View Full Version : 14 New Civs Mod


abbamouse
Aug 08, 2002, 07:27 PM
This mod adds 14 new civs to the game. I haven't changed anything else in the rules, save for replacing a few entries in the barbarians list and integrating the new unique units into the standard upgrade paths. The civilizations are:

EUROPE
Sweden
Lithuania
Hungary
Portugal
Hittites
Morocco
Ethiopia
Mali
Harappa
Polynesia
Java
Nunavut
Incas
Maya

Every civilization has unique units, city lists, etc. There is still some work to be done on graphics, as leaderheads and many icons and units are "placeholder" art. Still, it is playable and seems reasonably well-balanced.

A complete description of the mod and civilization characteristics, as well as the latest version of the mod (sorry, over 3 MB so I can't post it here) is available at
www.wright.edu/~jeffrey.dixon/civ3pack

Please contact me with comments, suggestions, or ideas for artwork. Enjoy!

Incubus0223
Aug 08, 2002, 09:18 PM
the link did not work

Civ Commando
Aug 08, 2002, 09:47 PM
Um, I dont mean to be rude but last time I checked Nunavut was part of Canada, or has my goverment gone into anarchy? you might wanna look at an atlas.........

abbamouse
Aug 09, 2002, 01:42 AM
I fixed the link. Darned tilde. As for Nunavut, yes it is part of Canada, just as Babylon is part of Iraq, Poland was part of Russia, Portugal was part of Spain, etc. That's because the game is based on civilizations, not nation-states.

I wanted to represent the Inuit civilization (which is much, much older than mainstream Canadian culture -- similar to the Maya vs Guatemala or Inca vs. Peru), and the closest thing to an Inuit polity the world has seen is the province of Nunavut. Thus Nunavut is the title of the civ, even though it happens to be a Canadian province at the moment.

PS If I had my way the Americans wouldn't be a civ either, and would be replaced by the Hopewell or some other original American civ -- Abe Lincoln just doesn't belong in the Ancient Era.....

Civ Commando
Aug 09, 2002, 02:36 PM
ok, i see your point, but why not just call the civ "The Inuit" or something, or is that term not politicaly correct?

Mendax
Aug 09, 2002, 02:52 PM
Originally posted by abbamouse
Poland was part of Russia.....
what are you trying to say? Poland was a soviet republic? NO! Poland was not a soviet republic!!!
Polish history begn in AD966 and for over 800 years Poland guarded Western Europe from Asian hordes ;) (e.g. Vienna - 1683).

i admit, Poland was part of Russia from 1795 to 1918, but also Germany and Austria participated in that division, (but in 1920 in battle of Warsaw Polish army defeated Soviets and saved Western Europe again).

i would rather say that Lithuania was part of Poland - in 1385 in Krewa(i suppose) there was a pact negotiated that joined Poland and Lithuania with a personal union. Poland dominated in that union..
i'm not sure now, but as i remember Hungary was in personal pact with Poland too.

i recommend you to download Polish mod for CIV3: http://civ3.ask-klan.net.pl/eng/downloads.php?section=Mods
there is a wonderful c'pedia entry for Poland..

kring
Aug 12, 2002, 06:06 PM
Since I won't be home for several more hours, on the d/l are all the issues taken care for immediate play: diplomacy txt; civpedia txt; pediaIcons txt, etc.; or will we need to do some editing things ourselves?

From what I can see so far, it looks great.

abbamouse
Aug 12, 2002, 09:16 PM
As for the name of the Inuit civ, I may change it if I get more complaints. The reason for using Nunavut was purely descriptive, since it was what the Inuit in Canada chose to call their homeland.

As for Poland, it was indeed part of Russia for a time (as you noted in your message). Actually, I think part of Poland is still in Russia/Belarus (the part that Stalin seized in World War II) though of course it has been Russified so much that it may no longer count as Polish. Lithuania was joined with Poland and I think you're correct to say it was part of Poland, since Lithuanian nationalism as something distinct from Polish nationalism didn't really arise until after the failed Polish-Lithuanian revolts of the 1830s and 1860s. The Lithuanian language existed, but most of the nobility and elites in Lithuania spoke and wrote in Polish or Russian. Lithuania was also part of the Soviet Union for a time (1940-1941 and 1944-1990).

My point isn't that these aren't "real" civilizations just because they were absorbed for some time by a neighbor, it is precisely the opposite -- that a distinct civilization remains a distinct civilization regardless of what lines on a map say. Linguistic similarity, cultural affinity, and common ancestry are what matter, more than modern borders (to the game, that is).

Final note: I didn't leave out the Poles because I thought them unimportant. Actually, they are one of the most obvious choices for an additional civ, given the major role they played in Eurasian history. I left them out because they're already in the Apolyton extra civs pack and I tried to avoid duplicating their efforts. I ended up including a handful of civs that are in their pack, but that was purely by accident.

All files to begin immediate play are included in the zip, which has just been updated to incorporate better graphics (though many are still placeholders). Remember to back up your existing diplomacy.txt, civilopedia.txt, pediaicons.txt, and units_32.pcx, which will be overwritten when you unzip the files into your civ3 directory. (Actually I have experienced no problems playing with the revised files, but I assume you'll want to go back to your originals).

