spain is better in my opinion, and more recognisable.

Tributary Spanish State is either Chinese or Mongol vassal, I'm not sure. If the latter it makes perfect sense as the Mongols had quite a few tributary states.

- I've read Hidschaz in a Atlas; in case I mispelt it I can change the name later, don't worry about that.

- Mandat is perfectly fine in french too
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandat_fran%C3%A7ais_en_Syrie

- Tributaries are chinese, japanese or khmer vassals. Mongolia makes khanates around

- Which codes do you need? è is 232 and é is 233
You can get them from the Windows characters map

- Please use capital letters for these names like in the other languages. I know adjectives in french (and italian too) don't have capital letters, and in fact they haven't in the adjective entries. But here I think we are considering these as proper long names, as the title of a song or like "Arabie Saoudite"

All right guys, sorry to have bother you with some stupid questions , I'll have a thousand more later.

I have just one right now in fact, why Kampuchea everywhere and not a single time Cambodia for modern khmer civnames?

Cambodia is just an english translation of Kampuchea after all, for Democratic Kampuchea it's specific, it's historical, but for a republic of Cambodia?

Caliphate of Spain is better in my opinion, and more recognisable.

I don't think so. 'Caliphate of Al-Andalus' adds more flavour and sounds more historically accurate (and it's easily recognisable too, just think of Andalusia.)

Other suggested changes:

TXT_KEY_DN_NED13 = 'Spanish Netherlands' / 'Países Bajos Españoles' (Dutch: 'Spaanse Nederlanden'). This is the customary name of the Southern Netherlands as controlled by Spain from 1581 to 1713.

TXT_KEY_DN_ROM12 = ‘Emirate of Italy’ or ‘Emirate of Sicily’ (instead of ‘Sultanate of Rome’). Motivation: In the 7th century an Islamic Emirate was established in Southern Italy.

TXT_KEY_DN_EGY08 = 'Mamluk Sultanate of Egypt' (instead of 'Sultanate of Egypt').

TXT_KEY_DN_EGY10 = 'Egyptian Satrapy' or ‘Achaemenid Egypt’ (instead of ‘Ninth Satrapy’, which in Herodotus’ enumeration only comprised Babylonia and ‘the rest of Assyria’.)

Actually, according to wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Andalus), it would be more precise to call it Caliphate of Córdoba or just Al-Andalus (both historical, one political, one geographical)

ok here I am again (ger,rus,ned,mal,port,inc,azt,mon,tur and america translated)
some ideas :

-"The Sublime Porte" in place of Sublime Ottoman Empire http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sublime_Porte
-"German-American Bund" in place of American Bund
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_American_Bund
-"Incan Junta" in place of Incan Government of Armed Forces
About the Inca, is Inca the old name for the Peru region? cause if not it made some name like Satrapy of Inca hard to translate in french (Satrape d'Inca means nothing)
-Maybe we can switch "Department" to the plural as "Departments of Portugal" so it shows there are several of them in a region (as the "Overseas Departments", common name to refer to Guyane and the french islands in the Pacific). + Where is the "Department of Batavia" coming from? Batavia was the capital of Dutch East Indies and batave is an adjective synonym of dutch.
-"Departments of the Rhine" in place of "Department of Germany'", it will sounds more "napoleonic"


Also I have translated Tsardom of Russia by "Russie Impériale", cause there is no specific word for Tsardom in french (Tsarie is very rare)

Actually, according to wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Andalus), it would be more precise to call it Caliphate of Córdoba or just Al-Andalus (both historical, one political, one geographical)

'Caliphate of Córdoba' is historically all right, but I don't like it being in the mod for two reasons:
(1) What if Cordoba is razed or never founded? Given the current mechanics of name changes, it is not a good idea to tie civilization names to city names.
(2) Muslim-ruled principalities (which me may collectively call 'Al Andalus') survived the Christian reconquista of Cordoba.

Calling it just 'Al-Andalus' is fine by me. However, the longer description 'Caliphate of Al-Andalus' seems better in game terms because it signals a bit more clearly that the civ has become a vassal state of Arabia. (After the collapse of the Ummayad caliphate, Al-Andalus became a collection of independent Moorish states called taifas. The title 'Caliphate' will make it clearer that we are not talking about this collection of independent states).

