View Full Version : Buy a peace treaty for 1 Gold


danieldaniel
Apr 07, 2008, 03:51 AM
This may be a well know trick, but just in case:

When you see an AI is about to DOW you (ie big stack approaching your borders), you can ask them for 1 gold as a tribute. If they accept, a 10 turns peace treaty automatically starts and so thwarts their attack.

If they are cautious or below you’ll get a -1 diplomatic penalty, at pleased you don’t get any penalty at all. In my experience this trick works most of the time, I think most AIs will accept a 1 gold tribute unless they feel overwhemly superior to you. If they are at pleased it’s even more likely they will accept.

Maybe someone with more knowledge on the XLM files can corroborate this.

EDIT: I just realized the thread title is wrong, you're the one getting the 1 gold! so it should be "trick the AI into a peace treaty and get 1 gold!"

obsolete
Apr 07, 2008, 03:57 AM
If they are cautious or below you’ll get a -1 diplomatic penalty

I'm not sure why you would try such a thing. No AI will EVER give you a gift when it is at Cautious or Furious mode.

BalbanesBeoulve
Apr 07, 2008, 04:01 AM
I'm not sure why you would try such a thing. No AI will EVER give you a gift when it is at Cautious or Furious mode.

False.

They will give you tribute if your power is greater than theirs and they're afraid of you.

danieldaniel
Apr 07, 2008, 04:05 AM
I'm not sure why you would try such a thing. No AI will EVER give you a gift when it is at Cautious or Furious mode.

Mmmm, then my civ4 installation must have some kind of bug, because I get tribute from cautious and furious AIs all the time.:confused:

pangu
Apr 07, 2008, 05:31 AM
Actually, I did something weird last week.

I had a big army and Geghis Khan had the nerve to demand 300 gold as tribute. I rejected and, just for the hell of it, I demanded 300 gold as tribute at once from him on the same turn. He agreed?! It was really funny... The conversation goes like...


Khan: "Give me to our demand (of 300g) or prepared to be destroyed!"

Me: "We reject your empty threat!" and "We demand 300g as tribute!"

Khan: "Kick a civilisation when it is down... :cry::cry: We agree..."




Which reminds me of another weird conversation with Shaka previously...

Shaka: "The peace loving people of Zulu propose an open border agreement :)"

Me: "Okay"

Immediately another window pops up after the 1st window is closed...

Shaka: "Time to die! :mad:"

desemondez
Apr 07, 2008, 07:36 AM
Which reminds me of another weird conversation with Shaka previously...

Shaka: "The peace loving people of Zulu propose an open border agreement :)"

Me: "Okay"

Immediately another window pops up after the 1st window is closed...

Shaka: "Time to die! :mad:"


hahahaha that made me chuckle :p I can totally imagine Shaka doing that!

Quotey
Apr 07, 2008, 08:33 AM
False.

They will give you tribute if your power is greater than theirs and they're afraid of you.

(Most rational) AIs will not attack if you have a higher power than them, and you can just defend the city against Monty.

siggboy
Apr 07, 2008, 09:39 AM
I once made a trade with Montezuma, offering him 99 gold and asking for 100 gold in return. He accepted ;-).

Maybe this is a bug in the AI code, or it simply treats it as a 1 gold tribute from the opponent, which would be weird though since it doesn't incur any diplomatic penaltic to simply trade.

TheMeInTeam
Apr 07, 2008, 09:46 AM
False.

They will give you tribute if your power is greater than theirs and they're afraid of you.

I can vouch for this being true too. If your power rating is higher, they'll cave in, usually to gold requests rather than tech...

danieldaniel
Apr 07, 2008, 09:57 AM
Well, all I can say is that this little trick has saved my day on more than one occasion. When I see Ragnar’s 10 galleons one turn away from my coastal city and all I can put for defence is 2-3 rifflemen, and the diplomacy screen shows he has greanadiers… then I guess I can just hope for the best… or I can ask him for one gold and get ten more turns to reinforce the city. Weaker AIs can sometimes cause a lot of trouble with a surprise attack.

