COTM 43 First Spoiler - the Ancient Age!

There's been quite a bit of interest in this game so I suspect that those who downloaded and played over the weekend are anxious to get a Spoiler going. So, here it is, a day earlier than usual, to release some of that pressure. :)

Reading Requirements

You should have general knowledge of most landmasses and civ locations.
You must be able to research a Middle Age technology.


Posting Restrictions

You may discuss any civs you meet and any trades you engage in.
You may post screenshots of the starting landmass and 2 closest islands.
You may post screenshots of remote colonies you establish or an AI civ, as long as the screen shot doesn't identify the location of the remote landmass on the map.
No shots of the minimap.
No discussions of the middle ages (or later)
No screenshots of any middle-age (or later) resources.
Absolutely NO discussion of any other currently active 'X'OTM!



Where to start? How did your exploring go in general? Did you find the new tech Polynesian Trade pretty useful? :) How about the Ancient Age UU the Polynesian Raider - was this unit useful and if so how? Any problems with the raging barbs? :D What plans do you have, and how are things working out? And, how is the AI behaving - anything interesting there? Any problems?

Predator report from the early MA:

As I told civ_steve, this game so far is basically the player versus the barbarians!

I didn't think the Sid AIs are very scary at all...since none of them can actually reach you until Astronomy, they are very useful for refusing demands, then triggering war happiness. :p

My opening went exactly as I had planned, and the extra food bonuses and BG made that better.

At 1000 bc, my civilization looked like this:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/104555/qsc.JPG

I am curious how similar city placement is for others?

My only possible mistake here was that of the two cattle and three wheats, my capital is the only city able to use one of those cattle, and two of those wheats. I did this to get more coastal and freshwater cities though (and a slightly looser build), so it doesn't bother me a lot. I just will probably mine some of the wheats...

Did anyone else notice the strange ability of the minor AIs to build wonders they did not apparently have the technology for? I think this is particularly useful to deny 'major' AI civs wonders. If you can use those civs right, that is. ;););)

The UU so far has been useless. I didn't build it because I don't want to trigger a GA quite yet either. I would rather use the middle age UU.

I hit the MA sometime around 600 or 700 BC, very rich with almost 3000 gold, but not making any money since I was going 70 percent research on Polynesian Trade with the other 30 percent in luxuries. Once I got Polynesian Trade, trading for luxuries allowed me to drop my luxury rate to 0. I went min on Republic since then, as I think I will be able to trade it to someone by the time I get it.

I was then able to then trade with a minor civ who had discovered Monarchy. I drew a thankfully short 6 turn anarchy a little while later. Around 350 BC, I became a Monarchy making around +100gpt with +50gpt from other civs.

The civs who are most advanced (America, Spain, Korea, China) also are in locked wars, so they can't have the opportunity to trade with any other AIs. On top of that, being in war, they research slower.

All the other civs are backwards. I don't think the Mayans have Alphabet at this point! :lol:

Finding the civs in the first place was a problem though. Other than the civ to the south (which I don't think you could miss), I found no other civs by 2000 bc. Instead, I sent a curragh around my island and had little luck finding anything. Then, between 2000 bc and 1000 bc, I found almost all of them. :) I loved the ability to traverse anywhere.

Yet the barb boats! :mad: This brings me back to the barbarians. Until I was able to start to dispense camps, the barbarian boats popped up everywhere. Generally in the early game, 1 of every 2 boats got sunk. This reduced to much less now, probably 1 in 10. I am still dealing with stray boats to allow passage in certain spots.

The one truly bad thing that happened in my game involved barbarians and small island city I had colonized. I moved the swordsman defender from the city to cover my worker, without realizing there was a barb camp a few squares away. The horsemen raided the city for 2000 gold. This was during Anarchy at around 500 bc. To prevent further damage, I had to abandon the city, thus abandoning the worker to the barbarians also. The swordsman went on to vanquish the barb camp, but he only got 25 gold from it. :( I ask the barbs this: what did you do with that 2000 gold? ;)

Luckily with all the gold I am making, the 2000 gold I lost won't make a huge impact on the game.

But this was really the only major mistake, I think. If you count out the raging barbs, it has generally felt like an 'Emperor' level game otherwise. I will of course change my opinion on this once I launch my first attack. Although I won't name particular civs, I think it is a little obvious which civs would be best to attack to get to domination (land-wise).

So definitely barbarians are a big challenge in colonizing new islands. One of my current priorities is to build more swordsmen to start working on getting rid of huge stacks so I can have a little peace.

Destroying barbs and colonizing islands are thus now the main priority as I wait for musketmen (assuming I have saltpeter). Such a point would be ideal to make war at; if I can get a big stack of muskets and land them on a mountain, along with the wars between AI, I think there is great opportunity to achieve domination in time. But the right civs have to be picked. I don't think there is time to take them all down.

Once again, kudos to civ_steve for a great and fun game. :king:

-Elear

Here is my empire at 10 ad. :)

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/104555/10ad.JPG

And my two colonies:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/104555/10adcolony.JPG
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/104555/10adcolony2.JPG

Predator, going for Domination (that's the challenge, right?)

Found Suva in place and start a min run on writing. Builds go curragh/warrior/granary/settlers.

Apia is founded on a hill above the sugar SE of the spices and builds warriors, then curraghs
Nuku Alofa gets a granary for workers, Honolulu builds warriors,
and I start throwing cities around in a pretty tight build.

I set up everything that is near a food bonus with a granary to ramp up workers/settlers.

Exploration is annoying at first - my first curragh gets sunk along the american coast...

and then I realize that barb galleys wont' attack me if I end on a non-coastal tile.

At that point, I send curraghs everywhere :)

Some things happened I didn't expect:

Lapita built Collosus in 3050 BC, which is earlier than I've ever seen it.
Then, Menehune built Pyramids in 2390BC and The Great Wall in 2150BC, which is just amazing.

Techs:

1750 BC got writing, Max run on Philo. Strategy was to get Philo and trade for Mysticism and Polytheism and take Monarchy
for free. Backup plan was Philo/CoL/Republic.
1275 BC, I got Philo, made trades and got Monarchy. At this point, I also found Menehune, and made a trade
I've never seen before!!

I get Construction.
I give Math and Writing.

Yes, I think Menehune got Construction as a starting tech.


4000BC Suva
2470BC Apia
2270BC Nuku Alofa
2070BC Honolulu
1790BC Avarua
1675BC Hanga Roa
1600BC Nati
1450BC Ahe
1350BC Lautoka
1350BC Hilo
1175BC Bora Bora
1000BC Labosa
850BC Bodo
690BC Kona Kaneohe
610BC Moorea
550BC Savu Savu


1000 BC

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/81969/polynesia_1000_BC.JPG

11 Cities
31 Population
Contact with 12 other civilizations.
Missing Currency, construction, CoL, Map making, Polynesian Trade, Literature and Republic.

