Hi.

I can't see s Defense Pact option anywhere on the trading page. I have researched Military Tradition but it's nowhere on the page even with my best buddies in the game.

Were you are at war? There are no defensive pact when you are warring. This is true of a potential ally. If he is at war, you cannot sign a defensive pact.

I see, so if either of us are at war with anyone we cannot sign a Defensive Pact. Thanks.

Don't forget that if you get one, and then declare a war, your DP goes away, wasted. It's a DEFENSIVE pact.

It also goes away if you are DOWed on ( and Of course your ally DOWs on the person that did it to you )

Exactly. That last statement was worded confusingly, so here it goes with a real example:

Say you are playing as civ A. Civ B, C and D are all stronger than you, and VERY mad at you. However, Civ E is in a DP with you, and any of them declaring war on you, would mean Civ E (much stronger than civ B, C, or D) would destroy them. You seem safe...

Then Civ F (a weak, backwards civ, who shall go unnamed) launches his Jaguars at you in a mad attempt to attack a city of yours. Obviously you DP means that Civ E declares war on Civ F, as you would expect.

Now... Since Civ E declared war, your defensive pact is now broken, so now you have no DP partner. So civ B, C or D can declare war on you, and civ E needn't do anything about it. For bonus marks, Civ B, C and D can all declare AT THE SAME TIME, further compounding your problems.

So, yes. DP's are not unbreakable, and if some weak civ declares war on you, then the DP is voided.

Then Civ F (a weak, backwards civ, who shall go unnamed) launches his Jaguars

who could it be? :rotfl:

Also keep in mind that the civ with whom you have the DP can DoW without warning. And now you have no help from anyone.

Only happened to me once.... things worked out better for me anyway since he had dropped a small annoying city on my continent. :lol:

Just happened to me,

Had the strongest AI "Zara" as my DP partner so let my Army slip a bit as he was my large buffer zone so felt quite safe.

Flying along well with Saladin on all other fronts.

Boudice, Ragnar & Hammanaburi (sp ?) were all less than pleased with me (read that as p%$#^d for a better understanding)


So good old ZARA declares on Ghandi and open borders to the 3 mentioned above and yes Boudice and Ragnar DOW on me and proceed to march the largest invasion force since D-Day across Zara lands right on top of me.

First time ever I lost 3 cities within 2 turns including my Capital.


Moral of story even with a DP with a stong partner do not take anything for granted or

Quote from Lock, Stock and 2 Smoking Barrels

"unless you want to be counting the cities (orig. Fingers) you havent got, I suggest you get an Army QUICK"