Doin some playtestin for your mod, I saw the only leader with traits was Corazin Santiago. Be nice if those were there. Cuz, as it is, Spartans have a big advantage that everybody else lacks.

Also, no civ had any UUs. I think jus one per civ would be good. It could be somethin based off of the civ leader's traits.

I also noticed that the different units like gun, laser, cannon, etc. have the same graphics for the most part. It seemed to me that only the Hovercraft had different graphics. Idk bout you but I find that borin.

These are jus my thoughts. Please comment and add your own thoughts. Modders of Planetfall, please explain how these things are goin to work. Thanks.

All bases start with a faction-specific free building (Governor's Office) which gives some different benefits. But the faction effects are basically placeholders - not much thought has been put into them yet.

Regarding unit graphics - we don't have anyone interested in taking a lead in creating unit graphics.

Ok. Bout graphics, if I knew how to do em, I would. But I don't. :(

This thread looks to be the closest thing to what I noticed.

I know there's cityset graphics outthere for the Morgans and the Spartans, but they don't appear ingame and a quick scan showed me no xml for them either. Were you aware of these or don't you want them to include for some reason?
Also, some of the citybuildings (the single models of the cityset nifs) which are used (gaians, university, UN,...) look too big for their nodes, in other words their scaling is too big. They jumble up with other buildings. The scale especially looks big in comparison with unit scaling because those seems to have been decreased in size.
Spacing the buildings out and creating empty plots of them has the effect that almost no unique faction buildings shows in a cityplot once a number of facilities have been constructed.

Is all (of some of) this intended, or is it something that is in the pipeline for fixing somewhere in the future? In case of the latter, I could give a try on the scaling/distribution of the cityset graphics. :)

I know there's cityset graphics outthere for the Morgans and the Spartans, but they don't appear ingame and a quick scan showed me no xml for them either. Were you aware of these or don't you want them to include for some reason?

Those cityset graphics are in fact included in the Planetfall art files. Unfortunately there is/was no one around with the skills and interest to make them work for Planetfall.

Is all (of some of) this intended, or is it something that is in the pipeline for fixing somewhere in the future? In case of the latter, I could give a try on the scaling/distribution of the cityset graphics. :)

I don't understand at all how city graphics work. Those currently in the game have been put in by Rubin. Perhaps you can contact him to know more about the reasons why things look how they look now.

IIRC there's an issue where facilities take up space even though they have empty.nif defined as their graphic. I'm not sure if that's what you're referring to.

In any case, all help with city graphics is of course appreciated. :goodjob:

This thread looks to be the closest thing to what I noticed.

I know there's cityset graphics outthere for the Morgans and the Spartans, but they don't appear ingame and a quick scan showed me no xml for them either. Were you aware of these or don't you want them to include for some reason?
Also, some of the citybuildings (the single models of the cityset nifs) which are used (gaians, university, UN,...) look too big for their nodes, in other words their scaling is too big. They jumble up with other buildings. The scale especially looks big in comparison with unit scaling because those seems to have been decreased in size.
Spacing the buildings out and creating empty plots of them has the effect that almost no unique faction buildings shows in a cityplot once a number of facilities have been constructed.

Is all (of some of) this intended, or is it something that is in the pipeline for fixing somewhere in the future? In case of the latter, I could give a try on the scaling/distribution of the cityset graphics. :)

The Morganites and the Spartans have deliberately been left out. It should be fairly easy to implement the xml, though (without any significant tweaking to the node choices).

The node scaling is intended, but may be a poor decision (there are almost no small (1x1/1x2/etc.) nodes). Building scaling can be, if I recall correctly, adjusted independently--and I agree that they may appear too big. I recall the choice of overlapping as a difficult one due to the reduced amount of buildings and increased node size, but I am not sure if simply scaling down the buildings would produce pleasing results.

The main issue with the default Civ4 city layout is the mass of tiny "houses". However, I believe the cityset .nifs can be used with the default layout.

Generally, the issues you raise are known and, for the most part, intended (if a choice between two evils counts). I believe different factions can have different layouts, hence if, for example, the Peacekeeper layout looks nice, you can keep it and just change those layouts that look awful (they are all using the same layout template with minor tweaks).

The Morganites and the Spartans have deliberately been left out.

Woops. See, I told you my knowledge of the graphical matters is lacking... :mischief:

I've always thought this (http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=4590) might make a great cityset for the Morganites. Very Blade Runner-esque.

It uses a modified ground though. all_mod_lots. Is it possible to use more than one different city ground in the game?

I've always thought this (http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=4590) might make a great cityset for the Morganites. Very Blade Runner-esque.

I know that file. Unfortunately, there's missing textures on the more futuristic buildings in it.

It uses a modified ground though. all_mod_lots. Is it possible to use more than one different city ground in the game?

If you work with era's, you can have different city grounds ingame by a bit of xml work. You don't even need to use a different cityset to achieve this.


Overall, the bigger scaled city buildings use more or less the slots usually taken by city facilities. It might be better to use some (the bigger ones) city buildings as a more or less unique city facility for the factions. You have the best of both worlds then: faction-specific facility art, and the small stuff can still be used as city fillers. It would solve part of the lack in facility art.

I know that file. Unfortunately, there's missing textures on the more futuristic buildings in it.

Do those buildings have textures on the screenshot? Who knows GarretSidzaka forgot to put all the files in the zip, and he still has them lying around.

If you work with era's, you can have different city grounds ingame by a bit of xml work. You don't even need to use a different cityset to achieve this.

Awesome! I think it would be great to have a seperate era for each faction. Not only for base graphical reasons, but also for soundtrack: it would allow me to give a different opening song and base screen ambience to each faction.
Would you be willing to do that, make the LSystem files work with 12 eras for the factions (the SMAC/SMAX 14, minus the CyCon and Cult)?

Overall, the bigger scaled city buildings use more or less the slots usually taken by city facilities. It might be better to use some (the bigger ones) city buildings as a more or less unique city facility for the factions. You have the best of both worlds then: faction-specific facility art, and the small stuff can still be used as city fillers. It would solve part of the lack in facility art.

Ah yes, now you mention it, I think I suggested this myself in a distant past. I don't think anyone said it was impossible.
Every base already has a unique facility: a "Governor's Office", a different one for each faction. BUILDINGCLASS_FACTION in XML. So art can be tied to that.
Also AFAIK it's possible to have the same building have different art depending on the era. So I'm wondering, would it be possible to give all base facilities for which there is no special art, the same generic art, but have a different art for every faction/era?

Do those buildings have textures on the screenshot? Who knows GarretSidzaka forgot to put all the files in the zip, and he still has them lying around.

They have. You can ask him, but that file is quite old.

Awesome! I think it would be great to have a seperate era for each faction. Not only for base graphical reasons, but also for soundtrack: it would allow me to give a different opening song and base screen ambience to each faction.
Would you be willing to do that, make the LSystem files work with 12 eras for the factions (the SMAC/SMAX 14, minus the CyCon and Cult)?

I thing you have a little misunderstanding on how era's work. ;)
It's entirely possible to have a unique artstyle for each civ/faction you put in the game. It's quite another thing to put unique sound on them. It might be possible, haven't checked that.
Era's are the different ages in civ4, and to those is the ground art linked in civ4. Artstyles dictate the outlook of the city buildings/facilities, in combination with era's. You could say that era's are global, and artstyles local in programming terms.

