View Full Version : Trying to step up to Noble


Augustgrad
May 18, 2008, 04:19 PM
I was introduced to Civ with the 3rd installment, and never was too good at it but bad habits from it have transfered to how I play 4 I guess. I can usually win on Warlord and am wanting to step up to Noble and win consistently(Ive managed one win on it already). I think my problem is mistakes with some of the basics. Im looking for a set of rules for what my first production should be, maybe a few set tech paths, and some rules of thumbs perhaps for dealing with other Civs. Ive read through about 20 pages of the condensed tips for beginners and it helped some. I usually pull off Domination wins but am looking to try something new.

Whats a good rule of thumb for deciding between cottage/farm? The 'city must work for x to grow' tags really annoy me. Should I not worry about that? Whats the rule on when I should be building my first settler?

If its Civ dependent, then could I get a few set build orders/tech paths for Frederick of the Germans, Elizabeth of the French and Qin of the Chinese.

Thanks for any help.

siggboy
May 18, 2008, 06:13 PM
Only cottages that are worked by the city can grow (into hamlet, villages, towns). If you open the city screen you see circles around the tiles that are currently being worked. You can adjust this by hand to make sure that a city always works as many of its cottages as possible. You can also have the city governor assign it automatically for you.

A city can never work more tiles than there are citizen available. So, a size 5 city won't be able to work more than 5 cottages. Therefore it doesn't make sense to build 10 cottages around such a city, because it will be quite a while until they can all be worked. Of course you can build cottages in advance if your workers don't have anything better to do.

Place your cities in locations where they have access to at least one food bonus tile (such as pigs, corn or sea food etc.). That will provide you with extra food in that city, so you can work cottages (or mines, if you want production) and still have the city grow quickly. Bonus food is very important, all of your cities should have access to a food resource (or flood plains).

Your first build should be a worker, unless you start with fishing and have seafood in the starting location, then a work boat is a good first build. After the worker, let the city grow by building warriors (or scouts) until just before it would grow into unhappiness. Then build more workers and settlers to claim land.

When you have a few cities established you can start to build military and conquer a neighbour. Obviously you need access to some resources for that (copper and/or horses for the early wars).

Your early research follows naturally from the above. Research Hunting/Agriculture/Animal Husbandry/Fishing first, depending on your starting location and what resources you get there. Then go for Mining/Bronze Working so you can use Slavery, chop forests and reveal Copper.

The very early game does not differ much for most leaders. Some have early unique units that you should target, but if that's not the case the openings are very similar to eachother. Financial leaders get 3 commerce out of a cottage next to a river right away, so early Pottery is a must there. Industrious leaders can build wonders twice as fast so there you should focus on building wonders. And so on. Look at what your leader's traits, unique units and buildings are and plan accordingly.

Noble is still a very easy difficulty, so as soon as you get the basics right most of your games should be rather effortless. There is also a Noble's Club series of games on these boards that you might want to follow.

Sisiutil has written a great strategy guide for beginners that you should read.

Elizabeth is English, not French, by the way ;-).

Bleys
May 18, 2008, 06:59 PM
I agree with sig, good tips there, and Sisiutils Guides are really strong, they helped me a ton early on. Heck, I am of the opinion that just reading these boards on a fairly regular basis is worth at LEAST a level or two in "difficulty".

In a shameless plug of one of my pet projects, I suggest you come and check out the Nobles Club (link is in my sig). There, we try to set up games so that certain strategies are a bit "easier" to play, like Hannibal on a water map, Freddy for an SE type game, Kublai Khan for a Warmonger style, etc.

In the Nobles Club, we encourage questions, and there, you will find many others in the same boat, trying to break that hump over the lower levels into Prince, which most consider the first "more advanced" level. It can REALLY help to play a common game, and look at how others played, what choices they made with regard to techs, buildings, city placements, etc, and see how it worked out for them. It gets easier to figure out what your doing that is strategically weak.