I play huge maps and sometimes my empire spreads so much that it’s difficult to keep all of it well defended at all times, especially when I’m fighting a tough opponent at the other side of the world. Besides that, the fact that it can also deter a pleased AI from attacking you makes it worthwhile trying, and it costs you nothing. You can also use the trick in a preemptive way to keep your enemies from bribing your other neighbours.

For what I know, the smaller the amount the more likely they will give in, thus the 1 gold. What I’d like to hear from someone who knows the game mechanics better than me is whether there’s a chance for a stronger AI to accept a 1 gold tribute or not??

Johnpecan
Apr 07, 2008, 02:19 PM
This sounds like only a tactic on VERY low difficulty levels.

A cautious AI about to attack is not going to give into tribute except for maybe chieftain and below? The only other situation where this would work is maybe if you have double their power...

Peluin
Apr 07, 2008, 02:43 PM
I don't remember the exact details but I once experienced something very strange.

In one of those occasional games where you get too distracted to build military, I noticed that Hannibal had brought an intimidatingly-large SoD into one of his towns on my borders. Fearing the inevitable, I desperately looked for a way to at least buy myself some time. I probably tried the "10 turns for a gold" stunt, but I don't recall if it worked. I do recall that I signed open borders with him, where we had not had OB before. For the next 20-30 turns, his SoD did laps between his border town and my closest city. It was the strangest thing, like he had targeted that city of mine as an objective, but only knew how to declare war by entering my territory without OB. I don't actually remember how it ended either, unfortunately.

That was a couple patches ago now, the issue may not exist any more, whatever it was!

BalbanesBeoulve
Apr 07, 2008, 02:53 PM
Unless he was displaying "we have enough on our hands" he wasn't necessarily planning on attacking you. Militaristic Civs will build big stacks of units even in peace time and they'll just pick a random city to station them in. And the AI definitely knows how to dow you even if you have open borders.

obsolete
Apr 07, 2008, 03:04 PM
False.

They will give you tribute if your power is greater than theirs and they're afraid of you.

Then the manual is wrong.

p. 7

Also (for all leaders) demand tribute or give help at or below cautious will be refused.

TheMeInTeam
Apr 07, 2008, 03:05 PM
This sounds like only a tactic on VERY low difficulty levels.

A cautious AI about to attack is not going to give into tribute except for maybe chieftain and below? The only other situation where this would work is maybe if you have double their power...

I don't know if you consider Monarch low, but I guarantee it has utility there. Typically in scenarios where your total power rating is higher, but some nut job AI is intent on attacking you or blindsiding you.

It's also quite good if you are afraid someone will be bribed into a gank on you. If you do this, that person won't be bribable for 10 turns, and that can be huge.

Kesshi
Apr 07, 2008, 03:09 PM
danieldaniel,

I remember someone mentioning something like this that involved map trading a long time ago. If I recall correctly, asking for their world map or trading yours for theirs would force the X turns of peace. This was a long time ago so I may be wrong.

BalbanesBeoulve
Apr 07, 2008, 03:30 PM
Then the manual is wrong.

The manual is wrong about a lot of things.

I see the same phrase in the pdf reference sheet. Is that what you're talking about? Anyway just test it out for yourself. Pull up a game where someone is annoyed or furious at you but you have an overwhelming power advantage. They'll cave in. I have a save from my last game where an annoyed elizabeth will give me some gold per turn that i can post if you want.

danieldaniel
Apr 07, 2008, 03:38 PM
This sounds like only a tactic on VERY low difficulty levels.

A cautious AI about to attack is not going to give into tribute except for maybe chieftain and below? The only other situation where this would work is maybe if you have double their power...

I've playing immortal lately and it seems to work there. I don't think that's a VERY low difficulty level . I don't know how does his power has to be for him to accept to pay, that's what I'd like to find out.