Okay, I can make the LSystem file so that 12 factions/civs have each a different outlook, as long as the graphics are there. I know of 6 or 7 cityset graphics. Do you have the 5-6 others hidden somewhere? ;)

Ah yes, now you mention it, I think I suggested this myself in a distant past. I don't think anyone said it was impossible.
Every base already has a unique facility: a "Governor's Office", a different one for each faction. BUILDINGCLASS_FACTION in XML. So art can be tied to that.
Also AFAIK it's possible to have the same building have different art depending on the era. So I'm wondering, would it be possible to give all base facilities for which there is no special art, the same generic art, but have a different art for every faction/era?

Do I understand you correctly that you want for instance the recycling tanks facility (which is pretty generic in my book) have a different outlook for each faction/civ? Yes, that's easy as long as each faction has its own artstyle.
If you want facilities have a different outlook after certain techs are discovered, that's possible too, even in combination with artstyles. But you're talking about alot of graphics here. It's basically what I've done for the Ethnic Citystyles mod, and after over a year I still haven't found enough art to cover all possibilities for each artstyle -and era in the game.

Again, I think you're confusing artstyles with era's here. Best to give an example so I'm sure what you want/mean.

I thing you have a little misunderstanding on how era's work. ;)

No I don't. :p
It's possible to fire a python event right onGameStart which changes a civ's era to whatever you want. Thus each faction can have its own era.

But so it's possible to have the same building, eg the lighthouse, look different for each artstyle as well as for each era?? I didn't know that.

Regardless, for sound-related reasons it would be preferable for each faction to have its own era.

Okay, I can make the LSystem file so that 12 factions/civs have each a different outlook, as long as the graphics are there. I know of 6 or 7 cityset graphics. Do you have the 5-6 others hidden somewhere? ;)

I assumed it was possible to define a new era in XML, even if no faction made use of it yet. Not the case?

Again, I think you're confusing artstyles with era's here. Best to give an example so I'm sure what you want/mean.

Within a faction each base facility could look the same: the recycling tanks, the command center, the recreation commons... all the same. So while the more variety the merrier of course if available, one generic building art per faction would suffice. Thus only 12 buildingarts would be required.

No I don't. :p
It's possible to fire a python event right onGameStart which changes a civ's era to whatever you want. Thus each faction can have its own era.

AFAIK, era's are linked refered to in the technology xml. Does that mean you have to create different techtrees for each faction? ;)

But so it's possible to have the same building, eg the lighthouse, look different for each artstyle as well as for each era?? I didn't know that.

Regardless, for sound-related reasons it would be preferable for each faction to have its own era.

Well, since it's python, I assume that's best handled in your capable hands. :p

I assumed it was possible to define a new era in XML, even if no faction made use of it yet. Not the case?

Oh, it's of course possible. It's only hard a bit harder to check for errors since there's no art for it yet, unless I use a properly renamed cityset niffile.

Within a faction each base facility could look the same: the recycling tanks, the command center, the recreation commons... all the same. So while the more variety the merrier of course if available, one generic building art per faction would suffice. Thus only 12 buildingarts would be required.

Ah, now I understand. Whatever the facility within a faction, they use the same graphic file. Quite simple. It does defeat the purpose of graphics though. A player can't determine from simply looking at his bases which facilities are already constructed. Unless you plan to put different textures on all these facilities in a later stage to determine their purpose of course.

AFAIK, era's are linked refered to in the technology xml. Does that mean you have to create different techtrees for each faction? ;)

Nope. Don't worry. It's in my capable hands.

Well, since it's python, I assume that's best handled in your capable hands. :p

Unfortunately I can't do the LSystem. :(

Ah, now I understand. Whatever the facility within a faction, they use the same graphic file. Quite simple. It does defeat the purpose of graphics though. A player can't determine from simply looking at his bases which facilities are already constructed. Unless you plan to put different textures on all these facilities in a later stage to determine their purpose of course.

The purpose would be to avoid empty spaces currently created by using empty.nif for some facilities.
Besides, the concern is academical. As you said yourself in your previous post, there's no art available for all the base facilities anyway. And I have no idea how many of the SMAC facilities could be graphically represented in a unique way. For some base facilities (eg Perimeter Defenses, Aerospace Complex) it's important to see and distinguish them on the map. For the others, if graphics are available, sure let's use them, but if none are available, no disaster, there's the generic building art.

Okay, a status report:

The following screenshots are from the University faction with the HQ and the Governor's Office switched to proper graphics (as I found them in the cities folder).

Some stats:

I used the LINMAP method of depicting cities in the GlobalDefinesAlt.xml file, and halved the values I found in there. In conjunction, In the Civ4CityLSystem.xml file I linked 4 of the 9 references I made for leafnode 1x1 buildings to the empty .nif spot of the University_cityset.nif. For the rest I only used 2x1 and 1x2 sized leafnodes. The general idea is to reserve the 4 2x2 buildings as art for facilities.
First screenshot: size 1
Second screenshot: size 2
Third screenshot: size 20

O yes, and there are no facilities whatsoever except the Office and HQ, so normally you'll be seeing less city buildings in the last screenshot.

How does it look to you? Spaced out enough? Not too many buildings?

I used the LINMAP method of depicting cities in the GlobalDefinesAlt.xml file, and halved the values I found in there. In conjunction, In the Civ4CityLSystem.xml file I linked 4 of the 9 references I made for leafnode 1x1 buildings to the empty .nif spot of the University_cityset.nif. For the rest I only used 2x1 and 1x2 sized leafnodes. The general idea is to reserve the 4 2x2 buildings as art for facilities.

Err... you lost me in the first sentence. :scared:

How does it look to you? Spaced out enough? Not too many buildings?

Well it looks great to me! I kinda like having lots of tiny buildings in a city. It gives the impression it is in fact an actual city, instead of just a couple of buildings placed together.

It doesn't look to me that there are more tiny buildings in that screenshot than there usually are in vanilla civ cities anyway. Or am I mistaken here?


I don't understand what you're doing, but is there anything I can do to in the non-LSystem XML to help you?

teh texture are in there :) i just checked :)

I agree with Maniac: looks fine!:thumbsup:

Err... you lost me in the first sentence. :scared:

:lol:
I'll explain to you next week in the chalet if you want to. ;)

Well it looks great to me! I kinda like having lots of tiny buildings in a city. It gives the impression it is in fact an actual city, instead of just a couple of buildings placed together.

It doesn't look to me that there are more tiny buildings in that screenshot than there usually are in vanilla civ cities anyway. Or am I mistaken here?

Okay. I just didn't know how close you wanted to adhere to Rubin's view of showing bases.
There should be less tiny buildings visible then usual in Civ4. To me it looks that way.

I don't understand what you're doing, but is there anything I can do to in the non-LSystem XML to help you?

You could prepare the ErasInfos.xml for 12 factions, and tell me if you just add new ones above (renamed) existing ones or replace the whole thing with new era's. ;)
O yes, a question about the HQ. Are its properties faction-specific too, or will it give the same things to all factions?

On the topic of Era's: if you created 25 era's, I could swing it that all factions start with the same prefab kind-of-style cityset (think the prefab hutches the fieldlabs are now using). After say the first tier of techs, the faction-specific citysets start to appear in a second era (this is where the first batch of 12 era's after the first comes for) and finally after another tier of techs the final 12 era's show each faction in their full glory (provided they all *have* a cityset of course ;) ).