In 530 BC, India shows up with currency, which I trade for and enter the MA

I didn't expand off my island in the AA, so I didn't run into huge barb issues - I did have some on my island and one overran a city for production,
but they were really no big deal.

At some point, both america and England made demands of me, which I refused, have been at war with them for some time. England actually did it while
I was near them, so they sank a couple of curraghs. The war happiness has been very, very nice :)

Wait until you get to the real fun, trying to colonize other islands. ;)

But you seem to have made similar progress with similar city sites to some extent. The differences was in my game, I was unable to beat America to Philosophy (for that matter, I didn't even try, I traded for Map Making and went full on Polynesian Trade).

And yes, the war happiness basically allows zero luxuries up to size 12, even without obtaining more than 3 or 4 luxuries in all. :goodjob:

... and then I realize that barb galleys wont' attack me if I end on a non-coastal tile.Yup! :)
At this point, I also found Menehune, and made a trade
I've never seen before!!

I get Construction.
I give Math and Writing.

Yes, I think Menehune got Construction as a starting tech.Yes, that is one of the 'benefits' that was added. Menehune got Construction as a Bonus Tech; I was most interested in giving the Player an extra trade to leave the AA a little early, but also building the GW is an interesting effect.

I used it like you said. Traded for Construction to the Menehune, and then traded Construction around for Philosophy, Map Making, etc.

may I ask an exploit in this thread:
do this exploit ban or not now?
I read http://gotm.civfanatics.net/games/rules.php again, but I know that there are some underlying expoloits such as massive troops jump which later added by aiwood on that page.
the exploit is:
1.gift AI A 100gpts
2.sign A vs B,take back gpts with techs.
3. wipe B.
thanks.

1.gift AI A 100gpts
2.sign A vs B,take back gpts with techs.
3. wipe B.
thanks.
Just to want ask it myself. With these minor AIs it is very handy.
And the same in SGTOM 13. (29 AIs 27 times more effective...).
My oppinion is that "all allowed what is not forbiden". And as game started already
we can't apply new rules for current game. After all for Sid it is hard:
you have to have Tech advanses and strong military. And, AI pays for "your" Tech.
They become more advanced and it will be harder to deal in a future.
However at lower levels it is unbeateble exploit.

Predator, going for Domination
Found Suva in place and start a min run on writing. Builds go worker, curragh/settler/settlers. /warrior/

With 7fpt+ did not bother about Granary, but Found 2 Cities to use other weat.

For exploration I use Archimedes spiral method, counter clockwise.
I knew, that barb galleys wont' attack me if I end on a non-coastal tile.

Only one curragh was for a while at turn 15 I recon Barbarians Galley?? (Anybody have writing??)
To ensure save exit build chain of Cities in 1 turn galley ran.

Some things happened I didn't expect:

Lapita built Collosus in 3050 BC, which is earlier than I've ever seen it.
Then, Menehune built Pyramids in 2390BC and The Great Wall in 2150BC, which is just amazing.

Techs:

1750 BC got writing, Max run on Philo.
Lapita got Writing at the same turn.
Nobody knew Poly at my game,
Probably Maory knows Poly, as they build ToA.
But I did not found them so far.
It was pointless to get Construction as Menehune had it. I hesitated between Currency and MM, but chose MM when in
1400 BC, I got Philo. Start Literature at Max and use MoM for library pre-build.
Researced Literature at 1000 BC and researched “Polinesian trade” at 775BC
Polynesian Trade appeared to be absolute ballast at this time, only China had Map making and could trade. Also this Polynesian Tech appeared to be “un tradable”. Even when some AI’s got MM I could not put in “on the table.”

Sometime England DoW. (I refuse to give writing, turn before they offered 300 for that, but I decline).


At 775 BC start to Republic at max with 21 turns.
Make MA with spain vs America.
Also the same turn trade some tech and go to MA alone.


4000BC Suva
2950BC Apia
2670BC Nuku Alofa
2430BC Honolulu
1830BC Avarua
I paused “Rex” for Phylo…
1275BC Hanga Roa
and so on.

At 900 BC Found Labosa at wine and Riders helped a lot to deal with Barbarians.

Techs at 775BC
Technology, Known to, Estimated Cost
1,Bronze Working,(14) China, Japan, Korea, Inca, Maya, Aztecs, India, America, England, Spain, Netherlands, Menehune, Aborigines, Lapita,150
2,Masonry,(13) China, Japan, Korea, Inca, Maya, India, America, England, Spain, Netherlands, Menehune, Aborigines, Lapita,220
3,Alphabet,(14) China, Japan, Korea, Inca, Maya, Aztecs, India, America, England, Spain, Netherlands, Menehune, Aborigines, Lapita,250
4,Pottery,(14) China, Japan, Korea, Inca, Maya, Aztecs, India, America, England, Spain, Netherlands, Menehune, Aborigines, Lapita,100
5,The Wheel,(13) China, Japan, Korea, Inca, Maya, Aztecs, India, America, England, Spain, Netherlands, Menehune, Aborigines,220
6,Warrior Code,(14) China, Japan, Korea, Inca, Maya, Aztecs, India, America, England, Spain, Netherlands, Menehune, Aborigines, Lapita,150
7,Ceremonial Burial,(13) China, Japan, Korea, Inca, Maya, India, America, England, Spain, Netherlands, Menehune, Aborigines, Lapita,110
8,Iron Working,(14) China, Japan, Korea, Inca, Maya, Aztecs, India, America, England, Spain, Netherlands, Menehune, Aborigines, Lapita,310
9,Writing,(10) China, Japan, Korea, Inca, Maya, America, Spain, Netherlands, Menehune, Lapita,520
10,Mysticism,(9) China, Korea, Inca, Maya, India, America, England, Spain, Menehune,270
11,Mathematics,(7) China, Korea, India, America, England, Spain, Menehune,600
12,Philosophy,(4) China, Korea, America, Spain,510
13,Code of Laws,(1) China,930
14,Literature*,,960
15,Map Making,(2) China, Korea,1070
16,Horseback Riding,(8) China, Japan, Korea, Inca, America, England, Spain, Menehune,360
17,Polytheism,(3) America, Spain, Menehune,1070
18,Currency,(6) China, Korea, America, England, Spain, Menehune,1260
19,The Republic*,,2800
20,Monarchy*,,2400
21,Construction,(5) China, America, England, Spain, Menehune,1650

I didn't make Map-Making untradeable, but I did turn off some civ's abilities to build Galleys. This may have made it less desirable, but I'm surprised you couldn't put it on the table. Also, could be side effect of new Polynesian Trade Tech. Hmm...