I remember someone mentioning something like this that involved map trading a long time ago. If I recall correctly, asking for their world map or trading yours for theirs would force the X turns of peace. This was a long time ago so I may be wrong.

Yes, any thing they give you for free starts a peace treaty. Maps, tech, money. I'm sure people have been using this for a long time.

obsolete
Apr 07, 2008, 05:12 PM
Guys, asking for a gift is a totally different thing from demanding one. If an AI is about to declare war on you as in the opening post, making a demand isn't going to help. Now, asking for a gift COULD, but it is not going to work on cautious or below.

Endure
Apr 07, 2008, 06:20 PM
Then the manual is wrong.

It must be.

I demand stuff from time to time when my power rating is towering over-weaker civs that I plan on crushing sooner or later (going for dom/conquest wins) and even though their annoyed/furious, they cave most of the time. They almost always cave in to gold demands...techs are iffy depending on how many civs have the tech and how big of difference our power rating is.

Yeh I get dinged with a -1 "you made an arrogant demand" but who cares, I'm playing on crushing them on my way to victory anyways.

I have never tried asking for gifts and/or demanding things to prevent an incoming AI attack though. Will try it next time I see a SoD coming my way in a war I don't want to fight yet though.

TheMeInTeam
Apr 07, 2008, 07:07 PM
Guys, asking for a gift is a totally different thing from demanding one. If an AI is about to declare war on you as in the opening post, making a demand isn't going to help. Now, asking for a gift COULD, but it is not going to work on cautious or below.

Demands will even work on furious if your power rating is much higher (almost never techs, but 100-300 gold). Usually, those kinds of civs won't declare on you, unless they're bribed. If they cave, they can't be.

This also goes for times when you have cathy as a "friend", and so does your enemy (or any easily bribed warmonger at pleased). If you make the demand/request early and they accept (which isn't too uncommon at friendly, and has some instances where it's viable at cautious/below), you have 10 turns of guaranteed peace from that civ. That's often enough to thoroughly cripple a target.

It's very situational I admit, but just like anything else that's situational people will see times where minding it might help them, and possibly help them considerably.

Edit: Monty with a SoD will almost always tell you to shove it, though :p.

Raoh
Apr 08, 2008, 01:15 AM
Hi there, LTLFTP myself.
Does the trick work in the other way ? Can you buy 10 turns peace with 1 GP ?

danieldaniel
Apr 08, 2008, 01:25 AM
Guys, asking for a gift is a totally different thing from demanding one. If an AI is about to declare war on you as in the opening post, making a demand isn't going to help. Now, asking for a gift COULD, but it is not going to work on cautious or below.

As far as I know, asking for a gift on cautious or below is not going work because you simply can’t do it. Anything you ask for free on cautious or below is automatically a tribute demand. Reversely you can not ask for tribute on pleased or higher, at that level you ask for gifts. So they are basically the same, the only differences being the other leader’s attitude towards you and the diplo penalty you get with demands.

And it works sometimes, I have had furious AI’s attacks thwarted using this tactic. I have tested it by reloading to check if they declare when I don’t use the trick, and they do.

I’m not saying it’s always going work and it probably won’t save you from a very strong opponent, it’s just a small trick, or a small exploit if you want, but it can work.

shawy89
Apr 08, 2008, 08:41 AM
Something weird happened to me yesterday,
playin on Prince as Mansa, had 5 vassal and nearing domination, but the other continent had Justinian and Charmelagne who had a defensive pact. i wanted to declare war on one of them but not both!
power ratings were:
1) Justinian
2) Me
3) Charmelagne

i then had an idea which i thot was genius!! i demanded 230 gold from Charmelagne, which he accepted, thus giving us 10 turns of peace. i then moved my huge fleet of ships into Byzantine sea and declared war (this was 2 turns after the demand) then a message say "10 turn peace treaty deal cancelled"!!
How is that fair!?
i took 3 of his cities then sued both of them for peace and won a diplomatic anyway, but i thot my idea was great and SHOULD have worked IMO !!