Another thing: I have now for the University faction linked most facilities I could find in the first part of the CIV4ArtDefines_Building.xml file to one of the four graphic models I reserved for facilities. Problem is, in the civipedia of the mod I can see there are quite a bit more facilities not refered to, and those are a bit hidden in the ordinary civ4 facilities. Could you delete all the entries in that file which are not necessary? Would help me to see what's in the mod and what's not. I'm particularly doubtfull about facilities with similar names like the factory and hydro plant. And while I'm at it, any reason why a HQ and Governor's Office should be together in the first base? I've seen you created seperate entries for the HQ for each faction, so I reckon it should be possible to give each HQ the same properties as each faction GO and python the GO away from a base which contains a HQ. ;)

Okay, attached is the altered files (graphic and xml) I worked with, and a screenshot showing you a bit of what I've done. You can do a simple drag and drop on the folder into a test version of the mod on your computer. Allow overwriting when asked. I also included the unaltered xml files just in case you want a backup.

Let me know when you downloaded the .rar file, I'll remove it from my attachment space then.

Some quick comments. More later.

Okay. I just didn't know how close you wanted to adhere to Rubin's view of showing bases.

I'm not really sure what Rubin's view on bases is, that is if the absence of tiny buildings is intentional or not.
For instance here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=6501835&postcount=636) he says "I could not avoid to change the models to include empty space, because otherwise the Peacekeeper texture would mess with the University texture (I fixed a few domes as well)." Does the need for "empty space" for some reason have to do with the absence of tiny buildings? I haven't got a clue. As usual, I don't have a clue what people are talking about when discussing citysets.

You could prepare the ErasInfos.xml for 12 factions, and tell me if you just add new ones above (renamed) existing ones or replace the whole thing with new era's. ;)

I'll release a new patch today or tomorrow. :)
I figured I'd just add new eras. I assume removing all references to the old ones would be more work than just leaving them in place. Or am I wrong in this regard? In any case, the "ancient" era definitely needs to stay as that's where all techs belong to.

On the topic of Era's: if you created 25 era's, I could swing it that all factions start with the same prefab kind-of-style cityset (think the prefab hutches the fieldlabs are now using). After say the first tier of techs, the faction-specific citysets start to appear in a second era (this is where the first batch of 12 era's after the first comes for) and finally after another tier of techs the final 12 era's show each faction in their full glory (provided they all *have* a cityset of course ;) ).

Hmm, that could be definitely cool. I always found it a little ridiculous for instance the first thing the Peacekeepers built after Planetfall was a Taj Mahal lookalike. Talk about white elephant projects... I guess the Greenhouse nif could also be used for early city looks.Anything else?
Plus I was thinking of making two eras for technology anyway. That way the player could start a game with the Pirates and Angels in the second era. Though I'm not sure how yet if that could work. Link for background reference. (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=7236335&postcount=86)

I'm not sure how a second set of twelve eras would work though. Is there enough art for this?? :confused: Besides, as the game progresses and bases become bigger, I guess bases become more impressive looking automatically anyway.

Another thing: I have now for the University faction linked most facilities I could find in the first part of the CIV4ArtDefines_Building.xml file to one of the four graphic models I reserved for facilities. Problem is, in the civipedia of the mod I can see there are quite a bit more facilities not refered to, and those are a bit hidden in the ordinary civ4 facilities. Could you delete all the entries in that file which are not necessary? Would help me to see what's in the mod and what's not. I'm particularly doubtfull about facilities with similar names like the factory and hydro plant.

I had a look. The only base facilities which are definitely not needed and I should remove are the "Nerve Staplers" and the Soil Enricher". Probably the "Biosphere" as well, though I might still use that name. There are a whole bunch of other unused base facilities in the XML files. They have as their tech prereq TECH_NEVER. Those I *might* use after a tech tree review, but I'm not entirely sure yet.

It's the nature of modding however that content gets added, balanced or remove all the time, including some facilities (though the ones you already put in LSystem are an assured value of course). Therefore an LSystem which doesn't require me calling on you every time I add a base facility would be preferable of course.

So I'm wondering, if I add a new facility, can I just eg use LSYSTEM_CRECHE for that facility as well, and will that work correctly?
The way you added building LSystems to the file kinda looks understandable to me in fact. Who knows, mimicking what you've done, who knows I might be able to add a new facility to the LSystem file myself. :eek:

And while I'm at it, any reason why a HQ and Governor's Office should be together in the first base? I've seen you created seperate entries for the HQ for each faction, so I reckon it should be possible to give each HQ the same properties as each faction GO and python the GO away from a base which contains a HQ. ;)

It's the HQ which adds the GO to all bases as a free building, including the capital. Trying to do the same thing in python, I'd probably have to account for all kinds of special situations like bases being captured, the GO being able to be destroyed by spy missions etc. I'd like to avoid that if possible. :scared:

But why do you want the GO away in the capital? If you don't want two big buildings in the capital, perhaps the HQ could be turned into some tiny building??

O yes, a question about the HQ. Are its properties faction-specific too, or will it give the same things to all factions?

All effects currently given by the faction-specific HQs could be given to the GO as well. Well, with one exception. I heard that the city defense bonus given by Chichen Itza can never be removed by bombardment. Unlike city defense boni given by local buildings of course. So I figured for the Hive it would fit best if their defense bonus was given globally by the Headquarters building. Kinda hard to break underground bases by surface bombardment.

Okay, attached is the altered files (graphic and xml) I worked with, and a screenshot showing you a bit of what I've done. You can do a simple drag and drop on the folder into a test version of the mod on your computer. Allow overwriting when asked. I also included the unaltered xml files just in case you want a backup.

Thanks! I have downloaded it but not yet tested in-game.
It looks awesome though on the screenies. And your screenshot includes University buildings I have never seen before. :hmm: Are there others which haven't been shown on the screenshots in this thread yet?

Btw, where did you get the satellite from??

Some quick comments. More later.
I'm not really sure what Rubin's view on bases is, that is if the absence of tiny buildings is intentional or not.
For instance here (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=6501835&postcount=636) he says "I could not avoid to change the models to include empty space, because otherwise the Peacekeeper texture would mess with the University texture (I fixed a few domes as well)." Does the need for "empty space" for some reason have to do with the absence of tiny buildings? I haven't got a clue. As usual, I don't have a clue what people are talking about when discussing citysets.

Well, having open-spaced bases is what I remember from the last discussion with Rubin I participated in on this subject. If you're happy with it I'll just leave it as is and copy the xml for the other factions.

I'll release a new patch today or tomorrow. :)

With my changes, I hope? ;) Btw, it doesn't alter gameplay in any way, it's just graphical.

I figured I'd just add new eras. I assume removing all references to the old ones would be more work than just leaving them in place. Or am I wrong in this regard? In any case, the "ancient" era definitely needs to stay as that's where all techs belong to.

Hmm, that could be definitely cool. I always found it a little ridiculous for instance the first thing the Peacekeepers built after Planetfall was a Taj Mahal lookalike. Talk about white elephant projects... I guess the Greenhouse nif could also be used for early city looks.Anything else?
Plus I was thinking of making two eras for technology anyway. That way the player could start a game with the Pirates and Angels in the second era. Though I'm not sure how yet if that could work. Link for background reference. (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=7236335&postcount=86)

I'm not sure how a second set of twelve eras would work though. Is there enough art for this?? :confused: Besides, as the game progresses and bases become bigger, I guess bases become more impressive looking automatically anyway.

Okay. So you need the Ancient era (you know you can rename it with the second line of the paragraph, don't you?), 12 era's after that, one for each faction, and I suppose one more era (future era at present) for the last future tech of the techtree. The second set of 12 era's would be for a graphic transition from prefab stuff to faction-specific art. But that's not really necessary and avoiding it makes things simplier for the python call to new era for each civ you plan on. As on your Angels/Pirates/... idea, there's the colony code that lets new civs start with the agreement of the "home" civ. Perhaps this code is transfereble to a non-voluntary situation.