Mendax
Aug 15, 2002, 02:11 PM
ok, i see your point of view. i didn't look through your page properly so i just got a bit nervous when seeing that Lithuania and Hungary is included while Poland isn't.

tmarcl
Aug 16, 2002, 07:09 AM
First of all, I like the mod. Once you get the graphics, etc. done, I think it'll be a great mod.

That having been said, in the Civilopedia, you have the Incas as having the Halberdier as their unique unit, replacing Pikemen. Unfortunately, it seems that you accidentally gave it to the Moroccans. I haven't checked the other ones, yet, but I did notice this one.

Marc

tmarcl
Aug 16, 2002, 07:53 AM
Ok, I checked out the other unique units, and they all go to the same places. Just a few thoughts on each though, if you don't mind:

Liberation Force (Ethiopia) This one's fine. But IMO, if you're giving it alpine ability, you might want to require a resource for game balance.

Slingers (Harappa) You might want to consider this as a replacement for the archer, not the chariot. It has the same stats as an archer with an extra movement, and just makes more sense, IMO. Chariots are a calvary unit, while slingers/archers would be artillery.

Heavy Chariot (Hittites) Rather than a replacement for horseman, it would seem to make more sense as a replacement for chariots. If you do that keep it at movement rate 2, though.

Horse Archer (Hungary) This one is fine the way it is.

Lotus Formation (Java) This one is fine, statwise, but you have it upgrading to musketman. Normal swordsmen don't have that, so if you want to keep it in, you might want to give it to normal swordsmen as well.

Forest Brothers (Lithuania) This one is fine the way it is.

Armored Horsemen (Mali) This one is fine the way it is.

Holkanob (Maya) This one is fine the way it is, though for some reason, you have it as upgrading to Heavy Chariot. It should be Swordsman.

Espingardasmen (Morocco) This one is fine the way it is, but there's a typo for the link to the civilopedia entry. It says, PRO_Espingardasman, it should say, PRTO_Espingardasman.

Kayaks (Nunavat) This one is fine the way it is.

Voyager Canoe (Polynesia) Personally, I would put this under Map Making-the Polynesians were exploring a *long* time ago. If you change this, I'd give four moves instead of five, and have it replace the galley.

Nau (Portugal) This one is fine the way it is, but you have the same typo you did for Espingarasmen-it says PRO_Nau, it should say PRTO_Nau

Infanteri (Sweden) Couple of things on this. Number one, you have this ugrading to Espingardasmen. If it's replacing the Musketman, it probably should be Infantry. Secondly, the AI sucks with multi-purpose units. It's not going to know whether to use this as an artillery (which it doesn't really know how to use) or as a defensive unit. Since the AI tends to just fortify artillery units, it'll use this as one, but then you've got a unit with a lower defense than a Musketman (which it's replacing). It's attack, while higher than the Musketman, still gives it a lower defense than the French Musketeer (which also replaces the Musket man). I would give it the same stats as the Musketeer (3 attack/4 defense) and take out the bombard. If you want to give it bombard, have it replace the cannon (which doesnt' have either an attack or a defense) and keep it at the same stats.

Remeber, these are just my thoughts, keep them or discard them as you wish. In the mean time, good luck with the project.

Marc

WHTKD
Aug 17, 2002, 04:52 PM
Originally posted by abbamouse

PS If I had my way the Americans wouldn't be a civ either, and would be replaced by the Hopewell or some other original American civ -- Abe Lincoln just doesn't belong in the Ancient Era.....

:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
Xerxes, Montezuma, Hammurabi and so on just don't belong in the Modern Era, but they're there! The game has several inaccuracies (like 100 years to build a road).
BTW, you can have it your way. You can either create your own civilization game (which will be purchased mostly by Americans) or you can just change the Americans in the editor.

curswine
Aug 23, 2002, 10:56 AM
Great mod but to use it i had to change it and kinda "fuse" it with the Double your Pleaure mod which i am also running.

I just started a world map game and put everything on random and I ended up getting the probably worst civ there was getting on a world map the polynesians, i also swapped the voyager canoe for the kayak between the nunavut and polynesians so i could move between islands earlier, so far i have contact with everyone and am 3rd last in the civ table with the germans and hittites being at the top.

Just thought i'd tell you. ;)

abbamouse
Aug 23, 2002, 07:57 PM
Thanks for all the comments -- especially Marc; your comments were much more thorough than any others I've received.

I fixed the Inca UU so the Incas can actually build it. That was a dumb error.

I'm going to start playing as the Ethiopians for a while to test out how unbalancing the "all as roads" ability is.

As for the Hittite Heavy Chariot, it should really be 2/1/2 replacement for Chariot, but the Egyptians already took those stats for War Chariot and I'm trying to avoid duplicating the same unit under a different name. I'm also refraining from altering existing civs or units, since I leave that to the judgement of players. If I had my way, the fast, nimble Egyptian War Chariot would be 1/1/3 and the infantry-smashing Hittite Heavy Chariot would be 2/1/2.