I didn't make Map-Making untradeable, but I did turn off some civ's abilities to build Galleys. This may have made it less desirable, but I'm surprised you couldn't put it on the table. Also, could be side effect of new Polynesian Trade Tech. Hmm...
Sorry, my poor English. I meant Polinesal trade, not MM.

My apologies; I thought you meant Map-Making, but reading closer you were still talking about Poly Trade. Polynesian Trade should be of no interest to the AI. :) I didn't realize that you couldn't even offer it - interesting.

Great game civ steve. I really am enjoying the whole polynesian flavour of this game. I discovered civ III complete a couple of months ago when my son bought it. I have never really played a lot of computer games except football ones so it was a revelation. Since then i have become completely addicted and am ruining my life ... oh well...
I am so far a regent player so trying this on the lowest class. Was able to find 3 asian, 4 american, 3 european, and 3 minor civs so far and i think one perhaps the Iroquois if they are in has been eliminated by someone.
From the other posts i guess the Indians are still out there.
I lost a couple of early curraghs to barbs before figuring out the staying at sea on end of turn tactic.
Was able to get to philosophy first and gifted a number of civs mysticism so was able to trade for polytheism later.
The poly raiders were great for taking out coastal barb camps when they were lightly guarded by approaching from sea and then attacking so no barb galleys could cause any damage. I upgraded archers to get them once i researched the new poly trade tech and was able to immediately trade for furs from liz and dyes i believe from mao.
A lot of my game looks like the maps posted earlier except i have been working my way down wine island and have three towns with granaries to keep pushing out settlers.
I appreciate the hard work this site puts in to keep all this going.

Predator, joining the challenge for fastest domination (I think)

Early game

Settled Suva in place and started a worker like Elear suggested in the pregame thread. I think that was really the way to go, though I didn't bother to make any detailed comparisons. After that an Outrigger, but since I didn't dare wait until after a granary to start chasing barbies I followed that up with two settlers. Apia was settled on the spices 2E of Suva, and my intention was to settle Nuku Alofa 2N of the capitol, by the cow there. However, when I had moved the second settler to that intended location, I noted this:

http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/4710/coastallureis6.png

Look at that, if I move one more step north I can get another coastal town! So I happily move another step north, and you all know what I found :wallbash:. After some debate I moved back south again and settled Nuku Alofa where I originally intended it, leaving that lake to future towns. Evil civ_steve... :gripe: ;)

Apia built an Outrigger, a warrior and then archers (once I traded for WC). Nuku Alofa built archers. Time to go barbie hunting. I lost a few archers in the war, but in 2070 BC the Avar encampment is dispersed, followed by the Tartar encampment in the far north in 1870 BC. The Avar camp turns up again though, so I have to disperse it once more in 1675 BC. In 1575 BC I disperse the Ghuzz encampment in the far southwest, and that's the last I see of the barbies on my island. At that point I had archers fogbusting all of the north and west to ensure no more camps would appear. To me the barbies were less than a nuisance, the only problem they gave me was that I had to wait to settle Papeete in the southwest until I could get an archer down there. Probably I had so little trouble because I didn't go for that early granary. :)

My first canoe met the closest neighbor, then proceeded to meet 6 other civs before 1000 BC. My second canoe (from Apia) was completed in 2630 BC, but already then the waters were troubled by barbie galleys. I thought galleys only appeared when two civs knew Writing, but obviously that's not true. I thought I was beaten to Writing by a long shot, but that would prove false as I met the others. Anyway, the second canoe stayed in the sea tile 3S of Apia on its first turn, and the two barb galleys blocking the way west both moved east. So I ran for it, they came hunting but couldn't catch up, so I could escape into open waters in the west. This galley met five AIs before 1000 BC. My third galley, built much later in 2150 BC, met two AIs, which makes up the 14 I've met so far. No idea where the last one is hiding, since I've mapped out most of the black already. :hmm:

I continued to settle in a slightly less dense pattern, so in 1000 BC my empire looked like this:

http://xs322.xs.to/xs322/07490/qscempire.png

Research was set to Writing at minimum, still only China beat me to it (by 2 turns). I had no problem being first to Philosophy, and by that time Polytheism was known by both America, Spain and the Moriori, the latter who obviously started with it since I could trade it from them for Mysticism and Alphabet... :rolleyes: I was expecting them to have Alphabet, so obviously it wasn't really a bonus, you switched Alphabet for Polytheism right?

In any case I had Monarchy in my hands by 1325 BC, and had my new government established by 1200 BC. I used Poly to trade for Map Making and went on to research Polynesian Trade at max speed. Or so I thought, but on the first turn as a Monarchy I forgot to turn research up to 90% from the 60% I did on the last turn of Philosophy. This meant I didn't get PT within the QSC, bah. ;)

In 1025 BC Korea comes up with CoL, and some trading around on the turn after for CoL, Currency (America and Spain had it) and Construction (Menehune) sees me ready to face the newer, better times in 1000 BC. No one else is close.

QSC Score: 14713
QSC stats:
1 city, 10 towns, 38 pop
1 granary, 1 harbor, 3 barracks
2 settlers, 10 workers
1 cWarrior, 2 rArchers, 3 vArchers, 5 vSpears, 4 vHorses, 6 rCanoes
14/15 contacts (missing Aborigine), no embassies.
All AA techs except Republic, Literature and Polynesian Trade (ETA 1 turn)
2184 gold, 1 gpt @ 2/7/1

My first game of COTM and I think I've already screwed up, judging by the look of these posts. One thing I don't get is how you guys are able to advance to MA so quick, well before my AD advance. I set my research as much as I can and also traded techs whenever possible. Judging by the screenshots, the cities are really closely spaced allowing for more cities so maybe thats the reason.

Also, I think most of you guys change to Monarchy, but shouldn't Republic be better cause it yields more gold?

Anyway, this is a good experience for me, thanks to civ_steve

Hi pearpenguin, welcome to CFC and the GOTMs! :wavey: :)

You certainly picked a good game as your first, the first ever game played at SID difficulty! If you've kept up long enough to actually enter the MA, then you can't be too shabby. ;)

One thing I don't get is how you guys are able to advance to MA so quick, well before my AD advance. I set my research as much as I can and also traded techs whenever possible. Judging by the screenshots, the cities are really closely spaced allowing for more cities so maybe thats the reason.
If you read my spoiler, you will have noted that during the AA I researched exactly 3 techs, of which one was optional. I researched first Writing in 50 turns, then Philosophy in ~20 turns, and then went for the optional Polynesian Trade. I also picked up Monarchy as my free tech from Philosophy. All other techs (except Alphabet and Pottery that we started with) I got by trading from the AIs, via so called tech brokering.