I had a look. The only base facilities which are definitely not needed and I should remove are the "Nerve Staplers" and the Soil Enricher". Probably the "Biosphere" as well, though I might still use that name. There are a whole bunch of other unused base facilities in the XML files. They have as their tech prereq TECH_NEVER. Those I *might* use after a tech tree review, but I'm not entirely sure yet.

It's the nature of modding however that content gets added, balanced or remove all the time, including some facilities (though the ones you already put in LSystem are an assured value of course). Therefore an LSystem which doesn't require me calling on you every time I add a base facility would be preferable of course.

So I'm wondering, if I add a new facility, can I just eg use LSYSTEM_CRECHE for that facility as well, and will that work correctly?
The way you added building LSystems to the file kinda looks understandable to me in fact. Who knows, mimicking what you've done, who knows I might be able to add a new facility to the LSystem file myself. :eek:

I noticed quite a few "Tech_Never" entries in the BuildingsInfos. Okay, then I only link up art to the ones with a tech prerequisite.
For adding new art to new facilities, it's best if you copy a previous entry in the CIV4ArtDefines_Building file, and give a similar name to the Lsystem tag as in the type tag after the initial keyword (ART_DEF_BUILDING_ and LSYSTEM_). Using this system frees the art from being restricted a single size on the game screen (ie the 3x2 size of the HQ). The only thing you need to do then is make an entry in Civ4CityLSystem file to the proper building leafnode (do a search for "LEAF [number]x[number] BUILDINGS" in this file), and there you have your art, hopefully in a leaf slot with the proper size (meaning it doesn't crop in adjacent facilities/city buildings ;) ).

It's the HQ which adds the GO to all bases as a free building, including the capital. Trying to do the same thing in python, I'd probably have to account for all kinds of special situations like bases being captured, the GO being able to be destroyed by spy missions etc. I'd like to avoid that if possible. :scared:

But why do you want the GO away in the capital? If you don't want two big buildings in the capital, perhaps the HQ could be turned into some tiny building??

Your call. I just thought it a bit inefficient, that's all.

All effects currently given by the faction-specific HQs could be given to the GO as well. Well, with one exception. I heard that the city defense bonus given by Chichen Itza can never be removed by bombardment. Unlike city defense boni given by local buildings of course. So I figured for the Hive it would fit best if their defense bonus was given globally by the Headquarters building. Kinda hard to break underground bases by surface bombardment.

Okay, this means I need to relink the HQ art. Now I linked it to the main HQ xml entry because I couldn't see any differences between the faction HQ's. But if you indeed plan to give specific properties to some of the HQ...

Thanks! I have downloaded it but not yet tested in-game.
It looks awesome though on the screenies. And your screenshot includes University buildings I have never seen before. :hmm: Are there others which haven't been shown on the screenshots in this thread yet?

Don't you have the GameBryo Scene Viewer installed? You can open niffiles with it when you put a copy of the boundshape file in the same location as a niffile. Together with the NifSkope viewer you have all the tools for doing some basic tinkering with art files.
As on testing, know that I linked the modern harbor art to the Naval Yard and a rusty wall from the FuryRoad mod to Perimeter Defense. Those still need to be tinkered with, especially the PD since it shows as red lines for some reason in Planetfall.

Btw, where did you get the satellite from??

Oh, that's the ISS model that can be found in the CFC database. I'm keeping more or les tabs of what's been uploaded for civ4. For you knowledge, there's also a "Rod's from God's" satellite model in it that could be used as a sort of Orbital Defense Satellite IF you ever found a XML/Python/SDK way to make it destroy certain base facilities like Solar Power Transmitters. :D

After linking art to the facilities for the University, I plan to link proper art to those farms/settlements and such in the PlotLSystem file. Once a faction is complete there's a base for copying all the stuff to other factions at will. ;)

Should I finish the expansion faction city sets that I started over a year ago?

And do you have a list of facilities? (I have your PM still Maniac so no need to reiterate those. ;))

I have a palace for Santiago started, do you need a 2nd HQ as well?

Well, having open-spaced bases is what I remember from the last discussion with Rubin I participated in on this subject. If you're happy with it I'll just leave it as is and copy the xml for the other factions.

You mean have tiny buildings for all factions right? :king:

Don't you have the GameBryo Scene Viewer installed?

GameBryo Scene Viewer? Never heard of it. Google doesn't mention anything. There's a certain "Asset Viewer" here (http://emergent.net/en/Products/Gamebryo/Tools/Asset-Viewer/), but I don't see a download link. I guess that's not it. Do you have a download link?

Oh, that's the ISS model that can be found in the CFC database.

I found the download link. It says it has some 4000 vertices. :eek: AFAIK that's four times the usual number. What's causing all that? Would merging those solar panels together reduce the count significantly??

there's also a "Rod's from God's" satellite model in it that could be used as a sort of Orbital Defense Satellite

Do you have a link to that? "Rod's from God's" didn't give me any search results. :o

After linking art to the facilities for the University, I plan to link proper art to those farms/settlements and such in the PlotLSystem file. Once a faction is complete there's a base for copying all the stuff to other factions at will. ;)

W00 cool.

For the coming patch I've changed the "land worked" graphic to a futuristic woodelf improvement, but I assume it would be better to use one of the tiny faction graphics/domes as well for that. Would you want to do that?

I figured I'd add some questions to the end of this post.

1) Are the files under Art/cities in your download different/the same from the ones in the Art PAK file? In other words, can I safely exclude them from the patch?

2) In a distant past, to make the windmills use the modern instead of ancient graphics, you suggested simply copying the modern windmill graphics into the folder of the ancient windmill graphics. But I would of course like to avoid needlessly including files in the download, to keep the size down. So I'm wondering, do you know these days how to edit PlotL so that the windmill uses the modern windmill graphics without needing to include extra files in the mod? Also, the sea windmill currently uses the ancient windmill graphics, despite linking to the same artdefine as the land windmill. :(

3) GarretSidzaka says all necessary textures for the potential Morganic cityset are included. You say some are missing. This is a problematic difference of opinion of course. :hmm: Can you say the textures of which buildings exactly are missing?

Should I finish the expansion faction city sets that I started over a year ago?

Would be cool! Which ones were you working on? I'd say Pirates would be most useful right now.

And do you have a list of facilities? (I have your PM still Maniac so no need to reiterate those. ;))

Do you mean a full list of all facilities in the game?

I guess the military facilities would be most important. Perimeter Defense, Naval Yard, Aerospace Complex... The trick is creating something which matches with an already existing faction style. Eg I know there's a fusion plant graphics out there, but it completely clashes with all faction graphics AFAIK.

I have a palace for Santiago started, do you need a 2nd HQ as well?

You said there already is one in the Spartan cityset you created. I guess I'd first need to have a look at that with that Gamebryo Scene Viewer.

All bases start with a faction-specific free building (Governor's Office) which gives some different benefits. But the faction effects are basically placeholders - not much thought has been put into them yet.

I'm afraid I will bugger you again on the Palace-->Governor's Office thing.

Now, correct me if I'm wrong but after a quick scan on what's possible on global parameters in the Civ4BuildingsInfos file, it seems to me that the HQ itself could cover all the things that a Governor Office's grants to its city.

If you want a Governor's Office just to show a first main facility in a new base, I frankly don't see the point. It would allow us to give the governor office's graphic to something else.

Was there any other specific reason why you want a main building in every base?


I'll respond to your latest post later.