The Kublai Khan game was one of the best rounds we had. That game has a lot of elements that can be tricky to learn, a close AI with PRO trait, a strong religious leader on the opposite side of the map, the resource for your UU not RIGHT next to you, and Toku, one of the most difficult AIs to deal with at any level. The first post of the Bullpen thread in my link contains links to all our games.

Another good series is the Lonely Hearts Club. That series focuses on isolated starts, so you are pretty much totally on your own as far as teching (no trading until quite late, usually), building, etc. It has REALLY strengthened my game.

BTW, Welcome to the Civ Fanatics Forums! Coming here and reading is the best step you will make trying to figure out this very very complicated game. All levels of players are welcome, and no questions are too dumb to ask! You will get better by osmosis, trust me!

Gliese 581
May 18, 2008, 07:33 PM
Whats a good rule of thumb for deciding between cottage/farm? The 'city must work for x to grow' tags really annoy me. Should I not worry about that? Whats the rule on when I should be building my first settler?

If its Civ dependent, then could I get a few set build orders/tech paths for Frederick of the Germans, Elizabeth of the French and Qin of the Chinese.

Thanks for any help.

In the early game you need growth and production so you shouldn't be working cottages then. One exception can be cottaging flood plains, especially with a financial leader, as they still provide a good food output but I still wouldn't recommend it unless you've also got some food-resources hooked up.
Basically cottages become more important as time goes on. Generally you'll be expanding horizontally, meaning founding new cities and/or capturing cities from close civs. When you've aquired more happiness resources, buildings and civics and your cities start to accumulate bigger populations and grow vertically, cottages become more worthwhile.

About first settler, try this:
You should use your initial scout/warrior to move in expanding circles around your capital, not leaving gaps of unexplored lands or go off in a single direction. Always move him on terrain that gives defensive bonuses if possible and utilize hills for added visibility, especially forrested hills that give the best protection.

In your capital, build a worker, research the worker techs necessary for improving the lands around your settler. If you have sea resources you can build 1-2 workboats first or build a scout/warrior and tech fishing, build a workboat and then a worker.
After your worker has finished build two warriors while growing your capital to size 4, the first should be sent to fogbust as much as possible between your capital and the location you want your first expansion to be in.
Fortify the second worker in your capital or if you need more fogbusting you can send him just a tile or two outside your cultural borders to help the first warrior but keep him close.
When you can whip your settler for 2 pops, revolt to slavery and do it.
One caution: if you execute this very fast on lower levels I think you might actually still have animals around, some of them can move two spaces so beware that your settler is not sniped on his way to the expansion. Generally you should be safe as long as you're fogbusting the necessary area with your warriors.

If you can't aquire copper and/or horses with your capital or first expansion, tech archery while you build the warriors and settler and build a couple of archers after the settler while growing back to size 4-5. Then build another worker or two and repeat process for two more cities or so.

Gliese 581
May 19, 2008, 01:06 AM
After reading through what I wrote in a somewhat tired state I realized I should probably clarify a few things. First of all, I consider Bronze Working a worker tech.
What you do is you try to figure out a way to get some food and then make sure you have Mining+BW for hammers. If you build a couple of workboats, you don't have to improve that wheat right away, it's more important to get Mining and BW online. Similarly, if you have a corn to work, you don't have to get workboats also straight away, choose one and get the other only after you've aquired Mining and/or BW.
The exception is an all forest start with no good food resource (maybe just a cow). For these starts you can go straight to BW and just use chopping for all your production.
In any case the best way to get your expansion started quickly is to chop some forests and to whip your settlers. Sometimes though if you only have one good food source (4+), it can be better to use some restraint with the whip.
Don't build more than two workboats before your initial expansion. Relying on the whip you get a faster production and you'll not be able to use more than two food resources anyhow to grow back or your city will not have time to lose the unhappiness from your whipping. This is also the reason you should always whip at least 2 pop. The only exception is in the very beginning, for example if your capital grows to size 2 before you've finished a workboat or worker and you already have BW.