The trick here is that the AIs cannot meet each other, but you can meet them all! The trade price for a tech depends on the number of others you know that also know that tech. The fewer you know that have the tech, the more expensive it will be. But this works the same for the AI as well, and we can use that to our advantage.

As an example, consider a situation where you know 3 AIs who all only know you (but not each other). Assume you know Alphabet and Pottery (like the start in this game). All three AIs also know Pottery. One of the AIs (A) has Masonry and Alphabet, so you have nothing to offer him. Another (B) has Masonry, but lacks Alphabet. The third (C) has Alphabet and The Wheel. Your only trade opportunity is to trade Alphabet to (B). Since he knows only you, he thinks the tech is worth a lot, only one of his contacts (you) knows it. But you have two contacts with Masonry, so that tech is not at all worth as much to you. In this situation he would gladly give you Masonry for your Alphabet, and he would throw in any gold he had as well.

So now you have Masonry as well, and AI (C) doesn't have it. Since he knows only you, he will think it's really valuable, since only one of his contacts (you) knows it (sounds familiar?). The fact that you know two others who know it doesn't matter, since he doesn't. He has The Wheel that you lack, but this time since you know no other AIs who have that tech it will be valued at full price for you. It comes down to which of the two techs (Alphabet and The Wheel) is worth more. Maybe you could get some extra gold from him, or he might ask some from you. You should be able to do the trade though, which means that starting the trade only from Alphabet you now know both Masonry and The Wheel. And if you have many more contacts, which you likely do in this game, the opportunities are manifold.

Also note that trading as soon as there is a tech to trade for is generally not a good idea. Better to wait until you can make a deal with several AI like I outlined above, and wait for several AI to know a particular tech, and then get several techs at once through trading around. Otherwise you run the risk of not having anything to trade that one AI whose tech you really need in order to trade with all the others, because you already traded everything you have to him for other techs!

Also, I think most of you guys change to Monarchy, but shouldn't Republic be better cause it yields more gold?
There are benefits of going for Republic, definitely. If you are planning a research game, Monarchy is really out of the question. But there are some things that speak in favor of Monarchy.
- For starters you never experience War Wariness if you are a Monarchy, which you do in Republic, so if you plan for a game with lots of difficult warfare then Republic might not be a good idea.
- Further, in Monarchy the number of units you can have before you start paying upkeep is much higher, so if you have a lot of units then you may actually be paying more money in Republic than the extra commerce would bring. Again, warring favors Monarchy.
- You can also use Military Police (i.e. units stationed in towns) to gain happiness, which could be a good idea if resources are scarce (like in this game). In Republic you make more commerce, but may end up spending more of it on luxuries.
- Then there's also the very real problem at this difficulty level that getting Republic for free, by being first to Philosophy and having Code of Laws already, is pretty tricky to say the least. I was able to trade for Polytheism in my game, and could thus get Monarchy for free. I couldn't have gotten Republic since no one knew Code of Laws at the time (and if I had waited, I wouldn't have been first to Philosophy, Spain got Philosophy many turns before Korea got Code of Laws in my game). So if the choice is between a very early Monarchy and a long wait for Republic, I take the former.

Though really, if I play 100 games I would probably go for Republic in >90 of them, likely >95 as well. But in this game, at this difficulty level, with the warring plans I have in mind, Monarchy is my choice.

Hope that made some sense to you and that you could learn something from it. :) Good luck with the game, and hope you stick around to play more COTM and GOTM when the difficulty level drops back to normal. ;)

Wow thanks for the long reply. I didn't know that the tech trade price depends on the number of people you know that has that tech, so that's a new thing. I probably didn't trade enough cause some of the techs in AA I researched myself and only traded about half of them.

I also underestimated the rate at which the AI builds stuff at SID level, since I haven't played at this difficulty before. I was planning to attack the little Lapita island but found billions of spearmen/swordsmen/bowmen on it. At least now I know what Sid level is like.

Indeed, usually the Sid AIs who live on tiny islands are the hardest to attack, at least until they fall behind on resources/technology. If you have a stack of advanced defenders, especially on a hill or mountain, their weak little units will die ridiculously fast against yours.

p.s. - It didn't make a big impact on my game, but I am curious that so many went for Philosophy and got it. If I had tried in my game, I would have lost the race for it. Usually on Sid level, I am unable to be the first. :confused: :confused: :confused:

A game like this is pretty much the only way I switch to Monarchy early, for exactly the reasons that Niklas mentioned. The AI is isolated enough, and we started with alphabet, so it seemed possible that we could get a free tech for philosophy. And the AI loves going up CB/Myst/Polytheism, so I was pretty sure I could trade for Polytheism.

What will be interesting is if I choose to switch to republic when it comes. I don't know.

One nice thing is that civs on small islands will be attackable, because of the seaborne invasion abilities of units.

It didn't make a big impact on my game, but I am curious that so many went for Philosophy and got it. If I had tried in my game, I would have lost the race for it. Usually on Sid level, I am unable to be the first. :confused: :confused: :confused:
I knew it was a chance-taking, but it seemed not too risky. When I got to Writing, only China beat me to it by 2 turns. I had 10/15 contacts at that point, so it seemed probable it would take at least 20 turns for an AI to get Philosophy. At that point I had an ETA of 26 turns, which seemed safe enough (and I brought that time down a bit more).

And what really made it a no-brainer choice for me is that even if I would be beaten to it, it would only be a few AIs at most who would be close to knowing it, so it would still bring a very good trade revenue. No real loss involved, other than the missed slingshot which is no different from not trying for it. Any other tech I could choose to go for at that point would be more likely research by an AI, in particular Map Making which the AIs always goes for first. Indeed, in my game I traded for Map Making from Korea many turns before I got to Philosophy.

I knew it was a chance-taking, but it seemed not too risky. When I got to Writing, only China beat me to it by 2 turns. I had 10/15 contacts at that point, so it seemed probable it would take at least 20 turns for an AI to get Philosophy. At that point I had an ETA of 26 turns, which seemed safe enough (and I brought that time down a bit more).

And what really made it a no-brainer choice for me is that even if I would be beaten to it, it would only be a few AIs at most who would be close to knowing it, so it would still bring a very good trade revenue. No real loss involved, other than the missed slingshot which is no different from not trying for it. Any other tech I could choose to go for at that point would be more likely research by an AI, in particular Map Making which the AIs always goes for first. Indeed, in my game I traded for Map Making from Korea many turns before I got to Philosophy.

I didn't really think about it that way: I just sold Writing around, went min on Map Making until I had more trade opportunities. It wasn't long before I traded around for everything, and researched full on Polynesian Trade (I got it as I went into the MA).