Do you mean a full list of all facilities in the game?

I guess the military facilities would be most important. Perimeter Defense, Naval Yard, Aerospace Complex... The trick is creating something which matches with an already existing faction style. Eg I know there's a fusion plant graphics out there, but it completely clashes with all faction graphics AFAIK.

Yeah. You want a building for each faction?!?!? That's a lot of buildings. Not impossible since you could make a generic building, throw in one piece of a city set that is unique and then use the cityset dds to make it blend in. Is that what you had in mind?

You said there already is one in the Spartan cityset you created. I guess I'd first need to have a look at that with that Gamebryo Scene Viewer.

Well I don't have any palaces done, but that building you sent a pic of is one of the styles I used in the city. I have a more elaborate one started. Two big ones of each style with the same texture won't be too difficult.

Yeah. You want a building for each faction?!?!? That's a lot of buildings. Not impossible since you could make a generic building, throw in one piece of a city set that is unique and then use the cityset dds to make it blend in. Is that what you had in mind?

I don't really have anything particular in mind. :mischief: I'm just wondering how to make building art fit in with a faction's style and colour scheme. Perhaps using different textures on the same model might work?


GeoModder, I tested your files in-game. The Solar Power Transmitter and University's Governor's Office show up as the Big Red Blob in Civilopedia. When building my capital, I didn't seem to see a HQ or GO. Any idea what could be the problem? :confused: I copied all the stuff to the right place AFAIK - it's not exactly difficult.

Well, there's clearly a missing xml link then. You have allowed to overwrite all the files, yes?
And it might be best to remove the graphics folders on your end which I rearranged stuff in, and put mine in their place. I've changed the xml to link to the "Buildings" folder, not to the "Cities" folder anymore. I bet that's the problem.

And check the Team forum thread for that viewer I mentioned.

Your XML links to Art/Structures/Buildings while your download has an Art/Buildings. That must be the problem. I'll change the art path and see what happens. But it (and the patch) will have to be for tomorrow. :( I have to eat now. :)

Change the folder path, not the xml files!

Though here's a file with extra eras added. I just named them the same as the artstyles.

Yep, will change the folder path to Art/Structures/Buildings.

You mean have tiny buildings for all factions right? :king:

Yes, of course. ;)

I found the download link. It says it has some 4000 vertices. :eek: AFAIK that's four times the usual number. What's causing all that? Would merging those solar panels together reduce the count significantly??

Consider it a placeholder until something better comes up. But yes, simplyfying the panels would help, though I think most of the polycount comes from the round habituation modules.

Do you have a link to that? "Rod's from God's" didn't give me any search results. :o

It's from asio³ (http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=1573), so expect quality work.

For the coming patch I've changed the "land worked" graphic to a futuristic woodelf improvement, but I assume it would be better to use one of the tiny faction graphics/domes as well for that. Would you want to do that?

I'll try to change it with cityset buildings. I remember having problems changing this particular graphic in the past.

I figured I'd add some questions to the end of this post.

1) Are the files under Art/cities in your download different/the same from the ones in the Art PAK file? In other words, can I safely exclude them from the patch?

2) In a distant past, to make the windmills use the modern instead of ancient graphics, you suggested simply copying the modern windmill graphics into the folder of the ancient windmill graphics. But I would of course like to avoid needlessly including files in the download, to keep the size down. So I'm wondering, do you know these days how to edit PlotL so that the windmill uses the modern windmill graphics without needing to include extra files in the mod? Also, the sea windmill currently uses the ancient windmill graphics, despite linking to the same artdefine as the land windmill. :(

3) GarretSidzaka says all necessary textures for the potential Morganic cityset are included. You say some are missing. This is a problematic difference of opinion of course. :hmm: Can you say the textures of which buildings exactly are missing?

1) The only graphic change I did was on the Uni governor graphic. I changed its position more towards center of the spot it uses in a city plot.
But I extracted the 4 facility buildings from the university cityset, and put them together with the HQ and the GO + Solar Power Transmitter and Perimeter Defense in a new folder structure, so I'm afraid you'll need to add the graphics folders I sent you.

2) I'll have a look at it once I'm busy in that file.

3) Perhaps I have an older version of it. In any case, if you decide to use this futuristic cityset we could use the NextWar graphics for some facilities.
Do I take it you don't want to use the existing Morganite cityset at all? Have a look at it first. Perhaps its usable for another faction?

Edit: nope, just checked. The one I meant (http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=4590) has missing textures. Infact, before this cityset can be used, all the pink buildings' (see sceneviewer) textures need to be assembled in a single texture file or included with the mod_eu texture file.

Btw, if you're interested in futuristic citysets, perhaps this (http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=10079) one will be something to your liking. Personally, I think the texture needs to be redone (made lighter).

Do you guys want futuristic even if it doesn't look SMACish?

I'll try to change it with cityset buildings. I remember having problems changing this particular graphic in the past.

Yeah, the land worked graphic is still the ancient cottage, despite me changing the artdefine. :hmm: The sea worked graphic has changed though.

1) The only graphic change I did was on the Uni governor graphic. I changed its position more towards center of the spot it uses in a city plot.
But I extracted the 4 facility buildings from the university cityset, and put them together with the HQ and the GO + Solar Power Transmitter and Perimeter Defense in a new folder structure, so I'm afraid you'll need to add the graphics folders I sent you.

Hmm, perhaps we're having a misunderstanding. I'm wondering if I need to include Art/Structures/Cities. Not wondering about Art/Structures/Buildings. I guess the files of the other factions don't need to be included. But which University files exactly have been changed in the Cities folder? They all have the same datestamp.

2) I'll have a look at it once I'm busy in that file.

Cool thanks! :goodjob:

Do I take it you don't want to use the existing Morganite cityset at all? Have a look at it first. Perhaps its usable for another faction?

Well considered by itself I think it's a good cityset. But it actually strikes me as a middle eastern cityset, not a Morganic cityset. It even has minarets. And the texture makes it so "cheery". Personally when I think of some corporate-based faction, I rather think of huge skyscrapers. And then I think GarretSidzaka's cityset fits better. Look at the Merchant Exchange secret project movie (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XnCmtqf7LY8). I think the trick to get this futuristic look as in the Merchant Exchange movie or Blade Runner is combining/contrasting dark & black with bright lights.

Perhaps its usable for another faction?

AFAICS, the minaret doesn't really fit with any faction. Perhaps the Believers? :hmm:
The dome could be used by the Angels.
The barracks-like building (four towers with some space inside) could be used by the Spartans.
All the other buildings could probably be used by many factions, as long as they get that faction's texture colours. Eg don't the Peacekeepers have a similar looking set of tiny buildings? They'd probably also fit for the Spartans. Perhaps the Angels, though I guess there archictecture might be more dome-like instead of rectangles.

Btw, if you're interested in futuristic citysets, perhaps this (http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=10079) one will be something to your liking. Personally, I think the texture needs to be redone (made lighter).

The building models are of course good as skyscrapers. Though I don't really like the texture either. Though probably for a different reason. That blue makes it look so modern/contemporary to me. Personally I'd prefer a Merchant Exchange movie style.

Do you guys want futuristic even if it doesn't look SMACish?

Are you talking about anything particular? For some stuff there's the faction wallpapers to go on, but for others, eg the Aerospace Complex, there's no source material at all, so there's no other choice but to invent something ourselves.

Btw, woodelf, do you have the wallpapers of all the factions' bases?

Woops missed this.

Now, correct me if I'm wrong but after a quick scan on what's possible on global parameters in the Civ4BuildingsInfos file, it seems to me that the HQ itself could cover all the things that a Governor Office's grants to its city.