I caught the typo for Espingardasman. Thanks for the pointer. I hadn't noticed the problem with Nau before you mentioned it.

I like the idea of Slinger as an archer replacement. I think I'll try that in the next release.

I'm going to alter Lotus Formation in some way, because right now it's a Legion under another name (3/3/1). Any ideas? The Lotus Formation was distinctively Javanese -- concentric circles of archers, elephants, and swordsmen (actually kris-men). It was ponderous and slow but very powerful.

Voyager Canoe is a tough call. While Polynesians were indeed exploring a long time ago, the major cross-oceanic voyages, such as that to Easter Island, were actually fairly recent (a few hundred years before Columbus). Nevertheless, after playing as Polynesians for a while, their UU turns out to be useless on 75% of maps so I think I'll make it a trireme replacement or at least have it appear with Map Making. The trick is to avoid giving them an automatic Lighthouse, which strikes me as a bit too powerful... I'll test this one out.

Infanteri -- I think I need to find out the Swedish word for regiment, for the books on Gustavus I'm redaing stress the use of the regiment as an organizational unit in his army, contrasted with various ad-hoc commands in his rivals. Moreover, his mobile artillery pieces were called regiment-pieces so they can be included in that description. Infanteri is not intended as Swedish infantry, but rather as Swedish combined arms in the age of muskets. I am thinking of using it as a replacement for the Cannon, though it's not quite historically accurate.

I reworked the upgrade paths so Holkanob, etc should be fixed now. Musketman upgrades to Musketeer which upgrades to Infanteri which upgrades to Espingardasman which upgrades to Rifleman. This way the upgrade path is preserved for each civ.

I just spent the last two days rewriting the placeholder quotes I had in diplomacy.txt -- the new civs are starting to get some personality. Hopefully I can release version 0.67b tomorrow.

Thanks again for all the feedback!

gormtheold
Sep 03, 2002, 01:08 PM
Since you note it is a beta, I thought I'd let you know a couple of problems I've had. Something is wrong with the Maya leaderhead. WHen you talk to them, it crashes. Also, the default .flc file for the Mali Mailed Horseman seems to be missing. I kept getting a crash (didn't frreze, just turned off) at about the time that a bunch of Mali (I renamed name Sudanese) units were moving into my territorry. When I set the default to the fidget.flc, it worked fine (and it was obvious what the problem was because all the other units were just standing there and the Mailed (or is it armored?) Horseman was fidgeting.

Incidentally, I've played a couple of games on a huge real world map (KOC without the rule changes-though I do my own). Once I set it to include the Polynesians starting on a real pacific island, having set the voyager canoe to be available on map-making and starting them with mapmaking. When the AI plays them, it didn't help. They just sit there with one city and a couple of spearmen waiting to be conquered.

Mortifer
Sep 05, 2002, 01:27 AM
Originally posted by Mendax

i recommend you to download Polish mod for CIV3: http://civ3.ask-klan.net.pl/eng/downloads.php?section=Mods
there is a wonderful c'pedia entry for Poland..

No we wont. I dont think that anyone cares here about 'sighs' poland.

As for the mod its a good one. :) I like it!

The Guardian
Jul 29, 2005, 03:18 AM
I click on the link and gey 404 error.

curswine
Jul 29, 2005, 03:21 AM
What do you expect when a thread is nearly 3 years old? :rolleyes:

thesizzler
Aug 15, 2005, 10:41 PM
lithuainia! awesome! im from there!

QFred
Aug 17, 2005, 01:19 PM
Portugal, I must say, was never part of Spain! (Ok, for 60 years of ignorance) Part of the Kingdom of Leon, I must say...

Portugal already exists in the game and, I believe, Carrack is the same as Nau.

So, change it!

Apart of, where do I download this, it's getting cool!

curswine
Aug 18, 2005, 02:40 AM
This thread was made Aug 09, 2002, 12:27 AM their are probably huge differences in the game now as their was then.

I'm still getting emails from being subscribed to it all those years ago.

AndrewH
Apr 08, 2006, 11:20 AM
:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
Xerxes, Montezuma, Hammurabi and so on just don't belong in the Modern Era, but they're there! The game has several inaccuracies (like 100 years to build a road).
BTW, you can have it your way. You can either create your own civilization game (which will be purchased mostly by Americans) or you can just change the Americans in the editor.

Catherine, Bismark, Mao, and Isabella weren't in the ancient age either, but they're in there too. ;)


o, btw sorry for bumping the thread. lol..

William GBTW
Apr 08, 2006, 11:39 AM
This thread was made Aug 09, 2002, 12:27 AM their are probably huge differences in the game now as their was then.

I'm still getting emails from being subscribed to it all those years ago.
That's funny and kinda sad. Looks kinda good as well.

JFJ
Aug 22, 2006, 09:50 PM
Os their a list of all the mods created with just new civs and is it possible to post the civ info?

Red Door
Aug 22, 2006, 10:07 PM
My god, do you not realize that you're not supposed to bump old threads? Sure, this one got bumped before, but there is no reason to bump it again.