See you in the next spoiler. :cool:

Predator Domination Challenge :ninja:.

As discussed in the pregame, the worker went east to the cow, I settled on the spot, and set research to Writing at the minimum. After seeing the extra wheat, I decided to build a settler first. After my worker irrigated and roaded the cow, he jumped back across the river to mine the river BG – when he saw the second cow, I decided my first settler would go in that direction, and I would build another settler for the wheat second.

After 2 settlers, it was time to get a curragh out, but it didn’t even make it out of Suva Bay before being sunk by barbarians. I decided it was useless to build more curraghs from Suva and started pushing them out of other towns where they could reach the open seas right away. Interestingly, it made my contacts different as I didn’t even meet the closest AI until I had already met 5 others.

Meanwhile Suva built a granary then 4-turn settlers with the first coming out around 2230 BC. By 1910 BC, Suva had been improved enough to be a 4-turn warrior plus settler factory. They were just regular warriors, but they helped with barb control and were useful for MP.

After completing my 50-turn run to Writing, I went for Philosophy at the maximum completed in 1400 BC. I had made no trades prior to then, but via the Big Picture, I picked up The Wheel, Masonry, Warrior Code, Mathematics, Ceremonial Burial, Bronze Working, Iron Working, Mysticism, Horseback Riding, Polytheism, and a bunch of gold, and I only had to give Philosophy away once.

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/5573/tradesvl1.th.jpg (http://img165.imageshack.us/my.php?image=tradesvl1.jpg)

I immediately revolted to Monarchy for 3 turns of anarchy. In Monarchy Suva became a 3-turn settler factory. Nobody had Map Making yet, so I started Currency while I waited for some AI to get Maps.

QSC:

13 towns
42 citizens
1 settler
31 workers :lol:
7 warriors
2 archers
6 outrigger canoes

http://img117.imageshack.us/img117/3284/bc1000sy3.th.jpg (http://img117.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bc1000sy3.jpg)

I had no idea I had that many workers until I was writing down my QSC stats – it still felt like there was a lot of work left to do, but I turned 1 of my worker factories into an additional settler factory at that point. The Hanging Gardens was a Forbidden Palace prebuild.

In 900 BC, my first “war” of the game started when Ghandi demanded Horseback Riding, and I refused, but I don’t remember ever seeing a single Indian unit.

In 775 BC, I completed Currency, and in 750 BC, I traded Monarchy to China for Map Making, Construction, Code of Laws, 395 gold and 12 gpt to enter the Middle Ages by myself.

At that point, I still was lacking contact with Japan, and I had not set foot on any islands other than my homeland yet.

Chamnix, why build so many workers when you have a slave farm to the south? :mischief:

:lol: It wasn't really planned :blush: - it seemed like I kept having excess food, and there was always more work to be done. Besides, I didn't get Map Making until 750 BC, and that is way too long to wait for workers. My native workers turned out to be useful anyway since I could eventually merge all of them back into cities once I had sufficient slave labor.

:) Poly Raider: amphib, with enslave, and an island full of barbs nearby = lots of free workers. You're welcome. ;)

I settled in place. Didn't know what to expect so I planned on a tight build. Went for writing at minimum. Took Niklas's advice (even though he ended up taking someone else's) and built three outriggers in Suva. I expanded to nine cities (then 11 later), exploring the seas all the while. My third outrigger was sunk almost immediately by barb galleys in Suva Bay and I wasted a few more outriggers trying to get past them. Finally started building outriggers on the west (end eventually east) coast. Made all contacts by 1000 BC and made lots of tech trades and outright sales. By 1000 BC I still lacked currency. I stopped my log at 1000 BC and I can't recall if I traded for it or researched it. I did get philosophy first and took monarchy. Had a seven turn anarchy.

Barbs (except ships) haven't been a problem though I haven't tried to colonize any other islands yet. I made a silly attempt to invade the Aztecs. I spent about 1000g upgrading warriors to swords and landed a dozen on a hill near an Aztec city. I've never played at Sid level before. :blush: After that debacle I switched to building raiders. Current plan is to try those on an Aztec city but after reading this spoiler thread I see I've forgotten the raider's enslave ability. Also, attacking Aztecs with raiders will start the golden age. Was thinking about buying republic before doing that. Now I'm not sure what I'll do.

My polynesia at 1000 BC:

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/462/1000bcnd4.th.jpg (http://img145.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1000bcnd4.jpg)

My QSC stats: score: 13617

1 city, ten towns
43 citizens

14 workers
11 warriors
2 spears
16 swords
6 outriggers
2 catamarans

2 temples
6 harbors
1 barracks

all contacts
all AA techs except currency, literature and republic

Timeline constructed from QSC log:

4000 BC: Settled Suva
3850 BC: Settled Apia
3650 BC: Outrigger #1 leaves Suva
3550 BC: Lapita contacted by #1
3450 BC: Outrigger #2 leaves Suva
3400 BC: America contacted by #1
3350 BC: Buy masonry from America for alphabet and 51g
Sell alphabet to Lapita for ceremonial burial, bronze working and 11g
3200 BC: Outrigger #3 leaves Suva
3150 BC: Aztecs contacted by #1
Indians contacted by #2
3100 BC: #3 outrigger sunk by barbs in Suva Bay
Sell ceremonial burial to Aztecs for warrior code and 10g
2900 BC: #2 outrigger sunk by barbs
2800 BC: Settled Nuku Alofa
Inca contacted by #1
2750 BC: Outrigger #4 leaves Suva and is sunk by barbs in Suva Bay
2590 BC: Mayans contacted by #1
2470 BC: Settled Honolulu
2430 BC: Sell masonry to Aztecs for wheel and 16g
2270 BC: Settled Papeete
2230 BC: Outrigger #5 leaves Nuku Alofa
Sell wheel to Lapita for iron working and 9g
2110 BC: Settled Avarua
Netherlands contacted by #1
Sell wheel to Mayans for 120g
Sell wheel to Inca for 80g
2070 BC: Settled Hanga Roa
2030 BC: Sell wheel to Gandhi gor 63g
1990 BC: Outrigger #6 leaves Nuku Alofa
China contacted by #5
1950 BC: Settled Nati
1870 BC: Settled Ahe
1830 BC: England contacted by #1
Sell iron working to England for mysticism and 45g
1750 BC: Learn writing, start philosophy at max (80%)
1725 BC: Outrigger #7 leaves Nuku Alofa
Menehune contacted by #6
1675 BC: Korea contacted by #5
Sell mysticism to Korea for 210g
1650 BC: America demands writing, I refuse, America declares war
1625 BC: Outrigger #8 leaves Hanga Roa
1600 BC: Outrigger #9 leaves Nuku Alofa
Moriori contacted by #1
Sell masonry, mysticism, the wheel and alphabet to Moriori for polytheism and 30g
Sell polytheism to England for 290g
1450 BC: Learn philosphy, get monarchy for free, queue map making
Start revolution, 7 turns of anarchy
1300 BC: Sell horseback riding to Menehune for math
Sell horseback riding, philosophy and math to Korea for map making and 48g
Queue polynesian trade (at max after revolution)
Inca demand alphabet and I give it
1275 BC: Establish monarchy
1250 BC: Give writing to Menehune (because they have construction)
1225 BC: Sell monarchy and philosophy to Menehune for construction and 2g
Sell philosophy to China for 106g
Sell polytheism to Inca for 88g
Sell horseback riding to Maya for 75g
Make peace with America, give them writing, they give me 360g
1150 BC: Spain contacted by #8
Japan contacted by #6
1075 BC: Popped hut in north - got warrior
1000 BC: Settled Lautoka and Hilo
Aborigines contacted by #8
Learned polynesian trade, queued currency
Sell construction to Korea for code of laws, 68g and iron