TXT_KEY_DN_INC06 = 'Túpac Amaru Revolutionary Movement' / 'Movimiento Revolucionario Túpac Amaru' / 'Movimento Rivoluzionario Túpac Amaru'
(instead of 'Revolutionary Incan Government'). And, in case Rhye adds dynamic flags:

http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/images/p/pe%7Dmrta.gif

ok here I am again (ger,rus,ned,mal,port,inc,azt,mon,tur and america translated)
some ideas :

-"The Sublime Porte" in place of Sublime Ottoman Empire http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sublime_Porte
-"German-American Bund" in place of American Bund
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_American_Bund
-"Incan Junta" in place of Incan Government of Armed Forces
About the Inca, is Inca the old name for the Peru region? cause if not it made some name like Satrapy of Inca hard to translate in french (Satrape d'Inca means nothing)
-Maybe we can switch "Department" to the plural as "Departments of Portugal" so it shows there are several of them in a region (as the "Overseas Departments", common name to refer to Guyane and the french islands in the Pacific). + Where is the "Department of Batavia" coming from? Batavia was the capital of Dutch East Indies and batave is an adjective synonym of dutch.
-"Departments of the Rhine" in place of "Department of Germany'", it will sounds more "napoleonic"

TXT_KEY_DN_INC06 = 'Túpac Amaru Revolutionary Movement' / 'Movimiento Revolucionario Túpac Amaru' / 'Movimento Rivoluzionario Túpac Amaru'
(instead of 'Revolutionary Incan Government').

Also I have translated Tsardom of Russia by "Russie Impériale", cause there is no specific word for Tsardom in french (Tsarie is very rare)


- OK for plural Departments where appropriate
- Change Department of Germany to 'Confederation of the Rhine'
- OK to change 'Revolutionary Incan Government' to 'Incan Revolutionary Movement'
- Translate Satrapy of Inca to Satrape Inca, like I did in italian
- Change 'Sultanate of Rome' to "Emirate of Rome'

Keep the rest as it is. Including 'Tsarie'.

Ok seems that most of the job is done, I was tough,
I'm more than ever impressed by your job Rhye, re-writing those files is soooo boring and you must be sooo meticulous, by the way I surely miss some stuff (like a ; somewhere in those freaking codes) I apologize in advance.

Some more ideas :
-Replacing North Africa for Carthago's names by Maghreb (better looking and geographically more precise)
-Replacing Kampuchea by Cambodia sometimes
-Islamic Republic of Iran in place of Persia
-Nilotic Peoples in place of Egyptian Peoples

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/101779/DCN03BB.rar

Keeping coherence was very hard.
Generally, I have tried to follow this rules:

- Don't invent new names from nothing (I did research all of them, there are only a few cases where I borrowed the name type from other civs)
- Try to keep the civ name in all the main names (the ones depending on civics): Persia would keep being Persia rather than Iran; more freedom is allowed in the vassals part
- For the name reason, I'm trying to avoid specific dynasty names or city names

Then, you may still find exceptions to these rules.
Like sometimes I replaced Aztec with Mexico, or when I used "Vichy France"
I prefer Kampuchea over Cambodia because it's a more ancient and accurate name
I prefer 'North Africa' because I also use East Africa and West Africa, terms used during colonialism to refer to some regions

Nilotic peoples won't make any difference, since thanks to their UP, the egyptians start already as "Old Kingdom of Egypt"

Rhye, I noticed you use "Republic of the 7 united Netherlands" and in Italian you use provinices. Histroical this is the correct name. But looking at you previous post it think you're not gonna change it?

@Cucumber: About the department of Batavia, during the French Revolution the Netherlands were conquered by the French and the Batavian Republic was installed there. Napoleon later installed his brother there as King of Holland.

Egypte: why isn't there a middle kingdom?

Rhye, I noticed you use "Republic of the 7 united Netherlands" and in Italian you use provinices. Histroical this is the correct name. But looking at you previous post it think you're not gonna change it?


It's the italian official name, I don't know why


Egypte: why isn't there a middle kingdom?

because there's only one era division

Historicly the Netherlands were named the united provinices (vereenigde Provincieën) and it was a republic, then cam the French time (Batavians Republic and Kingdom of Holland) and after the French time the United Kingdom of the Netherlands was formed (= current days Netherlands Belgium and Luxemburg) in 1815. After Belgian independence it kept this name.