Nope, the current Morganic, Hive and University effects can't be provided globally.

If you want a Governor's Office just to show a first main facility in a new base, I frankly don't see the point. It would allow us to give the governor office's graphic to something else.

Was there any other specific reason why you want a main building in every base?

Giving some factional effects. And they were added for the reason you mention: adding a main base graphic. I'm not married to that idea though. If you prefer not having them show up prominently, that's all finy by me.
But the building still does need to be present. Could they be given some tiny building graphic?

Yeah, the land worked graphic is still the ancient cottage, despite me changing the artdefine. :hmm: The sea worked graphic has changed though.

Improvement graphics are sometimes hardcoded in the machine. I know it's possible to change the graphic by using the exact name, but it's not possible to use more then two landworked graphics in an era. Though I never tested for different artstyles in an era.
The seaworked graphic is appearantly more flexible. I know that from the seaworked set I included in Ethnic Citystyles. That one shouldn't present a problem.

Hmm, perhaps we're having a misunderstanding. I'm wondering if I need to include Art/Structures/Cities. Not wondering about Art/Structures/Buildings. I guess the files of the other factions don't need to be included. But which University files exactly have been changed in the Cities folder? They all have the same datestamp.

Just replace the folder. The reason I included the cities folder is because I removed both Uni facility graphics in it (GO and HQ). If you keep it as is, you increase the donwload volume.

Cool thanks! :goodjob:

On my end the modern windmill shows in the seas when constructed.
I was even surprised you managed to let kelp and windmills coesist on the same plot! At least, I assume that was intended? I never heard of anybody who achieved two improvements on the same plot. Unless you have a niffile hidden somewhere with kelp+windmill in it?
One thing though, when highlighting the plot with a kelp or a windmill on it for a seaformer job, it still says "will remove [insert existing improvement] of this plot".
OTOH, seabases don't show any city building on the plot itself, only a road. But when adjacent to a land plot, city buildings show up on the shore.

Well considered by itself I think it's a good cityset. But it actually strikes me as a middle eastern cityset, not a Morganic cityset. It even has minarets. And the texture makes it so "cheery". Personally when I think of some corporate-based faction, I rather think of huge skyscrapers. And then I think GarretSidzaka's cityset fits better. Look at the Merchant Exchange secret project movie (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XnCmtqf7LY8). I think the trick to get this futuristic look as in the Merchant Exchange movie or Blade Runner is combining/contrasting dark & black with bright lights.

Personally, I wouldn't stare you blind on the movies. I mean, the Planetary Datalinks movie also showed terrestrial stuff. ;)
But true, the only type of building I can remember is this spiring broad tower with a domelike top. And lots of expensive materials in its construction.
When taking the factions' agenda in account, I wouldn't be afraid of using some kind of "dump" architecture for the lowest class. Perhaps prefab stuff should be kept on this faction at all times?

Are you talking about anything particular? For some stuff there's the faction wallpapers to go on, but for others, eg the Aerospace Complex, there's no source material at all, so there's no other choice but to invent something ourselves.

The Aerospace Complex shouldn't be more then a square landing field, but with a very good scifi texture, perhaps like the Russian carrier model in the database. With this I can always put a faction city building or two on the field to depict that faction's uniqueness in support buildings if you want. I see this Complex in a 3x3 node, so mosttimes it will appear on the outskirts of bases.
Another facility that could be generic is the punishment sphere. I say deliver a screenshot of the 'faction destroyed' movie to Woodelf and let him work with that. I envision this as a 1x1 sized facility.
A few months ago somebody uploaded a fantasy sphere I liked, though with a lot of ornaments on it, that I liked but I can't find it back in the database. :(

Could they be given some tiny building graphic?

If the effect can't be given globally by the HQ, then that's that. I'm not against extra graphics in a base, only unnecessary facilities for the sake of facilities. ;) But can't these effects be covered by a trait in some cases instead of a building? It's a start for the lack of traits in the mod at this stage.

Talking about facilities. Looking at the stats of the GeneJack Factory it striked me that its stats would be best served in a national 'project'. I mean, it looks to me a bit unbelievable that one base governor would be allowed to force citizens and drones in greater productivity, while in the next base all things stay normal. Oppression plays in my opinion more on the global level of a faction.
And, as a project, it saves on another graphic. :D
Same thing with stuff like the Human Genome Project, the Virtual World and others. As projects they don't need graphics, can't be rushed afaik, and can't be conquered too what makes sense in a way.

Are you talking about anything particular? For some stuff there's the faction wallpapers to go on, but for others, eg the Aerospace Complex, there's no source material at all, so there's no other choice but to invent something ourselves.

I'm talking about the cities in this case. The other stuff will definitely be a challenge.

I think I have the wallpapers, but any links or pics are always welcome.

I'm afraid I will bugger you again on the Palace-->Governor's Office thing.

Now, correct me if I'm wrong but after a quick scan on what's possible on global parameters in the Civ4BuildingsInfos file, it seems to me that the HQ itself could cover all the things that a Governor Office's grants to its city.

If you want a Governor's Office just to show a first main facility in a new base, I frankly don't see the point. It would allow us to give the governor office's graphic to something else.

Was there any other specific reason why you want a main building in every base?[...]

I believe the Governor's Office was introduced as part of the cityset visuals. That is, a purely aesthetic facility. The reason would most likely have been to have at least a single faction signifier building present in every base without worrying if the city layout happened to be very poor in some cases.

Changes to city representation (citysets, layouts, facility graphics, etc.) could render the signifier building graphics obsolete. Perhaps try doing some tests without the Governor's Office and see if the nodes chosen give a pleasing result.

Edit: GeoModder, perhaps have a look at post #599 in the dreaded (because it is so huge) citysets thread. Perhaps you are able to figure out the reasoning behind the current layouts.

From what I saw in that post, it sounds like it was considered a stopgap measure.

woodelf, for now, the current cityset buildings provide decent material for HQ buildings as well as signifier buildings.

I've used the University for testing and the result is good. The graphics style is retained, which I deem more important than spectacular headquarters (the current University buildings are spectacular anyway).

In my test, I gave the University a unique palace. This is a straightforward solution and I don't mind several different palaces showing up in the Civilopedia. It makes sense. In addition to this, I gave the unique palace a "free building"... this accounts for the signifier building present in all University bases (as well as in the capitol). This is a slightly problematic solution because each base will have an extra building showing in the list of buildings and the building is only there to produce nicer looking base displays. Hence, it can be considered a hack. See post #579 for suggested uses of signifier buildings (local HQ).

Because of this graphics issue expanding into other areas (additional base facilities) I need some feedback from the rest of the development team.

In any case, if my proposal for a first prefab-style era is accepted, there's less chance of a visual displeasing base once its proper architecture is visible in the second era. Bigger population and in case of established bases several facilities.

Maniac, if you could tell me which faction-effects can't be covered faction-wide by a HQ, I would know what to look for. For instance, the 25% Hive defense is covered by the Chitchen Itza effect, while the 10% food -and hammers is covered by the granary -and forge effect.

Edit: ah yes, I see the 10% hammers isn't covered globally. But perhaps this could be covered by the <ProductionTraits/> tag? Or a trait on the leader? A "Hive" trait so to speak?

How's this for a Spartan Palace:

Improvement graphics are sometimes hardcoded in the machine. I know it's possible to change the graphic by using the exact name, but it's not possible to use more then two landworked graphics in an era. Though I never tested for different artstyles in an era.