What a strange game for a Sid game! The cards seem to be heavily stacked against the AIs.

I settled in place, built a worker, send a canoe, and settled the mini continent fighting off the barbarians.

I did minimum research on writing (got it first :confused: ) then full speed code of law and philosophy. And got free republic in 1000bc, starting 4 turns of anarchy. :goodjob:
It surely helped, that I did not do a lot of trading with the isolated Ais.

The money saved during the min research was used to build embassies and I observed quite a number of wars among (mostly) neighboring AIs. I was surprised to see England and Spain at war, since they should not even know each other; a special twist of the game designer I suppose.

I refused all demands, but so far only America and Korea declared, giving nice war happiness.

The main question I am currently pondering is whether to go for the luxuries on the barbarian-ridden islands.

Though being able to research a MA tech, I decided to stay ancient and research polynesian trade and then literature, while my Palace pre-build for the Great Library was progressing nicely. Since the AI was slow researching, I calculated very good chances on getting TGL.

With pt researched, I built raiders and my first settlement on the southern island and started making slaves. Progress was slow, but steady.

With successfully completing The Great Library, I could started to accumulate cash. And since I did not yet want to start my Golden Age, I refrained from attacking other civs with raiders. Instead I built my infrastructure and sent many boats to explore the seas and shores. And proceeded to claim the southern island. And waited for the AIs to reach Middle Ages and give me techs.

I don't expect to be able to finish this game, but I've had a little time to play and have enjoyed it very much so far.

I decided that I'd go ahead and try for 20K, using the extra settler on open to build my 20K city at the starting location after walking the other settler 2N to build the capital.

I researched CB, writing, philosophy and made it first to philosophy, taking monarchy as my free tech. Because I put the capital inland, I was slow getting curraghs out. I would have been better served building a few boats after building my temple in Apia, but I didn't.

Trading was weird. Not being able to trade Polynesian Trade was an unpleasant surprise, although I'm not sure it would have been wise. I traded the Menehune math for construction. I'm pretty sure that somebody had polytheism free, too, based on when the ToA was built (or maybe I was just really unlucky). This was a big pain for me, since the ToA wasn't available to me. I didn't want it, but I needed a bigger prebuild than the palace. Because my palace was too small, I ran into trouble when nobody researched any wonder techs while I was working on philosophy. Map Making was available, but wonderless - thanks a lot. Anyway, I didn't realize my situation in time to do much about it, so I ended up going into civil disorder intentionally to avoid building the palace. Consequently, I built my temple twice, once before HG and once after.

Conquest Challenge:

Doing well, but don't think I'll be able to finish this one either. About 400 BC. and the Lapita are gone and the Aztecs are on the ropes, then comes Spain. Researching Feudalism and will switch governments then. Biggest issue is a 3+ minute interturn. Once the remaining tribes reach Astronomy, that'll probably triple (trade route calculations), and then I'll have no chance for the deadline. Will keep plowing forward and hope for luck (and a fasrter machine from Santa) :D

I'm glad I didn't go for Conquest Class, because even in Open Class this game doesn't feel to hard yet... :confused: Probably the second settler and all the other nice gimmicks, civ_steve has built into this game, help to keep up with the Sid AIs.

Settled in place and moved the second settler 2N. I had done some calculating and found, that this way both towns can become 4-turners. And so it happened. Built a worker and an outrigger and then started two early granaries. This allowed me to settle my island quickly and to send a couple of settlers overseas to found wine, gems and incense colonies. (Polynesian trade helps a lot here!)

Barb galleys were not a problem. I already knew from earlier GOTMs that the AI does not attack with galleys, if my ships are on sea or ocean, so I figured the barbs probably won't do either. I lost two outriggers while clearing a way to an intended landing spot, and I lost one Polynesian galley with a settler on it :mad:. I had to park it on a coastal tile in order to reach the intended destination on the next turn. I retroperspective it would have been better to waste another turn than to not land that settler at all...:lol:
However the barb horsemen were a nuisance! They killed a couple of workers and a settler and at the moment put an end to my attempt to further settle the wine island to the south. There are three stacks of 30+ units each and probably a few more hidden in the fog, so I first need to switch my economy to producing units, before I can complete the settlement on that island. (At the moment I'm running kind of a farmers gambit, as the "barb situation" on my home island is pretty much under control (due to my fast expansion, I presume).

On the tech side I made a 50-turn run for Writing and the full speed to Philosophy, which I managed to get in 12 or 13 turns. Can't remember exactly, as I didn't take any notes during this game. Anyway I was quite surprised at how fast I was able to get there! While I was researching Philo, I didn't trade away Writing, as I was much too afraid to loose the race to Philo, as had happened in COTM42. I guess that was a mistake, because when I finished Philo, neither Code Of Laws nore Polytheism was available for trade, so I chose Literatur as my free tech. I had a 10-turn prebuild for the Great Library (unfortunately too many other things had to be finished first, so I wasn't able to start it earlier), which still needed like 38 turns to finish. Therefore I didn't trade Literature around until 9 turns before my GL would complete and all currently started wonders were finished. I think the fact that I didn't trade any useful things around, was a major factor in the very slow tech pace of the AI! After some initial trading I was the clear tech leader for quite a while, because every AI had to do their own research: most didn't have any contacts and the ones that had were at war with their contacts... :)
Anyway, after Philo+Literatur I did another full speed run for Polynesian Trading, which I completed in around 20 turns. I figured that by the time I finished the GL, most other techs would be researched by the AI, so going for Poly Trading seemed the best way to go. From now on I applied a mixed strategy: I traded tech to those AIs, which had gold or other techs, but didn't trade my techs to those that had nothing to give. The idea is to keep them backwards so much, that later, when I start some military actions, it'll be easy picking... (Knights against Spearmen is always fun... Even if they have hundreds of them.) The drawback of this strategy of course is, that my Great Library won't do me much good.
After Poly Trading was finished, still no trade opportunity for Monarchy or Republic had presented itself. Therefore I started another full-speed run for Philosophy, which would require ~30 turns. A couple of turns later Korea had Republic, but wouldn't give it to me. (I offered all I had, which was approx. 1600 gold + 100gpt.) So I decided to keep my own research going. Then in 800BC my GL finished, and the next turn I got Construction and Currency from it, the last remaining ancient techs, so I entered the Middle Ages. But now something strange happened: my research for Republic was gone!! The previous turn it had shown like 20 turns to finish, and now it was back to 30 turns, all the beakers I had collected up to that point were gone!! :mad:
Does anyone have an explanation for this?