I understand it's a complex process, the civs must be immediately recognizable even by users who don't have a deep historical knowledge. The civ's names must have an historical background and in the same time those names have to be generalistic enough to be inserted in a dynamic mod where every game is different.

Nevertheless you choose to implement this new mechanic mostly for fun (as everything in your mod no?) and it's also a good occasion for evryone to discover new parts of history (I did'nt know anything about satrapies and german-american bund for example) so I'm partisan of a more imaginative and fun renaming system as Persia becoming Iran, Maya becoming United States of Central America etc...

And by the way was my translation correct and with not too much spell mistakes (especially in codes) ?

@ Sadomacho : I know about the Batavian Republic, why not using this appelation because Department of Batavia would only be good for a Khmer vassal of Netherlands?

very well, I've just finished cross checking all the entries, fixing any of mine or Cocumber's mistakes, and updated the 1st post with the new set.

- American Empire? From now on it will be called the United States of America!


Yay! :goodjob:

I'll do my best with the rest of them but i'm not promising anything.

One question, if I want to write the German version of the egyptians (Der Ägypter), what exactly do I have to do to get the a with an umlaut?

Am I right in thinking i should write it

Der U+00C4gypter

because that's what I can see for it on the character map.
If it isnt, could someone tell me how to do it properly?

<Tag>TXT_KEY_DN_FRA07</Tag>
<Text>Stato Spagnolo</Text>
<Gender>Male</Gender>
<Plural>0</Plural>

That's incorrect. It should read: "Stato Francese".


When opening the XML file for Germany I get the following error message:

An invalid character was found inside an entity reference. Error processing resource ... <Text>République Fédérale d'Allemagne</Text>


Another terminological suggestion: the term "Puppet State" could be suitable for vassals of the USA. More generally--

Tributary state, Vassal State: Ancient, Medieval, Renaissance ages.
Puppet state, Client state, Satellite state: Industrial and Modern ages.

I'll do my best with the rest of them but i'm not promising anything.

One question, if I want to write the German version of the egyptians (Der Ägypter), what exactly do I have to do to get the a with an umlaut?

Am I right in thinking i should write it

Der U+00C4gypter

because that's what I can see for it on the character map.
If it isnt, could someone tell me how to do it properly?

It's
Der & #196;gypter

You can tell the 3 numbers from the bottom righthand side in the Character Map

(remove the space between & and #. I had to put it because otherwise the forum engine automatically converts it to Ä)

It's
Der & #196;gypter


(remove the space between & and #. I had to put it because otherwise the forum engine automatically converts it to Ä)

Thanks, I get it now :)

I'll spend the rest of the afternoon on that and I'll get it up here as soon as I can

I just noticed something...

On the German translations, there's NULL:NULL:NULL instead of just one NULL.

Should I be putting in translations in 3 times or is once enough?

UPDATE:

I have completed the Spanish translations up to from the Egyptians to the Maya. I'll try to get the rest of the Spanish done by Wednesday evening.

My Spanish isnt very good so if someone could be good enough to go over them and make sure they're done right I'd really appreciate it :goodjob:

When opening the XML file for Germany I get the following error message:

An invalid character was found inside an entity reference. Error processing resource ... <Text>République Fédérale d'Allemagne</Text>




yeah this is what happens when you forget the ; after the numbers

I just noticed something...

On the German translations, there's NULL:NULL:NULL instead of just one NULL.

Should I be putting in translations in 3 times or is once enough?

UPDATE:

I have completed the Spanish translations up to from the Egyptians to the Maya. I'll try to get the rest of the Spanish done by Wednesday evening.

My Spanish isnt very good so if someone could be good enough to go over them and make sure they're done right I'd really appreciate it :goodjob:



there are some problems with your version.
Unfortunately German is a very ugly language and requires 3 versions of the same name, as in these 2 examples:

<German>
<Text>Amerikanisch:amerikanischen:amerikanische</Text>
<Gender>Neuter:Neuter:Neuter</Gender>
<Plural>0:0:0</Plural>
</German>

<German>
<Text>Türkisches Reich:Türkische Reich:Türkischen Reich</Text>
<Gender>Neuter:Neuter:Neuter</Gender>
<Plural>0:0:0</Plural>
</German>

Plus, you forgot the ; after the number codes.