Ah I see the graphic is set in PlotLSystem.xml.

Just replace the folder. The reason I included the cities folder is because I removed both Uni facility graphics in it (GO and HQ). If you keep it as is, you increase the donwload volume.

I can't remove stuff without releasing a new version instead of a mere patch. Anyway, if I understand correctly, no files were edited.

On my end the modern windmill shows in the seas when constructed.

That is suspicious. :hmm: Poor me! :cry:

I was even surprised you managed to let kelp and windmills coesist on the same plot! At least, I assume that was intended? I never heard of anybody who achieved two improvements on the same plot. Unless you have a niffile hidden somewhere with kelp+windmill in it?
One thing though, when highlighting the plot with a kelp or a windmill on it for a seaformer job, it still says "will remove of this plot".

Kelp is a feature. I use some ugly python code to make it work.
That message can only be removed by making some SDK modifications. I'll do it... some day.

OTOH, seabases don't show any city building on the plot itself, only a road.

Indeed. Some pirate graphics would definitely be useful for this reason!

When taking the factions' agenda in account, I wouldn't be afraid of using some kind of "dump" architecture for the lowest class. Perhaps prefab stuff should be kept on this faction at all times?

Lol, would be fitting indeed. GarretSidzaka's cityset already includes one building which fits this definition: the greenhouse.
I've PMed him with a screenie showing the purple buildings in Scene Viewer btw.

The Aerospace Complex shouldn't be more then a square landing field, but with a very good scifi texture, perhaps like the Russian carrier model in the database. With this I can always put a faction city building or two on the field to depict that faction's uniqueness in support buildings if you want. I see this Complex in a 3x3 node, so mosttimes it will appear on the outskirts of bases.

For the record, I noticed a possible Aerospace Complex alternative in woodelf's Spartan cityset!

(I'll edit this post as I reply to the other posts, unless someone replies to this post first)

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/TehManiac/Planetfall/AerospaceComplex.jpg

If the effect can't be given globally by the HQ, then that's that. I'm not against extra graphics in a base, only unnecessary facilities for the sake of facilities. ;) But can't these effects be covered by a trait in some cases instead of a building? It's a start for the lack of traits in the mod at this stage.

It would indeed be useful for all faction effects to be given by traits eventually, so that you can easily view all that makes a faction special by hovering over the faction flag.
But this kinda strikes me as polish work, not a high priority at the moment given all other stuff that needs to be done in the SDK, no? Can't the Governor's Office show up as a tiny building if so desired for the time being, thus not disturbing the cityset?

Talking about facilities. Looking at the stats of the GeneJack Factory it striked me that its stats would be best served in a national 'project'. I mean, it looks to me a bit unbelievable that one base governor would be allowed to force citizens and drones in greater productivity, while in the next base all things stay normal. Oppression plays in my opinion more on the global level of a faction.

The genejack factory represents the infrastructure required to create and put to work genejacks I guess, not the permission to do so. I was thinking Genejack Factories could provide 1 unhappiness under Democracy btw.
Having +2 hammers for citizen specialists for free, would make building new bases too attractive btw.

And, as a project, it saves on another graphic. :D
Same thing with stuff like the Human Genome [I]Project, the Virtual World and others. As projects they don't need graphics, can't be rushed afaik, and can't be conquered too what makes sense in a way.

But... but... I like conquering secret projects, or bases getting local benefits due to a secret project. :( Besides, because most SMAC stuff are indeed rather faction/planetwide projects rather than base buildings, there's currently an extreme shortage of world wonders! I need believable excuses to have MORE secret projects as buildings, not less! :D

I think I have the wallpapers, but any links or pics are always welcome.

If you have the wallpapers, could you please upload them? :mischief:

Unfortunately I only downloaded the Spartan and Gaian wallpapers back when they were available from Firaxis. :( So those I have on my computer are small low quality jpgs downloaded from the web.

Here (http://planetfall.apolyton.net/SMACwallpapers.zip) they are though.

How's this for a Spartan Palace:

Awesome! :goodjob:
(your Spartan cityset doesn't yet include anything like this btw :hmm: )

Btw, are you willing to make some modifications to this? Does making modifications to an already existing nif require lots of work??

If you're up for refinements, I think the following might further increase the coolness factor:

1) your model has a large flat top. The SMAC Spartan was different. I was wondering, would it be possible to lower the back of the top to the red line, and make the front follow the sloping green line? And remove the flags on the side? (see first screenie)

2) I assume to know what those bridges lead to, we have to look at the bitmap file. I placed an arrow. (see second picture) Those structures (sloping side, seem to have two levels, top is higher than the bridge) probably look better architecturally.

3) I'm not sure about this one, but on the wallpaper there seems compared to your model to be more space between the ground and the first platform to which the stairs lead. Though this may just be a visual illusion because we're looking at the building from different perspectives. What do you think? Might the look improve if the platform the stairs lead to was higher?


In an unrelated issue, does anyone know how to draw fracking LINES in GIMP? :mad:

If you have the wallpapers, could you please upload them?

Unfortunately I only downloaded the Spartan and Gaian wallpapers back when they were available from Firaxis. So those I have on my computer are small low quality jpgs downloaded from the web.

I think they are on my old comp and they might also be linked here by snipperrabbit in some post or another.

Awesome!
(your Spartan cityset doesn't yet include anything like this btw )

Btw, are you willing to make some modifications to this? Does making modifications to an already existing nif require lots of work??

If you're up for refinements, I think the following might further increase the coolness factor:

This isn't a nif yet so it'll be easy to modify.

1) your model has a large flat top. The SMAC Spartan was different. I was wondering, would it be possible to lower the back of the top to the red line, and make the front follow the sloping green line? And remove the flags on the side? (see first screenie)

2) I assume to know what those bridges lead to, we have to look at the bitmap file. I placed an arrow. (see second picture) Those structures (sloping side, seem to have two levels, top is higher than the bridge) probably look better architecturally.

3) I'm not sure about this one, but on the wallpaper there seems compared to your model to be more space between the ground and the first platform to which the stairs lead. Though this may just be a visual illusion because we're looking at the building from different perspectives. What do you think? Might the look improve if the platform the stairs lead to was higher?

I'll take a look at these 3 points later on tonight or tomorrow. Shouldn't be too hard. Also, there is the 2nd HQ to worry about. Any ideas?

@Woodelf:
If I may make a comment.
Woodelf, I think the texture would fit even better to the Spartan theme if those rectangular windows were replaced by narrow slits like you can see on the screenshot Maniac attached. (the yellow lights shining out)
Also, once done its not necessary to put this HQ building in the Spartan cityset. We need it as a separate graphic.

@Maniac:
As on your thought of using a typical launch installation for an aerospace complex, I think SMAC is a bit more futuristic then that. I'd rather see a sort of linear accelerator build along a hilly ramp to launch craft in orbit. Not a rocket with support tower(s). ;)

Woodelf, I think the texture would fit even better to the Spartan theme if those rectangular windows were replaced by narrow slits like you can see on the screenshot Maniac attached. (the yellow lights shining out)

And of course the texture isn't really the kind of brown as on the wallpaper. But if I understand correctly woodelf isn't really into creating textures, so I shouldn't talk to him about those.
Is that right woodelf??

As on your thought of using a typical launch installation for an aerospace complex, I think SMAC is a bit more futuristic then that. I'd rather see a sort of linear accelerator build along a hilly ramp to launch craft in orbit. Not a rocket with support tower(s). ;)

I agree a Mass Driver would fit best as an aerospace complex. I just thought "what the hell do we know how linear accelerators will look like - perhaps they will be vertical as well??"
Anyway, all fine by me of course as long as a graphic is available.

