I have just found out the beauty of collateral damage! Most of you guys out there already know about this, but for me it was a completely new concept. Previously I only used siege weapons to bombard. But today I found out about the ease of taking a city, even when normally I would lose my stack. Completely changed the way I wage war :D

Yeah collateral damage is pretty essential to taking over an entire map. I'd say in civ4 if you wish to be a serious warmonger you HAVE to abuse it to give other units good odds (keeps losses down bigtime).

However, one thing you might not know is that garbage units like catapults die horribly to say rifles, but they still do the collateral damage!!!!!! That means slamming 6 of your obsolete catas into a city will actually do significant damage...many times the damage of any other unit of its age.

Just make sure you still bring your city attacker units (usually with city raider or whatever in modern times once you're not using melee) and garrison troops too. Siege sucks on defense badly.

Also, don't forget cho ko nus, the Chinese UU. THey also cause collateral damage. I have been messing with rushing them after bulbing machinery. I can make it happen pretty well on emperor, immortal is tougher.

Siege sucks on defense badly.

No it doesn't. Slamming 10 or so cats into an invading stack and mopping them up can be quite helpful. :p
Saved my ass last game (OCC without horses/metal) where i faced knights and stuff with only longbows and siege :p (gotta love Shaka, gave me lots of GG points ;))

If you meant for standing idle and defending I agree, siege is meant to attack :)

Siege does not suck on defense btw. They are immune to collateral damage. So your stack of catapults will still be at power 5 while your axes and longbows are power 2 and lower after being hit by 10 trebs. However the catapults are more effective while attacking. If you want to use the siege machines defensively make sure you give them the combat upgrades.

Well.. Very useful.. But it's not the only way of waging war. There's a lot of other ways to increase your chances:

- Have a tech lead. First to be able to field infantry for instance.
- Use aircraft. Air crafts can attack without getting destroyed themselves. Bombers even does collateral damage without dying all the time like the regular artillery.
- Make sure you bombard down all city defenses in front.

No it doesn't. Slamming 10 or so cats into an invading stack and mopping them up can be quite helpful. :p
Saved my ass last game (OCC without horses/metal) where i faced knights and stuff with only longbows and siege :p (gotta love Shaka, gave me lots of GG points ;))

If you meant for standing idle and defending I agree, siege is meant to attack :)

That's what I meant...:)

Siege weapons were clearly made for attack, so that is what they should be used for. Not camping and taking on attackers. Yes, "aggressive defense" also involves attacking, although generally in land wars my rally point is right where enemies would invade and so I just use a new catapult or two to soften up invading stacks.

And as for standing on D as the other poster said, it's true they dont take collateral themselves, but they also get 0 bonus from terrain. At 5 str and usually only city raider, bombard, or collateral dmg promotions (the only logical promotions on siege imo), any promoted unit has favorable odds vs them. It should also be noted that the AI rarely tries to spank invading stacks with tons of siege. You might see the occasional cannon or something but they just don't hit you with 5 catapults carefully before using other units. Against humans it would probably be different...but then SoD's would have to be constructed differently and move in carefully depending on situation.

The amount of collateral damage seems related to the strength of the attacker. I.e., a strength 0.3 CAT is still fine for bombarding but not for causing collateral damage.

It also seems related to the strength of the defender. I THINK I observe that when I put a unit with a good defense bonus (Guerilla or Woodeman, e.g.), I take less CD as long as that unit stays on top.

Do Catapults cause as much CD as Trebs?

CK

Using collateral damage is a major strategy of mine, feel sorry for the cats and cannons that get sacrificed (use them as "cannon fodder").

As far as I know, the cats cause more collateral damage, the trebs are better at bringing down city defenses.