It would be great if you could correct all of these issues before going on.


For now I've updated the 1st post with the new spanish additions i've got, and with more fixes. You can add the correct german entries directly to these new files

I would love to help out with the translation, but I can't download the file. I get a 404 error.

try again now

there are some problems with your version.
Unfortunately German is a very ugly language and requires 3 versions of the same name, as in these 2 examples:

<German>
<Text>Amerikanisch:amerikanischen:amerikanische</Text>
<Gender>Neuter:Neuter:Neuter</Gender>
<Plural>0:0:0</Plural>
</German>

<German>
<Text>Türkisches Reich:Türkische Reich:Türkischen Reich</Text>
<Gender>Neuter:Neuter:Neuter</Gender>
<Plural>0:0:0</Plural>
</German>

Plus, you forgot the ; after the number codes.

It would be great if you could correct all of these issues before going on.


For now I've updated the 1st post with the new spanish additions i've got, and with more fixes. You can add the correct german entries directly to these new files

OK, I'm putting the German on hold for now, but I'll have a go at it when Ive finished the Spanish.

Apart from the ; after the number codes, are there any other problems with my Spanish translations?

no, as far as i remember.
I just corrected the 2nd entry to Pueblos X
and switched to "Female" when it was missing

I've finished all the Spanish translations (I think) but the genders need to be changed where they are wrong.

I'll have a go at the German tomorrow but it looks more confusing than the other languages.

I've updated the first post.

It took me so long because I had to correct heaps of mistakes (sorry flaming_iles, your spanish needs to improve ;) ) and typos...

Alright, I'm gunna call in a favor to my swiss friend. Hope he's not too busy.

Much needed:

Barbarians renamed to Insurgents/Terrorists/Rebels starting from the Industrial Era.

Also why where the Ottomans renamed to Turkey? I dont get it.

Also instead of "Arabian Empire" which refers only to the penisula why not "Arab Empire" to represent all the Arab people?
Also before they change civics they should be called Bedouin.

Sumeria for the Babylonians before they change civics.

Mycena for the Greeks before Civic change.

As Aztecs become mexico later why not- Maya/Guatemala or Inca/Peru?


Feedback would be appreciated.

I believe the peninsula is named after the people.

agreed on the Bedouins. Added that - and a few more changes, with translations included.
Post in the 1st page is updated.

Bedouins are Saharan tribes, and not from the Arabian penninsula... but that hasn't stopped me from downloading it. Thanks, Rhye!

agreed on the Bedouins.

How about "Bedouins tribes"/"Tribus de Bédouins"/"Tribus Beduinas"/"Tribù Beduine", instead of "Bedouins people"? Those people are notoriously tribal: "I against my brothers, I and my brothers against my cousins, I and my brothers and my cousins against the world".

Bedouins are Saharan tribes, and not from the Arabian penninsula...

Bedouins are traditionally found in the Arabian desert as well, so I think the name is fine.

okay...i might have a part of the German

Bedouins are traditionally found in the Arabian desert as well, so I think the name is fine.


I just found that out, so I apologize for my error.

BTW, I've downloaded the patch; where do I put it in the folder?

OK... Pleeeeeease tell me there's someone working on the German...

Hi,

Will these translations also update the Civilopedia and the RFC "Choose a Civ" screen? The following errors in French are still present as of the current Warlords build:

"empire chinoise" listed, should be "empire chinois", just a gender mistake

"empire turque" returns no Google results, this empire called "empire ottoman" in French or at the very least "empire turc" since "turque" = feminine form

"empire germanique" would make more sense as "empire allemand", "germanique" in French refers more to the family of languages rather than the modern German people.

"empire aztèque", though it looks incorrect, is in fact okay (though "aztec" also found in French)

OK... Pleeeeeease tell me there's someone working on the German...

Should be.....thank god for out-scourcing.....:crazyeye:

Is the Aztec country finally going to be called by its proper name, "Azatlan" or "Aztlan"?

The civs in RFC are called by their English-language names. (or French, Spanish, etc.) Otherwise "Germany" would be called "Deutschland". So Aztec is Aztec because that's what it's called.