As I was still not able to trade for it, I started Republic again, this time with all my force, as I was so mad about loosing ten turns worth of research. I build a few Libraries and employed a couple of scientists, which enabled me to reduce the number of required turns for Rep down to 22. Now I'm 9 turns from completing it. Korea has been a Republic for quite a while by now, and America recently turned Monarchy, but all the rest is still despotic. America and Korea are the only ones now, who accelerated their tech pace and gained 1-2 techs on me each. China is even with me and the rest hopelessly behind. So I think now I'm at a point where I need to decide about the future strategy: either keeping most AIs backward as long as possible and start an attempt on domination using Knights, or start gifting techs to make the best use of my Great Library and turn this into a tech game (Space or Diplomatic). One thing is for sure: I won't attack the nice Lapita people! Ithink their scientific trait is worth much more, than if I'd own these three cities myself...!
The domination plan may not be so difficult as we originally thought in the pre-game discussion, because there are still a number of unsettled islands, and with our unsinkable galleys we can be the first ones to settle them!

In the meanwhile I managed to get the required 18 towns, and my other prebuild finished the Forbidden Palace. And here is the second strange incident I have to report: the effect of the FP was alost nil! :confused: I had counted all the shields one turn before and after finishing it, and it turned out that after finishing the FP my income increased by 3gpt and my production by 3spt! Can anyone explain that? I remember reading in SirPleb's Sid blog that the location of the FP is irrelevant in C3C, it's only important to get it fast. Therefore I built it two cities away from the capital (see red circle in my screenshot). But at the moment it looks like a wasted effort! Perhaps it'll be more effective, when the cities grow bigger?

And a third very strange thing: the game cannot be saved anymore! After my second session the game crashed, while I was trying to type a new filename into the popup box. Therefore I started accepting the suggested default name from then on. For my third session this was ok, but after my 4th and 5th sessions, it didn't create that file, even though it said "Ok"! I didn't notice this after my 4th session, so I had to start my 5th from the last autosave. But after my 5th session I opened a Windows Explorer in parallel and checked the file system before quitting C3C. I saved the game two or three times, but no file appeared anywhere in the Civ directory! In the end I found a way to avoid having to retort to autosaves: in the popup box I clicked the name of an existing file, the game asks me whether I want to overwrite it, I say yes, and then the file gets created!
Has anyone ever experienced something like this? It seems that if you use the "automatic name", the file is not created, while if you type a new name into the box, you risk a crash. May be a peculiarity of my laptop, but unfortunately I'll depend on my laptop during the entire Christmas break. I'll investigate this a bit more on my desktop using the old save files, after COTM43 is finished.

Have a nice Christmas and a happy new year everyone!
Lanzelot

http://forums.civfanatics.com/newreply.php?do=postreply&t=253330

just one short note :
has anyone used amphi ability of poly marines (raiders)?
if yes, then did You successfully capture a worker?

in my situation, there were 2 or 3 spaces left on the boats, but when they left coast square next turn, slaves remained there... flying over coast tile.
it didn't really matter, i was able to move them onto adjacent land tile.

is this sth that was overlooked in regular game, cause there is no unit with enslavement and amphi flags?
[i mean that Your unit get a slave, Your transport vessels have free room for them and move away without loading a slave... slave stays in air]

@pol1: Yes, I think you pretty much summed it up. There are no units with both amphi and enslave, so they didn't fix the resulting bug. However, the bug is still there in the normal game too - if you generate a MGL with a marine in an amphibious attack the same thing happens, he is stuck standing on that coastal tile unless you have room on a boat or can move him onto the shore.

As for this game, a few times I've had slaves sit on coastal tiles as "magnets" to draw enemy ships away from my intended location of attack. :mischief: (I shouldn't speak of that though, since it's after the AA ;)).

I presume slaving units can create MGLs as well as slaves? Can they do both at once?

I presume slaving units can create MGLs as well as slaves? Can they do both at once?
Yes, they can.

Open class, Conquest VC, at it with scoutsout :ninja:

I don't exactly qualify for the Middle Age tech deal but it's on purpose, and I'm still pondering whether or not to go Middle-Age-borne right away.

I haven't had any trouble with the barbs, they only spawned on what I gather to be the pre-set camp on the NW swamp. I lost 1 spear, 2 workers and ~125g to them but I think that's a very fair exchange for the kind of farmer gambit I went for.

The canoes were really great, though I did everything I could to slow down trading. I want everyone to be dumb for a long time. I'm still looking for 3-4 civs in the northern seas and even if they're all alone on a remote island, I'll try my luck at not gifting them much more than alpha for gold.

I don't plan on researching polynesian trade at all, I've got enough workers and my focus is now set on conquering the Lapita for the Colossus and a dirty GLib snatch. I did gift them Literature on purpose, so it should work... :mischief:

Either way, I'll keep building infra and troops. My prebuilt FP is 40% of the way through or so, and it stands on the Lapitan shore. I just started leader farming on the barb island with a couple of swords, and there's more where they came from. I hope I can build enough pikes to survive the Lapitan bowmen on landing - if I can even find a landing spot.
COTM 43

Open class, Conquest VC, at it with scoutsout

Tech path will be writing (min), philo to Litt, get republic then boats through trade, invade whatever we can shortly.

Turn 0:

Spears to hills

Start planner gives me little out of working out a no-road worker strategy since my settler pump will be up and running fast enough. Were we IND this could've been different.

Settle Polygamy on the spot. 1 Settler will walk 2N, worker on cow.

Cow (mine) - wheat (irrigate to work gold every turn) - river bg (mine) - road a little and go work elsewhere.

Canoe - granary - settler (turn 23) ad vitam.