I'm trying to get better at textures, but they aren't my thing yet. If you have a 256x256 or any size texture that would look good I can incorporate it into the main dds. Same with any jpg or bmp piece you find.

Also, once done its not necessary to put this HQ building in the Spartan cityset. We need it as a separate graphic

Yeah, I know. :p

And for the record part of that aerospace complex is from hrochland. I just imported his launchpad nif into my cityset since I thought it went well with the Spartans. The dish thing is mine.

As on your thought of using a typical launch installation for an aerospace complex, I think SMAC is a bit more futuristic then that. I'd rather see a sort of linear accelerator build along a hilly ramp to launch craft in orbit. Not a rocket with support tower(s)

Geo - Did I ever finish that particle accelerator for SotM? Would that have worked for something here?

Geo - Did I ever finish that particle accelerator for SotM? Would that have worked for something here?

Nope, you never showed me anything on that.
But I'll try to get a picture of one. Either from a comic I have, or from something I find online.

Btw, can I interest you in recreating the SMAC landing pod as a HQ building for an early-era cityset? ;)

Nope, you never showed me anything on that.
But I'll try to get a picture of one. Either from a comic I have, or from something I find online.

I found it in a SotM thread, but haven't found the model I made yet... Pics are cool though.

Btw, can I interest you in recreating the SMAC landing pod as a HQ building for an early-era cityset? ;)

Yeah, if you remind me what that is. I'm drawing a blank.

Obviously this is untextured, but is the shape better on the Spartan Palace?

@Woodelf:

Yes, it is. :goodjob:

@Maniac:

Could you post a screenshot of the factional landing pod I refer to? It's the ingame picture whichs pops up when a new base is founded. The large white cilinder with a former underneath it.

Obviously this is untextured, but is the shape better on the Spartan Palace?

Man that's just awesome! :drool:

Can I make one last minor nitpick?
I think it would probably look better if the flags started hanging from a little higher. What do you think? If you agree, how about letting the green bits go up until the upper red line. And perhaps only let the green bits start protuding from the yellow main building starting from the lower red line.

After that I'd say it's perfect. :dance:

pic in spoiler:

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a183/TehManiac/Planetfall/spHQ2.jpg


Could you post a screenshot of the factional landing pod I refer to? It's the ingame picture whichs pops up when a new base is founded. The large white cilinder with a former underneath it.

Pcx doesn't attach and show as a pic on this forum I think, so I attached a zip.
The monolith screen has a bigger version of the pic I believe you're referring to. monbig0.pcx
I also attached monbig4.pcx which has the same building in its finished state, though unfortunately there's a big former driving in front of it.

I also included monbig5.pcx for a good pic for a secret project model.

Last I included monbig3.pcx. Could such a "garage"/building graphic be used for the early Command Center or Maintenance Bay for all factions, and part of the general Spartan cityset??

About the flags, that's my fault. I raised that front part, but didn't bring the flags up with it. No problem fixing it.

And if either of you do find a nice jpg or bmp that looks like spartan texture let me know. I'm going to redo the dds this weekend with the arrow slits and other changes.

For anyone interested, Illuminatus uploaded all faction wallpapers (http://rs541.rapidshare.com/files/148023125/SMAC_wallpapers.zip).

I figure they could be used as the era screen when going from the common early era to the faction-specific era. Seems like a beautiful way to show these off in the game.

Thanks. I'm interested.

I figure they could be used as the era screen when going from the common early era to the faction-specific era. Seems like a beautiful way to show these off in the game.

... or you could run a movie. It's perfectly possible to run a movie instead of having a still screen in front of you.

Btw, here's that pic from the comic. It's not as good as I thought it was. :(

Thanks Geo. I think my few pics are a bit better.

How's this texture for a finished Spartan palace?

Maniac - you mentioned needing the secret project graphic. Is this a good start? I'll need help on the green glow and need a better texture, but is it going in the right direction?

Looks great to me! I don't really see what more could or needs to be done model-wise?

In other news, GarretSidzaka fixed the problem with the futuristic cityset texture.
It can be downloaded again from the same link. (http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=4590)

He requested a screenshot of the cityset on Planetfall terrain btw.

So it's fine without any glow for right now then?

Woodelf, on the Spartan Palace, I think the actual building itself looks good (definitely different from original, but still alright) but the banners themselves could use some work. For one, I think the Spartan logo should be more centred (vertically speaking). For another, the background should probably be black instead of yellow. Other than that, there's very little I can say should change.

I like that pyramid shape. Not sure what you'd use it for, but it looks great even without effects.

Woodelf, on the Spartan Palace, I think the actual building itself looks good (definitely different from original, but still alright) but the banners themselves could use some work. For one, I think the Spartan logo should be more centred (vertically speaking). For another, the background should probably be black instead of yellow. Other than that, there's very little I can say should change.

Good catch on the centering of the logo. I must have moved some stuff around and not checked. Thanks.

About the color - I took it from something SMAC related and I don't know how a black background would look unless I changed the colors of the rest of the logo.

I like that pyramid shape. Not sure what you'd use it for, but it looks great even without effects.

Thanks. I think Maniac wanted a way to visually show wonders or secret projects since nothing in the original was graphically shown in the cities. Or maybe use it for a button showing someone is working on one? No idea.

So it's fine without any glow for right now then?

Sure. :D

About the color - I took it from something SMAC related and I don't know how a black background would look unless I changed the colors of the rest of the logo.

To look good, the logo should probably be part of a flag, not put directly on the building walls so to speak. But I guess creating a good looking flag requires some über texture creation skills? :-s

Thanks. I think Maniac wanted a way to visually show wonders or secret projects since nothing in the original was graphically shown in the cities. Or maybe use it for a button showing someone is working on one? No idea.

It's for a building graphic for city graphics.

Are you into button creation btw??

To look good, the logo should probably be part of a flag, not put directly on the building walls so to speak. But I guess creating a good looking flag requires some über texture creation skills? :-s

I was opting for a banner on a board look. Flags and cloth might sound good, but I don't think you'd notice in game. And my texturing skills won't ever be uber. ;)

It's for a building graphic for city graphics.

Are you into button creation btw??

No buttons for me, but I assume with a screenshot and asioasioasio's button maker it isn't too hard. Maybe...

Maniac - you mentioned needing the secret project graphic. Is this a good start? I'll need help on the green glow and need a better texture, but is it going in the right direction?

Hm, did I ever upload my 3D attempt at the Secret Project building? I believe I have the files archived somewhere.

Does it glow in game Rubin?

Does it glow in game Rubin?

Haha, I very much doubt it :lol: (it's just a normal 3D model with a texture). Perhaps someone can make it glow...

Oh my, we have to choose? :cry:

I kinda think Rubin's model looks cooler, no? Given that it has those stairways. And the texture is betetr.

We can use both. :p

And the texture is betetr.

I did mention my texture was just gray, remember. :mischief:

Hm, did I ever upload my 3D attempt at the Secret Project building? I believe I have the files archived somewhere.

I assume the files failes to go public, so here's the package. Let me know if this is the correct file (I have some problems viewing .dds and .nif files currently).

Oooh, my bad, turns out the original banner colour for the Spartans was orange, not black. Oh memory, you have failed me for the last time. *shoots out his hypothalamus*

Here's the spartans.pcx file if you want to look at it. I'm also uploading a .png copy of that so you can see it right here on the forum. Both files should open in any graphics viewer.

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Anyway, just in case you need more reference.