Hi,

Will these translations also update the Civilopedia and the RFC "Choose a Civ" screen? The following errors in French are still present as of the current Warlords build:

"empire chinoise" listed, should be "empire chinois", just a gender mistake

"empire turque" returns no Google results, this empire called "empire ottoman" in French or at the very least "empire turc" since "turque" = feminine form

"empire germanique" would make more sense as "empire allemand", "germanique" in French refers more to the family of languages rather than the modern German people.

"empire aztèque", though it looks incorrect, is in fact okay (though "aztec" also found in French)

it's all okay already

Rhye, as we can expect dynamic civ names, can we expect some new leaderheads too. For babylon I really like to see Sadam Hussein. Baathist Babylonia is one of it's names, and I hate to see an old leader then. Sadam was the leadre of the Ba'ath party, so...
http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=3679

For Japan a modern leader would be nice too. Here is Hirohito
http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=3646

For you home land Vittorio Emmanulle (VERDI)
http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=325
(although Mussolini would be better for the new Roman Empire)

Franco for the Spannish
http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=5927

Maybe Hitler?
http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=2138
(A risky one, but he, he was the German leader from 1933 to 1945, and very important for history)
Maybe a next fase for the dynamic changes: Leaderheads fixed to Civics
-> Nationhood + police state := Fascism -> Hitler, Franco, Mussolini
->State property := communism -> Stalin, Mao


Oh, and if the Ukrain ever makes it into RFC: Victor Yushchenko
http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=7333 ;)

Ok, so I've done the Germa Egypt. Some questions though:

- What is it with the articles? They do make the biggest difference in the three : : : ! Due to Gender and stuff. I didn't add them for now, but I can do that later. Just tell me... Don't I need to state the Gender of the principale noun (Sowjet, Ilkhanat, etc. ...)?

- The third option can be regarded both ways. It depends on wether the noun is a title (Das Sultanat Ägypten) or a "territorial" indication (das französische Mandat Ägyptens... ). I decided mostly after my gut feeling ;)

- What about the liberation rally of Egypt and Officers Egypt? I didn't find the German equivalents on Wikipedia, so I just translated it. Shouldn't the last be the "Free Officers Egypt" though?

Anyway, could you please take a look at it and tell me wether this is right, and then I am going to do the rest this way too. If I am wrong somewhere, I'd rather have you tell me now... ;-)

mik

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/37457/CIV4GameText_DynamicCivNames_00EGY.rar

Don't I need to state the Gender of the principale noun (Sowjet, Ilkhanat, etc. ...)?
- The third option can be regarded both ways. It depends on wether the noun is a title (Das Sultanat Ägypten) or a "territorial" indication (das französische Mandat Ägyptens... ). I decided mostly after my gut feeling ;)


Don't know about this. You should take a look at the original text files, such as CIV4GameText_Objects_BTS.xml located in Beyond the Sword\Assets\XML\Text. There are many entries which aren't triple. And many are male or female. So, it's up to you...

The rest was perfect.
Just a couple of things:

- Why is there no translation of "peoples" in #00?
- Make sure that "Tributstaat Ägypten" doesn't mean that the state is tributary of Egypt. I was very careful to put Egyptian + State next to each other in other languages, like: "Estado Egipcio Tributario"


Please begin from America backwards to do the next ones ok? So that there is less probability of clash with Mowque's friend

Ok, I just saw that I need to indicate the gender as well... ;-) I am going to do that ok.

- Nilvölker is one word, it incorporates both which is often done in German. You probably all have already heard of the "Donaudampfschifffahrtselektrizitätenhauptbetriebsw erkbauunterbeamtengesellfschaft", the longest word every been published in the history of the world. It means the club for subordinate officials of the head office management of the Danube steamboat electrical services. As you see, this practice is totally normal for the German language.

What I wanted to say is that I could have as well written the "Völker des Nils", which would be a Genitivverbindung a connection in the Genitive-case... But that sounds not really good. I have looked at other files and for example you cannot say Mesopotamienvölker, that doesn't sound right. There you need to write Völker Mesopotamiens or Mesopotamische Völker (the adjective form). On the other hand, the Hinduvölker once again has to be like that. [Unfortunately, I have already done up to the Greeks ;-) and made a little decision change in the translation, it just has to do with an s. ;)

- The Tributstaat Ägypten is once again the same case. It does mean that Egypt is a tributary state of someone not indicated. Tributstaat ÄgyptenS would mean that a non-indicated country would be a tributary state of Egypt... ;) The other variant would be der tributpflichtige Staat Ägypten, but that doesn't sound like a title.