Turn 1:

Settler 2 sees a volcano so it'll go no further.

Turn 2: Polytics founded, will do

worker (2) - granary - worker (ad vitam)

Turn 9: Meet Lapita, no trades

Turn 12: Meet America, they're up 2 techs: probably not alone, I'll go around

Turn 19: Meet Spain, they're up 3 techs (so is America), start going E from there. They have ivory on their island.

Turn 23: Meet Japan, up 3 down 2 so they're probably alone.

1st settler is out: will go for a wheat location.

The first 3 towns are coastal and will make a canoe first, then barracks/swords or settlers/workers for wheat locations

Turn 26: Polygon founded on the river hill to the SW

Turn 29: Polyhedra founded on the closest NW silks

Turn 33: Polypropylene founded SE of the SE silks

Turn 38: Polynomial founded

Meet China, he's up 5 - definitely not alone. Which reminds me I should trade Alpha before no one cares anymore: get all 1st-tier and Iron + 62g.

Turn 39: India is down IW - probably alone

Turn 41: Polyurethane founded

Turn 43: Meet Menehune, up 2 so not alone, but it's a minor civ ... then on the IBT, England sends a curragh and makes contact, so there

Turn 44: Meet Korea, down CB but won't trade it for Masonry. Korea and China must be the 2 at war.

Turn 48: Polyester and Polytechnic founded

China has Writing, fortunately they're alone and at war, so I'll dare hope they don't beat me to philo but get MM rather.

Turn 50: Get writing, trade IW and CB for Mysticism, Masonry and ~250g. Everyone is down Writing except Mao. 3 have Maths, 2 have HBR.

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u204/CFC_Beorn/cotm43-01c.jpg

Turn 51: Polyvalent founded

Turn 56: Polyunsaturated founded

Turn 57: Polyphonic founded and I make mistakes that cost me 1 turn on my settler factory as well as 2 workers to a barb horse.

Turn 59: The Aztecs are down 3 techs and have 0 gold: definitely alone.

Turn 63: Philosophy researched in 13 turns, grab Literature free, go for CoL at 30+%, should take about 20 turns. Libraries ordered everywhere that is not already making settlers/workers/swords.

Turn 65: Polygyny founded, sell writing to 2 big wallets, then grab gold for HBR elsewhere and decide to wait for MM to be out before trading again. All AA techs are out except MM. I won't go poly trade but Feudalism rather.

Turn 67: Incans are down Alpha, it buys their 120g, treasury now over 1700. Last barb clearing operation underway. Notice the Lapita have colossus: could really be worth sniping.

Turn 69: Polygala founded

Turn 70: Polymorphism founded, Philosophy is out and Spain is working on MoM. Time to trade. Gift Literature to Lapita so they build me the GLib. Get more gold out of obsolete techs, grab MM and realize I'll need a bit more yet to break the Currency/Construction price barrier. CoL isn't in yet and I want to research Republic anyways so I'll keep hopes and patience up.

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u204/CFC_Beorn/cotm43-02.jpg

Turn 76: Polymer founded

Turn 80: Get CoL (forgot to check, I missed it by 1 beaker last turn :gripe: )


QSC stats:
18 cities
60 pop
29 workers
1 spear (elite)
2 swords (1vet 1elite)
1 catamaran
7 canoes

2 grans
3 harbors
4 libs
5 raxes

1910g, just got CoL, headed towards Republic (max speed means 89bpt, so 31 turns) holding off on tier 3 trades as long as possible.

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u204/CFC_Beorn/cotm43-03c.jpg

I just started leader farming on the barb island with a couple of swords, and there's more where they came from.
You can't get leaders from fighting barbies. Or did you mean 'elite' farming, for later leaders?

Elite farming yes, my bad. I remember trying an actual leader farm with raging barbs, never got it working too well ;)

Btw, :worship: nice one tao, the full republic slingshot! We have about the same research times but I would've been beaten to it by Spain and Korea in my game :(

Hey Beorn, you're not allowed to show the minimap in this thread. :nono: :hammer:

Well, well, the crisis is over now :)

It's now become clear that I'm not going to be able to complete this as I'm still busy chopping my way through the hundreds of American units. I've got 2 Sword Armies and a Horse Army busy pillaging American resources and roads, but he just keeps pumping out Archers & Spears and I keep hacking away at them. Interturns are still around 5 minutes. I'll soon have MDI at the front lines with pikes beginning to land behind his borders to keep the resources unhooked. I'll play another day or 2 just to see how far I can get, then move on to GOTM 74 & COTM 44.

BTW: Steve this has been a lot of fun and I wanted to say thanks for the effort :salute:

My first sid game and my first post!

As it is my first post I want to first thank Civ_Steve, AlanH, Ainwood and the rest of the GOTM staff for making this possible! Lovin' it!!!!

I also want to thank all the top players here with hundreds (some of you even thousands) of posts. It really helped me fine-tune my game which made me a lot better player!

So now to the game; open class, going for anything that gives me a victory!!

My beginning was as everybody elses; settled in place and min run for writing. My second city went 2 north. Capital started on the granary right away and my 2nd city did warrior-worker-granary.

After that I build some coastal cities which go all out on the canoes. The following years were all about scouting with the canoes and building new workers and cities (which either started on barracks or canoes).

I traded as little as possible, initially only going for Warrior Code (wanted to build archers so I could later upgrade them to raiders). When I discovered Writing in 1750BC, I also traded for Mysticsm, Masonry, The Wheel and CB.

As I was the first that discovered writing I decided to gamble a bit and go for Code of Laws instead of Philosophy. A gamble that really paid out! In 1250 BC I discoverd Code of Laws, by that time only China, the Netherlands and Lapita knew writing (I already met 14 civs).

I discoverd philosophy in 1025BC and after taking the free Republic I traded for every ancient technology (except for monarchy, literature and polynesian trade) and all the gold in the world!!!

My 1025BC stats:
14 cities
55 citizens
28 workers
20 archers
2 spearman
1 warrior
3 chariot
8 canoes
2265 gold
14 contacts (missing 1)

as I already finished my game I will soon post the rest of my game.

Neo666, welcome to GOTM! :wavey:

And that's a really impressive start, especially for a 'newcomer'! This definitely can't be your first visit to civ-land... :thumbsup:

Hi Niklas,

thanks!! No, I'm not a newbie on the GOTM scene (I playing GOTM's for a little under a year know), just a newbie in posting!!

Welcome from me also, Neo666! Hope you'll enjoy the discussions over here.

Your game really looks impressive! Your "gamble" to try the full Republic slingshot seems to have given you a very powerful start. (I didn't have the guts to try that, fearing the "fast" tech pace of the Sid AIs... :lol: )

Cheers, Lanzelot