Perhaps, I have time again later this afternoon, but I somehow doubt it, I have some works to do...

m

Rhye, as we can expect dynamic civ names, can we expect some new leaderheads too. For babylon I really like to see Sadam Hussein. Baathist Babylonia is one of it's names, and I hate to see an old leader then. Sadam was the leadre of the Ba'ath party, so...
http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=3679

For Japan a modern leader would be nice too. Here is Hirohito
http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=3646

For you home land Vittorio Emmanulle (VERDI)
http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=325
(although Mussolini would be better for the new Roman Empire)

Franco for the Spannish
http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=5927

Maybe Hitler?
http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=2138
(A risky one, but he, he was the German leader from 1933 to 1945, and very important for history)
Maybe a next fase for the dynamic changes: Leaderheads fixed to Civics
-> Nationhood + police state := Fascism -> Hitler, Franco, Mussolini
->State property := communism -> Stalin, Mao


Oh, and if the Ukrain ever makes it into RFC: Victor Yushchenko
http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=7333 ;)


These where some really good/interesting ideas. Hope they get implemented in the future. Leader switches would really make the game more dynamic since the personality of the leader would differ from the preceeding one.

Ok, I just saw that I need to indicate the gender as well... ;-) I am going to do that ok.

- Nilvölker is one word, it incorporates both which is often done in German. You probably all have already heard of the "Donaudampfschifffahrtselektrizitätenhauptbetriebsw erkbauunterbeamtengesellfschaft", the longest word every been published in the history of the world. It means the club for subordinate officials of the head office management of the Danube steamboat electrical services. As you see, this practice is totally normal for the German language.

What I wanted to say is that I could have as well written the "Völker des Nils", which would be a Genitivverbindung a connection in the Genitive-case... But that sounds not really good. I have looked at other files and for example you cannot say Mesopotamienvölker, that doesn't sound right. There you need to write Völker Mesopotamiens or Mesopotamische Völker (the adjective form). On the other hand, the Hinduvölker once again has to be like that. [Unfortunately, I have already done up to the Greeks ;-) and made a little decision change in the translation, it just has to do with an s. ;)

- The Tributstaat Ägypten is once again the same case. It does mean that Egypt is a tributary state of someone not indicated. Tributstaat ÄgyptenS would mean that a non-indicated country would be a tributary state of Egypt... ;) The other variant would be der tributpflichtige Staat Ägypten, but that doesn't sound like a title.

Perhaps, I have time again later this afternoon, but I somehow doubt it, I have some works to do...

m

okay, great! Finish up to the Greeks and pass to America then. I leave the specific decisions to your good judgment.


"Donaudampfschifffahrtselektrizitätenhauptbetriebsw erkbauunterbeamtengesellfschaft"
:crazyeye: simply unbelievable

Hey, another thing. I've done all up to Persia all down to Turkey (America and Turkey thus ;)). I've uploaded them for now. It looks like I won't have time for it until next weekend though, I'm sorry... ;)

Anyway, some troubles:

- The French version hasn't been checken on singular/plural right? (on numeri)

- The Sublime Ottoman State. Shouldn't that be the Sublime Porte (of the Ottomans)? It does sound weird in German.

- When does the National Democratic Popular Turkey appear? Because I have lots of trouble translating this "monster". The problem lies with the term popular. If you translate that by word, the result is völkisch, an adjective heavily copyrighted by the Nazis... There is practically no way around that not making it sound nazistic. I went - for now - with the German equivalent of National Democratic People of Turkey. It's the best I can think of. Besides, three adjectives after each other, can this be real? (Google also gave me nothing, where have you got that name from?)

m

PS: http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/37457/rfc.rar

PPS: "Donaudampfschifffahrtselektrizitätenhauptbetriebsw erkbauunterbeamtengesellschaft" had a few typos in there. Now it is correct... ;-) the beautiful thing is that it does make sense. Another really funny story, a bit more modern than the Donau... Rinderkennzeichnungs- und Rindfleischetikettierungsüberwachungsaufgabenübert ragungsgesetz is a law proposed in 2000 in Mecklenburg-Vorpommern. As the Parliament broke into laughter when it was first presented, they changed the name afterwards to something more short. (wikipedia translates as following: Cattle marking and beef labelling supervision duties delegation law). but enough of that nonsense...

- It should have. If something's missing, is a mistake
EDIT: found where they are (USA)

- I'm trying to keep using the civ name/adjective always on the main cases (up to the islamic ones) in order to keep them recognizable. "Sublime Porte" would hardly be understood.

- National Democratic Popular Turkey came from some communist party of Turkey. Are you more confortable if you translate Popular as "People's"?

- I showed those german words to a german friend, and she was in trouble at reading them too!




EDIT: first post updated. Use those files from now on

I asked for the Saddam leaderhead to be implemented before for Babylon but it was rejected for some reason.
(Saddam evncied himself as a new nebuchanezzar.)

Theres a really good one Mahmoud Adminijadd as well for persia.

Dont know about the others though as most leaderhead mods look way to much like the leaders they were modified from. I,ll have to take look.

The civs in RFC are called by their English-language names. (or French, Spanish, etc.) Otherwise "Germany" would be called "Deutschland". So Aztec is Aztec because that's what it's called.

I normally would have left it, but - I've never heard of the ancient land of "Aztec". That's like going to London and being "welcomed to English". Azatlan isn't too hard to say or read, just as the Khmer have Kampuchea. Another name the Aztecs used for themselves was "Mexica"; I'm certain as a dynamic civ name, they later inhabit (English-language) Mexico.

Mexica and Mexico are used. Aztlan isn't, because it refers to their land of origin (somewhere up north)

Ah, makes more sense. Cheers.

Unfortunately German is a very ugly language and requires 3 versions of the same name, as in these 2 examples:

<German>
<Text>Amerikanisch:amerikanischen:amerikanische</Text>
<Gender>Neuter:Neuter:Neuter</Gender>
<Plural>0:0:0</Plural>
</German>

<German>
<Text>Türkisches Reich:Türkische Reich:Türkischen Reich</Text>
<Gender>Neuter:Neuter:Neuter</Gender>
<Plural>0:0:0</Plural>
</German>

Hmpf, German is not an ugly language, it's just not made for computers (or/and vice versa).

However, I would be glad to help adding missing translations.


Looking at the names, one question arises, though: wouldn't it be better to render "XYZian Peoples" as "XYZian Tribes" in some cases? I have never heard of Germanic peoples for example, but Germanic tribes.


oh, and that one is wrong:
Text>Reichskommissariat Ägypten:Reichskommissariat Ägypten:Reichskommissariat Ägyptens</Text>
the last s should be dropped
("Reichskommisariat" is also quite awful btw, and wouldnt fit, if Germany itself is Federal/Democratic Republic at that time ;) )

it would be great if you did Carthage to Russia.

I am keeping "peoples" for coherence.
As for the "s", there must be a reason why mitsho used it, but I don't know...

Well, after looking through the examples and the BtS-files I figured the last part was a Dativ, not a Genitiv, that's why I used an S. However. I later figured out that I can leave the S away and it sounds better and I changed everything back to without S. Seems I missed one... ;-)

On the question of why I used völker (People) instead of tribes. Simply to be coherent with the rest of the languages which I tried to be mostof the time. I didn't always succeed and I figure there are some things that could have been done better. But hey, you are free to control and correct me...

I'ts sometimes really difficult to find a fitting translation as it is a whole other language compared to English, French, Italian and Spanish (just compare the words, they are mostly practically the same...).

So, Rhye, you received my pm?

m

aye, 1st post updated (and I removed the s)

OK. I'm in the process of translating now. Some notes will follow in the end ;)

So, finished.
(quite) some notes:

-I'm not sure if "italische Völker" is the best translation for "italic peoples", because there is a German word "Italiker", which describes the same thing
-same for "Iberer/iberische Völker" (Iberian peoples)
-"Reichskommissariat Ostafrika" may be renamed to "Deutsch-Ostafrika" (than in all languages), as a colony in that region actually had that name(today Tanzania), and East Africa is better treated as colony that province.
-"Reichskommissariat Scandinavia" maybe should be rendered as "Reichskommissariat Nordland", the name just fits better (especially as the theme is somewhat Nazi-ish)
-I used "Kambodscha" instead if "Kampuchea" for the German version in the Khmer part, might be revised (just exchange it)
-perhaps instead of "Khmer-Reich" (Khmer Empire), the term "Reich der Khmer" (Empire of the Khmer), which is used more frequently, should be used.
-the French peoples should probably be renamed to "Gallic peoples" not "Frankish"
-Maybe the first entry for "Kingdom of Spain" should be rendered as "Kingdom of Castille" instead?
-"Caliphate of Spain" is ugly.. I agree with the discussion, that Al-Andalus may be better
-I used the Latin names for Roman provinces (not germanized/modern ones)
-The British Empire is often also referred to as "British Empire" in German. However, I used "Britisches Imperium", feel free to change that back.
-as some names are already quite long, perhaps the HRE may also be rendered as "Holy Roman Empire of German Nation" in one of the later entries (had been the official name during the last centuries)
-to be coherent, I also used "Völker"

Additionally, I proofread the first 6 files (Egypt, India, China,Babylon, Greece, Persia).. notes:
-changed "Mykenäisch" to "Mykenisch" (proper word for "Mycenaean")
-removed some overlooked s from the 3rd rows, as well as some typos
-the "Liberation Rally of Egypt" might be better translated as "Ägyptische Befreiungsbewegung" or at least "Bewegung zur Befreiung Ägyptens"
-the names for China including the "Middle Country" term are nonsense
in English that should be something like "Middle Kingdom" or "Central Kingdom", in German "Reich der Mitte" , the following "of China/von China" should be omitted or perhaps redone as "of Qin" ("Zhongguo", the Chinese word for "China", means "Central Kingdom", the word "China" is thought to derive from the Qin dynasty..)

and that was definitely enough translating for today.

I see you have added some s in the 1st and 2nd entry... is it correct?

yep, because I felt that "Altes/Neues Reich Ägypten" is a poor name, as it would indicate that Altes/Neues Reich should be read as if it were a form of government. (like in "Republik Ägypten")
"Altes/Neues Reich Ägyptens" on the other hand, means "Old/New Empire of Egypt" or "Egypt's Old/New Empire", which is the intended meaning as its refers to different incantations of the Pharaonic Empire.

A similar point can be made for the Liberation rally - Egypt has to be genitive there.

So I need to defend myself.

- von China: I used it because Rhye explicitly stated that he wanted to have the country name appearing in each name, the same with the Old and New Empire of Egypt. These names are usually also used without it.

- Are you really sure about mykenisch? I thought that as well until I looked it up in a dictionary...! ;-)

- Stick to Völker. It doesn't need to be perfect, it needs to be coherent...

- About the liberation rally of Egypt. I am not quite sure how I translated it but If I recall correctly I looked it up in wikipedia...


m

Why don't we just all play in english ?
Translations look ludicrous when you're lucky (at least you can laugh about them :lol: ), sometimes worse. The interface is not thought up for languages like German and Italian, so much is missplaced etc... I'd have to be an extremist nationalist and a bit masochist to play Civ4 in italian, and I assume the same for pretty much most other european languages !! :crazyeye:

-well, as "Central Kingdom"/"Reich der Mitte" essentially means "China", Rhye's requirement should be fulfilled already.
I did not drop the Ägypten in Altes/Neues Reich, just made it genitive.
perhaps "Chinas Reich der Mitte" or "China, Reich der Mitte"/"China, Central Kindgom" may be compromises, if the modern name really has to be included?
one could also just use the romanization "Zhongguo" as the name ;)

-mykenäisch might be a second form, but mykenisch is definitely standard.

-Völker is it then

-I haven't found the German name of the Liberation Rally anywhere. also the English wikipedia entry just names it "Liberation Rally", so "Egyptian L. R." / "Ägyptische Befreiungsbewegung" might be better names as placeholders than the current one, which sounds like it is an official name.

@onedreamer: Well, you are quite right, but the German version is actually rather good to play, the biggest problem I have with it is more that there are some rather ugly and incomplete translations(e.g. for city names there are often only the first 5 translated, the rest unchanged and some misspellings, yea, i know that i can change the xml files-and also did that at home), which can bug be somewhat.. (I'm also using an English installation right now, btw)
And if there is to be a translation of RFC, it better be a good one, else there is no point in it.

well thank you very much. Your name (of both) will be credited in the readme.

The new patch is coming soon!

So, the translations are done? When are you expecting the patch to be uploaded, Rhye?